How do you stay engaged without getting consumed? That's one of the central questions in this conversation between Dan and high-performance psychologist Dr. Michael Gervais. 

Together they explore: 

• working at your edge in meditation, panic disorder, and professional life

• why love might be the most important skill we can develop 

• navigating rage in difficult political times

• and the Ideal Competitive Mindset — a concept Dan found surprisingly useful. 

Originally recorded for Dr. Gervais' podcast, Finding Mastery, this one turned into a real back-and-forth.

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