There's a very interesting article on News twenty four at the moment.

Lots of interesting articles on News twenty four at the moment, but the one I'm thinking of particularly is by their parliamentary writer Jan Kerber, who looks at the issue of the DTI oxygen tender and how that whole thing has worked, how there is this pattern of an allegation being made, immediately denied, and then a counter disinformation campaign starting to try and undermine those who are making the allegations which have now proven to be true.

And the use of social media and the instruments of parliament and denial and offiscation and all of that stuff.

It's worth reading, as is the article by Peter de Toy, my next guest, inside the ANC's Ecosystem of extraction, the SODI and Matlala blueprint.

Peter, good afternoon, Good afternon John.

You've also got your has Matt suit on, have.

You I do?

And it's wearing sun Ya day.

There we go.

That photograph which is the photograph that prompted your article.

It's a photograph of a birthday party a couple of years ago where there is corruption accused and tended.

Tycoon Edwin Sodi Vussa Musi Katmaklala murder and corruption, accused in jail at the moment.

And Keith Corso, who happens to be I suppose the person who could most accurately be described as Deputy President Paul Musha te Lez right hand person.

Oh they are having fun, are they not?

How much can you read into a photograph like that.

Well a hell of a lot, John, I think you know that perfect perfectly illustrates the convergence between the ANC's extraction networks, networks that are up uphold, upheld by and motivated and and and kept in company by the ANC.

And you've got the extraction networks.

You know, it's invited by the ANC's political political office barriers.

So you've got the golden triangle right there in that photograph.

You've got a direct line to the presidency of the Republic of South Africa.

You've got a direct line to the leadership of the a n C at national level, and you've got a direct line to the ANC in Kharteng which shows you exactly how these extraction networks operate.

You've got the national leadership of the party, you've got executive leadership and you've got party leadership, which shows you exactly how this network of extraction has been operating over the last fifteen twenty years.

And I'm tired of constantly referencing the ANC's constant references to renewing the organization.

And even though this photograph is a couple of years old, it's still relatively recent and it does, for me anyway give the lie to any commitment to renewal.

I look at this nuggo renewal.

Sure, well, well, well, John, the most important thing of that photograph is if you've got to see, well, you've got to significant members or significant players in this vast network of extraction, sitting at a table in Bryanston in Johannesburg, enjoying the finest produce that this country can produce.

And you've got senior leaders of the party on the same photograph.

You've got Keith Corso, who is Deputy President, Paul Mashatilia's most trusted advisor, standing at the back, laughing at the foing and jury, enjoying his his time at this party.

You've got You've got Kat mccla, the person you've mentioned earlier, who is a central figure in the TEMBI six traction network.

And then you've got Edwin Sody, who is someone that is a current corruption accused, someone who has paid over more than three hundred thousand to Paul mush Tillo, who is the deputy president, and that this shows the depth and the extent of this network of extraction related to the ANC.

Look, we've been writing about this for many years.

There's been lots of exposure to how these networks operate.

And you're quite right, it is a couple of years old.

But these networks John, as we speak, are in operation.

You've got kat Machlalo, who was arrested quite recently named by the Provincial Police Commissioner for Cuisillion Natal as a central figure.

You've got Edwin Sodi who is who is a corruption accused and has donated money to Paul muster Telaus, as I said earlier, who is shown to be enjoying this fiftieth birthday party.

And no one, John, I think the most important thing is no one is disowning these networks and disowning these relationships.

T Kang Tser, who is the karting secretary of the ANC.

He says that Edwin so is his brother.

That people like kat Matlana are the brothers of these anc luminaries and no one disowns them.

And I think that's the most important thing.

Yeah, the the designation of comrade.

He's my comrade.

We've been in the political trenches together.

There are all sorts of reasons given as to why these relationships should not be brought to an end.

I guarantee you if I were able to get an interview with with Machatila's right hand man, that he would say to me, Keith Kosef.

I would to get an interview with Keith Corsey would say to me, Look, we've you know, we've been comrades for a long time.

Are you telling me I can't go to an old comrade's birthday party and have a good time.

Well, well, well that's the point.

Uh.

Edwin Sodi is someone that is a current corruption accused in the High Court of South Africa and bloomfom time being accused of playing a central role in the infamous as Best of scam run by Asma.

You've got Katmaklala who is the current accused of corruption and not only not not only a corruption accused, but he has been.

Arrested and being involved in a number of accusations around murder.

Now, these are the people that senior A and C leaders keep, keep their counsel with, Senior A n C leaders leaders defend their relationships with.

And it's it's quite remarkable that these and these these relationships are being instituted and being keift in in in in, you know, these relationships are being defended by ANC leaders.

It's been quite clearly shown that there are deep, deeply problematic issues with these relationships.

Edwin Sody is a current corruption accused.

Kat maclala is currently in incarceration in Johannesburg being accused of murder, and ANC people are defending them.

Now, that's uguely problematic.

And the ANC leaders.

Certainly, people like Keith Corsa, who is the Deputy president's counselor in the union buildings, keep on defending that.

Now, that's deeply problematic.

John, it is, indeed, And it would be nice if the A n C, the NEC is going to be meeting soon.

It'd be nice if they acknowledged it in some way.

Peter Detoy of News twenty four, thank you very much.

Indeed,