Welcome to the Frontrunner Podcast with your hosts Ray Mayfield and Tiara Jones two engineers more from coworkers to inlaws.

And now business partners, creating a safe space to be open and honest about what it really takes to start or run a business.

We know it's easier said than done.

But you were built for this and you are not alone.

Join us each week to hear stories, lessons learned and strategies from trusted advisors and new and seasoned entrepreneurs on how to endure the marathon entrepreneurship.

Thank you for joining us for another front runner podcast.

Peace everybody.

This is Ray

and this is Tiara.

Excellent.

So we got a good treat in store for everybody today so T can you tell us what we're talking about?

Excellent.

So Today our topic is your business your rules

Ding ding ding ding good.

We're not alone.

today.

We do have a special guest and we are recording at a remote location.

So t going everybody logistics in the rundown someone who's joining us today.

Yes.

So today we are with a longtime friend of mine.

We went to ODU together have known each other for years, Dallas, Paul Dallas, but he goes by Dallas and he is the co founder of The Haven arts, Virginia.

And so he has an amazing art gallery here in Manassas, Virginia.

And so we're gonna start talking about a little bit more about how he got to this point.

So Dallas is a Brooklyn born entrepreneur with a passion for music, art and technology.

He's a gallery owner and art curator broker for the havens.

Art, VA.

So welcome, Dallas.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you what's going on y'all?

You You may you may hear we definitely appreciate you.

Welcome into the Haven man.

Thank you for helping us set up It took us a while to get up and running a couple hours ago, Murphy man that will get in the detail sometimes.

But it's all good.

It's all good.

all worked out.

Absolutely.

Well here and

it's nice to recording from his art gallery.

We are on site at the art gallery that you all definitely have to check out.

We'll give you all the details.

But yes, we are here.

Yeah, definitely.

It's a good change of scenery.

Yeah.

Love Love here.

Love here open up in the attic here.

Yeah, no, see no art, but trust me.

We're in the recording studio.

Right.

It's all love man.

We definitely appreciate you're welcome to send today.

Hey, man, thank you so much, man.

So Dallas, once you tell us a little bit about yourself, maybe give us some background where you're from, you know, how you how you got into, you know, the The Haven and your your love for art.

Um, It's all good.

I mean, I really didn't come up feeling like I had a love for art.

It's kind of weird.

But I did grow up in Brooklyn, like you said, and my mom from 88 to 2001 worked at the Brooklyn Museum.

And so I spent a lot of time there, like, bring your kids work days, if I was sick of school was close.

In New York, in New York, we celebrate every holiday in the school system.

So like, there was a lot of days where I was out of school.

And anytime I was I was at the museum.

But I never was into the art.

You know, I mean, like she worked for, I don't know who she worked.

She was like on the admin side.

So like, when I went to the museum, it was like, behind the walls and the space that you didn't even realize was there.

So I seen the art passing through, but I've never like really stopped to like look at it.

And then it wasn't till years later that Kevin a good friend of me and Tiara.

Yep.

He wanted to go to New York to just hop around some different wineries and museums, and I went with him and we went to this one gallery called Eden Soho, which is like a pop art Fine Art Gallery in Manhattan.

And I just kind of that's when it kind of sparked like, and that was way after, you know, from when I was a kid in the museum, but this place had art that I was really interested in like, the museum stuff was like old like literally like ancient art.

But this was like more bright colors pop art, like stuff that you you would say to yourself like when I get a big house or have a nice four year I want that piece.

So that kind of sparked it.

And then long story long, came back to Virginia from that trip.

And me and Kevin had just moved into a an apartment, but this apartment was supposed to be supposed to be like stores, but they couldn't sell the the real estate of stores.

So they converted them into apartments.

But it had like the aesthetic of a store still.

So we had like the gray slate concrete.

Oh, nice and like 1213 foot ceilings, and then like three entryways that face the street then look like a store.

So I get back and we just sit down one day.

And I'm just like, you know what, we could turn this into a gallery.

And then from there, it kind of just started with me going to different art shows in the area.

And I'll be honest, like scalping artists from those shows, hey, I like your art you want to come and you know, check out a new gallery.

And I just kept to all of them.

Like, yeah, I got myself alright.

Oh my god knows.

I don't want to say I was lying.

I felt like I was setting myself up.

You know, it was kind of just forecasting what was gonna happen as opposed to, you know, tell them the full truth but I was able to get like three or four artists some local some from from far away and they were like alright, cool, yeah, we'll we'll give you the art, they sent the art.

And we started doing like private shows in the apartment where we would like do a full conversion like take all the furniture and like stuff it in Kevin's bedroom.

And then like all the other rooms we would just make look like actual business and it worked out we did like private shows swanky little things to like silver trees and like cotton fixes maybe we brought the artists in and did like live painting and stuff like that.

And that's kind of what started it.

And the next thing you know, I started sewing, sewing some pieces.

And one of my main buyers, Alex, who's now my, one of the CO owners here, he started buying a lot of art from me.

And he essentially kind of had a parallel track in terms of finding this love for art.

And yeah, he started buying for me and then he started throwing it out there Oh, you should open up a an actual gallery never saw my my gallery at home as actual gallery, he opened up actual gallery and I'm just like, whatever.

Anyway, fast forward to last year COVID struck.

And then we closed down the gallery that we did at the house because we weren't sure how successful would be going into the you know, further into the year.

And at the end of the year, Alex came back around was like you so you don't want to try this.

And I'm like, I really don't want to do it.

Now.

It's COVID everything is close.

But um, I ended up saving up a lot of money on like stocks and just not going out.

I was single, no clubs, no dinners, no, you know, I'm saying none of that.

And by the end of the year, I'm looking at my bank account, like, you could do something I don't know if it's gonna be by gallery, but and then we made a phone call one night, talk to the realtor.

And then he was like, Yeah, he was just so excited to get business because you could tell that COVID really like had, you know, done damage to his business.

But um, he was like, whatever you want to do.

That's great art, cool, whatever, you can have it.

So we literally came the next day we did the paperwork, put the money down.

And then that Monday, we were owners of a space.

I wouldn't say we were gallery owners at that point.

But then me and my other partner Jose, who was also a co owner, we we just got to work in here.

And suddenly no business model, no real plan.

I kind of just took what I was already doing and just do it into this part.

And yeah, we just started putting muscle into it.

Literally that night.

I mean, first day, and we started ripping up carpet and tearing stuff out nice and yeah.

And now we're here.

So that was November 30.

Here we are now on what September 18.

Not even a year, and we were doing pretty good.

So

and when you originally started the first gallery out of your home, what date did you start that?

That had to have been?

It was in the fall?

I think that was I want to say that was September October of 2017 or 18.

So you've been doing this art thing for some time.

Give yourself more credit.

Yes, man.

It's been it's been a minute now.

But it's just it's kind of transforming into so much.

But yeah, yeah,

That's dope, shout out shout out to Kevin to him.

I got to meet Kevin also to cheer.

Very, very creative in the pretty pretty solid brother, man.

So that's, that's dope, man.

So that's crazy, man.

So you went from you guys went from really creating the art studio in your living space to actually stepping out and actually building something from the ground up.

That's amazing, man.

So in 2018 to 2020 and 2021.

Here you are.

So in the background, you have a you know, consistent nine to five job as well, too, not I still well.

or Yeah, yeah.

So I work at AWS, Amazon Web Services I've been there for actually, what's today, the 18th this yesterday was my five year anniversary.

Yeah, so I'm a broadcast, live streaming engineer.

So basically do like in turn, it's like an internal TV studio, but for like 2 million people because we service the whole Amazon stuff.

So anybody from like the janitorial staff to like a kitchen staff to Jeff Bezos, like we do all of the videos and live streams for them.

So it's a pretty dope job.

keeps me busy and cutting a lot.

I used to say that what I was doing here is cutting into my day job.

But now it's more like my day job is cutting into what I'm doing here.

So that's becoming a thing.

But yeah, I love Amazon, I give them I even told my bosses that, you know, I credit them for this, because without that job and, you know, they pay pretty decent over there at AWS, you know, and the benefits are good.

And it just, you know, I feel like a good job allows you to do so much because people I think forget why we work we work to afford to be able to do the things that we like to do and there's a lot of people who work who can't afford to do what they what they want to do.

Some of them can't afford what they need to do, you know, and so I really give a lot of credit to and I will say it's a lot of stuff you can say about a big company like Amazon, but you know you get in there good.

You and they're good.

You No, I mean, like, I feel like a lot of people give them a hard time, but it's like, you know, fight to be in a position you'd rather be in, you know, don't, don't settle for the position that you don't like, you know, so I like my job, you know, and I keep it real with my managers about what I have going on here as well.

So they're really attentive to like, they first A lot of times, when we get into a meeting, the first thing they asked about is the gallery more so than, than the, than the job at hand there.

So so it's been pretty tight.

I still think I don't know how much longer it's gonna, how much longer I'm be able to do to do both.

Like, even yesterday, I told my mom, she got Max, I haven't been over there in a while.

And I was like, you know, I have two full time jobs.

And she's like, what, full time job?

You only work at Amazon.

I was like the gallery.

And I was the first time that I even started to look at this as you know, full time because I get off eight hours on Amazon.

And then I come here and do either nine, maybe 12 sometimes.

So.

So yeah, well, your Amazon's cool.

That was dope man

definitely makes a difference.

When you have one, you have a job that can support your, your other entrepreneur work and things like that.

But when that job also supports the work that you do, it just takes kind of a weight lifted off, and you have to worry about what they're gonna say what they're gonna do, even though you shouldn't be worried about it, but it's just, you know, it just kind of takes that pressure off of you.

Yeah, because the time alone is a burden, you know, trying to balance the two.

So the last thing you need is like the people who, who you need to support you to be against you, right?

I mean, so it definitely helps to have a job where, you know, you have support, even though it's support that they don't necessarily, but they literally don't have to get there.

Right, there's, you know, the guys those jobs where it's like you six minutes late, you're getting written up, you know, this is definitely not not one of those places.

So, so you're shuttled to AWS

nice, and the flexibility is not something to take lightly.

Absolutely, yeah, that's amazing.

I know, like, like our backgrounds, we both have, you know, what we call like the nine to five grind.

And this is like a, you know, what we do here with the podcast and woke up, but he's more like a, almost a 24 hour gig.

So yeah, shout out man.

Like, if you have organization, for your nine to five grind, I suppose should you do, it takes a weight off your shoulders, makes you look more easy to shake a move like a need to, to get things off the ground.

And so that's amazing.

Um, so, you know, when we were you were breaking down, you know, how you got into the Haven, you know, you showed us your pictures of how you went, from day one, you don't knock the walls down, build things out, man, the the nuts, that's crazy to me, because you put sweat equity into getting this up, you know, and it's a touch point for me.

Because when we do the podcast, we will live on Facebook, and we're telling people, you know, just start, you don't have to have it all figured out.

And it's like, perfect to have you on here to you know, as a testament and a testimony to that to that story.

Right?

You know, we know business plan, but you had a vision, you had an idea, you have a plan.

You know, we're not having a business way apart.

I don't want to send people into it, like, oh, whatever you think about just go and do it.

But, but, um, to you definitely want to have a vision, you know, I mean, because like, without the plan, at least you have something that you can, you know, even if it's not on paper, like even if it's just in your head to have some sort of guide rail to like what you're doing, you know what I mean?

Because, like, even this, like I tell people all the time, like we didn't have a business plan.

And I think they like they take it that way.

Like also you just, you just winging it.

We're not winging it, like this room is exactly what I envisioned it would be, you know, that room is exactly what we planned it to be.

We didn't know how it was gonna get to that point, we didn't know if it was gonna be by alone, if it was gonna be liquid, if it was gonna be, but you know, whatever grant, we just knew.

That's what we wanted it to look like.

And I mean, if I think if I was to draw up what I thought this place would be, and then look at what it is now, it'd be pretty damn close.

And but not because of a plan more, like I said, because it was a vision.

Exactly.

So.

And I think if you think back to when you started in your home, like, I'm always one to kind of start simple start small to test out your concept.

And that's exactly what you did.

And so I think not having, you know, the typical business plan that people sees, but if I'm sure you had things that you had written down, it was kind of unstructured kind of plan that you had, because you built it all out first in a smaller space.

And then you grew it to what the Haven is now.

Now we'll say two, I think a lot of what went into the original place was just opportunity.

Like I've always kind of seen myself as like a thinker, and like, use what you have to your benefit.

So I still didn't really feel like this Uber connection to art.

When I had the idea to do it there.

It was more of like, we have sleek gray floors and 13 foot ceilings.

This is perfect for gout.

And then it was like the flow of the room too.

Because having the three entrances It was like, people can come in here and they walk this way.

It just makes too much sense.

So it was more about like, if it makes dollars doesn't make sense more like entrepreneurial like we can make some money off of this.

There wasn't until it wasn't until I started getting some of the pieces in from some really good artists that I'm Looking at it like, oh snap, this is kind of dope, like one The art is amazing and to is cool to be the responsibility started to kick in, because now it's like, Okay, this isn't art to just decorate the, you know, the house, this is art that they're sending with the intent on selling, right?

And then that's where I have to be that seller.

So then it was okay, well, this is more than just, you know,

they trust you, right.

So then it was like keeping up with that and like, setting a rapport with the, with the artists to let them know that, you know, I'm serious about it, and I can actually move your work and we can actually make some money.

So it was like combining, that's when it started to kind of more become a love for the art and then like a passion for the selling part of as well because I don't really do sells, mainly because nine times out of 10 what you're selling is somebody else's stuff that you don't really take, you don't really care about.

But being that I cared about the art it made selling more fun.

So I think that's when it started to become more of a yes, it's a, it's a smart money thing, but it's also enjoyable.

So yeah, kind of grew on me.

And on that selling piece, that's real, because, you know, the kind of the backgrounds that Ray and I come from, especially me, and the job that I had before working with startups, we didn't have to sell anything, we were kind of like the best kept secret.

So then we're now now getting this position where, you know, I got to sell myself and so it was weird for me.

So you know, I think Ray, maybe a little bit more had more experience in it.

But it's a different space to have to, you know, really put yourself, put yourself on and really sell yourself and be confident in that and walk in that.

So.

But I definitely agree that if you're just loving what you're doing, like with this podcast, and then kind of using this like as a marketing tool for us.

We're just being ourselves and just doing you know what we do, and it just the money will follow type of thing.

Yeah, yeah, you put you put your passion into it.

Right.

So yeah.

So So yeah.

So you know, so even though you didn't have a written down business plan, of course, you had the vision, right?

So you know, and what I find dope too, is that you took time to cultivate that vision, you know, before stepping out and in buying, leasing, renting or renting office space to turn into our studio.

So you took the time to curate cultivate, and then you you had an opportunity to invite people tend to get feedback, establish relationships.

So that I think that process to me is always the most amazing man when you meet people, and they never take the leap, because you know, the smallest thing holds them back sometimes.

And, you know, the business plan, to me is a big sticking point.

Because I think a lot of people that I've come in contact with is like, do I need to get a template for a business plan or write this down?

I'm like, No, you don't need to, like if you know what you want to do, you can execute it without a business plan, right?

You could have mental checklist that you just move through, boom, boom, boom, boom, in order to get you know, from A to Z.

So that that fascinates me, that's quite impressive.

So so as you have the Haven so let's talk about the Haven a little bit, right.

So, you know, let's talk about some of the things that you do here, or, you know, for the local artists and local talent may go ahead, go ahead and plug your plug your your network, man.

So when it used to be called the gallery 66 Well, the first gallery at the apartment was gallery 155.

And that was like a simple play on address.

And then always had this idea of like, Okay, if we expand, what can grow with, you know, do we want the name to transfer or do we want the idea of what we do to transfer and I felt like with a name, like gallery, 155 b, and just the address of where we were, they would be easy to it was scalable, and that no matter where we went, it'll have an address, it'll be in a certain city, it'll be in a certain area, we'll just go in that place.

So we moved over here.

What other dudes we used to work with, throughout the idea of gallery 66 because of again, the location right there where we were, and that's okay, that makes sense.

And is it it shows a connection loosely to gallery 155.

And then, as we started, it became more than art, like the first few events that we did were like, parties, you know, they there was no art on the walls, but we the the money man was had his hand out like the, like asking for the for the bread.

So I'm like, you know, we never thought that selling art always knew that art wasn't going to be what kept the lights on in here.

But we know, we didn't necessarily know what would.

But that's when we started to think about, you know, what we could do to generate some revenue and parties was the first thing because of just you know, paying entry and stuff like that.

So then it was okay, so we're not just a gallery, we do parties.

And then we had people coming to us saying, hey, I want to rent this place to do a party.

And I was always in the back of our minds.

But it wasn't until art was kind of always on the forefront.

Because you know, again, you have these people looking at you like, Hey, you got my, you know, $50,000 is art work?

Are you doing anything to move it?

But then I started so you know what, we don't only have to sell the art, we can bring the people here and kind of let the art so so, you know, so that's when the party started to happen more frequently.

And then people started coming to us and saying, Hey, can we rent the place out to throw a party and then was like, of course you can't.

And then to your point about how how we serve as a community.

red tape, and the lack of it is where I feel like we serve as a community to burst like Where you can go to a McDonald's or a big corporation or even like a big event center and say, Hey, this is exactly what I want.

I want our cart like this.

I don't care about that menu.

This is how they're like, no, this is this is your options.

What we do here is we give the client as far as events goes, the full run of show and let them tell us what they want to do.

And then we do our best to try to bring it to fruition.

And then we have the so we do events, baby showers, parties, paint, private painting service, we do lock ins, we do private movie nights, we do screening.

So we've done music video rentals here.

We've done podcasts.

And just like interviews here, we've done a lot of stuff.

But our main thing is like events where you haven't met Tiana, but shout out to Tiana creates, she's our in house event curator.

So when people come and book us out for a birthday party, whatever, they'll sit with her and tell them a theme, like what colors you want, like what kind of diaper cake, what kind of birthday cake, and then she handles all of that.

And then we basically turn this space into that person's vision.

So perfect example, artist by the name of meego Shout out to me.

He wanted to do a party and a video shoot at the same time.

But it was a beach theme.

So here we are in the middle of Manassas, you know, no water, no beach.

So it was okay, how are we going to do that.

And then, that was the first major like event kind of design that we took on and we brought in like 600 pounds of sand, and like covered the showroom and like sand and we put like beach balls hanging from the ceiling.

And we had we turned Tiana turn the the beams downstairs and like these big palm trees and like, beach back.

So it was crazy.

And then like, even when the client walked in, he's like, this is beyond what I thought you're gonna do, and way beyond what I had planned on doing.

And, and, and we do it for an affordable rate, too.

That's the other thing.

So that's another way I feel like we serve as a community and that most of these banquet halls you go to, you get what you get an empty room, or you might pay an arm and a leg for like some chairs, and then like for catering and all that.

Sure.

But here, it's like, it's affordable one.

And if there is a roadblock, we we try our best to meet you halfway and try to make it work.

You know, I mean, like we're not gonna, we're not gonna say no to an idea because you're $50 short or because you know.

So that's, that's the beauty I love.

That's what I love the most about ownership is that you decide when you're going to, you know what I mean?

You can give people more by being just a little more understanding of situations.

And we also work with our clients in terms of our payment, like how they make payments, and we're super flexible on that as well.

So yeah, we just try to we just try to be accessible and affordable, mainly.

And then beyond that we just started in July.

As far as like officially opening, we do also plan to do more like a stuff around certain holidays, like food drives, and like backpack giveaways and all that stuff.

But, but we're still growing.

We're a small team, but that's all the stuff that we have.

That's some of the stuff that we have planned in the future as far as the community just more outreach stuff and more like our kids and getting the kids more involved in the arts.

But yeah, right now, it's just mainly just being being affordable and accessible, you know, and even when it's not an event, we tell people all the time, like if you're creating something at home, and you just wanted a new space, which is somewhere else like this is this is the spot for it.

Yeah, you've seen the facility like it's plenty of places to just sit down and like, just just create and that's what we that's kind of what we want here.

So, so yeah,

I don't think there's any place that you can walk in around here and get a complete done for you.

Like event coordination space, I had no idea that you guys went to that level, like that's huge.

Here I have the space and will completely, you know, design the whole room for you.

Can you explain kind of what the space looks like?

So I think that will give people a better idea of what we do.

This is just not like a one floor gallery where we're sitting right now.

So

downstairs is about I don't want to lie about the square footage of the main showroom, but our main party room has a stage we have a large a medium sized stage that can fit you know, a couple performers a small band.

We also do projection mapping and which is like is which is something that I don't even think I'd be able to explain over a podcast.

Yeah, but we'll have to link it if you have an example we can Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's pretty dope.

It basically scans what it sees and then you can use like you can project digital overlays on to pretty much anything like if it was shining in this room right now I can project them onto this wall behind you and make a turn colors and make the wall look like it's collapsing like a whole bunch of crazy stuff.

But we do that and but downstairs is it's a it's a big showroom where we host most of our main events like that's where the DJ would be.

That's where the main party will go.

We also have upstairs which doubles as an art studio or lounge and a screening room.

Which has 110 inch projection screen, we have pool tables we have dartboards we have area that can be a bar will say that we have a full recording studio, and also a photo studio as well upstairs.

And basically when all of those spaces aren't being used as what they were created for, they just double it's like art space, like just places you see every room has like chairs, and like just comfortable areas where you can sit down.

And you can even read in here, like it's just a place where when an artist comes up here to create, I want them to feel comfortable and to feel like like they're at home, like they can go any corner and just kind of do whatever they want, you know what I mean?

But yeah, and then we also have a small kitchen where we do some food service.

As well as a work from home space downstairs where if you're, if you're at home, you want to get away from the kids or the dogs are barking order, the lawn crews outside and you have a big meeting, you can come here we have gigabit internet and you could just find a corner and just kind of get your work done.

So.

So yeah.

And then you put on a lot of different other vendors and entrepreneurs as well, no, your grand opening, you had a quite a few different vendors here.

Yeah.

So that's, that's another thing with we try to have competitive pricing when it comes to like vendor fees and stuff like and we grandfathered in a lot of the local people who were kind of supporting us from the beginning.

So a lot of them we still give discounted rates to for because they we gave a lot of people a lot of opportunities to participate in this whole thing through social media.

So when we first got the keys, I instantly started posting, you know, if you ever want to come home, if you ever want to come paint, if you ever want to come, you know, help do these fours, like, then a lot of people did come You know, and those people who came are the people we still have like some of the strongest relationships with.

But the same goes for the vendors who came to some of our earlier events where we didn't have a name, we you know, we couldn't guarantee that they were going to get you know a ton of people up here who are going to buy stuff, but they were still willing to you know, hang their hat on us and come and support and like so those vendors, we still kind of show love to them to new vendors, we try not to you know, bust them over the head when it comes to, to pricing.

But we also do our due diligence to get people here.

And every every vendor show we do I typically make like free promotional flyers for each individual vendor, as opposed to like making one flyer with everybody's name and tiny font.

Because I find that just from a marketing standpoint, people are going to share something with their face on it more than they do something but yours, you know, so.

And I think there's value in that, you know, if I was to charge somebody for that flight, it'd be, you know, damage just as much as the vendor fee ended up itself.

So, so I try to give them something for their participation beyond just putting people here.

But yeah, we do.

We do source vendors a lot for different events.

Typically, if it's a party, a game night, or anything that does on a larger scale, we'll open it up for vendors to come and participate.

And it's becoming a, it's becoming kind of like an exclusive thing because we don't have a ton of space.

So I can't I don't ever want to pack it out with vendors.

But But yeah, we definitely try to show love to the to the vendor, community and arts community.

It's dope, man.

I'd like um, you know, so so let's, let's unpack this a little bit.

Right.

So when you when you got the keys to the facility, um, you know, talk about some of the stuff, you know, the hurdles you had to go through in order to take what was here before in transitioning into the hate because I think this is important, because again, this is another roadblock where a lot of people who had these creative ideas, but like, I don't have the money, you know, to do all these things that I want to do, you know, welcome you know, you know, share your testimony, your story a little bit what how you transitioned what was here into what you have now.

I That's dope, man.

mean, Well, for one, I couldn't believe that we got got this space at the price we did, because everything that we were seeing online was like, you know, 8000 square feet, 7000 square feet, 4000 square feet, and $3 a foot.

So it's crazy.

Those were the ones we were just looking at.

The first one we clicked on was this one, and it was nothing like that.

And again, I think a lot of that had to do with COVID sure.

But anyway, when we got in it was the main thing was I think it goes back to that vision.

And then it was the excitement to the excitement is what drove a lot of that in the beginning, where we all kind of had some money already because we all had decent jobs.

So it wasn't really about the money.

It was when we when we first got here it was like I said I think like excitement drove it was just like, once we got the key was already It was late in the day, we had already worked that day.

But it was still like now we're here.

Now let's do it.

I think I showed you other pictures that very first night, we started tearing down the drop ceiling.

And I think once that started, it got to the point where it's like once you rip the ceiling down you kind of can't stop.

So it was more like we just had to figure it out.

So a lot of it was just figuring it out.

But me and Jose did it all by hand ourselves.

Like we had certain things we had people come in like we had an electrician come in to help with the lighting.

But beyond that we'd like everything you see We did literally by hand.

And when I say by ourselves, obviously, there are people that hope and in terms of like, just the day to day work, like we would get off work and we'd come here and put in like 12 to 15 hours, I mean sleeping here and you saw some of the videos to dust like we literally just in here covered in like, dust and just sweat for like three weeks.

It didn't take long, like and then we just I think once it started rolling, that momentum was like a snowball down the hill.

Like it really didn't take much to dry because it was like you have to finish it now.

You know, if we ever gonna open it has to get done.

But the one thing I will say that wasn't easy was doing it without the loans because not too many people can can just go at it and because you know, I was taking I didn't have to rob Peter to pay Paul, we had the money.

You know, it wasn't a ton of money, but we so I don't want anybody to feel like you know, go go through your house at your investment and like you just because I said we didn't do it without alone.

Like it wasn't killing us to spend this money.

Like that was the one thing even though it was kind of shotgun, we knew that.

Alright, if we do this, how are we going to be in terms of our the necessities we already have?

And we all agreed that we wouldn't so we went with it.

But yeah, I think the excitement it was the driving the driving factor.

And then the other thing too, a lot of the stuff that you see was here already, so Okay, like there was like, tons of sheetrock already here there was these acoustic panels that Chelsea hanging up the carpet that was downstairs, we tore up and brought it upstairs.

So like we kind of repurposed a lot of stuff like even even the backdrop that's hanging here was like a u haul.

Whatever you call these things, like the blankets were for covering up sensitive stuff.

But yeah, we just repurpose everything.

The bar top was already here.

And then you see a lot of the furniture and stuff is made out of pallets.

So we really just got creative and cheap.

That's what makes them work.

That's what Yeah, and then after a while it stopped it stopped looking cheap and started more looking like the aesthetic, you know, and then we kind of rolled with it when now you know people love it.

And you know, people come up here.

And you know, downstairs, you can see it's more finished a little more clean.

But up here, it's like more upcycled and people love this room like they love coming upstairs.

It could be a whole party of 200 people and they will try their best to squeeze up here without even being like the I don't know what it is.

I really don't know they want to be I don't know, I don't know why.

But so this are we doing some right.

So

the party is always upstairs.

I feel like that party is always upstairs.

Yeah.

But I mean, that's I think that's very creative, right?

Because it's sweat equity.

And you're fortunate to have some money to spend on but to repurpose in, you know reusing materials, moving things from upstairs or downstairs or upstairs and you know, you got creative with your space.

You'd also just let that be a testimony for those who just know, I can't do it because I don't have everything I need.

Just start right.

Just take the first step right.

And like Dallas said, right, the passion is what drives you not I think that's the most important thing.

And if you don't have passion for what you're doing, then you shouldn't really be doing it.

Right.

There's a reason for everything.

And if you really want it, you'll you'll make it happen.

That's for sure.

And then I mean, talking about not letting things get to you on how things look, you know, because sometimes you will be like, well, this doesn't look like the usual art gallery or I got to make it you know, with the white walls you know, that usual type of art gallery look, but you know, I'm glad that didn't stop you.

Because you kind of just took it you use what you had and said okay, how can I really make this my own and that's what I love about it you really you really made this you and your you know your co founders you really built this up, you know yourselves your own with your vision and it looks great.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Great.

And we tried that we went I showed you the pictures it looked ice man when it was just white, we did the whole all white everything the white floors, white walls, which isn't necessarily a typical gallery look, most galleries have the darker ceiling, darker floors, but it was just too too clean.

And then it was almost like, and this might sound crazy when we first started, like we had like, a stripper pole for like, part like certain parties and like it just didn't, it just wasn't feeling like it wasn't given Art Gallery.

So you had a lot of people coming in and they were like, you know, one the white didn't seem it seemed too clean for what was kind of going on in the room and I and it played out literally too because you know, you pack out all white room with with people, a bunch of people, it's gonna get dirty.

So the first thing that sort of happened, the floors were turned in black and it was just like, Okay, this isn't gonna work.

But that's also why we changed the name to because it was more than a gallery.

Yeah.

And it was in my biggest fear, not fear, but concern was that the certain locals will come here expecting a certain experience based on the name.

And when they got here they'd find like, Okay, well this isn't quite what I was expecting.

So I think the Haven gallery event space in studio is still doesn't shine light on kind of all of what we do here, but it does, it broadens.

It broadens the scope of what's here.

And I think the event space thing is really what kind of helped help kind of bring all that together because events, they're all events, you know what I mean?

But it's not all art.

So, so so yeah.

Um, but yeah, we tried to we tried to pristine gallery look, and it just didn't, it didn't fit the aesthetic of what what we were trying to do and changing it up so

and then you've been changing things, you know?

Right, exactly.

I know I've competed at different times, and they just keep changing.

So me and that's okay, thanks.

I'll have to stay your showroom does that the state looking the same, you know, every single day

will come rst is kind of like people coming because like I said, there's a personal personal walk in here today, and stay for for eight hours, and then come back tomorrow and there'll be something, it might not be a huge change, but it will be a change that's noticeable by that even that person like wait, that was, something's different.

And people love that about the place because I, I've had people explain it one way.

And then when when they get here with the person they were explaining it to they're like, this isn't what you told me.

He's like, dude, I thought that's what it was.

But they changed it so much.

So dynamic.

So it's definitely dynamic and ever changing.

I think that's what makes it It keeps it fun and interesting to not just for the people who come here.

But for us.

We always find something, something to do.

You get to create, you get to create it.

That's growing up.

My mom was like that, like we had a decent sized apartment in Brooklyn, but she always was changing it around.

Like, every weekend, every other weekend, she was moving the living room to where the dining room is or moving the couch from this way to this way.

I don't know if she had a functionary book or what but she would change stuff like all the time.

But um, I think that kind of stuck with me subliminally because now it's like, this should move for like, let's change it up.

Let's make it look a little different.

And it makes it makes you your own space exciting.

Instead of getting stale.

Yeah.

But um, but yeah,

absolutely.

I know, I know, the first time when I'm on measure earlier last week.

When we came in here, you're moving to showcase your moving showcase around, but I think nothing that's very cool.

And there's even some additional art hanging on the wall.

They does now.

So there we came.

So like, you know, I like it, man, I appreciate the creativity.

That's sure I appreciate the creativity.

Definitely, man.

So, you know, as you're looking at, you know, looking back the, the span from now from then to now.

Like, can you touch on some of the hurdles, or some of the, you know, the obstacles you ran into that you had to overcome in order to get where you are today.

I mean, you know, honestly, me and Jose talk about this all the time.

And we really think this place is like just go so crazy, but it's just like a portal to like all things just good.

Like, as we built this place up certain stuff, which just happened I was like, how is that even possible?

You know, we've met people here with certain connections to like, like, for instance, one of the girls who works next door.

She She lives in my my apartment complex, right.

And one night, I'm leaving the gallery to go home short story to go home.

And it was like one of those nights where we did like 12 hours in here just working in where I live, the parking is really tight.

So if you want to spot that's like by the house, like your front door, it's rare.

Otherwise, you have to like Park way and visitors and walks anyway, just one I get a spot.

I'm waiting for somebody to pull out as I go to pull in this car, like cuts me off and jumps in my spots, like four in the morning.

Oh, sorry.

Oh, I was mad.

I said some words.

And then, um, so anyway, fast forward to like months, months later.

This go from next door, she comes over, she's like, Hey, you know, my boyfriend does art.

And I just want to introduce him to this place.

Because so cool.

I'm just looking at these people.

Like, it looks like he looks so familiar.

And this month's after this right somebody or whatever.

So we talked, we exchanged numbers or whatever, then they leave.

And then fast forward like last week, last week, they pull up, and I see the car and I'm like, No, no, no, no, I know that car, you know, and so that they're coming to the event.

Like I didn't invite him, you know, they come to the event, they saw it online or whatever.

And I'm like, No, you're the dude that cut me off in the Bigler that when that he's like, that was you?

And I'm like, What are the odds at work next door and live next door?

They live on the third floor?

I live on the third floor, all the way across town.

Right.

But, but I say that to say that, like stars align here, you know, so like, there hasn't been a lot of like, tension in terms of what not tension but there hasn't been a lot of roadblocks in terms of the business and I you know, knock on wood.

But um, it's been kind of smooth.

I mean, the only thing would be I think people lose sight of the future like file your taxes and know how all that stuff works, too.

You know what I mean?

Because come April.

Yeah.

So I think that part, but the biggest roadblock has been time with my day job.

And just Jose works a pretty busy day job.

Alex lives pretty far from here.

So it's been time management has been the hardest thing and then then laying the tracks as the train is going down.

And you know, I mean, the train being the rent, you know, the visuals and all that stuff like you most people and this will put them into perspective.

Most people work to pay for where the things that they have when he lived and all that.

I'm not you don't work to pay for your job.

Yeah.

If you if you start if I stopped working here, then my other job is also To pay this rent.

So that's been the hardest part of like realizing like, this isn't, this has to pay for it.

So true.

Like, you started taking money from over here to pay for this, you end up down bad, right?

I think that's been I think that's been the I wouldn't call it the hard part.

But it's been like, the part of that kind of over your shoulder all the time is like, don't slow down.

Because if you do, you got to pay for it.

Right?

So I think that that pressure, but that's also the driving pressure to that's that's kind of what keeps you keeps you going momentum.

So we just try to stay creative.

And try not to look at that pressure as something daunting, but almost as the goal for each month, you know, and you don't want to live paycheck to paycheck in your daily life.

But I kind of feel like when you run the business, you settle for paycheck paycheck.

You just get there.

Yeah, even get close, like you realize, like anybody looking to start a business, like don't feel bad if you barely make it, because a lot of people don't make it at all.

You know, like my landlord told me I neighbors hadn't paid the rent in months, which was the best news I can hear cuz I'm like, all right, we only need about 10 days.

They can go months.

We good thing.

Yeah, exactly.

But yeah, I think that's been that's been the hardest part is just, you know, staying focus and not letting that that pressure of time and everything kind of overwhelming.

And I'll say like, yesterday, I was working for Amazon.

I work from home, I fell asleep joining me in and it was a meeting that I was supposed to be running like, videos and the whole like a high touch me and I wake up like 10 minutes later to like 30 messages, like where are you the video supposed to play?

And I'm like, Oh, snap, my power went out.

So, so I had to, like literally finesse my way out of like, having that escalator up the chain.

But um, but yeah, so it's just, you know, staying on top of time.

Yeah, that's been.

That's been the hardest part.

How's it been with your partners?

Because you have two other partners, right?

That

is cool.

How do you guys know each other?

Sorry?

Yeah.

Yes, so

so I've known Alex since 2000.

And like 13.

So we've known each other for quite some time, but he was my then girlfriend's neighbor.

And they had kids that went to school together.

So they would play together.

And that's kind of how we met.

And then Alex was friends with Jose.

Then I met Jose through Alex and then when it was always just me and Alex talking about doing the gallery thing, but when he came on to do it, he said, Oh, Jose is interested too.

And I'm like, oh Long's he got the bird.

And that's kind of when me and Jose started to get we actually formed our bond and got tight from doing the work here, like, do that same sweat equity.

And just and also, you know, doing this was like a blood pack, you know, you sign that lease, or you sign the paperwork.

You know, we don't have to like each other.

We start, we start helps, it definitely helps you like your partners.

But um, so yeah, when when we first started that I had met Jose, at least a year or two before that, but we weren't, we weren't really close.

He was just always the guy that was like at Alex's house.

So yeah, so we got cool over the investment.

But yeah, that's, that's that's pretty much how we met.

And it's been cool working with him.

The one thing that they both they're very different.

We're all very different.

But Jose is definitely that's my right hand, man.

Right there.

And Alex is also that's my right hand too.

Because one thing that Alex is that you can call him for anything and he got you got I mean, but yeah, so So yeah, we're all tight.

And we haven't had any, any major issues.

I mean, they don't I don't say that to say that you won't have issues with your partners because we've had issues.

We know that

we have issues all the time, but it's how you it's it's knowing that going into those issues, you know that you're both you both have an intent to come out of it.

Okay.

Great point not malicious and non malicious

working through the screen like we've had we've had it out over some stuff but it's always been if you're not that passionate about making it work or about whatever issue then then you shouldn't be doing so so yeah, we have our we have our differences but nobody likes a yes man.

Nobody likes somebody who's just gonna always just nod and smile so so we all bring our different things to the table and it works and at the end of the month when it's time to pay the man like it's always there an estimating thing like that's the main thing so so yeah,

there's no but I read this book called The good from good to great and I think it's in this book or this quote, he says if you have a partnership and the point is always agree the two parties always agree one of them is unnecessary, right?

So it's like you got your sandpaper right?

Like you're gonna have to like smooth some things out with one another and do it in a cordial fashion was not malicious.

And so so that's that's a mouthful right there to a tee and I have an interesting relationship to be in first met each other at work, then, you know, again, her sister and marry her.

And then now you know, sister in law.

So like we have we have an interracial relationship too, but it's not I always move.

And everybody who has been listening knows, it's like, we have our issues.

And again, it's not malicious, but it's just things you have to work out to try to fit the pieces of the puzzle together the right way for the benefit of what we're working to build and building towards.

So that's always important for people who out there developing relationships and partnerships, you know, your, your, you know, you got a friend, you know, for 10 1520 years, and you guys crumble to pieces, when you when you step out on something together, you got people, you know, for three years that I get back way more in the business than anybody else.

So it was important to understand where you're going into business with, then they both you hit it on the head, like the individual you ever make the individual that you're doing business with, it makes it so much easier for the end of the day.

Yeah, absolutely no.

So.

So, you know, within the Haven, and the constructs and some of the things that you host here, you know, tell us tell us about like, what, what drives you, I know, you're a creator, I know, I know, you you like bringing people together, from the community to showcase their art to let go to have fun, too, and create this a fun environment, people that do what makes them happiest in, but I talk about some of the things that that drives you, you know, as as, you know, one of the three partners for the Haven and the things that you do here for the community.

I mean, at this, like I said, I think that the answers, why don't want to make it seem like the dance is always just, you know, keeping the lights on, but that that is a big driving factor.

But no, I mean, honestly, I never really looked at it like that I never really, like felt like, there was really, I don't want to say that, that we don't get anything out of it.

But it's always just been, I just enjoyed doing it.

You know, it's been fun, just even, you know, I was in music management for a long time.

And I kind of was just always in service, you know what I mean?

Like?

So like, for me, it's just been fun to manage the whole thing.

It's like playing the Sims.

You know, I told you, I told this chef, that one time shout out to her.

That, you know, it's like, the, it's like the Sims, like were you the actual characters, like we're the characters in the game.

And it's cool to see your house kind of level up as you go along.

You know, I mean, so like watching each room go from nothing to this, this studio, or watching the little makeshift kitchen we had turned into like, now we're starting to actually look like a kitchen.

So I think that's been, what's driven us the most is just seeing the fruits of our labor, like, just like, literally form in front of us.

And I think and I think that's been, at least for me, I can't speak for Jose or Alex.

But I think that's been the biggest, the biggest reward has just been in the biggest driving factor is just seeing it just and being the ones to do it.

You know what I mean?

Like a lot of people.

A lot of people in this area say that, you know, everybody who comes here, we're a good percentage of them.

Also, all the city needed this, like, I had this idea, or somebody said something about, and it's like everybody had just said it, you know, I mean, so like, it's cool to know that it's something that was sought after, and that is finally somebody doing it.

And it also helps to be the that person, you know what I mean?

It's dope to be that person, especially being an implant.

I'm not from here, you know, I'm saying I don't have, you know, Kevin's like, literally the only person like I can say, I know, and you Right, right, that I actually know what I mean.

And so it's dope to kind of feel like, I'm kind of shouldering that, because now so many people, that people who, who, who, who know about this place, when they, when I change little things, like we took the cloud installation down there, like what you did when I came here to get some pictures.

So it's not it's a little pressure there to like, just to keep it going and just keep giving them you know, that thing that was missing, you know, so I think that that that's been the driving factor as well.

I like that because like you set up little mini exhibits, that people can come in and see each and every time so like, it's a pitch drops like that they could be and bring people with exactly to sell the art.

I mean, it just all adds to it.

So yeah, we saw the video, the cloud, the cloud formation, he's talking with the Lightning Man, amazing.

It's downstairs, it's just, it's just amazing.

Like, it is really cool.

We look at you know, art coming to life, you know, 3d for 3d for me.

Yeah, that's one thing, I appreciate it.

But I've been telling my wife, it married about somewhere for a couple of years, I want to get more into art.

And then I want to I want to buy art, I want to start, you know, learning more and, you know, supporting the creative people who out there in the world.

I think that I think they're easily overlooked for the value they bring to the table.

Um, you know, my background like in in will say like, and then national defense, right?

It's, it's, you know, it's engineers, it's, you know, program managers.

But I think the ones who are the artists and have the creative minds are much more appreciated because it's the maneuverability, disability Sydney's from a different perspective, as it is the ability to look, look beyond The problem with through the problem and figure out the solution, but actually, we have a roadmap to build towards it.

So I definitely appreciate it, man.

And I can't thank you enough for what for, you know, for T for bringing me here and meeting you and seeing what you're having.

Man.

Is this amazing?

It's impressive.

Man, you said shot before man, it smells great in here, whatever.

Yeah, he's doing today, unfortunately for us, it's for they have an adult Field Day across town.

And he is he's a caterer.

So he's making all this stuff, I won't tell you what he's making.

I won't make it worse.

Because most good, it's all good.

So you're even provided a space for him to be able to cook.

So it's not just art.

It's also other entrepreneurs, here's your space, right?

For those looking to start a business that might have saw a similar format, like in order to maintain a liquor license, you have to sell $2,000 worth of protein food every month.

So it's a we have a somewhat of a symbiotic relationship on steroids.

Where, where, where it that gets us gets us that number.

Very cool.

And also allows us to, you know, maintain the bar.

Not to mention that's not the only reason.

He's also awesome chef.

Papi eats on Instagrams anyone listening think it has two s's at the end.

In just just a gym.

But yeah, awesome chef who was doing, he was, you know, Instagram chef, you've seen him, you know, guys cooking online.

And I have seen his food all the time.

And our friend groups kind of overlap.

So that's kind of how I met him.

And yeah, I had the food and then one day, we did a brunch here.

And then it kind of just kind of took off to where it was, like, you know, you're doing the meals, you know, from wherever you're at, why not do it from a more stable, stable space, you know, people can come in, they can take it to go, they can sit down and eat.

And this has been working.

I mean, we do some pretty good numbers, and we're pretty consistent, doing about three times a week.

So that's a versus free incident.

Isn't

that great?

That's alright, that's alright.

I like that.

So the fact that you know, and, you know, for the all those who had those ideas out there, study, learn, you know, you know, Dallas has dropped the gym, you know, 2000 2000 pounds of protein a month in order to maintain a license to sell alcohol is important.

It doesn't count.

Yeah, sorry.

$2,000 worth of protein, right.

Yeah, a couple in Norway in order to maintain a license was important.

You know, do you do you research?

Do you research?

Absolutely.

In fact, we're the only according to the ABC person I spoke to were the only Art Gallery from what she said in the state with food even in their, their business model.

Most of them you know, they go into it just you know, blinders on for the art I'd imagine.

And, and that's why most galleries you can't even get a glass of wine, because you have to have you have to have a food at least that's what they told me.

Yeah, she says not too many have that.

So we're, we're in first place when it comes to that.

So I love

it.

That's amazing, man.

So so like, you know, as you look at the, you know, the blueprint, and you know, I know, I know, the artist monster ever working, but you look what you're happy with the Haven man, like, what was next, like, you know, what do you what do you envision Next, you know, for the Haven.

That's amazing.

Um, I mean, honestly, we're looking at literally next door, we want to want to do a full on performance Hall.

So that like, we can dedicate this just to like, you know, typical art, art, you know, Canvas art, stuff like that smaller shows painting serves.

And then over there, which is same floorplan but as you can tell, they built this second level after they built the original building.

So over there, it's just opened.

So we'd be able to have a stage and we'd be able to do like a full the small concert hall, that we have just a performance art space.

That's one of the things that I want to do next, I'd also open up the revenue because we also might be able to do ticket sales at a higher volume for you know, events.

And yeah, that's what I'm doing.

I also want to get, I want to get this kitchen fully up and running.

But as far as like big picture, I do want to kind of shift the focus back to the art.

That's why we've been doing a lot of pop ups.

We have one tomorrow actually and DCU Street and 14th we do want to pop up out there right on the corner.

So just trying to sell more art and kind of put some light back on that.

But otherwise we kind of keep that same mantra of like we just as we go.

As we go.

I'm waiting for you know, some heavy hitter to walk in and see the drive and see what we're doing and say look, man, I want to invest some money.

Every night.

Yeah, and I don't I try not to hold my hand out i want i want whatever to happen here.

I want it to be genuine and like organic.

I don't that's why we never did the whole the loans like that real transactional.

Here's your money.

Now give us back this plus I'm like to be like that.

I want it to be like I see what you're doing.

I Like it, I want to invest in it, you know what I mean?

So I think just taking it day by day, and just keeping doing keeping up what we've been doing, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Trying to keep it everything legit, because, you know, for us it can be, it can be extra pressure.

In terms of, you know, we've already had some of that from like the neighbors.

And one thing I would tell people as far as that, like, you know, I don't like to, like automatically categorize stuff hate as hate.

But if you can't, like come up with a logical explanation as to why certain stuff starts to happen on the move, that's kind of what it starts to look like.

And what I say is don't stoop.

You know, cuz that's what they want you to do, especially in business, they want you to stoop to a certain level, and then they can say, Oh, look at him, look at that business owner doing that wrong thing you're not I mean, so, you know, I just thought he was right now just try to give them you know, don't do anything against your morals, or you know, your principles or whatever, just to appease somebody else.

But if you're wrong, or if it's something that you can fix without causing more of a stir, then just go with that, because, you know, be you got to be here tomorrow.

Last thing you want to do is to be here, we're stressed tomorrow, somebody, you know, poking and prodding at you, because you, you know, you talk to them a certain way or gave them a hard time.

So like I said, I don't say don't fold but, but you know, be played chess.

Chess, not checkers, because that's what they want, you know, in, in, in regular situations for us.

Even so, in business, you know, especially in a place you see, we're kind of in a quiet industrial parks, we're kind of like the new shiny thing.

So right, get all the we get all the attention.

So just be mindful of that.

And be cordial to your neighbors to like you.

Even if they're not to you always be cordial to them.

Because I like to tell people this all the time.

I like to leave the ball and other people's court, no, play your hand the way you know, you know, is right, and then let them let them make the next move.

let them decide how they gonna, you know, go about it.

Because at the end of the day, they got to live with what they did what they did, you know, I mean, so if you can go to sleep at night, knowing like, you know, I handled that situation, the best way, they're gonna be the one sitting up at night, staring at the ceiling, trying to figure out, did I do the right thing?

You know, so, so always try to stay on the right side and stuff like that, especially when it comes to, to your neighbors when it comes to business.

But But yeah,

yeah, yeah, definitely want any drama at your place of business?

Oh, no problems.

Yeah, yeah, makes your life easier, makes those who pager in here, it makes their life easier to, um, you know, just want to keep it cordial.

And just, you know, keep that high character, man.

That's what it's all about, you know, like you said, you want to be able to sleep easy at night, but personally important, absolutely important.

So, so as you as you talked about before, you know, you still have, you know, your, your job AWS, while you while you're, you know, you're running the Haven, um, let's talk about, you know, the, the burnout and the fatigue factor.

Right, like, so what are some of the releases and some of the things you may do, you know, to kind of mitigate that?

Know, Are there times you take may take a day off from here at Dell from there?

And then what do you do in your downtime, if there is any at all don't have downtime.

Worse person acts, just skip this one.

Because I said early on, just realized I might not be the best at managing this time.

And that was first time I felt See I legit, like it.

And it was because of it was because of both, you know, I'm tired.

And I don't know, I think even for myself would be to take more breaks for like I said, the hardest part is like, you know, weekends are short, you know what I mean?

They become even shorter when your business and for me weekends no longer exists, because stuff, you know, that stuff like, stuff, you know, parties happen, events and whatnot, so, so I would just say, factor in rest.

And you know, take that time out.

And also have a team that you can trust that you can, you can, you know, leave things to.

And in were there, I could definitely trust team, but we're all kind of the same, but we almost need a room.

You almost need a staff now.

But yeah, just just just make time for yourself.

And take breaks, even if they're short breaks, just just close the laptop, you know, take a walk, just do something else.

Even if it's for 20 minutes, just give yourself that space to just give your mind time to time to breathe.

But yeah, that's what I was saying.

That's more advice to myself more than anybody else.

But you know, I think that that's a learned thing too, though, especially if you're, you know, I've done I've always had something entrepreneurial going on, but never, never with this level of like intent and what the intent was always there, but the pressure is here because of the bills because it brings a difference.

Yeah, it brings a different level of pressure when it comes to actually starting, especially brick and mortar, right.

It's one thing to run your business.

Right.

It's another thing that actually have a physical space, you know, I could pay $20 for a domain but way more than quadruple.

Lights.

Yeah, these nice electric You know, they're like more or less But yeah, so just taking time to take a break and realize that you know, without you, you can't do nothing.

Yeah.

Like if you, if you not if you're not here physically and mentally, it's going to start to show what one physically obviously will show you you're not here but mentally it's going to show your work and your execution, you know what I mean?

Like, even to the point where, like, maybe you, you're driving home, it could be really, you know, I don't live far but I'd be tired.

Like, I'm gonna just stay here.

Yeah.

So yeah, so you definitely got to pay attention to your to your body and how the effects what you're doing is having on you and, and also understand that it takes time to train yourself to, to work at that level, you know what I mean?

You might think you you can go all day and all night, but it's a whole nother thing.

And I actually need to do that.

And, you know, so and that's something that, you know, thankfully, I've been able to do, but like I said, definitely gonna start slowing down and setting some time aside, and maybe certain certain actual days aside.

Yeah, cuz I definitely find that you can't plan anything.

It's really hard to plan.

Absolutely.

So like, you know, I've been telling my grandma was coming to Hampton for months, but it's just like, get all the way to Wednesday and boom, something pops up for that Saturday.

I was like them, I can't go nowhere.

But so I think I need to get more firm with setting the date and saying that stick into is done.

Yeah, yeah.

So yeah.

I think that's important.

Nothing is wonderful.

I know for me, I wake up and drive to work and fall asleep driving to work some days.

Well, it's just because you're just you know, you're you're always on the go.

So it's definitely important if you had the opportunity to do so yeah, definitely pick a date on plug everybody.

You need it, you need that reset, you need a little refresher, anyways, man is good.

It's good to stick your, your mind your body's like a computer every now and you got to reset your machine.

So focus properly, you know, so take care of your health as well.

If they say yes, very true.

Very true.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

So, so talking about tea, you know, so how are you guys?

You guys met in college, obviously.

Right.

Next question, are

you right?

to just throw in a curveball?

Sometimes a freestyle, you know, off the top, I think like I tell everybody previous like I thought a lot of curveballs man so I don't want to do number two crazy, but you know what, so the tiara, I know, is a very driven very task focused, which is great because me while while I'm very driven, I'm most likely you alluded to before, right?

My tasks are up here.

Right?

My my daily mental checklist is up here and get your rest everybody because if you keep it up here, you can quickly forget it too.

So, you know, my mental checklist is up here.

And I'm just curious man, like, you know, what the what the little TT used to know like, like, is that how to use always been always been like that task?

Boy goal oriented individual should like

I was gonna say college t I'm gonna wish he was going with that.

But they were always a year ahead of me.

So I was kind of I was the new the new guy on to the friend group.

You know, they had all you know y'all did a year plus knew each other before before school.

So yeah,

well, I came in not knowing anyone kind of new to the group and, and then you came in kind of after everyone.

Right?

So yeah, I mean, no, she was she was always the mom.

She was always the shape I want to sit by I want to use that.

I don't want to use tiara was.

You know what?

I'll say this.

I'll say this.

I can't speak much to her now because we haven't hung out.

Literally since then.

There.

Yeah.

I think the last time I saw you before this was bumped into you in Old Town.

But your mama says somebody came right away.

But um, but yeah, no, she's always she's been consistent.

I think not much has changed in her demeanor.

You know, she was never the part of the big party and type.

She was never the the she was always the one to keep to make us feel like we were willing.

She was always the best.

Yes, she was the one that always made us feel like but but she was always willing to let us wile out at her dorm.

So that was always cool.

This

is a funny story about that I was usually the hat out for them because no one would come looking for me no and have trouble you know, or anywhere I am.

I was the safe haven.

Okay.

Definitely the safe havens, boy.

Well, yeah, good.

Good times in college, it was a group of us, like six or seven of us that were, we're always together, it was pretty close.

And for the gallery open, some of us were able to come back and see each other.

So it was cool to kind of have a reunion, and then have the reunion in this space.

So to see, you know, how far you know, we've all come and then how much you know, Dallas and his team has created it was that was a good day.

None of us being the guy to come to the class reunion who's not doing anything.

Oh, everybody had something everybody got something going on.

And I think that's and then you know, shout out to those who I have anything going on.

Yeah, I'm saying this cool one day.

Yeah, yeah.

But it's seriously, as far as a friend group, it's awesome to see, you know, that you didn't have to, you'd have to look at anybody.

But then we left, we left Ray Ray behind them, look at them that we got to go help them like Should we get them help like, so we nobody has that problem in our friend group.

And I think that's dope because I know a lot of people who can't say the same thing.

So it's cool to see that we all stuck to it.

And I didn't finish it with you, I just, you know, as I gotten sick and dropped out.

But still, you know, and again to entrepreneurs, who cares, most of the world dropped out within 10 to say, they say, forget this, I can go make my own money.

You know, however you want to do it.

But I will say don't let anybody pressure you and tell you that there's only one way to do it.

That's that's actually not the case.

You know?

So

I think we were talking about that with Nicole, my sister was why the other day about how like, if you're, if you have your kids, and if they say, you know, what one being, you know, I don't want to go to college, or I want to go a different route, like, how would you feel about that?

And I would say, being completely honest, before I would have been like, no, you're going to college, you're doing this, but as the years have gone on, and, you know, I've jumped into this whole entrepreneurship thing, too.

I'm like, not here for the whole college thing.

Because I've seen kind of where it, where it took me in my mindset, and I think where you were going was I was kind of a square, it's okay, you could have said, that's where you're going.

And I was, I was very, you know, I didn't want to kind of rigid

the fact that she picked up on that.

And I think that was kind of school, like, you know, of course, I wasn't really into the partying, and you know, all that type of stuff.

But I just felt like I have to be here at this time, I have to do this, everything was just so templated and contribute that to, you know, being in the IB program, you know, in this area, and then go on to School of Engineering and these majors trying to get out in four years, and, you know, all this type of different stuff, trying to like just, you know, just make it through, I made myself think that I had to be this person that just stayed by the book, you know, and, and that's not it, because I think experience is the best teacher.

And so you know, it's taught me a lot.

And, you know, my kids, when they come up, as long as they have a vision, they have a plan of what they want to do, like you're not about to sit in my house and be like, I am going to school, and I do nothing, that's not an option.

I mean, as long as they have something that they want to do.

And in the sense, I know, when we were talking about, you know, taking time to rest and things like that, when you know, kids are in school, now there's a lot of pressure, there's a lot of things that they're having to deal with, and being open to giving your care today.

So yes, that's not you know, how it usually is, and how you can give your kids a day off of not having to be sick or anything like that.

But you just got to get out of the mindset of the usual things that people do and how people look at you and all of that, like, just let that go.

Like if your child needs a mental health day of your challenges, they're just tired, and they don't want to go to school, let them take a day.

Because I mean, we take vacation days, like you know, Nicole was saying we take vacation days, so why can't you know a child if they need that if they feel like they have a lot of pressure on them?

Why can't they take that and so that's, that's one thing I know, that I've learned throughout the years, and you're talking to other entrepreneurs, that you really have to just just just start figuring it out and not not being pressured to stick to what everyone else has done, or what everyone has always told you to do.

And how you just have to work a nine to five all your life and then hope that you have money to retire.

Like there's other options, it doesn't have to be that way in so many different areas of your life.

So um, I'm still learning and seeing how I can just go with the flow, okay?

Because I mean, like the world was so black and white at one point or another splashes of color everywhere, you know me so you don't have to, you know, you can do a test with the evolution of technology, the internet, we can learn anything, you can teach yourself anything, you know, but again, you may not need the degree but you got to have that passion, you got to have a goal in state.

I think that's that's extremely important.

More than the degree, right?

There's a drive to do something to be a part of something bigger than yourself.

If you have opportunity to do it, you know, just do it man.

Like you know, don't wait.

Tomorrow is not promised man Life is short.

You know, so short.

So definitely get up off the couch and you know, put yourself in the game.

Put yourself in the game.

It's very important for sure.

Absolutely.

So so you know back back on script now right.

So but that's that's good.

I'm always interested to meet people who were in tears circle because Tierra is such a she's different from a lot of people that I've come in contact with so it's always interesting to see it always been this way.

Yeah.

So, so Dallas missile.

So tell us man as you you know, we talked about Your vision your past your drive, where you see the AV going, how you see it becoming more integrated into the community, man, you know, where can people find out about, you know, the haven to some of the events you guys host?

Or the opportunities in the space?

And you know, where can they run you guys down at and look at you guys definitely support you.

Yeah, well,

mainly Instagram, haven arts VA on Instagram, and also my personal Instagram Dallas for president the number four.

And then our website haven arts va.com, which I will say sometimes might be a little, a few days behind in terms of some information but like I said, we're really small team, so bear with us as we as we ratchet things up.

But yeah, that's where you can find most of our stuff.

Okay.

Very cool.

Yeah, check them out, contact them, definitely, we'll put the address of the actual you know, gallery and event space on our show notes.

So if you guys that are in the area, you can come and check it out.

This is definitely space unlike anything I've seen before in the art world, I think like my my relationship to art is is always like, you know, our, you know, the Smithsonian Art Gallery.

The Atlanta or is the two in galleries down there places I've been to in Los Angeles, which a little more abstract.

But this is amazing.

To me.

What you create here is pretty cool.

So on some of those spots where you are, you know, your social media, your website, all those places where artists can link it with you to and discuss opportunities for to, for you to host their art here.

Yes.

So anybody who's interested in stuff like that, I would say reach out to me on instagram direct.

The reason I say that is I meet a lot of people in a day nowadays.

So it helps to have the instant face to the name.

Gotcha.

You know, because I'm the type person I never it will take me months before I save your number my phone.

So it will just be in there.

Like, literally sit here searching through my phone like, what did I say to them last I type it into search to try to figure out which one of these five seven ones just as this person, so definitely contact me on Instagram.

That's the best way to get to me I literally answer every every message now until I blow up then you know?

No, seriously, like, you can hit me on Instagram, you can send a you know, do the comments section on the on the website or through the havens arts Instagram, which is managed by me and Jose.

So somebody will get to you on that very though that's the best place to reach us

there.

Very cool, very cool young local artists worldwide man, you know, the check it out, come through.

And even those who are just interested in space for an event, work event, child child event, some fun, he told you about some of the creativity, they put in a way they transitioned downstairs into a beach was still kind of mind blowing.

To me.

That's crazy.

But I think you know, we look at the space you have here is very user friendly.

And the fact that you and your team are so accommodating to anybody who wants to use the space for something is also unique in itself too.

So definitely, definitely hats off to me.

Thank you for creating something so great.

Yeah, and

as far as my project, about as far as the kids parties goes, we also do like kid painting service.

So we get like locally.

So let them mix their own little drinks.

And Tiana is a certified child professional too.

So no.

So if you do bring your kids here, you know, we got somebody who CP CPR certified, like, we also have it to where the parents can come upstairs to the lounge and they can hang out, please have a glass of wine.

But then we also have cameras throughout the building.

So they can actually see what their kids are doing stairs from upstairs.

So it's quite on the big screen.

And so they have that peace of mind.

So even though we have a childcare professional, we also they can see and know that you know, cool, so we bring in like a instructor and you know, to teach kids how to paint and all that we give them their own easels.

And yeah, that's pretty dope.

I love Have you thought that through, like all the type of, you know, things that the parent would think about.

You've kind of thought that through so you have something Yes, you can still see it.

Yes.

You know, someone's certified so a lot of people would just pass that exactly.

No, we don't want any of that.

Especially not on the watch.

paint, paint.

Paint is 100% non toxic.

Yeah, I'm saying all our glue non toxic.

I love it.

I eat it all.

Gotcha.

not encouraged, but it's okay.

Yeah.

kids will be kids.

I know.

And it goes on to all too old man was dope man.

Like say, dude, we definitely appreciate your work and massage into your space.

It's a breath of fresh air.

You know, we have our own studio where we do our podcast.

We're just you know us pretty much looking at each other rolling eyes to rolling eyes me most of the time.

Because Ray's comments y'all be here we

certify gains spitter.

But it's all good, though.

You know, like, I think I think it's important to understand what's out there in the community is what you guys live in, which is why I'm I mean, I'm excited to be here too, because I didn't know that Hayden was here.

And now that I know I guarantee you know, I'd love to stay connected with Dallas and his team thanks to your for the introduction.

Absolutely don't need you anymore.

mentioned I don't think that was touched on this.

But he also is an artist himself.

Yes.

And so we have one of his original paintings I'll be sure to post that so you guys can see it and we were we were

the only original Oh the only we have the only original

painting

there's two more originals I have but they're both tables that I mean they're not they're not painting so yes that's the only original painting

I feel special we feel special yes in the

massive fight with my daughter over where it's gonna go

now it's gonna go on maybe I'll just make her one.

Oh man no she would love that she would absolutely love that.

She would she would appreciate it we would too but you know we will continue to support you no matter what you do man and I got some of the some of the archer created here if it's not it's not paintings I look I look at tables to there

you were I'll show you soon as we don't ya heard that right.

Yeah, I heard that he he said he was gonna buy but he'll look at

what does that mean is man I don't want to disappoint.

But it's all good.

It's all good man.

But again, thank you so much for allowing us to come into your your gallery and event space and being open to being our guest today.

Yes, thank

you.

Oh, it was fun.

And before we wrote like what what are the hours what are the hours so it's it's it's private so it's it's pretty much invite only your by appointment?

So but like I said that that means that that sounds more you know, don't just hit me hit me up on Instagram.

If you want to come up just let us know most most of the time we're here after four somebodies usually here but like I said, we all have those day jobs.

So until that's the thing of the past after for pretty much any day.

Gotcha.

But yeah, just shoot me a message Dallas for President.

Yeah, and we could set up a time for y'all to come check it

Perfect, nice.

So delta appreciate Joseph Dallas.

Look forward to coming back and seeing you again to at a later date.

You know, just checking what you guys see see what you're up to and how you guys are evolving and continuing to provide a great service to the community man again for me, thank you so much for hosting us today.

Appreciate it.

Look forward to the great things that comment a appreciate out.

Nice.

Nice.

y'all.

Thank you and maybe next time, I'll come to your studio and

I appreciate everybody.

Thank you so much and we look forward to seeing guys get on the next go around.

Until then.

Peace.

check us out man.

Stay solid peace.