Welcome to episode four ninety three of five and five.

It is Monday, September twenty second.

I am your host, cry Goldstein, joined as usual by Patrick Dubuk and Jeffrey Pattern Nostro.

Gentlemen, how was the weekend?

Do we have any banter?

So?

My kid had her first stay home from school secon Day and can open share them?

Yeah, we had a juicy Burke's incident on Friday.

I'm glad that's surviving.

Yeah, I mean she was, she was fine by like eight am.

But also I didn't get into there later work honestly.

Yeah, but like I don't know, Like she's not going to watch Prices right with me, which is just what I did when I stayed home from school, Like I don't.

I don't know dem she's not, thankfully, although the just the town this weekend because rap is being put on somewhere.

But uh so we had a Happy Meal Saturday and they have like the Happy Meal toy right now is like a K pop.

Yes whatever, demon Hunter is it just a kid?

They didn't get the rights to anything.

They made up their own K pop band and made toys of it.

I think it's a real band.

I don't think it is.

I think it's inspired, it's inspired by I don't know.

Yes, so the one she got was just named V the letter b uh.

She has another one too, So they're like hanging out BTS.

It is BTS.

I don't know.

Who's I've heard of them even so.

Well, i've heard of them, but I know who's in them.

I thought it said it was like BTS inspired or something.

Maybe it's literally Btscdonald's.

And BTS released new Happy Meal with Tiny Tan toys.

No, I don't, but.

I don't think it's actually I don't think it's actually the BTS toys of the BTS members.

I think they made up their own K pop band.

I understanding.

Uh.

It will include two sets of special tiny Tan toys inspired by each of the seven.

Members inspired by but this, well, I hear you ont inspired by like that's like it also inspired by a true story.

Usually it's not actually the story right.

Like, but it's got the blessing of the story.

In this case, they are working with them on.

That's under saying that I grant you, I grant you.

It's a weird.

Again, I don't know who the members of BTS are, so I can't is a tiny Boss.

I don't know.

I've already had to learn what a like.

I mean, it looks like No, I still don't really know what that is, and I don't know what six seven is, and I'm fine with both.

Oh, I do know about that as well.

It's stupider than you could that's fine.

I'm not worried about it.

No, I'm not going to explain more.

I'm just telling stupider than you could have been.

But I don't know if there's a V in BTS right, like, I don't know.

Uh, well, well you don't have to look it up.

A lot of playoffs.

V V is one of the group's seven.

Okay, so it's just BTS five inspired by, but also Josh.

BTS inspired inspired by in this case means funko popifyed.

That's the they're kind of funko poppy, yes, or there maybe a tiny Tan is a funko pop like you.

Want to know any members of BTS.

No, Okay, I don't need to know these things, good because I probably was gonna they had one like, I don't know if it was like I think it was like a k Pie.

It wasn't from BTS.

Like some fairly known K pop band guy doing a solo tour, and they played the venue that is right next to the kids dance class, and I at three o'clock, which is when her dance class was.

Then like the line was around the block waiting to get in for this.

Yeah, I don't like it.

It's it's kind of freeing in a way to be at the age where I don't have to understand these things.

Well you will.

Yeah, getting who bts is every day of getting older is just further understanding our parents.

Yeah they have whatever.

The don't generally feels bad, right, I don't remember.

It's like an insurance company ad.

That's it's progressive.

It was like the it's not like those are like they're they're very like stupid marketing.

I love Doctor Rick.

I'm but like it's just like it's it's entering the you know, the it's like the Grandpa Simpson.

I used to be it and they change what it was and then happened.

It's having me.

It's great, feels great, fucking great.

There's in your neck o Case album out this week.

I'm great.

Also, I did.

I felt like I had to look up what a tiny tan was sure the the AI answer.

I'm gonna be honest.

Okay, well they have fine.

You don't want to, you don't want to, you don't want to scroll further under don't really it's fair is.

A collection of Chibis style animated characters based on the members of the South Korean group BTS.

So this is not a wider world this is okay, this is this is not a BTS jump the McDonald's version of the BT.

But like they created an entire thing called tiny Tan, which I'll continue to not understand what that is, but it is only BTS.

Okay, So it's like the BTS branded it's not really.

I mean, it's smaller than a funk, but their heads aren't as wide.

The heads are larger than their bodies, but they're not as wide.

Yeah, right, I to admit I didn't expect the podcast to go this way.

No, I didn't either.

Is she feeling better?

Yeah?

She's fine today, Okay, Yeah, some days get some day.

She got to watch Wings with me on USA during her nice there you go during her.

For me.

My microwave exploded this weekend.

It began emitting a smoke so toxic smelling and acrid that I am not sure if I'm actually here now or if I'm just six sensing this podcast.

It could be gone.

I had to like just take it outside and let it smoke outside in the way where it could disperse the vapors.

It was so bad.

So I have no mic grave right now.

My other my other piece of banter is that I took my son to a soccer game, a child's soccer game this weekend.

It's participating.

No, it's his best friend is on a soccer team, and she wanted him to come watch, uh, attend his games.

And I'm like, all right.

The mom gave me the schedule and I said, okay, we're doing the first one.

That that sounds like sending your son to with another parent to me.

Yeah, I know, I don't have transaction right.

Because your child wants my child at your event.

Sounds like he's in your car.

It's okay, I went.

I was like, you know, and it actually wasn't you know.

I'm expanding on my watching sports.

I don't watch.

After the volleyball and I got there and I'm like, I I played soccer as a kid and I hated it.

I was not good at it.

I didn't enjoy it.

It's just my parents.

Just yeah, my parents just made me do it for like seven and I was weak enough to not object for like seven years.

I played soccer for a long time.

Sure, and I'm watching it and like it's pretty good, honestly, Like it's a sport you can you can make yourself watch.

Very popular.

It's a very popular one.

Very popular sport.

Not perhaps in this.

Form seven on seven no goalkeepers or there were.

No statistics, because there was you know, we're in a field high, but if there were, I think with kicks would be one of the stats where just the girl would wind up and kick and just get there.

It's like the ace of soccer, except it's just the ball against the ace.

But like I'm enjoying it.

And his friend like actually like basically drove down the entire field herself, dribbled past four people, missed a shot and then had had a ricochet off the goalie and somebody else scored, so she got the assist.

Was in president like and my son is picking the little rubber flex out of the artificial turf, lying on his stomach, just miserable to be there, and.

Like he was like complaining.

He's like, why did they keep ringing that cow bell?

Why are they why are they shouting?

I'm like, because somebody scored a goal.

Man, Like if you, if you were watching, you might put them put those things together.

But I'm not sure he would, like there's something about it like sports passes.

Through him, like radio ways.

It is fascinating.

That's the only way you can consume the Colorado Rockies.

So I don't know.

I just want to share a related soccer story since you're talking about you know how long you played it and hated it.

I did not hate it when I was a kid.

I actually liked it.

I enjoyed it.

My mother hated it, and I mysteriously she missed a deadline for signing me up for the next season of soccer when I was like, I don't know, nine or ten, and I found out later it wasn't it was intentional.

Yep.

She just decided that's it.

That's the end of this for you.

I can't do it anymore.

Yeah.

They gave me the dates and I was like, all right, which, you know, we're going in September.

We are not doing this in November.

We're not going to stand out in the rain.

Like there is a point where it's like I can't understand how everybody deals with this.

Oh yeah, the kid is talking about wanting to play soccer again, like very excited about it.

It doesn't this fall because the verse FIM class, but maybe in the Sprague.

But like last time we played, like she wouldn't get on the field, but she's like she really want to see it again.

But she scored, yeah, which is great.

Like I'm trying to she won't watch Wednesday with me, and God blessed, I don't even I don't want to be watching it right now.

But yeah, I will say that I did just say I liked it a lot.

But I my coaches were like, you can come to practice, you just can't play in the games.

And I was like, well, I'm not going to do that.

Yeah, signed, I.

Didn't pay for it, but they were like, can you can practice, which was fine, which is actually like at my age now, I'm like, oh, that's actually like that's a fair offer.

But like at the time, I was like, well, I don't know.

Yeah, so I'm not going to practice to not play.

I probably would have.

I don't like the practice game, I said.

I liked it, but I guess I didn't act well.

No, I was just like you.

Nobody passed to be in the actual games, in the practices they had to.

Yeah, it seems like like another pressure.

You just like screw around.

All right, my my, you know the real I just share.

I'm just gonna be honest with the with the listeners here, we've gone long on banter, so we're gonna move it on anyway.

But I did.

I did have some banter, but I I am choosing to keep it.

I got into a little bit of an argument at a a coach pitch.

No, I'm not going to go into the whole thing.

I'm just it's a teaser.

They don't get to know.

I could have just started recording like five minutes earlier than we did.

No, I'm not going into Craig just wants to pitch clock.

Yeah, but but that's what that's what happened to me this weekend.

I didn't I did you know?

There was like a banter thing, But it's it's not something I should be divulging in full.

So it is what it is.

Let's let's go to our first segment, the junior Circuit.

The Blue Jays pull up out of a spiral.

They are up around three on around three because they got a tiebreaker.

Yeah, but they also clinched t breakers stuff.

Just they clinched a playoff spot.

The only team in the Ale to do so.

Are they really?

Yeah?

Yeah, I guess they are.

Well, uh, yeah, they are two games up, but because they have the tiebreaker, it's two and a half and we can't do it.

Yeah.

I noticed that I saw Joshian posts on this over the weekend.

But like the tiebreaker stuff, just not being settled on the field sucks.

Yep.

Yeah, it's so bad.

Yeah, nobody, nobody likes tiebreakers.

Nobody wants this except you know the count the players in the accounts.

Yeah, they have shortened their rotation to four.

That includes Trey and Savage, which means it excludes Jose Burrios.

Yes, it was not empty.

No, oh is he not?

I had not seen it.

Isn't Bassett hurt so it might include him again?

Now?

Yes, Bassett, that's that's on the I l with back inflammation.

He supposed they back dated it so that he will be eligible for the first round.

Sure, but yes, it's Gossman.

Gosman Gosmin Bieber Bassett is probably the third, and then question Mark, yes, Savage, I guess it is the one.

But yeah, you know, he he's given up five runs and nine innings.

It's not been a walk in the park.

He does have nine strikeouts.

Sorry, that was nine strikeouts in his first start.

He has eleven strikeouts, five walks.

You know, Jeff, you watched some of his first game.

Was it the the splitter?

The splitter was just basically I think I hit something like seventy just like something stupid on some level of league.

Will it generally adjust to this to an extent?

They might not do it before the end of October, right.

Yeah, I mean my my sense was he has to be out of the zone.

I mean, or he was out of the zone.

I don't know he has to be, but he was.

And so the question is to me, how long.

To get a fastball like it's a good like he's got a full repertoire.

I do think walks Kennon will be a problem in the short to medium term, right.

Right, It's not My point wasn't that he can't be in the zone, but that his style of pitching right now is I'm gonna throw it out of his zone.

You're like, it's gonna look like a strike until it's not.

But if if major league hitters start start spitting on those, and like he walks in two strikeouts against the Royals, Yeah, you know, in a lineup that includes Jack Tagleon among others, you know that's isn't among others particularly well, there's well, my my point being that he's no, it is not no.

No, My point being that he strikes out a lot, and that he got two strikeouts against Yeah, a lineup with Jack, that's all.

I think.

Ideally you'd be using him as like your mid inning's bridge or whatever in the playoffs and things like that.

But the starting rotation is not pitting.

Like Bassett hasn't pitched twelve before the injury, so.

Right, and Sureser hasn't had a quality starting more than a month.

Cosmon has been the yeah, and and Peever's been great.

Yeah.

But like again, there's no good teams in the air, which is why they only want to have cluched the playoff spot so far.

I don't know how any amsition start up.

Yeah, three five, seven, are right, you had one blow up start one blow that's the second start was not good.

That's why I wasn't wasn't sure, But no, Gosman's.

Been goin better than I thought.

His was like a half point higher.

No, he's been really good.

He's eating a lot of Inians.

It's funny too, because like how you're talking about your savages a little bit.

Is the Kevin Gosmin story obviously strong for a long time, but like it was all about you know, the split.

Finger, and I think that's gonna be like the current commenty like Jacob isier Awski right who they're moving right of Milwalk.

I think it's a different arsenal, but it's the same kind of idea.

Yeah, I mean, I guess if Bassett is it is so what I apologize, Like, what is the story with sure as healthy?

Is he not going to be the fourth guy?

He doesn't looked good and they I don't think they.

I don't think he've talked about it because like wide heelers, I wouldn't want to do it.

But like, is he the fourth best starter on this team?

Like I don't, yeah, but I know you know, And again this is like far out of the field of saber.

Yeah.

His last start was two thirds of any.

Well, that was, yeah, but but he wasn't great before that either.

He you know, he's been given all four runs a lot.

Now, I think, does it really matter in the sense that somebody's pitching an he is one through three, and somebody's pitching four through six, Like, probably not as much as you would would be in the regular season, right.

We didn't even mention it.

We didn't mention your flower.

Yeah, well, because they had hunted him to the pen already and he hasn't been very good there.

He's been kind of struggling there too, so he's not even an answer, you know.

I just this is one of those things where I think with a with a I think even the more advanced sabermetrically inclined managers or whatever, like you have Max Scherzer and you have Trey Savage, and yeah, you just you're probably gonna go with Max Scherzer, right, Like, one is a guy who's made at this point, he's going to have made three career starts, maybe four, I don't know how many, probably three, and the other is a future Hall of Famer, and they're both kind of coin flips, right, I mean, maybe not even coin flips.

But yeah, just if you have a question either, right, so you probably just go with maxers are in that situation to not piss off maxterers or I don't know, well, it's probably not.

I don't think it matters.

I really don't think, right, well, that's my point is if it doesn't matter, like, don't you just not which maybe is the coward's way out, but I don't It seems also fairly reasonable to me.

I don't think.

I don't think there's anything wrong with doing that.

But yeah, like I mean, part of.

The problem I think for Toronto is that they have options.

And that's why we're talking about this, right, Like a lot of the teams in the American League, those are their third fourth starters, So like you don't have to argue about which bad picture is going to start the fourth game, because they're just going to start the thirty and fourth game.

So I don't know, it's an entire it's an entire rotation made out of Lucas Giolito's right, exactly.

And we do we do have a Bobochet injury update.

Oh yeah, he was asked for his injury status or whatever.

His fonts was getting better every.

Day, Okay, I mean that's inspiring.

Yeah, very inspiring.

He did.

He did some light hitting, grind grind set culture it is yeah.

Uh yeah.

I don't anything else on on.

I don't like this is the best.

They're not good, like no one is.

They're not bad, not bad, Jeff, I don't know what to tell you.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, they're good.

They're a good team.

Good thing is I think they are good.

They're not great great.

Every single Ale playoff review is just going to be these two teams start having a mid off.

Well yeah, honestly, I don't think that extends that.

I think you can extend that to that.

That's the majors this year.

Milwaukee's been, you know, coming back to earth a little bit.

Well, I mean we have a we have a very We could catch them pretty easily.

The Branchers Swars just got like beat up in it, like they lost to it three hours.

I don't know, they have this.

We have a weird time right now because because like you have the Mariners and Guardians right nine of the last ten, the next two hottest teams in baseball, you know where they are, Braids and Marlins.

Marlins out of ten, the Braids are nine out the Tigers tires.

Yeah, so like, yeah, you have.

Man, I've watched teams that don't exist are winning this many games.

Then teams do exist must be losing a bunch of them.

Right.

Just speaking of the Tigers very briefly, I know we'll deal with them, but like, did you watch the the will Vest employees did?

Yeah?

Moley, that that was I mean.

They had just you know, they had just had like the torqual Sin Homer to to you know, take the lead.

Oh man, that was unreal.

Yeah, all right, the same story it's been all year.

Speaking of which, let's let's go to the Al West.

The Mariners swept the Astros Patrick.

They are up three plus.

I'm gonna say it's because they have the tiebreaker with six to go in three three le six to go three against the Rockies At this point, having the Rockies left on your schedule is very bad.

Uh.

They they have one nine of ten as you as you alluded to it sure seems like they're going to win the division.

Yeah, I will say must win game last night for the Astros.

I don't think you can let Jason Alexandra wear it in the second ding.

As much as they did well.

Yeah, yeah, they probably should have done got the hook earlier.

I know that they like them.

You let him face JP Crawford because it's lefty lefty.

I guess I still might be more aggressive there.

Back to the Grands, like I gotta get out of there at five.

Yeah, yep, I had both teams were went out, bullpens had both been used quite a bit.

But yeah, no, it's it's uh.

I mean they got three things from a from aj blue ball anyway, right, Like you could just he didn't give you the length regardless, right right, you did not know?

He got one more out, yeah, and then a third seven runs.

You know, it felt like it felt like the Astros pitching couldn't keep doing this.

And yes, the yesterday example got credit to the haters.

Yeah, they were right.

I also think a big part of this story has been, like Logan, Gilbert looked good again.

Not elite, you know, four strikeouts and six innings, but he's looked good.

They've gotten some balls George Kirby start in this mix, uh, and those guys have kind of been underperforming most of the year, which feels strange to say when Gilbert has like a three four e ra which is not bad, but it's also not not the Logan Gilbert standard.

Speaking of their pitching, we almost did.

It, guys, as.

We almost did it, Jeff Jeff sent the.

Group chat has gotten into the MRI machine.

A tale is old as time.

Also, it's like, I understand that he's going to the aisle with a pack strain, but I also think he's star.

Is he is he going to the ale because the he's they have not decided whether he is not.

So he's making his next start and going five and a third because that's Brian Wu.

I mean, yeah, I'm guessing that they skip the started the I'm guessing what they what they hope is that they've clinched it, and then yeah they can they just they can just skip the start.

But in Logan Eppens or something.

Right, But yeah, yeah, the the team leader in innings, Brian Wu.

Uh yeah, this has made every start, hasn't it.

I think?

So let's see, let's see, uh thirty thirty starts, so I think he missed one.

Yeah, but yeah, son, And then this is another Toronto Blue Jay situation right where if if if he's healthy, you're number one through four starters are said right, I don't even know who is your fourth start?

Is that Luis Castillo is the worst starter in this team?

It has to be with and Gilbert?

What are what's the order you're going?

Then?

Well, I don't who's the best one?

I'll see that.

Yeah, he's the All Star.

I like, I don't know.

I think Castillo is fourth just because like he's more betted ball.

So you're pumping who are you bumping?

I sue Gilbert Gilbert?

It would go Wu, Gilbert, Kirby Castillo.

I think, so who who am I?

But?

But well, who are you missing?

Like if Wu can't pitch, then you've got either Logan Evans, who's still coming off of an injury himself, or you've got Emerson Hancock.

There is literally but do you need a fifth starter?

Ever?

Know?

But like if WU can't pitch and you need a fourth starter, Oh, that's where the Mariners are in trouble.

Oh, I say, because they've been using they've been using Logan Evans and Emerson Hancock is their fifth starter.

Well, you probably use Logan Evans and heavily deploy your bullpen.

Yeah, it's essentially going to be a bullpen day.

Bryce Miller's the other way say it was worse than Logan Evans.

I think at this point he's not.

He also, did you guys see the Victor Roblaze catch on that Oh?

Yes, okay, and that was but it's like out of nowhere.

The cinematography really made that catch just it was it was like twenty tens NFL commercial with like backers sacking the person.

Yeah, that's what that felt like.

He just flew in from that screen.

It was great.

I do also, I would challenge you.

I don't know if you're looking at the box score, Jeffrey, but you were talking about letting Jason Alexander wear it.

Do you know who the right fielder was for the the Astros.

In this skin.

Was a Taylor Tramael.

It was not Taylor Tramael.

That is a valid guess.

Absolutely.

I'm going to tell you someone hitting two ninety six with a nine to ninety seven ops.

Right now, No Dylan wars on the Rangers.

It's someone I've never heard of.

Oh that's that's why I haven't heard of the meet there, go ahead, Zach Cole.

Oh yeah that Cole.

Yeah, he's like been like you had like a home run first a bat.

Sure, yeah, no, he's getting The reason the Astros are still here even though they had an incredibly bad injury luck is that they just.

Keep getting Zach Coles.

And it's kind of like, you know, yeah, but I also tell you what the Rangers were doing for a while.

But I also feel like the reason the Astros are here, which is second place in the in the West, is that like they're running out Zach Cole.

And I know he's hitting.

I understand that, but like, come all right, uh, there are four teams for three spots in the wild Card.

Boston is struggling, Detroit wishes they were Boston, and then we have Cleveland.

Were Yeah, I don't where where do you want to start here?

Do you want to start with Cleveland or the Kims?

Can we talk about Boston?

And I'm not I'm not saying that in a request more, is is it possible to talk about Boston?

Like I feel like the Red Sox have just been or whatever.

Basically, yeah, they are.

The least notable playoff.

Team, Cleveland playing well and Detroit playing not well.

So I just kind of like in the conversation, now.

Yeah, yeah, Houston and Cleveland are now tied for the third wildcard, one back of Boston.

And Cleveland has a tiebreaker, so Houston is technically out of the spot right now.

Right.

I love this system.

Yeah, never let me forget.

Yeah, I don't know.

Yeah, Boston is just they're just treading water.

Yeah, it's like whether someone can catch them or not.

I guess they're not even really treading water, but like they're they're they're dying slower than everyone else.

Yeah.

The Star they coinly early had like a bad first inning against the Rais last night.

He's been great in his first two starts, but a little bit wild in the in the first inning and then they just didn't score.

And look they just got will your a bray you back?

That lineup's been a little.

Is not hitting at all anymore?

Correct, Ye know, they missed, they.

Missed Roman Anthony is the reality of it.

And like I know, Roman Gonzalez still has a one thirty oh ps plus, but you know, they've had a lot of those guys kind of come back to earth.

He's had it.

He's actually been fine over the last month, but his last week, which unfortunately matters right now, has been pretty bad.

Abraham Toro tailed off pretty hard.

Yeah, I mean, you know who that has the highest well bond the team offensively in the month of September.

I don't I didn't even know he was on this team.

Nate Neaton.

Oh yeah, Nate, Sure, we talked about him.

I believe Jeff brought him up within the last month or so.

Yeah, I mean, honestly, Nathaniel Low has been a nice pick up to supplant Toro at first base overall, but like Yoshida has been bad as a d.

H right, Anthony hurt and Bregman not hitting him as well as he was at the start of the season.

It's a lot of like average in a lineup right now.

Yeah, and a lot of pitching that's very average as well, right.

I mean, sometimes that means you're gonna go forward sex for ten games if the pen blow is water kind of you.

Know, maybe a good song.

Bregman has an eight eighteen ops in his last two weeks, eight forty in his last week, so maybe there's something there.

But I mean, Bregman's been fine, but like it's no, he's no, I.

Know, but yeah, that's actively good, yes, and yeah.

It's mostly like the offense, you know, it's easier to talk about the offense of the Red Sox.

It always is easier to talk about the offense with the Red Sox.

Their pitching just hasn't Like they are the anti Guardians right now, Like their starting pitching is just not getting it done.

And like their pictures, like it's the same, it's the same guys.

Yeah, the same.

I mean it's the same guys, like the same kind of guys as the Guardians pitching staff too.

That's true, there's.

Not a lot of difference in like Ryan Bellow and Tanner Biby right now.

Well, but I was also going to say it's not really the same guys because like they the Red Sox are just pulling levers left and right.

They're like Peyton Toley, come on down Conn only early, come on.

They used totally out of the bullpen too on Sunday the Great.

Listen, there's managing happening, yes, right, Like they are pushing buttons.

Okay, this is not someone looking at the two buttons and not sure what to do.

They're pressing all the buttons.

It just kind of looks like keyboards.

Slamming the keyboard.

Yeah, which brings us to Cleveland.

Yes, yes, which we talked about in passing in passing, excuse me, uh maybe with a little derision last time.

And I'm here to say I was I'm here to say I was right.

They keep winning.

There was this team is not good.

There was a tweet from Jeff Passon speaking of right, which is like it's during their wedding streak, Like they're doing this all with two above average hitters.

What a great front office?

Like, No, if you're a good front office should have more than two above and should be able to find more than two above average yams.

That's part of your job, right, So he said, like, you don't get credit for giving Daniel Schneman four hundred plate appearance.

It's just because the team is winning.

He was good early on in the scene the entire history of sports writing.

Yes, I know, it's like you're not allowed to have object permanence.

I understand this.

God, I wish I wish I could find that that post, because yeah, it was.

It was basically like it's Hosey Ramirez and everybody else like they're there.

It was basically like this team is actively bad.

What a front office?

Yeah?

Yeah, And it was like wait, whoa, whoa wait a minute, Like, you know, circumstances that you pointed out would indicate maybe not the best front office.

Yeah.

Do you know who is tied with Jose rams for the highest way to runs created plus on the team, Craig.

Hide with Jose Ramirez.

Oh is it George Valeria?

George run against the Twins.

The Twins just rolled out a usk of a team.

I say that, but they did.

They did actually pitch Pablo Lopez who went on the aisle.

They pitched Joe Ryan, who gave up a lot of.

Home runs, including to Jose Ramirez, but George Lai George Valeria did get one.

Yeah, Like Kyle Manzardo has been.

Fine, Kylenarto has been fine.

But like when you're talking about a one fifteen, uh, like ops plus from a last first basement or whatever.

I'm gonna hit in the middle of that lineup as possible.

It's like that again, that's solid.

I'm not that's I'm not dumping on that, but like that's what you what you need out of that position, and they don't get what they need out of anyone else, you know.

Fine, See I'm not worried about Stephen.

Watch sure you said accept the pitching, I.

Said, except this month where everybody Austin I don't know Hedges.

Is that what's happening?

I have not looked at like the team's.

Yeah, Austin Hedges is slugging for seventy eight in September, so and he's nowhere near the top of the list bon Naylors slugging.

Fighting hobsctically.

The more impressive part is Austin Hedges has a three hundred on base percentage.

Yeah, yeah, he did it.

Yeah, like those seventeen seven players are above average and several are exactly average.

Has been great this month, yep.

I don't think that's gonna stay.

Like I actually think he can hit a little bit.

He's like around league average.

For this brand.

Rokio put together seventy five league average at bats and that seems impossible.

He's doing it.

Twenty twenty four, David Frye is back briefly.

Also probably not gonna like an eight to one strike out to walk Ratio.

But yeah, but.

Yeah, like this this is just this is a team that gets hot, and like, I think part of the problem is that if you can't, if you can't, if you don't wait.

Here, wait a minute, they kind this, Yes, this is a team that has gotten hot.

You said, this is a team that gets hot, and like, I don't know if that's.

True about it's not like a trait and of the team.

It is true, it has happened.

That means it happens.

Anything that has happened.

Then also happens, like an oncological quandary exactly exactly.

We don't like, we don't like that this is this is like, this is just felting practice.

They showed it off in batting practice.

I just feel like a little bit here.

No what what I'm saying about passing.

What I'm saying is that, like the problem is if you don't use the hero worship, if you don't do this, you know this tacky like there, you have to.

Accept that nothing else to say, Well, you have to accept that none of this has any meaning, right all a random number generator spinning out new statistics that we used to make narratives.

The flip side of this, speaking.

Of the in a minute.

Speaking of the narrative, though, like the flip side of this is that Cleveland has has always been able to or this recent vintage of Cleveland has always been able to pitch, right, Yeah, yeah, they are pitching.

They have a two three e r A in September.

That's a full run better than the next closest team, which is the Mariners, who are also uh you know, which is a team that also gets hot.

As Patrick would say, they will have been getting hot.

We will, they are TJ.

Fodell, We will have appreciated TJ.

Fordell.

I.

Yeah, the pitching.

Has been very good.

We ran down this last.

The pitching has the pitching is not good.

The pitching has been very good.

Yeah, right, but like this, look I'm gonna double down.

I don't I don't buy.

I don't buy this at all.

They might make the playoffs.

I don't care.

They're not good.

I said this about the thing I said about my first quote on the past and thing was that we hit on every one of those notes in in the podcast, and passing ended up at what a great front office, and we ended up at the sixth wild card is bullshit.

The playoff spot is bullshit.

And I think we were right.

That's all I'm saying.

That said, it is the largest comeback.

Yeah, look, the Tiger.

We haven't talked about the Tigers and the Tigers have certainly played their part.

Here's here's okay, before we get into the Tigers.

Here's here's a question.

I just thought of, Patrick, because I know you were looking up com like the comebacks and whatever.

Would there have been larger comebacks among teams like before the playoffs were expanded.

That's something I would be interested in.

I suspect not.

It's a lot of it.

They might win the division, is the thing, like, regardless of what.

Yeah, but there there were I'm not the historical one of the three of us, much less anyone at baseball perspectives, but like I know, there were teams that made incredible runs and ended up second place and didn't make the playoffs right like way back.

So I'm just kind of curious, like how it compares historically now.

It might end up at the top of all that, but I don't know.

It's like they had this incredible run to make up fifteen and a half games since July eighty seven wins.

That's true, like A I don't know anyway.

Would you like to talk about the Tigers, or as I like to call them, the al Mets.

Everything's just going I mean, the Mets are like the Mets are sneaking out of here, and they're not really because of the Tigers struggles recently, but A J.

Hintry like you to know they're still they're still playing hard.

He sees the first place team, they're still in first place.

They control their own destiny all, which is true.

When he says when he says, I see a first place team, all I can think of is like the eye.

Exam, where yeah, you get you get the August.

The Tigers, and then the September Tigers, and then with like which one looks sharper.

I would just like to point out Kevin mcgon ken.

McGonagall is hitting like six hundred with three home runs in the Eastern League playoffs right now.

Yeah, oh man, Like.

That's Hobby Bias is Hobby Bias has one walk since like twenty twelve.

I think I read about this on Friday.

But like he's on there is on a Fawley roster because he like missed some time early in the season.

Like he can't you cannot send him to Arizona.

If you make the playoffs, you can't do it.

Fifty three ops plus.

You gotta do that.

You gotta do the Alex curl off here he should have been of a week ago, two weeks ago.

I mean, this is this is literally the team.

I mean this is a historical poll, Craig.

Yeah, but this is the team that when the world won the World Series nineteen sixty eight, turned tow center fielder into its starting shortstop in the World Series, like just after the regular season was over.

The like came up Whenki was transitioning right to the shortstop.

But like just literally in three days before the World Series.

Guess what, uh they can do that?

Like you know, I think that Parker Meadows get to shortstop.

I mean I mean I will I will mention here that they've actually hit fine.

Yeah, thank you Jamia Jones, thank you, Thank.

You mostly to Jamia Jones.

But like Parker Meadow has been good, Torque has been good, Garry Carpenter has been fine.

Well, Parker Meadows.

Are you saying of late September there were some struggles for parking it was, yeah, I mean.

Like Riley Green has been very bad.

Yeah, well and Patrick he wrote about Riley Green for box Score Banner didn't didn't you?

Yeah?

It is ther sections but like it's it's kind of in a like where he's come up in these situations where they need some contact and he's just not even if it's out and he's just not giving him the contact right now.

It's not what he's made for.

I'm just looking the shortstop.

They're an easy way to do this.

Probably not they're short stop.

You're trying to get the shortstop position instead of.

Trying to get Yeah, so they are.

They're shortstops.

Are four for forty seven in the month of September.

You know, wow, Yeah, the Giants zero strikeouts.

The Giants called on Bryce Saldridge and it's not going great.

He did have a basis clearing double for his first hit, but it's not going great.

But I also feel like just about the match, they should have called up Carson Bench two weeks ago.

Pull the level right, push the buttons.

It's one thing, but you know.

It's one thing.

If Tray Sweeney was having his twenty twenty four season where it's you know too, thirty two, ninety four hundred with decent defense, right, you just live with it.

These are black holes.

And just I thought it was very funny because I did that sort too.

So the Tigers have a eighty seven w RSC plus from short stop.

Last place is the Cleveland Guardians.

Come with Brian Rocky three fifteen.

Yeah, it's not one we're saying, it's not Tray Sweeney's ball, Like clearly, clearly you can succeed without him.

Why would you blame him?

Charlie No, I mean has been terrible and kider Mont but like everybody else's pitch, well, kider Montero has this again.

I'm just using September because it's when it's all happened.

More or less.

Kider Montero is a three point four to sixty ra Schooble's under three.

Clairty is just a little over three.

Casey mayeses three six eight.

No, but it's it's the bullpen.

The bullpen.

Yeah, I mean this is obviously a massive ran a year ago, and just these guys are are I don't know if they if they're gassed specifically or well.

They they literally gone out a bunch of extra ones, right, that was their their strategy was to get a bunch of dudes and and one of them.

That strategy kind of worked.

They got Kyle Finnegan.

He was amazing.

Yeah, he's actually been good still.

Yeah, he got hurt for a while they've got like a too eight e R A from Troy Melton in for it's not even that all these other They went and got Chris Paddock, who has been atrocious.

Yeah it was Morton is even worse.

Yeah, yeah, Finnegan is back in healthy a point six e R in fifteen twenty one strikeouts.

In four walks.

Yeah, that's wild for Kyle Finn.

But yeah, you know, even Raphael and Taro has been okay, ye, top line results anyway, he's walking too many guys.

Montero's right, But yeah, it's just it's just crucial again, like you will, Best, who has been good all year, just came in and just immediately two guys on and they had no one else to go to and just blew it.

Uh yeah, which will happen.

It's just you know, you hate when it happens.

Speaking.

Yeah, let's go to our second segment, because we are a Mets podcast at least for one more week.

Yes, the Mets have dropped another series.

They sure have.

I will turn it over to.

These were three of the worst games you'll ever watch your life, including the one and again.

I still get messages from how do you watch your your scheme?

Yeah, I mean that they had multiple chances to walk off the Nats on Saturday, didn't do it after kind of a Keystone Cops level, ending to give up three runs.

Then yesterday Sean and I get but two run home run did not seem men yet his first run hidden right around Power Battle cannot great Defenders.

He also showed off in this series.

And then you know, then it was a Jacob Young game, like they just yeah, there, it's sorry, it's Jacob Young game.

That's what happened.

No, I'm sorry.

It just like gave up a two run home and oh yeah, and then it was a Young game.

Yeah, it was a tank to like this was really cheap.

Na see, Nunia has got all of that.

But I think that's that means eight feet Apparently it's you get a little more in the tank.

Uh yeah.

So the various Mets group chats I'm in and Mets Twitter Brit Laard just completely.

By the way two for four.

Oh yeah yeah, and like I get it, but there's nothing, there's nothing to do about it.

It's there's been some horrible sequence, there's been some bad injury luck.

You know, they've haven't won a game, they've been trailing in the eighth all season trailing after the a fall season, I should say, uh, yeah, it's you know, they're the Reds.

They've let the Reds back at it, and the Reds like just got swept by the A's like last week or the week before two, Like the Diamondbacks look like they were going to be the more the dangerous team chasing them, and the Diamonbacks are right there too.

Now the Reds also have the tiebreaker because they lost two or three to the Reds a couple of weeks ago as well.

And yeah, it's you know, I've already saw there was like a Ken Rosenthal like this one of the most embarrassing moments in Met's history.

I'm like, Ken, how about the sixth sexual harassment scandals that like have happened over the last decade there?

Over that maybe, but uh, this is just a team underperforming and having some bad luck, is all it is.

This is like the opposite of the Jeff Passes tweet with the same it's the same milieu.

Yeah, I mean, presumably he meant on the field, it's.

Not even that embarrassing on the field, Like they three of the worst games they played Baseball but like I've seen worse Mets collapses recent memory, let alone my lifetime.

Very much like you think you're talking to.

Yeah, there's a book called The Worst Team Money Can Buy, written by one of Ken's colleagues.

I don't know.

I feel like I's coming up with this team and I don't.

Well, I can't, Like it's difficult to explain for Mets fans.

Uh and Jarrett can be uh a punchy about things like this, sometimes.

Doing it this morning.

Yeah, I yes, less less to Mets fans.

Yeah, but like the Mets are in great shape organizationally in a way they have been in my entire lifetime basically since like the cash and Davey Johnson and I understand it doesn't feel like that, like the Mets make your tummy hurt right now and you need to blame someone for that, and it's you for watching all the games.

But it's like David Stearns does not owe you like a personalized letter of apology for this season, Like Bets fans are being very weird about it.

Well, it's look, no matter how this ends, whether they sneak in and and then lose, sneak in and get to the NLCS or the World Series or whatever, like you're going to see those apology forms to David Stearns.

Yeah, yeah, of course in like June of next year, right now, there's no like to your point, they are.

They're fine.

Fans also have no object permanence worse than the baseball media obviously.

Oh yeah, there was somebody like you should have signed Matthew Boyd not Sean and I Like if they had signed Matthew Boyd instead of Sean and Ayah broke up their favorite hangout show from twenty twenty four, like that fan base would have gone nuts.

Look this song because it's terrible.

I watched most of, if not all, of these games, and like, it's terrible in baseball.

Yeah, and that's it.

Elevens.

They spent a lot, like the funny thing, like it's gonna be a lot made if they found money and did make the playoffs, which fine.

Also, look like Matt Matt Boyd has been very good.

Don't get me wrong.

He's sown one hundred and seventy four innings, which is staggering to me.

And look, I came out and said that signing completely changed my view of the off season because I was like, oh shit, like I is Matt Boyd's getting this money then, but and I did not think he was going to be either this good or this available.

To be clear, Also, his last five starts have been five earned, four earned.

He had one good start against the Nationals, which I understand, and that's what have loved.

Yeah, they got good, then.

Four earned, then four earned, and those are in you know, it's five and a third six five and three innings and that's he gave up four earned in three against Pittsburgh.

Okay, he wouldn't have.

Been saving this tail this this tailspin right like that's his performance down the stretch has not been Now, maybe they would have a bigger cushion.

Atally, like you can do like the perfect like precognition.

It's easy to do this.

In right, it's right hindsight, clubn Burns.

You'd be at the same spot like this is it and I get it.

Like when you spend a lot of money and don't make the playoffs, there's going to be fingers pointed.

And you know, a baseball media that's already gearing up for the lockout is gonna do whatever.

But like nobody talks about the pirates like this have failed for like twenty years by not spend like the teams that don't spend money and fail like we never make a connection there, but like.

Well we do, we do, but not enough.

Yeah, I mean, look, this is to your point.

This is like sequencing and variance and a satisfying answer if it can be a correct answer.

And it's not satisfying.

And they've had they've had bad injury luck or bad injury outcome, but not as bad as the Dodger's right, They've had like fortieth percentile outcomes for some of their stars, but not like twentieth percentile.

So it's like been very it's been like a very slow like they've done this for a couple of months now, where it's just been like it's like fits and starts, Like even before the NAT Series when they won the last game against San Diego and we're you know, too clear of pretty much everyone and I think three of the Reds at that point, it was like, okay, they're they're fine now, right, But.

Yeah, the other thing about spending this much money is that like when you when you shoot this many shots, like theoretically you're going to land somebody good right, we just talked about finning in the Tiger's Open.

You also had the opposite effect, where you can you can when you when you have a season that comes down to this, when coming down to literal tie breaker, you can point to one signing you go, yeah, well, I hated that's that's Frankie Montas.

Yeah.

Sure, and that Markie Mantess deal.

I hated it, Like trading for Ryan Helsley at the deadline, but also like Ryan Halsley one of the five best relievers in baseball, and they didn't give up that much for him.

And it's like it's so easy to cherry pick the.

Thing that no always yeah, you can find when it's one game, you can find anything right.

And they've lost a lot of bad games.

It is what it is.

The thing is like they still might make the playoffs.

They got to play one game better than the Reds this week, and I know the Reds have the easier schedule, but like they just gott swipp by the Athletics.

Yeah, yep, All right, shall we take a break.

I got to get my apology letter ready for October.

Okay, we'll be back with the rest of the show.

Welcome back to episode four hundred and ninety three of five and dive.

We are on segment three, Tunnels are back.

Is this uh?

Nobody nobody re Uh nobody retitled this.

I should have asked Jeff.

Id say, Patrick, is this another song?

I don't know or we know it?

This is a one article roundup.

There you go, Patrick, I'm going to give you the lead on this.

Okay, So we just published an article today that is very much worth reading.

Please go do So.

It is about uh, this is basically Stephen Sutton Brown his Saber seminar presentation.

We we textified it and put up on the site today.

It is about essentially using Baseball's the using mlb is new bat tracking data to tell us more about pictures.

Uh.

And I thought it was incredibly interesting.

It's essentially saying, okay, we have the stuff.

We can quantify everything about a pitch, right, we can once the pitch leaves the bat in the pitcher's hand, we can track every single thing that it does.

And yet we still have guys swing these terrible, ugly swings sliders, and it's one of those things that fans hate more than anything else.

You watch that slider and you think, oh, my god, that's a slider and the guy swings over the top of my six inches and you're like, why do you do that?

Why why are hitters swing it pitches out of the zone more than ever?

And it turns out, well, instead of going like that guy's really dumb, you could just use the swings to go Okay, they're doing this, so what is making them do that?

And so he's basically he managed to create the system where he can estimate essentially the expected rout of the pitch, the probability that the pitch is going to break or not, based on what you see and what you see in various stages.

Right, you have the first stage, the ball leaves the hand and you have a two D image and essentially you don't know whether you can't see whether it's going to break in ornet because nothing breaks right away.

You have time to read the spin and you.

Read out of the hand whether it's essentially straight out of the hand or whether it's going to prit like a crackit ball, and that's all you can tell.

That's pretty much it.

And and that's like literally for fastball, curveball, you don't even and you slider doesn't exactly or cutters or anything like that.

And so that's the point where you decide if you are going to swing or not, like, what does it look like it's going to fall on the strike zone, I should try to swing, And then you have a three D image later on, halfway through the pitch where you used to go, okay, this is where the ball is now going to go, or where you think it's going to go based on what you read in the first phase to say, Okay, this pitch is breaking.

It looked like it was going to go here, but since it's breaking, I'm going to swing here, right, And then you'd find out if you're right, essentially, and oftentimes you're not.

So it's really interesting because it's basically taking the deception, this thing that has been notably difficult to quantify right literally it's literally the stuff you can't quantify why it is the deception, and you're saying, well, based on how the hitters reacting, this is how we can start to see like why some of these pictures are working better than others.

And essentially this is tunneling.

So like five six, I don't I don't know how many years ago it was BP put out a bunch of tunneling research and everyone was like, wow, this is great.

How do we use it?

And the answer is we didn't know how to use it because.

Only only Matt true Blood was able to use it pretty much because there wasn't really that much data attached to it.

It just made perfect sense.

And like I in Slack, I made the nerdiest comparison ever.

Tunneling research five years ago felt like democratic democritis.

Discovering the atom without a telescope, like basically a Greek philosopher in four hundred BC like nailed atomic theory.

He's just like, you know, while Aristotle is everyone has to catch up when he like aristotles here like yeah, sneezers are made out of earth because there's four ls and like everything is made out of these four things.

And the other guy's like, no, there are tiny indivisible atoms.

You just can't see him.

You'll have to take my word for it because we have no way of checking this for like literally.

Two thousand years.

And he nailed it.

But also like it changed nothing at the time because there was no way to confirm or build off of it.

And it really feels like that's what toeling research was it.

Was very much like me, and it was like, well it made sense, it had good theory behind it.

The data wasn't there, Yeah, and now the data is there and it's looking like yeah, man, that was that was right all along.

Yeah.

I thought one of the parts of this article that kind of made me smile was he walks through how like because the model can know so much because the pitch has already happened, right, Like, he can know so much and it can accurately predict, like extremely well based on the first one hundred milliseconds what the pitch is going to be and where.

And he was like, but we're trying to figure this out for batters who don't have all that information, Like so it's like just on the first hundred milliseconds, like the model can can nail this stuff, right.

Yeah, it was like, but we actually need to make it stupider to understand batters.

Yeah, and so it's like, so we have to bin stuff into these overlapping bins of like it could be this, it could be this, it could be this, it could be this, and like spread out on like essentially create uncertainty to understand how batters are functioning, which I thought was like a very it makes a lot of sense, but it did.

It did make me smile.

That was like, we we have perfect knowledge and actually that's not helpful right now.

Well, yeah, it's like dramatic irony that you don't have time to appreciate, right You don't have time to realize that you're dead until you're dead.

Yeah, it's just a great article.

I don't know if if there's more we want to talk about, but like it's very exciting, like when I read it, you know, and I frustrated Quig with this last night.

I think that what we're what this is going to come to is that we need to do a better job when we need to in the sense that we need the data.

Just like you know we did before.

I'm really interested to see what this means for check swings and because that is the other demonstration of well but I have a decision making process.

Some batters need to check their swings.

Something don't okay, and just like finding out like seeing which batters are reacting to which pitches and figuring out whether they can or can't pull up on that is going to be the next point in which we decide I.

Thought, I think I misunderstood what you said because you said something about the definition of a check swing.

Well, I think that's how we're gonna I think that's how we're going to get it cynically, is that when not when?

But that's where you're wrong, because they've already done it like you are.

You're acting like they haven't defined it as forty five degrees, but they have.

They've done it in the AFL.

That's what They're not going to use this data to do it.

They're just gonna pick a degree.

They're going to pick an angle and say, if it's crossed that it's a check, it's not a check it is is a swing, and if it's behind that, it's not.

Because that's how they're already doing like you're acting like this this part where they haven't done something stupid and bad doesn't exist.

But it does.

And now I think what you're saying is is interesting and valuable.

I agree with that, But they're not going to use it to inform a check swing, you know what I mean?

We might in research be like, Okay, who's good at at pulling up?

Who does it the most?

Like who changes their mind most often?

Whatever?

Like, I think that's that's like fertile ground to look into, but the league is not.

I mean that's I also think that we're going to have another you know, was it, uh god, who who was it was?

That it was a Giant with Wilmer Flores who had the check swing that ended up deciding.

Darren Darren roof was naught.

It was Flores.

But we're gonna have another one of those, and people are gonna get mad because October baseball ruins everything, and people are gonna want this.

Definitely.

We mets NAT's game on a bad check swing call on Sunday.

So playoff Baseball demands exact exact they have is good for the rest.

Of the sport.

They have the uh the check swing cameras now like they have all.

Right, Yes, that's what I'm saying.

Yeah, which is funny.

What I'm saying is that it's gonna well I know.

But you have to swing so far for it to register as a check swing now too on those cameras for degrees.

Yeah is what the Yeah, I think it's terrible.

I think it's such a hand fisted implementation.

But yeah, and it's gonna and it's coming like yeah, it's they're going to do it.

I wish for me.

What it comes down to, I really wish that we had.

What we did is just use these things for when we care about this stuff.

The problem is that because October is going to demand it same just like you know, runner leave the bag for millisecond replays, we need these things for October when every single play matters, and they ruin July baseball when it absolutely doesn't matter.

They should turn it off.

They do.

Think the way it works in the AFL is you get too challenges per team, so it is restricted somewhat.

It's still going to happen in July, but like you're not doing it every single time.

Basically, all right, let's go to our fourth segment around the horn.

Milwaukee suffers yet another picture injury.

Brandon Woodroffe has a lat strain on his right side.

He still technically could be available for the NLDS.

I tend to think, you know, Latin oblique stuff, it doesn't sound great, tends to take thirty ish.

Days on average.

Yeah, and you know, damn for Woodruff.

This is second time like this.

This injury isn't as serious as the last time, but this is the second time in a row where he had something come up literally the week before the playoffs.

That's rough.

Uh yeah, and it's rough for Milwaukee, who again not not bad, but certainly not playing to their seasonal standard.

I guess.

Uh.

Jeff has repeatedly mentioned, as we've cycled through all these guys, Robert Gasser, it's Jeff, You're finally right.

I mean, he's fine.

I'm not a huge as an option.

I wasn't saying you were like giving a full throated endorsement.

I mean he's interesting, he's interested.

Yeah, yeah, he was.

He was.

He's coming off Tommy John surgery.

But he's he got him in the right yes, yeah.

Uh read Garrett and Trevor McGill or Tyler Tyler.

Oh, I didn't realize he was that.

So this is the we're moving on to the Mets.

This is uh, Garrett and Tyler McGill are looking at John surgery.

So as good as shape as the Mets are in organizationally' that's tough for twenty twenty six.

It is yesh.

On the Dodgers front, Will Smith has a hairline fracture on his hands.

This it's been what's keeping them out they had originally said it was a contusion.

I mean, you know, hairline fracture stuff is what.

We're gonna have to It's no longer to be wally pipped.

It's gonna be uh vetted.

Yeah, honestly, Like, yeah, so he's he's basically.

Done for the regular season.

They're not sure if he could be available Smith.

Yeah, to be clear, by the time they entered the postseason, it's they're going to be in the wild card game, so it's going to be sooner.

He this was off a foul tip.

Like a foul tip caught him in his throwing hand.

Yeah, I mean, we'll see.

Has been getting the bulk of the playing time, not rushing.

You have that here in the in the dock.

Rushing has been pretty bad offensively, So he's also been a little weird defensively.

It's we remember past balls.

He's got a great arm.

I I think he's fine defensively, but it's he's just had some moments.

They also put him in a weird situation.

Yeah, he's been playing, you know.

Yeah, And and I understand we talked about it at the time, and like I kind of understand what they were doing.

They wanted a better bench than Austin Barnes or whatever.

But like it's that that is a tough scenario to have to succeed it.

I think if you're Dalton Rushing so uh and it's just been playing well and he the pitching has been on an absolute tear.

Yeah uh, while he's been the catcher.

Some of that is just they're finally healthy.

But like the I should the starting pitching, I should say, uh, the Tiger's DFA Charlie Morton.

We we talked about this a little bit earlier.

Morton has been worse than Paddock.

Those those acquisitions have not gone well.

Seven points you're a nine e r A want only a one oh four?

Yeah.

Well, you know, dearI loves Charlie Morton.

He can stop walking.

He can stop walking anytime, Betters anytime he wants to.

I feel like I feel like dra is like rationalizing Charlie Morton's pitching style.

Like, no, he could get control, he could get comm anytime.

Is this it for Charlie Morton?

I don't know.

I mean, I guess that's probably up to Charlie Morton.

He can probably get another.

I don't know, Maybe it's not guaranteed.

Maybe he gets a maybe spring training invite, but it wouldn't surprise me if he could look Rich Hill pitched for a team this year.

You could convince me Charlie Morton latches on somewhere next year.

And you can even convince me he gets a guaranteed deal from team that just wants some innings taken up on it.

You know, it's like a couple million boxers.

The Royals in the Florida area exactly.

Uh, and we know it's it for somebody.

Clayton Kershaw, shortly after the podcast uh last week, announced that this would be his final season.

He made his final regular season start in Dodger Stadium.

I don't know how he he didn't fit on this team's postseason roster that well.

But use him to close like they did in Washington.

It is it's a little tragic, nothing to even if you wanted to do that, right, Like, and I was at that game.

By the way, he he's like his velo does not bump up in relief, Like he's already thrown as hard as he can.

They have about nine lefties.

Yeah, like he can't even be like, oh, we'll use him as a third or even fourth lefty, like they can't use him there, like he just doesn't fit on the roster.

But I don't know if they're going to do that to him.

Also, Blake Snell and Tyler Glass now start to make it through the week healthy.

Yeah that is, that's true.

But even even so, like I guess he would be the fourth guy, but you could and she has a better pitcher.

She and I get well actually play up in the pen.

I think, yes, I agree with that, but like they Yeah, I don't know.

It's it's a weird situation.

Patrick, I'm looking at it right now.

It's tragic that Kershaw's last game will be in the Paaffs.

They shouldn't be that way.

Let's see when so Kershaw just pitched.

I want to say he's gonna.

End up pitching this next series which the Dodgers are.

Playing the Uh, you're playing the Diamond.

Let's see defensive lands.

Okay, So Kershaw started on Friday, so he should start on Tuesday.

I think will maybe not, maybe they'll push it will be Tuesday or Wednesday.

I think I don't think that he gets pushed to the mirrors.

I think I think he'll pitch against the timebacks and then'll be his last one.

Yeah, but I will not get a chance to see him, sadly tragic in that sense as well.

Yeah, I mean, I don't know.

I feel fortunate I got to catch him in Baltimore.

The one game I went to was was him.

I got to go with my dad and my older son.

Look, this is a little I know how a lot of people feel about him, and I don't.

I don't fault them, and I actually agree in significant I would say, like probably ninety nine zero point nine percent of it.

I think he's done a lot of damage to his own image.

I don't know if he's done it to his legacy, but you know, uh, we'll see.

Probably should probably it probably should.

But like I don't know if you will.

That's not at.

That Twitter bubble too, right, is the thing?

Right?

Like I mean, I think largely.

At baseball fans just don't are either unaware of this or don't care about it real large.

Yeah, I I also think that there's I don't know.

I don't want to get yelled at, but but I don't think he's I want to be clear that what I'm about to say is I don't think it undoes any of the damage.

And I do think he's caused a lot of damage.

And and I think it's a problem.

And I don't have a problem with people bringing up the stuff they bring up about him every time because they're right.

I don't think it's malicious in the way that some other like even Blake Trying to right like and Blake Trynon has some he's it's like somehow a joke with him, where it's like less of one for Kershaw.

And I think that's because I mean one is like trying and one is Slaton Kershaw.

I think Kershaw is just kind of like ignorant of so much like the whole the whole thing with the sisters like that that to me just showed so much ignorance.

Yeah, And and I don't he's he's an extremely religious person and there's often a lot of hate there.

I from what I've read from the book that was written about him, to the various articles, to what he said, doesn't indicate like he has hate for those people.

It's just about himself, right, which is which is extremely selfish and obnoxious and just shut your mouth, right like you, especially if you don't have a problem with other people, and it's it is about yourself.

Just shut your mouth then, like let people have their day.

Every other day is fucking your day, right, But I don't know that.

That's just a sense I've got.

It's it's absolutely possible I'm wrong, and I think it's I don't know.

It's a bummer to me because he has as a fan.

And and this is why I think a lot of people who who were fans or even maybe still are and why it hurts so much is like he's given so much to me as a fan, as a.

Dodgers fan, and like you don't know any of these people, right.

Like this, yeah, but that doesn't help, right, Like he's doing the damn right, but it is him sewing or you know, this is him sewing.

I don't.

I don't feel bad for him, no, forgetting that.

I do think there's like a strain of like enjoying being a hater about it as a fan, more.

Of it than than some others for people.

He probably does.

And again I don't think any of it's unfair per se, but it's very it's very much like you don't really want like your faves pulled on this either because you're not gonna write the results and like Kirshall has done it publicly in our way and as as a face of that franchise that has done a lot of damage in his mouth.

He showed his ass, you know, a bunch of But.

No, it's not going to I don't think it's going to.

Look he's going to go under the Hall of Fame first ballad for what.

He do on the pile, despite what the one guy comment or yeah, yeah, and I and again I think and I'm not trying to say this like I feel bad for it.

I think he's done this to himself, right, but I think it's a shame he did it to himself, you know what I mean, because I think other other than that, like it's an I'm not trying to sweep it under the rug, like it's it's an absolutely remarkable career.

And I think it's like a shame that this that that along with the playoffs struggles are kind of the first things that people are are going to right now.

And I understand it.

But but yeah, anyway, uh, he will be done after one we're start.

I honestly don't know how he gets into a playoffs game.

They like you nine was too many.

But if you look at their playoff roster real quick, like, it's just in the in relief they have.

Tanner Scott, you don't want to you don't want to see any of them.

I don't want to see him either, yeah, fair enough, honestly.

And that's not a playoff joke.

It's just like I don't feel more confident in him.

It's it's Tanner Scott, it's Alex Vessia, Jack Dryer, and I do.

Actually I'm happy to see Jack Dryer.

Robleski uh and there's another Tony band, right, that's that's five, that's five left in believers.

They're they're potentially going to put Roki Sasaki on this in this playoff bullpen just because he's right handed.

Speak chaos.

Yeah, not recommend it.

I mean Brock Stewart, who's been awful, is probably going to be on this playoff roster because he's right handed.

Will gonna make it, Will kleinb Mike.

I don't think Herbie yates this mhm.

He's been so bad.

I don't think Blake Trenton should.

But Dave Roberts says he has his like undying trust or whatever.

I don't I don't remember the exact word, but it was like, I absolutely trust him.

David Roberts is definitely and toys being taken.

Away from territory.

I think with this bill, oh my god, I wish, I wish it's time that brings us to the game.

All right, See, you guys can decide whether you going to the booth for this one or not.

It is it's from another rear submitted one.

Thank you very much.

This was for Nate Freeberg.

This one he calls positional plurality.

And so basically, we're gonna give you fifteen players throughout history who have played more than one position, and all you have to do is tell me which position they played the most of.

Let's do the booth for this.

I think it's I also do want to note I try and open these emails, and I'm kind of as quickly as possible, but just to whatever.

So I didn't look.

But I believe Nate did us a real solid in pasting in the answers.

But he he covered them like he blacked.

He redacted it basically by by doing the whole thing in black.

And so we can Patrick, who's running them, can reveal it to himself but I didn't see it.

So I want to be very clear.

I appreciate all the games, but if you put the answers right there, it's possible we're going to see them.

So like hiding them either in a in an attachment or or doing what Nate did is extremely healthed.

Just don't don't open your email, right, that's that is actually not a bad solution.

All right, all right, so we're all right, Jeff goes first.

All right, So.

So Jeff, tell me what position did Babe Ruth play the most deaf?

Right field?

Alex Rodriguez oh mm hmmm.

Mmmm, third base.

I think I think there's a story about him ended up playing more than.

Third in the shortstop Ernie Banks.

It's plurality.

It's like first base, isn't it Robin yet, I'm gonna guess he bounced around the outfield enough that it's shortstop.

Uh, Paul Mallider, just dh physicians.

Yes, it is a possision, al right, Pete Rose, first base, Julio Franco, it's a good one.

Third base.

Uh, Brandon Inge, I.

Can't do the Mike Francesca accent.

Like Brandon Inch is a catcher.

Brand An Inch is a catcher.

Okay, Jim Tolly h.

D h.

Uh Lance Berkman wrist.

I don't remember, honestly, I don't remember which out fel position Lance Berkman played.

Uh so I give look really bad here.

I will say left field?

Uh one U reba.

Mmmm it's an interesting one.

Mm hmm.

Let's go a shortstop for fun, Michael Young he had to have played too much short style.

Dimitri Young.

First base?

Uh, Kevin Nucleus third and Russell and the muscle.

Brain you o DH all away?

Okay, all right, Craig head sets on so right now, Jeff out of fifteen, Jeff got one.

Two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.

Correct.

Okay, I don't like I feel like you do this.

When I go second, you give me like a score update, and when I go first, you just never say anything.

And and now I I feel that this is just Craig reflect for a moment.

Why that might be?

Does that get marked down on the big gameat wow?

I'm just saying these variables are not truly independent, all right, all right, okay, okay.

All right, so Greg, you know you could be like Craig got three out of fifteen, and Jeff might think, oh, oh, these are hard.

That's possible.

I suppose.

Cut a couple of different ways.

Greg, if I could, Greg, now that you're probably in more.

Babe Ruth, Oh, now, can I ask a clarifying question?

Is outfield?

You have to pick field?

You have to pick which field?

So left, center, right, and d H is a position pinch hit or is not?

Which I would almost like as also being a jerk almost said about Jim.

Tell me, I don't said the babe Ruth.

Okay, Babe Ruth might be the meanest one.

And having a start is very good.

I like that.

Alex Rodriguez, how long did he?

Uh?

But some of that was at d H, mister year.

Yeah, let's say shortstop.

I don't know.

Ernie Banks, oh god, yeah, this is where I'm sure like that.

I don't know.

He was like shortstop and center field, right, I think I don't know.

I'll say center field.

I have no idea.

I apologize to any Banks.

Uh, okay, cool, let's pick more modern guys.

You know, uh, I got bad news for you about the rest of this.

Listen, You're gonna get a little more modern.

I don't know.

For yeah, it's a center field.

I don't know, okay, Paul Matter, first base, Pete Rose, oh, uh, first base?

All right?

After six, Jeff's up four to three, uh, jo Alio Franco, first base, Brandon Inge, Oh, third base, Jim.

Tell me me you said DH is a separate position.

Yes, DH is a separate position.

But he spent so long.

Let's say first base again, just saying first base a lot, okay, Lance Berkman, Oh, that's a tough well.

He split time in center and the corners, So I'm gonna say first base.

Again, okay, all right, and after ten, Craig is now winning six to five, so you need three of these.

Last five to win.

Keep giving me first base options one your Rebay Oh, no, no, that's a that's a good one, good one.

Yeah.

Man.

He played so much third at the end.

I'm gonna say short though, Okay, he thanked a lot early.

Michael Young mm hmmm mm hmm sure, yeah, ah, just picking late career Dodgers at this point.

A yeah, uh, Michael Young.

And I honestly don't remember now how long he played third.

I know he ended up, but I don't remember if that's just like a few years at the end of his career, and that's what I remember, uh when all the discussions are about how classy he was or like is he a short stud?

Did he play six?

All right?

Mm hmm, I'm.

Gonna say third.

I feel bad about it.

I don't think that's right, but I'm gonna say it.

Dimitri Young, Oh oh he really that's a real mix of of outfield, first and DH.

I'm gonna say I feel like I'm gonna say right field that I truly don't know.

That's a real toss up to me.

Kevin Nucleus, These are good.

These are good.

This was the point we didn't get Ian Desmond in here.

Yeah, I feel like I'm not picking anyone for DHD.

I'm gonna say DH for Ugolas all right.

And lastly, you need this one to tie Russell Branyon.

Oh god, first base for I should have Why did I say DH?

I should have said first base before?

Shit?

Fuck it, first base, let's lose on it.

Incredible congratulations to Jeff who winsday.

Congratulations and Craig on abandoning his first base strategy just at the time when he should have kept going on it.

Yeah, all right, so.

We'll go through him, babe, Ruth played right field about seventy times more than he played left field, and a thousand times more than he pitched.

I remember they's a right fielder.

In the new historical abstract.

A rod edges out shortstop over third base one.

Ernie Banks was a first baseman for the second half of his career, just a little bit longer than he was a shortstop.

Robin Yet shortstop fourteen sixty eight, center field eleven thirty nine.

Paul Muhtor DHD for like, yeah, I felt bad about the problem of Monitor is that he did mounce around a ton early in his career, and then he dated so much late in his career that was it.

Pete Rose was in fact a first baseman nine hundred and five, first base six hundred and fifty two, left field six twenty seven, third base six hundred, second base five hundred one right field.

There's a lot who played a lot of posisions so much Holeo Franco.

I like this one a lot Franco.

Most of you.

I don't think either of you got first or second on Franco because he was a shortstop first and then second base for like five years.

He was a second base.

I had no idea.

Yeah, I mean, I know he I knew he was a shortstop, but I thought it was more in the like my two years and moved off.

Yeah, like the Jim Tommy third base situation where yeah, Jim Tomy played third base.

For like four longer than you would think.

Yeah, but like for like four or five years, but he was a first baseman primarily.

Brandon Inge was in fact third base three times as often as he was a catcher.

Lance Berkman first base, So good job, Craig, you were really on that first base thing.

Given points on first base, we'll tag flag this here.

We'll talk about this later.

That Lance Berkman first base, then left field and right field kind of split.

I think if you counted center field counted outfield together, Berkman was an oilfielder more than a first base.

Yeah, but he's spreader gun one ab is a short stop in her seventy one to fin or sixty eight third base.

Michael Young also a short stop, basically at the same exact proportions, except.

See I could have I could have had it there too.

I felt, Yeah, Dimitri Young first base over almost you were right, He's like it's first base, outfield er DH almost perfectly split in thirty I.

Said, I said that one was such a toss up to me, it felt very even.

Should have struck on first base.

Same with Kevin Euchless, should have stuck with first base five or fifty four games four and eighteen at third base, and Russell the mussele Branion, uh third base, more third base than anything else.

But he also like his career just didn't last long though a lot of DH first base time.

At the end uh Twitter, he went through base two and sixteen at first base, one hundred and twenty four left field, and only one hundred and one at d So there you go.

Very good game.

Those are tough.

Those are tough.

They were good.

Tough job, well done.

Thank you for running, Patrick, thank you both for cohosting, and thank you to our listeners for joining us on another episode of Five and Dive, brought to you by the Baseball Perspective podcast Network.

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