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To God on an unidentified object every liberty or call or calm on an unidentified flying object.

A Welcome to UFO Chronicles, a place where people share their experiences of the strange and unexplained.

If you've had an encounter, I would like to be on the show.

You can email me at UFO Chronicles at gmail dot com.

Hello everyone, and welcome to the show.

How are you all doing.

I'm Nick Kunter and this is the UFO Chronicles podcast.

Tonight's guest is Fred, calling in from Sweden.

He's a researcher and writer behind the book Northern Lights High Strangeness in Sweden, and Fred walks us through a series of his own experiences scattered across Sweden and Norway.

A violent interaction with an invisible force on a bridge in Stockholm, a shadow figure leading out behind a tree, and the haunting footsteps that circled a cabin in a Norwegian valley that scared Fred just before dawn.

He also shares a story of an odd little man that appeared during his youth in a forest, along the roadside and even in a shop, always looking at him and never speaking.

Fred is up next, but first, if you enjoy the show and you'll like to help support the podcast on Patreon, you can do this for as little as one dollar a month, head on over to patreon dot com forward slash UFO Chronicles podcast.

You can also find a link in the description of this episode.

Any help is very much appreciated.

Now on with the show.

Hey, Fred, welcome to the podcast.

Thank you, thank you, thank you so much.

House life over there.

You're quite far away from me.

I understand.

Life is always good, life is always busy.

To be honest with your Fred, Taxi Meca for joining us today, all away from Sweden.

Yes, yes, yes, Well it's starting to get awfully dark and cold here in Sweden at the moment.

This is early morning and it feels like it's night outside.

Basically there's a slight little bit of snow in the air, and well we'll see what happened during the day here.

So for those long, dark winter nights in Sweden.

Yeah, you know, I'm forty eight years old and I'm very very Swedish, and I've never really gotten used to them.

You know, I'm more a summer person, you know.

When spring comes, it's like my personality changes.

I'm you know, always out in nature, always out in the sun, listening to birds and whatever, you know.

So it's yeah, I'm long here for the spring and summer.

Long and wonderful.

Okay, Now, Fred, do you have some experiences to share with us?

Would you like to start at the beginning please, sir.

Of course, of course.

Well, I would say that probably the first experience I've had happened.

In our conversations earlier, I mentioned that I would talk about stuff that happened the last ten years or so, but this one, I'd say was maybe twenty years ago.

And I was working at an archive company in Stockholm.

So I was working with customer service, and each morning I took the commuter train to a station not far away from work, but still a little bit of a walk.

This area is quite close to an old castle and the military area.

It's quite nice part of Stockholm.

You know, you have water, you have a nice walk along the water, you have trees, you have you know, it's a little bit of nature.

It's waters.

It feels like a good place.

Anyway, to get to my to the office I was working at, you have to walk over small bridge over a road, and this is a quite crowded place.

So it's just when you walk over the road, it's it's big, and it's messy, and it's crowded with how and cars beneath you.

At that particular area, it's not especially nice, but you know, there's not many people walking there.

It was basically just me every morning.

This also passes over an old factory area this little bridge underneath it and around it there you have this big pile of porcelain, and that remains of an old factory that was closed down in the nineteen twenties.

And this big pile of porcelain is still there, you know, and it's protected.

So I was walking over this bridge, minding my own business.

It was just me on the bridge, no one else I've got.

Maybe I walked half the bridge and suddenly I feel violent force behind me.

It's kinda difficult to describe, but it feels like someone is grabbing me and pulling me with such force that I had this old leather shoulder bag on me, and someone is kind of grabbing this bag and pulling it, literally pulling it apart, and it's just me there.

Because I'm very, very shocked, my first thought is that am I being attacked?

Am I being robbed as someone trying to steal my bag?

Not that I had anything valuable in it, but you know, so the bag is pulled away from me with the enormous force, and seconds later, I feel this horrifying, terrible, terrible freezing sensation come over me.

I get very very cold.

I get so cold that my my teeth starts to shatter and my whole body starts to you know, it's literally like I've been outside in twenty minus thirty miners or something for an hour.

It was a horrible, horrible experience.

So anyway, after a couple of minutes, I managed to, you know, calm down, and I'll still look around.

There's no one around.

There's absolutely no one around, and I pick up the bag.

And here's the really weird thing, at least for me.

I mean, this was an old leather shoulder bag and the strap was permanently attached with a metal ball that went through a metal hole kind of, so the ball was bigger than the hole.

So by design, these two parts should never have been able to separate, and yet they did just that, which is so weird.

I mean, I still have the strap and the mechanism how it was attached to the bag, and it's absolutely impossible for this metal ball to even come out from this reinforced hole.

I'm not entirely sure how to describe it, but it's absolutely impossible.

But somehow these two parts separated From that force that I experienced, I was terrified actually, from the whole ordeal and I came to the office, and of course I told my colleagues, who were you know, probably just thought I was mad or something.

So that's one of the first experience I had that I really remember.

It's still something I think about, but you know, it's been a long time, and I can still feel the force coming from behind me and grabbing me and pulling this bag apart.

What that was, I have absolutely no idea.

I don't know if the area itself had something to do with it or one thing.

I'm absolutely sure that the bag didn't get stuck on anything on the bridge.

There was no one else on the bridge except me and whatever or whoever did this.

For a number of years I worked with a Swedish television show called Thetushanda, which literally means the Unknown.

It was a very very popular show.

I think in total there was around three hundred and fifty episodes, and the majority of these episodes were basically the same.

A family has issues with what they believe is a haunted home.

They get to tell about their experiences and a psychic medium comes there to clean up a little bit and make the place go a bit calmer.

So I did fifty or so episodes of this show.

So I traveled all over Sweden, visiting homes and sometimes castles or sometimes you know, smaller you know, summer cabins and et cetera, et cetera.

So in two thousand and sixteen we went to a small house out in the forest near Seaglua see Gloris, a small village and the family there they had bought this this croft you can call it, a number of years ago and they have, you know, some have they've had a lot of problems with what they believed to be ghosts or spirits or shadow shadow people.

You know, they were really really scared and they saw shadow people, they things were moving inside the house.

They had terrible nightmares, et cetera, et cetera.

So we spent two days there.

The first day we interviewed the family.

We shot the interiors, interiors and exteriors of the house stock shots, and they too.

We had the psychic median come and he or she would you know, check the place and see what was going on.

So this was quite cute place.

You know, I would love to have own it myself.

You know.

It's a very traditional Swedish old croft with the painted red with pine trees around and a small garden with a lawn.

If you walk a bit further you had a small stream of water.

So wonderful, beautiful place.

So I was standing talking with the mother and the daughter, one of the daughters, outside of the house, out on the lawn, and they had mentioned in the interviews that they saw a shadow person in the garden, a man with a hat, you know, like a silhouette or you know, a shadow person.

And I've been you know, I'm I'm honestly, I'm I mean, I work with this.

I've been working with paranormal TV shows for many, many years and UFOs and conspiracies, et cetera, et cetera.

So I'm also naturally a quite skeptic person.

I'm not a debunker or you know, something like that.

But I've I've always had a good eye for seeing what might be, might have a natural in planation.

And during this time, it was very very popular with this shadow people.

Everyone was talking about them on the internet and everyone who called our show, we're talking about them.

So I was a bit you know, you know, this is they might just be inspired what other people see, and they believe that is what was is what they think they saw, et cetera, et cetera.

Stuff that happens.

It's just it's a natural thing, I believe.

So I was standing out of the lawn talking with the mom and the daughter, and I looked up right over the shoulder of the mother and I see, I see a shadow person what I guess people would describe as a shadow person.

There's a quite thin tree, like a pine tree, but there's no branches on it.

Really, it's quite it looks quite dead, and it's right in front of me, and it's no I mean, it might be at the most thirty centimeters in diameters.

It's very very thin.

And I see how a male figure steps out from behind this very thin tree, and I see him completely clearly.

He's a black, solid mass, but I can clearly see the head, the hat, the neck, the shoulders, the arms, and it kinds of leans out from behind this tree.

And I'm not scared or anything like that, but I studied this figure for a couple of seconds, and then he disappears, and I turned to the mom and I say, I think I just saw what you usually see is in the garden.

And they weren't, of course, surprised at all.

This for me was when I first realized, when I first had an experience to see what other people think or believe they see.

It was very, very valuable for me to experience that.

It wasn't scary, it wasn't frightening or anything like that, but it was so clear it was It wasn't my eyes playing a trick, you know, it wasn't.

It wasn't It wasn't a shadow playing around.

It was a very very clear, solid black shadow person, clearly humanoid, if we can use that expression.

There was a few other minor things that happened during that the filming of that episode.

I remember the photographer saw a reflection of an older woman in the kitchen in the glass glass shelf of some kind.

She saw the reflection there.

But what really stood out for me was this shadow person.

And I know I happen to know that.

Since then, my observation has been kind of one of those stories that the family tells visitors when they come to when they come there, or they I've heard it being told in other TV productions and YouTube productions.

There was a guy here once who saw a shadow person behind that tree.

So that's kind of fun, you know, I feel honored.

You know, it's a nice it's a nice family, and it's a beautiful little house, very very cute.

It's just very very haunted.

One thing that I experienced that didn't had to do so much with ghosts or what people would describe as ghosts or perceive as ghosts, was something that happened during the summer of two thousand and nineteen twenty nineteen.

It was probably late summer, maybe at the end of July or beginning of August, and it was here in Mashda.

Mashda is like a suburb to Stockholm, and it's outside Orlando, the big main airport.

So you might believe hearing that that this is a very this area it's just buildings and the concrete and stuff, but it's not.

It's you know, you have if I walk ten minutes, there's forests for miles.

Basically you have forest and lakes and shields.

It's a very very beautiful area of Stockholm.

So I'm very happy to deliver here.

So this summer evening, me and my then partner and a couple of our friends wanted to go out and do some barbecue, and we have this favorite spot right outside Mashda takes maybe twenty minutes to walk there.

Area itself is an it's an old it's I mean, it's people have stayed there for thousands of year.

You can still find old grave mounds and you can feel find the remains of old farmhouses and such.

The forest is very beautiful and it's right at the edge of a huge field.

And on this field there is what I usually describe as an island.

It's it's like a bunch of rocks and trees.

So you can go there and it feels like you're on an island with field around, and it's so peaceful and it's so calm.

The only people you might meet out there there's some you know, if someone is out walking their dog, or maybe some some jogger or something like that.

But it's a great place and we usually barbecue there.

There's a fireplace, and you know, it's the best place ever.

So this evening we had brought some Polish sausages and we had a fire going on, and well, something was off though, because where we sat with the fire, we had this big fields around, huge fields, and far far away you can see lights from houses.

But it's a very very calm area.

There's nothing really going on there except one thing.

This night, we could out on the field see a big circle of light on the ground on the field.

Now this wasn't like a beam coming down from the sky or something.

It was just that the ground or the field itself was lit up as a big circle of light.

Quite tricky to describe, but you know, it's like an invisible UFO is hovering there, you know, shining its light on the ground.

So we noticed that this.

We were four people, I believe, out there, and we were standing looking at this, and we were like discussing, what can it be, you know, because there's no lamps nearby, there's no road there, there's nothing really that could create this light phenomenon in general.

Two of us, my ex partner and a friend of his, actually tried to walk to this place, but there's a big water filled ditch in between us and the circle, so they couldn't really move over it.

It was a bit too wet, so they kind of gave up and they came back to the fireplace where we were standing looking at this circle of light.

And we were looking at it, and after a while we just kind of got bored with it, I guess, and we continue with barbecuing our sausages, and then well after midnight, I guess we used to walk home.

Kind I ignored this giant circle of something.

What's odd, of course, is that everyone had cameras so we have, we had cell phones, we had even you know, almost a real professional camera, and we took no photo at all of the phenomenon.

Actually, of all the photos I took, I carefully seemed like I've carefully cropped away that area, so none of the photos is aimed at the direction of the circle of light.

And this is something I kind of forgot that basically the same, you know, as soon as I came home, I forgot about it, and my partner too, And a couple of years later, I was came up, you know, because I've never seen anything like it before or after, and this this memory came back to me and I went back to look at the photos, and I see that, yeah, we were there, but no one took photo of the circle.

So of course, even stranger at least if you look at the highest strangeness aspect of it, is that we had visitors that night.

We had two owls flying around in circles above us at the same time, which of course made the whole experience even more magical.

We're not talking ghosts here or poultrygeist or anything like that.

I have no idea what it was.

It was just a weird light phenomenon in a place where there shouldn't be any lights or lamps or traffic or anything like that.

And trust me, I've been there many many times afterwards, many times during the day, during the evening, during the night.

There's never been anything like it there Afterwards.

This time we could see the circle light and that's it.

Kind of frustrate thing actually, because I would, I mean, if I ever see it again, I will, I will try to get over that ditch and just explore and examine this thing.

Well, the last thing I have experienced.

I probably experienced other things, but these are the ones that comes to mind, but I had, what I would say, for me personally, the most interesting experience happened this summer in twenty twenty five, in August or maybe in the mid July.

I went to a cabin up in the Norwegian mountains.

The area is called Valdres, and it's absolutely stunning an environment.

You have this huge mountain ranges and you have these valleys and you've never seen anything like it before.

I mean, before you get there, you have basically walls of trees from all sides.

And the higher up you get, the lesser trees you get, except from birch trees.

But the higher up you get there's there is no trees soon or later there's just you know, stone and grass and it looks it looks amazing.

So we went to this valley named groom Queah Grunke is closed off during the winter.

It is just too dangerous and it will you know, hurt the roads and it's it's difficult to live there during the winter.

But during the summer there is there is some people even staying there, and my partner's family has a cabin up there.

And this is a I need to tell you a little bit about the background.

Here in Scandinavia VI, we have a very popular series of books called The Legend of the Ice People.

They were written by a Swedish Norwegy author named margitson the Move.

She passed away some years ago, but she sold millions of these books.

And some would say they're more like, you know, like sexy pulp books, a little bit fantasy, a little bit medieval drama or stuff like that, but they're quite I mean, she's a great story She was a great storyteller, and she wrote close to two hundred books.

Her most popular series of books were This The Legend of the Ice People, and she based the valley in those books on this valley on Grunka.

This was a place where she stayed as a kid.

Her father had a houster, her family had a house there, and of course my party's family, who are relatives of her, also have a house there.

So this is a this is a place who's been in the family for a long long time.

It's not just a beautiful place.

It's a place where there's been a lot of problems with let's call them nature spirits, from huldras or vitras to veta or the little people.

You can't call the gnomes because that's a different thing, but they kind of look the same, and they can be quite cheeky, and they can be quite disturbing if you don't treat them well.

So there's been all over the years, there's been a lot of problems with these kind of spirits in this area.

So much problems that Margaret, you know, she abandoned the house she had there and she built a new house not far away, so we were staying at this cabin that was kind of just down below the most haunted of these cabins.

This place, this is I've used the word magical a lot, but it's really a magical place.

You have the you have the mountain right behind it and it goes straight up, and you have these birch trees up to a certain point.

You have cows walking around.

It's like it's like it's like heaven, you know, it's it's so beautiful up there.

But then you have the alleged hauntings of this area.

The whole area actually there is said to be a trail for the little people.

Right over the where the house where we stayed, and not far away, you have a house called the Huldra House, which no one really lives in nowadays.

That's the house that had too much issues with Huldras.

For example, it's the rumor says that that has a haunted bed in it.

My partner's father have slept in this bed and he said it wasn't any problem sleeping in it, so for him, but he is a quite skeptical person also, so he didn't really, you know, for him, his family's beliefs in uldruss and ghosts was more like fairy tales.

But you know, me, I'm visiting a legendary place this summer, and I felt that I will keep an open mind.

So we had stayed there for a couple of days, maybe close to a week, and I woke up three in the morning and I felt I had to go out and had to use the bathroom, which literally means that I just go out in the in the in the nature outside and do a little bit of pee.

And I'm standing there and I'm looking around and starting to get bright outside, and it's so calm and beautiful and peaceful.

So I can see there is no cows, there's no sheep, there's no neighbors around, there is no unwanted visitors.

It's just a very very calm morning in this valley.

And I go to bed again and I lay down, and suddenly I hear very very very clear footsteps outside the house.

I hear them like a human being is slowly walking up the main little road to the house.

I can hear the footstep, footsteps in the gravel, in the stones, walking walking, slowly, deliberately and for a moment or two they stop in front of the house, and then they turn around and they walk to the edge of the house and walk around the corner, and I can I can follow, you know, these footsteps just by listening, because it's so clear.

I mean, this is an old wooden house, so it's the footsteps is right outside the wall, just behind my head where I'm where I'm laying in bed, and the footsteps walk up up to where I'm staying, where I'm laying down, and then they stop and it goes quiet, and I'm so scared because I've I have no idea.

Who can this be?

Could this be a neighbor, No, no, there's there's no neighbors there.

Could it be a cow, No, no, I would hear the cows because they would have a bell around.

Could it be a sheep, No, there's no sheep up there.

At the moment, there's it's very very calm, and you know, I know how the footsteps of a human being sounds like.

I have absolutely no problem identifying that this is a human being or someone but a humanoid being, at least something with two legs who's walking sneakily and slowly up to the house around the corner and stops right where I sleep, or where I'm laying down at least.

So I'm so scared I can't even talk.

I can't thinking about it now.

I've never been so scared in my whole life, you know, I'm so scared.

I'm kind of frozen.

It's impossible for me to wake up my partner or his dad.

And the only thing that goes through my mind is did I lock the door?

You know, can whatever this is, can it come inside the house?

If it's a human, can this human open the door and attack us?

If it's something else, can it, you know, is it invited into the house?

Now?

So for one hour, I'm laying there listening to the silence outside where I heard the footsteps walking in the in the gravel, in the stones.

And after one hour, I feel that, you know, I need to, I need to.

I can't.

I can't.

I can't stay like this anymore.

You know, this is impossible.

The time is closer to four, I guess.

So I managed to get out of bed, and I opened the door and I get outside, and it's a beautiful morning.

At it's so calm, maybe even calmer than before.

And I walk around the house.

There's absolutely no sign of anyone there, no animals, no human And then I also realized that the footsteps I heard they were walking in gravel.

You know this time the stones that you put around the house.

But this house doesn't have stones.

There's no gravel around the house or on the road leading up to the house.

It's all grass and it's soft, and it's quiet, and it's there's absolutely no chance that anyone would be able to make footstep sounds in gravel up there.

So I'm I'm I'm just waiting outside basically and sit on a bench until the rest of the family wakes up and I tell them about this, and they're they're not skeptical, because I mean, they know me, and obviously I'm quite affected by this.

Maybe eight nine hours later, the son of Margit sandem or the author her son, comes by to say hello, and I kind of joke jokingly says that oh, I had a visitor of the Huldra this night tonight, and I was kind of expecting him to laugh a little bit, but he was very very serious and he just said, yeah, right, and I had to tell him the story, and for him this was this was.

This is serious stuff.

To him.

The Huldra or whatever it was, something out of this world were visiting the house, sneaking around the house during the early morning.

And it wasn't him.

I can tell you.

There wasn't a cow, there wasn't there was no sheeps around, there was nothing like that.

There was something walking up there, and I choose to believe that it was something out of the ordinary.

I choose to believe that it was some kind of nature spirit or yeah, something like that.

I don't like to speculate, really, and I don't like to believe in things.

I mean, I have no proof of this, of course.

The only proof I have is for myself, and that I heard this an experience.

I know for sure I wasn't sleeping, and I know for sure what I heard, and I know for sure that it was absolutely impossible for these sounds to be able to appear.

Yeah, that's it, well, Fred, thank you for sharing all that.

M hmmmmm, very interesting.

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How would you describe the modern Swedish attitude towards folklore in general?

I mean, because folklore is kind of ingrained in Scandinavian culture.

I'd say that most people take it quite seriously, especially when it comes I'm using the word gnome here now that's you could the more correct word is Tomte or Vetta when we talk to when we met, when we talk about this, a tiny humanoid says I often call them.

I'm sure that most people, most people, not everyone, but most people take it quite seriously, especially from there, if they're outside the big cities.

It's something that most of our grandparents or great grandparents have experienced, and I'm sure there most families have stories about the little ones.

Of course, it's people talk about it with you know, a little bits of laughs involved.

I'm also quite sure that the majority of my fellow Swedish people out there totally respects this kind of phenomena.

I mean, we have from when we were kids and we've been outside in nature with our parents, there's always been talked about the trolls or or vitras or you know, these kind of nature spirits or landscape spirits or whatever you choose to call them.

Ghosts are something from my experience because I've been working a lot with the paranormal television, I noticed that most people actually believe in ghosts.

Can be quite difficult to find people who don't believe in ghosts.

It's not like it's something that affects their lives.

But if you have a cabin somewhere, or if you have an old house or your parents' old house, and there is some weird sounds or something happening, you kind of expect it to be ghosts.

So yes, that's from my experience.

There might be other people who won't agree with me on this, but considering how many people I've been talking with over the years in the productions I've been working with, I'd say it's a very respectful attitude to these kind of stories here.

So does the kind of thing happen where, say, if there's going to be a road build or a housing development in a certain ay area where they respect certain areas as believed inhabit gnomes or trolls or anything like that.

I can only remember one instance where it actually created some talk about that In Sweden, I don't think, you know, compared to Iceland, where that is very very important to really think about where you build the roads and houses, I'd say it's not the same thing in Sweden.

But there is a spot slightly north north of where I'm staying, maybe twenty miles two hundred kilometers from where I live now.

Up north, there is a stretch of road which is famous for accidents, and accidents are said to be caused by nature's bills about by trolls for example, or gnomes or tomb or whatever you want to call it.

I've been looking into it myself quite deeply, and I don't think that that stretch of road has more accidents than any other kind of road.

Actually it's more, but I mean the folklore around that the area is very very deep.

And I've talked to people who had some very very weird experiences when it comes to gnomes, et cetera, including a man who built this stretch of road.

He was a part of the original building crew, and they had a coffee break and he was standing talking with his colleagues when suddenly a short bearded man, not small, but short bearded man appeared right beside them and told them that it's not good that they're building this road.

And they were kind of looking at each other and they were laughing, and when they look back, this bearded man was gone.

Another man, a sick urity guard actually had he was involved in a car crash on this road, and when he looked out the window after the crash had happened, and he could see a gnome standing a couple of meters away looking at him, looking at his car, and he wasn't really sure if the gnome were you just checking that he was okay, or that if the gnome had caused the accidents so that I would say that stretch of road is the only place in Sweden where I can come to think of that particular kind of tradition that you should be careful where you build your roads or houses.

So people probably out of the city, in more rural areas, they tend to have probably a deeper belief in a higher respect than say, people in the more built up areas.

Oh yeah, yeah, absolutely, absolutely sure that.

I mean, it's not like these things are controlling their lives or something, but there is a deep respect for the gnomes.

For example, if you have a farm, or if you have an old house, or if you live live in an area where nature is very very important, you should take care of the nature.

Of course, most people I've talked with or read about when it comes to this, they always state that it's very very important to be respectful to the local gnomes, to to the tomte, so they will help them take care of the farm or take care of the horses or the other animals.

You know, it's a it's an important part of Swedish folklore and tradition.

Kind of goes hand in hand with nature, doesn't it.

So really, you know, if you want to do a build or an extension or something like that.

Not only do you have to get planning permission from the authorities from the government, but you also have to acknowledge the gnomes as well.

Oh yeah, yeah, definitely.

A friend of mine is an older man named Matt.

He told me a story about he was staying on a farm together with his family, and his father had once encountered a gnome out in the yard and the gnome had told him that they need to move the horse because the horse were standing in the wrong place inside the barn.

And the reason was that the horse were peeing on the gnomes dwelling that was underneath the floor.

So the gnome promised that if they just moved the horse to a different part of the barn, the horse would feel better and the gnome and his family would be much happier.

So well, it makes a lot of sense.

Yeah, the last thing you'd want.

Yeah, you're in rain down on you when you trying to relax of an evening.

But I must I find our uk obviously.

I find folklore fascinating.

So many of these stories are kind of pre ufo stories and encounters.

You know, you hear stories and little beings and it makes you wonder how much of a crossover there actually is.

I mean, I think I really feel it's the same thing.

I mean, it's just we have a different perception of things, and this perception have changed over the years.

I see similarities between older observations and meetings with gnomes, you know, compared to the aliens of today, for example.

I think the phenomenon itself, it's so connected to our own you know, upbringing and our own culture and beliefs and perception.

I think it's basically it's everything is the same under this umbrella of the weird.

You know, we just look at it with different eyes, depend on depending on when we're born basically and where we are born exactly.

Yeah, different eyes.

I mean, we've been kind of been fortunate over the last few weeks.

We have had a couple of guests and they have shared encounters with little beings, little people.

Over the years, I've had, you know, elves and that kind of thing, kind of rare, you know, And just a couple of episodes ago, we had a fairy, a fairy experiencing in Canada, the Fay in the Wheelhouse.

It was that that episode.

So it's always nice to get, but hard hard to get.

I tend to get more emails about these experiences than the actual witness wants to come on and share it, because there is you know, there is a lot of a little bit of I don't really want to come on and share that because you know, nobody will believe me.

People are more likely to believe me if I say I've seen an alien and I have a fairy.

Oh yeah, yeah.

I don't know if I can talk about this because I remember one thing now, But I don't know what kind of rules you have for your podcast because it sounds wild.

But this might have involved some psychedelics, but it's interesting.

I don't know if that's okay.

If I mentioned that's fine, Yeah, that's that's something we've covered many times over the years.

For it, okay, Yeah, Because I find this interesting because I don't remember how many years ago this was.

I was younger, wilder.

You know.

Now I am more comfortable, you know, watching a good movie and you know, picking berries out in the forest.

But when I was younger, I had a couple of summers when I took a lot of psychedelics, but mostly psilocybin.

The mushrooms of course, and there was this summer and I ate mushrooms three times that summer.

So the first time I was out in the forest and I was I was kind of calming down, everything was calming down.

I was going back home and I was a shoes a road where I was walking over a stream where there's a tiny wooden bridge shown.

And on this bridge stood a man.

He wasn't small, but he was quite short.

His pants were, you know, basically up to his chest.

He had big eyes, you know, kind of bulging eyes.

He was fishing, and so he had this very cartoonish, weird look.

And as I was walking past him, he just looked at me.

You know, I might have said hello, but he didn't answer.

He was just looking at me with those weird eyes and his weird looking clothes, and he was, you know, he was still quite short.

He might have had quite unruly black hair also, So this was, you know, just an odd man out there.

So a couple of weeks later, I I'm back it again with the mushrooms.

So I was taking a walk during the night and I meet him again, and this time he's kind of peeking up from behind.

I don't know how to describe it.

It's kind of like an electrical box.

It's like an electrical station of some kind by the road, and he's kind of behind it, and I can see clearly, it's seemed and he is there.

You know, this is not an hallucination or anything like that.

But I find it's weird that I've seen him twice now, and both times I've been eating mushrooms.

So the third time I've eaten mushroom that summer, I've been everything is calming down, and I decided I will go to the store to buy something to eat.

And I walk into the store and who do I meet.

Well, I meet this weird man with his pants up to his chest, with this big bulging eye eyes and he looks at me, and you know, our eyes meet each other, and I was like, Okay, three times the summer I ate mushrooms.

Three times I met this man who looks absolutely otherworldly in a bizarre, funny way.

He's like a troll or some kind of weird fairy or a gnome.

I can't even describe it.

The thing is, he definitely was real.

He wasn't an hallucination or anything like that.

And I think about him quite often because I never seen him again, and I have been.

I mean, I'm a quite calm person nowadays, But somehow I believe that through the help of psilocybin of these mushrooms, I somehow connected to some other kind of dimension, or I connected to nature somehow to some kind of nature spirit or or something.

I just don't know what it was.

I just found it very very, very very weird and just a weird synchronicity that I met the same guy three times that summer, all three times on psilocybin.

Yeah.

I've always been the belief.

I mean, I've experimented with mushrooms over the years, and you one hundred percent do connect with nature.

To anyone that's never really experienced it before, the term one with nature is one hundred percent true.

And I do believe you connect to a point where I think you may even draw back the veil a little bit so, which allows you to connect with things I think we're not generally accustomed to.

See.

Mmmmm, yeah, I totally agree with you, kind of longing back to those years when I roamed the forests being one with everything.

But I believe I've just gotten a bit older and or tired nowadays.

So but I guess it's never too late.

Well, anyway, I hope that I will meet this man again.

So but I guess I need to be you know, on mushrooms if I'm going to meet them.

Maybe your past will cross one day.

Yeah, I hope.

So yeah.

Fred's hobbies include watching movies, long winter nights in front of the log fire, and picking berries in the deep forests.

Yes, exactly.

Kind of stereotypical Swedish.

Very I'm a very stereotypical Sweden really.

I was in Scotland recently and I was talking with a boss for some big archive and she told me she loved Swedish people.

She loved Swedish people.

I was laughing a bit, and I said, well, I guess that's because we're kind of fifty percent awkward and fifty percent melancholic.

And she looked that me and she just she said, yes, that's exactly what you are.

You know, That's what Swedish people are here, you know.

And yeah, we're kind of both awkward and melancholic.

I would say that's that's the most Swedish thing there is.

We snuff.

Do you have snuff in your pocket?

Three months ago I had it.

I quit I quit snuff because of health issues.

I felt I just need to stop it.

But I love snuff.

That's the best thing ever.

I miss it every day.

I can tell you and everyone everyone I know are using it here.

It's it's like part of being Swedish.

I'm disappointed at myself that I had to quit it.

Really, it's the same as my friend, you know, we were talking at the beginning.

He would he would give me a snuff and he would also made caveat, you know, the caveat that comes in those little tubes, red caveat.

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sandwiches.

It was sandwiches.

It's pretty honest, sandwiches for breakfast.

Did you like it?

Yeah?

I didn't mind the snuff.

The snuff is okay, but not so much the caveat.

I'm not great with fish, eggs and seafood.

I love, you know, I enjoy fish like I have all kinds of fish, but when it comes to certain seafoods, my belly kind of turns a little bit.

Well, it's an a quiet taste.

Absolutely.

I'm not a caviar guy myself, but I recently ate for the first time.

I don't know the English name for this.

We have this rotten fish in Sweden, some kind of I don't know what it's called in the English language, but it smells like diarrhea.

Basically, it smells like shit, but it tastes lovely, kind of acidic a little bit, you know, but it tastes it's really really nice.

Absolutely recommend it, you know, don't smell it, just eat it.

I'm sure a lot of people are familiar with all the videos which have come out over the last few years of people heaving and vomiting just attempting to eat it.

Yeah, I'm familiar with it.

I never tried it, but yeah, I'm familiar with that.

It reminds me of a little bit like this.

There's a fruit over in Asia called Durian.

It's like this big, yellow, spiny like fruit, and it's banned if you're a tourist and you buy at the market.

It's banned in some in some hotels because it smells like feet, a really strong smell of feet.

But it's it's it's a beautiful, fleshy like texture and it tastes like apples and custard, but it smells like feet.

That's that sounds both lovely and disgusting actually.

So yeah, so you could be you could be in a hotel and you'll see the sign and it'd just be a picture of the fruit with a line through it.

And it's because people bring these buy these fruits to the market and then go and go back to the hotel room.

It just stinks the whole, the whole.

Well, of course, here in Sweden people eat the fish outside.

That's part of the you know, late summer autumn thing.

You make a table in your garden or or outside your summer cabin or wherever you are, and you open up a couple of cans of this rotten fish and you eat it together with the flat hard bread for example, and and cram fresh for example.

And it's so it's a very very Swedish thing to go go outside during those parts of the years and you can you can smell the diarrhea over over the over the city or the town or village, you know.

But it's it's a it's a it's beautiful food.

It is great food.

I recommend that if you ever come to Sweden, we need to eat it, that's for sure.

And is this is this fish in It comes in a can, doesn't it yeah, is it readily available?

I mean, can you just go into the supermarket and just just grab it?

Where is it?

Especially order?

You can buy it, you know, the whole year here in Sweden, but most people just eat it, you know, during specific days basically.

You know, that's more.

If you follow the traditions, you should eat it at a specific data, a specific specific week.

You know, that's that's when you eat it.

But I could go now and buy a can of this fish and eat it if I want to, but I'm not going to do that.

I'm not much for traditions, but some traditions I think it's important, for example eating rotten fish.

Yeah, I agree.

So, Fred, you were involved in TV for quite a while.

Now, what pulled you into the high strangeness of Sweden?

What was the thing which brought you into this subject?

Well, I mean specifically.

I mean I wrote a book a couple of years ago called Northern Lights Highest Strangeness, and I wrote it because I realized that there wasn't much written in English about Swedish weird cases.

Of course, everyone have heard about the ghost rockets for example, or you know those classic cases, but there's so much more.

I mean, Sweden had a very rich tradition of weird experiences, at least, you know, at least up until the early eighties, I'd say so.

I felt it.

I felt like I wanted to share this because everyone is talking about the United States or the UK or South America or that's what you hear about, and I felt that, well, I want to hear about Sweden too, but ah, I guess I have to write about it then.

So and for me, I'm extra fascinated by Swedish high strations because it's places I can visit myself.

I like to go to places if they're not too far away.

I love to be in these areas.

I love to locate certain spots, you know, from comparing you know, old photos and reports.

It's kind of a little bit of an adventure for me.

It's also easier for me to contact people who have experienced these things to do interviews with them.

I just feel it's someone needs to do it.

You know, we have a lot of great UFO people in Sweden, but basically all of them right in Swedish and only Swedish way, you know, I wanted to share some weirdness to the world.

Yeah, I'm really glad you did.

I think that's super important.

I've got a friend of mine over in Brazil and he does the kinds of the same thing.

He translates to English a lot of South American and books which you know generally just would stay in their own native tongue.

But it is important.

That's why I do like to have you know, different people from a different part to the world sharing these experiences that we might you know, we might not often be able to hear about.

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It's Time, It's ew It's the x x X.

Northern Lights High strangeness in Sweden.

Now, your book it covers cases stretching from the early nineteen hundreds up until pretty much present day.

But for you, Fred, which era feels the.

Strangest, I'd say, well, it's not surprisingly.

I'd say the seventies, which was a quite wild decade in Sweden and so in the rest of the world when it comes to high strangeness and weird and counters.

But there's also some interesting stuff from the thirties and forties, even fifties.

But you know, seventies, late sixties, i'd say, or have some of the best, the best cases.

Really it's oh, it's a difficult question because I have many favorites, you know, even from the eighties.

So it's but let's say seventies, Yeah, seventies.

I think when it comes to UFO cases, I think probably the one people would probably know best was probably Angel Home from the nineteen forties.

Yeah, it's the justa Carlson encounter.

Let's say it wasn't now forty six, it was allegedly a year before Roswell and or those other things.

Yeah, we have a we have a monument on the on the spot where he saw this flying saucer Land in nineteen forty six, and this was a monument.

He be financed himself at the beginning of the seventies.

It's a fascinating case.

I mean, Claus Swan, who's dear friend of mine, has written a fat book about it, and he's done some serious investigations.

He knew your stuff.

So they basically wrote it together.

But Claus said, I need to when I write this book, I need to look at the case with you know, criticalized to I need to, you know, turn every stone, you know, to see what is true, what is not true?

What what's the deal here?

What really happened?

And I'd say that the case is not really convincing, but it's a very fascinating, fascinating older case.

Just that obviously something happened to him, that's quite We're quite sure of that he had some kind of experience, but it was much likely not a physical experience.

It's more likely it was some kind of inner experience, you know, of some sorts.

You know, it's difficult to say.

And now that has passed away, and but there's there's a lot of questions that still needs to be answered around it.

And if you know the case you know that the aliens left some things there after they landed, and these are in the was in the possession of your stuff for a number of years, and this is a small staff, some kind of still staff, for example.

These are now lost or possibly his daughter have them, but we don't know for sure actually, so we can't do any further investigation.

Maybe in the future there surface, Yeah, I.

Hope so, because it's a it's an incredibly fascinating case.

It is.

I mean, especially if you if you go to a home and you visit this place and you can stand on the spot where he was standing, and you can look at this particular area out in the forest where these landing tracks can be fined.

There was damage in the in the ground afterwards, and in the seventies he put a concrete in the traces of the of the UFO.

So you have these kind of big concrete circles out in the forest that kind of marks where the UFO was landing.

So it's interesting to look at it from that perspective.

But I'm personally also quite convinced that this was an inner experience, which is interesting by itself.

You know, I don't but I do not think there was something physical landing there.

Actually Okay, But is there any Swedish cases that you think should be more well known internationally, you know the same as like Rosweldt or Wenoshan.

I would say, I have a chapter about it in my book.

It's more known as the Valentina Flat.

It was in you know, it was in nineteen seventy four where a family there was like a mom, two or three kids, the mom's parents or brother.

There was a bunch of people who had a quite close encounter with a UFO near their house in Valentine.

Now and it's a very very convincing case.

The witnesses, those who are alive today, still tells the same story.

I met them myself, I heard them talk about this.

There's haven't been any changes in their stories since nineteen seventy four.

There's I mean, I think at the most there were at least five or six people at the same time who saw this object quite close during this night.

There were at least thirty forty people who claimed to have seen something flying around over their town or in the countryside around it.

I just find it very very convincing.

The witnesses are convincing, and it was so convincing.

Even the military did some investigations there the weeks after.

There's still no explanation for it.

We don't know what this was.

So the Valentina Flat, which I'm sure you can find information about if you search on it on the internet.

It's a very fascinating case.

I know for sure that some people have stolen my texts and kind of were written them with chat Gypt.

So hopefully they got the hopefully they got all the facts correct.

That's a good one, really good one.

An interesting one.

Absolutely.

Okay, So you cover a lot of a lot of high strangeness and you incorporate folklore.

You think that there is a big crossover.

With this, Yeah, at least in my eyes, it is the same.

I think it all depends on from where we are coming from, where the witnesses are coming from.

I believe I'm in the book.

I'm trying to explain my view on it.

But i've been when I'm recently, I have been trying to explain it.

It's kind of just becomes messy.

But I kind of see the phenomenon itself as a big canvas, and our consciousness, our personal consciousness or collective consciousness, is kind of like the color being thrown at the canvas creating some kind of path.

And depending on who we are, the pattern looks different.

So if you're more connected to nature or are brought up with the tradition of gnomes or trolls, et cetera, that or ghosts, that is what you will see and experience.

If you come from a more technological point of view or having that kind of upbringing, you will you are more likely to experience UFO related stuff.

And when I say UFO, I mean like spaceships, et cetera, that kind of technology or seemingly something technological.

So that just makes me more curious, you know.

And of course these thoughts are these are nothing new, of course.

I mean both John Keel and Jacquevallee and a ton of other guys have written about it over the years.

But I can't get around it, you know, it's this for me, It is all the same in one way or another.

It all depends on who we are or maybe what we want to see.

I also very fascinating, especially in the stuff I write about in the book, is that many of these experiences happens in what I call liminal spaces, you know, countryside roads or fields.

You know, this kind of this space between civilization, these quiet, calm places where there is no distractions or anything like that.

It kind of feels like you need to put yourself in a certain mood to be able to experience stuff.

You need to find the calmness within, you can say, or maybe cleanse your mind from distractions or thoughts, and then stuff will appear.

I mean, in most cases I've been looking tour are set in those kinds of environments and with that kind of circumstances.

Not all of them, of course, but most of them.

I'd say it's set on the country side when there's no other people around, that's when that's when it happens.

You know.

That's an extremely good way of putting it.

When you said about the canvas, this is a big blank canvas, and we obviously we view a lot of these experiences subjectively, and our consciousness is basically the painting.

Depending on who you are, and you know, how you're viewing life, how you experience and how you view life depends on the color which is the canvas.

Yeah, exactly.

I think you described it better now than I.

Well, I just built on what you said, but yeah, it's a good way of putting out I might use that for the future.

Please do, please do it somehow.

It's a bit maybe a bit abstract, but for me it becomes very clear when I think about it that way.

But then again, what is the phenomenon itself?

What is the canvas?

How is that created?

Where does it come from?

I have no idea.

I read an article just a couple of days ago that in Uppsala University, which is just a couple of miles from where I lived, they come to the conclusion that, through mathematics and lots of other things that I don't understand, they've come to the conclusion that our consciousness is something external from the brain.

It's not the brain creating the consciousness.

It's kind of brain is connecting to some kind of wider, larger consciousness.

This is of course old ideas are used by a lot of different you know, religions and esoteric people and existential philosophy, et cetera, et cetera.

But they claim to have proven this with mathematics, and it should be able.

You can you can do tests on this, and you can kind of prove that there is a larger, more wide consciousness that that we connect to and if that is correct, then I guess that is what we That is what the phenomenon is, you know, that we connect to other kinds of experiences somehow.

I realize now that this sounds absolutely confusing, but it sounds good inside my head, but when it comes out from my mouth, it just sounds confusing.

But I still believe that this wider consciousness thing is what helps us create these experiences somehow.

Yeah.

Really, yeah, that's perfect.

No, no, no, And you know, I think the biggest mistake people can make, and you see this in the UFO, the paranormal and the cryptozoology community.

Obviously there's there's a lot of separation between all these all these groups on this show.

You know, I explore and have the whole spectrum of experiences on and I think the biggest mistake people make is that they put them, they shelve them, They shelve each different experience into its own area, into its own category, you know, it's into its own box.

Instead.

Really they should all be on the same big bookshelf.

Absolutely agree.

Yeah, So I think it's I mean, it's been so much division between these groups.

You know, you have the nuts and balts people, and you have the esoteric parts of the community and everything, and I feel it you need to kind of like you said, you need to put all these books on the same shelf soon.

You know, you need to realize that there is there is something connected between them.

You see so many say malarias between a lot of these experiences or connections, and I've always said that, I've always believed they are connected in some way.

You know what it is, may or may not never know.

But now this isn't just for our listeners of Sweden, but also you know, we want to incorporate our counterparts in Norway and Finland as well.

But Fred, what advice would you give someone who's had an encounter and is a little bit hesitant to come forward.

Well, first of all, you've got to realize that you're among friends, because most people have experienced something.

And if you want to talk about it, and you talk about it with one person, I'm absolutely one hundred percent sure that you won't get met with laughter or disbelief because that other person have for sure experienced something themselves.

To understand that no one is alone when it comes to these kind of things.

For example, here, I mean I to talk with you has been very rewarding, and I hope it's it's possible to understand what I'm describing.

You know.

I realize still that there's a slight language barrier from my side to to talk about these things in English, but just to sit down like this, it's a wonderful way to talk about it and come forward with with one's experiences.

This is how I would would recommend it to happen.

You know, don't go out and post it on Facebook or in some group or page or something like that, because you will meet idiots, find friends or those who are willing to listen, for example, this podcast UFO Chronicles because here, you know, it's places like this where you have friends and respectful trends and people who really want to listen to you.

You can also come.

I mean, if you're, for example, in Sweden and you want to talk about these things, you can you can contact You can contact me or my colleagues in Osvalia, the big main UFO organization, because we have the deepest respect for people's experiences and we would love to hear and we would love to investigate or sometimes we might find an explanation for what you experience and sometimes we won't find that, and that's what makes it so much fun and interesting beautifully put.

Absolutely, and you know, if you do want to reach out to Fred, I will put Fred's or Fred's links for northern lights, the high strangeness in Sweden, you know, I'll put all these details down below so you can correspond and bring more of these Scandinavian cases into the world.

Well, it's been a pleasure to talk with.

You, absolutely, Fred.

I really appreciate you coming on and sharing all these fascinating experiences.

Thank you, Thank you for inviting me.

I appreciate it so thank you so much.

You enjoyed the rest of your day.

I will, I will, and you too.

Take care of yourself and talk soon, sir.

Yes, take care, bye bye bye bye.

Well, that is all for this week and this year, so keep updated and connected with the show on x, Facebook and Instagram.

And if you have an encounter that you'd like to share on the podcast, you can email me at UFO Chronicles at gmail dot com, or you can reach out to me via the contact page on my website UFO Chronicles podcast dot com.

A big thing to Fred for sharing tonight, and thank you all.

For listening, and as we wrap up tonight's episode and head towards new year, I want to say a sincere thank you for spending another year with UFO Chronicles podcast.

This show wouldn't exist with people who listen, who reach out and trust me with their stories.

It means a lot.

I hope you will have a safe and hopeful start at twenty twenty six.

However you'll mark in the night, whether it's with friends, family, or a quiet moment to yourself.

I wish you all a good one and here's to more mysteries and more stories in the year ahead.

Take care and I'll see you in twenty twenty six.

Till then, stay safe and keep watching Uskies.

Goodbye to any