Welcome everyone to the Noble Just Bacon podcast.

I'm your host, Dr.

Allen, and with me here today is Coach Beth to answer all of your burning health and fitness questions from around the social media world.

This is a rapid fire episode and we have a ton of great topics to cover today.

So let's get rolling.

First off, from our Mighty Networks group, fair life protein shake versus core power versus whey protein powder, Is 1 better than the others or are all equally good?

Essentially this question at the very end, she's asking if a fair life a day is any worse than using a protein powder and the answer is no.

The they're all dairy sourced protein.

They all function just fine.

When you're choosing a protein supplement, any dairy source works very well.

There are plant based sources that work just as well.

Soy is a great alternative.

A combination of pea and brown rice works really well.

The main reason that you would choose one protein powder or ready to drink option over another would be based on cost, the taste, whether you like it or not, consistency and the macros inherent.

So it may make sense in general recommendations to recommend a whey protein shake and in fact, that's what we do.

The reason that we recommend that they often tend to have the best price per serving and tend to be equal as far as results go to a lot of these other ones.

I was going to say that they tend to have some better macros, but I would think that compared to like a fair life, they would be fairly similar because you get fair life occasionally.

Beth they have essentially skim milk in that that they've used.

Yeah, so, yeah, So Fairlife is the Fairlife and Core Power are, are pretty much identical.

They're the same company.

They're just called different things.

I think Costco sells both of them currently, but it's it it they're the macros are good.

Like it's, it's pretty low fat.

I, I think I want to say like 3G or less per thing per container.

It's essentially the same as adding fair life milk to a whey protein powder essentially.

So you get a really, a really a good hit of protein, like 25 to 35g per.

And I think core power even has like the 42g ones like they've got, they've got some really high protein options.

But in my experience, the issue is always going to be cost.

It just is going to come down to what people want to be the most convenient.

I know the RT DS are very, they're already made for you right?

Like you don't have to have a separate shaker bottle and make your own shake.

Like they're literally already there and they are delicious.

I will say that much.

Nuri is another good one that's pretty new and Urri is the name of it.

They are comparable in terms of taste to Fair Life.

They are a little bit thinner in terms of consistency.

I still prefer Fair Life and Core Power over the Nuri shakes in terms of consistency, but the macros on them are stellar and they taste really, really good too.

And those are also at at Costco.

Now, one thing that I would consider is you have the ability to customize.

If you get protein powders, you have the ability to customize them a little bit better towards your needs.

And what I mean by that is you could get a whey protein concentrate or a whey protein isolate or a casein or a blend of sorts.

And it's not that the protein works any differently.

You know, if it's got 25 grams of protein in one of those, it's going to work equivalently to 25 grams of protein in another.

But the consistency is very different and they can be used for different applications.

You know, as an example, a whey protein concentrate is a little bit thicker than a whey protein isolate, which is the thinnest.

The thinnest ones tend to work best in in fruit or citrus flavors and can even work really well in those clear ways.

And then it goes all the way down into casein, which tends to be the thickest.

Now that works best if you're looking for some satiation because it takes longer to digest.

It sits in your stomach, it keeps you fuller longer, whereas the way I slit would be the complete opposite end of that spectrum and it's greater for baking.

Casein holds up really well under heat it you can actually get a better consistency with baked goods if you're trying to make protein related baked goods.

I'm not pushing protein related baked goods, but if you're going to be doing that, casein tends to work best.

Way I slit works the least best, but whey isolate is a good alternative for people who are lactose intolerant because the isolation process itself removes large quantities of the lactose and that can be a really beneficial thing for a lot of people.

What do you use with the creamy Beth to?

I mean, what would you prefer out of all of those to make the best ice cream?

I would use a fair life protein shake.

I would use one of the RT DS for that and then add a little bit of a higher fat content milk in there with it.

So typically when I make mine, I use the fair life protein shake and then I add a little bit of 2% fair life milk to that just because the you don't want it to end up like ice milk.

And I will say that the Ninja creamy does a really good job when it blends it to like there's different settings that you can use on it to give you a different consistency.

But even when you're doing that, they do recommend that you pour a little bit of higher fat milk in while it's mixing to kind of thicken it up a little bit.

Because if you're doing everything fat free, like the mouth feel, you're just never going to replicate ice cream with no fat in there whatsoever, right?

So I usually will will blend a little bit of 2% fair life into the shake.

I've I have done those some ninja creamy recipes with whey protein powder the Legion cocoa cereal flavour.

That's more of a way isolate, so I I would think that would be difficult.

It's not because, well, that because I mix it with the 2% fair life milk.

I'm not mixing it with skim milk.

I mix, I mix together 2% fair life with the Legion cocoa cereal flavour and and do it that way.

But you do need you do need to touch a fat in there somewhere.

I'd be interested to see we, we just got the clear way lemon lime.

I would be interested to see that.

I mean, even without the fat, maybe it would make it kind of like a, like an icy or a, an Italian ice.

That would be, I'd be curious to try that.

If anybody has tried that with like a clear way, let us know because that can certainly be a recommendation that we can give to other people.

But these are good options to be able to get your protein in and maybe satiate a little bit of a sweet tooth.

If if you're looking for that, you know, every once in a while, these can be great ways to do it.

And particularly for people who say, you know, I have a hard time hitting my protein needs and, and, you know, I would be able to stay on my diet a little bit better if I felt like I had like a little bit of a treat.

This is a good way to to kind of combine a little bit of that.

And like Beth said, she does that to great effect.

And so I recommend it for people who are looking into this type of thing.

But they're all good options that you have here.

Like we've talked about in the past, the the, the only things that I would really talk about being a little bit more guarded with our collagen proteins and beef protein isolate.

Beef protein isolate being the one that really confuses a lot of people because they hear beef without realizing that it is not beef meat.

There is no beef meat protein powder on the market.

It is blood product and connective tissue.

It does not function like a good protein source.

It is very devoid of most amino acids, particularly the ones that build lead muscle and repair your body.

All right, next question.

Do you get enough calf work by doing normal leg exercises?

The question would be, for me, the question would be enough for what?

Is it enough to do the normal leg exercises?

Yes, probably.

Is it enough to have the strongest calves and potentially the the most shapely calves?

No, it's not.

If you want a muscle to be as strong and shapely as possible, you have to work it directly.

And I, I don't think that that is really surprising to most people.

I think that calves are often an ignored body part just because of the fact that they're kind of a drag to do the, the, the, the only way to work the calf is literally to just extend at the foot and that's it.

And so like there's like two or three exercises and that's all there is.

And so I think that people get really bored with calf work more than anything else.

But I would incorporate calf work the same day, same way that I would consider incorporating forearm work like grip work, or the same way that I would consider incorporating AB work.

Some people have a distinct reason to do this.

You know, if you're playing a sport that requires stability.

I mean, an NFL lineman would want to have some form of of work in play.

If this is a deficient area, If you want to build your if you want to build your cabs, yes.

Sprinters would highly benefit from this type of thing.

Ballerinas may really benefit from direct work, although they probably got a ton of work in their in their routines, But you know, there are certain people that would benefit from this work.

So is this necessary for you?

Maybe maybe not.

You know, if you say, hey, I've got good calf genetics, I'm able to squat, deadlift, all that kind of stuff.

I feel really stable all the time.

You might never need to train calves.

You know, if if you're somebody that once larger calves, you probably have to train them directly.

And most of the time I think the issue that people have with growing calves is that they just don't spend enough time doing it.

They do like three sets once a week and they're like, my calves don't grow And it's like, well, most musculature is not going to grow significantly doing that low of a volume.

You probably need to up it.

And so unfortunately, with the way that the calves work, they're more of a stabilizer muscle in most exercises than anything else.

So it's not like they're getting a secondary degree of work from most exercises.

I mean, the only ones that I could really think like you're pressing up a little bit at the top of like Olympic lifting movements, but it's not.

But it's, you know, it's it probably, unless you're extremely genetically gifted, it's probably not adequate to get like the absolute best look that you would like.

I mean, with the years of weightlifting that I did and the number of pulls that I was doing where you do come up to full extension on on the top of the toes with heavyweight, my calves didn't grow at all.

Yeah.

So I I would think that some people would based on genetics, but but most people probably need a little bit of extra work.

I was just trying to think of like what type of movement could you do normally that would actually work the calves in the way that they need to be worked and the Olympic weight lifts, you know, lifts are the only things that I can think of.

That's the closest thing I could think of too that.

Aren't dedicated calf work.

Yeah.

Because like, even squats, and I mean maybe lunges, you're gonna be.

I was gonna say some sort of like split squat or lunge where you're like you're having to kind of press through the toe to come, you know, to you're just never really.

Leaving the ground with your heel, you know, and like at least like in a split squat, in a lunge you might be as you're pressing forward a bit, but we're really reaching here.

Yeah.

So yeah.

We're just we're trying to help you out.

My, my comment on this would be if you are following one of our programs, we're not going to program an excessive amount of calf work.

It might come in occasionally, but this is such a niche thing for people because if you're doing our movements, you're going to be getting enough calf work to do the the core movements.

That's fine.

If you want to add in a little bit of work with calves after whatever we've programmed, I actually don't have a problem with people doing that as long as it's not taking the place of stuff that we've programmed.

I don't have a problem with people spending, you know, an extra extra exercise or two occasionally, you know, twice, three times a week, something like that.

If you want to, if you've got the time, as long as it's not causing hits to your recovery, it's not messing with your other lifts.

Like if you're doing them on a day and then the next day you've got legs and then you can't do legs because your calves are so sore.

You either added in too much volume where you maybe you should be placing it away from that day that has those calf intensive movements, at least for stability purposes.

But I, I do think just like with ABS, I know that there are a lot of of coaches and athletes out there that say you don't have to train ABS.

I don't agree with that at all because ABS typically only get transverse abdominis work from from general exercise movements.

You're bracing, you're not flexing the shoulders to the hips or the hips up towards the shoulders in most movements, unless you're doing something like a, you know, direct AB work anyways, like a wall ball sit ups or something like that, you're not doing that.

And so if you want the strongest ABS possible and you want the the rectus abdominis to be trained, you need to work it.

So it's it's it's very similar.

I mean, same thing with the forearms, like your forearms will grow significantly more than these other musculature that we talked about when you're doing lifts because of the, the grip work that's that's necessary.

But if you want the biggest forearms possible, you probably need to target it specifically.

But this is this is more of, of exercises that you add in once your base is covered and if you have the energy, the recovery and the time to do them.

So should you train calves?

It's up to you.

It could probably offer some benefits.

How do you avoid overshooting your calorie surplus or your calorie deficit in the first weeks despite water weight fluctuations?

OK, so when you are first changing into a cut or a build, there's going to be significant water weight, food weight, muscle glycogen fluctuations that are going to dramatically shift weight pretty quickly, especially if you're going from a cut to a builder or build to a cut.

It's real big to minimize errors or overshoot.

I would recommend that in between transitions, if you're not an experienced coach, I don't typically make people do this, but I would recommend this for everybody listening.

I would recommend that you get to a period of weight stability for about four weeks before making these changes because as an experienced coach, knowing what we're looking for, like if I've been working with you and I've been monitoring your rate of loss and a cut and you're like, OK, well, it's I'm thinking about this since it's September, you're like, OK, it's September.

I can now wear sweatpants.

We can go into a bill that literally happens every September with like half of my crew.

They're like, OK, summer's over.

I don't need to cut anymore.

Let's go into a bill.

Let's build as much muscle as possible until the spring.

Then I'm going to try to cut again.

Cool, we can do that.

I will jump people directly into a very minor surplus because I can tell where they were if they were consistent adherent in the cut and then I can figure that out.

For most people, that's more difficult because that requires a lot of experience.

And So what I would do is I would go to around maintenance calories for about four weeks.

That will get a lot of that water flux out of the way.

It will make you less hesitant because you're going to see a bump up.

If you're going from a cut into a build, you're going to see a bump up, but the bump up is going to be significantly less than if you're going directly into a build.

So maybe it's 345 pounds.

Then you hold steady and that can make people feel a lot more comfortable.

And then you can slowly raise from there into your build to hit the right rate of gain or, or whatever you're trying to do.

But I would hesitate from telling an average person jumping from cuts to builds or vice versa is the right move because you're going to you're going to have a lot of potential weight variance in play.

And if you can get some of that out of the way, if you can say, OK, well, I knew that I was cutting, I'm just going to go right to the to my new maintenance after my cut.

I get stable there.

Then you can go up in increments that aren't going to leave you struggling to figure out, OK, well, am I doing the right thing or is this just massive weight gain from the fact that I'm now flooding my system with, you know, more carbs, sodium, you know, muscle glycogen, food weight, all the different type of stuff that comes with it and vice versa.

I think that if you're in a build and you're not really overly experienced, you could drop yourself very low.

And, you know, that's in a short term, that's not really going to cause a massive problem.

But I think the biggest issue that people are going to run into is that consistency and adherence is going to be really difficult.

If you've been eating a bunch of food and then all of a sudden you have like no food, you know, you're really dropping your calorie amounts.

You're not getting used to hunger signals because you're going to have very increased hunger signaling during that transition period.

And usually every time, you know, we go into cuts with clients when I drop calorie amounts, I'll tell them, hey, 2-3 weeks, you're going to experience more hunger because of this drop than what you were prior.

Get ready for it and then make adjustments based on what you're eating.

But this, this weight stability transition is probably a better idea for a lot of reasons, including sustainability and how easy it is for people to get through these things and quality of life.

So I that's my recommendation for dealing with these without overshooting and then falling into the rates of, of loss or gain as we've detailed in other podcasts.

Beth, anything else you would like to add to that?

Yeah, that that's exactly the approach I would take as well.

OK.

Next question, How would you define the difference between a beginner and intermediate level for training?

This person asking this question had mentioned in a podcast we had said something about 6 up to six months as a beginner.

I think if I recall what we were talking about there was I was discussing exercise form and I said that after about six months, you know prior in those first six months that you're working out, we always talk about wanting to be within that like one or two reps in reserve range to really hit good intensity.

And I believe my comment was when you're in that first six months of training of lifting, don't even worry about reps in reserve, just get in and start training.

And then at about 6 months, you're no longer a beginner as far as understanding the exercises that you're doing in that training block, you probably have some good at least modest form down to where you can start to push intensity.

And I, I truly believe that I think six months or so people are usually pretty good, especially if you have a coach you're knocking out good form way before six months.

That's a little bit different then if we talk about training experience and the difference that the differences that I would use to define a beginner and intermediate and advanced trainee.

So I wanted to point out that when I was talking about a beginner under those circumstances, I'm talking about just literally understanding how your body moves and does the exercises adequately before you start pushing intensity.

In about 6 months, if not a little bit sooner for most people, is when you can start to focus on intensity.

Now when we're talking about is a person considered a beginner trainee, an intermediate trainee and an advanced trainee from a training experience standpoint and not a do they understand how to do a movement standpoint?

Has their body adapted to be an intermediate trainee or an advanced trainee?

There is no formal definition that is used to define these things.

However, I actually have my own definition that I use and I've talked about online a few times to identify this.

I consider a beginner, a person that can make progress in their lifts week to week.

Every week you're able to up a weight or a Rep and it comes fairly quickly and you say, OK, I can look back on what I lifted last week and I'm doing better this week.

Cool.

Every single week you're a beginner intermediate takes multiple weeks to be able to increase lifts, to be able to increase progressive overload.

Essentially lifts, reps you know, density in a in a movement frequency in the week, all those different types of things.

And advanced trainee, it takes months to progress less, many months.

I mean, even with an intermediate trainee, I would say a few weeks to a couple, you know, a month or two.

With advanced trainees, it takes many months to see improvements in lifts.

So you're going to start to notice that as you become more advanced, those distinct levels of progress come fewer and far between.

That's because in those beginning periods, you're seeing a lot of neural adaptation.

Your nervous system is learning to fire and that tends to happen really quickly.

And then once all that's through and you're conditioned and, and your body is used to firing the muscles as they should be fired optimally, then the only thing that can really change outside of maybe getting a little bit better in form, which doesn't tend to happen at on years in.

I mean, it can if you're like an Olympic weightlifter that has very distinct technique, but for most other lifts, they're pretty good within that first six months or so.

And and you're, you're not going to, if you've been taught correctly from the start, you're not going to massively improve your lifts beyond that point if you've been doing it right from the start.

Now people that have just started working with us that have been lifting for years, we will often find very distinct improvement in their lifts in those for six months they're working with us.

That's just because they hadn't refined the lift to begin with.

When you are looking at this as a training experience thing, one of the discussions that we have is when you're in those beginner phases, you're going to experience heightened growth during that period.

And I mean, it lasts, you know, those, those beginner levels can last for a year or so.

And you're going to get that, that thing that we talked about called newbie gains.

Yeah, blood.

Yeah.

And then you're never going to see them again.

And then you'll never have them ever again.

Right.

And and so this is that that's, that's a very distinct sign of a transition from that beginner period into that intermediate period because intermediate period you no longer have those newbie gains.

That's where like in that beginner period, technically upwards of almost 5 reps in reserve or five reps away from failure can grow muscle very well.

And that's why we see people start lifting and they're like, oh, I, I grow muscle extremely easily.

And you know, they don't realize that that rate's going to really slow down and eventually stop.

And, and the, The thing is, because there is so much leeway when you're first starting to lift, people will look at that and then not really feel the impetus to push themselves as much as they should be pushing themselves.

And so it's, it's a, it's a balancing act because in those first six months, when you're getting the form down and you're just trying to, you know, hammer away at getting your body used to that muscle memory of doing the movements correctly.

You know, learning a hinge pattern, learning to squat correctly, learning to not flare your elbows up in AT pattern and a bench press, like getting all those things out, you're more focused on that than focus on the intensity.

And so you get to this period where you're still gaining pretty well because you can be so much farther away from failure.

And then you get into that period where all of a sudden you've got to be close to failure.

And so that transition between that beginner period and the intermediate intermediate period, which is roughly a year of dedicated training for most people is in, in my experience.

And Beth, you can talk about how you feel about this, but anecdotally, that's where I find people end up quitting and people end up quitting because it's there's not that immediate gratification.

They I think there's a light bulb that goes off and they realize shit, this literally is for the rest of my life.

Yeah.

And they understand, like they understand at that point that like it's literally just about day by day, workout by workout, Rep by Rep.

And I, I don't think that they're mentally prepared for the slog that that is going to be.

But it, it, it's only a slog if you look at it like that.

Like I approach my training as like, I love going to the gym.

I love being there.

I love working out, even though I'm not making incredible gains anymore.

I love the way that it makes my body feel.

I love feeling active and vibrant.

And I think you just have to switch your perspective of why, why you're doing what it is that you're doing.

Once you kind of get through that big interface, you're training for life.

You're training literally to prepare yourself to live the rest of your life as the healthiest version of yourself that you can be.

And all of a sudden people stop seeing all those gains and they get really depressed and unhappy.

And they're like, wow, this really is like, I really am going to have to do this every single week for the rest of my life in order to kind of keep what I'm doing here.

Yeah, I mean, that's that's the catch 22 of the thing.

You there's no end.

And I think that people in their minds at that point, they haven't really fallen in love yet with yeah, the benefits that it gives.

I mean, usually at a year people aren't really even aware of the non scale victories as much as they should be.

I mean, the more advanced that you become, I think that you become this is one of those chicken or egg things.

Do you become more advanced because you start to value the non scale victories or do you know, or is it the opposite?

You know, and I, and I think that the people that really start to notice their improvements in their relationship with food, how they feel, even a little bit of self loathing can be used productively there.

Because you're talking about like, I love the way that it makes me feel.

I think sometimes, and I'm not advocating self loathing, but I, I think that if it's not really taken to the core, it can be used beneficially.

Because sometimes I'll look at it and I'll be like, man, it's been 2 days since I have since I've lifted.

I feel like shit.

It's like just hating the idea that you feel so bad.

You're just like I, I feel terrible.

I want to go like do something like and even if it's just going for a run, that's fine for me.

Like I.

Movement and elevated heart rate for a little bit.

Yeah, you just need to sweat a little bit sometimes.

And so that can be a really beneficial thing.

But for the people that are, you know, intermediates and beginners and they're trying to figure out how to make this a thing we always talk about.

And it literally everybody talks about how this is a lifestyle.

It's not, you know, a diet or a season or whatever it is.

And I think that that can feel overwhelming for people because if there's no end, like, am I always going to be suffering?

And the answer is yes, you will always be suffering.

But your mind tends to shift and you actually enjoy a little bit of that suffering because it stops being something that you're forced to do.

It starts being something that you get to do.

And then it becomes a personal challenge.

And I really like the fact that this is not, you know, unless you're in a competitive lifting sport, it's you're not competing against anybody else.

This is you against you.

And what's really cool about that is you can always strive to improve.

And you know, as a person that is mid 40s at this point, maybe I'm not going to be improving in maximal strength ever again really.

But I can, I can, you know, always focus on being the best version of myself.

And I can look at what I do these days and I say, Hey, I'm, I can outpace most 30 year olds.

And so that's always a really cool thing.

And, you know, for the people that are listening to this, I would think that the majority of you are either just getting started or, or have, you know, had a history of, of fitness in your life.

And I think that either you see those benefits and compare yourself to people that are 15 years younger, or you want those benefits.

And you know, for people that are just starting, no matter the age that you start, you can significantly improve compared to what you were before, or you can maintain if you've been advanced.

And even when we look at the research, people maintain really well up until, you know, almost 70.

And I can, I, can, I have an anecdote.

I had a patient when we used to live on the East Coast that he was 85.

I mean, the guy looked like he was maybe 60.

And, and we talked about fitness and stuff because that's how he stayed young.

And he's like, yeah, I, I don't lift weights, but I swim all the time.

I swim, you know, every day.

And, and he was hilarious because he would come in and he would make up these, these just outlandish stories about like what he needed to do to, you know, I, I need you to fix this tooth that I cracked because I'm speaking at, you know, this college nearby and, and on the weekend and can you get me in his emergency?

And I'd be like, yeah, sure, let's get you in.

And then we would, we would fix it and we would get to talk.

And he's like, yeah, I don't have that.

I got a date.

And I'm like, what this 85 year old guy is like, yeah, I've got a date with a 62 year old.

I'm like, OK, so this is, yeah.

I mean, it was hilarious.

He kept pulling this too.

And they'd almost became something that like I expected.

I was like, OK, what is he lying about today?

Because it was always a date, but it just, it's, it goes to show how much activity.

We don't age physically really because of chronological years.

We age physically because we stop moving.

The second somebody hits like 25 in general, they just stop moving.

The second you get out of college, all of a sudden everybody stops exercising.

Workman.

I mean work kids.

The man dragging you down.

Yeah, you're not in a you're not in a position where like you've got that free time to, to really do it that well, you feel, you feel like you don't deserve it.

I think, I think that some people feel selfish.

I think women particularly take that that on.

Oh, well, if I'm doing this, then it's selfish.

It's not I'm not focusing on my family.

I mean, maybe that's that's misogynistic or traditional general roles, but I've found with my clients and I work with a lot of 40 plus women that they take that family burden upon themselves more so than the men.

Yes, they do.

I mean, that's still that's not misogynistic because that's still a the the burden of rearing children and tending to the home still falls to the woman.

Even if the woman has a full time job, it still falls to her.

So there is a lot of that's associated with, OK, if I'm going to take 30, even if it's just 30 minutes out of my day to sequester myself in my home gym or go to the gym and drop the kids off at daycare or whatever it is.

There is that feeling of of mom guilt for that.

Like I could be at home vacuuming or I could be at home prepping my, you know, dinner for my husband and my kids.

And I'm not, I'm here.

I'm here doing this purely for myself and there's a lot of guilt that is associated with that for now.

I, I do have, I do have men that fall into the same thing.

You know, I, I cook for my family.

I I've seen a lot more men in the past couple years that are the main cooks for.

The the main cooks for their family.

Yep.

Which is wild to me.

And like there's I've had a lot of of men clients who who are like, my wife doesn't know how to cook.

And I'm like, Oh my God.

And I don't think that of like, Oh my God, the wife doesn't know how to cook.

I say that when like anybody says that they don't know how to cook like you, you should literally, you don't need to be able to be like a major chef, but like grill a chicken, boil some water.

Like if you can boil water, you can make pasta.

You can make rice, you can do potatoes.

Like there's a whole bunch of stuff that you can make just by being able to.

You don't even need to know how to boil water anymore with an instant pot, you literally just need to know how to add water to it.

Throw it in and.

You should be able to do that.

Press the poultry button.

Yeah, I mean, it's Jesus.

So it's, it's really funny.

But I I've seen, you know, and I, I have had men who carry the same burden.

I have a lot more women that carry that burden.

And I guess misogynistic was not the right phrase for it, but it was, it is stereotypical, but it's a stereotype that I would like, if anybody like put a gun to my head and they're like, do you believe in the stereotype?

I'd be like, yeah, I do.

I, I would bet statistically, and I say this with absolutely no backing other than anecdote.

I would bet statistically that women deal with that probably at a higher rate.

The other thing with with that, though, is women also have that tendency to want to really take care of themselves really well.

And, and I think that that that that adds a lot of stress to life.

I think that it does to everybody's life, You know, everybody that's trying to make improvements in their lives, They always feel pulled between social obligations and kids and work and all that different kind of stuff.

And I, I think it sucks, but you know, do the best that you possibly can do understand that at any time in life, you can make big changes.

You know, you don't have to spend your life in the gym to be able to do it either, But you should spend some time in the gym, whether that's your home gym, whether that's, you know, at, at, at a commercial gym, because especially if you've got kids in play, they need to see that.

They need to see that it's important for you and they need to see that you can make time for it because that sends a much better message to them than them seeing you say, well, I can't do that because every day I have to do laundry.

You know, taking care of yourself physically and mentally is a really important thing.

And I think that in this quest to take on all of these burdens, we might be setting our kids back by accident because this is this is an example that they will look at for many, many years to come.

And I know that a lot of my clients that we've shifted that mindset have said, hey, this is huge for me.

My kids are now asking if they can go to the gym with me.

If they, you know, they're they're interested in these things.

They're starting to view me as, you know, a superhero.

And that's awesome.

And so hopefully we can bring that to you guys through some good information, through these podcasts and the information that we put out there.

All right, off the soapbox.

Next question.

Thoughts on citrus fruit while aiming for weight loss?

They never seem to be in the spotlight.

I don't know why that would be.

I think that citrus fruits are great.

They provide a lot of vitamins.

They have few calories.

Grapefruit baby.

So good.

Well, I think I think part of the reason that citrus fruits don't get a lot of love is because they have hardly any fiber.

Yeah.

So I think that's why you don't hear people touting them a lot like they do berries and stuff like that.

Or they're not as necessarily high volume as something like watermelon that has a super high water content.

So they.

Yeah.

But they're they're not that high in calories.

I mean, they're not at all.

They're no, they're definitely that's, that's definitely not what I meant by that.

I've just meant that like watermelon is known for like that being super high.

Like you can eat like 500 grams of of watermelon for like nothing.

But I do like, I love a good and especially in the winter, like grapefruit.

I love grapefruit.

But there's also like, I mean, I don't we, we, Alan and I eat a lot of clementines, like those little cuties that come in the bag.

We eat.

We tend to eat a lot of those.

I don't even know the difference between clementines and mandarins and.

I don't either, it's all the same to me.

And I have multiple nutrition certifications that I don't know the difference.

I've literally just.

I'm refusing to look it up.

But I also don't know anybody who's like eating lemons and limes, like nobody's eating like the and you know, it's like the and I think also just the popularity of citrus fruit, like there's not a ton of it.

So I don't know that that necessarily it's going to get a lot of love because the the selection is lower than other fruits that are out there.

But it's we love citrus, we're advocates of it, really high vitamins and minerals.

I think it just doesn't get more a lot of the love because of the variety and because of the the lack of fiber.

Hey, if you want to go back to youth soccer, grab yourself a bag of oranges.

Oh man, they work really, really well.

Loved halftime, yeah.

Every every soccer match.

The halftime orange, why'd you put it in your mouth?

And like a little :).

All right, next question, Does someone who does low volume weight training need less protein?

No, no, you need you need protein.

You need the protein that you need.

If anything, you might need less overall calories.

But that that low volume, I mean, I should not have painted myself into that corner.

Ignore everything that I just said.

I mean, low volume, low volume training.

I'm literally just trying to like, like think of something that I would adjust because of low volume.

There's nothing that you would adjust.

I mean, even low volume training, the difference in calorie burn between that and like standard training, because standard training is much lower volume than most people think.

Like if you're, if your training is program is optimized, it's not thousands of reps.

Yeah.

And So what someone considers low volume might actually be correct volume.

Adequate volume.

Yeah.

And so.

I'm assuming this person means that they lift like once or twice a week.

I know, I mean, protein's still going to be the same.

Yeah, your protein needs wouldn't really change protein.

'S still going to be the same I mean even calorie needs are probably going to be roughly the same I mean people, people really get this weird idea in their heads that oh, I lift weights and it's really hard therefore it's burning a lot of calories it's not burning shit you're you're.

Burning your retraining sessions burn hardly anything.

Nothing.

Yeah.

I mean, really, really strong sessions are burning like 250 calories for like the entire session, maybe less if you're smaller.

And so certainly maybe a little bit more if you do like CrossFit for that entire time.

But the thing, the thing with CrossFit is, I mean, it's cardio, so it's going to burn a little bit more.

But CrossFit workouts, it's not continuous.

So it's like 10 to 20 minutes of really hard work.

And so people think, oh man, I I'm dead.

I went to this hour long class I must and I've I ended up dead on the floor at the end of it.

I must have burned 1000 calories.

And most of those CrossFit classes are they do like a 10 minute warm up.

They do, they do a 20 to 30 minute weightlifting, like whether it be, you know, squats, deadlift, whatever, or Olympic weightlifting and they might do a teeny bit of skill work.

And then they do.

At the very end of the class they do a 5 to 15 minute.

And that's what makes them feel like they're on the floor, but that that actual time that they're, you know, burning more calories is at the end of the class for like 5 to 15 minutes.

Yeah, it's, it's like nothing.

It's negligible.

You know, sweating, effort, intensity really don't alter calorie burn.

I mean, they're just, they're not really indicative of it.

Volume, continuous volume is, is the indicator.

And that's why we talk about things like step counting and walking.

I mean, the, the issue with the high intensity work is that gas is used so quickly.

And so before you can really burn any calories, you're done.

And so people think, OK, well, it's a lot harder now.

Yes, in, in 10 minutes, if you've got 10 minutes of just walking versus 10 minutes of all out, you're going to burn more calories with 10 minutes of all out.

But if we're talking about absolute calorie burn, which is what really moves the needle on fat loss and weight loss, the total absolute calories makes more sense.

And so you figure out, OK, well, how can I burn calories through activities in a productive manner that also doesn't completely trash me from a recovery standpoint?

And if you're only outlet there is I'm going to do things that are as intense as possible because I want to feel dead.

You're going to kill your recovery for like all the important stuff, like actually building lean muscle and strength from the weight training.

I mean, that's why you do the weight training.

You don't do the weight training to burn calories.

That's just it's, it's the worst way to burn calories other than just sitting on a couch does not burn many, but it adds a lot of benefit to your lives.

I mean it, it improves bone, it builds muscle, which reduces injury risk, which makes you stronger, which makes you able to handle life better.

It produces lean muscle mass that acts as a metabolic sink.

You know, cardio, metabolic benefits, all of these things are really beneficial from weight training.

It's just not calorie burn.

Next question, what are your thoughts on doing a 72 hour water fast?

My thoughts are don't do a 72 hour water fast water.

I mean, fasting of any kind, disclaimer, if you fast for religious reasons, you can do that.

That's fine.

Everything that we're going to talk about here with fasting is physiologic in nature.

The argument that people always have is, OK, well, it's good for me spiritually, It's good for me mentally and emotionally.

Anything that you feel that is good for you spiritually or mentally and emotionally can be that is a an expectation effect, that is, that has something to do with your personal relationship with your deity or whatever it is.

We won't make any comments on that.

Physiologically, you don't want to be fasting for extended periods of time.

It doesn't matter if someone brings up the term autophagy.

It doesn't matter if people show you studies where if you don't eat for long periods of time you lose weight.

Yes, starvation.

Yes, starvation is a thing.

Starvation causes you to lose weight.

Nobody's ever arguing that when we look at research on fasting, fasting provides no specific benefits beyond the calorie deficit that it creates.

So you will find studies that say, hey, in this population of people, they fasted and if they were obese, their blood markers, their cardio metabolic, you know, health improved, yeah, they lost body fat.

The number one bad thing for your body is to have excessive amounts of body fat.

It is massively inflammatory.

It causes a host of problematic health issues down the line.

And so in the short term, anything that makes you lose body fat is probably a really good thing.

If you've got excessive amounts, however, you can do that with a standard continuous calorie deficit without all of the negatives of extended fasting.

And I don't know if Beth incorporates this.

I incorporate intermittent fasting with a lot of my clients.

I asked them if they would enjoy eating that way and then we can do that.

A168 intermittent fast where you fast for 16 hours and eat in an 8 hour window has nothing to do with the fasting.

It has everything to do with it allows you to control your daily calorie intake.

It gives you enough time to get nutrients in in a window that does not put you into micronutrient deficiencies, into lean muscle loss, into problematic outcomes for performance.

And intermittent fasting seems to work just as well as a standard calorie deficit in a body composition standpoint.

From a body composition standpoint.

Now it does not work as well if you are at maintenance or above.

You do not build as much lean muscle doing an intermittent fasting style routine.

But probably anyways.

But you can use it effectively in fat loss.

What fasting advocates do is they will show you studies that looked at fasting compared to not not controlling a calorie restricted diet.

And they'll say, hey, look, this works better.

They can show you autophagy upregulates.

They can show you all these benefits to body fat, to cardio, metabolic health.

They're just not comparing it to an equivalent category.

If you compare it to a continuous diet that takes a little bit longer, but you equate the calorie deficit, the continuous diet sees either equivalent outcomes in all of these things.

Body composition, cardio, metabolic health benefits, autophagy, lipids, all those things, it's either equivalent or better.

It's never worse.

The fasting is problematic because you can lead into things like micronutrient deficiencies if you do it too much.

I mean, a 72 hour fast is way too long.

You can cause problems with lean muscle loss.

The thing that's literally the hardest for you to build over time, you're now getting rid of it.

You're removing necessary proteins from the liver that are used to to fight off things like cancers.

I mean, the more often you do this, the worse of an idea it is.

And you know, starvation is never a great idea outside of like medically induced starvation diets because you're literally just going to die if you don't do it.

Like if you're like 600 lbs and your doctor says you need to start doing this fasting routine that we put together for you, you better start doing that.

But outside of a medically guided fast, because they will typically give you vitamins, they might even do IV transfusions if necessary to make sure that you are healthy while doing it.

In those instances, the benefits outweigh the risks.

For people looking to lose 30 or 40 lbs, the benefits do not outweigh the risks.

It's not superior.

And if we're talking about things like autophagy because people say, Oh well, I want to live longer and I've seen the data, There is no data on fasting that have shown outcomes in humans that improves longevity.

There's none.

That's super confusing for people because there is data suggesting autophagy is up regulated when fasting.

Yes, a calorie deficit up regulates autophagy.

You can do that with a standard calorie deficit.

You can do it with just exercise.

You don't even need to be in a calorie deficit.

You could do it with just exercise, a standard calorie deficit and exercise provide those autophagy benefits without the negatives that come with starvation.

And so that's why this, it's a very confusing thing because there's a lot of really famous gurus that many people don't realize are gurus that are pushing fasting because, OK, you need to do this for longevity.

You need to do this because you've got you're perimenopause.

You need to do this because of, you know, there's a lot of reasons that they start to institute these things.

But the at the end of the day, the reason that they bring that up is because if they've got a special fast, they can sell it as a program and if fast you.

Sell not eating to somebody.

You get a new name you brand intermittent fasting.

You're not even giving that.

You're literally like withholding food.

Like it's so funny to me that like, I mean, I know they sell the protocol.

I know that that's what that is, but it's just it's such a weird concept to me that like you're like, there's no actual product that this person.

No, I mean, if you called it, so if we instead of calling it intermittent fasting, which you know, lean gains fasting took off like 10 years ago because it became so marketable, if I called that, hey, my plan's called skipping breakfast, nobody would buy it from me.

That's literally all it is, skipping breakfast or skipping dinner if you wanted to set it up that way.

So funny to me.

It's literally just skipping breakfast.

And no one would look at the skipping breakfast protocol and say, hey, this is really smart.

They'd be like, I'm just skipping breakfast.

It's like, right?

So what fasting?

Is and so with the 72 hour fast, one of the things that you will see is that they will say, hey, look, my specific protocol is different because I, I can show you what to do to counteract what Alan's talking about with these micronutrient deficiencies and all that.

And then they'll tell you to like, take in bone broth and take in amino acids.

And you know you can.

Have it does have calories.

Like how can you say that you're still fasting?

Right, that's this is actually a Brecca protocol.

Brecca Brecca bushes this so he, he will tell people that they need to do a 78 to 80 some hour fast, but within that fast you're allowed to have calories.

So it's not a fast.

No, it's not.

And so it's hilarious because he's like, well, you can have bone broth and you can have like he actually has a protocol where he's like at hour 12, you drink this much bone broth and then at this part you do my he sells aminos.

He's like, and then you buy my aminos.

And so like there, it's, it's a really, it's funny.

It's funny and it's very convenient that there are specific things that you need to buy to do this correctly.

And the people will do out of your fast.

Yeah, and of course if you starve yourself and you don't eat anything, you're going to lose muscle glycogen, you're going to lose food weight, you're going to lose.

And so people will do this 72 hour fast or longer because his actually goes, I think 80 some a little bit longer.

Dana White always pushes it and the, the guy that's the head of the UFC always pushes it because he has Braca as a coach.

And they'll say, oh, well, it, it lowers cancer risk by 70% or something like it's a random number.

They've made it up, which is why I can't quote it because they they literally fabricated it.

Fasting does not lower your risk for lifetime cancer.

There's no data anywhere that says that it does up regulate autophagy.

Any, any calorie deficit does.

Right.

But the problem with cancers is that they are a a an umbrella term for a bunch of diseases and some of them work better when autophagy is up regulated, which could cause cancer to spread.

And so there you'll see, you know, well, well, this cancer diet for from this doctor says too fast.

You might need to with that specific cancer, but you don't want to randomly fast because all you're doing, if you're randomly fasting, if you don't have the cancer that needs it, is you're depriving your body of proteins that are necessary to fight cancer in the 1st place.

You're lowering your immune system.

You're not raising your immune system with frequent extended fasts.

And you know to say Oh well, I need to get into a fast because it will jumpstart my diet.

It doesn't jumpstart shit.

You lose weight really quickly while you're fasting because you've got no food weight, you've got no water in you, you've got no muscle glycogen that drop.

You're not dropping fat faster than an appropriate calorie deficit.

You're potentially losing some muscle during that period, but it's, oh, it's a jump start.

It's not a jump start.

It is a false sense of progress because the second you pull out of that fast, you're going to fill up those muscle glycogen stores.

Even if you're going into a regular cut, it's going to go back up to that level anyways.

So you're going to end up where you would have, if you would have just on the continuous diet over a couple weeks.

You're going to get right back to that point if you go to an appropriate level.

But maybe you're losing, maybe you've lost a little bit of muscle and maybe you were a little bit sicker during that period.

Maybe you didn't sleep as well.

I mean, there's there's no reason to do this.

It's literally just to make yourself feel better in the short term to see the scale drop and maybe feel a little bit tighter because when you deprive yourself of, you know, all of this stuff, you're, you're going to feel tighter for sure.

You know, this is a reason that people do these water fast to make weight for wrestling, powerlifting, Olympic weightlifting.

When you're getting onto a bodybuilding stage.

I mean, you do it because it, it's essentially a way to like shrink wrap yourself and, and you feel great.

And that's the problem with this is that you feel great.

The scale goes in the direction that you want.

You've just proven to yourself this is survivorship bias and you've just proven to yourself that this works.

And then you tell all your friends and they say, Oh, well, I saw you at the beach, you know, right after you.

Oh, I just did a 72 hour cleanse or detox or fast or whatever it is.

And, and yeah, it, it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Oh, it really works.

Well, I mean, yeah.

I mean, it'll, it'll shrink wrap you for a certain period of time.

That doesn't necessarily mean that the physiologic benefits are there that you think are there.

And so this is a really confusing thing for most people, but hopefully we've given a little bit of insight into what's going on there.

So you can choose not to starve yourself.

Weak, thin, malnourished.

OK, moving on, how big should a calorie jump be if progress in gym performance stalls in a build?

So First off, I want to want to start to put this into perspective of, you know, OK, well we have a fitness plateau.

We've been in a build, we've likely been gaining weight over time, and now all of a sudden we've stalled.

Well, one, how long has the stall been?

Because if your gym performance has only stalled for a couple weeks and you're an intermediate or advanced training, I mean, what were we talking about earlier?

Maybe it will stall for extended periods of time that's possible.

So being conscious of that fact is, is really important.

I mean, is there are there any purposeful exercise alterations that you need to do to address the deficiency?

Because if we're looking at performance, I can say from from experience that most of the time we're looking at like squat, bench, deadlift, maybe the Olympic lifts, very few other lifts people will look at like these big lifts and say, OK, well, I want my bench to go up.

They don't ever really say, well, I want my lateral raise to go up.

So that that's not usually what we're looking at when people start to claim that there's a stall.

So when you got one of these exercises that you're focusing on as, OK, I really want to improve this, are there any exercise alterations that you need to do?

Do you need to address a deficiency?

Is there a point in your deadlift that you're sticking?

Should you do rack pulls at that point?

Like should we just adjust the training itself to address that deficiency?

Do we really need to up our calorie levels?

Is that is that the case or is your volume to low?

I bring that up specifically because this person is talking about a build.

Were you working on a volume that you were doing in the cut or maybe a maintenance and now you can handle a little bit more?

Could you handle a set here or there?

Maybe that's appropriate.

You know, if you've been training for the same with the same routine for three or four months, maybe it's time to to do a deload and, and switch out and do a different routine.

Maybe switching up the stimulus can allow you to benefit from that.

I mean, we see people all the time where like they, they really want to get their conventional deadlift up and then maybe pulling out of that and doing rack pulls or sumo deadlift or something else and then coming back in a training cycle beyond that, all of a sudden you've smashed the plateau in your conventional deadlift.

Giving the muscle a different look or giving the movement a different look, albeit something that's similar and will still work a similar pattern can be a really good way to be able to, to do that.

Are you giving yourself enough rest, rest days?

Too many times these days I'm seeing, you know, 6 days of, of weight training because people think more is better.

Maybe it's time to prioritize or identify whether your recovery needs are, are being met because a lot of times that's a big issue.

I mean, especially if progress is a thing and maximal strength work, 3 or 4 days for maximal strength work is more than adequate.

In fact, most power lifters will not train main lifts more than like four days a week.

It's not this is not a more as better type of situation.

So I would be looking at some of these things.

I mean, certainly your technique could improve for many people and, and that's, that's something to look into.

But you know, addressing the efficiencies in when performance is in play, really identifying where the sticking points and lifts are and why you're sticking can be the thing that you need to get past this.

I mean, we see people all the time where, you know, bench press, maybe pin presses are needed.

Maybe you're sticking at 1 little point off of your chest.

And if you were just able to get past that, maybe maybe, you know, like I said, the, the, the rack pulls are what are needed.

And I'm sure that you've got examples with Olympic weight lifts, Beth, you know where you're, you're doing pulls from one position or another, but that might be what you need rather than trying to just grind away at the entire lift over and over and over and just constantly getting stuck at that point, you know, getting getting through that point.

But this is where identifying where your issues are and then getting with a coach that can help you can really make a big difference because it does make a big difference, especially in people that are more intermediate to advanced.

This is where that really comes into play.

Beginners, you probably don't really need to do this.

But again, when someone says, oh, I've stalled, that's why the first thing that I said was, is this stall more than multiple weeks in a row?

Because is it really even a stall, particularly for a beginner if they're asking this question, maybe they just haven't improved the lift in two or three weeks and maybe you're moving into that intermediate stage and that's OK.

But I would evaluate the movements where you're sticking, where those problems are, evaluate your recovery, evaluate whether you need a little bit more volume and then making the decision once you're looking at an overall view of the entire program itself.

So I know that people ask these questions and they want a very distinct answer, but this is again, one of those it depends.

And there are a lot of variables in play.

And we're assuming that you're the question had had been how big of a calorie bump should there be?

If you've been in a build for a particular period of time and then you've done all of the things that I've just said here and you know what you're talking about, you can identify.

OK, well, I don't really have a major sticking point.

Form is good.

I'm getting adequate rest, I'm recovering, my program is right volume.

Well, when you want to bump up calories, I mean, it could be in general, literally between 100 and 200 calories.

And that might be all that you need.

But I would be hesitant to start adding food in until I address those other things that we talked about first to see if that's the issue and not food.

Because if you don't address those other issues, all you're going to be doing is adding food and food and food, and you're not going to be improving that lift so much as just packing on mass to pack on mass.

It's not necessarily going to be exactly what you want.

Any thoughts there?

Yeah, and I also, this question reminds me of the one that we got a couple weeks ago of like, you know, when it, when how many calories do you drop in a cut when somebody has stalled?

It's it's literally the same question but the opposite.

But I also in, in that I said the same thing.

It's not linear.

Like your loss is not linear, but your gain is also not linear.

Like I, I don't want people to expect in a build that you're like constantly gaining weight and increasing your measurements when you take your measurements and always increasing your lifts.

Like that's not, you're not just looking at at those things.

And it's not always linear.

Like you might go up and then kind of do this for a little bit.

You might go down a teeny bit and then go back up.

Like it's not if you're looking for for like steady, consistent, always moving out, like you're just going to get fat.

So you like it's not more food isn't always the answer here.

And what's going on with your sleep, your stress, social life, work, kids?

If all of a sudden you're sleeping less total volume or less quality, if work is ramping up, I mean, Cpas in like April, yeah, you're probably not going to go up in lifts.

I can almost guarantee you you're not going to go up in lifts.

You know, like, what else is going on there?

Because a lot of times when I talk about this with clients, I'll say, OK, well, what's going on in your life?

And they'll be like, oh, shit, like I'm getting divorced.

OK, dude, you're probably not going to go up in your lifts right now unless you can channel that rage somehow.

But like, you need to be conscious of this type of stuff because emotional effect and sleep loss will dramatically hamper this progress.

And then it changes from, well, I need to progress to holding steady might be the best that I can possibly do.

And if you're holding steady, that's a huge win under circumstances like that, you know?

So be very conscious about that kind of thing because it's going to come into play and it's going to come into play big time.

And there might not be anything that you can do from a food standpoint, from a, you know, if you've evaluated all the, the fitness side that we just talked about, if you've evaluated all that and all that's good.

But these other things are going on, you know, emotional instability, stress, I mean, the economy sucks.

Like all that kind of stuff like I that can add in.

And so give yourself a break because you're going to need it.

You cannot expect to progress rapidly under those conditions.

All right, guys, that is it for us today.

Thank you for joining us for another podcast episode.

Reach out to us with your questions in my story, Q&A's on Instagram, Facebook group, Mighty Networks, Community, YouTube.

You can post up questions in the comments section.

We will be happy to get to them in the future.

We will see you on future episodes of Noble Just Bacon.

Thanks for staying with us guys.

We'll see you next next time.