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Tonight's guest is Bruce Brown.

Bruce, Welcome to the show.

I'm glad to be here.

Well, it's screed halfn't you?

Bruce?

Please give us a brief bio on yourself.

My name is Bruce Brown.

I'm living Tennessee.

I'm a former law enforcement officer, served as patrolman, the deputy, hire sergeant, sergeant of patrols, from detective.

From detective, I went to cheap and narcotics, and cheap and narcotics, I have stayed as a detective and cheap in narcotics.

I'm sixty three years old.

And that's basically They're all there is about me.

Well, there's a lot to you, Yeah, there's no denying that.

How much does you, being a former law enforcement officer complicate you coming forward to tell us about all of your cryptid related experiences.

It does hinder me in some instances.

There's some of this that's classified that I'm not actually able to share.

The why I was the law enforcement officer.

Of course I couldn't share any of it since I'm no longer a law enforcement alstru hurt and a line of duty busting math labs.

There's things that I can share that's not classified.

But then there's things that involve the military that are classified.

Now I totally understand, and of course we're not even think by getting into them.

When you were working in law enforcement, did you have any standing orders on how to handle a cryptic related incident?

Yes?

Yes, yes, our orders were secrecy.

In my instance where I'm cheap in narcotics.

When I had encounters with cheap and narcotics, I pretty much was the boss and I had to sign off on everybody's reports.

And there's certain things that we weren't allowed to put in trained the officers and not putting those things in which caused us less headache in the department, and that way we didn't have to do.

I didn't have to send men off to have sych evals because of what they put in their reports.

That could mean something as strange as the big butt, the dog men, other cryptid animals.

Some claim they've witnessed the devil, and if that's put in a report, then we have to redact that.

Then the original report the spiles, but then we make a copy of an appidavit of what they're saying, and then that spiled.

And then when the nine one one system I'm in and that the government comes in every few months and audits that system, and it's locked behind the cage and they only have the key to it to go over the nine on one system.

And what was all filed and stuff and stuff like that they pulled out and took with them that involved any dog men type or other creatures.

So there was a lot.

There's a lot to it, a lot of things that they weren't willing to share with the public.

And as law enforcement officers retard, there's things that they can share.

And they know which is classified and which is unclassified, and some every now and then will step out there on that limb and give out classified information.

They will get a call.

It might come from the Department of Defense.

It might the call that they get may come from the US Army Corps of Engineers, and they come from the Coast Guard.

You never know where the calls coming in there, and a lot of times the first call will be nobody says anything on the other end when they call you and they hang up.

If you give out more classified than some information, then you'll get a visit and asked to swarm back into secrecy.

And what the consequences are legal wise, that can happen to you if you keep talking, meaning your retirement, pay your insurance, you never even existed.

There's so many things that they will do.

They will go on any site that you posted to or a part of and intentionally destroy or over up any pictures or certain parts of what you said through audio.

And that's about it.

I've just got to cover yourself what.

You just told us.

That's a testament to why I try to warn people who have really good evidence and they think they're going to be able to prove the existence of these guys of sasquatch, of dog men.

That's why I tried to warn them.

You're never going to be able to beat the government.

They don't want this let out of the bag.

No matter what you do, you're never going to be able to beat them at that game.

So no protecting self.

You're not the or the average citizen that sees this and reports it or talks about it in the community.

Somehow the military gets involved, and generally they come in with uh military helicopters, whether it be the old style hugheyes with the right our arms sticking out the front of it, or the what I call the chin hooks, the big helicopters that carry the soldiers equipment.

They will come in and into an area that they think they pinpointed where these people are seeing these creatures add and they will hang around for two or three days and then disappear.

And then if there's any questions asked, it was a training exercise.

So the public has led to believe it's training exercises.

Yeah, it seems like that's a story every time.

Funny how that works.

If you came upon the scene of a cryptid related incident and Bruce, would you be the one tasked with calling in the FEDS or would someone else into that?

No, I would be the one tasked for that.

I would be what we call the supervisor or the ranking officer, and so I would be tasked with calling in to the military, and then the military then would whatever division that goes to it.

Sometimes will surprise as you one encounter that I had wound up being that US Coast Guard Commodore contacted me and then come to see me, which is the US Coast Guard.

Commodore is a four star admir and we'll sit down and review your camera footage and what you've seen and stuff, and then he'll slide you to PaperWorks to take your evidence.

You sign off on it and slide it back to him, and that's the end of it.

If that's not calling in the brass, I don't know what is right.

It's it's according to what you see, is what type of a ranking military operation and or personnel that you get.

It can be handled from the ground.

That will handle it from the ground.

But most of the time, a really good sighting that's uh, that's caught on video or dash can we'd like to call it has a dispatcher and you talking, it's all audio video.

They'll retrieve that.

That will generally bring in the military.

Telephone calls will generally bring in the federal government.

They'll come in and tell you their FBI, but you're clearly not FBI.

Uh.

They'll be wearing the Eagle Star badge.

It could be any division of the Department depends or the Department of Justice.

Not people you want to have to deal with if you don't.

Right right, right, Generally they're pretty nice to you.

I mean it's not they don't They don't come out and threaten you and you know, put you under bright lights or anything.

It's just a code of conduct that you go by.

You know what you're allowed to talk about, what you're allowed not to talk about.

And then if another agency like a military or the FED step in, then you know they have can control of the incident.

And it's natural nobody talks about an ongoing investigation, so when it comes to these cryptis, it's always an ongoing investigation.

So that silences everybody.

Oh, I can only imagine the files they have on that investigation.

That'd be an awfully good read, wouldn't it.

Yeah, yeah, I mean to have it actually signed off on.

High ranking military individuals, high ranking FBI individuals, and plumb to the Secretary of the United States will be involved in a lot of these things, so they do keep a file.

Your presidents know what's going on.

They're one of the first to be briefed in the what they call the cabinet room where their cabinet members.

Those things are brought up and then sound off what the generals are the Secretary of State of whoever recommends them signed off on that, and then I'll just like I said, it goes to its own place.

Every situation is a little bit different than the next, so you never know what you get uh.

Here in Tennessee, a lot of this is controlled by the US Army Corps engineers.

So mostly what you get here, if it's not federal agents will be the US Coast Guard, even though we don't have any oceans here.

Make sure do you have this worked out?

Don't they?

Oh?

Yeah, it's all like I said, it does with the situation and what the apartment gets it.

And then then you have your your SAP apartments, which is uh is intelligence.

Uh.

Then you have your cleansestine ops and special departments that handle different situations.

That's specializing on those things.

So they have the best equipment, the state of the art equipment to evaluate.

A lot of this ownseen tested.

Do their samples.

I've had the privilege to be in on a couple of them in the work and got to see how they take their hair samples stuff like that, and they prefer the hair samples over the blood samples and stuff.

It's a in the ncice type of investigation, but more thoroughly with better equipment.

Like I said, they really do have this all worked out, Bruce.

After going from not knowing the cryptids exist to one day finding a dog man pop, how can you have any kind of normalcy in your life after that?

It doesn't.

I mean, you have to keep an open mind.

You're clearly not going to see these things like sitting on your couch if you get out.

And I was fortunate enough to work jobs that exposed me to a lot of this and was fortunate enough to keep an open mind and do detective work.

And my detective work was a little bit different than a lot of them.

And what I mean by that is my detective work was to prove your innocence.

When I could not no longer prove your innocence, I had to turn you over to the DA and from there it was the judge and the jerry decided your fate.

And a lot of times, you know, these officers and detectives and stuff.

Now the military you're guilty and they go from there.

But I had a little bit different perspective on detective work in the same and I use that in the field quite a bit.

I don't go in to hunt a dog man.

I go in looking for tracks and stuff, and more times than not you come up empty handed.

And then but you do have those moments that you can get quite a bit of information and thirty seconds to two hours, it's just according for where they want to stalk you.

If they decide to stock you, they will follow you home.

Then again it gets you start questioning whether it's a dog man or a whooper or are they both the same?

And you've got these creatures out here that no one can explain and a lot of people just won't talk about it, which is normal.

They can only wrap around their minds around so much where they think they're going crazy.

So it's just like I said, detective work pay attention to a lot of stuff that other people don't pay attention to.

Act stupid it sometimes when you're actually smarter than what you're dealing with, you capture a lot of a lot of things in that aspect.

That's funny.

Yeah, you know, it's just like uh uh Scotland Yard.

You know, when you deal with Scotland Yard, you know that they will come in and their best detectives act like they ain't got enough sense to pour glass of water.

But that's part of the game, is to get people to talk and stuff and then and try to act smarter when and you're thinking you're out smarter them, but you're not.

In the same way with the detective work.

You know, there's things we can say and do there, and we can act like you know, we ain't got to clue what's going on, but we know everything.

There is an art to it.

It sounds like there really is.

If you've had a dog Mean encounter that you'd like to speak with me about, whether in private or on the show, please go to Dogmanencounters dot com and submit a report.

All right, Bruce, please tell us about your encounters now, give us ever less detail that comes to mind.

I know you would probably prefer to start with the most recent one and work backwards in time.

If you prefer to do it that way, that's fine.

I normally prefer for the guests to start at the beginning and work forward in time.

But whichever way you're going to be most.

Comfortable, we'll start with the beginning and just work forward.

Then we'll start with One of my first encounters was deer honey, and I'll saying what I thought was a war, which there weren't any whoops in that part of the state.

And as it got closer, it had attributes about it that something wasn't right.

Daytime.

It had red eyes, was definitely not right looking through a scope at it had extremely large feet.

The feet on this particular one, this particular one was black jet black, and when it did spot me and open his mouth to growl at me, it had a black inside mouth, exceptionally long canine teeth.

It come on down to where I was in a tree stand, within twenty yards of me in the tree stand, and I was using it at that particular time.

I was something with a two forty three high part ripple, and I just didn't feel comfortable taking the shop because as everything about this creature wasn't right, and growing up you hear about hants and stuff like that, and that's the first thing that comes to my mind, and I didn't know about dog men at that time.

To me, it was just a supernatural creature.

It had exceptionally long legs and huge feet.

My first one there, I had a after the counter with it and it had left, took off running and left and it run like a horse.

A gallop.

It wasn't a full speed run.

It was more of a gallop.

And when I come out of the tree stand after a couple hours to make sure everything was all clear and back my way out of the woods, when I got down to the bottom of a tree stand and come back around it, what I hadn't realized it had circled my tree stand and it stepped in some mud.

And I had a paper plate in my backpack that I had that I was pouring, actually pouring beanie sausage out on it with the pork and beans with cut up wings in it, called beanie wings.

And I had that plate and that's what I used to measure that print with, and that that standard size paper plate.

The footprint was almost exact size, the plate, just being maybe a quarter inch bigger all the way around the path of this thing at its foot.

After that, my next encounter was probably i'm going to say another year and a half, maybe two years later.

It involved one that I had been gen saying hunting and I had run upon in the woods.

Was standing upon the rock bluff looking down on me, and it was a black one with a buckskin one side of it had a buckskin color to its hair.

It also come off the rock with it had red eyes.

It circled me with its head low, and I own all fours now, and when I look through at it, before I could get to a spot, I hid behind a tree where I could get spot to get a good look on it.

It had a gold amber looking color to its eyes.

Now, this was a big animal.

We're not talking about a hundred or two hundred pound dog.

We're talking about five six seven hundred pound animal that was just exceptionally long hair.

It had ears as long as a cow's ears.

What they stood straight up in there on top of his head.

It knew I was there and I had hidden, And at that time all I had was a small caliber pistol on me, and it was more for snakes and it was anything else.

It was a twenty two automatic twenty two eleven shot ten in the clipper in the one barrel that was chambered.

I reached and got it out and held it in my hand, But at that time I hadn't I note I was either dealing with a dog man or a werewhoop.

And gradually picked up information from people talking and stuff that was calling them dog men.

It looked more like a wear whoop.

It had an upper body that was built like a man's muscular but the back end of it was thin and narrow, more like a dog's.

It had a I would say about six to eight foot tail on it.

It started circling me, going at a good distance from me without coming up on me.

Encircling me, which is a prime example of what most predators do is circle their prey.

So I eased out the woods with it.

Still at that time it was flanking me, and I got across a pence into a haypild that the hay pild had been freshly cut.

It was a pall cut, so the hay probably the grass where it was cut probably wasn't or three or four inches tall after the ay was cut off of it.

And I get in the center of this hell haypild because I want to see all the way around if this thing comes out.

So I get two thirds across the I can see my car at the other end, which was probably a football, and I had built long to my car and I made it eventually made it to my car because I was constantly looking around walking a slow pace.

When I get to my car, And actually I never locked my vehicle.

When I leave the keys hitting the car gently under the I keep a towel across the seat.

I generally slide the under that towel or put them on the floor mat.

Well, that particular day, i'd slid it under the towel in the driver's seed bucket seat.

So I get in the car and I'm heavy breathing because I'm on It's not that I'm scared.

I'm just on really high alert.

So go to start the car up, and I feel something hit the car, and it's my car on the driver's side, pushed down.

And when I look up, there's this massive creature standing up.

He's got one massive pall on the driver's side of my windshield and he's got the other one on the driver's side of my window door, and he's pushing down on the car and it cracks my windshield and I just sat down on the horn.

I'm putting it in reverse, and I go in reverse.

I get turned around and this thing is still.

It has jumped on top of the very top of my car.

So when I come out of the Haybild and hit the main road, I was able to sling it off.

That one followed me home, and I didn't know it was followed me, but it followed me home.

And in that night we had a yard dog, or I had a yard dog.

He was a park Mountain ker who wasn't full blooded, and he had a certain bark.

When he seen somebody coming up in my driveway, he had a certain bark.

If somebody was walking around the house, he had a different bark.

And if it was barming's outside, possums, coons and stuff like that, foxes, he had a certain bark for that, which anybody that has dogs can tell you that they hear their dog outside barking a certain way, they know it's somebody here or somebody coming up the driveway in a vehicle.

Well, this dog come to the back porch and he was really cutting the shine.

So that told me somebody was out there, and I just would I kept a shotgun in the living room where I was at watching TV.

Kept a shotgun in behind the couch stands up in the corner.

It was when he gage shot and back, single shot, and I walked to the back door, leapt the porchlight on, and the dog, which never has done this before, run when I when I opened the back door and then pushed the screen door open.

Uh, he run between my legs into the house whimpering.

So I shut the door back and went and got a bigger handheld light because the porchlight wasn't wasn't giving me a good enough view, and shined it out there and I didn't see anything.

And so I went back in the living room, got the dog and put him out in the front door.

From my front door of my house, come into my living room and I just walked him out there on the porch and turned him loose, and in just a few minutes he went to screaming like something was attacking.

Well, then, this dog is not weak by any nature.

He's a smaller type mountain curve, but he is stout.

He would tackle about anything he wanted to.

He started screaming like something was attacking him.

So that I go back out with the gun the flashlight, and I see this thing that's about seven and seven and a half foot tall and the glowing red eyes.

Put the flashlight on him to see the glowing red eyes, and the dog is terrified.

He runs in behind me, just about trips me and knocks me off balance a little bit.

I didn't fall and I just shot up in the air and this thing took off, So everything was good.

I come back in the house.

The dog was shook.

He laid against the front door.

He wouldn't move from the front door.

Well.

An hour or two later, I was checking quite a bit and I left the porch lights on running back, and it was a probably an hour and a half, maybe it could have been two hours by then.

It was getting by twelve twelve thirty at night.

So he lets out another just tremendous bark.

Well, here comes a high, really high pitch that sounded like a coyote, but much higher and deeper.

So here I go back out and don't see anything.

The dog runs right back in the house.

And he's not a house dog.

He doesn't run in the house.

It's not like him.

You couldn't keep him in the house if he wanted to.

So he again acting strange.

At this time he was going around in each one of my rooms and coming out of each room with a low growl.

And then I really last, whatever it was was circling the house, and he could tell and he would follow from inside of the house.

So I knew which side of the house was on.

So when he went into my bedroom winder, he backed up slowly and started a low growl but a whimper at the same time, and he would sit down and he was just staring, and when it would move.

I had two windows of my bedroom.

One was on one wall facing north and the other one was on another wall facing east.

He eased around and he would follow it to the next window, and there was no way for me to get out the door, to get around that window without exposing myself.

And so what I knew what I was dealing with then was a dog man.

And I went out the back door.

And one thing you don't want to do is leapt fear over take, because you make bad decisions.

And I stepped around the corner, flipped the light on him, and sure enough that's where he was.

He was standing there, and he took off, and this time instead of running on the oars, he took off running two legs.

But he had that upper human like muscle structure to him, and I shot at him, and I'm sure I hit him.

I didn't hear anything else.

The rest of that night, I put the dog back out, this time in the backyard, let him out the back door, and he stayed pretty much calm, and then daylight come.

Then that's six thirty seven o'clock in the morning.

I went out with a cup of coffee.

When I was sitting in a portion of what we call a gladder rocker was drinking my coffee and across my garden spot as a big, massive set of woods as it goes for about five miles, and I could hear something down dur in the woods.

And then before I got my cup of coffee done, I heard what sounded like coyotes again, which was unusual for them to be out howling during the broad daylight.

So I walked over and down in there, and I caught a glimpse of this thing again, probably pitches sixty yards to these trees.

It was a big pauper thicket.

The paupers were probably two foot thick, good sized trees.

This time, I went back to the house and I got a high powered rifle again.

It was a two forty three, and I went down there to the edge of the woods and got right inside the woods where the sun wasn't hiding me.

I stayed in a shady spot where I could canoutlatch myself in and he exposed himself again.

And this time, instead of me deciding to shoot right at him, I would shoot around him and I would shoot.

He would move a few yards out.

I would ease down to keep moving towards him until I had shot.

I had bought just had bought a fresh box of shells, and I had stuck them in my back pocket, and my gun held three rounds two forty three held three rounds each time, so I would reload, move, move afore a few more yards until I eventually pushed him out of the area and never had any more problems after that.

But I learned when I had my encounters not to drive straight home.

I don't know whether whether he was running behind my car or smelt the car and was able to track a car on the road to the house without being seen, but it was the same one that I had seen.

It had cracked my windshield that it bothered me home.

My next one was right outside of standing Stone State Park in Alberdin County, Tennessee, on the Clay County side, on private land that wasn't in the park.

I was in there with some guys coon hunting and we heard coyotes.

We thought was coyotes, but we had this one particular one that had an extremely deep voice.

The dogs come back and passed us up and we were more in the rest he did at that time.

We'll know what's shoot.

These coyotes help the farmers loper farmers out.

One of the guys that was with us was actually on his farm.

So we're up in there and we get these red eyes, which you know for coyotes and stuff, you'll get those red eyes.

Predators have red eyes, but these were taller up These were six and seven eight, but off the ground.

So we knew we want to doing with coyotes.

And the guys when we had never experienced seeing any creatures like that, they had been in the woods and heard these sounds and didn't have any explanation for him, but they never actually got to see one.

And so this particular one crossed the creek branch in front of us, and we had coon lights.

It's a lot that hangs on your head with the battery pack hooks to your waist and it's on the long cord that goes up the back of your neck under your shirt.

So they're good bright whits.

So we got a clear picture of him as he crossed.

We've got of you.

And when he crossed this creek branch, he was standing on two legs, but he wasn't the only one.

We had more to the left of us on the hill more to the right.

So three of us were backed up to each other's backs to make sure that we weren't surprised and jumped, and then I explained to him.

Then I said, don't shoot unless you absolutely have to.

Let's try to Let's try to get out of here.

And of course they had no problem with that.

They were scared pretty bad.

And one of the guys there is his farm.

He had coon hunted there for forty something years and heard things but never seen anything, and that was his first time seeing it, so he accused me of Later on, after we got back and everybody calmed down, and I was telling him the store that it was a dog man, He's like, well, how would you know that?

And I'm talking about something my counters and he said, well, those things are attracted to you, because you must have brought this thing in here.

And you know, I was like, well, no, I don't think they're attracted to me.

I just think that instead of tucking tail and running, I like to see what I'm dealing with.

But anyway, I got ahead of myself on that.

This thing attract us back almost to his house, probably a quarter of a mile from his house, and he got real nervous and just started shooting.

Every time we'd shine a lot and see an eye shine, he just start shooting.

And then at one time in the cedar tree, up in the cedar tree, way up.

I'm talking fifteen to eighteen feet in a cedar tree.

He's seen, he sets eyes.

He started just shooting into the cedar tree.

And this particular dog man he climbed the cedar tree.

Well, when he jumped out of a cedar tree, we got a clear view.

And when he hit the ground, he run, but he runs back to the left of us, behind us.

Now we've got this dog man between us and his barn, and his house sits a couple hundred yards.

Father passed the barn.

I said, now we've got trouble.

We've got to pass this barn in a direction he went just to get to the house.

And we're calling the dogs.

We don't know where they went.

They went silent.

We're calling them and we're easther way.

We get back to the barn and we realize that it's in the barn, So we're setting there a western.

What do y'all want to do?

You know, do you want to enter the bar and see if we can take this thing out?

And you know, if I told the guy there that they're on the property, I said, it's your call.

I mean, you want to let it go.

Hopefully we'll go back in the woods and we'll leave it alone, or we'll we'll take it out.

He said, I'm not, I'm not.

I don't think we need to go in the bar.

I don't think we need to take that risk.

And he said, I don't have any livestocker in there, it's just hey.

And he said, I've got a tractor in there, in an old truck, and he said, we just I just don't believe we all the food with it.

We get back to the house and the dogs are at the house.

We thought we lost the dogs, but they beat us back to the house.

And from that one I went into uh left there and I actually had a dream about it that night, and his help probably helped me more than anything.

I dreamed about it to clear a lot of things up because things happened so quick, and sometimes we tend to see things that we're not actually seen, so we have to slow down and try to figure out what we did see.

So I went back and went back in there two days later by myself and was able to find the tracks around the creek where he had run across the creek and again come into the same situation.

This one was a little bit bigger than the normal.

It had a print.

I was wearing a ten and a half boot.

It had a pad print of at least ten inches long six inches wide.

It did show the claw marks.

You could clearly see the the claws were in the money, and then I was pretty much satisfied that's what it was.

The following year, I get another call from this guy and his neighbor had seen something right at the boundary markers with the Standing Stone State Park, and he said, you really need to talk to him, and we would love to talk to you.

He needs somebody to talk to like you.

So I went up and talked to him, and his nerves were shot.

He was fearful of going out of his house.

I couldn't believe what he's seen, but at the same time, he knew what he seen, so he described it to me and it wounded up being a dog man.

He in his thoughts, it was aware whoop.

And so I was able to talk to him for three or four hours there, and I asked him I would be I would have been all right, I come back at dark and he said, yeah, you know, And I said, you know what you experienced.

And he was out checking on his cattle and seeing this thing and it it bluff charged him.

But he thought by his tractor running and him getting away, he got away from the tractor, but he didn't.

We just bluff charged him.

And that's what I explained to him, a lot quicker than the same.

So I went back that night and took a Kyo puppy call, using them again a Johnny Walker game caller.

I took it out and called and we got some kyoes to answers and distance off and three different groups.

But then we had this one.

Kim kept coming in closer and closer but had a deep, deep scream to it.

Sounded just like a coyote, but just had a really deep voice to it, and without alarming him, I kept some of those coyotes, so we we'll get on the porch and sit on the porch with their guns, and we got enough moonlight, and right down at his barn, which was maybe one hundred yards from the house or so, he had a street light hanging on the front of his barn.

So that's putting up enough light in ap direction the roads on the other side of us, the other side of the house, so we weren't too worried about that.

And if the call was coming down the hall or behind the barn is location there.

And we sat on the porch a couple hours and nothing happened.

Well, his wife had cooked some chicken and she'd come out on the porch talking to us, and she wasn't quite sold on the idea, you know, y'all y'all done got up or and steered up some hants, you know, they called them hants, and I was like, yeah, we've got into something for sure, and uh uh.

We got through eating the bones, and he said, just throw them just we'll just pitch these bones out in the yard.

Just pitch them out of the yard, and we'll need to take them back in the house and just have to bring them out them in the halld lot.

So we just threw the bones out in the yard.

Well, me and him were sitting there talking.

When we were talking low because every few minutes I would cut this cayo pup scream.

Well, all of a sudden we heard a bone crunch and we got real quiet.

We heard a crunch and crunching.

We cut the light on, and there's this big wolf standing on his back legs eating these chicken bones.

And I mean, he's tearing them up.

And so I reached down and I cut the collar off.

When I cut the collar off, he looked straight at us.

And then I cut the light on.

I cut the flash light on and I had on and again it was a dog man.

It took off on all fours.

But at the corner of his yard, next to the driveway was a big maple tree.

He went up that maple tree just like it wouldn't there, went straight up in the top of a big, massive tree.

It takes two men, maybe three men to reach around the base of it.

So got in.

We got We got down there next to it, and we shine up and we was looking at him.

Okay, we're gonna have to get him away from the house, and we're going to have to either shoot him or shoot around him and see if we can get him out.

And I wasn't scared as much as I didn't want to be on the line if he jumped out.

But he did jump on top of one of us, and so we got back a little piece and we started using a twenty eight shotgun with a low brass number eight shot, which is bird shot, and started shooting into the top of a tree and he come out.

When he come out, he hit the road.

He come down with him fifteen feet of the ground and made a leap and he hit the road and he would run past his mailbox and got past his mailbox.

He come up on two legs and was running down this driveway on two legs.

So looked back again.

Like I said, again, we had really bright last last we watched him and he cut and went into the woods.

And the guy said, well, do you think you think you'll come back?

I mean, we've shot him, you know, he's full of bird shot.

And I was like, well, I don't know.

So I stayed with him Mr till daylight and nothing else happened.

And he never had any other experiences there other than he could hear the calls off in the distance, but at this time he knew enough now to knew what the difference between the coyote and the dog man call.

And then this passed well.

The last month, I was in the woods doing a little detective work.

I'd found what I thought was a deer trail, but it was exceptionally wide, probably three foot wide, and it was worn down, just dirt, no leaves, no twigs, nothing in it.

So I was walking it around and I was looking for actually slash squashed footprints.

And I had walked around a point of this hill, and it's a long ways down from the top to the bottom, and I had went off of a point to the bottom and was working my way up on this big, wide trail, and I seen something coming down a great vine, and the grape vine was up in a tall tree.

I believe it was a white oak, good white oakre red oak, which is which was unusual.

You don't very seldom see grape vines growing at the oaks.

And when I got around close enough to it, I could see this thing and it wasn't very big, fifteen or twenty pounds coming down head first down this bne and I walked up closer to it with than twenty feet and realized it was a pup.

It was a dog pup.

It was jet black, and I walk on up to being careful because being out in the middle of nowhere like that is definitely wild.

And it looks up at me and it's not aggressive whatsoever.

And I had a pair of gloves in my pocket, and I pulled my glove out.

I didn't put it on.

I just used it to stick out in front of my hand, and it didn't buy it a growl or do anything.

So I reached and gently picked it up off a grapevine.

When it got down to about five feet, I just reached up and got it and set it down on the ground.

And it had a little short tail sticking out maybe three inches, but it was bloody on the end, like it had been cut off or betting on offer.

It'd got into an accident or something and lost its tail.

It didn't have hair on it, it was just a fur ball.

It had a very long pointed ears on top of its head.

It had a short snout.

The hair was covering somewhat of its eyes, and so I opened it.

I grabbed its top flip and pulled its toplip up and it had a very large canee to be a young pup.

And so I pulled down its lower lip and it's had it's about the same length canine on the lower lip.

But when a rail raised the upper lip again to look at it, I noticed a pocket there.

And I've reached to the other side and done the same thing and noticed the pocket.

When it shut its mouth, its two lower canines won't fit perfectly into these pockets.

And when it came when the mouth was completely closed, I noticed the top can irons come outside the mouth and laid against the outer gums, the outer skin there.

And so I pulled the hair back in front of its space, and it had clear eyes.

I never seen that.

It looked like I was looking into two glass marbles.

No pupil, no nothing.

There were just two clear glass eyes.

That's what it looked like to me.

And so I know there had to be a mother somewhere.

I didn't know exactly what I was dealing with.

This thing was clearly not a kyo pup, clearly not a woof up.

I didn't know what it was it.

It's had an extremely big beat.

But where the bend is is for us like where our elbow is the elbow on this creature went in moved on the black ground, the elbow off of touched the ground, so the print it would leave would look like a big turkey leg.

In other words, you'd have the pall up here and it's skinny down to like an elbow, and that was the whole print it would leave with its front with his front legs.

And again, like I said it, now, this wasn't very big.

He's fifteen pounds twenty pounds maybe, but just a big battle of bur So I went into set him back up on the bin there.

When I set him on the bne, he started going back up the ne real slow, and this time his claws his claws had retracted out of his feet and he was using his claws to go up the vine.

So I eased on back out and went around the hue and got back up to the top of the hill and went down on the logging road, and that was I was probably a mile away when I heard this scream and again it was a high pitched a call similar to the cayoes.

And then after several calls, it got deeper and deeper.

So I made my way back out into another holler and was going out a ridge and I sat down.

I was give out, and I sat down on a big rock.

And when I sat down on this rock, I noticed that I could see something down to the left of me that was big, black in color, and I thought I was hid, and so I just stayed perfectly still.

They come on around the hill below me, but as it just about got even to me, it stood up on two legs and looked right at me and let out just a terrible scream that it messed my breathing up.

It didn't scare me, it just messed my breathing like I was having an allergic reaction.

I felt like my throat was my throat was closing in, my eyes were burning.

And I got up off that rock and I went up the hill and I got behind it by then up the hill, meaning I was about halfway up the mountain, and I got behind this massive poplar tree and was peeping out behind it, and it was trying to locate me, and I was trying to breathe.

By then, I was breathing really really heavy.

If it got much closer to being able to hear me, So I stepped out from behind it and it let out another scream and it just I don't called zap you.

You just built a boat of electricity go through your body, just you just your muscles jumped and everything.

And so I decided then to go straight up the mountain mountain as straight as I could go to get to the pence rod.

Once I got to the pence row, I could get over that fence row back on to the logging road at the top of the mountain.

And that's what I did.

I made it up there, climbed the pence and got over.

And this is a wooman warm fence.

It's probably four foot tall with two strands of bob war on top of it, so made it right around five and a half feet tall.

So I get out the logging road after I crossed the pence in this logging road that people had drove ATV's offer vehicles on it, so it was pretty clear didn't have the saplings and stepped growing up in It's like the old logging road down the hill down the mountain.

Well, I get out there a pretty good piece and it comes up and it doesn't jump the pents, it doesn't do everything anything but step right over it, just like me, me, and you would step over a toy in the floor.

This was big.

So now I'm I'm wearing a pair of forestry farproof bdu pants and they have outside zippers, and they've got an inside zipper that's out of pocket, and find zip the outside zipper.

Reached in my pocket to the other zipper zip tip.

I pulled my gun.

I took my had my gun out and I fired one round in there.

Didn't didn't pay any attention to it.

So this time I cut to the right and went back into the woods, and I knew that there was an old barn used to be an old homestead.

So I made it to that homestead and I held up there.

And this time it was probably one or one thirty in the evening, a good clear sunny day, bright sun.

So I get into the old house and I had no doors on it.

The windows was long ago.

I get into the old house and I'm watching.

I don't see it.

I'm very good.

Thirty minutes, you don't see it, So I'm good to go.

Well, I come around the corner of the house when I went out the door.

When I come around the house and headed back towards where my vehicle was parked, which at that time was probably still I would liked another mile to the vehicle, could have been more.

It's just my heart was pounding at the same time too.

I get almost to where I think I can see the vehicle, and I hear something to the ride in it, and I look to the right of me and this thing is coming through a sapling thick at the briars, and it's way above the briars, and it's walking on two legs, and it's just staring me down.

And it's got keep in mind, the sun's out.

It's in the evening, but we got a bright sun out, and it's got red glowing eyes, just like lasers.

So I wouldn't look in its eyes.

And these these I mean, they were just captivating.

I was afraid it would like the old people say, don't look a snake in my eye charming, So I was afraid to look at my eyes.

But I caught that red glowing eyes and I kept going.

I kept going, and eventually I got to where I could see my vehicle, but it kept pace with me.

But it stayed just twenty yards right inside a briar thicket.

And of course it was making all kinds of commotion and stuff.

And right before I got to the car, it stepped out on this atv old logging trail that was regorarly used by ATVs.

It stepped out onto it, and it let out a roar, this time like a mountain wine, and made just to scream and showed me all its teeth.

I got in the car, windows were up locked, the doors started the car.

I wanted to put some distance in between it took them backed out.

I turned around, stayed come, don't want to get stuck, don't want to wreck.

Eased on out there and made it back out to the main road.

And from there, when I got onto the main road, which I called a gravel road, mostly red dirt.

We just had gravel on it.

And then when I got back out to a chipped road, instead of making a right and going back the direction of which I come in, I made a left and made my way across and I come out in Kentucky and drove across Third until I come up on a convenience store, went in and got me a cup of coffee, sat down there, and I was wearing camouflage clothing, and sat down there, and I drunk that coffee, went back out and got in the car.

I took the back ways and seventeen different roads to get back home to make sure I wasn't followed this time.

And that was, Like I said, that was a little over a month ago, so that was my last encounter.

Wow, Bruce, I've had some pretty intense encounters there most people after just having one of those experiences with all to pieces.

I don't know how you do it.

It's the detective side of me, and you know, fear will get you killed.

Now, I ain't going to say that there weren't times I weren't scared, but I couldn't show it.

Fear causes you to make bad mistakes.

And when you're dealing with animals and certain people, they sense that here.

When they sense that here, they take that opportunity to bounce, you know, to hurt you or come after you.

So you have to have to stand your ground and not show the feer.

They might be able to hear your heart something.

But at the same time, you want to stay who you want to talk from time, and you're not.

You're making it clear you're not hiding after you know your first when you first see them.

You want to hide and try to work your way out but still be able to see them.

But after they spot you and then they start stalking you, I call it, then it's time to show that you're not here and stay out and not hiding and talking and they're intrigued by that.

So that that's helped me on.

I believe in not getting directly attacked, other than the time at the car where I ended up with my windshield busted, my mirror busted.

Uh, it actually busted my mirror, the one that followed me home.

Uh.

That for people out here that run have these dog man encounters, they will follow you home.

I suggest you take an alternate raps to your house, that you even make a stop.

Go into a town or a small community's got a convenience store, make a stop, hanging around for thirty minutes or so, drank you a cup of coffee of cold rank whatever, and then you know, take different different routes back to your house.

The way that they have a better chance of them losing.

I think it's by sint, by losing your scent, scent of your vehicle and the scent of you.

That sounds like a really good way to handle it.

And I realized that all the years in law enforcement where you had to practice not showing any fear to perpetrators or anything like that, I know that that was a lot of practice, and it makes it easier for you to do that.

But in those encounters that you had, for you not to show fear, that still takes a lot of constitution.

That's awfully impressive.

The her on your arm and stuff will stand up.

But one of the key things that the survival of any kind, whether it's encounters or whether it's the elements itself, is to stay calm and don't show fear, because if you keep the fear out of your mind, you can think logically and how to get yourself out of a bad spot or even save yourself.

You predators, whether it be man or cryptids or whatever, can sense fears.

The bad guys can sense fear.

The good guys can sense fear.

I would know when my buddies were scared, you know, the color or color was changed, their voices were changed, they would stutter and stuff.

And I know people that I had with me on a couple of my encounters that we were in trouble, and you know, so I had to calmly talk to them.

But at the same time I'm talking out loud.

These cryptids will know, but I'm not scared because I'm keeping up a low, deep voice and saying it's slow enough that they I believe they understand when us.

I think they're smarter than us to start with.

Well, that makes two of us and still to do that.

You've got an awful out of sand.

You really do well.

I'll tell you what, Bruce, I've got a ton of questions to ask you about your encounters, but we're out of time.

Would you be willing to come back for a part too, so I could ask you.

All these questions.

Sure would be Oh good, that's really good.

Then well, if that's the case, I'll just schedule a recording with you so we can hear that part two next week.

Then thank you.

Yeah, that'll work a lot of work read I'm looking.

Forward to doing that.

Well.

Having said all that, thanks again so much for your time, and I'll catch you next weeks.