[SPEAKER_00]: Hey friends, welcome back to part of the mess.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host, Courtney Defeo, and I have a question for y'all.

[SPEAKER_00]: Have you ever heard your kids share their testimony?

[SPEAKER_00]: I haven't.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's funny to me.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was looking at a picture today someone sent me of Larsen sharing her testimony at 8th grade retreat.

[SPEAKER_00]: They asked a few juniors to come and I was like, I've never heard her testimony.

[SPEAKER_00]: Which I think is normal.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you open up and vulnerable to share about how God's worked in your life, maybe at a camp or, you know, in front of your friends, but not often at the dinner table.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I was thinking about that today.

[SPEAKER_00]: could I give her a safe space to say like, hey, but I asked the lady that was listening.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, was her testimony?

[SPEAKER_00]: My mom is crazy, but God is good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is that was that what she shared it?

[SPEAKER_00]: She said, no, she's talking about her dad's cancer journey.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, I don't know, just something to ponder about how do we make our dinner time conversations and tables safe enough to be like, hey, where have you really felt God speak to you and work?

[SPEAKER_00]: How did you know God was we all maybe something like that?

[SPEAKER_00]: So, [SPEAKER_00]: put that out there.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, we have a phenomenal guest.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love when I have another podcast around because there's like zero edits.

[SPEAKER_00]: This girl has done this.

[SPEAKER_00]: She understands that this is our lane, but it's Greta Eskridge.

[SPEAKER_00]: And she has the Greta Eskridge podcast, which is in the Christian parenting network and family.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I've heard so many great things about her and her book that is [SPEAKER_00]: It's time to talk to your kids about porn and I've actually had a couple of moms read out to me and say we are dealing with a porn situation or house for your terrified.

[SPEAKER_00]: We don't know what to do.

[SPEAKER_00]: And this is the episode for you, whether you're walking through it, whether you have a baby and little bitase.

[SPEAKER_00]: And just know that this is something all of our kids, all of our families will face at some level.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so it's really important to just think about how to talk to kids about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's not too late if you're like, Abteenagers, I wish I would have done this.

[SPEAKER_00]: But for those of you with Littles, I link to her book, but also a couple of other books.

[SPEAKER_00]: One is God made all of you.

[SPEAKER_00]: And this talks about good touch, bad touch.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then there's another book that's old, but it's awesome.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's called Good Pictures Bad Pictures and just talks about what they're supposed to be seeing and not seeing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And this can feel like a big scary topic.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you're going to love every minute of this.

[SPEAKER_00]: She talks about how can you respond when they come to you that they've seen something.

[SPEAKER_00]: We need to be calm and steady, but if we've reacted in anger and fear, that's normal.

[SPEAKER_00]: But we need to circle back and make sure that we are a safe place that they are not in trouble when they deal with something like this.

[SPEAKER_00]: and that they come to us a couple other interesting parts is she said she spoke at a group of teenagers and they came up to her and said we didn't even know porn was bad and that it's so common.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that is just some more fuel to say you got to have that conversation say this is not best for your eyes for your heart.

[SPEAKER_00]: relationship with God for a future marriage and talk to them about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And she gives a lot of language around how to do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing that's interesting when we get towards the end, she talks about one of the number one greatest dangers for teen boys is sex distortion.

[SPEAKER_00]: And what that means is someone asked them to send a picture and then they think it's a girl and then that person says, [SPEAKER_00]: I'm, you need to send me $500 or I'm going to release this photo to everyone and they get really, really trapped.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so this is another one of those conversations to go, I know this probably never happened to you, but if it does, here's how to handle it.

[SPEAKER_00]: So just big thanks to Greta and her husband and their testimony in their story for being able to put it out there so that other parents like us can benefit and learn from how to talk to our kids about porn.

[SPEAKER_00]: Enjoy Greta.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Greta, welcome to part of the best.

[SPEAKER_00]: How are you today?

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for having me on your show.

[SPEAKER_00]: I have heard about you for so long, and you've been on my list of people to have on.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm just so delighted we felt like it to do it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we are cousins.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, family members in the Christian parenting network, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, that's right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, we totally are.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's the name of your podcast, your name.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's the Greta Eskerge podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: Easy to find.

[SPEAKER_00]: Easy to make easy.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, we were talking before we got on that you never knew that you were going to be the porn lady.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that is true.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was not on my life plan, but we're in love.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's super important.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's one of those topics that I've gotten moms reach out to me to say, you know, my son.

[SPEAKER_00]: I've just caught my son or my daughter.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then it's really scary for parents.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so we're going to cover a lot of things really quickly today.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I want you to go connect with her because her book is phenomenal.

[SPEAKER_00]: And her podcast goes in a more depth than there's resources there.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so [SPEAKER_00]: Let's start there is the book is time to talk to your kids about porn that came out earlier this year.

[SPEAKER_00]: What led to that?

[SPEAKER_00]: How did you become the porn lady?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it actually came from a place of deeper.

[SPEAKER_01]: I try and remember the timeline, but it's been at least 15, 16 years.

[SPEAKER_01]: My husband came to me and confessed that he had a pornography addiction, which had resulted or helped result in an affair.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it rocked my world, obviously.

[SPEAKER_01]: And his world, our family, our kids were all really young, three kids under the age of five.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it was like, well, what do we do?

[SPEAKER_01]: And so we worked through restoration.

[SPEAKER_01]: many years of healing and recovery for Aaron.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was sort of pushed into, well, how can we help our kids?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And give them the tools that we didn't have.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because we really have no tools for navigating this thing to other of us.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: We grew up in a time where nobody talked about pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I was like, okay, well, let's see what we can do different.

[SPEAKER_01]: And through educating myself and then starting to talk to my friends and then starting to talk to other people, [SPEAKER_01]: the book was born because I recognized parents who were crying out for help just like we were.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember trying to think how to tell the story not to 30 one of the bus.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we stumbled upon a friend's dad's playboy magazine.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that was it.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like the access these days is really frightening.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I want to get to a place of reality today to go.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like it's everywhere and not to freak these parents out, but we can't have our head in the sand and I often talked about extremes here that like we could better head in the sand and just be like, I don't know what to do, and that's a really dangerous extreme and then we can shift the other way.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're freaking out all the time and we don't let them ever have a phone or leave the house or that kind of thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so today you're going to talk about a realistic blend of those things of like how can we protect our kids.

[SPEAKER_00]: but also be open to the fact that they're probably going to see something and what do we do then.

[SPEAKER_00]: So let's start there.

[SPEAKER_00]: When and how do we start talking about this?

[SPEAKER_00]: This is the age old question, but just not perfect, but give us a place to start.

[SPEAKER_01]: The number one question I get and everybody wants to know, well, I want us to preface the answer by seeing the average age of first time exposure to pornography for kids right now is between the ages of eight and eleven.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if we know that's our framework, the ideal is to talk to our kids before they are ever exposed to explicit content, because we want to give them a plan for how to respond.

[SPEAKER_01]: My goal is always, let's be proactive rather than reactive.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's not always the case like that we can't, we can't always make that happen, but in an ideal world, we're gonna be proactive rather than reactive.

[SPEAKER_01]: So ideally, we're gonna talk to our kids before the age of eight, before, [SPEAKER_01]: their chances of being exposed to explicit content, you know, skyrockets.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if it's okay, I'd love to give a sample of what that first conversation starts.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I was just about to say, I'm sure that's at the boat, but tell us exactly what to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so if you imagine your eight-year-old and you're talking to them and [SPEAKER_01]: And you're not sitting down to have a real formal conversation.

[SPEAKER_01]: This could be while you're stirring at brownies in the kitchen or throwing a baseball in the backyard, going for a drive, having donuts, something just real casual.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you say sweetheart, I need to tell you about something called pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I need you to know what it is because it's harmful for you and for your body and your brain and your heart.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's my job to keep you safe from things.

[SPEAKER_01]: that are harmful to you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so, pornography is pictures or movies of people who have no close-on and are showing all their privates.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we know that privates are worthy of respect and protection.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, we don't show other people ours and we don't look at others in pictures or movies or, you know, with each other.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if you ever see pictures or movies like that, here's what I want you to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: It could be on Mom's phone while you're looking for something to [SPEAKER_01]: I want you to just turn the phone over and come talk to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or maybe on a tablet while you're playing a game, I want you to turn the tablet over or turn it off and come talk to me or die.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or if someone shows you on their phone, it could be a friend, it could be somebody's big brother or sister, it could be a grown-up, and if they show you on their phone or their computer, I want you to say, in a really strong voice, I don't want to look at that, and then I want you to leave, come find me or another safe grown-up and say, I need help.

[SPEAKER_01]: We will help you love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's the first conversation.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's so good.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think we get frozen I'm that we're gonna say it wrong or you know, it is awkward, but I think you're calm You're not like you said making them we have to sit down and have this moment [SPEAKER_00]: And I think my kids, I remember what L.S.

[SPEAKER_00]: said, bump, can you tell me all the customers?

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, what?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, they wouldn't know about things before they're shocked with it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, they wouldn't be prepared.

[SPEAKER_00]: They don't know how to say that.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so before your book, we had good pictures, bad pictures.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was like a little, you know, quick book, give me the language really to say.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then there was another one that I cannot remember the name of, and I will find it.

[SPEAKER_00]: But it was more about good touch, bad touch.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, this is kind of parameters [SPEAKER_00]: touch your private parts and have you seen that song on TikTok that's like these are my private parts private parts Oh my word this teacher in Africa says this holds like nobody can touch them nobody can see them and I was like man That would have been a great song [SPEAKER_00]: to just laugh about, but also just be like, this is the deal, like it's funny, but it's true, like no one could touch your own private part.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I know some young mom is freaking out right now, but I think to me there were three big conversations that I always had for whatever reason I have girls, but Ron was like, you've got these, but just like, words in the bees, safety for their own body, and then pornography, and I'm so glad I did.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would, to this day, don't know, I'd be curious to ask my girls.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're like, no, we haven't seen anything, but I know they have, I know they have.

[SPEAKER_00]: But one important thing you said is come to me.

[SPEAKER_00]: So how can we make sure we are a safe place, and we're not making it, you know, making them have to hide it or hold it because they're afraid of our reaction.

[SPEAKER_00]: How can a reaction be okay?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, one of the best ways, and there's no, again, there's no guarantee, but we do our best, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the best ways is to create open communication with the kids.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why starting before they ever see anything before their filled with shame, [SPEAKER_01]: embarrassment or fear or discomfort for what they've seen.

[SPEAKER_01]: You've set the stage.

[SPEAKER_01]: You've established yourself as the expert, as a safe place and said, you can come to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: You won't be in trouble.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will be so glad that you came and told me this happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And [SPEAKER_01]: then to keep bringing the topic up and not just the topic of pornography like you're pounding it over their heads, but like a month later you like, hey, remember when we talked about that thing called pornography and I remember with one of my sons having that conversation and I'll do you remember when we talked about that thing called porn and he goes, corn?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, not corn and you know like he needed to be reminded because he had already forgotten.

[SPEAKER_01]: And taking it out of this box of like this is the super scary box of super scary things we never talk about and instead just making it like these are open conversations you read a book about you know staying safe protection of their body and part of that is also protection of their eyes and so.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a good time to remind them, like, oh, also we need to protect our eyes and what our eyes are seeing and protect our brain.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so just casually talking about the ways that they can honor and respect their own body.

[SPEAKER_01]: and other people's bodies, and not looking at pornography is one of the ways to do that, just like they keep their bodies safe from inappropriate touch, not being afraid to have these conversations with our kids every few months, reminding them of the truth that they're created in God's image, and where the of respect and protection, saying, [SPEAKER_01]: don't have to be afraid to talk to me and then modeling it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's right.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I remember I heard you on Monica Swanson's podcast and you were talking about like just even rehearsing your response, being like, you know, just like poker face.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like even if internal you look, oh, my gosh, like what are we done?

[SPEAKER_00]: What have we done as a mom?

[SPEAKER_00]: how do we, you know, it's just like saying calm because they certainly won't keep coming back when we're freaking out.

[SPEAKER_00]: So how do we talk to them about curiosity?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think a majority of this, I would imagine you may have a statistic is that it's found accidentally.

[SPEAKER_00]: So they stumble upon it, a friend sends them something at school.

[SPEAKER_00]: But what do you do with the warrior girl that's like, [SPEAKER_00]: I'm just actually curious, like, what is that word, or people are saying this, they did this with a boyfriend, they go looking for something that they're just curious.

[SPEAKER_00]: So how can we help them with that?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because it's like, I'm not going to go to my mom and say, what does this mean for a second base or whatever.

[SPEAKER_00]: or the kind of things they're, even though like a term about a private part or something.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well again, I always feel that the best thing is to establish yourself as an expert, especially for those young kids, and to really say like, if you have a question, if you're curious, like, call it out, like, put it out there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you may be curious about the things I just told you.

[SPEAKER_01]: You may be curious if you hear kids talking at school or somebody shows you something at baseball practice.

[SPEAKER_01]: If that's the case, tell me and I'll help you figure out the answer if something that is safe for you to know right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if you like acknowledge the fact that they could be curious, that's a big help because then that takes away some of the mistake and you're like, you know, hey, you can come ask me and I've told my kids over and over from the time they're a little, you can ask me anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do they always less when they were younger and in their [SPEAKER_01]: we can talk about just about anything and they're not afraid to ask me and sometimes I'm like, whoa, I can't believe we're having this conversation right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: It turns red, it's all fine.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm really glad because like when your daughter said tell me all the cuss words like to not freak out and be like, oh my gosh, you can't know that stuff right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just be like, well, why do you want to know and have you heard some?

[SPEAKER_01]: And let's talk about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I will tell you these are things you shouldn't say, but it's okay for me to tell you what they are.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you know that those aren't good words for you to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, at school or whatever.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just yeah, establishing that you are the one that they can come to for everything and reminding them of that over and over again.

[SPEAKER_01]: That goes a long way.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it takes years to cultivate that, but it's worth the effort.

[SPEAKER_00]: Do you think as I'm, I think I know your answer, but let me set you up.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think in our minds, we're like, okay, if I have a daughter, the mom talks to the brother of the boy talks to the son and that's not the case.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, some people in relationships are more comfortable talking about this.

[SPEAKER_00]: So is that your experience that you talk to both your sons and your daughters?

[SPEAKER_00]: It depends on the marriage or the personalities?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's a lot of nuance there, but I think that it's absolutely vital if possible for [SPEAKER_01]: moms and dads to talk to sons and daughters about pornography because we have this kind of old fashion idea that in the past pornography was a man's issue only and so the men talked to the sons and then that was it and it's like number one that's not the truth pornography in pexman and women it's a human issue so therefore we all need to address it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also, there could be a family for a variety of reasons where there is no dad to talk to the kids.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so does that mean the mom can't talk to the sons?

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely not.

[SPEAKER_00]: Love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also, I want my son to know pornography impacts women.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, they need to hear from the voice of a woman that it hurts women.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I want them to hear that from me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want my daughter to know from me and her dad that [SPEAKER_01]: And I am not okay with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just, that's great.

[SPEAKER_01]: If possible, we should all be talking about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if not, do the best you can with what you have.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: So let's talk before we move to teen years, because I think it's a little bit different than how you handle.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's stay in the little kiddo years.

[SPEAKER_00]: How can we practically, and there's a lot of resources out there, but can you give us some ways practically that we can help our kids out?

[SPEAKER_00]: Just say, like, hey, there's no 100% full proof way, and I think you mentioned, again, and another podcast that an email could be sent, you know, and you can't, you can't help that, but like, what are some ways that we could get on it today, and start helping to protect our kids and keep them from this?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, in your home, that's obviously one of the easiest places to protect your kids and you can install a router which helps lessen the explicit content coming into your home, the devices in your home.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they're one of my dear friends, Chris McKenna, Rens and Artization called Protection Eyes.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he has like a whole blog post about how to install a router in your home.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's a great level of protection in your home.

[SPEAKER_01]: OK, great.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then just establishing like safe tech rules, like, you know, if you [SPEAKER_01]: You don't just get on the computer or the iPad and Google anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like if you're, you know, seven, eight, nine years old, you say, hey, mom, I want to look this up and let mom or dad know that you're looking for something so that we can sit next to you and help you.

[SPEAKER_01]: do a safe search and then begin to teach them what that looks like so by the time they're in middle school or high school they can do it more safely on their own but you don't just hand them the keys and say drive right you know they're eight you sit next to them and help them learn how to do this safely.

[SPEAKER_01]: not playing video games with strangers.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's something a lot of parents don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I would say, like, let's establish that from, you know, little kid all the way through high school.

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: Being on a video game console, and it doesn't have to be connected to the internet.

[SPEAKER_01]: It could be connected to your TV, but any video game console that is allowing strangers to [SPEAKER_01]: to play games with your kids, you are allowing a potential predator to have access to your child.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they have headphones on, you don't even know what they're talking about.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have no idea that that person they're playing with if they're 12 or they're 35.

[SPEAKER_01]: So those are things that you can do in your own home to protect your kids and establish those kind of just using tech in a safe way when they're young, establishing again yourself as the expert saying, [SPEAKER_01]: I'm here to keep you safe here at different ways.

[SPEAKER_01]: We do that just using making tech Something that is not individual, but we're doing this as a family.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I have given this business idea to several people and I'm gonna now give it to you Greta and I need you to implement it, but we need to get squad team of fans that shows up at your house and we're like we are the tech support [SPEAKER_00]: Because I would get like one block of like a password.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh crap, I don't know my eye cloud thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then I would just forget about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so like part of me was like, I wish there was a person that would show up.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I would bring out every device, everything we have and we would go through all the things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because I don't even think we realize how awful the parenting controls are.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like the factory set is terrible.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like getting in there with a friend and so my suggestion to you of Greta doesn't start the geese squad for porn.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's to invite some friends over and say we are doing this tonight.

[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone bring your devices or I'll come to your house, you come to mind and we open it up and say, my gosh, click that and I'm going to go into Roblox and say, we only message friends or whatever the things are because the more barriers they have, the better the safer it is for them.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so any other thoughts on the parental controls, I think, and a lot of people don't know that they're set to be wide open from the start.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my gosh.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I had no idea when my oldest spot he bought himself an iPad when I think he was 17 and he's an artist and he's like, I need to use this for art and like, I got your 17 it's time we can we can say yes to this.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I was shocked that the factory settings of his iPad and it would be the same with any other device from Apple and probably from Android as well or whatever was set to explicit it was set to explicit how it came and so I had to figure out how to go in there and change [SPEAKER_01]: So that I could say, you know, gee, we're ready to see it, no, it was it, but it is tricky.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I would say that's why my book is not titled here's how to change the settings on all your devices to make it safe my book is titled it's time to talk to your kids about porn because the reality is like you said there's so much there's things that slips through the cracks.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can't tell you how many times parents say I did everything right, but my kid found an old phone hidden away in a drawer.

[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't even know it was connected anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't even know it was active, but they figured out how to use it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or someone shows your kid something.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we have to talk about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because things will slip through the cracks.

[SPEAKER_01]: We can't, we cannot control everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.

[SPEAKER_01]: We have to talk about it so that if they are exposed, when they are exposed, the prayer is that they'll come to us and say, this is what happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we can say, I'm so sorry.

[SPEAKER_01]: You must be hurting.

[SPEAKER_01]: You must be scared.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is uncomfortable.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is painful.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let us help you because when the things that the safety procedures we put in place, the safety settings fail for whatever reason, our kids need to be able to talk to us and we need to be able to talk to them.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you repeat that statement.

[SPEAKER_00]: So if you have a young kid come show you something or they say, I keep saying this or something, what is that baseline conversation?

[SPEAKER_00]: I love that you said let us help you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is that the the first one or the past?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I'm I'm so glad you came and told us what happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: You must be confused or scared or sad or hurting.

[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: We want to help you.

[SPEAKER_01]: If that can be your response, one of compassion and grace, not anger, not judgment, not fear, but a calm, Eddie presence that says, we help you.

[SPEAKER_01]: That can change everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: And as someone who has failed in that area, I can say it's also never too late to repair.

[SPEAKER_01]: I messed up on that response.

[SPEAKER_01]: Can I help you now?

[SPEAKER_01]: I shouldn't have responded that way.

[SPEAKER_01]: Will you forgive me and can I help you now?

[SPEAKER_01]: Is never too late to make a group hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: That establishing again, yourself as a person, who will respond with compassion and with help.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is a big deal for a child in the scenario.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, let's move on to teens.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you can have some different conversations with teens that you can't have with the five-year-old in.

[SPEAKER_00]: And meaning like, really talk about the reality of what this does.

[SPEAKER_00]: And really talk about the illegal nature of sending pornographic photos if someone asks you for one or you send one.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there is ramifications.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, that is not a legal thing to do.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, did you, again, you had many conversations, but one of the ones that I had with my girls, I had a pastor friend in Atlanta, and he was a pastor for young married couples, and he said, I cannot believe the number of young married couples that are struggling in their sex life because they've seen so much porn.

[SPEAKER_00]: They can't even get excited to be with their brand new wife, and they're 20 years old and their bodies are perfect.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, why do you care 50?

[SPEAKER_00]: It was like, what the world, you're 20.

[SPEAKER_00]: You got everything going for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's all working right and you're already struggling.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I talked to my girls about that and said, like that is a reason to not do it because of your future relationship of what's your spouse.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so what are those kind of conversations that we can have with our teens just to just be real with them about, and you know, firsthand the effects that add on your marriage?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, first of all, I want to say kudos to you for having that conversation because I do not think that's a common conversation that a lot of parents have.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, usually the conversation with teens is, you know, don't do it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, it's not good for you.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, maybe we say don't send sex, you know, no sex team don't said nudes.

[SPEAKER_01]: That could be, you know, [SPEAKER_01]: help porn impacts their future relationships and their marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like that's a big deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that that is crucial because it's going into the why and our teams need to know why.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because they're growing up in a culture that says porn is fine.

[SPEAKER_01]: Porn is normal.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but it is funny.

[SPEAKER_01]: Porn everyone uses it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we have to be the ones that are not just saying don't use it, it's bad, but they need to know why.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I will say I gave a talk to about, I don't know, a few hundred teenagers and they were not raised in the church.

[SPEAKER_01]: So they didn't have like that messaging coming to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when I talked to them about the dangers of pornography in the ways that it can impact them and others, their response was, we didn't even know porn was bad for us.

[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't have to use it because everyone uses it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so as parents, we need to know that's the messaging our teens are getting.

[SPEAKER_01]: We need to tell them the truth, like pornography hurts them and hurts others.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's connected to things like sex trafficking.

[SPEAKER_01]: it's connected to things like child pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: It can impact their marriage like their bodies.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like if you train your brain to only be stimulated by pornography, then when you're with your real-life partner, your husband or your wife, you can't actually, um, intimate relationship because unless your body is stimulated, it's right.

[SPEAKER_01]: as you're brain in your body.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like if they don't know those truths, then we are failing them because we're not telling them the facts about what pornography does and how it impacts people.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's our job as parents to do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Layer on that biblical framework.

[SPEAKER_00]: How do you [SPEAKER_00]: phrase that in a way I know this may not even be accurate, but I remember saying with my kids one time it like, is that pleasing to God and I don't know that goes back to like the birds and the bees is like, God's design is dot dot dot dot.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so what is some of the language reverses that you use with your kids to kind of set up just because they're the levers that this is going to have a different framework or filter for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well yeah, you use the term God's design and if we really believe that God's design and God's plan is best that sex is supposed to be between a man and a woman and it's supposed to be in the context of marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: that when you take that out and you, you know, you remove one of the people and you're just engaging in sexual behavior with a screen and an image on a screen that that changes everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, actually does hijack God's design.

[SPEAKER_01]: and it impacts the brain and so that the brain cannot function and then the body can't function the way God designed it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it makes sex into a selfish thing and it's all about yourself and it's actually hurting other people because that person on the screen is a real person and you're engaging in hurting them even though you don't realize that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so when we take it [SPEAKER_01]: his best plan to give us the best thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: That helps it become more than just porn as bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not the best, and God's plan is best.

[SPEAKER_01]: And let me tell you why his plan is best and why porn wrecks that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's helpful because it's less about this hammer coming down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Don't do this in everybody else, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, let me tell you why it could be so much better than what the world was off of.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: I want to wreck it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: One more question about teens.

[SPEAKER_00]: What are some other things we don't think about that we Nate may need like for instance books you brought at books before with girls.

[SPEAKER_00]: So talk to us about some of those other things we need to be thinking about and educating them even on Pinterest.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like there's things that you're interested in.

[SPEAKER_00]: Pinterest is like oh I'm getting a cupcake recipe and that is not a cupcake recipe.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Pinterest is actually full of porn.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I know in myself included, I'm pretty, pretty, I walk a pretty hard line about giving kids social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think social media should be delayed as long as possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: But for many of us, like we don't realize like Pinterest is a kind of social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: And once you start looking at one thing, the algorithms like, oh, let me feed this stuff to you.

[SPEAKER_01]: and it can be explicit content.

[SPEAKER_01]: So yes, be careful of any kind of social media that your kid is on even if you think it is in social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: But two other really important ones I would mention is one for girls.

[SPEAKER_01]: For many girls, the most common way they're introduced to pornography is through books and erotic literature, which is really pornography on a page.

[SPEAKER_01]: is absolutely rampant in young adult literature for girls.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is not an accident.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is by design.

[SPEAKER_01]: The pornography industry was like, wait, we're missing out on this huge audience, this huge money-making opportunity.

[SPEAKER_01]: We need to create porn for girls.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so it starts with a book.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're reading these books that are they're highly, highly sexual.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm very graphic.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then [SPEAKER_01]: that proceeds to other things because you're building an appetite.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you need to be aware of what your daughters specifically are reading and in books and also online because there are so many things online that are like, you know, you're reading this story and whoa, wow, this is so much more than they bargained for but if we haven't prepared them for that then how are they going to respond they're curious they're going to keep reading.

[SPEAKER_01]: So be aware of what your girls are reading and then [SPEAKER_01]: happening right now is sixth portion because you've got these 14 year old boys who their prefrontal cortex is not developed and they're talking to some girl and TikTok or snapchat or whatever.

[SPEAKER_01]: other there are many social media accounts out there they're talking to this who they think is a cute 15-year-old girl who's complimenting them and says you know send me a picture and they're like okay because I'm dumb and I'm 14 and she sounds pretty and they do it and then that person reveals themselves to be an adult.

[SPEAKER_01]: In some other countries, as if you don't send me $500 right now, I will share this picture with everyone and everyone that you've done and then that boy is terrified and doesn't know what to do because he doesn't have $500 but he doesn't want to tell his parents because they're going to find out what he did and he's just absolutely just stuck and he feels like I don't know how to handle this situation and right now the FBI says that this issue of sex distortion amongst young teenage boys, [SPEAKER_01]: is one of the number one, if not the number one greatest danger that that age group is facing that demographic.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so we have to talk to our sons and our daughters and say if anyone asks you for a picture, don't do it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if you do, come tell me right away, I want to help you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I love you.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want to keep you safe.

[SPEAKER_01]: We have to tell the police.

[SPEAKER_01]: They need to have a plan to respond.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.

[SPEAKER_00]: It makes me so mad because I'm like, it's not like they're even looking for it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's just like they are the target and they're you're getting saviour and saviour with it and it's really really frustrating.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, give us some hope.

[SPEAKER_00]: So hope from your story.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hope from people that have read your book to say like, okay, my husband went through this.

[SPEAKER_00]: I went through this.

[SPEAKER_00]: I am struggling.

[SPEAKER_00]: My child is told me they're struggling.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is there redemption or hope on the other side of a struggle like this?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of my favorite quotes is from a lady named Betty Temboom.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was arrested and put in a Nazi concentration camp for hiding Jews in World War II.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was a Christian.

[SPEAKER_01]: Her whole family was arrested.

[SPEAKER_01]: And while in that concentration camp, one of the things she said is there is no pit so deep.

[SPEAKER_01]: That God's love is not deeper still and I say yes even the pit of pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: There is no pit so deep that God's love is not deeper still So if pornography has been a problem in your own life if you've been hurt by it if you're using it right now and it you're struggling or if your child has used pornography has been exposed [SPEAKER_01]: porn does not have to be the end of anyone's story.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have to live in fear of it happening to our kid and we're terrified and we like, you know, hide them in, you know, the closet because we're like, we can't let you out in the real world.

[SPEAKER_01]: But also we don't have to say, well, they've been exposed or I was exposed or I've used it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the story's over.

[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the most [SPEAKER_01]: to show that this is true porn.

[SPEAKER_01]: Does I have to be the end of anyone's story?

[SPEAKER_01]: Is that the brain is something called neuroplastic, which means it can change and heal.

[SPEAKER_01]: God designed our brains to heal.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if there have been new pathways created by using pornography over and over again, that when that stops and new habits are created, [SPEAKER_01]: and the person who's used porn or scene porn creates new habits to stop using the pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: The brain begins to heal and those pathways close up new pathways are for Romans.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say the verse wrong.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to have to go back to the show notes that it's in the book of Romans.

[SPEAKER_01]: We need to be transformed by the renewing of our mind.

[SPEAKER_01]: And of course that's spiritual, but it's also a physical thing that brain [SPEAKER_01]: that brains get be healed.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so there are so many people out there working now to help people who have been exposed or are using pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: and one stop.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I know from my husband's story, and then he works with men every single week who are changing their lives, getting off of pornography.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know from people I've interviewed on my podcast, like it is not the end of anyone's story.

[SPEAKER_01]: None of us have to say, I'm held captive by this for the rest of my life.

[SPEAKER_01]: That doesn't have to be the truth.

[SPEAKER_01]: There is healing and there is hope, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: For the person that is like, hey, you just got to the part that I really want to talk about, is there a resource on the book?

[SPEAKER_00]: Is it a resource on your podcast?

[SPEAKER_00]: Have you helped what people through?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I just found this out.

[SPEAKER_00]: What steps can I take towards healing?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: So my book does have a whole chapter on what to do after your kid is, you know, you find out your kid was exposed to porn or he's using porn.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have a whole index in the back with information about websites and organizations that help people and then also on my podcast, I've interviewed countless people who were engaged in pornography, men, women, couples, and they share their story and they share about how they came out of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I am all about not just prevention, but also saying there is hope on the other side.

[SPEAKER_01]: Love is we need to hear, we need to hear both sides.

[SPEAKER_01]: We need to hear, like, how do we try to avoid this?

[SPEAKER_01]: And if something happened and we didn't, we need hope to hear how people came out of that life.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, big thanks to you and I would say thanks to your husband for being willing to just be honest about this and I know you've helped thousands and thousands of people.

[SPEAKER_00]: So really, really appreciate you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Where can people find you?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the place I most active is Instagram.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you just look up Greta Esker John Instagram and I'll come right up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then you can also check out my website, GretaSquidge.com.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the book is, it's time to talk to your kids about porn and it's wherever you buy books.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or even your library if it doesn't carry it, ask them to.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's a great idea.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're such a delight.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is going to be so helpful.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for having me and being willing to have the conversation.

[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, so of course.

[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you enjoyed this episode of Part in the Mass, as always, we've got more encouragement and resources over at ChristianParenting.org.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you can also stay connected with us on social media at Part in the Mass.

[SPEAKER_00]: And if you liked this episode, I'd love for you to do two things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Press Follow on whatever podcast platform you love, and also be sure to leave a rating so other parents can find us.

[SPEAKER_00]: Remember, you're never alone in this beautiful Mass of Parenting.