Namaste and in LA catch and welcome to this episode of One World in a New world.

I'm your host, Zen Benefiel.

And as always, please do like subscribe and by all means make a comment.

This is how we get conversations started in the video thread.

So please do make a comment and subscribe.

And if you'll visit planetarycitizens.net, you'll get a opportunity to download a copy of Planetary citizens awakening the heart of humanity.

It will give give you a big picture view that will just absolutely blow your mind and soothe your soul.

Well, this week's guest is Anton Gross.

He's an American author, a spiritual teacher and an interfaith minister who had an interesting experience just much like mine that we'll be talking about.

You're going to just love this conversation.

He's got a PhD in the evolution of human consciousness from the California Institute of Integrative Studies.

He's got several books, one of which is just amazing.

It's called Handbook for a New Consciousness, the next step in human evolution.

He's got another one called Dying Friend, helping those who who you love make a conscious transition.

And I'm sure we're going to talk about that because we've both done similar things.

He was born to an atheist family, and this is going to be just an amazing conversation.

If I didn't say that before, stay tuned, we will be right back.

Well, you can get coaching from just about anybody.

There's certificates everywhere.

But do they have the life experience, tenure, understanding education and training to actually do it?

Find out.

Anton, it is such a pleasure to have you.

I've been looking forward to this conversation and I know it's going to be phenomenal.

Thank you for being here and for the work that you do.

Well, thank you then for the invite and my pleasure to be here.

It just, you know, one of those, one of those wonderful things that happens when you weren't expecting it, suddenly there it is.

Oh, sure.

Yeah.

And then being one right now we're we get to play with each other.

There you go.

Now, Speaking of the oneness, right, you and I both have had, let me preface this a little bit.

The purpose for these conversations is to bring out those inner conversations that we don't have with others so that others can understand.

Yeah, it's OK to talk, right?

We're not crazy.

We're not insane.

We're talking about real experiences, which are our only truth, and how we can then integrate those and bridge those inner and outer worlds so that we can create one of harmony with each other and the planet and the cosmos.

That's a big goal we're capable of.

How did this start for you?

Well, it's really an interesting story, I think, and goes many, many years back.

I mean, gosh, you're only 85.

Well, there you go.

You know I so.

You're still a young guy though, right?

Yeah, no.

There were those who lived, what, 7-8 hundred years long time ago?

Well, why aren't we?

Well, if you want to consider all the times I've been here in in different incarnations, but that's another story for this one, yeah.

It's a rabbit hole we could get in for hours and days.

Yeah, I'm near the end of the current one.

I'm in, no question about it.

You know, another 15 years would bring me to 100.

Wow, whoever expected that?

But it's a joy.

It's been a joy and it's getting more and more fun, which is something I wouldn't have been.

Absolutely.

You know, Urban Laszlo's 93 now, and he's still going strong.

Oh, absolutely.

Anyway, let me get you back here.

I grew up in an absolute, oh, by the way, I was born in New York City, in Hell's Kitchen, section of the New York City called Hell's Kitchen.

And I think it's really appropriate when you consider how far I've come from there.

Well, yeah.

Born in Hell's Kitchen to an atheist family.

One more can you ask?

One more everything would perfectly set up right.

Perfectly set up.

When I was six years old, my grandfather sat me on his knee.

He said God is the sum total of man's ignorance.

We used to think that the sun was God.

Then we learned how the sun works.

Now the sun isn't God anymore.

Someday humanity will understand how everything works and there'll be no need for God at all.

Now, when you're 6 years old and your grandfather tells you that and you know he's the smartest one in the family because he's the loudest and he wins all the arguments, right?

Right.

You believe it all right.

And then when your mother says to you, you know, if there were a God, which there isn't, but if there were a God, I'd spit in his eye for what he allowed to happen to the Jews in the Second World War.

To her, God not only didn't exist, but if he did, he's nasty.

I grew up ambivalent.

Yeah.

Well, he not, not even that he let it happen, you know.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

This is this is from her perspective, the point being that I grew up with science is the only thing that matters.

If you can't prove it, it's not real.

If not real, you know, and I'd argue with my, my, my friends, my, my, my friend Beverly, we're, we're eight years old.

She says how would you know not to kill somebody if God didn't tell you not to?

Oh, I just know it's wrong.

I know I don't need anybody to tell me that I shouldn't.

You know some.

Evidence of the indwelling spirit, right?

Yeah, by the way, Speaking of indwelling, I somehow knew from the very beginning that if there were a God, which there wasn't, but if there were a God, he'd speak to you by a voice that you heard inside.

I don't know where that came from, but you know, I'm back with it anyway.

Fast forward to college.

You know, I become agnostic just so as not to fight with.

And you know, my, my, my fraternity brothers, I had to take a, a liberal arts course to go with my mathematics and economic studies.

I took religion.

And the first day I asked Reverend Abernathy, who was teaching the course, to excuse me, Reverend Abernathy, if I failed this course, do I go to hell?

You know it was.

Smart ass even as a kid.

Right.

Yeah, it was a wise ass anyway.

Yeah, Yeah.

So Fast forward to my mid 30s, all right, my my sister's husband dies and she is distraught as we all are the beautiful, beautiful young man.

And she gets involved with Siddha yoga as an A chance to just find some peace and meditation and so on.

And Guru Mai, this would be for Guru Mai, this was Baba Buktananda.

Guru Mai was his assistant at the time, but she then took over for him.

Pardon me.

So my mother, you know, says to me, will you find out what your sister is doing?

You know, she recognizes that she needs some, you know, support.

But what is this yoga stuff?

So my sister sends me a book on meditation by Baba Muktananda.

I'm a smart kid, all right?

I try the meditation.

Damn, it's fun.

It works, you know?

I just sat there and boy, this crazy world out there just kind of disappears for a while.

You can go find inside wherever that is you know.

Many.

Worlds So one night, all right, I mean my, I mean my 30 late 3037.

As a matter of fact, I'm sitting before going to bed.

I, I, I, I'm too awake thinking of all the things that I've got to do the next day.

So I just want to calm down.

So I go to meditate and I sit there and I put a candle in front of me with the candle flame going and I back and forth.

I'm looking at just trying to relax and for some reason I let all the air out and keep it up.

I don't know why I did it.

It just felt right.

And suddenly I'm above my head, underneath the ceiling, looking down at the top of my head.

Oh my God, if this is me up here, who's that down there?

Or if that's me down there, who lives up here?

I'd taken a gulp in air.

I'm back in my body and I think, wow, that was fun, wasn't it it?

Was the thought the thinking that brought you back into your body too?

It was it was the inhaling of the air.

Yeah.

OK, All right.

Or at least that's my that was my take on sure that.

So I said, wow, you know, this was so cool to be outside of my body.

I'd like to try this again, and maybe if I hold the air out even longer, I'll be able to stay outside of my body even longer and have more experiences.

By the way, while I was outside there, I was hearing sounds, tones, you know, the music of the spheres of you know, right God.

The Hindus call it the one form of it, the Shabda, right?

The sound current.

It was incredible.

Yeah.

So one, one other thing had happened.

This is really, really weird.

But my wife's sister's husband had died also another young man.

And she gave gave me the book this this book very classic book.

Life Afterlife by Raymond Moody.

I had a conversation with him years ago.

Beautiful man, wonderful, wonderful.

And I had read that, you know, and reading about all these people who had gone through tunnels into lights while they were in an operating room or underneath the ceiling, you know, looking down at themselves, they couldn't have been, it couldn't have been made-up.

I mean, these people with different ethnicity from around the world, different languages, clearly they each were experiencing this.

This wasn't some made-up stuff.

So I compared that with what I've been reading about from, you know, Baba Muktananda and the, you know, and his meditation thing about the inner life.

And I thought, what if mind and body really are separate?

And it was the only leap of faith I ever took, in effect.

All right, just that.

But it's not.

So he was sort of, as I go get it back now.

He was sort of like walking up a seesaw when you get to the middle, just the slightest tilt can make it go in the other direction, right.

So anyway, here I had, I had been underneath in the ceiling on top of my head looking down and I want to do it again.

And I said, well, as soon as I get the opportunity.

Well the following weekend, April 16th 1978, I remember the day like it was the day I was born, which as it turns out it was.

My wife and daughter are out shopping, my 9 year old son is playing in his room and I decide I'm going to try what I did the other night.

I'm going to meditate and I'm going to wet the air out and I'm not going to breathe in until I separate from my body.

I'm just going to hold it out there.

I did not do anything stupid like put, you know, tape over my mouth or nose.

I I'm not that, you know, Nutsy, you know, I knew that if I, you know, blacked out well.

If you're able to do that and be conscious control, then there really is some safety there.

Yeah, right.

Because you're in charge.

I was in charge or whatever was in charge with.

Yeah, yeah.

If I was, if I blacked out, the body would take over.

That I knew, right.

So I, I'm lying on my bed, on my arms, right?

It is, you know, looking at the headboard, all right.

And in, out.

And I let all the air out and I say to myself, I am not going to breathe in again until I separate from my body and the clock goes around once one minute and I have no more air in my lungs.

Clock goes around a second time.

Nothing.

I'm beginning to now feel some pain.

I feel like I'm my body is shaking like it's going through an earthquake.

And then I feel like I'm drowning in a flood, and then I feel like I'm burning up on a fire.

I later learned that these, according to the Tibetan Book of the Dead, these are the fur three steps in dying separation from the earth element, the water element, and the fire element.

I was already separated from the air element, right?

The only thing connecting me to my body was the ether element, which sounds pretty nebulous to me though.

Anyway, it was.

It went around 2 minutes, 2 minutes 45 seconds.

As it approached 3 minutes.

I'm shaking on the bed.

I see a little light.

I see on the top of my head and it starts getting bigger and I think, Oh my gosh, this is what the people in life afterlife described as going through the tunnel.

And I think, Oh my God, I'm dying.

No, God will not let me die while I'm searching for him.

And I'm thinking, what?

What did I just say?

That's ridiculous anyway.

You find out there really is no death, right?

Duh.

Well, it gets bigger and bigger.

I still am.

I am I conscious or am I not conscious or I'm not breathing?

I'm still not breathing.

So I must be conscious because if I were unconscious, the body would be.

And I refuse to breathe.

I refuse to breathe.

It is those thoughts flood you.

In such rapid succession.

Absolutely.

And I go through that econo tunnel into the light, the brightest light I could ever imagine.

Unbelievable.

Oh my.

Gosh.

An amazing thing I've my body starts whooping around like an epileptic fit.

Which makes sense because my mother and uncle both had their first epileptic fits in their late 30s and I was now 37 while this was happening.

I roll off the bed, however, and oh, and I I do suck in an air.

Some air.

At that time I realize that, you know, this is an unbelievable experience.

Inside.

I am so peaceful.

The body is flaring about like crazy, but I have never felt more peaceful in my life.

I feel other dimensions.

I feel a reality that I never would have believed existed except now I'm experiencing.

Now you're experiencing, So what are you going to do?

You lie to yourself.

I don't.

Think so?

Well, so many people do, you know, at this point, I'm rolling around on the floor like this.

My, my wife comes in the room absolutely panicked.

She had driven up from coming home from shopping.

My son, in order to keep her from panicking, runs out to the car.

He has hooked in the room and seen me like this.

And he runs out the car to tell her, Daddy's not dead.

Daddy's not dead, all right?

Strange phrase, but totally appropriate I guess, right?

Fortunately, by the way, she she, she called up somebody to help.

She didn't call 911.

She was very, very smart.

She called a friend of ours, very spiritual person whose name by the way, was Shepherd.

So I thought that would kind of kind of work.

Anyway, is it interesting how those synchronistic names come up?

But it's throughout.

I don't think is so there are no coincidences, no world is all synchronicity.

But anyway, when I could finally finally, you know, control my body when it kind came down, the first thing that happened.

I'm on the floor on my knees, my hands like this.

My first words were I am reborn.

I am reborn in God.

And I was so embarrassed to hear me say that because after 37 years of being a yeah.

Yeah, I, I can, I can relate because that's when the outer world programming comes in and they're like, what the hell are you talking about?

Right.

And yet it's the truth, because you.

My life went like this 2 completely different shapes, completely different direction.

I cannot tell you, you know the the difference that that it made, I began.

Well, you can sure try and you're doing a great job.

Well, thank you.

I, you know, while I was still in this state, you know, I was able to go in.

If I lean my head one way, I was in the room.

If I lean my head the other way, I went back into outer space and saw the planet from a distance.

So you were like attenuating based on your the the the angle of your antenna, right?

Whatever I I never, I never, you know, tried to strain it.

It just happened.

But the farther I went back, I get it went back Earth became a yin Yang symbol and I suddenly realized that everything is balanced.

It's perfectly balanced and you know, we can get into that, you know, you know, right later too, about, you know, the balance of different types of valid, but all of it.

And it completely changed my life, which and that's what got me out.

I, I out to California, to the California Institute of Integral Studies.

You know, several, several years later, it got me to write my first book, Letters to a Dying Friend.

You know which by the way, I gave, I gave a, an early manuscript.

I went to the to see the Dalai Lama speak at A at a conference in New Jersey.

I was living in the East Coast at the time.

And I brought out some of the manuscript that I was writing and gave it on the offering table.

You know, when you always do that along with some, some wooden sticks to represent the cellar.

The student, he wrote back an introduction to the book, never even asked for it.

But the Dalai Lama wrote an introduction to my book.

How unbelievable.

Amazing.

So amazing the way things work out anyway.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

That's how I, you know, I.

You were talking about, you know, going different directions.

I'd like to roll back just a little bit to talk about the when your dad was talking to you about the son, you know how we used to think of the.

Grandfather, right?

Right.

Or your grandfather.

So the one of the experiences I had, I've been on the questions, you know, we haven't really on deep here not my intention because this is mostly about you, right?

There is a shared experience there, the.

It's about us, ma'am.

There's only one of us here anyway.

You.

True.

And we're just, we're filling in that those separate of gaps, right?

But yeah, and this, by the way, is I think the thing that makes it so exciting and why people watching this get so much pleasure and value from it is that we each do this in our own unique way.

But ultimately the experience is the same.

And the one right there is the one of us here, so.

Absolutely.

Absolutely.

And it's a paradox too, right?

So I've got several.

The one's purple, right?

Favorite shoes.

Anyway, the I had questions about.

Yeah, yeah, The Trinity, right?

It's ubiquitous, but where did it come from, right?

How the heck did we get it?

And so during one of these William Schweigard technique things that I was going through is called the multi level awareness.

This one gives you the ability to go inside and examine the Akashic records, your chakras, your guides, all those kinds of things.

So I got hijacked by my guide, who I'd met as a teen in college, shortly after my awakening, and his name was Zephyr.

And he shows up, waves to me, says come.

And so I'm right inside looking.

And so I'd leave my body.

We're traveling through the universe and we see stars to begin with, and then blackness.

And then all of a sudden we're at this.

Now I'm talking with him the whole time, wondering where we're going.

And basically it ended up being a refresher of the things that had been happening for the years that I hadn't seen him, which had been several.

And so it was kind of a check in.

And so we reached this solar system and I feel like Ellie coming out of the tunnel, right, and the wormhole and she's got tears streaming down her face because this is just an amazing, awe inspiring vision here.

But it wasn't a vision.

I'm seeing it.

And there were three Suns with about a dozen small planets in a planar orbit around them, and they were probably 100th the size of the spheres.

And I'm just in awe looking at this and in silence at that point.

And then there's several voices as one that say we are not only your forefathers, we are also the forefathers of your solar system.

And I want to ask questions.

What, what do you mean?

Right.

And Zephyr says, Nope, that's it.

You've got all you need, you'll figure it out.

And so back we came.

Now interesting fact about this, there was a facilitator sitting next to me during this whole process and the the training was being able to witness or experience and also maintain a verbal connection with the facilitator.

So he's asking questions and I'm giving feedback as to what's going on.

Well it took 8 minutes to get there and 8 minutes to get back.

Now I don't know what speed we traveled at however I was querying OK, what's the speed of thought?

And the only reference I've ever found to that is in the Urantia book, and it says it's 841 trillion miles per second.

So right, What are you going to do with that?

Except you go, wow, you know, it's almost incomprehensible.

Yet here is that journey to that distant center of the universe, if you will, that took 8 minutes at that speed.

So when I came back on the way, I recognize, OK, so the Trinity that shows up, that's a macro, the micro proton, electron neutron.

OK, what doesn't fit hydrogen?

There's only the proton and the the neutron.

And so where's hydrogen?

Oh, it's the most plentiful gas, powers the sun and is also the bonding agent for DNA.

Oh, wow.

Is it possible that consciousness, what we know to be the godness of us actually is transmitted through that tertiary leg, invisible leg that hydrogen provides?

And then there was a quite a biologist in New Zealand recently I spoke with and he said, Oh yeah, yeah, there's a in one of the rings of the proton is the cause of proton tunneling.

He said it releases light and this is that formation.

So this is still like brand new stuff.

Don't understand it.

And yet here's that experience that goes, it makes you wonder, right?

It's like, OK, how did that happen?

Well, it's, it's it's amazing.

You say this is brand new stuff and it's not brand new in stuff that, oh, this stuff never existed before and now it does.

It's a case of, hey humanity, you were.

Unaware of that, we're just now discovering.

And now you're discovering that all the stuff really is.

Excuse me while I take a sip of coffin.

Sure, sure.

I remember right after.

I mean, this is early on, maybe a couple weeks after that experience that I told you about, sitting on my sofa at home crying my eyes out.

And Lord, Lord, why did I have to wait this long to find out that you were real?

That there is.

And the voice in my head said, hey, you have now stood on both sides of the river.

How could you have shared with anyone who didn't believe if you had started by believing, by understanding?

So it is I'm, I'm aware of the fact that, you know, we learn things as we go along, right?

We test the idea that we think is that's right.

Absolutely, Absolutely it is.

And it loves to be tested.

That's what it's there for.

It's our obligation, if you will, right?

Well, that's why, for example, in in in my book, in, in in the handbook.

All right, The one that I just that I just did that.

It has games and exercises for people to experiment and experience for themselves.

You don't have to be a believer.

That's the whole point that if.

You.

That's the science behind.

It, it's the science behind it exactly.

And it's the experience.

And I, I think I mentioned I'm a phenomenologist, which is phenomenologist.

I love that terminology.

Yeah, it took me so long to learn how to spell it.

Phenomenology too long a word.

But what it means is the the science of experiential reality.

I'll give you an example of, you know how I know, but that my life was building in this direction, all right?

And this is something that I think your viewers are going to realize.

Absolutely, because it's all about bread crumbs.

We just don't necessarily see them.

And in their life, they'll find little things of experience that go on back in college, back in college.

All right, I'm walking down the the street one day and it says five $5 psychology department studies come and it's a bunch of, you know, doctoral students who who got feces going, who need to have some data for their, for their dissertation, right?

You take all the tests you do and then the very last room I walk in, there are 5 booths set up with a panel in front of them with a red light, green light and buttons.

Underneath the red and green light in the corner there's like a glass phone booth.

Remember the old days?

The phone booth, glass phone booth, guy in there with a lab coat on looks like the professor.

There are five of these booth, four other students in there.

And the guy said, oh, we have the full amount, we can do the test now.

And he said the test is going to be, I am going to press a button in here and on all five of the different panels, the light will show up.

It will be the same light on each one.

You know, there were boards in between you couldn't see, you know, And so press the button underneath the light and I'm going to keep going.

It's going to get faster and faster.

Keep going until somebody makes a mistake and then we're going to stop.

So I get into my into the booth and boom, boom, put red.

I push the red button, green, the green button back and forth back, but suddenly beep, Somebody pushed the wrong button.

And the guy in the end says hoop.

Did anybody push red?

I said I pushed red.

He said it wasn't red, it was green.

I said, what do you mean mine was red?

He said, no, mine was green.

He said.

And the professor said that that everybody's was going to be the same.

The girl on this side said mine was green.

I said, I don't care what you're doing.

Mine was red.

All four of them.

He says, hey, the guy in the end said, what's the matter?

You, you screwed this up for everybody.

I said, what do you call him?

Are you calling me a lot you want and we started.

Oh, there's the experiment.

Each other right on I'm we're heading towards each other and I'm really seeing red now right and I suddenly feel my grab.

It's the professor out of the booth.

He says stops to hold a hold on.

You were right.

You were right.

You were right.

It was red.

This was not an experiment on how fast you can push a button.

It was how well you stand up to peer pressure.

You did very well young man here take this chick and go out and get your $5.

You're you're done for this.

Oh, I was so pissed and I forgot about that until my experience that I told you about when people said oh, you're making that up.

I am not making that up.

I, I experienced it.

And then I remembered this study.

You have experienced it when I wrote my first book, this Letters to a Dying Friend, All right.

And I was on, I was interviewed as we're doing here, and people would sometimes call in and they would say I had an experience like that too, but everybody told me it wasn't real.

So I forgot about it, you know?

And that's the point, right?

What you experience is true for you.

Sure.

Not what someone tells you it should be, and certainly not what someone tells you you experienced.

And to stand up for your truth, you know, you know, I both I think mine was a little worse and and you know, the the belief factor and the crazy factor enemy in the institution for a while, right.

And and diagnosis of manic depressive, paranoid schizophrenic.

No symptoms of that whatsoever.

I'm just trying to get them.

Don't listen to me right?

Right.

Just to help me understand what the hell I just went through.

Well instead they decided to diagnose me from the DSM four and put me on 2000 micrograms of Thorazine a day.

Well what's that do nothing to me?

I was up playing ping pong, beating male nurses right?

Showing them up in the corner.

They couldn't figure it out.

Well, it wasn't until I said I thought to myself, OK, what do I need to do to get out of this place?

And it occurred to me, well, I need to tell the doc what he wants to hear, right?

Not my truth.

And so you wait, which is so unfair.

Absolutely.

So, and this is one of the things that is changing in the new reality that you are helping bring to the world, namely yes.

Yeah, because here I am, 3540 years later, 40.

Oh my God, 50 years later then.

That is such a minimal time in the in in the growth of a human species 50 years meaning.

Oh yeah, it's a blink of nine.

Yeah, absolutely.

But it's we're going in that direction.

That's that's the key, that's the key.

And every little bit I remember also thinking that, you know, whatever, and this is to ethic as a young man, I remember thinking I'm going to be doing many, many things in my life, but the one that the later in life I do it, the more important it is.

I think that sharing this world, I've had United States patents, I've had a business, I've performed professionally as a professional singer, I've done a lot of of things that have been pure fun and enjoyment, which by the way is another.

Yeah.

As to whether you're doing it right.

Drum kit in our formal dining room that I play on a couple of times a week.

There you go.

There you go.

It's, it's, it's just, you know, phenomenal.

You do what you want.

It's part of the.

Phenomenology.

That's right.

The you know, as I always say, God did not create the universe because his mother said will you get up off the couch and do something right, right.

He did it or it did it because sure, you know, this has brought something up to to me.

You.

Remember the Guy Ballard books, right?

Godfrey Ray King, several series of teaching the Ascended Masters basically and started out with the Unveiled Mysteries was the first one about his Guy Ballard's relationship with an Ascended Master known as Saint Germain.

Well, in all of those books there was one reference to a guy named Sanat Kamara who's supposedly A planetary Logos, and in order to gain that office, he had to Incarnate 1000 times simultaneously.

And then bring that.

Back in order to understand how to fulfill that office stole.

Take that and.

Exponentiate it with this formless consciousness wanting to experience the reality it created in so many different ways.

Is that how boring?

It would be if we were all the same, absolutely.

Absolutely.

I mean, it's a joy.

Well, be nice if we could be just a.

Little bit the same, right?

If we could figure out how to be planetary citizens and live and work together in peace and harmony, that's our next step in my opinion.

And this is.

Let me tell this I, I tell I I've come up with this.

What if there were eyes on the ends of the fingers and they.

Looked out and they saw.

The thumb and they said you stupid thumb coming from all the way over there.

Why are you opposing us?

And they?

Scratched it and the thumb got infected and the infection went back up into the fingers.

Would the fingers have attacked the thumb if they knew they were all connected and attacking this would hurt them?

I don't think so.

Shouldn't we be as smart as our fingers when we learn that we are all connected, not visibly on the outside, but on the inside, where what I do to you, I feel what we do to each other.

How can any of us not feel the pain and suffering of children in Gaza?

Oh, absolutely.

You know it.

Is so, you know, we try to think our way through a system built on vibration like and as we understand things now, especially with quantum physics, it's all vibrations, even urban.

I got in conversation with him, I said, you know, according to quantum physics, we're 99% space and 1% material.

And he says, I would say we are 100% energy, energy, energy.

Vibration, right?

We cannot.

Think our way through that because that's a projection and you got to sense our way.

Through it because.

That's the body, right?

The body's a transceiver and it has all these kind of instruments in it that it's we don't know how to tune yet alone play in concert with we.

The the the energy field that is within beings is existing as strongly.

I mean, there was a time when rocks were the most advanced beings on our planet, right?

Imagine the, the the, the, the evolutionary step that occurred when plants showed up.

Holy commode.

Wow.

I can turn and face the sun.

I can reach for water instead of just sitting there stoned like a stone.

You know what I mean, right?

All right.

Or animals.

I don't know, did you inhale?

Depends.

Add the stone.

The rock doesn't inhale.

It just sits there.

Yeah, yeah, right.

You know, and it and everything happens to the rock, but it has the IT just does not have the capacity to understand its own universality there.

There would seem to be a certain.

Amount of natural differentiation in what?

We perceive to be the material.

World in order for us to experience its glory for lack of a better yeah.

Yeah, well, this is this is where.

Quantum physics is is doing something.

It's it, it has raised the issue and raised the point that viewing the viewer effects that which is out there.

And there's no question that is there's an interaction between it and old science.

Old material science said it's out there, I'm here.

We are separate.

See the space in between us.

Clearly we're not connected.

All right.

But that's no longer what they understand because we realize that we are inside the energy field within my body, within your body, within the, you know, the viewer's body, within the books of the within the rock, within every, and we're all able to perceive.

And sense each other in that place.

And and Tom Campbell twos and and.

The level, the size of the brain you remember You know how everybody says how the brain and the mind are related?

The barger, the brain, the greater the mind.

Absolutely true.

But what is not true is the concept.

That the brain.

Creates the mind.

What if, Oh yeah, what if the size of the brain did not create the consciousness into the mind, but opened up the being to a greater amount of consciousness?

That all depending on the curiosity we have.

Right, so.

So sure, my mind and brain are larger than that of a dog, which is larger than that of a frog, which is larger than that of a slug.

But it's not that the brain created it, it's just that we are open to more.

And we now, as humans, are at a point where we are able to experience and realize the absolute oneness.

And I, you know, and we're set up that way.

Physiologically right, you've got the in between the hemispheres.

You got the corpus.

Callosum and you got the pineal on the front, the hypothalamus on the back.

Well, the pineal is, is that higher sensing organ, right.

And the hopsalmus is the reptilian, you know, survival part of that.

And then you've got the corpus callosum.

Which is the transceiver?

Between the two hemispheres, that actually merges them into that oneness.

And so, you know, here's that trifecta again between those 3 organs in the brain that we're just now trying to, you know, that there's been all this bifurcation, right, the bipolarism, the right brain, left brain.

This is where Tom Campbell came in and he's trying to explain, you know, the right brain thinking to the left brain people.

And so he's got this idea that OK, we're, and I love it because it, it encapsulates my phrasing of where we put our attention, intention and interaction is where we create flow.

And the so as an avatar in Tom's world, right, we're an avatar in a virtual reality.

And wherever we put our attention, that's the data stream that we're now exchanging with or interacting with.

Now, that doesn't eliminate other data streams that we can move along in fractions of a second, right?

And yet, and we're capable of doing that because right thoughts 841 trillion miles per second, right?

So if we're able to do this, that's pretty close to instantaneous I.

Guess you know, Yeah.

And so is.

There that which gives credence to those moments of when you think something in pure innocence and naivety, it instantly appears.

This, I swear to this, has.

Happened to me with jigsaw puzzle pieces.

I cannot find the piece.

And I will say this, here's the piece missing here.

And my wife says, yeah, yeah, yeah, you're you're doing it again.

And I can sit and I can't find the piece and she'll walk over and she said, I know the piece is here somewhere and there it is.

I can find it when she shows up.

I haven't figured that one out.

Yeah, because you rely on her.

For assistance You're you 2 are one.

Oh my God, yes.

After 62 years of marriage, we definitely are one.

Yeah.

And that's.

That that's that Mobius strip, right, right, right.

Oh, it's, it's incredible.

Then when I when, when I see, you know, I see our age, we no longer sound like a.

Couple of goofballs when you're younger, right?

Because nobody understands this.

Now.

We're at the place where, yeah, we understand this.

We live it so we can express it without any angst or consideration for the naysayers.

I knew many years.

Ago, a woman, June Burke, who was the channel for Julian A Seraphim.

And when June was a little girl, she said she could tell who was about to call.

The phone's going to ring.

It's Aunt Harriet or you know, there are three things in the mailbox and they're from such and such, you know, and her mother said, will you stop doing that?

Father Anthony thinks we're crazy enough already professed by the devil.

Yeah.

But more and more people are beginning to realize that there is a connection other than the physical that we can see well, and they find it in fearlessness.

They find it in fearlessness.

Yes, right.

We're told that.

In Scripture.

Says, you know, in perfect love there is No Fear.

Well, we are in perfect love.

We just separate ourselves from it, right?

And we separate.

We separate.

Ourselves from from from each other.

I love the fact that that in Scripture in John 14-6 where where where Jesus said, you know, I am, I am the way he didn't speak English.

I don't want to surprise you there, but he actually didn't speak English.

He spoke Aramaic and in Aramaic that could be translated as I am is the way the.

Same way that.

Luke 1721 could be you know, the Kingdom of God is within you.

That's where we feel it.

That's where we feel the connection.

But oneness.

And when you get into meditation, deeper and deeper and you leave, you leave the noisy, messy world outside.

And then if you get good at that, you can leave your thoughts, you know, and then you can take that wherever you go.

Yep, and then you take and.

That's the whole point.

You can.

It doesn't take 20 minutes or an hour to sit in meditation to find that.

But once you know that at your core you are peace and love and comfort and compassion and caring and joy, you know, once you realize that this is who you are, you can get back there at any time.

And our core desire.

Is simply to love and be loved to be the one.

That we truly are, that we are not separate leaves.

We are one tree.

And if I have different skills than you, great.

One skill I do have is playing table tennis.

You call it ping pong, I call it table tennis.

Maybe we can do it someday, you know, but you know, but other than that kind of competition, which is purely for fun, absolutely, the rest of what we do should not be in competition.

We should use our skills and talents for the good of that.

So there's a.

Difference, the collaboration, even a football field, right?

You're there to have fun, play games and we've taken it to extremes to to where there's a winner and loser.

That's never been the objective.

It's always been about the team and learning how to work with the team in the dynamics of it so that it's successful as a team, not as a competitor per SE.

Because that sets up this false front, that of separation, right, Where you don't just enjoy the game.

You get caught up in that wanting, yeah, you get trolled, you can get.

Caught up and where it really, really shows up.

The worst, I think, is in capitalism, where we do things not for the good of all, but for the higher.

The money has become our highest.

God.

Right.

Well, the agendas we've been.

Running on is pot is profit over people and planet, right?

And we're flipping that agenda now to people and planet over profit doesn't do away with the profit because there still has to be an exchange and and ways to continue what we're doing now.

What I find is that there there's this whole misnomer about socialism, right?

And that what socialism essentially does is the excess is returned to the people, not hoarded in profit, right?

That's really the only difference, of course.

Of course it is, but it's that's not the way it's publicized by those who already have the largest amount because they don't want to give up what?

They have and they will fight and still are fighting.

You know, the whole, as we discovered all the wars were created by the bankers and manufacturers, right?

And just to make money and the human lives were not considered they they were acceptable casualties, right, Because it didn't matter because it wasn't them exactly, exactly if.

If if I can make I find it.

I find it fascinating that the United States was founded in 1776, the exact same year as The Wealth of Nations was published.

Adam Smith's book, the very first book on economics, was published the same year the United States was founded.

They, I think there's some synchronicity there that we, that we have been created a country that, you know, where profit, where capitalism is so strong that anything of sharing with other people becomes a dirty word, you know?

Yeah.

And we've got, you know, Russia doesn't have any.

Homeless people, Russia's, the their educational system is far superior than America's.

I, I wear, I'm married to a Russian wife and she's explained to me she went through their system.

You know, they start with the assessing kids at five years old.

So what their aptitude, attitude, skill set and passions for right When she chose piano or she has the choice between piano and gymnastics, she chose piano.

So they took her to clear through that piano strand and she graduated from one of the most prestigious music colleges in the world, Mesorski College and now Petersburg.

So in that process, she also had the the robust education of everything around that, math and science and all those kinds of things.

Well, we don't nurture our children in America like that.

We put them in the box and we test and we expect them to reach certain.

We teach them to get a job.

We teach them how to get a job.

And that's right, thanks to Dewey and.

His one of the one of the saddest moments.

That I had one of those instantaneous feelings was a couple of years ago.

Oh, couple of years.

My God, maybe 30 years ago.

But you know, I don't watch yesterday.

Yeah, yesterday.

If something relates, if you relate to something, it could feel like yesterday, even if it happened 50 years ago.

I can't believe.

Did you plug into that file?

That file?

That's an instant.

Plug in.

You're there.

You're there.

Exactly.

The but I was watching the Morning News and it was a take your daughter to work day and one of the cameraman had his daughter there.

And the, the announcer, you know, the, the host moderator asked this little girl and what do you want to do when you grow up?

And she said I want to get a job in an office so that I can do what I want to do on the weekends and.

I Oh my.

God, you little girl, she's been programmed already to get a job.

Get a job right yeah forget the just over broke what about what do you.

Want to do I want to make music.

I want to dance, I want to grow flowers, I want to no it's do something so I can do it on the way.

That's what the whole thing is about.

If the universe was created because the Creator felt this joy and desire to turn waves into particles and see what would happen, shouldn't that be true for the creations of that Creator?

That we feel within us the desires of what we enjoy doing, what we want to do, what makes us feel happy and to then do those.

But not so we can earn as much of this, but just right for the joy it can bring to everyone else.

So anti this brings up because you and I both.

On the same page and we know this stuff in spades, right?

Because we live it.

We live it.

That's, that's the whole point.

That's.

The whole you've got to live it to really experience and feel it.

Yeah, yeah.

How do we impart this?

How do?

We hold the hands of the younger generations and help them through this transition period.

Because right now, I mean, we're both boomers, right?

You're on the, the front end.

I'm on the I'm I'm early in that I was born 19.

40 So you were at the end of the transition, Traditionalists I.

Guess whatever.

Yeah, I'm.

Still trying to, you know, compartmentalize and frame.

For understanding, right?

SO, so we've got this new generation that is far superior in their ability to say no.

And they're also population wise, the largest since the boomers.

So these guys are going to be in charge.

How do we move them into that place that promotes this natural order as opposed to a prescriptive one that is in the programming?

How do we do it?

Well, one, we live it.

And two, Are you ready?

We sell them my book.

I got a few of those and I'm working on my 50th.

Book, yeah, but that, that's, that's the key.

You, you, you let people know that yes, what is What you feel is what it is.

What you experience is what it is you know, and if you go down deep enough, I, I love meditation now.

I lead groups online, I lead groups in person.

And you leave the noisy world out there.

You get inside your thoughts, inside your emotions to that place of quiz.

And when you realize that I am feels the same now as it did when you were a kid.

It feels the same for for me as it does for you.

There's one of that when you realize that that is true, then you put it into your life.

There's another little story that I that I share, if I may what if, what if?

And you know, these insights that come, you know the very insights I am the receptor, you know, for them.

You know what if when you were a child, an infant, you were flying across Australia in an airplane and the airplane crashed and everyone died except for you now.

The the Indigenous people.

Majoria, who were in there, they would have heard the plane go across, they would have heard it crash, they would have gone to see what happened, and they would have found everyone dead except for this one tiny infant.

They wouldn't have left you there.

They would have.

Taken you into their arms, they would have raised you.

You would now and now.

You would be the same age, but your language would be different, your abilities would be different, your beliefs in oneness would be different.

You may not be able to drive a car, but you could probably run for miles much faster and longer than you could now.

But still, the feeling I am would still be the same and that this is a cool thing about you know if.

You're in a quandary.

It's one of the things that that I use, you know, put your fingertips together, feel your heartbeat in them.

So you're out of your head, out of your brain, you're thinking right, You're sensing and then inhale I and exhale M and it is just amazing as to the difference.

Just a few seconds of doing that can have and you can do it anywhere.

That's right.

And you know the fascinating thing also then?

Is that if you get into that place any?

Decision you make is going.

To be so much better if somebody in your family ticks you off or the neighbor next door or somebody cuts you off on the highway, we drive and you want to react and use some, you know, let's go to that place.

And now what you?

Do is going to be so much more intelligent, make so much more sense, and be such a better, better decision in groups, even if you're in a.

A group that a work group at say you're at work, right?

And you're in this meeting and it's going awry.

Well, how can you recenter it?

Do that exercise.

It will change the energy in the room because you're permeating that energy to other people.

Oh, absolutely.

If you walk around like.

This If you walk around like this, you, you have, you know, the ability to change, you know what's around you.

I'll give you another little story, if I may.

You still, I lived in San Francisco for 30 years.

One day I'm driving down, going, taking the bus downtown and it's early morning, you know, commuter time.

I'm sitting in one of those sideways seats right behind the driver and it's very crowded and in front.

I didn't have to get up.

I'm in my 80s, you know, and the woman, young woman standing up and she's shaking every time the bus moves, you know, stops to bed and she can't reach there did the straps are all taken and she can't reach the pole in front of her to hold on to.

And I look and the guy next to me, he's got a briefcase on the floor in front of him.

And I realize and I say to him, excuse me, Sir, if you could put that briefcase on your lap, this young woman over here could take a little step forward.

She could reach that pole and be a lot safer.

And he looks at me and he says like, that's going to solve all the problems of the world.

And I said no, it's not.

But it will solve the problem in this little corner of the world.

All right.

He looks to the woman at her, his left, who must have been his wife.

She gives him a if you ever want sex again look better, put it on your lap.

He picks it up.

He puts it on his lap.

The young woman takes a half step forward, grabs the pole.

Our eyes meet.

We smile.

She's safer for the ride going off.

That's what we can do.

Yeah.

Little things.

Little things.

And.

We help and not only.

That, you know, the Tibetans teach that after you die, there's a, you know, justice holding the scale and you get a white Pebble for the good thing back for the for the bad.

They say if you do something good, you get a good Pebble, and if because of what you did, the person you did it to or 4 does something nice, you get another white Pebble even though you didn't know that they did it.

Wow, network marketing.

That's a good, great marketing network.

Exactly.

So, you know, it's like you've dropped the the, the the Pebble in the pool and it sends out ripples.

We do it here.

I may not be able to stop the war in Gaza.

I may not be able to stop the war in Ukraine, but I can make life better here in this little section.

And if the thing about that is Anton and I think.

You'll agree with me 100%.

When we reach that critical mass of people doing that little thing, wars will be gone.

That's that.

Is that going up the sea?

Star thing that I mentioned, it just makes sense, doesn't it?

It does it.

It's the the great.

You know, the, the, the Rupert Sheldrake, you know?

Yeah.

Yeah, you know whom you know.

We, when we think alike, when we realize that we are one that will make such a big difference.

And I don't have to compete.

I have to live my life in the best way possible.

And what is that?

I'll give you one other thing.

You called me in here.

You invited me.

You're stuck with me.

You got to hear my 3 rules of life.

All right.

Ready.

Rule 1.

Be happy rule.

Two, be kind.

Rule 3.

That's it.

If you're happy on the inside, you will be kind.

If you're kind on the outside, what else do you need, right?

That's the loving and being loved it.

Starts with self love.

Oh, absolutely.

Absolutely.

People who feel down on myself.

No, no, no, no, no, no.

70,000 thoughts.

A day?

Probably 347.

Eights of them are self deprecating.

Now if you can pause in a moment.

Reflect.

On when you're having those thoughts, manage your mind a little bit better.

Just stop thinking for a moment and then supplant that for the in breath I and the out breath M and just hit the pause button.

That's right, the rest your connected self will take over from there, right?

And your connected self exists at all times.

It's just that the other is so noisy.

The crazy world outside the thoughts, you know?

The 12 step approach is a beautiful way to separate from your thoughts.

You know, to I, I, I, you know I am not an alcoholic, I have a problem however raised, you know, to separate from your emotions.

These things are constantly changing, but the one thing that has never changed in your entire life is I am.

And it has no characteristics other than its self, the feeling of being and the feeling now that's the God participle that day I even.

I wrote a book.

The God participle, which is being It's me, just me and and when, When I be, then I'd be me, I'd be you.

I'd be all living things.

I'd be Mother Earth.

I'd be the universe.

I'd be.

That's another factor.

Mother Earth, right where?

Do we get all of our sustenance from it Comes from Mother Earth.

So what are we from that perspective?

We are Mother Earth embodied in a consciousness, exactly the kind the consciousness was.

It was.

Was in Earth to begin with, you know, so we are just little things that have grown up, you know, from grown, you know, little plants, little beings.

I don't know if we've grown up yet.

Well, no, we have.

We're still we're still in the in.

Seed form, you know, but but someday, someday hopefully, and the direction that you're going, the direction that you know, I'm trying to go, that we're all working on, this is the future.

If it isn't the future, then I'd hate to think you know what the future will be.

May show up at another planet somewhere else.

But look at it as as yes, we do have a choice.

We can annihilate ourselves, right?

Or we can adhere to natural order, which is an evolutionary process that we're engaged in and.

It has that natural.

Dynamics, right?

You're moving up the levels to that unity consciousness where we act and play and work as one.

And then maybe we'll get to, you know, like my book 0 to one that based on Cartesian scale, right?

When we can get to a type 1 civilization where we're using the planet's energy to sustain ourselves, well, that would kind of lead to that consciousness of oneness.

That's right.

I mean, no other.

No other.

Species is screwing up the planet.

I can't think of another species that's putting plastic in the oceans, putting fumes, gases in the atmosphere, you know, doing all of this stuff that that we made a mess and we can clean it up.

Because we have that capability.

You got the capability to make the mess, you got the capability of cleaning it up.

That's true.

Do we have the?

Desire to clean it up.

There it is, the point.

And I think that's a growing desire.

As the same with the consciousness, right, That we're looking at, OK, how do we be good humans, right?

You can, you can tell.

That, you know, if you're in a car and that it's accelerating very rapidly, you know, do I still have time to put the brake on?

Before I go over.

The Cliff you know, if you get too.

Close.

You know, if it becomes too late, then it's a problem.

We have to recognize that, you know, we, we still can control it.

We still can valuable because look at the acceleration rate with.

The, the learning and development that's happening with AI, right?

It just escalated.

We we were concerned about the information curve going almost straight up Now we're looping right?

Do you realize you?

Realize that when we were growing up, we knew that seeing is believing, right?

We were taught that, right?

That's no longer true.

I can see, you know, somebody saying something that they never said, that some they, I saw an image of Doctor, Doctor King doing a making a comment on something that occurred after he had died.

Obviously he had never said it, but it was his image and his voice.

How can we believe what we see anymore?

Yeah, well, and.

And you've got.

You know, I remember several years ago, what was that rap artist that they did a holographic projection of him for a concert after he'd been shot.

And and killed oh, oh, oh, oh.

02/2 pair.

Tupac, right?

Yeah.

Tupac Tupac his maybe it was a three POC right at that point what he but that technology we we can falsify so many things and one of the things that Howard Bloom put out in Lucifer principle had an interesting conversation with him that of course, I I didn't get recorded.

I just got deep quick.

He speaks of how a few people have manipulated entire populations through telling lies through a controlled media stream and getting people to believe that they're true.

Don't you find it fascinating to just to to?

Build on that that a couple months ago, the entire editorial staff of The Washington Post wanted to write a particular op op-ed peace.

op-ed peace.

Yeah, And one person, Jeff Bezos, said I don't want it.

And so it was.

Not done.

One person, but he happens to own the Washington Post, right?

That's not freedom.

That's not freedom, exactly.

We have to.

It's interesting.

I had a an insight as you were speaking here that this growth of AI is actually part.

Of the whole.

Problem.

But it's also going to be part of the answer because we have to accept and to recognize that it is paradox of life, right, It may seem.

To be bipolar and yet those two, it's like we have to launch, we have to.

Want to go in One Direction?

It can go either way.

We are constantly at a fork in the road.

Well, if we consider it like the Hasidic tradition, you got the 70.

Names of God, right?

36th grader, 36th lesser.

Well we see them as angels and demons, but what in fact is happening is 1 delivers the message and the other one tested.

Oh, I like that.

They're both.

Moving us toward the one that's.

The the paradox put into the.

One right, right and essentially becomes a Mobius strip.

Right, Either side is all the same.

That's right.

Right.

Evolution will will continue.

You know, thinking of continuing, man, we have just another.

Jet we had.

A wonderful.

Conversation that flew by.

How long have we been doing this?

Now we've been.

Over an hour.

Which is not uncommon.

You know, we could talk for hours, I'm sure.

I think I and we've eaten weeks.

We've eaten, knocked off our our cup of coffee, and here's to you, my friend.

And back at you.

I really thank you.

Anton, this has been a wonderful.

Conversation and I do hope that it continues offline and and who knows where this has been a really pleasurable conversation for me edifying my own life as well as your own and that's really what it's about right right.

It's nice to know that there.

Are other people who are with you that we're in this, we're, we're heading the same direction.

We can, we can hold, hold hands, spiritual hands, knowing that we're moving in that direction.

And the more people, as you say, when the tipping point is reached, then the entire, the entire species will evolve.

And that's the goal.

And I got the sense it's closer than what we might think.

I hope you're right, I believe.

Well, but you have to.

Believe it.

It's where you what you believe.

If you're heading to the mountaintop, look at the mountain.

You're right where you where you want to go, that's where you should focus.

I think it was Napoleon that said whatever the mind of man can think and.

Believe it can achieve and how true a statement absolutely right.

Well, thank you.

Very much for the honor of hanging out with, with, with me.

I thank you.

I appreciate it.

And it's been fun hanging out with you.

Yeah.

A couple of peas in a pod, right?

There you go.

And we'll catch you again, I'm sure sometime.

Maybe even over the ping pong table.

That could be true.

Very good.

So thank you so much and namaste and thanks for sticking with us for this episode of One World in a New World.

Again, please subscribe, strive, like, share, make a comment, start a conversation.

We'll be there with you.

I guarantee it.

Thank you so much.

I'm Zen Benefiel for Anton Gross and myself.

Have an awesome week and I'll see you next time.

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