Ay Va fam, it's your girl, Mandy Money.

Welcome to the wash Day.

Wou saw.

I have a very special guest for y'all today.

Her name is Lisa Cunningham.

Lisa is a visionary storyteller who's brought her creativity from directing thousands, hundreds thousands of chart topping music videos to producing campaigns that drive health equity.

As the head of marketing at the Black Women's Health Imperative and the director of a documentary called Me Period, Lisa is changing the way we tell stories about Black women's health.

And I'm just really honored to have you at Brown Ambition.

Thank you for having me.

I am honored.

You are a veteran in the podcast game, so thank you for having me on Geriatric Podcaster.

Although we talked about just owning our age, y'all may not know this, Lisa and I met, I don't know, three years ago.

Yeah, somehow, somehow.

Somewhere, in some divine chain of events, I ended up getting tapped to moderate a panel for Black Women's Health imperiod imperative?

Is it imperative?

Yeah, it's imperative because Black women's health is in fact imperative.

Now, this is an iconic nonprofit.

It is the oldest nonprofit in the US.

Yeah, that's focusing on health equity for black women and girls.

Absolutely, And when I got tapped to moderate this panel, I was nervous but ended up being such an incredible experience.

And through that process I got to meet you, Lisa, and you just had this energy, this aura about you that you were one of the people I remembered from that you know, that short but meaningful experience for me.

And then you know, you follow people and you follow their journeys and I was just like, oh, Lisa, Like, her style is amazing.

You can tell she has a toe with entertainment, but she's also such a huge health advocate.

And I saw that you had directed this documentary me period and You've got Tabitha Brown in it and Sir Lee Ralph, and I was like, this does it.

I'm tired of not knowing more about Lisa.

I'm gonna have her on the show.

And you are so gracious to say yes, So thank you, first and foremost, thank you.

So tell Brown ambition.

We're going to get into your career trajectory, but tell us what we need to know about Lisa today, Like what what's actually when you got cooking over there?

What are all the projects you're working on?

What?

What it's I'm working on myself every every day of my life, Like seriously, that's what I'm working on over here, and you know, making such a big pivot as time goes on.

I'm actually thinking about three point zero right now.

Right So it's just.

Like, how do you keep retranslating your life into you know, the next best version of you for that particular time.

In all honesty, that's what I'm working on right now.

I'm working on me.

Okay, so we might have a pivot.

Well, pivot sounds so like, but it's almost like so binary, like changing from this to that.

But I think that you, I mean, let's talk about your career, because I do think that you have done a wonderful job, just from an outsider's perspective, kind of harnessing all your talents.

And it's not like you.

Do one and only one thing and then that's the period when I'm only doing that thing and then I'm going to switch to something new.

Can you talk about how.

You've layered your career, you know, leveraging all of your different talents.

You know, because I was in the entertainment industry for most of my career.

And I'm dating myself right now.

Because I'm thinking back to the first paycheck I ever got was handed to me from Pebbles with La Face Records because I was on the site set of TLC's What About Your Friends?

WHA.

So you're not directing just any like this, you're directing like music videos in the nineties.

That was a pa I was the lowest on the total.

We're just can rite, okay, but this is, you know.

Nineteen twenty, you know, year old Lisa at that point twenty, I forget.

How old, but I was very young.

And I got that check and I used to kind of like scramble.

I was still in college and I got that check and I was like, I'm dropping out of school.

I just made one hundred dollars for one day work and that's it, Like it was over, and and that began this career that I am so grateful for.

I truly am.

I mean, when I look back at all of the people that I've gotten a chance to work with, from your Missy Elliott's to your Sierra's to your gladys Knights and all these different folks at different stages of that journey.

But I call my.

Pivot because I do agree with you.

I think the word pivot is so binary.

I call it the remix because I was in the entertainment industry and one of my favorite stories is that I used to be marketing director at our radio station Hot one O seven nine here in Atlanta, and we were doing some sort of promotion with with with Ryan Cameron, who was at the station at the time, and all of these acts, you know those those radio station events where all of the acts come to perform, And there was this newer act, a girl group, and they I actually I wasn't marketing director.

This is way before that.

I was working at a record company at the time, Itchabond Records, and I had brought a group that had one of the biggest songs out and so I was all excited, like, you know, this is like one of those things where you have that proud moment of like, my group's hotter than your group, right, So nodding, but.

I have no idea how that feels.

But yes, yeah, I had.

I had the hottest group out and so we're just waiting for our time.

So this girl group has to get up and they start doing their song and this crunk crowd in Atlanta is listening to them, and they're like, when I say no, no, and dead, crowd is dead.

And so somebody from their camp says, put on the remix, and here comes that beat, here comes white Flat, here comes the energy, and all of a sudden they had the crowd eating out of their hands.

They got off that stage.

I remember being introduced to Beyonce at that time, the young Beyonce, and I'll never forget that because it was the remix.

Had it not been for that song, we don't even know if we would have had Destiny's Child and Beyonce and in the version that they grew to.

And so I think about that so much with regards to my own life, because when I was twenty seven years into a career that I wanted to pivot from, I had to take some inventory in another way.

And so that concept of the remix, because sometimes in the remix you speed things up.

Sometimes a remix gets slowed down.

Sometimes you have to collaborate with a new individual.

So I was scared to get out of my little entertainment bubble because I felt so validated within that world.

But knew that I just wanted to use my gifts for some sort of social impact, and so how was I ever going to do that though, you know, if I didn't get it right in here?

And so my you know, shamelessly tracking back to brown ambition, you know, my ambition.

I had to get rooted in something though, So I had to take that ambition and say, okay, now what's my intention?

My intention is to give people aha moments from the content that I produce and have that content be something that is, you know, redeeming for our people.

And boy, it has been a damn journey.

So when was it, so you said, a twenty seven year career, So when did this pivot start to happen?

When did you start to think I'm ready for something different?

You know, it's so funny.

I was on the set of a music video.

And I really like to tell people this because we think of these things as like this epiphany and then my life changes, and no, no, no, no, this.

Was a slow process.

My dad died and the same week that my dad died, I will never forget I had directed Gucci Man's first few so icy don't go.

Back and look at that video y'all, it's got awful.

But anyway, I had directed that video and I remember then just being in a state, Mandy, and I'll just keep it real right now, emotionally, physically, spiritually, garbage, garbage.

You found out your father passed after you had completed the video or during this Yes.

After I had completed the video.

I found out.

I was literally in my producer's office and got the call to come to And I never at the time, I was such a bad human.

I never answered my mother's calls because I was always so busy.

Yeah, trash, right, And I something told me answer mama's call.

And my dad was in.

His last stages, and she said, you need to come now because they don't expect him to live through the day.

And I raced over there and was able to hold my dad's hand and he would pass away two hours later.

And there was.

Something about that moment of my dad's passing that began the process.

But it was a it was It still took many years for me to really sink into this better version of myself.

But I was on the set of of a of a Big Rappers video one day and he happened to also have a TV show on a broadcast network and we had it was all about gangs and drugs and guns.

And so he had all of these guns out and his family came in and the son was playing with the with the weapons and I'm not you know, everybody could do what they see best with training.

Raising their children, right, don't do that.

People don't don't do that, And so I was just it was that was my real AHA moment.

Like that was the day where I set it all in motion.

I was like, I've got to make a change, and so I'm going to start going about what does that look like.

And as soon as I set that real intention, Mandy, and this is what I need your audience to know is that I started listening for the signs to get out of my comfort zone so there would be an opportunity here to collaborate with somebody.

There would be an opportunity here.

And so that is what started me on that path.

But what I now know is that I didn't trust myself enough.

I didn't care about myself enough to make the remix.

Until I started doing those things, everything opened up.

You know, a little bit before we started to record, you said something that I thought was honestly refreshing to hear.

But you said I'm a reformed ask and then just now as you were talking about you know, your father and not wanting to answer your mom's call, talk to me about that.

It's refreshing one to just let that sit in the let that those words kind of sit hang in the air for a bit, because I wish more people could accept that, like have that moment where they're like, oh, I am not this is not right.

I am holding.

Myself accountable and then making some change.

So can you talk to me about yea, so think about that.

I say that if I if, hopefully I will write a few books, but the title of one of them will be maybe It's you.

And that's truly because I feel like all of our books are written for the victim, you know, they're not written for the air quotes narcissist.

I don't think I was a narcissist, right, because that's such an extreme clinical term.

But just I wasn't my highest self and write I need somebody to write the book for that person because I needed somebody to help me through my own I don't know what to how to pinpoint it in terms of you know, how I got out of it.

But I knew I know one thing for sure.

I decided to take baby steps, and each day, each month, that's what I would do.

I would envision myself constantly.

I would do this, envision myself talking to a different group of people than the people that I currently was talking to.

So I would take and then I would slowly start eliminating.

If I talked to ten people regularly that I knew were kind of toxic, I would just slowly start eliminating them.

I wouldn't answer the call.

If I had to answer the call, I would keep the call to five minutes.

I started assessing who brings out the worst in me?

Every time I talk to this person, I would gossip.

I am not a gossiper, So why is it that every time I talk to this person, I'm led down the path of gossiping.

So I started to just not, you know, quiet, quitting friendship.

Yeah, because what you don't want to do is that you don't want to upend your life and be so abrasive.

I don't think that works for everyone.

I don't think it works for most of us.

I think you have to kind of layer this thing so that your nervous system.

Other people's reactions to you.

Half of the people I quiet quit, probably ninety percent of them don't even know that I even did.

It, because of the.

Space and grace and the way that I did it, don't even know.

So are you.

I'm saying that you were realizing you were surrounding yourself with people that was kind of normalizing or letting you feel okay behaving the way you were behaving and acting the way you were acting.

Yeah.

Yeah, So part of it was realizing this is not right, and I need to stop associating or surrounding myself with people that normalize this kind of behavior, and that aren't, you know, giving off the energy or the vibe that I want to give off.

The entertainment industry can be.

I won't, I won't speak for everybody in it, but I do think that it can be a place where you can easily lose yourself, and so you have to do, like the Goodie Mob said, you know, fight to keep your spirit in mind throughout that industry.

Hey, ba fam, We're going to take a quick break, pay some bills, and we'll be right back.

And I applaud anybody who's able to stay in it and keep themselves and be the best version of themselves.

I remember I was.

Doing a video for what is now like one of the biggest rap artists groups out there, and we were shooting at the Fox Theater and nobody had ever shut down Peachtree Street and changed the marquee of the Fox Theater in Atlanta, like this had.

Never been done.

And we were waiting on them to come downstairs from the hotel that was right across the street.

We were waiting for hours, and I will never forget that feeling of why am I waiting right now?

Like what good and purpose is this product going to serve once they get down and once we film, and once we go to the next location, which was the Strip club, Like what value is any of this actually going to bring into the world?

So I am this upset right now, But I knew that there was no real substance or value that was going to come from that.

And that's when I start, you know, like I said, it was just this quiet you know, nope, And I would say my meditations, I would say my prayers, and I would just continue to ask God for the strength to just walk away, because I remember I used to do a journal entry that would say, right now, eighty five percent of my projects are entertainment industry.

Like I had clocked it, and I said, and I want it to be the reverse, and I want this to happen within a year.

But I had to accept some things about myself first.

And that is the real secret, I believe to the remix.

Because I did a video for the Atlanta Voice, this heritage newspaper in Atlanta, and they were turning fifty years old.

I believe I was tasked.

With doing this beautiful tribute video for them, and they were going to have a gala and the mayor at the time was going.

To speak at it.

And I'm in the car Mandy outside of this venue not wanting to go in.

Why because it was the first time I was presenting like a whole man in suit and I had never gone into a formal situation like that before.

As this you know, version of myself with old Atlanta in the building.

I don't know if your audience knows, right, there's New Atlanta and then there's old Atlanta.

That's a crowd of folks who may be a lot more judgmental.

I am in the LGBTQIA plus community.

I was born a woman, but I get called sir every day of my life.

I identify as a woman, and I didn't want to walk into that space where people would sit in judgment on and I got the courage to get out of that car.

And the editor of the newspaper, her husband, mister Washington will never forget this ever.

He walks up to me.

He's like, he's probably like a sixty five.

Year old man, and he said, first of all, I want to ask you, how do you identify I said, identify she her?

And then he goes, well, then, girlfriend, we just played your video.

And you did the damn thing.

What year was this?

This was only seven years ago.

He was fresh out that training.

I love that and think about the impact that had on somebody who was so frail and broken and didn't want to walk in the damn door.

And that moment was one of those pivotal moments in my life.

When I tell you every door I walked in I have walked in since that day, I have walked in with my head held high.

That's the person you met at CBC because of mister wash and or.

Make me get all emotional.

So you said you had to accept some things about yourself.

So were you grappling with your your sexual identity or how you presented yourself while you were directing?

And it sounds like you were in these like really intensely males like sexist yah, like the worst and worst of hip hop culture that you think about, the massogre noir and the you know, the over sexualization of black women, black female bodies and all the.

Most toxic parts of hip hop.

We love hip hop.

Obviously, like we're from Atlanta, like we we appreciate that culture, but it can be so so toxic for black women.

What were some of the challenges you would encounter.

Well, I think that you know, I'm glad you brought that up because I had to forgive myself.

I had to forgive myself about what you just said.

I was a part of the culture that was telling people, you know, do this and do that on camera, and so I had to forgive myself for all of that.

And I used to say that I'm trying to outrun my past.

I'm not I honor my past.

It's okay.

That was that version of me, and so that was a part of that healing journey, right forgiving myself.

And then in terms of my identity, I've always identified as a woman.

I like to I like to present on what people would call, you know, a more masculine presenting way.

And so that's y'all's problem, not mine.

I like to dress like this, you know.

But at that time I.

Was still look damn good.

Can we just say you look good and you carry it so well?

Thank you?

So that's I mean, that's you know, but that's that work we got to do on ourselves.

Because the moment I started accepting myself in.

My full glory, I can.

I can be honest with you.

I do not have people when they're really able to interact with me.

You know.

I don't have issues with folks.

I really don't.

So I'm blessed with that now.

Using the restroom in public, that's a difference.

You know, you're really you're I'm from Atlanta, I know.

We talked about that.

We both went to UGA different different classes.

Will say overlap.

I was there the year you were born.

I think, yes, you were there the year I was born.

University of Georgia BA FAM if y'all aren't familiar, it's the largest public university, is it the oldest public university in the country.

It's real old.

But the phrase pwy UGA invents that.

It was definitely like even when I went there, you know, some years after you attended University of Georgia.

It was I had a great experience because of the small pocket of black Uga that was able to lift me up.

But shit, you were going to campus.

You said you were going to class and they were marching on Robert E.

Lee's birthday instead of mlk's birthday.

Yes, yes, that's a real thing with cannons in full, you know, Confederate guard.

Yeah, only about twenty years after it was integrated by Charlene Hunter Gault too, that's right.

Yeah, what was your experience like at UGA.

Well, it was it's all a blur, right, because we had a lot of fun.

That's a party school, and I have some great, great memories from there.

And so because the black population, I think when I was there, it was like about fifteen hundred out of the thousands, But if you think of your average black college, that's you know, that's about how many people are at the entire college.

So it's almost like we had a university within a university.

Yeah, that's how it felt.

I went to so many differ high scho and I'm a mixed kid, like I grew up all over the place.

Never really felt really very very well rooted in my black identity and self love.

And yes, yes so by any means, I did not go to historically black college.

However, I agree within Uga, it felt like I was in a bubble, like I really cocooned myself in the bosom of my black friends.

Were you able to be out during that time in college?

No, No, I definitely I had boyfriends.

And you know, I did a ted X talk once where I talked about that transition of being able to come back to my home city during those years of Atlanta and Atlanta being a place of inclusion.

And I remember walking into this night club and I saw this tall person in thigh high go go boots on a platform dancing, and I was so mesmerized by this entire culture.

The first time I had ever been in a gay club.

And I would later find out that that was RuPaul Wow.

Okay.

And what people don't kind of understand is that those nightclubs were more like family reunions.

There was no other place where we gathered, right, So it seems it seems like, you know, real trivial, but it's it's really not.

And so that's where I started to kind of find my footing in the community and kind of transition, you know, out of you know, being this woman that I was, you know, culturally expected it to be.

But Atlanta definitely was a great city to be able to, you know, finally materialize into my full rainbows.

You know, I visit my brother, he's an East Atlanta village and all the kamalassigns and all the rainbow flags and all that, but it's still Atlanta, It's still Georgia.

Do you feel safe and do you feel supported?

I know you said you every day someone is questioning your identity and how you present, But what's it like for you?

Do you do you see both sides of it on a daily basis?

Yes, that's interesting, you would you would say that because there's this, right, there's that juxtafication right, And I think that most areas in the country are kind of like this, you know, where you've got this these different pockets.

So there's there is the pocket where I can be absolutely affirmed where I sit on the LGBTQ Advisory Board at the Mayor's and where you know, Atlanta is a city where the Human Rights Campaign gives us an extremely high rating.

And that's that's with regards to our you know, local government making sure that LGBTQ folks are protected from you know, regards to employment and housing and all of those things in public spaces.

So we live in that city on one end, but to your point, there's still a culture of folks that are very different.

And so yes, I have moments that when I walk outside of my door and I need to just simply do the most basic thing, mandy use the public restroom, And as soon as I get ready to walk towards that door at a movie theater or something like that, I'm immediately on guard and hesitant and dare I say, maybe even a bit of a panic attack, because I know that somebody as I emerge to that door might say you're not supposed to go in there, or even when I tell them I'm a woman, they say, no, you're not.

Or this part right here where I'm at the in the bathroom stall at the sink, and some parent has their daughter and they hold their daughter tight and they rush out.

This is what I have to experience.

I actually am executive producing a short film about that right now, because it is something that this is women doing this to women, hello, Right, because we always talk about what the brothers are doing to us.

No, no, no, no, no no, this is this is what women are doing to women because I am a woman.

So there's there is definitely you know, there's definitely two sides to the city of Atlanta.

Did you grow up in the church or in a religious household?

I grew up in a very religious Catholic household.

So when you say that you grew up in the church as a black person, that is not the church they're talking.

That was a.

Part of, you know, my shame, right because growing up Catholic and obviously that religion denounces you know, gay folk, and so yeah, I had to deal with that.

I had to deal with zero representation of not even one person on the television screen that looked like me.

So I didn't even see an example of hope youwhere, And so yeah, it was definitely a struggle to find the footing to understand my identity throughout all of those spaces.

Right, Because you did talk about the entertainment industry and how misogynistic it is.

And I saw a lot of my sisters, you know, have to play that game.

It's painful to see and to think back on.

I'll be honest about that.

Yeah, hey, ba fam, We're going to take a quick break, pay some bills, and we'll be right back.

You posted this on Instagram.

You had recently gone to the Sarah Jakes Roberts conference Women Evolve.

When you were telling that anecdote about the Atlanta Voice party and being afraid to walk in, you had a similar hesitation about going to Women Evolve.

Which Women Evolve is my mean?

Sarah Jake's Roberts is you know, this huge brand and has this huge community, and it's very rooted in like Christianity and like really religious.

That's that's my understanding of it.

Yeah, and you were invited as a speaker.

No, I had an activation there with our organization, the Black Women's Help Them Narrative and with Gilliad, And I was super excited about the activation, but I knew that I was gonna interact with a lot of folks who you know, had come to this conference and you know, some hyper religious people, and so yeah, that definitely gave me pause.

And I'm so excited that I pushed through that fear because that was probably one of the few moments I've had that, you know again, And I'm so glad that I pushed through it because it was a glorious experience and there were people who came up to me and literally affirmed me.

One woman said to me, I'm.

Glad you're here.

Oh you know.

So it's just like every time, And that's why I just want to keep saying to your audience, It's like, every time you make that leap through your fear, God, the universe will show you right, Fere's a sign.

Okay, I would have held my breath on your behalf if I knew you were walking into that space.

That's really comforting.

And I mean, I don't think either of us is saying that, like things are perfect and rosy and we're in such a dangerous time for the LGBTQ, you know, ia plus community and in a lot of ways.

But at the same time, two things can be true.

And I'm so happy to hear that you're getting the embrace that you deserve in some rooms.

And my sister I've talked about she's married to a trans man and I've seen him through his transition.

I mean they've been together for shit more than half my life.

They're like the the most romantic, happiest love story in our family.

And we were not the most hospitable.

We were not hospital at all towards the time.

Wow, there's the general lack of knowing how you're going to be perceived when you walk in or if you're going to be safe, you're going to be embraced like that, that level of anxiety I've heard them talk about and hearing you talk about it, and just I'm glad to hear that that's not always the case.

That you are walking into rooms where you're embraced.

You're so embraceable this Lisa that I have had the pleasure to know.

But you know, but I think that that that level of you know, getting getting to that point in my life where I can be fully embraced and even if I'm if I'm not like in the bathroom scenarios, you know, I kind of don't hold it in my heart right from this resentful perspective, I understand, I, you know, try to give folks grace, and I think we need a lot more grace in this world today.

I just I just do all of these you know, other ring, the other ring of society is something that is very dangerous.

And hope that we can turn this thing around.

So we got to get out of our internet silos and get.

Yeah and mixing.

Yeah, you know, And that's why I just love.

I love the aspect of my life as a filmmaker because I love getting people into a room and letting them talk about potentially things that they've never spoken on before, right, and then being able to uncover and give real information to folks that's rooted in facts and make it digestible.

I mean, these this is what I like.

Wake up in the day and I'm like, hey, get so hype about because once again, accurate information, community, all of these things, getting outside of our silos, all of.

These things will help us to heal.

And you said you're producing or working on a film about the bathroom experience.

Let's talk about I mean, what a masterful and beautiful, you know story of your career and how you took all those all those incredible creative skills and marketing and film direction and production and you are now using those forces for good, you know, And talk to me about making that transition into the nonprofit space.

You ended up with Black Women's Health Imperative.

You've been there now for how many years?

It's so funny, five years.

I kind of just started working with the organization as a contractor and then kind of back and forth.

Okay years.

You know.

It's like it's like putting your baby tow in and then coming back out.

And it's an organization that, even when I'm not there anymore, my heart.

Will always be rooted in it because of our founder Billy Avery, who is eighty seven years young, still a major factor in our organization, and she actually is the impetus for me creating the film me period.

She created a documentary back in the eighties called on Becoming a Woman.

I saw it on the Black Women's Health Imperatives YouTube page.

And I was like, what is this?

And then I go on Beyonce's Internet to see if anybody had ever done it.

Maddy, nobody else had made anything like this, and so I was like, you know what, if we can get some funding for this, let me try to make this film.

And then, unbeknownst to me, the president at the time, Linda Gohler Blount, had actually made that promise to Billy that we would eventually make this film one day.

So you know, for those who don't know me, Period is a film where we brought together real world women.

So I brought together a set of those folks in Atlanta, and then we went out in la and filmed Tabitha Brown and Cheryl Lee Ralph who are also real world women there, but they just happen to be celebrities.

It is a love letter.

It is a love letter to young people, to mothers.

I believes it was done with so much intention and love about dispelling myths.

The amazing aka Period doctor on social media, doctor Charis Chambers led us through a lot of that film.

But what I saw is that women are parenting with a lot of trauma, a lot of misinformation.

They were looking for the information.

It was just beautiful to see how much they shared.

You know, in this sexual assault came up.

I mean, we could have not predicted that, and we had a therapist on hand to handle that using my powers for good Mandy, Oh my gosh, So.

You're making the documentary so me Period, it's what does it actually cover?

This is an independent documentary, so we can't really see unless we go to a screening right.

Have made it available from a limited standpoint and I can share the platform with you.

But it is on Kinema with a K like cinema and you can put in the movie me period and you can view it.

So you're making this film, so the documentary, are you interviewing mothers and daughters about coming out, like getting their period, coming into that?

Okay, so we're talking young women, So that makes perfect sense.

I mean Tabitha Brown, you know, and SHIRLEYE.

Ralph are like America's moms in some ways black black women's moms, I should say.

So what can we expect or what's like the synopsis of the documentary or it is?

It is really where and we have a discussion guy that goes with this and a caregiver's toolkit because what we really want is to arm our caregivers and parents, arm our mothers with the resources to be able to have a young person in your life and take them through that process of their first menstruation and set them up for success with their whole reproductive health journey and health journey for the rest of their lives.

Because what we find is that you know, oftentimes if you're stigmatized at that point, right, you're not my little girl anymore.

Even though girls are so damn young now that they're getting even period at like eight nine years old, trying.

To get rid of that stigma and then from there arm them with the ability to embrace their health journey and pay attention to their health so that as they get older.

We know that black and brown folks have you know, a higher instance of a lot of different things by broid, pcos, different things.

So imagine if you're tracking properly, you're paying attention to your body, you're empowered when you go to see your physician, you know how to talk to your physician.

Doctor Chambers in the film says, you know, my favorite thing is when I come into a session knowing that I am the expert in medicine and you are the expert in your body.

And when these two experts can come together, that's when we get the best outcomes.

So, I mean, that's the gist of what that film is promoting.

I'd love nothing better than for everyone with a young person, you know, as young as as young as five to watch, you know, and younger to watch that film so that they can see how to prepare themselves for that journey.

And if you've got a young person in your life, it might be your sibling.

You might be the older sister you can watch it.

You may be the father.

We included fathers in the film.

They're a part of it too.

So do you hear from fathers in the documentary as well?

And are they like having conversations with their little girls?

Yeah?

Yeah.

This one father said that he after she got it, he had a conversation with her and the mother was like.

You did, and he was like, yeah, I did.

And so it's just that kind of revelation that this everyone in the family kind of can be involved in our own health journeys.

I mean, we have to normalize men taking their health serious as well.

Right, So when you destigmatize it, you need to destigmatize it for everyone.

And that can get us to a whole health journey for families because we've got we've got to understand that there is a system that's broken, all right, So we know that, we know that we need to deal with physicians who don't deliver the standard of care that our folks need.

We know that and we're working to change that.

But the reality is, until that's changed, there are some things that we can do ourselves, and that's what I advocate for, and that's what the Black Women's Health Imperative advocates for.

On a day to day basis.

The work couldn't be more important than it is.

Now.

Can you talk about what kind of impact this work has had so far?

And like, what are the big themes or issues that y'all are focused on right now?

What should we as black women understand about the landscape of health and reproductive health right now?

Well, I think that, you know, I've been thinking about this a lot with regards to you know, and like I said, we're every day we are as an organization out there, you know, doing research that includes us.

We just had a press release come out where we've partnered with the Morahouse School of Medicine for breast cancer and cervi cancer study.

Right of once again our folks.

We're constantly, you know, trying to get policy passed for once again our folks.

So we're doing all of those things.

On that on that end.

But when you when you when you ask kind of what we can do, you know, I like to think of it like this.

I like to call women we're the chief health officers of our family.

So we're we're typically the one that schedules the doctor's appointments, right.

We're we're the ones who cook the food a lot of times.

And not to put that whole pressure on us, but as a chief health officer, we also get to delegate.

We also get to say, hey, partner, maybe you need to do this for for our whole health of our family, and maybe you need to do this.

And then it's also about extending that message out to our commune unity.

So for us, you know, we really are focused on chronic disease prevention.

I mean that is really is.

We are at critical mass with regards to obesity in this country.

We need to understand that obesity is in fact a disease and there are many.

Tools in the toolkit to help you deal with that.

But we can't just act like a magic pill can save the day, right we can't.

You mean, Serena Williams says, all you do is inject my bicep with whatever she's saying it.

You can't just act like a magic pill can save the day.

We believe that.

That there is a space for those therapeutics, you know, we believe that I personally believe that right.

I believe that some people choose bariatric surgery, and that's another tool.

There's many tools in the toolbox, but when you start from the premise of lifestyle change and dealing with how can how we can deal with our system in terms of the food we put into our bodies, of the amount of sunlight we get, or the amount of sleep, I mean just sleep alone, it's so huge to potentially how it can impact our health.

And so I understand that people live in food deserts.

I understand that people don't have green spaces, and so we have to kind of look at these things.

We call those in the health industry the social determinants of health, like these are things outside of kind of your control that are in your environment.

So then we have to figure out how can we help our folks through that, And that's a lot of what our organization does.

We have a wonderful program sponsored by the CDC called the Change your Lifestyle, Change Your Life Program, and it helps you to prevent or manage your chronic diseases like diet type two diabetes.

In my in my late thirties now and I have two children.

All I always thought I was going to be like different.

This was my ego, This was my my millennial snowflake energy.

I was bringing.

Kidney disease, diabetes, you know, heart issues.

My grandma died fifty six, and so many members deal with chronic you know, conditions and obesity, and it just runs rampant.

And I was like again thinking I'm a snowflake and I'm going to do mazumba and I'm going to eat healthy.

And that I know better than you.

And let me tell you, I didn't have these two kids, got a little got a little bout with postpartum depression.

And anxiety, yes, a pandemic.

Later starting a business, trying to be a black woman in this world, and why don't you know here I am dealing with these My body is like showing me that these it feels like they are these these like I don't know, something sneaking behind me, like something like in the closet that that's just trying to like get in, come get me.

Like.

So that's the thing called epigenetics.

I want you to look that word up.

Say it again, epigenetics.

Right, yeah, you know I'm not a clinician, so I don't want to get too deep into that terminology.

But it's basically it's.

In our DNA, right, So you're fighting you're fighting all of the trauma, the health trauma.

You're fighting that health trauma in your DNA.

But I got news for you.

You can get you can push through that.

One of my favorite phrases is it ran in my family until it ran into me.

I'm gonna send you that shirt.

Doesn't it suck being a millennial.

I know you're a gen xer, but god damn, it just feels like millennials.

We have to fix everything that's wrong.

We have to heal a generational trauma.

Nope, my elders can't really help me.

And like, I'm doing it for the youths, but we I just want a moment for the millennials because I think we have a lot on our show.

There's to be better.

Than you all do.

Anybody who knows me knows that I love the generations.

I love the generations.

You know you're not watching on YouTube.

You need to be watching on YouTube if you need to see Lisa as she's telling you this, because I'm telling you.

If they did a black version of the Age of Adelaide with Blake Lively.

We don't say her name.

They need to cast Liez to Cunningham because you're giving I'm twenty two years old, maybe twenty five, maybe twenty five, maybe you.

Just got out of grad school.

Well I am.

I am fifty five years old and proud to say it.

But you've gotten to if you're so wise, because you've lived all these different decades.

But the reason why I go back to.

Saying that I embrace this kind of generational aspect of things is that I've learned to kind of take the good of the different worlds right.

And so I've got baby boomer sisters.

And my sister on the road to sixty five, she had always been, as we say in our community, heavy set her whole life, and I me thicker than a snicker, right, found whole life.

And she said, on the road to sixty five, that's just not That's not how I'm gonna end up.

My sister lost sixty plus pounds two years on the road to sixty five.

She made it.

So what'd that do for me?

I said, Okay, game on.

So we talked through some strategies together as a family, and she helped me to get to what is now seventy pounds down.

So I feel you.

When I saw you, Yeah, when I met you three years ago, I was in the grips of what you're talking about right now, and I put something in motion through baby steps, and this was my journey.

So, like I said, not to vilify anybody who needs a GLP one or anybody who chooses surgery.

I did it naturally.

Continue to do it naturally every day because I realize that I did not.

I did not sign up for this addiction that America gave me.

And it's real.

It is a real thing.

It is built into the DNA of our food, unfortunately, and so I've had to, you know, figure out how to get through that.

And it's a daily struggle.

Though Mandy, it's a little easier for me because I didn't have those things.

So it's a it's a it's a little you know, I was partnered, but I didn't have you know, the young child and cooking of this different food, and the partner who wants you know, the unhealthy you know, right there in my physical space.

This is brown ambition, right, And we don't shy away from conversations around career strategy and money.

And I'm wondering for you, did you have any like sticker shock moving from the entertainment industry to you know, you said you started contracting a nonprofit.

Now you've been in this world for a while, Well, how have you managed your fight?

Has anything changed with the way you've managed your money?

Absolutely not transition.

Yeah, So, you know, when you're in the entertainment industry, and I was successful in that industry, I took I took a bit of a break, and a lot of people don't realize this because I wasn't very public about it.

I was caregiving for my mother.

My mother had cancer, she was having you know, dementia.

All of the things started surfacing, and you know, I was the single, no children child, and I was honored to caregive for her.

And through that process, I was already shedding those layers of you know, kind of different financial, you know, comforts.

And I think, you know how the entertainment industry you have extreme highs and lows.

You'll be balling out of control week and then like wait a minute.

So it was always this kind of roller coaster ride.

But I think that when I set the intention and motion and the thought of turning down jobs, it started because I was caregiving for mother.

So it wasn't even you know, this new work.

It was just I couldn't leave the house.

So that was the was the financial strain physically being having to be attached to the house.

And how long was that period?

For oh my gosh, years years.

So people would see me out because I would do these cameo appearances and even when I met my partner at the time, she thought I was this jet setting person, right, So I would be out for fifteen thirty minutes at a time and race back to Mama because somebody would be with her and I would be dressed at the affair, keep it moving, and no nobody even knew that, you know, that month, I might have made, you know.

A thousand dollars because I just couldn't work.

And so that actually started where I was able to transition into the nonprofit space a lot, you know, a lot easier because I had already gone down to next to nothing, and it's it's been a glorious ride to get back to this point where I feel so you know, secure financially, but fulfilled personal.

And I know that's the space a lot.

Of us are trying to get to and so I just want to tell everybody to keep swimming because ten years ago I couldn't see myself today.

But I just you know, the baby steps.

Yeah, ten years ago.

You're in your mid forties.

I know we have listeners.

I mean our listeners age range from like twenty five to fifty five, but we have a very healthy listenership.

Shout out to my forty plus my fifty plus BA fam.

I know they need to hear what you're saying because a lot of and I'll get coaching clients too, are in mid forties and you feel at that stage like maybe you have been doing their version of the music video industry and like you know, and not feeling fulfilled and is it too late?

Can I make a change you?

I mean, just to break down your career path.

I mean you go from like the entertainment space obviously the ups and downs of that.

Then you start to like contract and freelance.

It sounds like and just doing like, you know, similar to what you're doing in the entertainment industry, doing folle off projects.

But then you transition to what's now a full time role.

What was that like for you?

Was it scary?

And like how did you even negotiate a salary because at this point you've been doing one off projects.

What was that like for you if you don't mind sharing, Yeah.

I think that.

You know, Fortunately for me, I will say, the Black Women's Help Imperative we're a national organization, right, so we're not talking about a grassroots nonprofit.

So fortunately for me, they had a budget, not with the reserves of the American Cancer Society or anything like that, or even the NAACP.

But when you do talk about a national nonprofit, you're really talking about, you know, a different pay scale at that point.

So I was.

Blessed to not have to, you know, worry about my lifestyle from that perspective.

But I did give up some things.

And you know, the if you look at what's going on right now November of last year to today, the world has turned upside down once again.

Right we went through COVID, it was unprecedented times.

Now we're in unprecedented times again, which which are creating so many financial tail spends for people, especially black.

And brown women.

And so we've heard the statistic about three hundred thousand black women losing their jobs and what have you.

So I think for me, I'm I'm grateful to be able to have that sort of stability, and a stability that didn't have me, you know, kind of compromising my lifestyle.

But I mean, I live pretty simple though.

That's that's the thing.

That's another thing.

I just I just live pretty simple lifestyle.

Inflation will kill you.

Today.

I was like, okay, Lisa, you could cut out subscriptions, and so I did take a lot of inventory on subscriptions and didn't realize I get did like twenty five subscriptions.

I mean things that range from six ninety nine to things that range from to one hundred and forty nine ninety nine.

So that was definitely helpful to take.

Inventory of because you just don't pay attention what's coming in and out.

You know, of your bank account on a monthly basis, like that with regards to subscriptions.

Yeah, that's one of my success stories, getting my subscriptions in check.

I could do it.

I could do an audit every month because it's insane.

I subscribe for hairdel because that's the only way to buy it.

I'm like, do I really need to subscribe?

I don't know if I'm gonna need this in six more months, but it's good hairtel Oh the subscription economy, my god, by the way, join our Patreon.

Oh yeah, I will.

I'm part of the problem.

You can join for freedom.

Then I'm a bit of a philanthropist, so you know, I also had to assess.

That was another hard decision for me.

I did have to assess, you know, my monthly giving.

So I did go.

I did take that down a bit.

Yeah, what about retirement savings?

Were you setting aside any nest egg who was teaching you how to start that?

When you were an entrepreneur it were solopreneur.

Nobody, zero body, you know.

I started listening to you all and getting nuggets here and there.

I remember when I did pay for a Budgeanista course and things like that, you know, for credit repair all of that.

Yeah, because it was a mess.

It was just an absolute mess.

Because you that industry, you just live by the seat of your pay Attie.

And I never forget.

I used to.

I used to joke with my partner.

We would always I would be like, my.

Credit score just got raised by this, and and then next week and you know, next month it was by this, And She's like, girl, catch up because mine's mine's like seven eighty already, So.

We're we're okay, all right, don't need to be annoying about it exactly.

Yeah, but it was definitely motivation.

And that gets back to what I said much earlier in the conversation, right, it's about having those people around you that bring out the what the best?

So is that how I got invited to the CBC by y'all?

Did y'all did you listen to Brown Ambition before?

Of course?

Oh?

Well thanks?

I so.

Now okay, so you weren't really setting aside for retirement.

How have you been catching up?

Yeah?

I mean I've been touching up best I could.

And I literally that's so interesting.

Just signed up for some like real financial planning.

Just now.

Oh okay, keep you post it, keep you posted on that.

Yeah, I'm excited.

Yeah, it was Listen, we have to give grace to ourselves.

And there's so many seasons of life, and like I made the best financial choices when I was twenty four with no kids.

Let me tell you, the last five years adn't broke every rule I talked about.

Life is laving.

What do you want me to do?

We just got to give grace, got to give grace and I'm very happy for you to hear that you're going to get some professional help.

We deserve, we deserve, we deserve.

Health is our birthright, but it encompasses all the different areas of health right, mind, body, spirit, finances go right, all of that hand in hand.

So health is our birthright.

We have to stop.

I love I never forget watching a Lisa Nichol's YouTube on money and it was just it just is so powerful because she just talks about our relationship with money and we just have to have a better relationship in order to get to that healthy side of it.

Yeah, definitely, having financial freedom, it brings out the best in everybody.

It does, especially when you're able to achieve that by doing such a great work like you have.

Lisa.

I so appreciate you joining me a Brown ambition and getting to know more about you.

It's been such a treat.

It's been such an honor to get.

Now I want to do the reverse.

Now I want to have you on my podcast.

So I literally am about to launch.

I did it as a pop up podcast a few times, and so now I'm going to do both pop up podcast mixed with a traditional format and see what we got.

The brand is called take what you Need, so we'll see.

Take what you Need?

Okay.

I love that?

All right, Lisa, I wish we had more time.

I want it.

Will you come back sometime or can I see you next time?

Moment, next moment at Lanta.

I'm gonna hit you up, yes, because I'm just like that Kiki Palmer Sierra, like I need to see more of you.

I have not stopped thinking about this conversation.

It's so good.

Thank you for your vulnerability, your transparency or candor and sharing your light with Brown Ambition.

Now tell us we're gonna go watch this documentary.

We're gonna get a link I can put in the show notes.

Yes, yay, I'm so excited.

We can post, we can tag it.

What do you need from us?

Put us to absolutely spread the word about this documentary.

It's called me Period and just share it, share it in the group chat.

You can go to meperiod dot info and that'll get you there.

But we'll put it.

In the in the link and we'll get the first guide you mentioned that comes with that as well, and then we can find you at Lisa Cunningham on Instagram.

I am Lisa Cunningham on Instagram and.

Then we're going to check you out on your podcast.

It's called fake what you Need, Take what you Need.

I love that's another good book title.

We'll have you back when you're promoting your book because that's just the duh.

Of course is happening.

Of course.

Thank you so much, Lisa.

Take care all RIGHTBA Fan, I will see you next time.

Bye, okay va fan, Thank you so much for listening to this week's show.

I want to shout out to our production team, Courtney, our editor, Carla, our fearless leader for idea to launch productions.

I want to shout out my assistant Lauda Escalante and Cameron McNair for helping me put the show together.

It is not a one person project, as much as I have tried to make it so these past ten years.

I need help, y'all, and thank goodness I've been able to put this team around me to support me on this journey.

And to y'all, BA fam, I love you so so so so much.

Please rate, review, subscribe, make sure you're signed up to the newsletter to get all the latest updates on upcoming episodes, our ten year anniversary celebrations to come, and until next time, talk to you soon via bye