Welcome to at Home with Kelly and Tiffany, where we share powerful tools, exciting education, and relatable views about holistic health, physiological birth, and thriving in the female body.

We are home birth midwives in sunny San Diego.

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Now let's dive into today's show.

Welcome back to the at home with Kelly and Tiffany podcast.

And today we are getting personal.

We have an ask us anything episode, which is always a joy to do with you.

'cause sometimes I'm not always surprised by your answers, but sometimes I am.

And it's fun also just to like, share different sides of our lives with people And so it's kind of fun to connect on a different level.

Yeah, I mean like I appreciate the opportunity to like mix it up a little bit topic wise and I think that like, I think that we're rather like open about just our experiences as women in our lives so that we can create relatability.

And I think that's why, I think that's why we do the pod.

I think that's a part of why we do the podcast and it's fun'cause we get to.

Thread some of those pieces throughout episodes that have nothing to do with us, but we end up getting so many questions just about us personally that I'm like, okay, let's just bust out an entire episode that is just about non-professional pieces.

However, you can't take the midwife out of the lady, let me tell you.

There's.

So many questions about birth and work and stuff still, so, we'll, still, it'll still be relevant.

We're not gonna, oh, there's a lot of things we could talk about, but to ice break us.

Kelly Pappas.

Tell me if you can, this is, this is one, this is out there, but I'll tell you the, I'll tell you the reason later that I was thinking about this.

Tell us a topic that you know nothing about.

Truly.

You have like, no.

Extra information about this particular topic but that you could totally bs your way through a conversation about it.

And you might not be in a conversation with another expert who would recognize that you don't actually know what you're talking about, but you could with the average person talk about this thing just because you, like there's some adjacent knowledge or something like that.

Yes.

I'm just envisioning like being at a party and getting in that conversation with somebody and you're like, what am I doing here?

Like, who do I know here?

How can I get outta this conversation?

And so one's kind of hard for me, but I, is somewhat random.

I'm gonna go with cryptocurrency.

So technically it's not that I don't know anything about it.

I have the most minimal baseline knowledge of like the idea of what it is my husband enjoys that, years ago, got into cryptocurrency and so I, I generally have an idea that it is a thing, but I don't understand it But I have had people, because my husband for a while was like talking about it with like a few friends and their wives would be like, oh, so what is this about?

And I'm like, So, you know, answering their questions, but I'm like, I don't.

I'm saying right now may not be true or it has like the general ethereal idea of it, but if I, you ask me to give you details, I have no clue whatsoever.

But I think I could actually carry on a conversation about you know, digital currency and alternative coins and all kinds of weird stuff like that, makes me think we're living in like an alternate universe because it's just a weird.

Weird topic in general, but I bet you weren't expecting that to be my answer.

I wasn't, but I can't tell you what I was expecting because even when I was thinking about this for myself, so it did, that is what happened to me.

I was at a party and I got stuck with somebody who wanted to talk about something that I knew nothing about, and they didn't have the social awareness to realize that.

I was not interested in this topic, but I had, I felt the social responsibility, and I don't always feel this way.

Sometimes I'm just like, yeah, sorry, I don't.

Yeah, I'll just change the subject or whatever.

But for whatever reason, I decided we were just gonna go with it, and all it took was me just asking some questions with the tiniest bit of understanding that I thought that I had about it.

It was sports related.

So of course, like I really do not understand, I do not actually understand how sports work, but I have enough people in my life who have thrown out some words and terms and stuff that I can, I can ask questions that make it sound like I do know or I am interested.

And I think I have just enough reflective listening skills, probably just from being a midwife that.

I, I think I can go a pretty long time in a conversation just reflectively listening and adding in some pieces here and there to like fake my way through a conversation with somebody.

I know it's made that really made me think about that.

But I feel like I think people want us to have like a lot of knowledge about other medical things because we're in a medical field and so I think that that's another example where I can.

Where I'm like, oh, you think I understand orthopedics?

That's really interesting.

I.

I could just say I have absolutely no idea and I, I'm not interested in talking about this with you.

Or I could just ask some questions and just think about the time my friend broke her arm, or when I broke my foot, or the x-rays my kid got for her.

Kneecap situ, you know, and then you just start to pull all these little pieces where you're like, actually, I, I could, I could have a conversation about this right now with a little bit of what I know, and you clearly wanna talk about that so I can help string that, string that along.

Cryptocurrency, Kelly.

Okay.

It's a, it's a weird one, but it does, it does kind of remind me like just that whole thought train of how helpful it is sometimes like I feel like we get into conversations and we just wanna talk, right?

Like, or we're like, I wanna talk about this.

And so like, that's what this, that's where this conversation is going.

And of course, like it's great to have the back and forth of, to be with somebody that you're actually like.

I enjoy you and I know you and we can go wherever we want with this conversation, but how sweet it is when you're like building community or meeting new people or whatever, just to be like, yeah, I don't, I don't, maybe I don't really connect right off the bat with you or I don't understand really what you're talking about, but like I do know how to ask questions and I do know how to pull from my own life experience to be able to be like, can we find some kind of connection and can I help you feel seen in this situation too?

And all of that.

So.

Anyway, that was like a good little question reminder for me.

Yeah, I'm sure it's relatable.

I don't know.

There seems to be like, I mean, this episode's being recorded.

In the summer still?

I don't know.

I can't remember when it's gonna release, but I feel like it's a more social time.

I feel like there's more opportunities for socializing probably this, and then like around the holidays, there's just more things going on and you end up, you end up, I guess, you know, we could get into a whole thing too about like where you're at in your cycle as you endeavor into social situations could potentially guide you in how you are able to interact and respond.

Hundred percent.

Okay.

But today we are diving into a couple of personal questions, Kelly and Tiffany questions.

We,

We

pulled our audience on Instagram and I was, I thought I was really clear, Hey, we're gonna do an episode.

It's all, you know, ask us the personal things, not the professional things.

I even gave some examples like.

Work life balance, homeschool and family lifestyle things, right?

Like, just to be really clear, and then people were still asking us for medical advice about their personal medical things.

I love, I

I was like, no, not not personal question, not your personal situation.

So good.

Yeah.

Not personal

So.

about you on our podcast.

Okay, great.

If it was just one or two, I'd be like, oh, they misunderstood, or they don't, they're not paying attention.

But like several people were like, please talk more about VBACs.

Please talk more about endometriosis.

I'm like, well, I don't have experience with either of those things.

So those are, that's not a personal question for me or Kelly.

So the whole idea behind this, this concept of course, is that we are often answering other people's questions.

We're often providing context and education and information for people and what they're going through.

And I think, like, I think

think we

we like to show up in per, in a personal way, inside of.

Different spaces.

And I think Instagram is a great place for us to do that, but it's not always appropriate to be talking about ourselves constantly.

So, so Kelly, do not hold back.

This is our chance in this episode to make it all about you all about you.

this is

We wanna be trying to,

True dream.

My absolute dream in life.

Make

it's, it's, I know we, well, you know what?

We probably should have divided this into two episodes.

We probably should have done a personal questions for Kelly, personal questions for Tiffany, and we'll have to di we'll dive into that later after this one runs its course and see, but.

We,

we ha we also got a lot of questions'cause it just comes up and I did invite the work life balance concept.

I did invite women to ask questions about that too.

And we talk extensively about those things in a whole series because we get questions about how we became midwives and midwifery school and how we started our practice and how we balance work as a mom or birth worker.

And so you guys can go to the show notes and.

Capture the link to these episodes.

It's 124 to 126, and we'll answer some of those questions today because it's just a part of, I mean, that's evolving that, that we did that series maybe like two years ago or something, and so potentially there's something, you know, different to share today about some of those things.

So we'll, we'll answer some of those, but if you're really curious about that part of our lives and us talking about that extensively, we have those episodes for you guys to.

Jump into but the questions for today, I, since it's all about you, Kelly, all about you, the very first question that I have for you is what's your favorite thing about working with me?

It is, it is never really all about me, is it?

No, I'm just kidding.

My favorite thing about working with Tiff.

And like generally speaking about having this partnership with like, my best friend to be able to do this work, to be able to live life outside of work to go through life just together, both professionally and personally is like the sweetest thing for sure.

The work part of it, I will say like, so when we're at births and doing the clinical work or even in, you know prenatal appointments or something together.

It's the knowing and the comfort that I can, we can communicate just through like a expression or like a quick meet of the eyes that I feel like we're able to say things without having to say them out loud.

And just that familiarity and that level of comfort when doing this kind of work is incredible because we don't have to mess around.

I mean, sometimes we do, but we don't have to mess around with saying a lot or, you know, interfering with what somebody is doing because we're struggling to know what the other person needs or whatever.

There's certainly a time to explain very clearly what you need, but a lot of just the, the life that we do together within our work is just, feels really familiar and safe.

And that's just I, I don't think I, I wouldn't wanna do this without that.

Like, I just, I wouldn't.

I know after you experience a partnership that just go like, really, you know, jives Well, I, everything else would be a compromise.

Like, I would be so hard pressed to do something different.

It would be really difficult for me to be at a birth regularly with another

Mm-hmm.

And Ha And not just the work of having to relearn somebody else's.

Thinking patterns and mannerisms and like, you know, decision making processes and stuff, because that's worth it.

That's worth putting it in, but just the.

Comfort of knowing you personally and having you at my side Personally, it makes me feel safe.

It makes me feel covered.

We've had birth before that are going so fast and only one of us arrives, you know, before the baby's born, and I'm just, every time you walk in to that situation.

I'm instantly relieved.

It's just like, oh, my person's here.

Even if it's postpartum, even, you know, just like, oh, my person's here.

But I don't want that to discourage.

I, I know that some people look at our relationship and they see.

How, oh, I could never get that.

What are the chances that I would be able to work with another midwife who I like so much that I get along with that I want, that we have, you know, that we're aligned on so many pieces and I don't want someone to compare themselves to.

To us and think like, oh, I'll never be able to have that.

I think it's still worth putting yourself out there and being vulnerable in a partnership, and compromising in a partnership and serving in a partnership and not thinking all the time about everything you have.

Like, oh, if I, if I work with somebody else like that, then I have to give up.

This, this, this, and this.

And not look at it so much like, like that, but, but look at it like, how can you be a part of the team?

How can you serve well in that?

And if you both have that perspective then there's something like really beautiful that can come outta that.

But I was just telling somebody our story.

For the first time, someone that I'm just getting to know who is like, oh, tell me more about like your, you know, your work partner and stuff.

And it's so funny for me to go through the story of like, oh, well we didn't really start out as friends.

And they're like, how is that?

Like how, how have you not always like been friends from birth?

You know, like just because our friendship is so deep and like so profound and such a huge part of our lives.

And I just love remembering that.

I love remembering that like.

We did not purposeful, we did not set out to be best friends.

It just was how it, how it went.

And I know that we've shared that recently.

How that happened through some of the birth stories that we've told here over the past few months has been the piece that like has shaped that being in a really vulnerable situation and sharing that with somebody else.

It just, how could you not.

Hmm.

Amen.

Yeah, I think it, it is helpful to remember too, we will get to other questions in a moment, but we came together with a similar idea of like, can we do this midwifery thing differently?

Together.

Can we figure out a way to serve people in a way that feels right for us and also honors our family and is just not something that we've been shown through the community that we've seen so far.

What can we do to do something differently?

And that's really what started bringing us together is our desire to be like, okay, I see what I see and I don't, I don't necessarily wanna be a part of that.

I wanna do something a little different.

And then it just kind of snowballed from there, which is, which is super sweet.

And again, we have a whole three part episode where you can go back and listen to lots of stuff about.

Partnership and midwifery school and all of that kind of good stuff.

Okay, next one is also still birth related.

Do you still attend births?

If not, when will you start again?

That is a common question we are getting.

Tiffany, I will leave that up to you.

I know that's, that's, people are asking us a lot about if we're still attending birth, because on our website we have had our midwifery calendar closed for.

A couple years now, we have not been taking new clients.

We have been working with a very small amount of our own repeat clients for the most part.

Every once in a while there's a different circumstance, but we really are taking it case by case because we're doing a really small number of births in this season where we're preferring and needing to be more present with our own families.

And so balancing that.

Is, I feel like we're constantly balancing that and we discuss almost every single potential that comes our way where, you know, if we get inquiries in our email, we almost are always discussing together, Hey, here's.

You know, just checking, making sure that we're still on the same page with this.

And that's been really hard, especially to turn away some of our repeat clients and say, I'm sorry, but I've already blocked this time off to not be on call.

And I would love to serve your family again, and I would love to be a part of that experience again, but I have to put my own family first.

And if you don't say no sometimes, then you will always be.

Stretched.

Even when we were, even when we were, what I would say, like working full time, doing four to six births a month, we still had to say no sometimes to somebody.

And so that's just a part of this work is there's just only a certain amount of capacity that anyone can have at any certain time, and it's not the same for everybody across the board.

So we are still attending burs.

We used to be a lot more.

Open about being, being like we used to talk a lot more about the clients that we serve.

And we used to talk a lot more about the clinical pieces with our own specific clients on social media, and that was a really fun thing to share.

But now, because we work with such a small amount of women, if we share something in real time, it would be really easy for mutual people to be able to find out who we're talking about.

And then now they know that it's just too much.

It's too easy to violate their privacy, and so we can't.

We don't talk very often about who you know about what's going on with our clients clinically, which is to the detriment of those who can learn from it.

And we'll try to like continue to fold in those pieces in other ways too.

But, so I think that that's another thing that people are like, are you even, are you doing this still?

Are you even still doing this?

I don't know when we're gonna open the calendar again.

It might be never, we might not ever have our calendar open to the public.

But that seems, that seems kind of silly to say because things are changing all the time.

I mean, we, something could happen that makes us change our mind next month and that we feel called to serve in a greater capacity.

Again, I can't imagine it until my kids are.

Ha until my kids have more of their own life.

Because right now there's so much that I wanna be present for every single day, and no matter what, if I.

Choose to work, even though the pieces are very flexible, no matter what, I have to ask somebody else to stand in or for my kids to do something without me, and I'm just not willing, I guess I'm just not willing to to sacrifice that right now because they want me and I'm just like, I'm blown away that they want me around and want me to be a part of these teen years I wasn't expecting.

It's kind of cool.

Yeah, I think, I think we both thought, oh, when, when they're not breastfeeding anymore.

Oh.

When they're easier to just drop off real quick at, you know, grandparents' house or whatever, then we will feel like, oh, we're free to do the, you know, more work or whatever.

And we've just discovered, like as they get older, the needs, it's not, it is not less.

In some ways it's more, and in a lot of ways it's deeper and.

More, I don't wanna say more meaningful'cause it's all meaningful, but just the stakes are just different now and they're a bit higher, especially as they get older and the fact that there's a desire for more time together.

I'm like, well in, I'm not gonna look back on my life and be like, I wish that I took on more clients while my kids were still in my home.

You know?

And so, i'm so thankful we were on the same page as we decided to, you know shift around what we were, what we were doing, which is a hard, hard decision and hard, you know, season to, to walk through.

But I'm actually really proud of us too for honoring, you know, the things that we tell other moms to do.

Like we were able to extend that to ourselves and that's, that's sweet.

Yeah, that is, that is probably one of the best things about working together is.

That we do get to be on the same page about that.

And that wasn't my expectation.

You know, when I came to you and kind of like initiated this, like, Hey, I need to step back a little bit.

I was expecting you to, I was, I was anticipating that you were gonna be like, okay, I understand that.

That's really sad for me, but I'll figure out a way to.

Move forward, you know, in some way.

But instead you were like, yeah, actually I wanted, I wanna step, I wanna step back too.

I wanna be more present, you know, with my family too.

And I was like, dang man, did we hit the jackpot or what?

Hundred

Or what?

So another part of this conversation is like the patient ratios.

Someone wants to know, like, how do you, how do you know to whether you're taking on.

Enough to like make it worth it and without like overextending yourself.

And there's a, that's a similar answer, but it's a little nuanced.

Yeah, for sure.

And obviously it's gonna be different for different people.

It will kill you if you look around and say, well, this person's able to take on seven per month.

And they seem like they have their life together and you know, whatever.

How come I'm taking on three and feeling like I'm underwater?

Right.

Everybody's in a different season, different capacity, and you don't know what is going on behind the scenes for somebody else also.

Right.

So trying to sort out, also just looking at your whole business goals too, and figuring out how much money.

Do I need to make?

How much time do I have to give?

What's the season of life that I'm in or that my family's in?

And recognizing that that can change and shift and being able to, I guess, be humble enough also to say like,

Phone.

I can't take on what I used to be able to, or I took on too much and now I've learned.

And what's hard about this work obviously, is.

You don't always know until nine, 10 months down the road that you're like, oh yeah, that was too much.

now I have to, you know, now I'm walking through the rest of this too much for a little while longer while I shift my boundaries.

And that's just, that's just part of the work, I suppose, right.

Is being able to respond in that way, but also recognizing like you are living a lot in the future in some ways too, which is, yeah, it's a, it's a hard balance for sure.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And like when we say yes to somebody, we're saying, yes, I'm gonna walk with you for the next year and a half, you know?

And so that's a huge commitment.

We don't take that lightly.

So we need to make sure that when we're saying yes, like we really mean that I'm gonna come across challenges.

It's going to, it's not gonna be easy for me to always support you in the way that you deserve, but I'm gonna do it.

I'm gonna sacrifice things in order to do it.

And that's a big deal.

It's a big deal for somebody who's, you know, also has a really flourishing family life.

Yeah, absolutely

next question is how did you each land in San Diego and or the San Diego area and choose to put roots down here?

Well, I feel like these answers will be somewhat straightforward.

I moved here in high school.

My dad was in the military.

He was stationed on an island called Coronado at the time, and so I had no choice.

My family had no choice.

We came here and then we were like.

This is amazing.

My dad retired while I was ending high school.

And so they had the decision of what they were going to do, seeing where, you know, my brothers had both graduated high school already.

They weren't living in San Diego, but my parents were like, we love it here so much, we're just gonna stay.

And so.

staying was, you know, I, I feel like I, I grew up here more than my brothers.

I lived here longer.

Like even by the time my dad retired, I'd lived here longer in those four years than anywhere else.

And it really did feel like.

Home in that way.

And so it was an, it was an easy thing to, you know, even though I left a bit for college, like come back and be like, this is, this is where I

Quick.

Despite it being expensive despite, you know, the, the other pieces of the like make it hard sometimes to live in California or whatever.

The community that I ended up building here, and I mean, ease of life here in a lot of ways in terms of like, it's beautiful and the lifestyle fits what we want for our family.

So yeah, that's the long long story short of me landing here.

And your husband grew up here, so his roots are, his roots are here.

It was really easy for you guys as a couple to decide to, to stay here and raise your family.

Yeah.

And we've had, we've had moments where we were like, are we going to move?

We can find something cheaper elsewhere, that kind of thing.

But like the roots are, the roots are here for sure.

Yeah, and I grew up here and my husband grew up like in Southern California.

And so, I mean, we,

I.

we started out in a really nice coastal, quiet town, and as we have.

Advanced our selves financially, we can only afford things further and further away from that place.

So we were slowly moving away, but we're still considered San Diego County.

And I just, same as you.

Like I think somebody asked me recently.

Do you think you could move and be happy someplace?

And I'm like, yeah, I think I'm, I'm not good with change in general, but like after that transition, I probably could thrive anywhere because I feel like The location is not as important as some of the other like pieces, but I wouldn't want to have to.

have to

Every time we go on vacation or something, we're trying to think like, well, what's nicer than San Diego?

What would be worth spending money on for a trip?

And then we go and experience that and we're like, yeah, that's pretty cool.

And then we come home and we're like, oh, but there's no bugs here.

And like, oh, but all of our people are here and my bed.

And yeah.

So I don't know.

San Diego's just.

It's a, it's, it would be really interesting to see if we end up ever living someplace else.

I can't imagine it, but I've been surprised by life before.

Yeah, for sure.

It's kind of a blessing and a curse I feel like, to be from here.

'cause you're like, this is amazing.

then you go other places and you're like, oh, like there, there's other ama There obviously are other amazing places to live, right?

But then you're like, oh, but I'm also from one of the best places to ever So, I don't know, it's like, it's a weird weird situation there.

But let's let's move on.

So the next question is about balancing social media, where.

We spend a good amount of our time and we have like a pretty sweet platform there to be able to connect and share all kinds of funny things, real things, educational things, a mix of it all in one.

But balancing social media in an already busy world to, I'd love to hear,'cause Tiff, this is actually, I don't know, again, I don't know exactly when this comes out, but currently it is your month on Instagram.

So.

I'd love to hear a little bit about how that's going for you so far, and a bit about like what you've learned about balancing some of these things.

'cause even me just saying it's your month on it has been a you know, a work in progress of us figuring the question or, you know, the answer to this question out.

Yeah, so I mean, a part of the balance is not being the only person who has to sustain creating content somewhere or showing up somewhere.

So us we're, right now, the rhythm is month on, month off.

So like I'm on, I'm on social media right now because it is.

So much work, truly, and time to show up there.

That's my only job in our business right now.

Besides like some behind the scenes things, my day to day right now is showing up on social media and that is kind of silly to say out loud.

But can you

My job is to just be on.

Like if that was your,

know

was just every day 12 months, a

it would be.

it's a lot.

Unsustainable.

Completely unsustainable.

So Kelly's job right now is showing up in our membership, answering all of our emails, handling the clinical pieces of our practice, and running like prenatal appointments and all of those things.

So like that's how we have divided up the tasks in our business right now is that.

Half of the energy output is for social media.

And that, I mean, and we're going back and forth on that all the time, right?

Like, we're always shifting and changing.

And there's times where we're just like, oh, you know what, like, views are down.

That means our, we're gonna, we're gonna.

Down regulate our energy and time there.

People are out doing other things in the middle of summer.

This is not the time to put out, you know, our best content.

And then there's times where, I mean, usually when we're ovulating, we actually feel really creative.

We want to share, we want to be social, and we put a lot of time and energy in there and it's.

Feels reciprocal.

We really enjoy that space and spending time there.

And so I think it's just, I think the, the long-term sustainability piece of that as a business owner who's actually, like, we actually, we've had, you guys have probably heard us talk about this.

I think maybe.

About a year, a little bit over a year ago, we got kicked out of our Instagram.

We shared some graphic image about birth, and we got on the no-no list, and it took a really long time, like almost a month, to get control of our account again.

And so we were like, oh, well this is really interesting.

Should we even stay there?

Do we want to be there like it is?

There are pros and cons and we're constantly evaluating those.

There can be a lot of cons.

Sometimes it can be a really difficult place to, to navigate, but you kind of like thicken up your skin and and brush it off.

And the people who are trying to be weirdos and rude, like you can laugh at it and you know, most of the time you can like let it roll off when you have the right perspective.

So the point there is for us to.

Build relationship with our followers, build transparency create relatability let people see that there's like actual live people.

Behind our, our brand so that people are, feel more connected to the information and the education that we wanna share.

So if our goal is to get more holistic tools and alternatives into women's hands, and there's a huge part of our demographic on this platform, then.

The benefits of being in that space and figuring out how to be in that space and share information, then the benefits that you know are, are currently outweighing the risks.

So I think it's just BI think it's just about continually balancing that and a good amount goes into planning.

So even though Instagram kind of appears to be this like spontaneous place, that's like you're just always sharing what's happening in the present.

Most often it's a little bit more curated than that and we're spending a little bit more time upfront planning what we want to share, because doing it in the moment is not always conducive.

Like sometimes that just takes away more time and, you know, doesn't, doesn't get drive the points home that we want to.

And, you know, we're also running a business, so we're, we're trying to, you know, sell things, trying to share information and be compensated for the type of support that we offer.

And so we have to be balancing that out too constantly in that space, right?

Like, not overloading people with the opportunity but also being, being willing and able to serve too.

So it's multifaceted.

I guess at some point we could, do something, you know, share something with our audience.

For women who are trying to build businesses on Instagram or just flourish in that space without going crazy.

We could at some point maybe share, share something somehow in, in the, how we've done it.

Story.

Yeah.

Which is like ever evolving.

And just a real quick point about that too.

I think I've shifted a lot in how I consume the content too when I'm on there.

So now during my month, I'm like, this is not my month to consume content.

And sometimes you see stuff and you're like, oh, this is a trend, this is something I can get on, you know and enjoy.

And like, I think this is funny.

So I wanna do something like.

Pivot from it a little bit and do something about that.

But for the most part, I'm trying not to consume as much because then I just feel like that much more of a time suck at that point too, in my per, you know, there again, it's just a, it's a shift and you have to kind of do what works.

Kristen, from We Heart Nutrition, who started, who started, we Heart Nutrition actually has like timers on her phone where she's like, this is the.

This is the amount of time I'm allowing myself to stay on here.

And I can only get on it during these specific times when like, you know, here's what my kids are doing, that kind of thing to be able to, you know, kind of reign that in for her.

And I was like, I just appreciate when people can figure out a way like, that doesn't work for everybody, but it really works for her.

And so anyway, it was like a, it's a cool reminder that like look around and you think that somebody's, you know, maybe flourishing in a certain way and you're like, oh, actually that's.

You know, it's a hard earned lesson.

Hard one lesson for sure,

And I totally understand why people give it up because it just feels too, like, too much.

Like I can think of a lot, like again, if I was on my own or, I mean, I don't, I don't think I actually have the heart.

To do it on my own.

I think if I could not share with you some of the hard comments and stuff that we get on there, I would be crushed and could not recover without being able to process some of that with you and.

I mean, that sounds kind of hard to admit out loud.

So if somebody who's listening to this feels that way, like, oh, it's just so hard.

It's, it, I, I feel like I can't sustain it.

I feel like it hurts my heart sometimes to be in that space, and I don't know how to navigate those pieces.

Like, for sure.

That is real.

That is absolutely real.

So, I don't know, maybe there's a, there's some pieces there of like kind of removing the, not making it so important.

It's just social media.

I used to feel really freaked out about.

How we were represented there and people misconstruing things that we say and stuff like that.

And just being like, no, no, no, no, no.

That's not what I meant.

Oh my gosh, now we look like crazy people.

And I'm like, oh no, I don't care anymore about that.

I can't,

Yeah, it's,

can't care about that.

It's very freeing to be in that place.

For sure.

cause

Yeah.

Because no matter what you do.

They're gonna crush you,

yep.

so people will crush you for no reason.

Just because they enjoy crushing people.

And you're like, oh, man.

Oh man, I'm

Okay.

Here's the next question.

Next question.

Kelly.

How do you plan sleep when someone's in labor?

Hmm, very hard.

So part of it, part of our communication with our clients before they even go into labor is surrounding how to communicate with us in labor.

We are never like, Hey, don't call us in the middle of the night, or, you know, whatever.

We're like encouraging of that.

Of course, if you need something, of course reach out to us.

But what we what we communicate is.

Overnight hours or even like leading into late, you know 8:00 PM 10:00 PM time, where we're like, okay, if you need us, call us.

If you think that maybe labor might be starting, but you don't really know, but you're fine, but you're excited or, you know, whatever you don't need to tell us that you can be excited with your husband, you can be excited with your friend or whatever, but that if we are, if I'm told.

Hey, I might be in labor at 8:30 PM or something.

It's not actually helpful.

It's not helpful for me to plan my night because my night was otherwise just gonna be spent sleeping.

Right?

And so understanding those pieces of boundaries and communicating, and that was a little bit hard earned as well, figuring out how we wanted to communicate the communication piece with our clients.

But.

If I do know somebody is in labor, you know, labor started at 4:00 PM they don't need us yet, but I'm like, I'm gonna get a call tonight.

I still am focusing as much as possible on my sleep hygiene because if I get one hour or four hours, whatever.

It's better than getting none.

And sitting there just running in my mind's like, oh, I'm gonna miss this call.

What do I need to do here?

We need our rest, right?

And so I try as much as possible to,, continue on with the same sleep hygiene as I can and make sure a million times that my phone is the loudest it can possibly be and all of that.

And then hopefully just kind of trust that I will get the sleep that I.

Need at some point.

But there have been nights for sure where I'm waking up four or five times, checking my phone, making sure I didn't miss something, that kind of thing.

And so yeah, you have to, as much as possible, not put it out of your mind, but Put it on the priority list of like, okay, sleep now is number one as, as much as I can do it.

And again, I may need to like take different homeopathics or add more, you know whatever it is, magnesium spray to my feet, just to help my body get into a, a calming space.

But yeah, it's, it is a hard, it is a hard part of being on call for sure.

And I think like a, a part of that in the partnership piece is sharing call with each other.

And it really sucks when you have to deal with this situation and you're the primary midwife and you're just like, oh my gosh, I am, I'm exhausted, but I have my backup person and I know that I'm.

The reason I'm taking this on is not just because I'm the martyr and this is my job, and I am only a good midwife if I completely put myself on the altar of everybody else's experiences, but I'm doing it to serve my partner because she's going, there's gonna be times when she has to do it too.

And when I need a break, she's gonna take it over.

And so that's like, I think that's, that's a part of it too, is like, I know that.

When I'm bearing the brunt of that, it's to help protect you so that you can come and pick up the pieces when I can't, kind of a thing, you know?

Yeah, and it's a, it's an absolute benefit of partnership for sure.

I'm just laughing at how much people want these questions weren't as personal as I thought they were going to be, but they, like, they are in some ways, but just really interesting how there's like more of a deep dive that people want on the background of the work that we do which makes complete sense.

It's just, it's.

It's been interesting.

But our last question does pivot a little bit and I'm interested to hear what your response is to it.

So what is your one exception to low tox living?

Right.

We talk a lot about like reducing, you know disruptors that are just gonna mess with our livers and what they're trying to do and all of that.

So we're like, oh, if we, if we reduce the toxic burden, that is like a great place to start.

And we're always endeavoring, right?

A life that, generally speaking is like conducive to that.

But do you have something that is like an exception to that where you're just like, I'm just gonna do this and I know maybe it's not the, maybe it's not the lowest talks thing, but this is my thing and it works and I'm just gonna stick to it.

I, I think we have several of these, probably like I remember you sharing your.

Your dry shampoo saga, like mascara is one of those things that I'm like always riding the line on of like, well, like I wanna do the cleanest thing, but that actually works and looks good.

There's some ba like, there's some balance there, right?

But the thing that comes to mind the most for me on this one like if I think about like another.

Very crunchy person coming into my house and seeing like the reality of the, you know, like what would I be the most embarrassed by kind of a thing, you know?

And besides the, this little stash of terrible food that my husband keeps for himself and like a whole different part of the cabinet.

I don't know if there's other households out there where the least crunchy person in the family is just like.

Constantly rebelling against the movement of the other persons, you know, trying to progress the family.

But I'm like, that's him.

I don't care.

You know, he's an adult.

He gets to choose, he gets to do whatever he wants, if he wants his little cabinet of things.

But I for me, I think it would be my reliance on Ziploc bags.

I truly do think that I need.

The whole variety of sizes of Ziploc bags and I have reusable bags that zip that you wash.

And my, and we do use those all the time.

And I have tons of glass containers and I have lots of alternatives that we do still use all the time.

And yet I, I really.

I really still need my Ziploc bags for things just to make it easy.

I really try not to put hot food in there.

I really try not to, you know, reuse the bags over and over again.

Like I, I have some conscientiousness around it, but I am not gonna give up those Ziploc bags anytime soon.

It's, I know they're absolutely terrible.

In fact, I had some friends come over.

I had to leave for something.

It was probably work related, and they were cleaning up dinner at my house and so they were looking through all of my cabinets to get the leftovers put away, and I was gone already.

And they took a picture of my drawer of Ziploc bags and they're like, wow, you've got this secret little.

Microplastic stash.

I see.

And they loved, they loved that they had this thing on me, you know?

And like I was dying because I was like, oh yeah, I guess maybe you would've, you wouldn't assume that I have zip.

It is.

So, it's so funny too because sometimes in this like world, we're like, oh, this needs to be like our secret, guilty thing because it, even you mentioned what's the thing I would be embarrassed by?

All of a sudden we're like, oh, this is gonna like tarnish the image or something.

Right.

I saw somebody share a reel that like.

They used Cascade or something, every few washes because that's just, you know, what they've figured out is best for their dishes getting clean and whatever.

And it was like a very crunchy, you know, whatever account.

And she was like, I just wanna say like I do my absolute best, but like sometimes I just need my dishwasher to like do the thing.

And this is, this is what I've discovered works best for my family.

So like, judge me and all of these comments were like, oh my gosh, this feels so good to know you have this.

You have this thing, right, that isn't perfect, that isn't you know up to this image or something.

And I just, I appreciated it.

'cause I was like, whatever, that's not my thing.

But like that, it, it, everybody maybe not everybody, but you will go crazy if you try to like live that out perfectly.

And I feel like the stress of that maybe worse than just allowing yourself the thing.

Right.

My thing personally though is I so.

I have alternatives to try before this, but I am I have accepted the fact that I will always have some bleach in my house.

I don't like use it consistently to clean everything, whatever.

But there are times where I am like this, I need the heavy guns of this.

And I am okay with having tried the other things and needing to go this route.

And I know that there are natural ones.

I have, I have those, I have created some of them.

But.

Sometimes I just need some Clorox bleached to do a thing, and I've accepted that.

I'm okay with that.

Good for you.

Good for you.

We should do.

We should do like a, we should do like a house tour sometime walking people through and only showing them the bad stuff.

Mm-hmm.

highlighting like, oh, here's this new health rhythm that is giving me life and so wonderful and here's how I'm avoiding all the, the bad stuff.

But we should just like go open cabinets and drawers and stuff and only find the bad stuff to show people.

I love it.

I have so many things to share.

I'm not going to, that'll make this episode so long.

And we have to say goodbye now'cause it's 40 minutes.

Ah, it's 15 minutes long.

Okay, friends, this has been fun.

Thank you for, thank you for being in the spaces where you can ask questions and, like Kelly said, I don't know if we got as personal as we were expecting but we'll do another episode like this sometime.

So you guys are primed for thinking of your really personal questions.

You can send those as an email or something and we'll categorize them for later.

But we'll see you next week for a regularly scheduled health topic of of some kind

Of our choosing.

Bye ladies.

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