Scitation's Mets fans.

Welcome to this week's edition for all you kids out there, I'm Mets adjacent to Baseball Perspectives podcast.

I'm your host Jeffrey pattern Astro with me once again this week's Jarrett Tiedler.

Jarrett, the Mets have their twenty twenty six closer.

Maybe probably probably.

Yeah, So I would like to say that we skipped a recording for because we knew this signing was coming.

I actually had.

No idea that I was busy.

Yeah, I was not surprised at the Mets signed Devin Williams, but I had heard no specific non public information to that effect.

But yeah, I mean this was Louck.

I mean they have been linked to him really since the off season started.

Yeah, we're both like, I mean, I don't think there's nothing to the bridge familiarity.

But it's also yes, maybe that just makes you more confident that you can get him back to Devin Williams.

And also, we talk a lot about how teams don't pay for pat teams want to pay for future performance.

Right, smart teams going to pay for future performance, And it's not like one of the inputs into projecting future performance isn't past performance.

It's actually a pretty useful one in a lot of ways.

Yeah, but like the next fifty innings of a reliever, right.

Because this is very heavily weighed down by him having again, like we talked about Hellsley, like we talked about with Diaz previously, he essentially had a bad few weeks early.

It was real bad, like enough to keep the ra high the rest of.

The season, right, and then for the rest of the season he had some fluky low strand ary issues and stuff like that, the stuff that we know is predictive.

Essentially, every smart team was rushing to give him a contract because he was only gone again despite being younger than Diaz.

Hes is asking for five years right now.

Williams was asking for three of us money.

And you know, if you had asked before the twenty twenty five season, thirty out of thirty teams would have taken Williams over Diaz.

Look than that, Yeah, and if you look now, you know it's probably fifteen fifteen.

I mean, like, I know, Diaz on a run prevention basis and significantly better than Devid Williams in five And that's not to say he won't do it again in twenty twenty six.

It's possible to be discussed right.

A running point that I have made on this podcast I've also made it publicly, is that we keep searching for a stat that beats a simple stat that beats K percentage minus be B percentage for prediction outcomes.

And by those you know, Williams was a little bit better in twenty twenty four and Diaz was a little bit better in twenty twenty five.

With the months three years and fifty ish million, depending on how you want to deal with the deferrals and net present value and whatnot, and the others looking for a five year deal and is older and beyond.

It, and it's only eight months.

But there's more velocity loss, I.

Say, besides K percentage minus walk percentage, there's more reason to believe that Diaz's stuff is in decline right now.

Williams doesn't throw as hard as he did five years ago, but he basically throws as hard as he did three years ago.

He's pretty close to the throw.

He doesn't really throw like he doesn't set ninety seven ninety eight like when he first came.

He had a big had a big deal decline, but it was about five years ago.

That's about That's where I'll put it.

He's been pretty consistently in ninety four ninety five guys since then, where it was more of a ninety six even ninety seven guy when he first came up.

You know, some of that also can be a choice in some situations.

Sam working on is gonna touch on pictures don't always throw Max up or like they just don't.

We generally think believers do because they're get out for one ad.

They don't always see either like they just don't.

So you know, there's there's involvement that you know, when he was throwing that hard when he first came up, he wasn't very good, right, you know, he was terrible back in two, not terrible, but he was when he first came up in twenty nineteen.

He was not the Devin Williams.

We know now that took until this short in twenty twenty season.

But since then, if you blot out the eras, he's been extremely consistent and extremely consistently good.

It's just the ri last year is pretty.

Unsightly, right, and he has like very similar like it's a very in some ways, it's a very similar fastball that he has is it's a you know, a flat approach, get big, swimming swing and miss in the zone despite only sitting.

I will say something here about the preferences of David Sterns and building and pitching staff and then make a prediction based off of it.

David Sterns very much likes highway fastballs, don't we all know, right That is something that he is consistently valued.

Not to say that he doesn't value pitchers that don't have thaty the trade for Tyler Rodgers too, sure, but he has consistently value high with fastball.

Williams and have two of the highest with fastballs in the league, which I think is why the Mets are willing to give Diaz the three year deal a high av even though you know, I don't think they're particularly tied to him as a closer.

There's one pitcher that's out there on the market that sticks out like a sore thumb for a GM that has that loves high fastball with rates.

The Royals have publicly acknowledged the Cole Reagans is available, and that is he is among the highest fastball with starters in the league.

Breaking ball is pretty good too.

He's another guy who, just like Devin Williams, that e R A X e R A gap.

Is huge and he had shoulder issues last year.

So we might be available right to a team that has more rich risk tolerance than the Royals do going forward.

Right, So he might be available at the Royals might want a premium for him relative to the season he turned in the last year, and it still might be worth it.

So that's that's something I think everybody should keep their eye on, right.

And if you want to look, maybe why could I Sang and David Peterson are on the trademarket that might be a reason as well.

Yeah, yeah, that's it's easier to do pitch design off of that base, right, it's harder to do pitch design.

What are you going to design with David Peterson?

We've been going through this for years at this point, right, like, you know, what what are we doing here?

So do I you know?

I think that you know?

They apparently Williams is fine pitching his set up.

They made that very clear within like five minutes of the contract.

Being a league.

I don't think that closes So I don't think this closes the door on Diaz, but I would point out that this pretty much smokes his leverage.

That's kind of what what this is going to do.

I think the Mets, both stuff we had heard and public reporting by the athletic indicates that the gap here is three years.

To five right, and be very difficult for him to shop an offer back to the Mets.

Now with Williams already.

There, right, you know, if the Blue Jays or whatever other team are going to give him five years, five years and one hundred and ten million, I think they're just gonna say, Okay, nice knowing you, Yeah, and they'll release another statement, you know, Edwin was a great mat.

He'll get the video it comes back to the park and.

Yeah, like they did with Memo.

But you know, from a you know, look, if you asked me who it's going to have a lower era in twenty twenty six between william and Diaz, I would slightly lead to William.

Sure, he has been the better pitcher over the last five years.

Yes, under for any period other than last year, he has been the better pitcher.

And it does not seem that the degradation here is particularly sticky.

He just had a inflated era.

It is a thing that happens.

This is why extremely smart teams were all over him as a fridge, and it's why he signed on December first, because the market for him was very hot.

I'd been hearing the market on him was very hot.

And look they got him for three And again I think it's like fifteen million a year.

For Yeah, it's fifty one total, but the way it's calculated is a little bit.

Look, this is a this is a very and again how these contracts have reported bugs me sometimes because there's both the initial report of the number, but then there's always you know, let's say, more left leaning guys that are going well, that shouldn't be the number we report.

And again I want to stress these deferrals, these bonuses, these are a tax dodge to benefit the player, not the team.

The player.

Now, do they also benefit the team a little bit in the I mean, yeah, I don't think annuity.

Yes, I don't think it's gonna be the between the Mets getting under the third apron or not either whether it's seventeen or fourteen and a half.

Yes, but you know, yeah, so that this is you know, again, I am extremely unsurprised that the first two major relievers to fall here or Hellesley and Williams, because if if you're a smart team looking for a dominant reliever, those are the two guys you're going to go after because they got less than you know, Robert Suarez is probably not as good of a reliever as either one of those guys, and it's going to get a lot more money than Hellesley and maybe more money than Williams because he had a signing or era last year.

Not the Robertsz is not also a great believer is but he's also.

And they're building a bullpon right you want to you shouldn't necessarily I mean the Dodgers whatever, I guess, but you shouldn't really want to sign two of these guys unless it's like very advantageous for you, which you again, I comes back for three and sixty shure.

But if you're going to pick one, you want to pick the one where it's you know, the best value for the contract you're going to.

Again, I think you can make a very coherent case that he is just us the best reliever that's going to move this there.

If it was Williams, that if you knew you couldet DS for three and sixty right now, or his Williams for three and fifty one.

Okay, you know you can have that conversation, but that's not the price for DS.

We know that.

Yeah, on December first, maybe we'll be on Debruary first, But that's the big mete.

That's the big Mets move of the week.

People are annoyed about it, but whatever, Yeah, I.

Mean, I look, I get your why.

Yeah.

Yeah, he had a four point seven ninety ra last year, dared right.

He bombed down his closer for the Yankees.

He had very publicly one of the biggest home runs in Mets history too.

So you're if you are a lower information, more casual Mets man, your understanding of Devin Williams is that this was a guy who is a good setup man and a small market and then had like a one and a half year run.

Is a good closer in a small market.

The second the light scott on him, the Mets, the Mets blew up the Brewers season, and.

Then he your Yankees fans friends complained about him all April.

Right, But this is an Outlirish pitcher.

You know again that the other thing that we know Sterns really loves at this point, and it's actually does relate more to Tyler Rogers directly, is that we know he really loves the outliers pitch shapes that are just way off the expectation, and there may not be a single more outliers pitch in baseball than Devin Williams's change up, which basically moves like a lefty slider.

Yet really given the horizon moment.

Like just a very very very weird pitch that nobody has been able to pick up basically since he debuted and has led to not just this is why some of the whiff rate on his fastball is what it is, but because of that dichotomy.

But this is not just a this is not just a whift pitch.

This is also a ball and play suppression.

This is the contact made off of this pitch is typically pretty bad.

So yeah, he is.

He is a very similar pitcher in a lot of ways to Edwin Diaz, you know, obviously not exactly the same, but it's you know, low slot, kind of weirdly moving fastball, but not like it's kind of a it's a little bit of a De's on fastball because yes, because the angle that's okay, missus enormous amounts of bats in his own and then he just has he has a change up that does not that you know, Yeah, he has a change up with negative twenty horizontal brain.

Yeah.

Yeah, yes, his change up is like dustin maze to seem like kid, right.

His his change up basically has a I don't even know what hell to.

I mean, there's just not a lot of pitches that like that, right, Like his change up in something like it just it's it's a weird pitch.

It's just it's a really weird pitch.

It's just there's not it.

Yeah, it moves like a lefty slur basically, yeah, with extreme horizontal tilt.

So yeah, the idea.

You know, I think this is a great signing, But I also just don't really care that much if they bring Edwin Diaz back as long as they're replacing, you know, I think there's a lot of ways to get to a good bullpen, and I don't know how much the elite closer really adds to that other than as a security blanket.

But again, I would point out that Diaz is not functioned as particularly good security.

Blind and he's crossed his job like a half dozen times over his Mets tenure.

Right, No, reasonably, but not that far.

He keeps timing these era seasons that start with A one.

With his free agency.

It's very lucrative for him, right, you.

Know, going back to what we what I was saying earlier, you know, his K percentage mnus be b A percentage is down thirteen points since the injury.

It's still really, really, really good.

He's one of the better relievers in baseball.

But to the extent there was an actual legitimate sticky skill jump in twenty twenty two the cause the Mets to give him the largest reliever contract in baseball.

He has given it back like.

That, a little little Freudian slip there, Jared, what was that sticky jump in two?

Oh yeah, uh, that one was actually an intenso but yeah, we're talking about guys three years older who suffered a really traumatic injury.

He's given a lot of the performance back.

Who's you know, the the fastball's lost something.

Right, I mean, this is also the being a good closer and you know, the best pitcher in baseball on a per pitch basis, which is basically what he was in twenty twenty two.

Yeah, and he's gonna rank higher on everybody's free age and rankings.

I'm sure if I pull ours up, he ranks higher on ours too, because you're not gonna put and.

Look, some teams are going to be scared off by the four point seven ninety.

Absolutely, it's not going to be the smart ones.

And that's why.

That's just kind.

Of if you want a brand name closer, Like you know what.

We actually ranked he As and Williams back to back.

I do remember that.

Yeah, yeah, quickly some other ones are JA ranked he As fifteenth and Williams nineteenth.

Yeah, I mean it's it's clawless.

Fangrass had a much bigger gap.

But yeah, this is you should not want to be tied down or two relievers for a lot of years just because of the volatility of the position.

So if you can get a similar, maybe even better quality player for two years last term and also not encourage or I have to pick consequence because of it, to me, that's a no brainer.

But I understand a lot of people are very attached to Edwin Diaz in particular, and I'm not telling you that you shouldn't be.

I will say I don't think there's a lot of gap between Devin Williams and Lean Doran, even Mason Miller, and that really like the idea again, maybe Miller is going to get converted to a starting pitcher.

Maybe that's the missing kiece here right right, the idea that you could sign a reliever of this caliber for three and fifty one on the market.

Why the hell would you ever trade Leo Debrize for one of them?

Which you know that.

Was not a the part don't sign.

I know they haven't ever signed.

They tend to want to trade for control, right.

They want to get cheaper control too in most cases.

Right, whether this is not going to be cheap for all?

No, he's not right.

You know, he's going to rack up some pretty many.

You know, he's a he's are valible this year.

He's not going to be making seventeen a year probably until he gets the third year of our But it's not going to be cheap.

I mean, you know, is he better than Devin Williams since closed?

Yeah?

I mean I say probably, but probably.

You think.

The other is I don't know, man, yea, we're gonna in the top five.

I don't know.

Prospects again, that's just you know, you can put him one.

You could, We're not going to, but you could.

We have we've we've assessed that there's five viable candidates for number one, and he has one of them.

I guess six probably because probably throw you Savage in there, even if he's not gonna rank necessarily there.

But you know, it's it's it's essentially the top four short stops all might not end up and short stop plus Clean and your Savage, those are the guys that I don't think you can make a viable case for JJ weatherholders, right.

I think there's actually a little bit of a gap between those six and the rest too, So you're trading one of those guys, like right.

Yeah, like and you know, yes, I think there's a larger gap between Leo Dabries and Walker Jenkins or col Emerson that it will look like on our lists.

And yeah, Debris did some like actually really special things this year in terms of outputs, not not Ethan Sala's special, like.

Actually actually special.

And again he's one where you can literally just watched the video, like go to YouTube and look at Leo Devrees highlights for twenty twenty five, and it becomes pretty obvious that this is not like he's taking major league swings up.

There, like and this matches on the analytics something.

I mean, you liked him to have maybe a little more present, high end exit.

But also he's nineteen in Double A.

Just turn it.

He was eighteen in Double A.

It wasn't even nineteen.

Yeah, so yeah, it's all kind of a little bit complicated, but at the.

Right and like, maybe you can't conjure up a Mason Miller, but you can conjure up eighty percent of Mason Miller pretty easily.

It's Stephen Williams.

I don't even mean, I don't even mean, I don't even I've been gone to the free agent market, right like they had you know, they traded significantly less.

Ceremonia strata for like nothing.

Lucas is another one, right.

Yeah, yeah, that's yeah, that's he was a way of verk Clinton.

Yeah, just the idea that to build a bullpen and you need to shovel prospect after prospect after prospect of the problem.

I just to me the ease of it.

And I know the counter argument to this is that you need at the deadline.

But also the Mets traded for one of the guys that shouldhim in a lock at the deadline.

He was horrible.

You know, trying to predict what the reliever is going to do over his next fifteen or twenty innings is just not You're not going to be able to do it at any sort of meaningful level.

I mean, right, love what philm Aton did for the Mets in twenty twenty four versus what he did for the Cardinals last year and cash that into a two year deal.

Yeah, and like he was really pretty much film Mayton the whole time, frankly, but all.

Right, and again, the gap between the gap between film Aton and Kevin Williams in terms of more contracts are assuming should just be a lot larger than it, right, And that is a that is a point of leverage.

That is a point that you can leverage because you know, there's severn.

I think most smart people are able to assess that Devin Williams is going to be underpaid on this contract because of because of everything that was happening around him.

But you need a lot of stuff.

One, you need somewhere that Devin Williams wants to play.

That's the first part.

Apparently he likes New York likes taking the train to the game.

Sure, you need an owner that's wanting to spend fifty million dollars on a reliever who had an unsightly ra and like solid eighteen or twenty owners when you bring this to them are just going to go absolutely the hell not like, you know, this is not I want a guy who had a nice r Roberts Roberts far As, it's a much easier sell to you're sign Robert tore And then you also need you need this to be a way giving your budget in team structure to where it makes sense.

And there are teams that are able to identify.

I am sure the Tampa Bay Rays were able to identify that Devin Williams was going to be a really good signing this year.

And I do not think they were going to spend seventeen million dollars on a relievers.

They did not pick up the fairbanks like ten million dollars option or whatever.

So yes, correct, So you know there's a lot.

So that's why even though this you know it's in some way is it's similar to the Soto deal where even though I think most people within the game, at least most smart people are able to assess this with reasonable confidence.

There's still not that many teams that are in on it because it's still this is a luxury expenditure that you are going to have a hard time selling to your owners and your fans, and so that's that's kind of what becomes a limiting factor.

The same thing as like every single team could you know, put together a commensurate package for what Mookie Bets was traded for and be like, this is a great trade to get Mookie Bets, But yeah, they wouldn't do it because they wouldn't extend Mookie Bets.

Right.

We saw this with Garrett Crochet last offseason, where not as many teams, a lot of teams were able to assess that Garrett Crochet would be a good target for them, but then actualizing it into a deal contract extension is several steps beyond that.

You're probably going to see this with Kyle Talker too, or you know, I think there's a reason that the teams that keep popping up in the passing articles and the fine sand articles attached to Kyle Talker are generally the smartest teams because you can kind of see that because his numbers are a little bit dipped in twenty twenty five because of an injury.

And because he's miss time the last two seasons.

Yeah, much easier to sell Cody bones or to your fan base.

Which is a crazy thing to say, but yeah, you've won an MVP, not gonna.

Get nearly as much money.

You're going to look like more you'.

It's the same thing to have with Corey Cer a few years ago.

You're gonna be giving an over three hundred million dollars contract a guy that casual fans do not consider on the top twenty or twenty five players in baseball?

Now?

Is he Yeah?

He is?

Does he project to be that moving forward?

Yeah?

He does.

In fact, made four straight All Star Games.

But I think the perception of him is that he's a nice little four four and a half Winden player who doesn't reach a lot of leader boards.

And then you start looking at the actual fundamental stand is also coming off of a down season, and then you start looking at the actual underlying fundamentals and it's like wow, like position players are this hot.

He just don't become availables free agents at blow to thirty at this.

Points, right, and you know, Seeger entering his walk here played ninety five very good games following up a very good pandemic season.

But you know, he had a reputation as not being able to stay on the field.

You know, he had the really bad injury in twenty eighteen.

It looked like he was just a different player after that.

And then look, he's had trouble staying on the field in Texas, but has been one of the best hitters in baseball when he's played, and he's you know, one hundred and nineteen hundred and twenty three, one hundred and two games last.

Tucker Tucker over the last two seasons, even with his injury highly affecting his production in twenty twenty five, has been a seven win quality player.

He just hasn't played the full season in either one of those.

If you take out the period of time in which his injury just completely wrecked him last year, he's like a nine win player.

Yeah, And like, look, there's that.

That's and he's getting old or so, like that's the reason he's going to get three hundred million instead of five hundred million.

But he probably deserves four hundred million, So all right, and you.

Might get that from somebody than that, you know, that's the Mets keep coming up.

Is a team connected here, There's several issues.

One of the most obvious one is that either Here Soda would have to play left field, which both of them have played, but neither of them has really played it that much, so at times is indicated that perhaps he doesn't love playing it in particular.

And then longer term, you know you're gonna have if you're signing Tucker for say, ten years, you're gonna have to at least have to be thought in the back of your mind about, Okay, who's moving to DH, who's moving the first base, what are the timelines on this stuff that you can't necessarily outright predict, but you do need to have at least consideration of even this early.

So yeah, that's uh, that's kind of where things lie going into the winter meetings.

I think I think the Mets are going to be very active.

I think they've probably got a couple more big free agent signings in them.

I would not be surprised that all if they made several big trades.

But look, they're absolutely out there looking for top of the rotation.

Pitching, whether that's am I, whether that's Reagan's, whether that's Scooball like.

Yeah, Mackenzie Gore's another name I've heard of with him.

But I can see the vision I suppose from Valda.

Yeah, but but passing.

Yeah, I think there are numbers in which they'd be interested and it's probably not.

All right, Well, that's the current state of free agency.

Yes, before we go, we need to talk about Mike Puma's article.

I mean, the other thing that's fans are freaking out about in the last week.

And a half.

Look, uh, I so I have to be careful because people get quite angry about all of this.

Yeah, just about all of it.

This is not the first article that has been written and suggesting that Francisco Lindora is a less than ideal teammate.

It's not the second.

It's not the third, it's not the fourth, it's not the fifth.

It might be like the sixth, seventh.

This is up to a lot.

And this is dating back to when it was Cleveland.

This is not specific to him being with the Mets, that that these articles are written writen about him in Cleveland.

Something that I noticed over the past five days since this article came out, even on background, wasn't a single person in the Mets clubhouse of den eyed any of this right.

The best they could do was, you know, I saw and some other people promoting Disha's article that tried to portray basically the same stories in more positive lights.

No, there was no one.

Soto didn't call anybody and say this is a false one.

So didn't post an Instagram story saying this as fall as Jeff McNeil didn't call anybody and say this was Jeff mcdeal, didn't post an Instagram story.

There was no Seawn ma and I I didn't call a reporter and say how untrue all of this, not to put that on Seawn Man I was you know, nobody did Brandon Nemo did.

He's not on the team anymore.

At some point, this is this stuff's probably all just true.

Like again, and that's not how much you care about Soto and Lindora not hanging out off field or in the clubhouse.

Sure it's up to you.

I don't think you should care about it a ton, but.

Yeah, but this is again, this guy's been here for five years now.

Out of that five year period, the Met's club palace, his reputationally had been talked sick for about four and a half of the five years the peer in which it wasn't involved major outside leaders coming in for a portion of one season.

Dandy Martinez, Yeah, you know his his former teammates have said the stuff on the record.

Jason Kidnas said it on the Foul Territory podcast a few years ago, and that was a big story.

I just the idea that he is secretly this incredible leader of men in whatever way you want to say, it just doesn't add up.

Put aside the years and years of league articles, this look like a team that has a great, veteran superstar leader.

Look again, he's been a top ten in the MVP last four years.

You don't really need to care about this, but a lot of people do.

It's yeah, it's just the people get this spawned the entire cycle again of you know, oh my god, if you you know, if you criticize Francisco anddor oh my god, how dare you?

I got messages again, how dare you make a post about this?

How dare you?

What?

Am I just supposed to pretend that doesn't exist?

Because it makes you feel bad that these.

Guys like I don't I'm fine with, you know, the kind of fandom that you know doesn't necessarily reflect there that you don't have to be fans of the Mets in the order in which they produce for the Mets, right like you.

I've done this with Josh Satin and Gabriel Anell over the years.

I do it a lot less now for reasons not yes, we never have met, because I enjoy watching them for weird non productions.

And I enjoy watching Lindor because you know, he's finished the top ten in the MVP.

As for you as a great baseball player, and I don't, you don't, I don't know.

You don't have to be overly invested in these people being friends.

Now, Look, I think there is something to the idea that the clubhouse was a mess and that look, maybe that was the reason they couldn't fire in August and September.

Maybe it was just the pitching was done.

It didn't really matter how many times Kumbaya.

I think it was.

But again, I think this all means to go up in the context of Lindor being an aging player that the team may want out of the contract.

I will say all this is not speak particularly well about Carlos Mendozo's ability the clubhouse either, but we already knew that.

So right again, we talked about with the Atom Montavino stuff like, you know.

Do I think they're going to trade Lindor in the next month, because that's really when you'd have to do it.

No, but he's also an agent player with like six years left on his deal.

Like, I'm sure they thought about it.

I'm sure they talked.

About it, because there's going to come up, Like like with Nemo, there's going to come a point in time where that contract is just not movable, right, And it may may not be this offseason, it may not be next off season, but it's coming.

It may already not be movable because he has no trade cause well they need to provide consents.

I do think there's going to be a lot of Again, we spent the better part of I mean really the Sandy Alderson will contenure on down.

But even before that, frankly, where there was just so little player movement, right, we always made jokes about the Mets retaining or bringing players back.

They were familiar to the clubhouse, Right, David Searns is going to take the Bill Walsh, I'd rather move you a year too early than a year too late sometimes in baseball because the guarantee contracts, you can't move my year too late, right, Yeah, and that's going to be uncomfortable for a lot of people.

I think.

Yeah, it's already I mean that's.

Ultimately the Edwin Diaz tough it's Alonzo.

Yeah, like it's it's the.

It's the same thing, right, They're going to spend like significant money.

Like it's going to be the top of the market, right, It's going to be Soto, it's going to be Tucker, it's going to be acquiring extending Schooble.

It's not going to be like you know, they're going to try to find you know, ninety.

They're gonna try to find guys that are undervalued relative to the bigger name free agents, whether it's Devin Williams versus and when Diaz, whether it's Okamoto or uh Ryan O'Hearn versus Pete Alonzo.

Yeah, like this is what is going to happen, right, because the Mets do have a budget.

At some point.

We've talked a lot about the Dodgers, and we've talked some about Corey Seeger.

Over the course of the last half hour, the Dodgers like Cory Sieger walk and didn't even really try that hard to retain him, right, and.

They got Trey Turner for a bit or Turner before that.

Yeah, it was ultimately to clear room for Gavin Lots and even end up being.

A good yeah, and they end up with.

Right.

Yeah.

Mcgell Rojas was playing series.

Obviously it worked that long time, because again it's baseball.

Anything can work.

But you know, they're able to basically give up to not particularly interesting low miners in fielders for Tommy Edmond too the year before too.

So the point I'm getting at here in regards to all of this, frankly, is that if you are expecting perfection from the guys making baseball decisions, like that's just not a standard that you're going to meet up to.

It's absolutely possible.

At the Mets, let Edward Diaz walk Devin Williams is a disaster, and Edward Diaz continues to rattle off seasons at about his twenty twenty four to twenty twenty five quality for the next five years.

It's a pretty low percentile outcome.

It's absolutely puspen.

It does happen.

You cannot predict the future to the extent that sometimes I think people would like you to be able to predict the future, as comes up in prospecting all the time, where he said, we don't know exactly where Leo Devrees is going to be in our wor a one that needs to be locked in three weeks, and that's not even a moving target, like we're not getting more additional information.

It's hard like that decision.

There is very little difference between Leo the reasons Moday's prospects, Like there just is not much different.

And for whatever reason, because baseball is baseball, Like there's a decent chance one of them is has a twenty war better career than the other.

Yes, like maybe we're just not good enough to predict it, or maybe it's just really hard, you know, like you start going down because you know, I have one on one document open right now, and it's like, who's who's better pitching prospect between Peyton Doyle, Peyton Taly and Liam Doyle.

I don't know, Like I actually don't know.

We're gonna have to rank them against.

It's also like a weird I mentioned this, So yeah, one's going to be in the major league rotation with the Red Sox.

And the other.

I don't think a starn a professional inning yet.

Maybe Doyle pitch a.

Little bit after that, Yeah, actually pitch a little bit.

But like was in college this year.

It was like hanging out in Palm Beach while Peyton Toley was throwing innings for a playoff team.

Right, like right, but again was in college the year before, right, Yeah, even just a little further back.

Was primarily hitting prospect, no hitting prospect, and totally does not look anything like the pitcher he did when he got drafted either.

He throws harder, his stuff max is different, like.

Kevin de Prunk in the Marlins system, who was I guess probably the best if a pitcher coming into the season, but that really doesn't mean anything.

Only got five hundred and sixty thousand dollars, you know, went to the DSL, pitched very well.

It's really good stuff.

And he'll be younger than most of the prep arms will go in the top fifteen or twenty picks this year.

He will still be seventeen on draft day next year.

Yes, and I'm ranking him next to like Carson Nolbront, who might be in the majors next year, and Robbie Stanleing probably will be like, right.

The exercise of ranking Leo Dabries versus Nolan McLean.

It's just and that's not even like an extreme example of because the reason it's played in double A right, Like right.

The exercise of ranking Nolan McLain versus Edward Florentino is like just like what what Edward flor you know, is playing in the complex?

And July, Like, what are we doing here?

John's warganzal is playing the DSL this year?

You know, how are how are we supposed to rank Johns warganzals versus Nolan McLain, Like I know what.

He did both on a top level and a KPI.

I also know the kind of pitching he's seeing, right, Like the gap.

Between those two players at the stages of their career is less than a gap between Noel MacLean and Towurd School.

So you know that's that's a little debul digression on prospect evaluation.

It's it's the same thing, right, It's all the same, it's all the same processes, right, You're trying to predict future production.

Yeah, yeah, and within that context, I mean, you know we've went through this before with regards to Lindor, like a decent percentage of the players who are situated Blake Lindor has been, which is already a fairly small group because there are not many players who are on a call of fame trajectory through this through the age is some of those players went off a cliff pretty unexpectedly.

And you know, I have this page open.

I can give you his most comparable players through age thirty.

Yeah, they saw an updated.

It's like a lot of It's a lot of Ander Bogarts and Handley Ramirez and I think it will still be.

Sevens who was done.

You know, Jimmy Rollins had a pretty early decline.

Was still good?

Was still good?

Yeah, we we have literally done this.

I mean it's funny that the career most similar batter firms Marcus Semi.

Yeah.

Anyway, you know, it's a complex situation.

I I think these articles keep getting put out because there are people who will not accept that this guy might be a really good player, and that this guy might be the capital t capital ce the captain to the fans.

But he isn't in the wrong, and that's fine.

He doesn't.

And again, I don't know how much that actually matters.

I don't know if Lindor specifically wants.

That, right, that's that's fine.

Right, Like he goes out and he stands in front of his locker and he's, you know, up until this year, was the best player on the team.

So he's going to get questions and he answers the questions, and you know, people sometimes read more into that than they should.

Yeah, So yeah, I just I do I think.

Look, do I think, knowing the information in that article, that there's a higher chance that Jeff mcmill get straight.

Yeah, it was already a pretty good chance.

It was already a pretty good chance.

Do I think that one Soda and Francisco Lindora are friends?

Probably not.

Do I think that we all have workplace proximity acquaintances people that are you know, we're all for two or not closer.

To somebody's Look, I don't.

I literally, very very occasionally talked to one person I worked at Travelers with, Yeah, and like when I was there, like, we know, we need to do group dinners and have lunch together, but that's like, you know, you have another job, and that's I think it's troop For baseball players, A lot of the time too.

Some is and some isn't.

You know, like I know current baseball players, I know former baseball players.

I know former baseball players they're still very close to a lot of people that they played with.

And I know former baseball players who don't tuck to many people they played with at all.

Like Nick Evans, like a groomsman at David Wright's wedding or something like that exactly.

But yeah, Satin, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And you know, I had a small handful of coworkers at my wedding, but it wasn't that many.

And it doesn't mean I didn't like all of the people that didn't invite it.

It just meant I wasn't didn't feel close enough to them to invite them to my literal wedding.

Conversely, you know, there are people you struggle to get along with but still do fine in a professional contexture right.

It's part of being a mature adult in a actual in person job.

And I think a lot of the people who are responding to this or one either not mature adults who don't have in person jobs or in some cases jobs at all, is that you will have to interact with people that you don't particularly like, and you will have to treat them respectfully, and you'll have to figure out a way to get along and get.

By with the right And it's a lot lower stakes than trying to win baseball games one hundred and sixty two times.

While you're on the road with them and traveling with them and are you know, around them twenty four hours a day or thereabouts.

Some of these people you just won't vibe with.

Some of them will have wretched political and social opinions that you can't grasp.

Some of them won't treat you particularly well.

But if you want to work, if you want to be a professional and a professional context, you just have to get on with a lot of this stuff, right, Like, that's just how life goes.

And look, I not to get into old men shouting a cloud societal stuff, but I think a lot of younger millennials and zoomers don't get that and struggle with that.

And I think that's some of the reasons that they're struggling in the quote real world now.

And I think you see that especially on Blue Sky.

The portion of the former Twitter base that moved to Blue Sky is I think it's more weighted.

It's that crop of people.

And if you feel attacked by this, you probably should.

Driver of my burrito taxi wasn't nice enough to be kind of stuff or whatever.

Yeah, or you know he voted for Trump.

I can never talk to him again, which is a very privileged thing to be able to say.

And frankly, I think drives a lot of this Lenora stuff of being totally honest, because you know, look, I see I see the pust from his wife Sincetagram two and I know everybody views them as the woke King and Queen family.

And I obviously know his wife's political opinions.

I don't know his We've discussed this on the podcast previously.

We've gotten conflicting feedback after having discussed it on the podcast previously.

I don't know.

I don't care.

I don't know if he cares either a lot of care about this.

There was I will plug There was a very good staff cat this week in which I won't spoil it.

But Rich assembled I think five Mets beat writers for a roundtable, and they discussed a former Mets Beat writer who worked at Newsday and now is a Red Sox.

This is typical.

Yeah, kind of gave away all the details there, but.

They were discussing Tim Hell.

You know, they discussed it by name, and Tim Healy is somebody who within the woke Mets Twitter turned blue Sky.

Although many of you went back to Twitter, I still see you.

Universe got Pillar read for his perceived politicals and you know, he was anti congestion pricing, and they discussed that on the podcast, and I guess it turned out that he didn't really understand how taxes were and his political his his anti congestion pricing rants were just based on the fact that he didn't want to pay congestion.

We're not based on deeper.

A lot of people just a lot of people don't care that much about it.

There's there's also a there's also a name for that particular political stance.

But yeah, nip, yes, anyway, you know, and we you know, I am obviously not one of those people.

You are not either, although I think in both cases we are.

We pay less attention than we used to for various reasons.

But that being said, like that's just it's a fact that like a lot of people, you know, like I, a lot of people just like don't know what's going on in the world or don't have fully formed thoughts or just don't really.

Get a ship, and a lot of baseball players have enough money where they don't have to.

Give a ship, right, So like that all blends into this.

I don't know what the nature of the disagreements are between Lindor and Soto, but if you have eyes and ear, like this wasn't that hard.

Just I mean, they're just like they've never either hung out, like they played on different teams.

I don't think there.

I mean, I guess they probably, I mean lives in New York now, like I guess you know it.

Nemo played to high school ball in Florida, right, and Soto came over as a.

I f A.

I don't think that would have interacted.

I mean they, yes, they're both you know, Latino star baseball players, but they're from very different backgrounds like.

Right, Lindora's Puerto Rican and grew up in Florida, and Soo is Dominican and grew up in the Dominican.

Right, you know, and again that's fine, right, It doesn't mean they can't be like but is its.

Eighty six?

Yeah?

Five cats?

But yeah, you know, alternated between wanting to kill each other and then getting in fights of bars together, Like you know, that's just it's the nature of thing.

You know.

You go back to the Reggie Jackson, Billy Martin Yankees are and there's that.

There was literally a mini series about how much all those people hated each other.

They won the World Series several times.

So this is but like, if you like say this, you're pilloried for besmirching the good name of Francisco because we're not allowed to talk about this because it makes people sad or uncomfortable, And I just I don't get where that's coming from, like I do, but at the same time, I just really don't.

So I don't people really want us to say that this is a manufacturer controversy that you should pay absolutely no attention to.

If Coma just made some shit up, which he didn't do, you don't.

Have to pay attention to it.

To be clear, yes, this should.

This can in no way impact the way you watch the twenty twenty six Mets or remember the twenty twenty.

Five.

This wasn't clickbait.

He works at a hard paywall site that had this behind the paywall.

They published this at a time where it was going to get the least amount of traction possible.

It was on Black Friday against football games, like, this was not a and it is news worthy.

It's newsworthy that for a second time when Door was the aggressor in a fight with Jeff McNeil in the course of a game about McNeill's perceived defensive lapses.

This is not the first time this has happened either.

This is almost the vac same story as the rat raccoon thing, and that was four and a half years ago.

Now, like that was a very long time ago.

And it's look, if when Door and Soto are going to cooperate for puff pieces about how they are vibing together in their first year, that makes it fair game to report on their relationship, even if you don't otherwise think it's fair game to report on the relationship, which it is because these are public figures.

But I saw that strain of thought out there too.

Well, this just isn't something that should be reported on, and that's like, Okay, that's weird.

Yeah, so these are stories that come out after a team implodes and the Mets keep imploding.

Yeah, I'm gonna treat this as like a breaking a new show.

I guess we've covered the Yeah, we'll probably be back.

We'll probably be back because the Mets might sign Cody Ponts or something.

Uh, but I'll see you again for another edition of For All Your Kids out There.

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