[SPEAKER_00]: Are you someone over forty or what I like to say in your two-point-oh era in life?

[SPEAKER_00]: And you have something to offer the world.

[SPEAKER_00]: But when you think about social media and YouTube and posting content online, you probably think to yourself, man, that's just for the young people.

[SPEAKER_00]: They're the ones who know how to do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would say you actually have more of an advantage than all the young people.

[SPEAKER_00]: And the reason is is because of what you know and your experiences.

[SPEAKER_00]: And today's department is the personal brand department.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I have Lee Jenkins with me [SPEAKER_00]: a pastor, entrepreneur, financial expert.

[SPEAKER_00]: You in eighteen months have grown your audience online across a few platforms to over four hundred thousand followers.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Eighteen months, four hundred thousand followers.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I found you at around maybe fifty to sixty thousand followers about a year ago.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I loved your approach, and I think you'll have so much insight because you represent so much people who have expertise, a passion to help people.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so do it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm honored.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a fan.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I want to look like you when I grow.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my God, thank you, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I'm honored.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a huge fan of yours.

[SPEAKER_01]: I discovered you probably before you discovered me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And man, I've been so blessed by your content and inspired by greatly.

[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, I'm a little older.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm over sixty.

[SPEAKER_01]: Believe it or not.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm, I'm in a thirty five year old body.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go ahead.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I don't believe in getting old.

[SPEAKER_01]: I believe in getting better.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I have loved [SPEAKER_01]: aging because the more you age, the more experience you have and you can draw on some of that experience.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then you can learn new things.

[SPEAKER_01]: And what I love about today's generation of young people and millennials is you all are so entrepreneurial and you're not scared to take risk.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so what I try to do is surround myself around a lot of young people.

[SPEAKER_01]: We have a lot of young people on our church staff.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so when you fuse the energy and the innovation of young people with the wisdom and the experience of those who are older, man, it can be a beautiful thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I try to do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: So good.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that is a kingdom paradigm at our church.

[SPEAKER_00]: We literally are our mission at city light is we're building a house for the next generation love it and next generation is literally the next generation but it's also for those that aren't here the people that don't know the Lord yet and and yeah, we serve a God Abraham Abraham Isaac and Jacob and so it's threes he's God's always doing something in threes and so yeah so powerful but [SPEAKER_00]: I want to unpack your journey process on how you found your sweet spot and I guess we could start with what led you to feel like it's time to put out some financial advice and and good because even you're you're also a lead pastor yes I am and you could have put out [SPEAKER_00]: specific like theology or biblical advice, but you're like, no, I want to do something a little more practical.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: So when it comes to like the Instagram or like, how did you decide on a platform where it's like, okay, I want to put my expertise and passion out there.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I think it was two things that inspired me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number one was saying so much financial information disseminated through social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some of it I liked, some of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hate it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it was, you know, the Bible is an incredible verse it says, what shall it profit a man if he gained the whole world and loses soul.

[SPEAKER_01]: I felt like people were just talking about wealth building, not knowing that you can build wealth and make a lot of money, but that doesn't necessarily equal success, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: and it doesn't necessarily make you happy.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I felt like there needed to be a balance out there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Somebody needed to come and to talk about wealth building, but be able to balance it with integrity and to top purpose too.

[SPEAKER_00]: Look at it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Which I love that you're what you're highlighting is you felt like there was a void.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was a void.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that you felt you could feel because because it although it's your passion, although it's your expertise, [SPEAKER_00]: Just doing stuff with your passion expertise without filling.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's a you're filling a void could lack purpose.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I just think that's a really good insight for many people because as people are wondering what's my nature and maybe I didn't go to the get sign of the NFL or your people are thinking this way, but you have something too offer, but what are you seeing out there from your observation and something that you feel you could bring a different perspective on.

[SPEAKER_01]: when you think about all the pizza places in hamburger places and do we need more pizza places but they keep popping up and they keep making money saying with hamburgers and I can name a lot of other restaurants it's the same with content yeah the market is flooded with content but that doesn't mean it doesn't need more content [SPEAKER_01]: And what you have to do is find your niche and try to feel a void.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I saw where there was very little balance between financial principles and spiritual principles, incorporating or integrating faith and finances.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was number one I saw a void.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number two was very personal what I'm going to tell you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is the older we get, [SPEAKER_01]: You know, the older I get, you know, you think about death.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you should really think about death all the time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now I don't mean that in more bit way, but I mean you don't know when your number is going to be called.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you should live like, you know, to your to live life to its fullest.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I think when you hit, you know, late fifties are so the reality of it probably hits harder and so God began to deal with me by kind of making this statement to me in my spirit and it was this.

[SPEAKER_01]: It sure would be a tragedy if you died with all of this stuff inside of you and you didn't get it out to help people.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I realized that this was the time to get what was inside of me out so I could help other people.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I had taken for granted.

[SPEAKER_01]: People have been telling me for years.

[SPEAKER_01]: Man, you ought to be sharing this stuff on social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: You ought to be doing coaching things.

[SPEAKER_01]: You ought to do a community.

[SPEAKER_01]: You ought to do that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't feel like it was any big deal because I've been doing this since I was twenty five years old.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've been talking about this stuff and helping people.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I realized that it wasn't just for me, it was also for others.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's what got started, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.

[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I see that pattern with people who things come easy to them.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so they discount it and they don't think it's valuable because it's familiar.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: and that's a really good place to come to where you shouldn't approach it with it being for self-serving because that's why I think that that is why you're winning.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I did discount it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a little embarrassed about that because [SPEAKER_01]: If I had not discounted it, I would have started sooner and been able to help more people sooner.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I think that's one of the reasons God has been blessing me with the support and the fellowship is because I'm having an impact on people and God knows how to catch us up.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's on a different, he's on Cairo.

[SPEAKER_00]: Not Chronos.

[SPEAKER_00]: So specifically for me, it was Instagram.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is there a specific reason why you chose to kind of go all in on Instagram with vertical short form content?

[SPEAKER_01]: I read that you needed to pick one thing instead of trying to do all of them at once.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so Instagram just happened to be my favorite for some reason.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I decided to start on Instagram and then let it spill into the other ones.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it was no scientific reason behind it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just I had enjoyed probably following people more on Instagram and you were a user and I was a user and you being a user made it more familiar to be able to be a creator on the platform.

[SPEAKER_01]: No doubt, but I also was a user of X and I was also a user of Facebook and I was also a user of TikTok, but [SPEAKER_01]: For some reason, I just gravitated and liked Instagram more.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I figured that was going to be my primary one.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wait, and then, so what's interesting is what most people would have done, because you probably already had Lee Jenkins in Instagram account.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: But you start a brand new account called the Stewart chip code.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you're chipping away at content.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And here's something I love, by the way.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right now, if you do this five or six times, you get to the beginning of your journey on that account.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But then there's over three hundred thousand followers on it, which is cool.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can you talk about the journey of like starting and then realizing that the format needed to change?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I felt like [SPEAKER_01]: My content had already been tested in other forms.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had been doing financial seminars, speaking engagements in even coaching and consulting for years.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just never bragged about it and went on social media about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was more excited about doing the work than bragging about it and telling the world about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, by the grace of God, I've been asked to speak at some incredible events.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I've spoken for years ago at TDJX's, a woman that are loosed, manpower when he was doing these man's events.

[SPEAKER_01]: So this area was not new to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: However, I needed to get it out in a form that would be shorter and compact.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, one of the things I did in my investment career is oftentimes, I would, the new stations would call me and they would say, hey, the stock market crashed.

[SPEAKER_01]: Could you give a statement?

[SPEAKER_01]: And they would come to my office and they would interview me and they would say, that is great.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, it was.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, well, why was it so good?

[SPEAKER_01]: They said, because you talk and sound bites, you're able to take [SPEAKER_01]: complicated financial things and get it within a thirty second a minute.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, wow, I didn't even know that I was good at that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I thought about what I did in the business world.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had to do these short form responses to new stations about what was going on in the economy.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, wow, I'm going to apply that.

[SPEAKER_01]: to Instagram and some of my content.

[SPEAKER_01]: So when I first started, it was me looking at the camera and just talking and then I decided we wanted it to look more like a podcast style where somebody was asking me questions and spurring the conversation and just kind of let me roll.

[SPEAKER_00]: Which I love because you're not, you're not looking directly at the camera.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's right, which probably makes filming as simple.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it makes it more simple.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I have a little cheat sheet over there.

[SPEAKER_01]: I could look at my notes a little bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: But my son is my producer.

[SPEAKER_01]: His name is Martin.

[SPEAKER_01]: So he's sitting right across the table.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I want it to look natural like I'm talking to somebody.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I am looking at him, you know, and occasionally a glance at my notes as I'm put you can't even tell because this stuff is inside of me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And these are things that I live out.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I've been talking about for decades.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, Department Fam, question for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Based on you listening to this podcast, you probably are either looking to grow your personal brand this year, build your audience online and just stop chasing business and start to have business chasing you.

[SPEAKER_00]: If that's you, I want to invite you to the content to cash challenge.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is a five day coaching experience, a live coaching experience with myself that's done all on Zoom and you get access to a private community and it really is unlike any other experience that I offer.

[SPEAKER_00]: By the end of the challenge, you'll have unreal clarity on what you're supposed to do online and you'll have the insight on how you can make an extra six or even seven figures.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I said seven figures in your business this year.

[SPEAKER_00]: And if any of those things sound great to you, I want you to join the next content to cast challenge.

[SPEAKER_00]: Scan the QR code if you're watching on a television or click the link in the description.

[SPEAKER_00]: Once you go through it, go ahead and upgrade to VIP because you'll get an extra hour of bonus VIP Q&A with me every single day of the challenge.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so looking forward to seeing you there.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's get back into the combo.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, good.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's so much here that I want to unpack.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you get to a place where you're using a studio or an office consistently in my home in your home.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's go.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then you're not uploading every day.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like you've gotten to over three hundred thousand followers on Instagram in eighteen months, essentially uploading once a week.

[SPEAKER_01]: Once a week and people told me it would never work.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me tell you why I decided once a week.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number one, I believe in quality more than quantity.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was following certain people.

[SPEAKER_01]: And man, one of their videos would be just full of meat.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the next day, they didn't have to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was kind of a waste.

[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I found out that that was a tactic that people just post every day and just they want to be seen.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it will increase their fellowship.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I decided that quality was more important than quantity, number one.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that when somebody clicked on my video, I wanted it to be worth their time.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to earn their listenership.

[SPEAKER_01]: And in order to do that, it had to be something that was helpful.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was my strategy is to do it once a week [SPEAKER_01]: I might increase that, but I wanted to start once a week.

[SPEAKER_01]: Then I'm busy.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I run a big church.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do, I have a consulting company, I have clients, I have an incredible wife of thirty seven years, or I'm madly in love with three grown children and two grandchildren thus far.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I do have a life, and I didn't want this to totally consume me.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I tried it.

[SPEAKER_01]: and once a week for the first few months, and it really didn't take off.

[SPEAKER_01]: I probably had five or six thousand followers, which I was pretty happy with.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I was thinking, man, maybe this is, maybe people don't [SPEAKER_01]: know how to look at their faith in their finances as being together.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said, but I'm gonna keep on doing it because I know this is truth that I'm talking about and I know it's important.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I just kept at it and then I changed the, you know, how I was doing it, which was more of the podcast look, not looking at the camera and then I had a couple of videos that went viral and when I mean viral, I mean millions of views and after that it just went crazy.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm appreciating how people have supported me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't take that for granted, but I do put a lot of work into the content, thinking through every word and I'm doing this to help people to inspire people and to to challenge people and how they see money.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would just attest to that because I feel like I have to watch every time you show up on my feet.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because you could feel the content value, which that's what people need to prioritize.

[SPEAKER_00]: In any case, it's the principle that a content value is more important than production value.

[SPEAKER_00]: Although it is crispy, it sounds amazing.

[SPEAKER_00]: But more important than all those things, what you're saying is more important than how it looks.

[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, there's different approaches.

[SPEAKER_00]: I am a fan of less is more.

[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, people who are building businesses and stuff, their thing is as many eyeballs as possible.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it doesn't matter what kind of eyeballs and eyeball is the goal.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I think it's just, I think your, your process is giving people permission to, [SPEAKER_00]: that it's okay to start with less like you're you're not competing yeah and that you you created a sustainable way yeah like [SPEAKER_00]: If you feel inspired to create a real, it's not like you have to do so much to get it going.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, I am going to venture in the next month or two into longer form content on YouTube to take some of these two minute deals and turn them into twenty minute deals.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm going to be doing some other things podcasting and all of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But overall, [SPEAKER_01]: I believe when you deal with the Bible and spiritual things and when you deal with financial things, you need to know what you're talking about.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't want to just flippantly, just say stuff, you know, and because it's too important, man, our money and our faith.

[SPEAKER_01]: I take a lot of time thinking through what I'm saying.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you're taking responsibility, which is good.

[SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, I'm thinking about something you said, which is really good.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're honoring people's time.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So what's funny is like, although you've went all in on vertical short form content, your short form content in many ways is long on the platform.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So like your Instagram videos could be upwards of two, three minutes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And because you hang on every word or I hang on every word as a viewer, because you're careful, careful for it.

[SPEAKER_00]: But that is a very powerful principle.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's when you create in somebody else's mind.

[SPEAKER_00]: that they're literally getting time back for giving you their attention.

[SPEAKER_00]: They will always keep coming back.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, I'm going to speak in a couple of hours.

[SPEAKER_00]: And one of the biggest principles with YouTube is, is that I want people to get light years of information [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a biblical principle of the presence of God.

[SPEAKER_00]: Better is one day in your house than a thousand elsewhere.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's a principle when you have the Spirit and your teaching truth.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is that when you're exposed to truth and biblical principles?

[SPEAKER_00]: you can get a God idea or an inspiration that can take care of decades or, you know, no doubt.

[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, no doubt.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I try to shorten it a little bit, but I don't want to cheat people out of some good principles.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so some of them will be a little shorter before the most part, two, no more than three minutes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of how most of my videos are.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's cool that you invited your son in the process.

[SPEAKER_00]: Some people don't have that luxury or our own college or maybe some people don't have that ability to do that or invite somebody to help them.

[SPEAKER_00]: What would you have done if you didn't have help?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well let me tell you what I have seen people my age do which I think it's a big mistake and I did not do this and it helps me tremendously.

[SPEAKER_01]: That is to embrace the young generation to realize that you can learn something from young people.

[SPEAKER_01]: So my children who are grown [SPEAKER_01]: They're always coming to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, Dan, let me show you the latest thing, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, all ears.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said, guys, don't let me get old.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: I literally tell them that don't let me get old.

[SPEAKER_01]: Don't let me get outdated.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me know what's happening.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it was a natural consequence of my son and I working together because we're always talking about what's going on in the world.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he's always making sure that I stay up to speed on stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so he had been telling me, he said, mom and dad, and he even tells my wife and we're, by the way, we're going to be launching some things on money and marriage here this fall, a whole podcast and everything and of course as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: But he would say, hey, man, and we're even called me, man, it goes me dead.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, but he says, hey, dad, [SPEAKER_01]: young people and everybody would really benefit for what you're saying and what you're doing and your experience.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you need to let me come and shoot you and you just need to talk and I was like, I just took it for granted.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, I don't think it's that special.

[SPEAKER_01]: He kept, he was the one who told me.

[SPEAKER_01]: how special it was, and how he has benefited, being my son.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I said, okay, I'll do it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's been pretty cool working with my son, but the most important thing is it's allowed me to grow.

[SPEAKER_01]: And now my son is mentoring me in some areas.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's causing me to live out my latter years being very productive and relevant.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But if you didn't have him, would you just go with your phone?

[SPEAKER_00]: Would you have, um, well, I mean, I know that it was your reality to just tap his shoulder.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would have used just use my phone.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would have done it anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I have enough young people in my life that I could pull from my staff at church.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the bottom line, I would have done it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: anyway because God was dealing with me about this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Remember I told you how I felt.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, don't die with this in you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so that was really driving me.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, I got to get what's in me out of me.

[SPEAKER_01]: The experience, the expertise, the good, the bad, the ugly, all the mistakes I've made.

[SPEAKER_01]: Man, there's a story behind all these things that can help people.

[SPEAKER_00]: the few that have gone super viral for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is there a pattern you've seen with them?

[SPEAKER_01]: Not really, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've been studying it and I looked at like, I think I've done seventy five or seventy six videos in a year and a half and over ten of them have a million plus views.

[SPEAKER_01]: one has thirteen and a half million views quite a few of them have six seven million five million four million three million so that's that's pretty incredible so obviously I'm like okay man maybe I did something on all thirteen of those videos and I studied it [SPEAKER_01]: And I think there are some principles.

[SPEAKER_01]: The hook, you got to catch people's attention pretty much right off the bat.

[SPEAKER_01]: But here's a deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people have a great hook and then the content doesn't match the hook and you're disappointed.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you don't want to come back to it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So one of the things I wanted to do are two things.

[SPEAKER_01]: a good hook, a legitimate hook, not just a hook to get people to listen, but then to give them more than just a hook, to give them some good, meaty content.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then thirdly, to try to talk about some of my personal challenges and successes to personalize it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, and I chose those older to three things, hook, [SPEAKER_01]: backing the hook up with good solid content and then personalizing it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I would say lastly encouraging people.

[SPEAKER_01]: You do do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which is really cool.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's this thing I teach where it's a visual hook.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And a visual hook would be like, maybe you're saying a hook, but if somebody had their phone off, there is a, you know, just a headline.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Visual headline.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would say just off record your a visual hook.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow, thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, just like, I want to look like you went out.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're a straight up.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: Work hard to stay in shape.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Try to stay young.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, something that's really cool is you did this without any motive to see what you can get from it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it is, it's interesting hearing you process eighteen months later.

[SPEAKER_00]: a handful of viral videos, and by the way, the principle is you uploaded seventy-six high value pieces of content in eighteen months, and that's why the ten twelve, it's because of the overall thing is why those did.

[SPEAKER_00]: But we're talking and just now you're thinking about ways to get people off the platform more into your world and even monetize the audience with deeper help.

[SPEAKER_01]: Here's what I said and I say this with all humility, but I didn't need social media to feel successful.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had already had a successful twenty-five-year career.

[SPEAKER_01]: God has blessed our church and I do a lot of things behind the scenes to help a lot of people.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I did not enter the content world trying to be famous, trying to be successful.

[SPEAKER_01]: I literally entered it to help people and to get what was in me out of me.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I figured I would let the market determine the value.

[SPEAKER_01]: I thought I had value.

[SPEAKER_01]: But you really don't know until you put yourself out there.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I was shocked that the reception was so great.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it really validated what I thought.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I think the natural progression is people are following me because they appreciate the content.

[SPEAKER_01]: They benefit from it.

[SPEAKER_01]: They like me.

[SPEAKER_01]: God has given me favor with them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so now I want to take them deeper because there's more where that game from.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I can do more longer form.

[SPEAKER_01]: I could do some more group coaching and some community things that I can launch.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there's a lot more there that I did not want to do any of that unless there was a demand for it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because I think a lot of people put that ahead of the thing and then it prevents them from even starting or overthinking, but if you're just really giving you and let that be the focus it usually the byproduct and the overflow of that will you know turn into resources.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's something you've mentioned multiple times is like get what's inside of me out.

[SPEAKER_00]: In order to get something and you have to be intentional with what you're consuming, can you help me?

[SPEAKER_00]: I love learning.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love the Bible.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love podcasts.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love value content.

[SPEAKER_00]: But some people don't have much value to give but many times it's just because there's nothing inside in regards to putting the content and how can you how can you encourage people to like [SPEAKER_00]: make sure what's inside of them.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, a lot of people have have fed themselves junk through much of their life and are still feeding themselves junk.

[SPEAKER_01]: Junk and junk out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the best way to get something out of you that can benefit people is to make sure what's coming inside of you is good.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the reason I felt like what was coming out of me would be good because I know how I worked so hard for since my twenties to make sure that what I consumed was something that was beneficial and that could be [SPEAKER_01]: the church I went to, the mentors that I had, some of my favorite TV preachers, you know, and people who I listened to, how about this, the books I read and consumed, and then the experiences that I had, the good ones, the bad ones, and the ugly ones, in business and finance.

[SPEAKER_01]: When I put all that together, and then you just live life, [SPEAKER_01]: I felt like I had something to offer.

[SPEAKER_01]: I believe most people have something to offer because the world is so big and our experiences are so vast and diverse.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I will say that the more junk you put in your life, which it's junk or whatever you put in consist of, books you read, people you have in your life, what you learn from, who you learn from, a lot of experiences.

[SPEAKER_01]: The higher the quality that goes in, the better the quality will be when it comes out.

[SPEAKER_01]: I put a lot of work into my life, making sure that quality came in.

[SPEAKER_01]: And what people are benefiting from in my life right now, as a pastor, as a business guy, as a content creator, are things that I intentionally consumed to make me better, and people who are hung around to sharpen me.

[SPEAKER_00]: In your journey of building successful businesses, communicating in different contexts, but consistently on a weekly basis at church, now in video, and I would classify you as a master communicator.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: What are some things people can do to get better at communicating?

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for that compliment.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm still learning.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't consider myself a master communicator, but I would consider myself an effective communicator, which means you can move the hearts and minds of people, which is a gift.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't take that gift for granted.

[SPEAKER_01]: I used to.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't think it was a big deal at first, but it's a very big deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the things that I think people need to do who want to communicate for living, whether it's through writing, whether it's through speaking, content creation, is first of all be authentic, be themselves.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to admit something to you.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the most insecure moments I had in my life is when I became a pastor.

[SPEAKER_01]: because I had been listening to some of the greatest preaching for most of my adult life.

[SPEAKER_01]: TD Jakes and Dr.

Tony Evans and Andy Stanley and I could just name so many of them.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had consumed their stuff and I said, man, [SPEAKER_01]: I can't touch these guys.

[SPEAKER_01]: What am I doing?

[SPEAKER_01]: Standing behind a pulpit.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can't talk like them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it made me feel very insecure when I started the church.

[SPEAKER_01]: By the way, which I think was great.

[SPEAKER_01]: because I had to depend on the Holy Spirit and not my own skill set.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it also taught me that, hey, I can't be like them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, I tried, I tried teaching preaching like TV Jakes.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was practiced any good.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was in a shower, man, with a deep narrative voice.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it just didn't work for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said the only person I know how to be like is me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so after wrestling my first year as a pastor with my preaching style, I just said, look, I'm a former business guy.

[SPEAKER_01]: The way I see the Bible is very linear and it's very practical.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I know deep concepts theologically, but I'm not trying to impress people with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the bottom line, I had to learn how to become authentic and to be me, to be the person God made me.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's the first thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say the second thing is when we speak, when we produce content, it's not for us, it's for others.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're not speaking to impress.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're speaking to empower.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I always keep that in mind when I go speak when I do a video, this is not for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not trying to get the attention.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is for the hears and the people on the other side of that camera lens and the people sitting in those seats on Sunday.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm here to serve them.

[SPEAKER_01]: through this thing called content and communication.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So those are the three things.

[SPEAKER_01]: They good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, that's that's so good because what it's a funny thing that we do as far as people who love communication because I mean, you're paying attention.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would I would argue the guys you were watching [SPEAKER_00]: You're not necessarily watching for the content you were watching for the delivery.

[SPEAKER_00]: No doubt.

[SPEAKER_00]: And the attack and the storytelling and the inflection.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, the way it helped me, by the way, and there were a few little nuances of copy.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and you'll be a culmination or yeah, a culmination of all the voices that we feel drawn to.

[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, similarly in the same sense of not knowing, for me, it was like, do I hold a microphone?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I am a natural teacher and I like using my hands.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I found early on when I started preaching.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was, I was so focused on the content.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: that I needed to get so much content to them, which doesn't always empower, you know, it sometimes get overwhelmed and overwhelmed people don't take action and they don't, you know, take the next step and I found that like as I got more [SPEAKER_00]: I guess comfortable within my voice.

[SPEAKER_00]: I realized a few things and that was as students of communication and somebody who studied it and also as a student of the Bible, being in Las Vegas, having healthy assumptions or knowing who I'm talking to, influenced what I was gonna say.

[SPEAKER_00]: And one healthiest assumption I have, which I hate that it is a healthiest assumption, is that most of the people [SPEAKER_00]: aren't reading their bibles consistently and then most of the people are going through it and most of the people are in valley seasons and so they're not coming to get my super duper insight [SPEAKER_00]: They're actually coming to hear what comes naturally as an overflow of my obsession of the things I'm studying.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, so I've learned to like not stress so much or put too much pressure in recently, especially in the business base.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I've been doing content for nineteen years.

[SPEAKER_00]: I started making vlogs when I was in high school.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so when I get asked to speak, [SPEAKER_00]: I actually am like what's what's this simple thing and I just draw a lot of connections to that just being okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, that's good.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you said something I was asked a question a person asked me so that you've been pastoring in a thirteen and a half years.

[SPEAKER_01]: What would you do different?

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, that first year, I was too focused on content, delivering this content, perfect theological interpretation, and all that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, I should have been a little bit more focused on the people and their problems and all of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'll learn how to do that, eventually.

[SPEAKER_01]: But now there were some things as a communicator that I needed to work on.

[SPEAKER_01]: My natural voice is more monotone.

[SPEAKER_01]: So my natural voice stays within.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I had to learn how to do voice inflection.

[SPEAKER_01]: So as I became a content creator and as I became a pastor in a preacher, I didn't like the way I sound it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hated it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Still not crazy about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I love your, what do they call it?

[SPEAKER_00]: Your tamper.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: The sweet spot of your voice.

[SPEAKER_00]: And thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I get a lot of compliments, but you know, sometimes we don't like ourselves in certain areas.

[SPEAKER_01]: But there were a few things I felt like I needed to work on.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I worked especially in a live setting.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that was my voice inflection, getting excited and raising my voice.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then saying something and slowing it down and pacing and all of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So when I study speakers like some of the guys I mentioned, like a Bishop TD Jakes or Dr.

Tony Evans or Andy Stanley to name a few, I noticed that they were masters and how they used their voice.

[SPEAKER_01]: So as I was learning how to connect with people verbally, I still had to make some changes along the way.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's still a point where it becomes natural.

[SPEAKER_00]: You do it and then you watch your sermon back and you're like, oh, snap, I did it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But in the moment, I wasn't conscious of it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, those are fun moments.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, can we talk a little bit on the financial side of things?

[SPEAKER_00]: I've been I've been blessed to be exposed.

[SPEAKER_00]: I got saved at twenty and just went all in for the Lord and got plugged into the local church.

[SPEAKER_00]: I've got married young and tied on a very small paycheck, which which was good because once I started making a lot of money, [SPEAKER_00]: It, you know, I was glad to give it.

[SPEAKER_00]: When it comes to the Tive, can you bring clarity on that?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because I get a lot of people who say, man, it's not New Testament, New Covenant.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, and my think it's like, it's a principle.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was also pre-law.

[SPEAKER_00]: Anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you, you just kind of see it what I was going to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: First of all, it's a principle.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to hail if you don't tie.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately, I'll tell you the bad part first.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately, the church has beat people up, brow beat people over this issue, and that never works in the long term.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then it giving should be out of a heart of love and gratitude.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now there should be some obligation to giving because I love my wife, but I am obligated to provide for her and my family.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it's still out of a heart of love.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, Tyving was predated before the law.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then once the law came, they had all of these restrictions and things around it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it became more, you know, something you had to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then in the New Testament, the Pharisees took it to another level.

[SPEAKER_01]: It became legalism, you know.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, Tyving is a principle that has never been [SPEAKER_01]: a note, it was no point where Jesus said, you shouldn't type.

[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, he affirmed it in Matthew, twenty three, twenty three when he was rebuking the Pharisees, or he was using them, has a object lesson of what not to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says, you tie the met and kune in and this and that, but you neglect way to your things.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we affirmed that, yeah, you may tie.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's good.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's cool, but there are some other things that are just as important.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I believe Typing is a legitimate, biblical principle that should be practiced by Christians for various reasons.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number one, it keeps us focused on where our blessings and our provision comes from.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's a good practical way to stay focused.

[SPEAKER_01]: Secondly, percentage giving is just a good practical way to give.

[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe you're not a tie, they're your five percentor.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, one of the ways to increase your giving and to give more to the kingdom is say, you know what, this year I'm gonna up that to seven percent.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the next year, ten percent.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the next year above that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So just from a practical standpoint, man, it, it makes sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: But then, thirdly, for me, now this is just for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't grow it with a lot of money.

[SPEAKER_01]: I made money really fast for that one year in pro football.

[SPEAKER_01]: I felt like I needed something to keep me focused and to keep me from becoming greedy and selfish, which was a natural inclination of mine.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, tiving helped me to keep my eyes on Jesus and to keep me to stay focused and to keep Christ first.

[SPEAKER_01]: So those are just some of my thoughts.

[SPEAKER_01]: I at our church, we teach tiving, but we don't beat people up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we don't condemn them if they don't, but we do challenge people to implement that as a spiritual discipline.

[SPEAKER_01]: No different than us challenging people to pray.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a spiritual discipline.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can you speak just briefly on prosperity gospel?

[SPEAKER_00]: There is a thing out there where people believe or camps believe [SPEAKER_00]: the more poor I am, the more holy I am.

[SPEAKER_00]: And like the concept that God wants to bless your life and bless you is, I don't know, the people don't want to accept that.

[SPEAKER_00]: But can you, in all your years of being in church and how you've even seen probably this swing of things on you?

[SPEAKER_00]: on that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've been around a long time and I've seen a lot of fads come and go.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm going to give you three quick perspectives that I have seen in the church and the last perspective is the best one.

[SPEAKER_01]: The first perspective is what I call the poverty mentality or scarcity mentality.

[SPEAKER_01]: or you could call it poverty theology.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is, Christians should suffer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now we may not verbalize it, but we think that [SPEAKER_01]: that God does not want us to enjoy material things.

[SPEAKER_01]: We think that we are closer to God, the more we suffer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, there is some virtue in suffering, okay?

[SPEAKER_01]: Occasionally, all right.

[SPEAKER_01]: But these people feel guilty.

[SPEAKER_01]: They see their spirituality as [SPEAKER_01]: having nothing to do with their financial advancement, and they just have a poverty mentality.

[SPEAKER_01]: They feel closer to God, the more they struggle, and they relate their relationship with God to struggle.

[SPEAKER_01]: And by the way, the reason I know that is a prevalent way of thinking is because I kind of came from an environment like that as a child.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the church I grew up in, people talked about money like it was bad and dangerous, which it can be.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I just didn't hear money talked about in a very positive way.

[SPEAKER_01]: So poverty mentality.

[SPEAKER_01]: The second thing is a prosperity theology.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is the extreme of the opposite of the poverty thing, where you equate your spirituality to your material possessions.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the reason you have a Mercedes or a big house is because you have great faith in God.

[SPEAKER_01]: And with the reason people don't have it is because they don't have the faith.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you equate your faith with material things and the more material things you acquire, that means you have a greater faith.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is not biblical at all.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some great people in the Bible who were close to God struggled at times financially, like the Apostle Paul.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: What I tell people is what I call the stewardship, theology.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is, God gives us resources to handle.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's different for everybody.

[SPEAKER_01]: Our job is to be a faithful steward.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we could be a [SPEAKER_01]: a five talent steward where we could become multimillionaires if that's what God has put in you or a hundred thousand airs or whatever it doesn't matter what matters is we're supposed to maximize our God-given stewardship potential.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when we, and that's Bible, I mean, that's a parable of the stewards right there.

[SPEAKER_01]: The guy who put it in the ground was severely castigated and rebuked because he didn't grow it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So prosperity.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of people get a bum wrap for teaching prosperity.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we should want a prosper.

[SPEAKER_01]: We want to stay the same.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Who shouldn't you should want to grow?

[SPEAKER_01]: You should want to be better tomorrow than you are today.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I believe in that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I believe I want to prosper.

[SPEAKER_01]: I believe in prosperity.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just don't believe in the prosperity theology where I base my relationship with Jesus.

[SPEAKER_01]: on how much material things I accumulate.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I do believe that God can use suffering, just like he can use prosperity.

[SPEAKER_01]: He can use them both to draw us closer to him.

[SPEAKER_00]: When it comes to the prosperity thing, it's a how healthy do you want to be?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's healthy as possible.

[SPEAKER_00]: How safe do you want to be?

[SPEAKER_00]: You know how smart do you want to be?

[SPEAKER_00]: And then it's like how rich do you want to be?

[SPEAKER_00]: And it nervous people get nervous and I follow a guy who says we grew up thinking it was rude to talk about money and he would say I believe it's rude to not talk about money.

[SPEAKER_00]: and the reality is is the more money became more of a tool is the more I realized had no real, you know, it's just, it's just, it's just a tool, it's just a tool.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but have you ever made an investment that was risky and had a big loss?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, first of all, I love how you frame that.

[SPEAKER_01]: You said, would you want to be more healthy?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, who would?

[SPEAKER_01]: Would you want to be smarter or more intelligent?

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do you want to grow closer to God?

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: Would you like to have more money and prosperity or whatever?

[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's amazing when it comes to this money thing, we get freaked out about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me make a quick statement that I read in a book.

[SPEAKER_01]: I might have been John Wesley who said this.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said, earn as much as you can.

[SPEAKER_01]: Give as much as you can and save as much as you can.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I've always kind of said, you know, I just want to be the best I can be in those areas.

[SPEAKER_01]: But you ask about, have I ever lost money?

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm even going to expand that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Have I even even made some bad financial decisions?

[SPEAKER_01]: And answer to that is yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll mention one or two things.

[SPEAKER_01]: I fell into the trap in my early thirties once I started making hundreds of thousands of dollars in my net worth.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now it's no big deal like now millennials make hundreds of thousands of millions, but man back in the early nineteen nineties to make two or three hundred thousand dollars and to be knocking on a million dollar net worth or to have a million dollar net worth as a African-American.

[SPEAKER_01]: Young that was almost unprecedented.

[SPEAKER_01]: I let it go to my head.

[SPEAKER_01]: I fell back into the trap of wanting to show people that I had money, that I was successful.

[SPEAKER_01]: In other words, I cared more about looking wealthy than being wealthy.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I started buying stuff that I could afford, but [SPEAKER_01]: I should have concentrated more on building my net worth in my future.

[SPEAKER_01]: And thank God I called myself doing that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I felt like I wasted some money on some cars and things like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I missed out on some opportunities to invest that would have been worth millions.

[SPEAKER_01]: And some of those were real estate opportunities.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had a buddy of mine.

[SPEAKER_01]: who told me back in the early nineties about a sleepy beach town, uh, off of the Gulf Coast of Florida called Destin Florida.

[SPEAKER_01]: Dang.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he said, man, I'm investing there.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I had enough money to buck up.

[SPEAKER_01]: a condo or so and rented out and I said, no, I want to Mercedes.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I ended up buying cars instead.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I like to tell people that I may be the only guy walking, you know, who spent over a million dollars on a Mercedes because that's how much that decision calls to me by me turning it down.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's number one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number two, the second biggest financial [SPEAKER_01]: experience I had that was negative.

[SPEAKER_01]: Was two thousand eight nine and ten and this one was not my fault.

[SPEAKER_01]: The subprime mortgage crisis, the great recession, home prices went down, the stock market went down.

[SPEAKER_01]: And my income as an investment advisor got cut about sixty percent plus.

[SPEAKER_01]: My net worth went down about sixty or seventy percent.

[SPEAKER_01]: Why did it go down so much?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because all of my money except for my emergency fund was on the stock market.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I had some money in commercial real estate and I got crushed.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was a time where I didn't do anything wrong, and circumstances dealt me some bad cards, and I had to deal with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I dug myself out, and I had to learn how to put the principles that I spoke about to people all over the country, I had to implement them, and climb my way back to multimillionaire status, but it was very difficult.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was somewhat embarrassing.

[SPEAKER_01]: because to lose that much money.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the first year was no big deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: Had an emergency fund, I had stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: But then you're thinking, okay, it's gonna come back.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I double down on some investments and it got worse.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I have experienced financial adversity that has been my fault.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I have experienced financial adversity that has not been my fault, but I still had to deal with it.

[SPEAKER_00]: What do you see in the current financial market today?

[SPEAKER_00]: Are we healthy?

[SPEAKER_00]: Is there signs of something based on history?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think we're healthy.

[SPEAKER_01]: I believe we're going to get healthier.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the problem is human beings have this major problem called the sin nature.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the way that shows up in the financial markets is through this word called greed.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm starting to see greed and profit be prioritized over people.

[SPEAKER_01]: and every time I have seen that, it did not end well.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just like the sub-prime mortgage crisis, that happened because Wall Street got greedy.

[SPEAKER_01]: They said, we can package these loans, man, and people don't have to have great credit anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: We can do no dot loans and no documentation, and they weren't trying to help people become home buyers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, in the way they were, that was the justification.

[SPEAKER_01]: If we package these things more people could buy homes, but the real underlying issue was great.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it brought the whole economy down.

[SPEAKER_01]: I am seeing signs of that right now on the political side.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I am concerned.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do I believe we got a next couple of years that could be pretty awesome?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if the rate we're going, no, I don't believe it's going to end well.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hope it does.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not a doomsday guy, but I'm saying this enormous greed.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what concerns me.

[SPEAKER_00]: Great.

[SPEAKER_00]: Great observation.

[SPEAKER_00]: I have two more things.

[SPEAKER_00]: One is what is it like you interpret this question the way you you desire to to be a pastor where your congregation knows your multi-millionaire.

[SPEAKER_01]: My congregation knows that I had a career before I became a pastor.

[SPEAKER_01]: That I was very successful in.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's number one.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't acquire all of my wealth from being in ministry and being a pastor.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that helps tremendously.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number two.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd like to practice what I preach.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if I preach to them that if you handle money God's way and if you are generous, that God will reward you your faithfulness, then the natural outcome of faithfulness should be financial increase.

[SPEAKER_01]: The money that I do earn from our church and through other ministry and business ventures, I try to treat it well so it will grow and I can do the right things.

[SPEAKER_01]: So for me not to be successful financially, for me not to be a multimillionaire, to me would be a shame.

[SPEAKER_01]: especially at my age with my experience.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, I don't see a conflict of pastors becoming multimillionaires as long as they are doing it in a integral way.

[SPEAKER_01]: and they are being a good steward and just growing their assets naturally.

[SPEAKER_00]: So good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Are you real estate stocks?

[SPEAKER_00]: How does someone decide?

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm more of a stock guy, but let me tell you why that was my career for twenty five years.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then it doesn't take a lot of your time and energy.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd have invested in commercial real estate and I've kind of fallen in love with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I did a commercial deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: joint venture is for our church though we bought a huge property that is some of it will be used for ministry some of it will be used for business but I was the person behind the whole thing you know I got the whole team together and I did the development you know and [SPEAKER_01]: So I kind of fell in love with commercial stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I am doing some commercial things on the side.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I'm more of a stock guy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I like the stock market and it doesn't take a lot of your energy and time to make money from it.

[SPEAKER_01]: How long have you been married?

[SPEAKER_01]: I've been married for thirty seven and a half years.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've been married in nineteen eighty eight nineteen eighty eight.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's when my wife was born.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so yeah, I mean, my your kids are probably close to my age.

[SPEAKER_01]: There they're there.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're a thirty one through thirty five three three.

[SPEAKER_00]: I just turned thirty four.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: How do you, how do you last in marriage?

[SPEAKER_00]: How do you keep the fire lit?

[SPEAKER_00]: being a pastor and people to put a demand on your life, all those things, how do you do that well?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not easy, but I would say number one, you have to marry well and I marry just an incredible woman.

[SPEAKER_01]: But when we got married, we married because we were in love and we had a lot of all the romantic things were certainly there.

[SPEAKER_01]: But overriding that was our purpose.

[SPEAKER_01]: We felt like God brought us together for a deeper purpose.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we've always had Christ in the center of our marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we've always been very cognizant that God brought us together to do ministry to advance the kingdom of God.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we've tried to do that and the Lord has blessed our efforts.

[SPEAKER_01]: Other than that, man, we're great friends.

[SPEAKER_01]: We like to have fun.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have some friends who are Christian counselors.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they serve secular, I'm sorry, secular and Christian couples.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they say that Christian couples struggle more with intimacy issues and marriage issues than their secular couples.

[SPEAKER_01]: Why is that?

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of times we allow our religion to hurt our life instead of enhancing it.

[SPEAKER_01]: We forget how to have fun, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I flirt with my wife.

[SPEAKER_01]: I chase her around the house.

[SPEAKER_01]: I date her.

[SPEAKER_01]: We vacation together.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hold her hand.

[SPEAKER_01]: I look in her eyes.

[SPEAKER_01]: I did not reduce my pursuit of her.

[SPEAKER_01]: As the longer we stay, Mary, the more in love I became and the more I try to win a diner.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can you just end it with an encouragement for people, my age?

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm thirty-four.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm experiencing a lot of success right now.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm trying to exhibit wisdom and patience and [SPEAKER_00]: the laid gratification, just got a second investment property, trying to do those things.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I feel the, I feel the, the nice stuff, the cars, the, help me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Man, what first of all, I want you to know I'm proud of you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not only proud of you, I'm proud of your generation.

[SPEAKER_01]: And let me just speak to that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I'll give you some warnings.

[SPEAKER_01]: My generation, which I came out of college in the nineteen eighties, we were the first generation that had enormous opportunities because my parents grew up in the silver rights era.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so for many African-Americans, my age, we were to get a good education and get a good job and climb the corporate ladder.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that worked for a lot of us.

[SPEAKER_01]: But what I love about your generation, it's create your own job, control your own destiny.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I love that entrepreneurial spirit that you all have.

[SPEAKER_01]: My concern is you're still human and you're still young and money can consume you and it can consume you through comparison, through competition, through priorities getting mixed up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so my advice to you and your generation would be to keep that fire burning for entrepreneurship and making money and building wealth, but to make sure that you have justice much fire for things that don't have anything to do with money.

[SPEAKER_01]: And those are things like your family, your spiritual life.

[SPEAKER_01]: giving to other people your time and helping other people because that balance is those other things off.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I would say, balance, not a perfect balance.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they're always going to be seasons where you work a little harder, but making sure that you are giving and serving a purpose.

[SPEAKER_01]: and not just making money to post it on Instagram and to flex about what you have.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me say this last day, in my generation, and some of this is a little old school that I'm telling you, we didn't flex a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: We didn't want everybody to know how much money we were making.

[SPEAKER_01]: Certain people, but not everybody, not the whole world.

[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, that could work against us.

[SPEAKER_01]: I am a little bothered by the young generation that they tail all their business.

[SPEAKER_01]: They put everything online, how much money to make it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm just saying that's just not always wise.

[SPEAKER_01]: So wealth whispers.

[SPEAKER_01]: riches and immature money shouts.

[SPEAKER_01]: The wealthiest people I know don't feel like they have to tell everybody everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: And in maturity makes you not feel the urge to have to prove something to people.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm at the stage in my life and I've been here for more than a decade or so.

[SPEAKER_01]: Where I don't have anything to prove to anybody.

[SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to know that I'm a multimillionaire.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have to show you that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Money is peace, money is freedom, and money is power to me, the power to help people, to power to have influence.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's all I need.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's peace, freedom, and power to do some things.

[SPEAKER_01]: What people think doesn't matter.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it took me to be almost fifty years old before I got like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would love to see you get like that in your generation, a little earlier than fifty.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, whispers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, whispers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Where can people find you and connect with you?

[SPEAKER_01]: My favorite platform is Instagram at the stewardship coach.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can also find me on TikTok at the stewardship coach or just lead Jenkins, which is my personal platform, Lee Allen Jenkins.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or you can go to my website, Lee Jenkins' stewardship, and I'm going to be redoing this site, but you'll find that a little bit more about how I serve people, especially churches, and I'm going to be coming out with my coaching programs and things like that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'll link it all up at the bottom and speaking of Instagram being your faith.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, are you, are you invested in meta?

[SPEAKER_00]: I am, because apparently, I think last week, I think it did really good by it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have stock.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there and have for a long time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, I'm old enough to remember me when the internet first came out.

[SPEAKER_01]: and I wish I had just poured money in it, but AI is the next big move what we're seeing now is just the beginning.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some of those stocks we need to pay attention to.

[SPEAKER_00]: I appreciate you and more than me appreciating you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I honor you and thank you for setting the example for guys like me.

[SPEAKER_00]: I see so many similarities and [SPEAKER_00]: I felt I feel like I unicorn sometimes and that's only because I don't know who to look at for and after.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I feel like drawing a supernatural connection.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because of your interest passions, integrity and your heart for the local church and all those things.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so grateful for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: And thank you for doing this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I appreciate it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've always felt like a unicorn.

[SPEAKER_01]: But now I see what God was doing with me the whole while.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I feel like he's going to do the same thing with you.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is doing it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you continue being a unicorn because you're making a huge difference, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: I receive that.

[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Shoutout to, was it studios?

[SPEAKER_00]: Leader pass studios.

[SPEAKER_00]: Leader pass studios in North Cross, Georgia.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and then if you're Atlanta, we would say the greater Atlanta area.

[SPEAKER_00]: Just want to thank them.

[SPEAKER_00]: And thank you guys for watching.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, if you're still watching or listening, you're what I like to call department fan.

[SPEAKER_00]: So DM me on Instagram and just say, Hey, I watched through the whole thing and I just want to connect with you.

[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: Man, all right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Man, that was incredible.

[SPEAKER_01]: That might have been one of the best interviews I've ever had.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's conversations.

[SPEAKER_01]: You.