So sometimes I would say it's like takes 3 minutes of making a difficult decision.

But then on the other side of it, you can find a positive environment and focus less on.

I was very concerned about other people thought I was very concerned about what other people were doing and we need to do that too.

Like I was very concerned about checking all the check boxes in the curriculum or whatever, those external things that now I'm like, OK, this is not as important as I thought it was.

Hello sweet friends, and welcome back to the Schoolhouse Rock podcast.

I'm Kristy Clover, and I'm excited to be your host again this week.

I have my dear friend Tricia Goyer back with me.

But last week we tackled some of the emotional challenges of raising preteens and teens.

And if you missed that episode, definitely go back and listen.

But today we're going to be diving into the relationship side of parenting our preteens.

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Alrighty my friends, I'm back.

And today I'm bringing Tricia Goyer back on the show with me.

So welcome back to the show, Tricia.

Thank you Christy, it's always so fun chatting with you.

Oh, I love it.

I know I I love these opportunities just to try to get you to, you know, unload all of that wisdom that you have for everyone out there.

I've.

Been homeschooling well my oldest is 35, Christy.

No way this.

Has been a while, yes.

So wow.

My first home school conference was 1992.

I've been doing this like this is the in the in the pioneer days of home schooling.

I always graduated from high school in 92.

I know.

Amazing, amazing.

But yeah, so you've you've been there, done that.

Been there, done that.

No.

Well then you know, what I wanted to kind of kick off with as you talk through this is, well, I think if you've homeschooled for a hot 2nd or even thought about homeschooling, you have heard the question that like everyone talks about, like what about socialization?

And I kind of giggle because it really depends on my mood and how I answer because I've got so many different ways to answer that.

But I want to look at the other side of that question.

And how do we actually help our kids to find and form healthy, like minded friendships?

You know, like the ones that you want your kids to be social with?

I think this is one of the hardest things going on today because there are even within Christian families, different levels of what they let their kids do, what they don't let their kids do.

And then just what kids, our kids enjoy getting along with doing things with.

And so I think when it comes, when kids, I'm, I'm really like, OK, what is a group of kids that I really, I enjoy just them as a group and figure out how to connect my kids there.

And then within that group, they will find their individual friendship.

So I have two examples that just from last year.

So I'm so glad you brought this up.

1 is our homeschool basketball.

So Casey played homeschool basketball two years ago and didn't make a lot of good connections on the team.

I'm trying to be kind.

There's just a struggle because I'm like, are some of the parents going to be listening to this podcast?

I don't know like.

It was it was a struggle for my child.

We'll just say this.

And so I, I talked to some other parents and one parents was on a different team in a different town.

And she's like, you know what, just come here.

And it was such a good move for him.

The kids pulled him in it because I will say, you know, he all kids have quirks.

He just has some quirks.

And the kids were just like, they just loved him.

They just brought him in.

He became one of the team and, and it really made such a huge difference.

And you know, we had to talk about like, why did you switch?

Why did you go like on both sides, on both parents?

And I'm like, you know what, We were just, we were just looking for a switch and it just works for family.

You don't have to explain anything else.

But I will say that was a great move for our family and the types of kids.

Not that they're like best friends and he's hanging out with these kids all the day every day, you know, but we are having connections.

We're doing stuff with them.

And just as a group, they were a much more positive group of kids than the other group.

And then same with the home school Co-op.

We had just some, it was just personality things.

We're not working with some of the kids.

I'm teaching at a different one and that group of kids and it's not that again, we're trying to say anything against someone elses kids because they get along.

They had great relationships with each other right?

But we for my kids to find good friendships and so we made a big Co-op switch.

So sometimes I always say it's like takes 3 minutes of making a difficult decision, but then on the other side of it, you can find a positive environment.

And so these days is there a group of kids Co-op youth groups?

And it really is worth the investment.

Even if it's a change, even if other people might have questions, even if they're other people are are are feeling like you've abandoned ship, it's worth it for our kids to surround them with people that they're going to connect and that are going to be positive influences on them.

And it helps that also, I have adult kids.

And So what seems really, really hard in the moment, because my kids, my older ones are 3532 and 31.

I'm like, it'll be fine.

10 years from now, this isn't going to be an issue.

It'll be really hard for me to call up this Co-op or call up whatever and make the switch.

But I think when I was younger and those were my older kids, and I would get so stressed out about it or even having to call a parent and talk about a situation like now I'm like 10 years from now and it'll be fine.

And so it has helped me so much having adult kids, knowing that it's worth it to be advocates for my kids and find good places where they get surround themselves with good people.

Yeah, no, I mean, I think it really is that perspective.

When you start having adult children, you start being like, I stressed way too much about these things.

In fact, my one of my older boys, I always giggles.

They're like, you were not this relaxed with us.

I'm like, I know, I'm sorry.

I should have been, but I didn't know.

Like, you know, you're just in like the world is dangerous and.

So, but yeah, Nathan, who's 31, Nathan who's 31, Casey, he was 14, was like, you are such a strict mom.

And Nathan just started laughing.

He's like, you have no idea.

The mom I had, I feel I have relaxed, but also like I feel like I'm focused more on the things that do matter.

I focus less, which are, you know, the heart issues type of stuff and focus less less on.

I was very concerned about other people thought I was very concerned about what other people were doing and we need to do that too.

Like I was very concerned about checking all the check boxes in the curriculum or whatever, those external things that now I'm like, OK, this is not as important as I thought it was.

I know, you know, and I remember when my oldest were young and I had a friend who had older kids and like her youngest, the youngest child was my oldest child.

And if you're watching her and thinking like she's crazy, I can't believe all the things she lets her kids do.

Like, you know, like, Oh my goodness.

Like I was so scared.

And I'm like, you know, like watching, I'm like, oh, that, like it was just so scary and getting out.

I'm that mom.

I mean, relax.

Yeah, I'm like, oh, you're not gonna finish that curriculum?

Don't worry about it.

They're like looking at me.

Like what?

I know I'm giggling because I literally was sitting at your kitchen table as we were in between conferences and I was staying with you.

And then my oldest at the time, who was, I want to say my even 14.

Grant was I think 14, maybe 15.

And he was flying by himself from San Diego and going to meet us in Nashville.

And he like, his connecting flight got cancelled.

And I was like, he's going to be in Texas as you literally got to.

And you were so relaxed.

You're like, Christy, it's all going to work out.

I'm like, but my son's going to be in a different state.

I can't get to him.

And you're like, it's going to be fine.

And I'm like, she doesn't understand.

No, you're like, it's, it's fine.

See.

You got to watch me panic.

Yeah, I, I, Christy, I was just talking about you earlier, too, because when you stayed through that time, I'm like the best guest to have over is another homeschooling mom because I like me doing something in the kitchen and you, I turn around and you're like, you're doing, you're like doing the next thing.

I'm like, this is like a miracle.

This is so nice.

Having another homeschooling mom as a guest was like, so fun.

Well, because I get it.

Like, you know, I think I was helping you fold your laundry at some point.

I'm like, can I help?

And you're like, yes, like so.

Please you you've.

Got it.

Like you say yes and other people are offering and like I didn't have any laundry to fold.

So here, let me fold your laundry.

Here's here's my sock band.

Please do this while you're here.

I'll play the matching game, Yeah.

Oh, well, I want before we go into our break, I just want to make sure like 'cause this kind of goes into what we were already talking about how, you know, when we are these young moms and now I'm that I'm the old mom and I'm like, oh, I've only, I, I mean, I tell moms now that if only I knew what I know now, but I find myself all the time telling these young moms like it goes so fast.

And especially once you hit these preteen years, it's like a blink of the eye and suddenly they have their own strong opinions.

You get deodorant on, hopefully you have deodorant on hand.

You have got drivers licenses, you know, coming up on the horizon.

But what are some ways that we can really be intentional with this short time?

Because I feel like this should be like when your kids hit preteen teen years, like it should be a like you should have a little light going off like it's coming to an end.

Your time and your like, most influence on them is coming to an end.

Your relationship will always be there if you cultivate it well.

But how can we be connecting with our preteens and teens while they're still in our home?

Yeah.

And I really just try to figure out how many ways I can pull them into things and have fun with them and enjoy them and do things that they enjoy, even though I might not enjoy them.

And really just, and if not every day, like trying to find things.

So for example, tonight's going to be our movie and game night, movie game and snack night.

But I remember when my older ones were younger, they have these very complicated board games that have like 5000 pieces and like, mom, come here, we'll teach you how to play it.

And I could have said no, but I sat there and I listened to the rules and I now I will get a call.

I was actually at a Way to Home school conference and I get a text message from my 35 year old and my 31 year old like, hey, we want to get together for a game.

Can we come over your house?

I'm like, I'm out of town.

But I would say a couple times a month my 35 year old, my 31 year old, they come over.

We put out those very complicated board games.

If I can beat them, I get super excited.

I but just like a couple nights ago, Nathan who has not he doesn't even live at home.

He brought two friends over.

Then I got to meet for the first time.

So me and his two friends played a card game.

Actually three friends played a card game and I'm like, I want to be that parent.

Where his friend Jacob will text Nathan like, hey, does your mom want to play a game tonight?

Like I want to be that mom.

But it came to when they were 131415 me looking at all those pieces and I really did did not want to learn how to play those games, but I did or Alyssa loves doing nails.

So she did all this whole multi level layer thing.

We went to this beauty supply, she got all this stuff.

I washed my hands and nail Polish came right off.

So then I had to redo that, I say.

But it was fine.

We had that time together.

We went to the beauty supply.

She's still learning how to do.

Yeah.

And it's still time together now, even when I travel, if I can find any time, can I bring my kids?

Anytime I'm going someplace, I'm going to bring at least one or multiple of my kids to try to work in, you know, weekends away, family gatherings.

For Christmas.

We got 2 houses that that was their Christmas present and everyone we went up to Branson, which was like 3 hours away and every kids, grandkids, everyone was together in two different houses.

And we went to Silver Dollar City, which is like a theme, but that's what they're like.

This is the best thing ever.

So if we're doing that when they're younger, if we are going to the doing the rides that we don't maybe not enjoy playing the games, they will come back.

We have that relationship.

We have, you know, if we let them Babble on about whatever singer they like, we'll have those conversations later.

I was just on the phone for an hour yesterday with Lauren and Florentina, who are in Poland.

Like, we have to cultivate that though, when they are little, when they are younger, so we can have that.

So they want to call mom so that that will just be a natural thing to do.

Board game nights to do, snack times to do.

I just get in some tents.

We're going to be sleeping in the yard.

Like I want to cultivate those things with them because I see how much my older kids are impacted and then my grandkids.

So now I have grandkids that want to come over and then we're doing the same thing.

We're playing the board games, we're making the cookies, we're doing the things.

And so I think that, and although they get, the more I focus on that because realizing that is really where family is.

And that's where you, you pass on your traditions, your, your service to God.

Your love for God is not just in let's go to church together, let's read the Bible together, but in the, the activities, entertainment, the things we choose to do as a family.

I love it.

And I did that when I was at your house.

We played one of those complicated games.

I remember thinking like, I am never gonna learn this, but I'm like, but I am here playing.

And Nathan was with us.

See, you brought your old friend to play with your.

Yeah, exactly.

Like if you come over to my house, you're gonna play a board game with us and it's gonna be fun.

We're gonna have.

And what's I found this even fun is like introducing them to things that I'm interested in and like a little like when I would drive to youth group with my now 16 year old.

So he drives himself, but he keeps the tradition is we even listen to 80s and 90s music.

And it was always like the, you know, can mom sing along?

And you know, it's shocking.

Shocking how?

Much you remember.

I don't think I've heard some of these songs since the 80s or the 90s, and I just know them.

It's frightening, but it's become the silly thing.

And so now we play them at home and we dance around.

And so the kids are just like, you know, to asking about Michael Jackson and asking about all these.

I mean, so like most of my kids know how to moonwalk.

So I'm.

Fine, I love it that you know what that is something you're like, you need to have like a button that says that.

But tying into that, we just we're coming back from a trip and usually we love to do like we'll we'll do like 14 hours in a day.

Like it's just we just get in the car, we just go and the last two hours we play the what 80s song is this game?

So I put it on my Spotify random thing and we'll do it.

And we sing along.

And we were coming back from Orlando just what Sunday night and probably 3 hours from home, Bella in the back goes, aren't you going to do the 80s music thing?

And we're like, oh, it's getting close.

We usually wait a couple hours, but we did turned it on.

And then when I go hear them around the house, like singing along, it's like, that's a memory where we're all in the car and I'm like in the front seat like doing the dances and we're guessing the lyrics.

And then they're pointing in and they may be like, not this song again or whatever, but that is, it's a memory that they're building.

And then you see them humming along to Toto and you're like, it's all good.

I love it.

Well, we're going to take a quick break, but we'll be right back to talk about more family fun and just ways to cultivate some family traditions.

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We're back with Tricia Goyer and we've been talking about how to connect with our older preteen kids.

But I'd like to do a little pivot and talk about how to create a welcoming home.

I kind of like all things home life, but I want to to talk a little bit about what is a welcoming home and kind of how we can do some things, including inviting our kids into the process of of making sure our home is a welcoming home.

So Tricia, my friend, how can we create a more welcoming home?

Well, I think we have to get the like definitely the Pinterest idea of what home should look like out of our mind and be OK with the shoes by the door and the sports equipment piled up.

And my husband got couches that have cup holders in them in my living room.

Like I had to just say that's OK, honey, that's OK.

I don't like, and the majority, like our family is in this house, like we have guests.

But you know, it's not like I need to impress the guests, you know, of how this house looks because it's always going to be home school stuff everywhere.

And she was everywhere and sports everywhere and just being OK with that.

We have three dogs now.

I mean, like all the dogs are running around.

Wow.

And like, I went downstairs between breaks and we have a baby Bunny that they found in the yard when Casey was mowing.

So it's like, oh, cool, we got a baby Bunny.

It really is like just relaxing and realizing like our home is for our family.

It's not to impress other people.

And yes, and, and people understand, like, you know, some people's houses I walk over, I'm like, wow, this is beautiful.

It's amazing.

Come to my house.

It's not going to be it's.

Not your house is beautiful.

It's not going.

To be perfectly job, but it's not going to be perfectly different.

I think just getting that out of our mind and being OK with it just being a comfortable place for our family.

And then a welcoming home is being the place where it's OK if their friends come over, they bring their friends over.

Yes, we're going to get pizza and yes, you can have your friends over at the yard.

We have the basketball net outside and this whole bunch of kids in our backyards.

It's just being the place where you want the kids to hang out later.

It'll be the place where you want the kids to hang out.

And, and I think a lot of that is just also smiling, paying attention, making eye contact with your kids.

They're not an interruption in our day.

They're not bothering us from the things we want to do.

And yes, we, I mean, they do have chores.

They do have things that they have to do in the day.

But also this is our home.

This is our family.

We want to enjoy each other.

And that is what they're going to remember when my daughter comes home.

She lived in the Czech Republic for 12 years.

She's a missionary there.

She'll be like, mom, can you make tuna casserole?

And I'm like, that is like the last thing you think.

But that is like the easy thing that I would make after homeschool.

They throw some cream and mushroom soup, some sour cream, some tuna and some noodles together and some cheese on top.

That is like what she wants now because that is home.

And so just thinking about the things that this is, the memories that they're going to have, we don't want them to be, you know, just so overwhelmed and stressed.

But all the things we're trying to do or all the things we're trying to be, it really helps having my grandma who's 95, she's still.

Here.

Oh my goodness.

Yes, and I would be running around crazy and the house is a mess and she would just smile at me like these are the best years of your life, honey.

And I would like grandma like the best years of my life sound like laying on a beach somewhere and not this, but but she's exactly right.

Like it is the best years of our lives.

All it is around all the noise, all the chaos.

And if we have the expectations that our days are going to be busy, they're going to be noisy, they're going to be messy and be OK with it, then we'll have a great day.

Like if we have an expectation that we could do have a clean house and everything to be perfect, then we're just gonna stress ourselves and our kids out.

Yeah, even if there's goldfish and the cup holders in your couch.

Exactly.

There probably is, right?

Yeah, that.

Was the first thing I thought.

Recent cup holders.

I was like the crumbs.

I'm like, that's okay.

Well, one of the stories you actually share in the book faith that sticks that I thought was so funny was that you were talking about your gratitude jar And I was thinking, Oh, I remember when you did the, the book about gratitude and you were saying like, I was not working with one of the girls.

And but what I love is number one, I was like, how is she going to pull this out?

Like I, I got wrapped into the story, but can you share a little bit?

But I want to hear, I want you to share the shift in your approach.

And so kind of like that's another gratitude.

That's another gratitude to to the shift that you did.

Yeah, absolutely.

So we were trying to go a year without grumbling because everyone was grumbling.

And I would come up with all these activities that we would do.

Like every time you grumble, you have to put a gratitude.

Well, then they just kept grumbling and it's like, I'm not going to put a stupid gratitude in your truck.

Like, that did not work.

And so then I realized like, OK, she would, she would argue with me.

It was Florentine.

And she gives me permission to tell the story.

I should laugh something about it now.

But every time I would tell her to do the kitchen, she would argue with me.

Then I was praying about it and it's like, well, what?

Why does she not like to do the kitchen?

Because I've been there.

You didn't wipe this down.

You need to love the dishwasher 1st.

And so it's like this nitpicky mom.

And so I'm like, I wouldn't want to do something if I just had someone always just criticizing me.

So it turned to praise.

And so here she is barely wiping the counter.

Florentina, you are doing an amazing job.

That counter is sparkling.

And she's like perks up and then she swipes more the counter and like, I was putting laundry away.

And every time I went through, I would just like start praising her and praising her.

Pretty soon she's unlive, the dishwasher scraping off all the dishes and the praise really turn things around.

And so when you catch your kids doing something right, even when we went to therapy when Casey was little, the therapist is like if he's throwing a car in the direction of the toy box, like praise him.

Like we almost got the toy box, Great job.

And then they'll perk up.

They love praise.

And so they will, anytime we continue to criticize, it's just going to a heart in their hearts.

It's just going to push them away from us.

But if we praise them, like, wow, you're doing such a great job.

And that kitchen, like she spent 45 minutes in there just that first day as her praise either it was completely clean.

She ended up being the person that always did the kitchen the best.

And it reminded me that I need to praise him.

And also that night at dinner, I told John, I'm like, you should have seen the kitchen today.

It was so amazing because they want to hear us saying the good things that they're doing too.

So I think we could really, and especially as moms weren't there parents, we're just there all day long and we just can be that negative voice in their head and just we could turn it around when we just start praising and then they want to please us.

They love getting attention for the right reasons, and then they don't have to get attention for the wrong reasons.

Yeah, I mean, this is this is great advice for parenting and marriage.

Praise, praise.

Don't criticize praise.

I love it.

And even I loved because I love that you mentioned it here too, because you put it in the book.

But not just praising directly to them.

Let them hear you or catch you praising them to other people.

I try to be really intentional about praising my kids, but praising my kids to other people because so often we just get into these little whiny, you know, messes that we do with our friends and like, Oh, my daughter's not doing that Answer my dad, you know, like, no, like just focus on the praise, focus on the positives, build them up, be their biggest cheerleader.

So I love that.

And I love that you got like great results with that too, because it's, it's amazing what can happen when we slow down and focus on, you know, not the little tiny things that need to be tweaked, which I have an eye for that.

So I'm letting it go because it doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter in the big scheme of things.

So my sweet darling friend, do you have any final thoughts of just like any practical encouragement for families who are walking through these pre, you know, these preteen early teen years?

And I think one of the things, of course, when we're, we always would like, like, how can we help the kids?

How can we do this with the kids?

I mean, we have to start with us and my thing is like I don't have time with my kids until I have time with me and Jesus and he will like he's the one that's reminds me like, oh, praise her.

Like it's like when we spend time with God, like he is a constant help.

He can help us, guide us, lead us.

He can stir our hearts to one of our kids that might need more attention.

He can bring to mind the conversation starters that we need to have or the ideas we need to do.

I was just the other day, my kids were having a really hard day and I'm like stressed.

I started writing out a prayer and I got the idea to do summer vision boards.

So I took them all to the dollar store and I we were like, what do we want to do?

What are the because they're complaining you have to work.

And so we wrote down all the things that we want to do.

We made plans, game nights, sleeping.

And so that was me writing on a prayer like I don't know what to do.

I'm trying to balance everything.

Lord, give me wisdom.

And that idea came.

So God is there to help us with our families like he knows their hearts.

He knows our hearts.

He knows who he designed them to be and so just turn to him and have that time with him.

So good we forget to do that so often.

Sadly enough that I love it and I'm totally stealing that idea I'm going to go to.

The yes, I wrote, actually I'm going to put it on on my blog because I wrote a list like choose from these things.

That's another thing.

Then they're like, I don't know what to do.

I gave them like 20 things to choose from and they.

Yeah.

So yeah.

We may or may not have had that conversation.

I'm so bored, like one of my kiddos and I was like, well, like, let's make a list.

And so my older daughter, she actually does, she has a list of things that she just goes to.

And so it's great because she is not one who sits around and just, you know, she, she's a doer, which I'm always like, slow down, sit down, relax.

But she also has a fun list of things that she knows she can go and do.

And so she'll go and, you know, do art or bracelets or, you know, just whatever it is.

But she knows.

And yesterday she, she was waiting.

So I'm like, God bless you.

I will take.

That put that on your list.

Chrissy's in there writing things on her list.

You let her garage.

Oh well, thank you so much.

I feel like it's not a I'm not a podcast toast without having you as a guest.

You're.

It's so fun to always talk to you.

I love it.

Well, thank you for coming on and encouraging everyone that before we go, please remind our listeners where they can find you and all of your amazing books and resources.

Absolutely.

Well, most of our books are on Amazon or christianbook.com or any of those places.

But my website is also just Tricia Goyer, Tricia's Tricia triciagoyer.com.

I'm on Instagram at Tricia Goyer and Facebook all the places and I would love to connect with you.

Perfect.

Well, my friends, make sure you are finding Tricia online.

I get, I am.

I'm a big Tricia Goyer fan, both in my personal life and in just my home school life and all the things.

But I hope that you know that you can find all the links for the show in the show notes.

And also be sure to head over to schoolhouserock.com where you can stream the movie Schoolhouse rocked the homeschool Revolution for free and subscribe to Schoolhouse Rock YouTube channel and follow on your favorite podcast app.

It has been an absolute pleasure to be your host this week on the Schoolhouse Rock podcast.

And sweet friends.

Before you go, I want to make sure that you know of a few tools I've created to support you in your homeschool and mom life.

First up is the homeschool reset.

It's a free three day mini course designed to help you declutter your mind, reset your routines, and find more joy in your home school days.

You can grab it anytime at christyclover.com/reset.

And if you want to go a little deeper, you can check out my Sanity Savers for Mom's Boot Camp.

It's a powerful 90 minute workshop packed with practical tools to trade your chaos for calm and to create systems that work for you.

Plus, I have a brand new course called Training Kids to Help.

So if you resonated with anything Trisha and I were talking about and you're tired of doing everything yourself and are ready to get your kids involved without the nagging, which see not just coming from me, it's coming from Tricia too.

This is experience.

This is for you.

So and because you are a podcast listener, if you use the code Clover 10, you get $10 off either training Kids for Help or my Ultimate Homeschool organization course.

So head over to christyclover.com to find all the links to all of my resources.

And you can also find me on Instagram and on YouTube as at Kristy Clover for any of more encouragement and tips behind the scene of my crazy family life or whatever it is.

But you can find me online there.

But come back next week for another exciting guest on Schoolhouse Rock podcast.

And be sure to stay tuned to the end to hear a preview of what's coming up next on the podcast.

So have yourself a very fabulous rest of your week, my friends.

Take care.

You're listening to the biblical.

Family Network.

Hey, I'm Miki.

And I'm Will and we're the Co host of the culture Proof podcast.

We want to invite you to join us every week as we discuss what's happening in the world and then filter those happenings through a decidedly biblical.

Lens.

There are many questions, especially when we see what's happening in our culture today, but the answers are found within the Word of God, so that's where we want to look.

Amen.

When we resist those cultural trends that rival the truth.

We remain culture proof.

In the first few years, I really took that as I control it all.

I have a hand in everything, I have a say in everything.

My no one can move forward a lesson unless I am sitting by you watching you.

And that became really taxing.

I really feel like grace kind of inserted itself in Year 5.

I will say the latter years have been way better than the first years.