Cal: We'll get started with the fast five.

What's your name, Ernie: My name is Ernie Mathis.

Cal: and Ernie, where are you located?

Ernie: I am in northwest Georgia a town called Rising Fawn.

We're about half an hour southwest of Chattanooga, Tennessee.

Cal: Oh, Ernie: right where Alabama, Tennessee, and Georgia touch.

Cal: Oh, very good.

And what's the name of your farm?

Ernie: Hey, our farm is Iron Root Pastures.

Cal: I, I, I ought to add a question in there.

How did you come up with the name?

Because I think that's really interesting.

We may have to cover that in a little bit, but what species do you graze on your farm?

What livestock species?

Ernie: do a grass fed dairy raw milk.

We are raising beef cows for eventual sale.

We do pasture raised broilers, pasture raised turkeys pasture layers.

And then hopefully here soon we'll be doing rabbits and we always try to find another reason to add another species.

Cal: Yeah.

You know, it's like, oh, I went to bed and I wasn't completely tired and I'd love to be worn out, so let's add another species in Ernie: Yeah, I'm exhausted, but it's addicting to see how many animals you could put on here.

And if somebody's buying it, it only makes another reason to sell it.

Cal: Yeah.

No, I, I, I get that.

And what year did you start grazing animals?

Ernie: started in 2023.

Cal: Oh, very good.

So just a couple years in.

Yeah.

Ernie: yeah.

We bought the farm in 2023.

Cal: Welcome to the grazing grass podcast.

The podcast dedicated to sharing the stories of grass-based livestock producers, exploring regenerative practices that improve the land animals and our lives.

I'm your host, Cal Hardage and each week we'll dive into the journeys, challenges, and successes of producers like you, learning from their experiences, and inspiring each other to grow, and graze better.

Whether you're a seasoned grazier or just getting started.

This is the place for you.

Ranchers, farmers and landowners, if you're looking to optimize your grazing operation and boost your bottom line, Noble Research Institute can help the noble approach to education pairs their own infield research with the expertise of ranch managers and advisors to find practical solutions to your unique challenges.

In July, Noble's in-person courses will head into new areas.

Join them in McKenzie, North Dakota, July 15th through the 16th for Noble Land Essentials.

And in Pendleton, Oregon, July 30th through 31st for Noble Profitability Essentials.

The expansion doesn't stop there.

Later this year, they'll be in Winter Garden, Florida with the Business of Grazing.

And right now, each of these two day courses is $50 off the regular price.

The pricing is available for a limited time, so take advantage of the savings and visit noble.org to learn more about the courses and enroll today.

For 10 seconds about the farm, I have a confession to make.

In fact, I talked to Lee from episode 94, I believe last week, and I.

Was telling him about my dilemma, said I, I have to tell you, my listeners about it.

For the last few weeks I've talked about my energizer that I don't know what's going on.

I was getting voltage out of the ground side and the fence side.

I added a few ground rods because I felt like I was a little light on it.

And then.

Due to my fence, not pushing enough power.

I had my dad's cows getting out.

My cows still respect it.

Uh, they've been trained really well, but my dad's cows just would not stay in.

That caused me to move the cows and actually get 'em in a situation where I didn't have to use the electric fence and use some of our permanent pa permanent paddocks.

So I go up there just the other day, I'm like, I'm gonna figure this out.

And I go to the energizer and I trade out energizers and I have the same thing happening and I test it and I'm losing lots of apps amps one way, and I know I've got a poly wire off that I thought, well, I'll go down there.

But the other thing is there's a pond there and it goes across the pond, and I've checked when I've been up there before to make sure it's not going in the water.

And to be honest, it's hard to see.

It's on the far side of the pond, but whenever I'm up there I felt like it's not in the water.

It's fine.

Well, the cows, I had a pole on top post on top of that pond dam that had knocked down.

It couldn't handle the force on it, and it was laying over.

So I walked over to get that, and that got me on the side that I needed to look where I could look at the wire closer.

And it was underwater.

My wire was underwater.

So when I got that fixed, um.

I'm running 10 K on my fence.

In fact, I took a couple pictures and thought I would post them online.

I don't think I did.

But yeah, so I got my goats moved up there, got 'em in some electric netting because my fence is hot enough now, so I'm able to, to go back to what I was doing, doing it a little bit different.

I've got my cows back up there.

I've got dad's cows going through his place.

Uh, and I moved some sheep and goats up on the, on that place as well.

Anyway, the moral of the story is to check your fence all the way through.

Even if it's always never been a problem.

If it's never been an issue, check it anyway.

I was too trusting.

That's never been an issue.

It's never been in the water.

I couldn't see it very well, so I thought, oh, it's fine.

I was wrong.

I was wrong.

Anyway, enough of that, I got the fence going.

Uh, for 10 seconds about the podcast.

If you are in the business of producing genetics that thrive on grass, you're selling to other producers, the grass-based genetics are where you need to be.

Go to grass-based genetics.com and sign up for your breeder listing.

And if you're in the market for some genetics that thrive on grass, go to a grass-based genetics and, uh, contact those breeders listed there because they're producing the type of genetics you need in your herd.

Not very many is listed there.

But there will be.

So just keep watching it.

Uh, grazing Grass Resources, you know, we launched that and I've told you, go to grazing grass resources.com.

Please stop.

I say that because I can't figure out how to fix that.

So it's working.

So if you go to grazing grass.com and click on resources, it'll take you there.

If you go to grazing grass resources.com, it's broke right now, and I'm trying to figure it out.

I think I have all the settings correct.

It doesn't seem to be wanting to work correctly.

Anyway, I talked way too long today.

Let's get back to Ernie.

Cal: Let's jump back to the beginning.

Growing up, did you think you'd have a farm?

Was that something you wanted to do?

Ernie: Absolutely not.

No, I I was very much growing up in New Jersey, I was very much like a city kid.

Living in the suburbs.

There was farms around me, but it's not something I wanted to do at all.

It wasn't, it wasn't until I got older thinking about having kids, and we were in metro Atlanta at that point.

We had a garden and we were outgrowing the garden on the tiny little quarter acre backyard or eighth and acre, whatever we had.

And then, it was when we started worrying about our health that things started changing and we started getting interesting in it.

So we did like a batch of meat chickens in the backyard.

'cause we can, if we want pasture raised chickens, I mean, you can go to Whole Foods or any of the grocery stores and get organic, but it's organic from a barn.

It's hard to find 'em pasture raised.

So as we got a little more strict in what we wanted to consume, it came down to growing it ourselves.

So.

It wasn't fast for us to outgrow that tiny little backyard 'cause we weren't allowed to have chickens in there 'cause the ordinance.

But we hit 'em for the first batch and then, and then COVID happened and it was time to sell that house and get away from all the crazy people in Atlanta.

Cal: Oh yes.

You know, having kids just change your perspective on so much what you're doing and how you're doing it.

And it really, it really causes you to evaluate what you're doing.

Ernie: sure does.

Cal: So at the time, let's just talk about that first batch of chickens because I think there's a good story right there.

No matter where you are, you can get started.

So.

So what was your thought pattern there?

Did you, how did you find out the information you needed and how'd you progress?

Ernie: we were basically, at that point in time, we had it in our head that we were gonna do, get a homestead.

It's what we wanted to do.

We were tired of the food we were getting, and we wanna be more self-reliant.

And we didn't even have kids at this point.

We just knew it was, we were getting there.

And so for, we were watching like Justin Rhodes on YouTube and watching a bunch of farming vlogs and Saladin and everybody else.

And then that's pretty much where we learned how to do it first because.

Chickens are easy for your first batch.

I mean, so it was, we just got the chicks and made like a little tiny chicken tractor and it was only 10 chickens at first and just moving around around our backyard once a day.

And it was, it was simple.

And then watched a couple YouTube videos and how to process 'em and process 'em in the backyard.

Somehow our neighbors didn't see us doing it or didn't hear about it.

And that was it.

And we did the first batch of chickens and then and then it was time to find something different.

Cal: There are lots of Homestead YouTube channels, so lots to pick from.

But Justin Rhodes, I used to watch his channel a lot more religiously than I do now.

I just catch it once in a while now.

But yeah, getting those getting started and getting started with 10 chickens.

That's, that's enough that you can try it and see, and you, you can find out, do I hate the chickens?

Do I, is it something I enjoy?

Is the product something I would be willing to, to raise more of?

So that's a great way to get started on a small scale without going broke, Ernie: Yeah, it was, it was really easy 'cause it's not much food to afford for 10 of 'em at that year.

At 10, we ordered 'em online, but you could have just walked into the tractor supply in spring and got 'em.

And then we built a tiny little wooden two by four structure with chicken wire on it because we weren't worried about predators.

'cause we had a fenced in backyard.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Even better.

Ernie: it was just moving them that way.

And then the biggest hurdle was processing, but.

We, it wasn't that hard, just figuring it out, making sure they stay cool and you have a way to dunk 'em and, and wrap 'em.

Cal: Was there anything that you, you'd watch those videos on processing?

Anything?

You all process, process those 10.

Was there anything that surprised you about the process?

Ernie: I think it was gonna be more intimidating 'cause I didn't come from like a hunting background, so Cal: Oh Ernie: any live animal.

I thought it was gonna a little bit more different, difficult to do, and it was really simple.

Cal: Yeah.

I think chickens help that out because they're not real lovable, to be honest.

I, I know there's some people that love their chickens, and I apologize, don't wanna offend anyone with that, but chickens just aren't real cuddly and lovable, so it makes it a little bit easier.

Ernie: would have, it would be a difference between processing a chicken and then processing like your beef cow or your dairy cow on the farm.

Cal: R right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So with those first chickens, you all just did it for your own consumption.

How was that meet?

Ernie: it was great.

We couldn't complain about it.

It's different than the store.

And that set us further down the path of getting a farm.

Cal: Yeah.

So what was your next step?

You said that was in COV, or not in COVID, but right before COVID.

When did you all raise another set and did you continue with small numbers?

Did you start expanding?

Ernie: it took us probably about two years until we did the next batch because we sold the house in metro Atlanta.

We bought a rv.

Then we traveled around the US in a RV trying to figure out where we wanted to, where we wanted to live.

So we thought we were gonna end up in like Montana, Idaho, big country out there.

And then we did fire season out there.

We did a winter, and then being out there kind of changed how.

We would wanna farm 'cause you're gonna have to put those animals inside in the winter or you got a short season.

We already had some of my family that moved down to Georgia from New Jersey and it was like, nobody's gonna come visit us out there.

Cal: Oh Ernie: life gets away from everybody.

So we we were traveling around and then we were looking in Nashville.

'cause at first we were looking for raw land to build the farm and build the house ourselves.

We had the rv, we renovated that.

We were living in it for two years by the time we, we finished.

And then we found, we decided to look back in Georgia again for some reason to, and look for a house with land for a mortgage.

'cause it was easier to get a loan on that.

Then we found the farm that we're on, which is an old cow calf farm that was, had just been out of service for 10 or 12 years.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Now.

Hearing that you really followed that Justin Rhodes model because he did that great American farm tour across the US and then decided to go back home.

You pulled something pretty similar.

You all went around and then went back to where you were not in the exact area where you were, but the same general area.

Ernie: Yeah, and it, it didn't turn out, we didn't start off that road.

It was, we were still planning on being in Georgia when we sold the house.

We just bought the RV renovated so we could live in it.

Then it was gonna be like a short vacation.

Go look for something while we're looking on Zillow and trying to find land.

And as we're traveling, like, well maybe, maybe Idaho.

This is Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: here or Montana or somewhere else, or Texas.

And as we're traveling through, we ended up doing a lap around the US like two times.

'cause we're seeing friends in like Bend, Oregon and Texas.

And just finding a reason to travel around.

And then as we're traveling around we're, no, this really, really wouldn't work.

And then just figuring it out.

Cal: I, I think that would be really appealing.

Now, my wife says that she, she's not sure she can put up with me in that smallest space, but there's, there's a lot to it to be that's appealing about that.

How did you all fund that trip?

Ernie: So I have a construction company.

We work on cell cell phone towers around the Cal: oh yes.

Ernie: So at that point.

I pretty much had a lot of people in place in to run the company, and I just did everything that I could on the computer.

And then as we would come back to Georgia, I would sit down and I'd park the RV in the warehouse for a couple weeks and then catch up on everything with everybody, get everything where it's supposed to be, and then we might leave again for a couple weeks and come back Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: to see family and, and just kind of do it, handle everything from the phone and the computer.

Cal: You know I, that's a great way because a lot of times people talk about doing stuff like that, and I'm like, how do you afford it?

Of course.

You know, with the podcast it's pretty mobile.

Wherever I want to do it, I could Now, my, my sheep and goats aren't so mobile, so that's a little bit Ernie: No.

You'd be a big RV to put them all in there.

Cal: I would, yeah.

So you all found this old homestead or property with a old cow calf house on it.

What did it look like infrastructure-wise when you got there?

Ernie: So it's about, it's a total 2 25 acres, 74 in pasture.

It's kind of got a beat down perimeter fence holes in some spots, barbed wire, and a lot of holes in, in spots not patched up.

There's not really many watering spots on the, on the property.

Some old barns that they kept maybe have kept the calf in or kept the hay in.

And then the house needed a lot of work 'cause it was just, the front walls were rotted.

A lot of the windows were rotted, so it took a lot of work when we first moved in, which most of it's still not done.

I fixed the rotten spots and put a roof on it.

That's almost done.

But then the farm started taking off and I had to divert all my attention to that and just get the farm going.

Cal: It just takes time to to do that.

I remember, I think I was probably a teenager and my dad was trying to convince my grandpa.

To buy some land that adjoined his property and my grandpa's like, no, that's a lifetime worth of work there.

And you know, WWW, these farms can be that way.

Even ours that we're here working on.

Sometimes I look around, I'm like, there's a lifetime worth of work here just to keep up with everything.

Ernie: it's been, it's been a lot because there's always, with how fast we've grown the farm, it's been a lot of labor into it and figuring out what will work here.

'cause you could look at.

Like saying pastured broilers or pastured layers coming up.

But there's so many designs on houses.

But what's gonna work here because we're a little bit hilly.

And then in the winter time, or like the winter time, it gets really windy here 'cause it just comes down the mountain.

And then we're in the valley, so we've had chicken houses get flipped over.

Or like our broiler houses that have taken off in the wind.

So figuring out.

How our next design's gonna work and how to make 'em heavier or less of a kite.

Cal: Oh yeah, yeah.

Don't want those flying away.

How did you, or not how what did you get started with first on the farm portion?

Ernie: It would've been broilers were first, we got some layers.

I think we bought maybe 60 chicks for layers.

And then the first batch of meat chickens were maybe 50 of them, maybe a hundred.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: and it was just to put meat in our freezer at first.

And then at that time we were processing on the farm.

And then Georgia got really strict on their, their processing rules.

So I think it was like summer of the first year we started selling whole birds from the farm.

And then it wasn't too long until we had to find a processor to start processing the chickens Cal: So what'd Georgia do on those laws about selling meat in.

' Ernie: cause Georgia has so many giant poultry farms here.

They made it so there was a thousand bird exemption and that was it.

And then with that thousand exemption you had to have.

A state inspected facility up to a state inspected Cal: yeah.

Ernie: requirements.

So it made it, they needed an indoor facility, an indoor kill room.

Just made it unattainable for the small farm until this past year they opened it up to the 20,000 bird exemption.

Cal: Oh yes.

So when that came in place, did you all find, were you able to find a processor close by?

Ernie: Yeah, we use A-U-S-D-A processor in Tennessee.

It's about a three hour drive for us Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: the birds there.

Cal: With the increase and number you can process per year with the new law.

Have you thought about coming back to the farm to do it or are you happy with the processor?

Ernie: it's absolutely what we're gonna do.

It's just building the building and, and funding it all.

So.

Hopefully for next year we'll have something where something basic set up that we can start doing on the farm because we spend so much money on the USDA processing.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

I know I raised one batch here.

I was gonna see how we liked 'em, see about selling them, but I wanted to take 'em somewhere and get 'em processed.

Just so I could see how this would scale and stuff, and by the time I got that cost figured into my price and my birds, I was just like, I, for my area, I was a little embarrassed to ask that much money for it.

Now, I, I think the market's there, but it wasn't right where I'm sitting, you know, have to go into a farmer's market or something, Ernie: yeah.

It's, it's intimidating for the pricing.

I think the only thing.

Part of it is 'cause we're in such a niche of the kind of poultry we're doing with the organic corn free, soy free that people are willing to, to pay for it 'cause they can't get that anywhere else.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: completely open to, you know, people seeing how they're raised and then what, how much it costs us for everything.

Because it's hard for people to believe that they cost that much per bird to just get it processed or the pigs or anything else.

Cal: yeah.

Well, you know, I think back to candy bars and pop bottles or pop and think it should be 50 cents and it's not.

I still have sticker shock every time I go in a store and buy one.

Ernie: Yeah.

Cal: to stop buying those.

So with those, those first birds, how'd you find that market?

Was it.

People, your friends really interested in it, or how'd you develop that market?

Ernie: It was our, because we didn't know very many people when we first moved up here in this area, and we're about two hours, two and a half hours from where we were in Metro Atlanta.

So we started with doing drops in metro Atlanta, where we used to live and where our Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: around there.

We're kind of patched in with like a bunch of chiropractors that they're like the new wave of of health because a lot of people are going to chiropractors and they're more eat healthy, have a healthy lifestyle, lose the weight, get off the, the prescription pills.

So it's helped us be involved with them.

So we do a drops at multiple chiropractor's office and that are all part of this Max Living group.

Cal: Oh yes.

Ernie: We do.

It's a biweekly drop.

Well, you were asking me about the, how we started.

Cal: Well, yeah, but that, that's still interesting because I think that's a pro tip.

You just dropped on everyone right there.

You found where the, where your ideal customer are going and then you're basically providing the chicken there now.

Which, yeah, that's, that's a really good thought pattern.

Have you done any farmer's markets or has your model been along that line?

Ernie: We try to not do farmer's markets 'cause it just takes so much time.

We do one every Friday, about a half an hour away in Mentone, Alabama, and then once every quarter we do one that's like three hours away in Beaufort, Georgia.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

Ernie: and that we do great at those, those markets.

But.

It's hard to go to a market every day 'cause the farm's too busy.

I can't afford to have my wife, Janet, at the market all day, every day and need her Cal: Oh yeah.

If she's not there working, who's gonna get the job done?

I know you've got other things to do.

No.

Ernie: I got other things to do then if she's there, I have to juggle the kids doing chores and everything else.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

So.

You, your first customers.

Just continue on that path just a little bit.

Your first customers metro Atlanta area, when did you start building a base closer to home?

Ernie: So our first, we with the first customers were to friends, people we knew, and we were also going to a chiropractor here in, in Trenton, Georgia, and just advertising with him and in his chiropractic office.

There's other people that were looking for healthy food that weren't getting it in this, this area.

So we started with that and it was a couple customers there, and then that's how we started getting involved in raw milk because they were looking for it.

And we had one dairy cow and then that spread and everybody wanted it.

So it worked that way.

And then we've grown from there.

Cal: So you were, when you got those first chicks, you were doing some broilers, you had got some for laying, which obviously that takes some time.

So if I follow this correctly, you had eggs eventually, you had pasture poultry for sale, and then they started asking about dairy.

Yeah.

And you all had already started with a dairy cow for yourself.

Ernie: at first we got dairy goats and that was gonna, we were gonna do, we were doing milk goats and then we just never did anything.

We never got a buck, so we never got the do pregnant.

And then, and then I was just on Facebook and we were thinking about a milk cow, and then I found one, and then of course he was selling more than one, so I grabbed two because I was figuring they had to be separate from the beef cows and it need a friend, so.

Cal: Oh Ernie: So we started with that and then all, we had extra milk, so we were selling milk and then it evolved from there.

And now we have not eight jerseys that we milk.

Cal: Oh yes.

Yeah.

So let's, I am just thinking Arnie, because I know we're gonna come back and talk more about your dairy and how that's done a little bit later.

So I'm not gonna ask any more questions on the dairy right now, but we'll be back to it in just a little bit.

Along that time, when did you add pork and why?

Ernie: So we added pork shortly after we started chickens, but we got, they were basically piglets.

They were, they were a little bit older, but we had, we bought a couple Mana piglets and a Berkshire and then grew them for us to consume and then also to start the, the.

The pig side of it, of the things.

So it took a while for them to grow out and then to get pregnant.

And then our first boar that we had, he was, he didn't produce.

So it took a while until we finally had our first set of piglets on the farm to process.

'cause we didn't wanna just get feeder piglets.

We wanted to farrow on the farm so we can control.

What's going into them, what the parents are eating, what the parents are being, what's going into them.

And the same thing for the piglets.

So it was probably about a year until we had started getting piglets, I think.

And then it takes 10, 8, 10 months for them to grow out.

So it was a while.

We finally, this past year, 2024 was the first time we had started selling pork.

Cal: Oh yes.

And are you using, you mentioned Mag Magnises, did you, are those your sows or did you bring in any other Ernie: Yeah, right now we have Mana Sows and then a Red Waddle boar.

Cal: Oh, a red waddle board.

Ernie: it gives, because the man takes so long to grow out, it's mostly lard, so it's like a well, well marbled meat, but they just take so long to get the maturity.

So we added the red, the red waddle, and tried that and they grow.

We were processing them 300 pounds there.

It's taking 'em eight months to get there, maybe nine months.

Cal: Oh, okay.

Yeah.

Ernie: too long.

Cal: And you like the meat pretty good.

Do you, you see, continuing with that pattern, using a Magis Sow and a Boer, that's a little bit more conventional, not, not that red Waddles super conventional, but you know.

Ernie: Yeah, because the meat's completely different than like we had one Berkshire here and we crossed her with the red wattle and looking at comparing their meat together, it looks completely different.

Cal: Oh, yes.

Yeah.

Well, following along on the podcast, you know, I've tried some pigs with very poor success, and I don't have an answer to my lifestyle.

Guardian dog in the pigs yet.

However, I still love the idea of getting some pigs and I'm raising some, and one of those discussions has been a breed I've, I've kind of shied away from mangoes or the Cooney Cooney just because of the growth Ernie: Yeah.

Cal: but I know that meat's supposed to be really good.

Ernie: It's, they've been easy.

I guess the pig side of things has been pretty easy 'cause we just keep them in electric netting.

We don't have a dog with them and I probably, 'cause we keep the bo with them year round, that we'll separate them occasionally.

But haven't had issues with predators and the pigs.

Cal: Oh, very good.

Yeah.

And then now you mentioned something there in talking about it was that diet that you're feeding your animals, and you'd mentioned it earlier with your chickens.

You're feeding non GMO organic.

No soy, no corn.

When, when you talk about that, that's above and beyond what a lot of other people are doing, do you find your customers are really focused on that and they really want that difference?

Ernie: There's a lot of people that don't care about the difference.

They're just looking for the organic fed forest race pork or patched pork.

But then we have a lot of customers.

That really are looking for that.

They don't want corn, they don't want soy for allergies.

Or they don't want wheat.

Like our, a lot of our layers are wheat free.

'cause we deal with so many Cal: Oh yes.

Ernie: that for them it comes through in the eggs.

So Cal: Oh, okay.

Ernie: going so strict, it, it's helped us with everybody.

Because a lot of the things we wanted no corn, because from what we've read and heard was that it changes the consistency of the fat and the pigs.

So we started going down that route and then just trying to do healthier versions of it.

And then so we started feeding 'em that, and then for our consumption, and then just talking to everybody.

They also wanted that, it's been a big Cal: Oh yeah.

And where are you able to source that feed?

Ernie: We go to Kentucky.

Kentucky Organics is the only organic feed mill anywhere around, so it's about a three and a half hour trip.

And I'll go up there every other week maybe to pick up feed.

So hopefully I think that this might be our first batch where they bring the bulk truck and fill us up here because it's been with running so many broilers.

It's been driving up there.

They go through a ton of feed a week Cal: Yes.

Yeah.

Well, and that really helps out if they're able to bring it down in bulk to you on a Ernie: Yeah.

Cal: Yeah, I you know, I talked to my wife.

We were gonna do, we've talked about doing some pasture poultry again, raising some broilers.

And that's one thing we've talked about.

Do we wanna go that higher step and do no soy, no corn, but then where do we find that feed?

And I haven't gotten far enough into it to research it because I'm not doing it yet, but it has crossed my mind to do that.

Ernie: It's been, I think part of it was that they offered a soy-free, corn free feed already, so it was easy to do it.

And then on some of the stuff we've modified to make it like wheat free or the pigs, we just, we feed 'em a lot of their portion is barley and their barley and peas and, maybe some, I can't think of off the top of my head everything that's in there, but they'll, as long as whatever we want, they'll mix whatever customer action that we, that we, choose.

As long as we're getting 'em in like one ton tilt totes and as long as we're getting 'em in bulk, then they're Cal: Yeah.

So when you were driving up there getting it, were, were you getting it in those big feed bags?

Ernie: Yeah.

We started, when we were doing, when we first started, we found them because.

The organic food from Tractor Supply wasn't exactly what we were looking for, and we started with that.

And then we found, there's other farms around here that we, we found through the chiropractor, other homesteaders that were already getting it from Kentucky Organics because they'll do Cal: Yeah.

Ernie: like a bulk, a bulk drop.

So like they have a drop in Chattanooga, they have drops throughout Tennessee where they do like the beginning of the.

Beginning of the the month, they'll have a drop at certain farms for everybody to come pick up their bags, but it's bag feed only.

So once we Cal: Oh yeah, Ernie: to totes to one ton, then we had to drive up there and get 'em.

Cal: yeah, yeah.

And those, I think you said they hold about a ton.

Ernie: Yeah.

Yeah.

So it's a big sack and it holds one ton of feed.

That's all my tractor could pick up, or else I might go bigger because I do a two ton bag, but.

Cal: Oh, I didn't realize they made a two ton bag.

We've used some of the one ton bags years ago.

Ernie: Yeah, Cal: Along this journey you've added beef cattle as well.

How, what did you choose to go with on beef cattle and how's that process going?

Ernie: we started with Belted Galloway and it was kind of something my wife decided she wanted to, as a dual purpose.

She wanted to milk them and have 'em as beef.

But we never went down that route with milking.

It wasn't something we were gonna do on the farm.

We didn't have the time for it.

So now we still have the, the belt of Galloways.

Probably gonna get phased out here soon 'cause they do terribly in the, the summer sun down here.

They just sit under the mobile shades all day and then kind of graze at night.

Cal: It's kinda like me during the summer.

Yeah.

Ernie: don't blame 'em.

They're black and white and that it's hot down here.

Cal: Yes.

So what do you think you'll use in the future for beef cattle as you try and find something a little bit more heat resistant?

Ernie: I want to do something where we can have, it works more symbiotic with everybody else.

So instead of having the belted galloways, and then the jerseys for dairy, right now we're using the belted bull on the jerseys, but I'd rather go something.

That's gonna do better.

So maybe like a south pole bull or come up with a, a better grass-based bull to cover over 'em.

And then keep, keep them for, for beef.

And then have a, a jersey bull too.

So we could do replacement heifers for the farm and then, you know, the bulls can go to the beef or some of the girls can go to beef, so we don't have to keep buying heifers.

Cal: Yeah.

Have you considered using like.

AIing and using sex semen for the Jersey portion, Ernie: It's gone through my head.

It's just another thing that I would have to try to bring on and do myself.

Sometimes I'd rather do that because then I'm not dealing with having a bull on the farm and then him getting out or trying to separate him from the, the young heifers that are too young to breathe that shouldn't be breathing yet, that he wants to.

So we'll see.

But at the same time I kind of like the idea of having a bull cover than, than AI in Cal: Yeah, and I get that.

The thing that concerns me, and this is from my experience growing up on a more commercial dairy, was dairy bulls get mean, and jerseys are some of the worst.

Ernie: That's been a fear we had when we started doing it was like, we don't want a jersey bull 'cause we're worried about the kids and we don't have like a separate.

Fenced in lot to put them in.

So like our delta gall bowl, he's like a puppy dog.

He'll stay in single wire, single wire poly and do fine.

Occasionally he'll get out if somebody's in heat, but he respects it and he just kind of meanders about and he hasn't pushed too hard.

And you can walk right up to 'em and pet 'em do whatever.

But the dairy bowls have always been a, a fear.

Cal: Yeah.

That, that's something you're just gonna have to talk to who you're getting it from and make sure about that.

Yeah, because that, that's my initial concern as well.

With six semen, you can get the benefit of having a few jersey calves your best cows without the risk of a dairy bull.

Ernie: Yeah, and that may be something that we could do just another tool in the toolbox.

So we have a, like a beef bowl that we can do live coverage for.

And then some of the girls we could do in AI every once in a.

So that we don't grow the dairy too fast.

Cal: yeah.

And having sex semen really helps you out.

I mean, that's a, a marvel being able to do that and 75% or 90% of your CSB or should be heifers.

That's something I wish they had years ago when we dared.

Ernie: yeah.

I'm learning about it.

It's crazy that you can pick it out now.

Cal: It is and, and it opens up such opportunities, I think, for commercial dairies in that they can decide how many heifers we need, you know, work backwards, how many we need to freshen, how many will breed, and get back to the point they're saying, well, we need to breed X number of cows to this, and then.

All the other, then we need to allow a few, if we want a certain time period, and then the rest we could do beef over dairy to get a higher sale price for those, those calves that don't work in the dairy.

You know, I love abl Black Baldy that's half hosting, half Angus.

You know, black Baldies, that's Hereford Angus are pretty nice, but a, a Baldy that's out of a dairy animal.

They can flat milk now, they actually can get too much milk in there, but you know, they make some really nice animals.

Those beef dairy crosses.

Ernie: Yeah.

So far our our belty jerseys have they look cool 'cause some of 'em have belts, some have partial belts.

They've all come out black and white so far.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

So, yeah, because your black gene is going to be dominant and your belt gene is dominant in the coloration.

Now with the, the belt gene, you know, depending on your, your bull, whether or not he's homozygous for it or heterozygous for it.

But yeah, that belt's pretty, and, and the belt gene is interesting ' cause it doesn't actually mean a full complete belt.

It can be a, just a little bit of white up on its side.

I've got a half belted Galloway, half South Pole cow.

And she's got, she's got a little bit of white going up on her side, so she's got the belted gene in there.

She just doesn't have the modifiers to get it to the nice wide belt.

And she had a, a heifer kef this year with that same Ernie: Oh yeah, Cal: It's, it's pretty cute at this stage.

Ernie: it's been cool seeing what comes out with belts and how they look.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

Used to just going on that tangent a little bit used to, I, I looked all over for goats with belts because I thought, I thought, well, I've just been fascinated.

Dutch belted belted Galloway lacking veder chickens, you know, they have the, the black tail and the blackhead and white body, and you got hamshire hogs.

It's got the same type of pattern I thought.

For a while as a teenager, young adult, that's what I wanted to farm, where all the animals had the same color pattern, you know?

And that black with a white belt was so cool.

Ernie: Yeah, it would look cool.

It'd be picturesque.

Cal: It, yeah, it would.

Yeah.

You mentioned earlier, well, I was going to go to species.

You're going to add in the future you're talking about, but I hadn't even talked.

You started turkeys in there as well.

Ernie: Yeah.

We started turkeys last year for Thanksgiving.

We did 200 of them and then.

Cal: How did that go, Ernie: It went well.

It was a higher mortality rate than the chickens.

And in learning turkeys, they're more of a grazing species than the chickens, so just figuring them out.

But they're like little white puppy dogs compared to chickens, Cal: Oh, Ernie: if they got outta their net, 'cause like a hawk came over and spooked them, it was easy to just get a person out there and just walk past and hurt 'em back into the fence.

They're really docile and you just walk up to 'em and do whatever you need to.

They're just like Cal: Oh yes.

Yeah.

With were you using electric netting with them and did you have some kind of shelter you pulled around?

Ernie: We had a shelter for them at first.

We started with like enclosed, so we did a pro progression of when we started with the same thing with the broilers.

They were in poultry netting with like a kind of an open house where maybe there was a door we closed and we still moved them every day.

And then we did the same thing with turkeys at first.

We had them with a door that can, they close 'em out at night, open 'em up in the morning, and then we'd still move that structure around.

But they were getting hammered by just one hawk the whole time.

They, they were in that, that stage between chick or like when we first put 'em out to when they're up full-sized Turkey.

So then we put them in the.

They were like a 24 by 12 foot wide, like a prairie sch style with a billboard tarp on the side, chicken wire on the side.

And they were fully enclosed, but then they were a little too crowded, so they started attacking each, the Toms would start attacking the hens or pick on the, the weak ones.

So then we took the chicken wire off, put 'em on.

By that time, they were big enough, so we opened them up and then put them back in poultry netting, and they did fine that way.

So.

This year, our first batch of turkeys comes outta the brewer this week, this week or next week.

And we'll put 'em in the same open style and then just put 'em in a different part of the farm.

So hopefully we, we can avoid the hawks.

Cal: Oh yeah, yeah.

But you're gonna start 'em in that open side at Ernie: Yeah.

Yeah.

'cause even with the broilers, we went to like ENC fully enclosed last year and it just made for.

It was easier than like pulling 'em.

Every day was easy 'cause they're all enclosed and you're going in there, but then they're in there, they're not out just, I guess out free.

They're kind of Cal: Right.

Ernie: and it was just messy getting in there after you pull it out.

And then so we changed them.

Now.

Even the broilers or everybody's out in poultry netting.

Our little hoop structure have gotten a little smaller in length, and then just open so they can get under there for the shade, food and water, and then kind of do a little bit more grazing and chicken stuff or Turkey stuff.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Yeah, you mentioned adding rabbits to it, so obviously you've already got a lot of irons in the fire and you're just glutton for punishment, but why add rabbits?

Ernie: I don't know.

I don't know.

Rabbits are on the list, sheep are on the list.

We're just trying to figure out how to make it all work and as we, as we advertise and market.

So far it's a been easier, the more products we can offer, the more somebody's interested in it and they might be looking for a rabbit and then find everything else.

Or they're looking for chicken and they see everything else.

It's worked, definitely worked that way with people.

Getting more things from us, and I think it's just, I don't know, I don't know if it's for the kids, for the rabbits, but we'll try to move 'em around all the time and, and make mobile pens for 'em.

But I think it's just a, just another species to have.

Cal: I don't blame you for that.

I, I'd like rabbits and I've thought about, you know, I purchased that raising meat rabbits on pasture book, trying to look to see if it's on my shelf.

And with, with their management philosophy that's put forth in the book.

You're keeping your do in in cages and then you're only raising the offspring once they're weaned on grass that you're moving around.

You know, and there's, there's something, I forget what that disease is.

You gotta be careful about wild rabbits.

And I don't even know the range.

I think it's in my area.

So it's something to be con to consider rabbits, like to tunnel.

How could you do it?

Because I, I've thought myself, I like rabbits.

I like raising them to figure that out.

And I.

And I just have too many irons in the fire for me to, to do it.

But I do look at 'em on Craigslist because we've got ox here Texas a and m University at Kings Kingsville, I think is where it is.

And they bred a heat tolerant New Zealand.

Variety.

They also have a composite, but the New Zealand type is white and looks like New Zealand.

Ears are bigger which helps 'em handle the heat better, but they grow fast.

Even in the heat.

They'll continue to raise babies throughout the heat.

In fact, I think.

I think there's a, a guy in Georgia that's got 'em, I'll have to look that up because I had a few of 'em.

I was really happy with them, but I was doing them in cages and I, I just love to do 'em.

I on the ground and I know there's, there's other problems, but you know, if I think about grazing, why am I raising something in a cage?

I should have it out grazing.

Ernie: I think that's probably the, the how we started on the rabbit thing was my parents right now are doing them in cages and they have three rabbits in cages and they started with meat rabbits, you know, a couple years ago.

And then they keep thinking about just getting rid of 'em.

They don't wanna do it anymore.

It's too much of a hassle they don't want to keep at, as they come up and help us on the farm.

Their cage rabbits seem less appealing.

Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: we've talked about just taking their rabbits from them and doing it here, or taking their offspring and just doing it here on the farm.

And then I saw a video of white oak pastures.

They have a video on YouTube of their new rabbit habitat that they're doing Cal: Oh, I'll have to look that Ernie: but they do the bucks in cages and then the dough are out with the babies on pasture.

Cal: Oh, yes, Ernie: Yeah, I think on YouTube it's called the, they call it like their rabbit hat.

Cal: Oh, yeah.

Okay.

I'll have to look that up.

I didn't know they were, I knew they had rabbit, but I didn't know what they were doing For sure.

With the rabbits.

I, I think that's interesting.

There is a YouTube channel that I've thought about reaching out to 'em.

They are in England, and they are grazing Guinea pigs.

Which I thought's interesting because you have some of the same characteristics.

Not all of 'em, Guinea pigs don't tunnel like rabbits will, but they are a small animal.

And just moving them and doing it.

And I, I think it's interesting what they're doing with the Guinea pig.

So I've, I've thought I need to reach out and get 'em on the podcast just to talk about it.

I, Ernie: considering that we don't consume Guinea pig here at all.

Cal: Well, and that's kind of their deal.

They, they didn't get 'em for consumption because people eat 'em in other countries and if people eat 'em, I'm willing to try 'em.

I haven't found any per and pro pervi, Peruvian.

I'm sure Peru.

Restaurants near me that serve it, but I'd be willing to try it and see what it tastes like.

My wife says, no, you're crazy, but I'd try it.

Uh, but they're not.

Ernie: eats it.

Cal: Yeah.

But they're not raising them for consumption right now.

Actually.

They don't have a business model for the Guinea pigs other than grazing because they're using it to graze.

I think they have a vineyard.

If I remember correctly in their grazing those areas and they're just trying to figure out a way how to manage the, the grass that's growing up without spending time on a mower or something that would hurt.

And they may have, I don't remember exactly what all plants they have.

Maybe, maybe it's a orchard.

I'm not sure they're growing something and the Guinea pigs are a means to maintain the Ernie: Okay.

Cal: Yeah.

Which, because when I first saw it, I thought they raising it for consumption in Europe.

That doesn't sound right to me, so it's interesting.

Yeah.

Now, of course, sheep, we raise sheep.

I think sheep jump in there really nicely for you without a lot of work.

But I'm interested to see how it goes for you with the rabbits and if y'all decide to incorporate Ernie: yeah, yeah.

Hopefully soon.

Cal: Yeah.

Ernie, let's, let's jump back to your dairy cattle, and that's gonna be our overgrazing section for today where At Redmond, we know that you thrive when your animals do.

That's why it's essential to fill the gaps in your herd's nutrition with the minerals that they need.

Made by nature, our ancient mineral salt and conditioner clay are the catalyst in optimizing the nutrients your animals get from their forage.

Unaltered and unrefined, our minerals have the natural balance and proportion to help that your animals prefer.

This gives your herd the ability to naturally regulate their mineral consumption as they graze.

Our minerals won't just help you improve the health of your animals, but will also help you naturally build soil fertility so you can grow more nutrient dense pasture year after year.

Nourish your animals, your soil, and your life with Redmond.

Learn more at redmondagriculture.

com Cal: where we take a deeper dive into what you're doing and our focus for overgrazing is going to be the calf sharing.

But before we get to the calf sharing, let's just talk a little bit more about your dairy and how you're managing that.

I believe earlier you said you have eight, nine jersey cows.

You're Ernie: Yeah, we're milking eight right now.

Cal: Yeah.

A, and you kind of jumped in there, not whole hog, but you jumped in with a couple cows at first, right?

Ernie: We had 2, 2, 2 jerseys at first that we got in milk and then figure out milk in them because we don't have a structure.

So we milk out in the pasture.

Cal: Oh, Ernie: at first it was just buckets of alfalfa and a little portable bucket, milker and a generator on a trailer and milking 'em outside.

And then it's progressed and we still milk out in the pasture.

I just built a 12 by 12, kind of a four on four by fours.

12 by 12 sled with a roof on top of it, and then like a stanchion, and then they walk in there, they get their alfalfa, and then I just have everything on a trailer that would pull behind with a four wheeler and I just milk 'em out in the Cal: Oh, okay.

Ernie: bring the, the milk back up to the house and then process it.

Cal: Well that was my first question.

You're doing this by hand, but, or a bucket Milker.

So you're using a bucket milker with nine cows.

How many stalls do you have for those cows?

In a 12 by 12 Ernie: Just two right now.

Cal: You've got two.

How do you.

I, I know you're working with a small number and maybe you just push 'em back and get another cow in there that hasn't been milked, or do you have some kind of process you go through with that?

Ernie: So I have, everybody gets moved once a day.

All the cows are in single wire poly.

So I just park that sled in their next pasture or their next pa, next paddock, and then I'll turn off their fence and then open up the poly wire.

And after I.

So like with the heifers, when they're freshening and they've never done it before, it's kind of, they know they're gonna get alfalfa when they get in there.

So everybody's waiting in line, but then they figure out like their order.

So I have the first two are waiting for me when I get there, and then the next two, and occasionally they'll try to cut in because you have a mixture of.

We have two A one cows and then the rest of 'em are a two.

So we'll milk all the A two girls first, and then the A ones Cal: Oh yeah.

Ernie: So everybody kind of knows their order.

And then I'll just push the ones out.

That need can't come in.

Most of the time they're respectable.

As long as we're removing them and they're, they're full, then they're not pushing in there too hard.

But like if for some reason I gave 'em a too small the paddock and everybody's hungry, then they'll wanna bum rush the the stanchion and get their treats.

Cal: Now, you mentioned their order.

They're coming in and you, you do have a reason for that order.

You need milk.

The A twos first.

The A ones at the last, outside of that order, does it, do you have a certain order within the A two or do the cows have a certain order in the A two group that, that they milk Ernie: The, the cows have their own order.

I could care less who comes in there, but they have their, their pecking order of who's gonna get in there first, and they'll fight over it.

But they, and the weird thing is they just.

To it.

So the first two, that cows are there, they'll come in and the second two are waiting, and then it just, it's been a repetition when we're doing it every day.

Cal: It, and I really baited you in that question because I knew that was going to be the answer, or I was reasonably sure that was gonna be the answer.

Because growing up on a dairy, we milked from 40 to over a hundred cows, depending on here, my grandparents and.

It was almost like the third set.

The first cow's gonna be this cow.

It's just some cows were really particular about when they come in, some didn't care as much.

Some were very particular if they came in the front hole or if they came in the backhoe because we had a double four herring bone, so four cows standing there.

Some of 'em were very concerned.

One 11 always came in on, on one side of the barn and she'd.

She'd grab a bite of feed we fed in the barn and then she'd stick her head below the gate and chew on that feed and she'd make a huge mess whenever she was in there.

It's just interesting and like you said, that order.

It's such in the two year olds were always at the end.

And now when they mature a little bit further, sometimes they move up in that, that order they milk in.

But it's just so interesting and pretty predictable.

And if you're, you're watching for heat, if they come in outta, outta sink or something, you're like, wait, why is she in here now?

This is not her time.

Ernie: Yeah, because even with our thing, I'm in the middle with the bucket milker, and there's two stanchions on each side of me, so they have their own side that they want to go into, and they'll go into that side every, every time.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Are you milking twice a day?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: No, we're only doing once a day.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Which, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the majority of it, we went to twice a day milking when we weaned this last batch of calves, and then it was milking twice a day for a couple weeks, and I went, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh, yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: juggle this with the rest of the farm.

We're going back to once a day.

I don't care if we're getting a little bit less milk, need, I can't do it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: I, I completely agree.

I, I think this once a day milking, um, could be a game changer.

F for people considering your labor, you're gonna get a little bit less milk.

But man, doing that twice a day takes a lot of work.

I always think back to, um, my grandpa grew up on a ranch, worked on a ranch, and they'd milk.

The cow night and morning, night and morning.

And he, he got this job on this ranch and they were milking.

So first Saturday night, he, he gets ready to go out there and they're like, what are you doing?

He said, well, I'm going out and milk the cow.

And they're like, oh, she doesn't give milk on Saturday night.

You, you know, uh, cows, cows get used to that routine.

So once a day I think is really a labor saver.

So with once a day out in the pasture.

How are you raising your calves?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: so we are doing calf sharing, um, and we have for that, we have a portable structure that I built too that stays out in their paddock with 'em.

It's foot wide by 16 feet long, 20 feet long, something like that.

And it's got cattle panels on the side and a just a livestock gate in the front.

then we, when it's getting dark outside, we'll go out and we'll get all the calves, put 'em in there for the night, and use some poultry netting as like a funnel first and get 'em used to it.

They'll get alfalfa when they go in there and then far they've trained themselves to go in there put 'em in there and, uh, keep 'em there overnight and then let 'em out after milking.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: So, so giving them a little bit of alfalfa, pellet, alfalfa pellets, they, they get in the routine fairly early and it's not a, a rodeo every day to get 'em into that pen.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: It used to be, as we've done it, it's progressed more so like one calf was fine and then if it's a really docile calf, it's easy to get 'em in there.

And then there's been, there's four or five of 'em to get in there, and then nobody wants to cooperate or we're doing something, we were out in town and all of a sudden it's dark out.

You can't get 'em in there.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the poultry netting of just putting that up and then getting 'em in there and it's worked out.

And then our structure has changed over, over time on how we need to do things.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

So talk about that structure just a little bit more for someone.

Uh, you mentioned 12 foot by 20 foot long or with cattle panels on it.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, I think it's 12 by.

12 by 16 or 12 by 20.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

I.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: our, originally it was our milk stanchion that we were our portable milk stanchion.

And then I went to a different design to put two in there because we had too many cows.

And then the cattle panels went up and at first we had the cattle panels on there to keep the other cows out when we were milking.

So I had cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: pasture with, in their paddock with them.

I'd open the gate, bring the one set of cows in, milk them.

We just had two headlocks in there.

Then as the calves were born.

I would have the calves in there and then I would let the calves out and bring the cows in.

'cause there was only two at a time, or like two milk cows that had calves.

And then we needed something different.

So now it's 12 by 16 and it's just two by 6, 3 2 by sixes stacked on top of each other.

And then just, uh, square frame on top with some metal.

Metal roofing on top cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: calves dry.

And then the cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: put up some metal panels, roofing on the sides to keep the wind out and keep the calves warm.

And cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: a headlock into the side of it too.

So if I need to put a nose ring or work on somebody out in the field instead of chasing down calves and, and them.

Uh, now just when they're in there, we'll, I'll run 'em through.

That way I could run 'em through a headlock or shoot.

And, uh, put a weaning ring on 'em, or if something's wrong with 'em, I could address it there instead of having to get 'em.

'cause we don't have like a corral.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the other side of the property, but it's impossible to get cows down there.

'cause we don't have like a roadway to get down there or any, any infrastructure for fencing.

that way, even if it's uh, one of the moms, I can either get them in the milk sled or if it's the bull, I can get somebody herded into that calf sled and then get them in the headlock.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah, so, so your headlock in there will work for your mature animals as well?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

It's cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Well, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I found on Marketplace for a hundred bucks and it's a full size, headlock and cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh yeah.

Well, the, the, I'm, I'm sure that's really handy when you need it to have that available.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, it's been a changer since it's only been on there for like the past six months, and it was like, why didn't I do this before?

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Yeah.

I, I know how that is so.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: We had, we still had like one of the wooden headlocks from when we were milking the cows in there.

But no way I'm, the way it was set up, there's no way I'm gonna get a calf in there and try to cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: get them locked in to get a nose ring on.

But if I put an actual metal headlock on there, I could just close the gate and then just herd everybody through and then let the, the ones go through and somebody just closes it on that calf and then we could do whatever we need to do.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh yeah.

With your, your calves, how long are you keeping them on the cow?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: We've been doing about six months, so we're giving 'em a little bit longer.

Um, and as we're trying to go forward being better on grass, it only makes sense to keep them with mom to learn what the gray's on and what they can't eat, what they can't eat, rather than.

Putting everybody on a bottle and then expecting 'em to go out and graze and then giving them a better chance.

If they're on mom for longer, they're, it's my expectation that they're gonna do better than if we wean them super early.

So it's worked out.

Some of our calves went to eight, nine months.

Mom was like a low producer, so we really didn't milk her cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: wouldn't get that much, so the cash stay on, or they learned how to get around their weaning ring, so just no other option.

just let 'em cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: mom and they still did the cash sharing for longer.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

And those caves will do better.

Having access to mom, then if you were, and if you raise them on bottle.

I've raised lots of calves on a bottle, but that's another job.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, it's another job.

We don't have anywhere to keep them and, and do that whole cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

With your, your calves, you mentioned putting a weaning flap on them.

Is that working fairly well for you?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: It has until it falls out in the pasture and they get another taste of mom's milk cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, yes.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: that are just smart and they figure out how to go sideways and get it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: So, and for them we, like right now we have the, before we had the beef cows and the dairy cows all together for breeding and everything else.

Now we're back to two different herds.

So we have the lactating cows the lactating jerseys separate, and then the dry cows with the beef cows.

Behind them uh, that's worked for problematic cow calves, we can kind of separate them into the other herd.

They fit right in 'cause it's their friends they've been in with before cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: not missing mom now.

So now we finally have all the calves weaned this season cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: And do you, is it just a single strand separating them or are you using electric net or something else?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: they're probably, the beef cows are probably like 60 days behind.

Uh.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: The dairy cows, so I could be a little bit more selective with the, the milk cows.

And then I'll use the beef cows and the, the wean calves to come back in and do a little bit more high density on the second, the second grazing period for that set.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

And are you moving your do dairy cows once a day?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

With your, your calf stall or calf shed.

Are you.

How are you moving that with A-U-U-T-V or four wheeler?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, the UTV, it's a little bit too heavy for the four wheeler.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: so it'll, depending on where it's going, it'll move with the four wheeler.

But the UTV, To move it because it's only gotten a little heavier as the time's gone, especially with that headlock on there and as we add more panels or the, the metal siding on it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh yeah.

True with your.

Your stall.

Let's talk about your milking stall just a little bit.

You've got two stalls and you have room in the middle for yourself.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

And then so the cows walk into it to get feed.

Then are they backing out to get out or do you have like a board on the squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: backing out cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: They're backing out.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: that thing, it's, it's easy that way.

I thought about putting like doors on the side so they can go out the front, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yes.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: having them go out the front and then try and get 'em back into the paddock they were just in, like it'd be complicated without running posts out and then more poly wire to try to get a lane back to where they're going.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh yeah.

Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: they've learned how to back out and maybe I have to.

Push one or just get 'em, get 'em out.

But all know what they're doing now as long as they run out of alfalfa, I pull their bowl and there's nothing else for them.

They'll cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the ground and then they're, they're over it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Yeah.

And that's not a problem.

They figure it out.

Uh, just curious.

So do you strive to give your cows a certain amount of, um, alfalfa pellets each feeding, or do you give them enough while they're milking and when they're done milking, you pull it?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, I'll give 'em enough to milking and then I'll, I'll pull it cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: occasionally if I'm doing something else in there, they might get a little bit more, if I'm trying to get vacuum flies off of them or something cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: or.

If somebody's got, if one of 'em have mastitis and they need cream or doing something, then they'll get a little extra treat just to keep them in there and occupied cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

Do you put a, a chain or anything behind them or is just the feed good enough to keep 'em in?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the feed's good enough.

I have one makeshift headlock on one side.

there's, I.

If they're having a problem or like they're just not over it or heat and nobody wants to cooperate, ' em cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I have to lock 'em.

But as long as there's alfalfa in there, they, they pretty much will stay cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Pretty good.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: don't cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: unless like one of the kid, little one of the kids spook 'em or something like that.

But they'll back out momentarily and then come right back in.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

With your, uh, your shed.

Does it only have a roof for your milking shed?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, it cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: a, a roof right now.

Um, I've thought about doing sides on it in the winter time.

but at the same time it gets so windy here.

I'm just worried about it flipping.

There's been a couple times where I've had to the tractor forks to hold the milk sled down on some of the, the windy winter days.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, yes.

Yeah.

My, my thoughts or my worry as I think about it, obviously winter with the wind's not gonna be any fun, but when it's raining.

How, how is it when it's raining?

Or does that tend to not be that big of issue?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: It does, unless it's like a really bad storm and it's raining sideways, coming in, it's not, hasn't been that big of an issue.

Um, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: and then I can park them.

I could maneuver it to face a certain way, whether the wind's coming at us or cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: coming at us or behind them.

then, uh, there's enough of an overhang where it's not really coming, coming cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

Yeah, and that makes sense.

Um, you know, I look at those New Zealand style barns where they have a herringbone and it's all open and just a shad highly jealous of that compared to what we milked in.

Of course, our weather, I don't think would be all that much fun to milk out in the open, but squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: No it wouldn't.

And then we did it for the first winter.

We did it out in the open, and then maybe I would take a little 10 by 10 popup shade out there cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: really rainy or really cold days.

And I was like, we need to do something else.

And the sled works because.

It cuts down on the cleaning time, like cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: and then the next, when I go to move them in the afternoon, I'll pull their, their sled forward, and then they're in a new, fresh piece of grass away from manure, away from everything.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: and then it's cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: With.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: like the height of the grass, trampling it all, or knock it down with like the Tupperware that I carry the hoses out with and just getting everything bent over to where it's not all over.

Them fighting with the milk claw.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

With your, your milk, you, you milk your cows, you've got it in the stainless bucket, I'm assuming stainless steel bucket.

What's your process after that?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: So then we get done, and then if we're milking all eight and we have a whole bunch of milk, wife or uh, Dana, whatever, our employees will come down and they'll pick up the milk that's done and bring it up to the house.

And then we just filter all right away, bottle it and put it on a, an ice bath.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: get it chilled.

'cause we we're just getting to the point of needing a chill tank.

It's only been this past year that we've been milking eight.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: And you're bottling it in like gallon jars and putting in that ice bath.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: jars.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: 'cause that's cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: thing with us being, you know, the organic inside that we have a lot of people that want it in glass jars and out of plastic.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

What's the regulations there in Georgia for you as sell raw milk?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: we're doing as pet milk?

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

As pet milk?

Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Herd shares aren't legal here.

They legalized raw, made the, gotta be a full enclosed milk parlor and, and room.

And then they set the, the restrictions really low to kind of deter everybody from going that route, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: So we're just under the pet milk cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, okay.

Yeah.

Are you able, able to advertise it or do you even need to, is there enough of word of mouth that people just know?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: We'll, we'll advertise it on social media, um, we, when we have a lot of milk, but there's such a demand for it that we don't really need to advertise 'cause everybody's calling for it.

Or they'll see the pictures on the website and try to order it and.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Pictures make a big difference in Oklahoma.

You can't advertise raw cow milk for sale, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: but um.

But there seems to be a good demand here for it.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, it's, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: big boom behind raw milk right cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Which, which the crazy thing for me, you can advertise raw goat milk for sale, but not raw cow mills.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Oh, wow.

That, that doesn't make any sense.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: At least that's the way I understand it.

Someone may say no, you're understanding that wrong, but that's, that's my understanding.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: popular than goat milk.

They figure they don't have to worry about those couple people that want the, the goat milk.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: R.

Right, right.

Have you had anyone ask about other species, like goat milk versus sheep milk or anything?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

There's been a bunch of people that have called to ask about goat milk or cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: milk.

we, that's how we started with, we were gonna do goat milk, but.

I don't know.

There's just something manlier for me, getting out there and milking a cow versus milking a bunch of goats or sheep.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I, all of it appeals to me.

Of course, all this homesteading grazing appeals to me, so I, if I had time, I'd do everything.

So I have to, to really watch myself.

But, um, yeah, with the cows, it's just, it's just the way we've been exposed to as society here in America is it's cow's milk.

Um.

My grandma used to always buy goat's milk 'cause it was healthier and I've had goats milk and sometimes the flavor's just a little bit different with goat's milk.

Sheep's milk is really interesting.

In fact, probably 15 years ago I, I purchased some East, east Friesian.

Boy, I can't even talk.

I purchased some East Friesian use with the plans of doing some sheet milk and milking them, but.

I was busy and never got a milk.

They just raised their lambs every year for me.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, a, uh, there's a sheep dairy, maybe about a half an hour away from us, and they do sheet cheese.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yes.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: there to visit them yet, but it, it's something that cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: I squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I had more time and more stuff, it would make sense.

Or if we were just doing a.

Just a dairy, it would make more sense to have all just a different dairy species 'cause they're all doing the same thing.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I can't, I don't know if I, I can deal with meat sheep or hair sheep, uh, but I don't know if I want to go the dairy route.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah, I, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: had a couple goats and they drive me crazy trying to deal with them.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah, I, I don't imagine you want to, if you've got the market for the cow's milk, that's the way it go.

Um, the hare sheep, no, not the hare sheep, but the sheep's milk was really appealing to me because I could freeze the milk and then.

Make cheese when I had time, or at least that was the plan.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Mm-hmm.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Not that I ever finished that plan, but yeah.

Is there anything else about your farm?

We ran through most of your species and you can't get into a lot of detail.

Um, partly because you, you have a lot of species, a lot of things going on.

Is there anything on your farm we didn't talk about?

I know I have one more question about your farm I just thought of, but go ahead.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Um, we do, mostly everything we do is direct to consumer, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, very good.

That was a question I had wrote down, but I didn't ask.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: We have, uh, a couple like health, food stores that we'll supply, um, for chicken.

Um, but almost everything is direct consumer.

We, uh, we ship, uh, to most of the East coast.

We don't do very many shipping orders, but it's cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: we went into like we are gonna be able to reach more people, but there's so many people out there that marketing it and, and getting stuff.

So we'll ship the neighboring states.

Occasionally.

Um, and, uh, I don't think there's, I think that's it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: My, my other question I had in mind goes all the way back to the beginning.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Root Pastors, where'd the name come from?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Uh, it took us a while to come up with it, basically pastures.

'cause we were grazing everything and we didn't wanna be a farm.

Um.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Then because everybody's got farm after the name or something.

And then cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yes.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: was just something where we could put solid roots down.

And iron seemed like a good thing to, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: To put a solid foundation down.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

Yeah, it makes sense.

Uh, I think farm names are interesting.

We call our little farm what we do, hedge apple acres.

And I, I like acres in there because it's just the image in my head is such idyllic image of few animals, grazing and stuff.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, you gotta come up with something different than, like if it was just hedge acres farms, it's just cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: thing.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right.

I, I actually, as I think back now, not right now, but in, I've thought about it that I kind of wish I'd gone with hedge apple pastures, but you know, it still works out.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Ernie, it is time we switch gears and we jump to the famous four questions, same four questions we ask of all of our guests.

For today's sponsor, we wanna talk about the Grazing Grass Resources.

We just launched it and it is built by graziers, for graziers.

It's a listing, it's a directory.

It's your go-to spot to find farms, consultants, books, podcasts, tools, and more, all focused on grass-based and regenerative livestock production.

Even better, you can submit your own listing there for free.

That way we keep it practical, useful and a community.

Whether you've got a service to share, a favorite Facebook group or a farm folks should know about head over an add it.

You can check it out at grazinggrassresources.com or just at our main website, grazinggrass.com and click on resources.

I look forward to seeing you over there and I look forward to seeing your listing there.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: And our first question, what's your favorite grazing grass related book or resource?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Uh, let's see.

It would probably be either maybe Joe, farm, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yes.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: because that's one of the biggest things I say now to everybody when they.

ask what they could do and it's just get started.

Don't care.

I don't care about what infrastructure you have anything.

Just get a couple animals and get them moving around.

I mean, we don't, we still don't have waterline here on the farm.

We harvest everything from a spring that comes off the mountain and we fill, it all runs in IBC totes and I use the tractor and water everybody cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: or with a tank in the back of the UTV.

And if we just.

Analyzed everything.

We would've never had water lines in the ground.

We would've never had animals, we wouldn't have started.

So just some animals, start, throw some two by fours and chicken wire together and just get started.

It would be s you can farm to just get it, you pushed your way.

the, this podcast would be another one.

'cause I listen to it all the time and it cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Well, thank you.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: you have such a, a Amount of people on for different things that it exposes you to a lot more than just reading a grazing book and then trying to cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: book and then do that, and then you're the year's gone and you've only learned about one species that you're, and there's only one point of view of one species.

It's not a cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh, right.

Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: are doing it themselves, and there are different ways of doing it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Well.

Joe Ton's book, YOUCAN Farm's an excellent resource.

I'm not sure if the Grazing grass is worthy of being there, but I really appreciate you including it and I hope it's beneficial to our listeners.

Our second question, what's your favorite tool for the farm?

I.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I guess my favorite tool would, it would be.

It'd be tough 'cause we have so many different species, so many different things going on.

would probably be the tractor that we have for hauling water and the cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: we couldn't do that.

We used to do it with filling up in the back of a little trailer and toting around with the UTV.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: uh, it would probably be the tractor.

UTV will close second 'cause we have to haul the feed there somehow.

And then polywire.

'cause how else are we gonna keep the animals?

And we wouldn't be able cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: graze every day and cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: day if we didn't have polywire.

Like my energizers, the batteries died in the energizers because you solar energizers.

And they died this weekend.

We hadn't been able to get the battery stored, so they still have not learned that the fence is non, uh, we gotta get 'em the batteries in there tonight, but it still works.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: You know, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: of those three things.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: and all those are great resources.

Uh, I, I like to caution people that.

You know, a tractor shouldn't be your first purchase.

There's a time when, when that's tractor can be really handy, but there's a lot of things you can do without a tractor to get there.

Um, the energizer, UTV, both really good energizer.

Those are all good resources.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

And the tractor, we really got it because we had, 74 acres when we first got, we didn't have any cows at first.

And then it was only started with four.

Yeah, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: three cows and then add two more.

So we had the bush hog everything in the cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: maintain the, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: and then it was hauling water, and then it was, by then we were doing enough broilers that we had to.

Steel with bulk totes, so it's being able to pick up the totes off the trailer that I couldn't cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: had a skid steer forks, and that's a whole nother piece of equipment.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right, right.

Yeah.

Um, and brush hogging is really valuable if you're doing selective grazing.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Mm-hmm.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

So, yeah, that all makes sense.

Ernie, what would you tell someone?

Just getting started.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: It would be that just start, you can do analysis for analysis and worry about everything else, but get started with enough chickens or whatever.

are the easiest, but get it for you cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: start that way and then learn.

And then it's, I.

not that big of a deal.

Like you could overanalyze it and think about what you need to do and the perfect brewer and everything else, and it just slap it together and get it going.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah, I'm, I'm gonna have to raise my hand.

I am terrible about thinking I'm gonna do something and then I dive in so deep and I gotta do this.

I gotta get this equipment, I gotta do this, it, this certain way.

No.

Just start where you are and do what you can.

Um, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I and, um, I can overanalyze things so I just don't let myself do it.

So cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: batch of two batch of chickens ago, we went, moved from 250 broilers a month up to 600.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: and we had the demand that we sell out of our chicken in the first week after processing.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh wow.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: time to to go.

So before we had a big enough brewer for all the new chickens and big enough houses, it was.

All right.

Place the order.

600 chickens are coming in two weeks now we gotta build it.

We gotta go, we gotta figure out a brooder and it might just be slapping, ply, plywood up together and making a roof and getting some lights in there.

And it's just forcing myself to be, to build the stuff and get off off my butt and, and move.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: I, I do something very likewise.

You know, if the easy step is to order it and it's coming in the future, order it, and then you're forced to do it.

So I love that strategy to kind of force yourself out of that analysis paralysis.

Yeah.

Our fourth question, where can others find out more about you?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: You can find out more about us on It's at Iron Root Pastures on Instagram, Facebook.

That's our, the farm one.

We don't have a TikTok.

We keep talking about starting a YouTube, but I cannot find the time to edit videos unless I'm hiring somebody to edit it for me.

we have so much going on.

I feel like we should just start like a farm vlog and keep everybody on.

'cause we're always building something and always expanding.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: the time to do it is, I can't, I can't find it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right.

I, I completely agree.

There is so many different methods or channels out there for you to, to promote what you're doing.

It can turn into a full-time job itself.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: You know, I've kind of, with the podcast I was pushing stuff out through a lot more channels than I pulled back.

Now I've added some back.

It's always a evolving solution I'm looking at.

But yeah, you gotta be careful.

You've only got a certain amount of time you can focus on on something like that.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

When I look back at it, like all the farm blogs we used to watch, that was their main thing.

They weren't actually selling the products.

They were just food for themselves and building infrastructure and building the cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: that vlogging was helped pay for all that.

Trying to vlog or record things about where to removing the cows and what we're doing.

It just, to sit there with the time of just staring at, like talking to the phone and then going to edit something and then do that.

By then, I've already moved the cows, I'm onto the chicken.

We're building something else, cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Oh yeah, yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I can't just sit there and like set up a, a tripod and a camera and then talk to it for a certain amount of time, I won't get anything done.

I'm just always in a rush.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah, yeah.

I completely understand that.

Uh, to wrap up today, Ernie, do you have a question for me?

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I guess it'd be is how you find most of your guests, because I feel like sometimes they have to reach out to you and then it's, is it just people you find interesting through other podcasts or things you're reading?

I.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: So the way, so like everything, there's a few different ways.

I put out at the end of each episode, it says, if you're a grass farmer and you'd like to share your story, fill out this form, which is broken right now because I'm changing the website around.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: um, I get, I would say about one guest a month through that.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: sometimes it may be two or three this month, and I may go a month or two without anyone, but I typically have a trickle coming through that.

And then.

I get recommendations, I get people contact me and say, Hey, this person would be great on the podcast or so and so like, I posted it in Grazing Grass Community and I've got, besides the people that reached out and said they were interested, I have a list of people that was, that that was recommended would be good on the podcast and that's.

Th that post has me a whole bunch of names and people that's gonna help me, um, get started.

I'd gotten a little bit lazy and was a little bit behind on getting it, so I appreciate you jumping on this weekend to record for this week.

And, um, that happens from time to time.

I strive to have about a four week lead time, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: but.

Um, here lately, I haven't been doing a good job and it is about to bite me.

That's the reason I had to post in the community about it.

And that's another reason that if you're not part of the Grazing Grass community, I suggest you get there.

The, the other way is I go and I'm looking at websites.

I'm looking, I'm part of a lot of different groups on Facebook, and if I see someone doing something that I think, oh, that looks interesting, I jump on their.

Well to their profile.

I'll go to their webpage and look, and then I have a list that I put down, um, on a spreadsheet that I go through and contact people.

Uh, and that's kind of hit and miss I think sometimes, uh, the emails I.

We'll end up in spam or people miss them.

Our inboxes are just so full, so sometimes I think that's a little bit of a problem when I'm reaching out, but I'll reach out either through their website or email and get 'em on.

I try to, as I'm looking at, at these potential guests, I want to make sure we're having a range of species.

I wanna make sure we're having a range of geographical locations.

I wanna make sure we have a range of.

Uh, experience, like you've been doing this a couple years and we talked to, I'm drawing a complete blank, but, um, Ricky not too long ago, and she's been doing it for decades.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: you know, I want that range.

And when I think about that, I want a beef producer every month.

I want someone with small ru small ruminants every month.

Those, those are the two big ones.

I love dairy.

I also know my downloads take a little bit of a hit sometimes when I talk too much dairy.

So, you know, I try and temper that.

So I'd like to have dairy each month.

Then I'd like to have something else, and that could be a repeat of something we've already covered or something unique like bison where we had Dusty baker on here, or, um, I'm drawing a blank, um, with, with the ducks just to, uh, I should know the name.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: one yesterday.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: I wanna say Doug, was that right?

I don't know, but I try and get, get that range.

And as I think about, I would like, and this is one area, I haven't done a great job.

I would like someone outside the US at least once a month.

Um, and I might even change that and say outside of North America once a month, and then just kind of group North America together, because there's times it seems like it goes in spurts, like.

I'll have a few Canadians on the podcast.

Or a month or two ago I had a couple episodes with South Carolinas.

You know, it's kind of interesting how that happens.

Um, but I just try and keep an eye on that to do that.

But for guests, they either come to me or I'm reaching out for various reasons.

Somebody told me or I found something they posted online.

Interesting.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Okay.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: answer for a.

That should have been the short answer.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Well, I mean, it makes sense because.

Experience levels.

And that's one of the cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: that makes it like interesting and keeps, I think.

'cause you have all the knowledge of there, of the people that have been doing it for a long time.

But then you also have the, either the younger people or people that are just starting to farm and they're figuring it all out and they, they can think of things that the older farmers, it's not on their head 'cause they haven't done, they haven't been to that cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Right.

Yeah.

Well, and and one reason.

I, I'm really particular about that, that I want to, to that range in all those different directions is I think our journey speak to each other and you're going to identify with someone's journey.

There's someone that listens to today's episode and they're going to be in a lot, their house is in a lot where they only have a little bit of area, and for some reason when you said, Hey, I raised 10 chickens.

They're like.

Why didn't someone say that to me before?

And people could have, but it was something about your story, your situation, that spoke to 'em.

And the goal is that wherever you are, you take that next step and to get that next step, I feel like you've gotta identify with the guest.

I listen to Dusty Baker's story, um, with the bison, and I love his story, but it doesn't speak to me.

Greatly because it's bison and I'm not gonna do bison.

So there's some things now there's some great things you can take from it and I think with every episode there's things you can take from it.

But to really if, if you're in that analysis paralysis and you need to take that next step, sometimes you've gotta hear just a certain thing that that causes you to say, wait, they did it.

I can do it.

So that's what I'm thinking.

Not to pick on Dusty, because they're doing great things at Cross Timbers.

He was on my, he popped in my head first, but you know.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Yeah, his stuff with a bison is interesting.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah, it is.

Yeah.

And his YouTube channel and stuff, but, so that's where I'm working from.

I don't know if it's right, but I hope it's beneficial.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I think it's working out for you.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Well, Ernie, really appreciate, like I said a while ago, I appreciate you jumping on this weekend.

So we have an episode this Wednesday.

Um, enjoyed hearing about your story.

I'm glad when I posted that you said, Hey, I'd be interested.

So thank you.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: I'm glad you had the time.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: I squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: out your, uh, the form for, uh, website, but one of the ones that didn't make it through.

'cause you're fixing it.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: yeah, I know.

It's, it's kind of the, the.

I, I've changed the whole website up and it's breaking a lot of stuff.

I'm going in there trying to fix, I'm trying to save money on the back end and going and getting it all under one house, which is, it's caused some problems, uh, like grazing grass resources we've got set up.

Um, but the grazing grass resources.com is not routing right.

And I'm trying to figure out why it's not taking it Right.

You know, you, you move stuff, your brake stuff.

I.

I noticed searching for some, um, episodes, see who was on 'em.

Just Remi, refresh my memory.

Some of the links on Google results are broken, so I'm like, I need to go in and put some redirects to make sure those work, because I don't want someone searching for something, going to the website and say, oh, it's not here, and then just quitting, because that's what I would do if I was searching.

Yeah, squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: you gotta make it as easy as, easy on people as possible to cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: right, right.

Well, I, I really appreciate you coming on and sharing today.

squadcaster-jie3_3_06-22-2025_172911: Hey, thanks for.

cal_8_06-22-2025_162915: Yeah.

Last week we got the episode published and then I remembered I didn't put my reflection piece at the end of last week's.

It's a new segment.

We're trying.

Let me know if you like it or not.

Um, I know I get tired of listening to myself talk.

Actually, my wife would say, I never get tired of listening to myself talk.

But at a certain time, there's enough talking from me.

On today's episode, Ernie came on to talk about his journey.

It's a, it's a fairly short journey.

Been doing it a couple years on their own farm, but I love how he, and this is what really jumped out at me, how he got started in, in his backyard when he didn't have any land.

Now granted, he was just growing for his own family's consumption.

But it's also a proof of concept.

Hey, I can do this.

This is a product that I can sell.

People are interested in it.

It didn't matter where he was, he got started 10 chickens.

I think for me, that's the big takeaway.

Get started where you are.

If that's a lot in town, maybe you can grow 10 chickens.

Maybe you can do a few rabbits.

Um, probably not a cow in town, but you know, wherever you are, there's ways to get started and that's my big takeaway for today.

And once more.

I really appreciate Ernie jumping on kind of last minute, so we get this episode out.

Thank you, Ernie.

Cal: Thank you for listening to this episode of the grazing grass podcast, where we bring you stories and insights into grass-based livestock production.

If you're new here, we've got something just for you.

Our new listener resource guide.

Is packed with everything you need to get started on your listening journey with a grazing grass podcast.

It gives you more information about the podcast about myself.

And next steps.

You can grab your free copy at grazinggrass.com slash guide.

Don't miss out.

And Hey, do you have a grazing story to share?

We're always looking for passionate producers to feature on the show, whether you're just starting out or have years of experience your story matters.

Head over to grazing grass.

Dot com slash guest.

To learn more and apply to be a guest.

We'd love to share your journey with our growing community of grazers.

Until next time.

Keep on grazing grass.