Worrying.

Today's episode candad spoilers for episode two of it.

Welcome to Darry on HBO be worn.

Hello it is Jason kispt the own and on Rosey Night, and welcome back to x Ravage of the podcast, where we dive deep into your favorite shows, movies, comics of pop culture covered by our podcast.

We'll bring you three episodes week plus news.

In today's episode, and the Andy and Farbara Maschetti returned to Derry with New Kids thirty is prior to the events of it.

Once again, we are in Welcome to Dairy episode two, and it's still good.

Jason and I are going to recap the episode and then of course we will bring in the scream Queen's Common and Joel to join.

And discuss Welcome to Darry.

Okay, Welcome to Darry Episode two.

We open sometime after the events of the movie Theater.

Lily wakes up after dreaming about it in her in her bedroom and the events are you know, we don't know how long it's been it's but it's some amount of time, but the events are just as real to her as when they happened.

We go to outside Ronnie's house where the cops are posted up.

They of course suspect Hank, Ronnie's dad, the projectionist, of committing some kind of crazy crime despite the fact that there are no bodies.

There's just like a lot of blood, no no sign of Phil Teddy or Phil's sister, and I guess they don't have the arm.

Yeah, I think it's basically looking bad for all these So that was definitely the arm, just like an illusion was like maybe a penny Wise illusion or maybe the arm got sucked back into the screen or something, because penny Wise are really messing.

With these kids.

So inside the apartment, Hank understand he knows exactly what's going on.

They're trying to pin it on him.

They're waiting for him to mess up, but of course, like he has an alibi and Lily said that he wasn't there, so it's tense, but he's he's basically playing the calm one because Mama, Ronnie's grandmother, his mother is flipping out, as is Ronnie.

They're very worried about this, but he's like, yeah, no, no, don't I'm gonna be fine.

Everything's don't worry about it.

And Mama is like, why did you let those and honestly a good point, like why did you let the kids into the theater to try and play detective?

Like what exactly was that going to do?

Anyway?

And Hank is like, listen to his daughter and to his mom, it's gonna be fine, don't worry about it.

Major Hanlin welcomes his son and Will and his wife Charlotte to town.

He alludes to the incident the other night where masked men broke into his barracks and beat him with a pipe and threatened him with a Russian pistol, but he doesn't get into the details.

He doesn't want to worry them.

Meanwhile, they are getting looks from the neighbors, and that's you know, that's what it is.

It's there.

They're giving him weird looks because the black family is in town.

Meanwhile, Will is a big nerd loves the telescope that dad got him that's in his room.

And this was, you know, Charlotte's advice.

Apparently Major Hanlan you know, doesn't understand why his kid doesn't want to play baseball and be like a sportsy guy.

But Charlotte like is like, that's your son, that's what he likes.

You like at school, we really meet the mean girls now Pattie and the gang of mean girls.

Marge is like kind of on the periphery of this group and and it's so eager to be accepted by them.

But it's definitely like a head spinning.

You can tell, like she's a she's climbed higher in the social hierarchy than she ever expected, so she's still like wide eyed.

It's this whole thing of like hanging out with the mean girls.

The girls are discussing like who they have crushes on, and one of them says, admits in a moment of vulnerability that she likes this boy, Scott, who was formerly known as Scott the Snot, and so the girls are making fun of her, and then Marge like there's an impression of Scott the Snot, but goes a little too far with it, you know.

It's like the girl the Patty, the leader major domo of the mean girls, is like, okay, okay, Marge, we like you, but like, don't get don't forget, like you're still a rook you're on your probationary period of yeah, you're a rookie mean girl, so don't you know, like let's dial it back, And when Ronnie arrives at school, all the mean girls are immediately talking that shit like, oh Hank, Hank the buget, Oh my gotcha.

Yeah, hang gadget.

Come on, guys, how many times you've gone through that projectionist movie there and enjoyed a film?

Don't don't turn on him?

Now.

Marge checks in with Lily and they haven't talked since the movie theater, and Lily's like, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.

Fine.

What do you expect her to say?

Like a week she gonna say like, yeah, no.

Marge is like, you're ignoring me, But listen, I want you to know that, like, I'm kind of in with the mean girls now, and the mean girls are talking shit a little bit about you, which is a good indicator that the school at large is probably talking about you.

So come hang out with us like and rehab your giddings, don't.

Hang out with Ronnie, which I mean, March, what the fuck is like?

Yeah, Lily is like fuck off.

Will comes in late to class, first day at the new school, and everyone stares her down and you get the typical kid hijinks with the poll of chair move and all that but and the teacher is very very mean, maybe especially mean to Will, but she's mean everybody, but it seems like she got a little bit of an edge for Will.

And then but there is a moment of kind of like a break in the clouds where one of Will's new classmates is like, oh, nice pencil like he's apparently Will's got like at the top of the line.

Like mechanical pencils, showing of.

These tai canderoga pieces of fucking shit like this, ah boy, like pressed graphite, like the real shit.

Hanlan goes to Colonel Fuller's office and Fuller gives himn update on this whole case.

Since listen, so we what we have here, major Handlin is a case of racist airman doing a bunch of racist ship masters.

You know who you met last episode.

Admits that he was like the mastermind of all this.

But he's it was racist.

That's so we don't he's not giving up the identities of the other airmen involved.

But Wolf, we'll figure that out.

We'll get it.

But it does feel like a little bit of a sweeping in under the rug type situation, which Handlin kind of is sensing.

And as he's leaving.

He's like, hey, I noticed that the gun that Masters apparently was pointing at me it was a Macrof Soviet pistol.

And Fuller is like, yes, it was a Macroff.

We don't We will understand the importance of this.

Later, Charlotte is walking around downtown.

We get our first kind of feel of like what's going on in the town, And apparently the big hubbub in town right now is a very very active protest against the Paul Bunyan statue.

Not a statue, it's an eyesore.

It's ugly, disgusting property values.

Ew, some people don't like it.

We'll wait till Babe the Blue Ox gets in there.

Nah.

Charlotte goes to the Butcher Shoe or some of me and Stanley.

Butcher's nice guy.

Seems like a very very nice guy, Like he's happy for any customer.

He doesn't care who it is, Like, you come into the shop, a new person in town, just be buying it.

Go buy it from my competitors.

Nice guy.

She sees the bullying incident, which we saw a little bit of episode one, kids chasing another kid down the street, kicking the shit out of him on the street, is the adults in town literally do nothing past it, don't even care.

She runs out there, she tries to stop it, and it's the exact same scene he's on episode one, where they're very ominous to her and then they run off, and then everybody looks at her like why are you getting involved?

Over dinner, she talks about it, She's like, this sounds there's something a little weird, and the major is like, and then she she looks at her son and looks at Will and it's like, hey, are you getting bullied?

Are you experiencing bullying?

And Will in a very much whatever, what in my experience kids did every kid?

Just don't get involved.

Don't worry about him.

I'll handle it, because at the high school age, even if you are getting bullied, no, mom, there's no worse thing than the parents get involved.

Now, it's never going to go away.

So Will is like, I'll handle it, and the Major's like, yeah, yeah, he'll handle I agree with him.

And apparently something happened in Shreveport then involved Charlotte getting involved in whatever, and the major is like, let's not have a repeater sport.

Don't rock the boat basically, and he doesn't want to talk about the stuff on the base either at the Grogan family's mama still complaining about the cops creeping around.

Ronnie's hearing all of this.

She can't sleep.

She's worried about her dad.

She's you know, worried about what's her family being torn apart and what happened to her her classmates.

And she looks at a picture of her mom who passed away, and then the bed starts to throb like a heartbeat, and then all of a sudden, she's trapped in the womb, with the top sheets being like the you know, like the.

Yeah, the kind of the womb.

She's trapped there.

The bed sheets become like.

The bag of amniotic fluid.

She is trapped, and it's this is legit such a great scare, and there's definitely some very interesting stuff going on with this show and childbirth and being a child and yeah, it's this is a really gross one.

Me and Joel were pretty shocked when we watched this one.

It's shocking and very well like, really good stuff.

And so Ronnie eventually crawls out of the birth canal and looks back at her mom, who you get the feeling from what this kind of vision of her dead mother is saying that apparently she died giving birth to Rannie, and you know, she begins accusing Lily of killing her and killing her classmates and of endangering light.

She basically says, you're gonna kill your father, you know, with the things that you're you're involved in, and she turns into a demon and starts strangling Ronnie with in umbilical cord.

Yeah, tries to pull her back into the birth canal.

This is like dark birth and you see the glowing eyes of Pennywise.

That's what I was gonna say, ye first view Honeywise in the birth canal.

Dad comes in disgusting because Ronnie's screaming his sister dream.

At a bar, the black airmen are hanging out, uh, including Dick halerin of the Shining Thing, the Shining and they're all talking about the major handling incident and how it's you know, this racist plot and how you know they were apparently some of these couple of these black air men were questioned as if they would be part of it, and they're like, why would we be part of it?

You know?

And Dick is like, I was an interviewed and and in fact, I can't talk about what I do all day, and and the airmen are like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's clear that there that Dick.

There's something up with Dick.

Wen't guess from the shining that he may be that due to his extra sensory perceptions.

Jason, this I think ties into your hotest take about the show.

So I'm gonna bring this back up.

We're gonna get into it.

The chief of police comes in and two local political big wigs come over and they fucking press him as to why Hank the hatchet, the innocent man, Hank Grogan has not yet been arrested.

They want him in jail.

They don't care about the evidence, they couldn't care about the testimony.

Just figure out a way to do it.

Dick sees all this happening, It's like, let's get out of here.

They arrive back at base, they're super drunk, and the MP is like, you guys aren't supposed to be out the basis on lockdown.

We're doing super fucking top secret shit here.

You're not supposed to leave.

And Dick is like, well, I'm Jick Hallerin and I'm involved in some fucking top secret spy shit, So that means you whatever the fuck I want.

And the MP is like, yeah, whatever, buddy, and then makes a phone call and it's like, oh, okay, that's true.

Yes, that's true.

Elsewhere in the woods, the military is digging for stuff.

It's a real Indiana Jones type archaeological dig going on out in the woods out there, which is being in turn spied upon by what appears to be a contingent of Young Native America.

Yes, which I'm very excited about because Stephen King historically has done a lot of damage with the Native American burial ground trope.

So I really like the idea that there's going to be like an active Native American part of this story, and that we're going to get to see hopefully more about the tribe and the way they're impacted by this era of America, and also the arrival of Pennywise.

So Colonel Fuller is running the dig and he's given Dick shit because apparently they're not finding anything, and this is the four site that they've been looking at, and Dick is hungover and basically making Fuller look like an ass to get sick and throws up, which you get the feeling that it's not that he's hungover, it's ah this sickness power, how he senses that they're close to whatever they're fucking looking for.

We go to the school cafeteria.

Marge tries to get Lily to sit with her at the Mean Girls, but of course Lily's not going to do that.

Ronnie sits with her and is like, we got to talk about it.

It came back.

Mean Girls are watching this whole thing.

Ronnie and Lily have this big argument in which Ronnie basically is like, hey, here's what happened.

What did you tell the cops?

And she's like, well, I told him that your dad wasn't there.

I said one hundred percent he was not there.

But did you tell him like a demon baby killed everybody who was like no, I couldn't tell them that.

Then they think that was insane and.

Lily had it seems like Lily's already been in some kind of mental institute that we've learned from the Fast One, so she's that to her is the ultimate fierre is to have to go back.

Yes.

So Ronnie is like, and you this is a really well the conflict between these two characters is really great because both sides of it, and as you learn more about what Lily's been through, you really can see Lily's perspective and I can totally see Ronnie's perspective too, Like Ronnie is not is absolutely well within her rights to be like, you got to do more to clear my dad.

Yes, she's like, hey, this is the truth.

But at the same time, it's like, is that gonna clear your dad or is it gonna make it seem like you guys are making something up to clin exactly.

So I think you really do see that the the pickle that they are in.

Will, who is still the new kid is you know, doesn't have any friends d He's eating lunch in the hallway.

He and pencil Kid are a kid who's named Rich, kind of are striking up a little bit of friendship.

We learned that pencil kid Rich has a crush on Marge.

And then someone throws a stink pomb into the hall and Will runs away and gets blamed for it.

Charlotte goes to the store where the major bought the telescope, and the proprietor is Native and we're starting to edge now into the world of the Native characters in the show, although this is clearly just like an introduction.

It's yeah, Willian and Will and Ronnie are in detention.

Ronnie's crying, and we learned that Will is not just a nerd but a big, big, big science guy.

Clearly, the science is going to be a big part of whatever role he's going to play in the taking down of or the delaying of the immersience of Pennywise, whatever the case may be.

But of course Ronnie's upset.

She can't really focus on how smart you know, Will is.

And then she sees Lily getting escorted away from school by the cops, and she's getting very nervous.

Now at the police station, lots of missing kid posters, And here is where I pause to say, cops, what are you doing?

Come on, like you got guys, you got her?

Like this is looking really bad?

How many times like and I'm sure, like Hank the Hatchet is not the first time that they've arrested somebody who they thought was or blamed for being the person.

If the if the disappearances are not stopping guys the right guy, let's figure it out.

It's fucking dairy Maine.

There's nothing going on in this town except for this, get your fucking fucking dicks out of your hands, and why you do some fucking workout here.

Yea anyway doing racist hazing and like find these missing kids.

Figure it out.

So at the police station, Chief Bowers really puts puts the irons to Lily and is like, listen, it'd be a shame if you had to go back to Juniper Hill, the probably terrible state facility which you were housed after something happened with her dad that we get alluded to here, unless, of course, you tell me that actually you're not sure if Hank was there.

That's all you have to do.

You don't have to say that he killed him, kill the kids.

You just have to say, you know, I'm not actually sure where Hank was.

Evil evil behavior.

Long story, shirt cops rest Hank.

Ronnie goes to Lily's house and yells at her, and honestly, you get it.

This is again it's like, guys, Lily deserve it, yes and no, yes.

Terrible what she did.

But she's also a kid.

Choice and is telling her say this and we will not put you in prison.

Which choice did she have?

But you can see both sides.

But also Ronnie is right to be angry.

Let me listen, taking yourself away from the emotion of it, right, Lily got forced to do this, But you're putting yourself in Ronnie's shoes.

You'd never let it go.

If you were Ronnie, you'd never let it anyway.

Hand goes to see Masters in the brig and basically says, hey, that Macaroff.

Like when I was a prisoner of the North Koreans during the Korean War, I became very versed in the Macaroff PM, which is a very fiddly pistol, hard to load, hard to hard to rack, the slide everything.

It's like a really hard one to use.

And you like you racked it like a like an experienced North Korean soldier.

It was incredible, and so like, what's going on.

My Handler's like, here's my theory.

You weren't the guy.

You're this is a story to cover something up, and you weren't actually the guy that was in there, the mass guy with the gun.

And then he goads Masters basically into picking up uh his own Handlan's own personal macroff that he brought to the brig and loading it and trying to kill him.

But he can't like get.

The slide rack load it like it proves.

It in handling.

Mind, you're you this is bully.

I'm not the guy.

He goes to see the General and he's like, listen, I want to file a report.

Innocent man on the brig.

This is all bullshit.

I just want you to know, like, I'm not like.

He was like he was like he didn't do it.

He's like, just get on that breakman, it's just a drive by.

I'm just I'm not even coming to sit down.

I'm sure to tell you that's an innocent man.

The General is like, who wha, wha, who have a seat.

This was all a test to make sure that you Apparently he suffered a significant brain injury that and this is important, the brain injury to Major Handlin's amigla when his plane crashed in North Korea, and then he was apparently tortured by the North Koreans.

Whatever it was, whether it was the crash or the torture, resulted in damage to Hanlan's amigdala, which means he's not a He can't biologically feel fear love that.

You know where.

Jay where this is going folks anyway?

So he says, Listen, I just wanted to make sure that your brain injury didn't have any other negative effects like snagging vans, you know, taking away your natural fear response.

And so now that you've passed my test, I'm going to let you know what we're really doing here on this base.

Lily goes to the grocery store and it turns into a fucking absolute nightmare.

It's trapped in a maze, she's hearing whispers, and then her dad appears, as it's very clear that some sort of sexual assault took place, or some sort of untoward groping from her father took because for me, he's he's depicted as an octopus with all these disgusting arms and he's like like grabbing her with the tentacles and pulling her in and give a kiss to daddy, and it's set.

And from what we learned before, had dad was killed in some kind of like nightmarish industrial accident, so that it's probably some kind of like duality there between her around being him happy to die.

But yeah, yeah, this is that another really scary, fantastic sequence.

I think this show is much scarier than people are giving it credit for it is really these these big sequences are so good.

It was really gross and really looked fucking great.

Clearly some sort of mixture of CG and practical because.

It looks and also as well, I will say, like, something I loved about this is the really scary fear of being a kid.

And again Jason leans into what you were reading into her relationship with her dad of like not being believed, because then the moment that she's found, it's just like broken glasses and jar and she looks like she's crazy again.

So it's really playing into so many levels.

I love your read of it that it's more complex than originally we thought.

Right, it's not just that her dad died in a horrific industrial latinans that maybe Lily on some level before that would have wished that something.

Like well, and she said that she asked him to go back to the factory that night, and it like he had she hadn't asked him that, then you know he wouldn't have died.

So I definitely think we're going to get something.

Yeah, really interesting that and then Jay said, let's cueue out the craziest revealed that you, by the way, guest Lost Week, which I never would have guessed tell him about it.

It's fantastic.

So the General Hanlan General, the General takes Handlan to like the secret part of the base and they see like all the like doctor Strangel of War room stuff with the big board and the maps and stuff.

And the General is like, here's what's going on.

The Cubans and the Soviets are conspiring to put missiles in Cuba.

They can strike any part of the US in minutes.

And we couldn't do it thing about it.

But what can we do about it?

We have we're working on a defense strategy right now.

We are looking for a weapon that instills debilitating fear upon its victims.

Yes, oh, they are trying to weaponize pity one guys.

Oh my dad, Oh my god.

Crazy.

I love that.

I guess this is the kind of insane swing that we need.

Yes, let's be real.

This is absolutely what the American government would do wise was real.

So you know what, I love to.

Say, the government, And you know, we should shoot on the American government when they do bad things.

Any government would.

Love to have an evil, scary, debility power.

And I kind of love how we're learning that.

Derry Maine is basically now becoming like the supernatural hub of America.

Like they're bringing.

Their psychics, they're bringing their men without fear, they're bringing you know.

Sadly, though that was very exciting for us, Lily ends up back in Juniper Hill, not exciting for her, feeling very bad about that.

And then yeah, Dick is right.

They pull something out of the ground and it appears to be like an old Ford, like of nineteen twenties, late to mid twenties Ford four door that's all shot up.

I think it's like a kangster car something weird.

Yeah, my skeleton's in the car.

And Dick Karen was like, I'm right.

He's like, some creepy ass shit is going on here.

Is that meant to be the same car that the kid was pulled into in the first episode at the beginning with the family?

I think so, I think that that's yeah, depending on what timing, I don't know, but yeah, I mean I just think another great, really scary episode.

This has been a little Halloween treat, and uh, yeah, I'm really excited to come back off to the break.

And talk more to the screen queens about it.

Yeah, and we're back.

Hey, Okay, let's welcome in the screen queens.

A queens Joel and Carmen.

Yay, it's good.

Let's talk about Uh, let's talk about the show.

Now we are into episode two and the kind of big philosophical conceit of the show has been dropped on us and your thoughts.

Joel, let's start with you.

Oh my god, guys, I really love this show.

I didn't know what to expect up top.

Uh.

We talked a little bit last week about some of the criticisms of the show.

One of them that.

I've seen Freely's like, it's not scary.

The burst scene.

Are you out of your mind?

Are not only being birthed is scary?

Be inside is scary?

The actual birth from outside terrify.

But then she tries to lure her back in by hurt.

And Billy Lord.

I was like, this is the most gnarly, in your face show.

I had seen that a lot.

I don't know what HBO's obsession with crazy burths is, but I would like to talk to the executive producer who's constantly like, what if it was a birth scene?

What if?

I do wonder if as well?

I was reading some Reddit threads about the show and stuff.

I think the birth stuff made a lot of viewers specifically on Reddit.

You know, mayle viewers, but I'm sure there were many viewers.

I think that the opening sequence of the first episode, with the woman giving birth and seeing the blood, that seems to have really made a lot of people uncomfortable and go.

Oh, this isn't scary.

Pregnancy happens every day, And I'm like, you guys are crazy.

Pregnancy scary?

I love that's yeah, I love that that's a recurring theme here.

Common What are your.

Thoughts post episode two?

Yeah?

I for me, this episode was amazing.

Obviously, the pilot episode did such a great job really hooking us.

In this episode, I loved how they expanded the world, which is really what the show is all about.

We get to see more of the town and some of the dynamics of racism going on in the town, as well as what these kids are going through.

The stakes feel very real, you know.

I ask somebody who I don't know if I mentioned this last time, I have not read the Stephen King books on this, but this feels very like anyone could die at any moment.

Well, I was going to talk about that, it does seem like they killed off a lot of cute kids in the first episode because they don't come.

Back, and they're fat actors too, so it's like, wow, they've got great They've got even more great actors lined up for us.

So I'm I was.

Gonna say, they just keep pulling them out, Like the kid is plays Rich great new edition.

I believe he had a crush on mad Yes, so yeah this.

I thought this episode did a great job expanding the world, and of course that of course that childbirth horror sequence.

Once again, I'm just like, Wow, they're really going for it with the horror sequences here.

I don't understand the criticisms of the show.

To me, it's doing a fantastic job of being terrifying.

It's really giving I said this last time, but once again it's really giving me a lot of like Nightmare on Elm Street kind of like.

Yeah, Freddy Kruze, very Dream Warriors coded Verry.

That what are the what are the criticisms?

I haven't read a lot of the pants, but okay, like I get the I mean, I get the disappointment in that penny Wise is not like in every episode, okay, which he shouldn't be.

She shouldn't be, we.

Shouldn't be but that.

But I get it if you're like a big well clown, like a scary, scary clown person, and then you turn it on and you don't see penny Wise, like, I kind of get it.

Yeah, I will say that I'm on, I'm on the old you know, very controversial, but you know, basically the monolith of how we look at this stuff now with rotten tomatoes.

And I will say that, honestly.

It has seventy eight percent from okay critics.

I think what happened is it looks like it got almost twenty.

Rotten reviews, and I think some of those were from the top critics, so they were kind of the first things coming out.

I will also say, though, eighty percent average Popcorn Meter, which is your average audience.

So I think these were more critical pans from people who I guess had a lot of expectations of what it would be.

And also, like I said, probably people who were not loving the.

Pregnancy and birth sequences, the fact that it deals with Ray they loved a million Perez.

So they don't know exactly.

So I'll give you an example here we are.

This is Peter Travers he is a top critic.

He was at the Rolling Stone now, I guess also the travers take, aren't we all getting fired from digital media?

Me too, guys, I get it.

So it's a treat to see Bill Scarsgard briefly back as Pennywise the Psycho clown.

But the trick is after a grabby start, series bogs down in character deficiencies, pokey pacing, uneven acting, and FX that rank the stressingly low on the scare meter.

Don't agree.

Where is he feeling?

I wonder if maybe?

Yeah, I'm interested to see that could be?

That could be?

I would also say, this is from the guy at Slate.

Welcome to Derry isn't so much a further adaptation as the novel as a half baked attempt at a prequel, an elaborate but vapid work of King fan fiction dumped into a landscape already boast.

There's no shortage, sure, But some of the other more positive ones, like Rob Owen at the Pittsburgh Tribune review, he is more in our vibe.

Nineteen sixties production design.

Is gorgeous use of period music, not like the supernatural stories.

But actually the reality of the town.

Is what is drawing people in like it, and I think that's definitely where we stand.

So I think what really happened is a few big people kind of came out early and were like it's not good, and that started the conversation.

But overall, like Ollie Richard's Empire magazine, I love Empire Magazine, he was like a strong return to an imperfect horror world.

Turns out clowns are still very upsetting on this small stream.

I think that's really bad.

Yeah, Like it's fine.

It's like it's not gonna be for everyone, but I think for us it's really hitting on some big kind of points of what we like from horror.

It certainly might be the case that it gets worse from here on out, because it seems like a lot of other reviews, we haven't seen the whole thing, so maybe that's the case, but but I do yeah, I'll be interested to see how like, if it continues, because I think it's great, and I do wonder if some of the disappointment is not the you know, the the fact that like this is.

I mean, the heroes are black.

That's why I was.

The people who are right are black.

I also say for me, I I do think, Jason, that you're onto something because I found that the first two movies by the Maches, they very much trafficked in like, hey, it's the it's the eighties.

So everyone's calling each other a racial slur, everyone's calling each other a queer slur, everyone's calling each other Like so maybe if you were in maybe you like that kind of storytelling.

I feel like this is a course correct or an expansion to kind of understand that that's not all the world was.

And maybe people don't enjoy that, but I love the kind of social realism, supernatural horror that this is doing.

Joelle and Carmen after episode two, what are some of your fun predictions?

Because Jason did predict that they were going to weaponize Pennywise, which.

Is hilarious and I love how crazy me too, Like take a big sway, Joelle, what do you want to see as the show?

A ball?

So something else?

Really?

Marge is a character I'm struggling with, Okay, I think because insecurity makes me deeply uncomfortable, and desperation makes me deeply uncomfortable, and Marge has both in spades.

She's just so desperate to be seen and I was very intrigued by a moment where Rich sees her in the hall and we get that walk on song slow motion moment, which was really funny to me.

If you guys look at Marge's eyes, penny Wise pops up, hear me out.

Her glasses have the orange globe glow of Penny Wise.

And who does penny Wise love to go after?

Is it the insecure and the desperate?

It is?

It's the non believers, it sure is.

March doesn't believe.

She was like, there's no way there's pound On there.

She was totally She's like, you guys stupid.

Exactly, and you know, poor poor Rich.

Have you ever seen a kid who's gonna get stuck in the sewers?

More?

No is Rich is gonna die?

He's the Definitely.

So I think Marge is going to be the next prey for penny Wise.

I think that he's going to I agree.

I like that it's going to be devastating.

I kind of went another way with Marge in that I think she's going to be like the Renfro, you know, because she's she is so desperate to please anybody.

Who's so penny Wise could for her soul.

And yes, she's I think she's really that she's going to be like the little Pennywise is a little on the street assistant.

Well, her ghosts are going to be more effective the way she like makes fun of people and how it even makes the mean girls like un comfortable because it's so in there.

I think it's he's going to power her up.

Yeah, because also what she's a white woman, so she could use that meanness very quick to stoke anti Ronnie Ferva, anti Hank Ferv like.

I would be interested to see if he utilizes her in that way and essentially kind of makes her like a racial kind of like lightning Rod for the town.

Because she definitely isn't afraid of being cruel.

Yeah, and that is definitely what Pennywise leans into.

Also, Joel, could you you know, we talked about the pans and kind of the general perception that maybe this isn't as popular as people are expecting, But Joelle, talk about those numbers, because we just got our first numbers and they're pretty crazy.

Yeah, you guys, this show in its first three days is only behind the Last of Us and House of the Dragon for premiere number.

Sure, the HBO Max app so they debuted at five point seven million across platform.

Most of those were from app viewers, which is really exciting.

So like House of the Dragon did ten million day one viewers, and then The Last of Us did four points seven on its first day and then got well past five points in the following three days.

You know, HBO decided to release episode too early, I think probably off of the support of those numbers and the fact that it's Halloween and they were like, let's be the last horror episode.

I'm shocked.

I wasn't expecting top three from this show, but it may be really excited that folks are like leaning into it.

I think the season maybe has something to do with it, and it'll be interesting to see in the same way that we saw the Last of Us Season two numbers you know, start off really high, dropped only gets terrible, but definitely lower than what HBO wanted.

So if they can sustain here, I think that would be a really good get for them, especially because they want to turn this into an entire expanded universe.

Maybe even grow a little bit.

Okay, I also did note you guys did a great job kind of talking about like just since twenty twenty Stephen King has adaptations have generated over six hundred and fifty million dollars.

Those years are really cashing in coca.

Was worthy, dude, he said, I remember when when I was a kid, right, I read on writing like Stephen King's book and he was one of the best.

It's one of the best.

But he was like, what you need to do is just write two hours a day.

And I was like, okay, that sounds good.

And then as a girl, I was like, oh, well, it's easy to write two hours a day every day if you're high on cocaine.

That's like a very efficient, very efficient.

I will say I do want to shout out as we are fans of the X Men, and I will say MGM plus ever heard of them?

Probably not.

That's a service that maybe you didn't know existed.

It's obviously now owned by Amazon, who owned MGM because monopoly.

But they did a show recently called The Institute that is basically like Stephen King's X Men.

He wrote the book more recently and the adaptation is pretty recent.

But I actually found that to be a very enjoyable show, way more grounded, but much more in that kind of like X Men.

Space so is it a like a fire Starter.

It's basically it's basically and the institute from the fire Starter, but this is more focused on like what would that look like if you were a kid who went there.

So I found it really really good and it's all out and it got you can binge it and it's.

A different vibe to Derry, but I found it to be.

I was like, oh, this is actually pretty good, like if this had been on a different network, and the cast is crazy.

The cast is really really good.

So yeah, there's a lot of good, good Stephen King stuff right now.

I also love Joelle.

You pulled out something that I think is really interesting about this series.

Could you talk a little bit about how the scares that the kids are getting in this show are actually really about like horrific stories they've been told, which I think.

Is a really real thing when you are a kid.

Yeah, something I've been tracking is like just what is scaring people?

Like where are the scares coming from?

And we've seen a lot most of the violence we've seen in a did in the show is against children, right Like we even there's a when the guys are in the bar chatting, there's somebody comes out playing a bagpipe.

You hear him get like hit, but it's completely off camera.

And I was really intrigued by, like, what are they choosing to show us and what are they choosing not to show us?

And then I was thinking about the kids, and like the scares are if we think about the lamp made of human skin, if we think about the burst scene, if we think about the dad and.

The pickle jar, the kids aren't there to observe.

Any of those things.

That she sent her dad back into the factory, so she was on site, but she didn't observe the death.

Obviously, he didn't observe his ancestors being tortured at a concentration camp, you know.

And I was really fat.

And then two, when Ronnie is imagining her mom, like she humanizes her in such an interesting way.

All I wanted to do is hold you.

And I thought about, like Pennywise is always about fear, but what I think this show has done is really narrowed in on fears that resonate and have more impacts.

So like the fear that you're responsible for your mother's death is so much more impactful than like, say, the fear of a Paul Bunyan statue, which is, you know, very valid, kids have irrational fears, and I think it's great to play up on those.

But like for an extended television show, really leaning into the things that haunt you, I just think the show's really nailed it here and I hope we continue to continue to see more of that going forward.

Yeah, this is where I want to lay out.

I mean, I lay this out before we turn on the mics.

But you know, as I have spoken about it, you know, I'm not scared by horror movies.

The vast majority of her stories and stuff don't scare me at all.

And here's the reason why.

It's in particular, talking about Penny Wise and Welcome to Derry and even it back in the day, it's to me, it's a positive story.

It's actually, like you could look, it's okay, it's a positive story first of all.

Beside but first of all, ghost stories, supernatural stories, the Exorcist, you know, demons, it's proof that life exists beyond them.

Right, So like headline you continue to live on, isn't that a good that's good news in the context of the fictional reality of this story.

Secondarily, with Penny Wise and Penny wise is kind of that's right.

Well, and listen, I would quibble with his methods conditions.

Yeah, the whole thing, but isn't condone, Jason said, I do not condone what he's doing.

It's kind of like therapy in a way because it's saying, Hey, here's what you're worried about, here's what you're scared.

You need to deal with this fear of whatever it is.

And is that something that we should all take into our.

Okay, okay, when.

The cloud comes, gut her, go meet him, talk to him directly.

Face your fears.

Head.

I'm just gonna be like, listen, bitch, I'm not scared of you.

That's scary.

When do you start to feel out?

That's what it was like.

I'm not I'm sleeping.

I've read the books.

Anybody I read the books.

I've seen the movies.

I know I'm not scared of you, bitch.

Go somewhere else.

Jason read stories jumped out.

By the way.

Guys, Guys, I gotta tell you, Jason is currently dressed up.

As a card.

So this is even back, this is eating I'm scared of the super.

Guy.

Okay, okay, Jason, you gotta lay out your biggest theory about why this is actually a happy story, though, which is if Pennywise exists, that proves the existence Jason.

Yeah, I mean, and that goes for any story like this.

It's not even just it the universe and penny Wise in particular, but if penny Wise is part of the natural world, which and I'm preserving my judgment for when they start to bring in the native characters.

But like I think clearly this is penny Wise is going to be some manifestation of like nature, right, but the bad part, the target feeds on your fears, et cetera.

Then there's got to be some sort of balancing because like nature is an ecology, it's a highly complex system of like checks and balances in nature, and so they're therefore must be some equally powerful good version of something out there, right, And isn't it?

And I think that's a positive story.

Let's not let the actions of one superdi supernatural individual living in the sewers, you know, the image of the wider supernatural community.

Pennywise, not big penny Wise pocket money being paid to revamp.

I'm not probe, I'm not pro Pennywise.

All I'm saying is don't give if you just don't, just don't give him what he wants.

Don't don't give him.

What he wants.

I like this, Freddy Krueger Lore.

Just tell him you're not real, and he will disappear.

Okay, let's see how that works.

Okay, we will get before we wrap, I'd like to hear from everyone, who do you think survives?

If Pennywise always leave someone behind to survive to continue on the story and.

The Lord, I think it's Will, Yeah, it would be Will, right, it's gonna be well.

I think anyone else survived.

He's the historian.

Yeah, yeah, because if you read the book.

I think our characters, we don't know their futures.

You know, there's there's a lot of characters in here from the Stephen King universe.

They're going to show up later, Okay, But outside of that, I'm first.

I'm hoping that Ronnie survives.

That's my final guy.

I believe her I Will could survive together.

I think so, Jason, who's going to survive?

Fuck?

Do you say Pennywise?

Penny Wise has a long, long career.

He's gonna get a long life ahead of them.

He's gonna get for at least a few more decades in that particular part of the Northeastern Empire.

I uh, let's see who will survive.

I do hope that not just Ronnie, but I hope Lily makes it too.

She's had such a tough I agree, I do hope he survives.

That would be nice.

But I have a feeling that I think that the major, the Major, has to has to die somehow, right, I think that what do we?

I think the major is going to be like that.

The idea is the general wants the Major to be like the the dog handler holding.

The face manywise.

Yeah, and I think that eventually the Major is going to have to sacrifice himself.

Well I would, yeah, I was gonna say.

I mean, like, also the notion that yet got rid of his you know, fear, sure, but that didn't get rid of his care for his wife and his kid.

Who if Pennywise threatens, is still going to scare him, you know what I mean?

Like, I think there's going to be a lot more uh leeway there than they think.

I would love for him to survive, but I could see him being the hero definitely.

And also, guys, the interesting thing about the show is no matter who survives.

We are not going to follow them because the next sequel is set twenty six years ahead of this or something, right, So I think that's really interesting.

Okay, guys, penny Wise meter, what are your odds?

What are the percentage that we will see penny Wise is full face next episode episode three?

What do you think of eight?

No, I think we gotta cook it a little bit longer.

I would like somewhere between nine and I think O.

Yeah, so nine full episodes.

I think we see hands or maybe more eyes like wise.

Yeah, once I realized they weren't going to give us that in the first episode.

Yeah, I think we're gonna probably be episode five before we see him as mine.

Okay, I like that.

I like that.

I mean I think as well.

Guys, anyone who complained that maybe you were seeing too much of the Xenomorph and Ali enough and it wasn't really getting up too much.

Now you get the teas.

Many guys, this is the show of the teas.

So don't worry.

We're gonna tease penny Wise.

Bill Scar's God, he's got that big money deal.

They gotta call him back, you know, can't call him back too much.

But we love to see him.

Yeah, what a fun episode.

Can't wait to talk about this more with you guys.

On the next episode of extra Vision, we were visiting Classic Star Trek with season one, episode one of Star Trek, the original series.

That's it for this episode.

X ray Vision is hosted by Jason SEPs Young and Rosie Knight and is a production of iHeart Podcasts.

Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman.

Our supervising producer is Abuzafar.

Our producers are Common Laurent Dean Jonathan and Fay Wag.

A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme songs by Aaron Kauffman.

Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman and Heidi our discorded moderator.