Hey there and welcome to host.

Whitney Webb.

Since rise of a particular clique of capitalists has been quite paying attention.

The core of prominent members of the so to prominence in Silicon Valley early executive roles at PayPal, quickly dollarized the internet world currency, and consulted agency they could get a meeting unlimited Hangouts, first interrogating the political entitled The Pay Pal presidency, ambitions for healthcare and to guide and arguably subvert or Maha movement toward policies ostensibly opposed during the examining the philosophies and the most prominent members of Peter Thiel and Elon Musk, and concrete US policies through the well as Thiel proteges like Over the last six months, major mainstream and allegedly portray these wealthy unquote counter elites, arguing challenge to the elites that had election, while these so called PayPal Mafia, have sought to significantly different, At woke, for example, are there philosophies really functionally elites they have supposedly really libertarian leaning and claimed?

What motivates them and look like?

It's important we ever.

Between their wealth and they have the ability to shape unprecedented ways.

Joining me Davis.

Iain is an independent contributor to Unlimited books.

He is from the UK, and Manchester attack.

His recent Unlimited Hangout, the dark one and two delve deep into the technocrats, many of the members house, philosophers like Curtis joining me today, Iain, and Hangout.

Thank you very much, here.

Well, as I noted just a election, there's been a good oligarchs now lined up behind Vance, are counter elites, and elites who we have been told shadows by American voters.

So narrative regarding the so Well, they're not counter they're, they're oligarchs in know, the real sense of the converted immense wealth into That's clearly what they're call them oligarchs, you know, know, the kind of things that to move America forward and make certainly in doing so, obviously the world.

There is, there's, agenda that we've that we're perhaps the other side of the of Swabian side of the side of rolling out top down, controlled know, as an OP, I would say it's proposed kind of privatized which is, which is pretty much oligarchy control mechanism that of the fence, you know, if we traditionally, people like people are kind of very wary of, presenting themselves as these overreach of.

Kind of globalist certainly Republican voters, that's probably how that they've political authority within the extent that they have, it's supported by people who want to consider to be, you know, overreach, that what they've that.

Well, I say exactly the that what they're proposing in you know, we're going to go on Dark Enlightenment.

And also know, that what technocracy kind of systems, what they are form of top down hierarchical envisaged.

So So you know, to obviously Republican voters, that, what they've got is, is, be.

Yeah, I tend to agree with see, like I said in the intro difference they seem to actually cultural veneer they put over of cloak themselves in this, you these things, and that seems to difference at a fundamental it really means anything.

It Democrats and Republicans in the differentiate themselves largely that's abortion or gay rights.

that's sort of been the main way conquer, and now you're having you know, the exact nature of slightly and focused sort of on things.

And you know, when Trump elites had supposedly come in.

CEOs expressing relief, because retarded at board meetings noted, a lot of the actual going to be very significant in new crop of elites really has and more broadly the world.

So course, and I think you know that word over the past few included.

And so I think maybe of maybe define what technocracy of prominent figures today, like ideology.

So would you mind necessarily, but enlightening us definitions there, yeah.

So first, I think it's these people are very much on technocracy.

So we had a tweet.

Bezos, he posted to Musk, and he is being formed before our eyes, technocracy.

So in reference to comes out of a book the network by Balaji sriniva.

Can't Srinivasan.

And basically come through in policy, in the what, what Srinivasan was, was no regulation where particularly tech, tech, hand to do whatever they want in become now within the Trump sort of understand it as steroids, where they would and people that would live there the city as sort of like a would have its own like that.

Yeah.

Yeah, so that's the state, how to start a new was talking about.

So, so means, you know, what would be managed, and how would that, how administrative zone work?

Well, technocracy.

And he further something that he published in comment where he said, we're development to build the Martian there.

He's spoken about, wants to construct a putting it in the context of to think, well, he's not in Earth.

But obviously that that So I think the most people is.

I think, you know, most technocracy, they they equate it technocratic governance.

So have experts that make policy we think about what happened you've got people like Fauci, medical matters.

That's that is important that the public are experts making decisions, and necessarily elected politicians.

people about technocracy, if of what it is, that's normally but technocracy is, is is much it, but it's much more than system, like an operating complete re reconfiguration of with society entirely, and what it what it calls a social came out of the out of the was a movement that was headed other other people, you know, oligarch interest.

People like were looking at that idea.

And break society apart completely.

social mechanism based on what functions.

So you have the function, the industrial by a continental control.

So it nation states.

You would create on a continental scale, and that small group of people, no more continental control, and in appoint from within their ranks would be called the continental level of the degree of social that is inherent to technocracy it's not something that most to, because it is, it is, it is that they they are talking human animals to be programmed function.

Are what where we go, entirely controlled by a new surveillance that monetary now in the 1930s presenting that the bureaucracy suggested by 1930s when the original shortly, You know, briefly in feasible thing.

How would you even a national scale, if we alone a continental scale?

But were looking at that with there may come a time, and Technotronic era was very much this of technology enabling such to function.

You know, they've they've followed it.

You know, would very much suggest that, trialed to a great extent in proceeding to roll it out computer technology AI in that with digital ID and digital of actually establishing a feasible, feasible prospect.

that we've got key technocrats technocrat Musk, you know, so, administration.

Well, I think it's, it might probably the first more or less executive level in the United actively, actively taking that there is ostensibly to maximize in your piece, this idea, the animal.

The goal was to engineer animals and the human animal their efficiency.

And in ostensible goal of this DOGE obviously, you know, on onto it's pretty clear that any being hit with claims like, Oh, defending the corruption.

It's know, in the case of, like, the spending bill, those spending They're full of all of these ridiculous expenditures that kind of been a known thing that that there is sort of pork, government at large that either or through those same types of, policies.

And that is what Elon focusing so much on the exposure at what what is being with the data that Musk now has given that Musk in the PayPal intimately involved with mass the United States, particularly and national security agencies, about, and also the fact that replace a lot of workers, are being laid off, and a lot of a lot of them, you know, with AI ultimately, that has a because whoever controls those would have the power of those the organization employing it, maintains that algorithm kind of that's sort of how I see it.

So, happening right now.

Changes are level, all under the name of kind of made himself the the will.

But I would argue that well, not necessarily more equally important to sort of now playing in the US administration, is also the on the large content platform He his AI company, which is your PC and the technocracy can science of social engineering.

engineering human animals to they're programmable automatons.

where the role of government system to do that programming.

is a key part of that, and technique dominated world, yet, spheres of of engineering.

So I mean, I think if you, if um.

You know, it is technocracy note, as you quite rightly said, and something that is common to going to talk about the Neo idea that there's, there are problems.

So all problems, there, there are technological thing that you need to do in problems is apply the right tech, technological kind of of very mechanistic, kind of AI decision making is elevated, above everything else.

So you know, all decisions are made logical way, and that's the best long as we obey the algorithms.

obey whatever the algorithms world of the of the technocrats reactionaries, will be, will be direction now the DOGE, and it's people's performance, and I it, but I've seen it.

I think it saw it, but it's been described precisely what technocracy is.

this notion of, you know, know, large language modules, think there's an argument to be nowhere near this suspected and the Neo reactionary?

Yeah, I absolutely agree.

myself, but continue, yeah, well, I mean, we'll this, so this, this notion that workers we're talking about, in quite a large swathe of the their their futures will be nanosecond, by a computer.

And that's, that's the decision, the human element of that, you mean, someone's job, someone's like, their family, their you know determined you that you are are gone.

And that that is, that you know, if you boil it down to it.

That is exactly the kind of and venerates, and that's what what people like Musk venerate, that is the world that they are you know, I mean, and I think of the kind of way that this look, what it would look like if installed, right?

And I relates to x, for really mentioned just a second ago live in this system, would need submit to the algorithm.

I active on X lately, but I've have been and it's generally was know, engaged with it was a major effort to kind of users, namely with the x ai, Elon Musk new AI company, after at open AI that he also helped asking Grok, the AI chat bot of everything.

So, like, for opinion or a story or something it, there are replies of people Grok says, you know.

Or, let me you're criticizing Elon Musk.

about the thing you know.

And obviously started that to a it's becoming.

Uh, extremely also told, though I haven't seen with these AI generated images Studio Ghibli engine.

I guess being the Hayao Miyazaki film prominent and frankly wonderful sort of animating themselves and style, and that x is just a wash interesting how people are sort normalization on x of AI answers to things, and that I've argued this before, and a lot of their their agency, critical thought, or also just, you know, algorithms in yeah, no, I've noticed that mean, people do say, you know, don't have to go very far in a saying, Well, this is what grog think, I think when, as with any there are potentially, about AI.

I mean, I'm not a that, you know, that we there are any advantages to it.

think about, you know, how we things, or design design, you that kind of thing, and how we like that.

Sure, what you know, models are very, very might be AI might be very useful.

But one on another platform, which I we think about, you know, the social media about all kinds of anything, these large language data and analyzing it, you know, in particularly in reference to You do realize that all these sub stack are being fed in, fed you know, and we are effectively interesting things so far I've that, if you put in thus far, it you like, about some people that as just out and out.

You know, theorists.

Grok doesn't analyze know, people like myself and know, it's quite, it comes back on us at the moment, but, but I problem is, obviously that it's perpetuating, random, just the algorithms are programmed by ultimately, while it's currently up as much data as it possibly not that it could ever complete that those models have been people are Using those models themselves.

Then, obviously, by can social engineer on a scale previously, I would have, you wouldn't have been able to even a lot of what you just you know, this, this book that actually written a piece about Schmidt and Henry Kissinger, who elites that were deposed by the you know, very tied up with the course, Henry Kissinger, having Klaus Schwab and very, you know, and the trilaterals and all of different than than Musk and their book, they basically chart this rule of all aspects of our happen.

And they basically say dominated by AI already.

And I, I think, like four years ago saying that AI is, is shaping music to listen to, what things that soon, it will shape our will become completely dependent much, period.

And they refer to diminishment, that basically more of our of our agency and then eventually we won't be able or we will forget how to do it.

explain this to people is, you mental math ability if you or something like that.

The you lose it, kind of thing.

And know, we're, I think we're still novel, and people are AI and all of that.

But slope.

And this is outlined by that it's a slippery slope, and of, oh, it's so convenient, I'm all the time to analyze news might forget how to do that And that's basically how these Schmidt chart out how we get to governance by algorithm and in And another thing they bring up that's related to what you that government by algorithm and lead to a fairer society.

It society.

And you made that point continental directors being on human animals, as it were, and book that it'll lead to this, a call it Neo feudalism, or have have the people who are AI and determining the functions above everyone else, who are being enacted upon by AI doing to them and how it's meaning that the people that are those effects are and where Yeah, no, I agree with that, something you said earlier, with these LLM kind of things seem to that's very much what, what moment.

So, you know, that's gathering the data together to efficiency of the model.

You that is enticing people to possible, which, of course, is so, yeah, and I think the idea that we run, and certainly, what envisaged, is that society that mean, in technocracy, they do.

that they've got in there of rights.

This is so I'm going 1930s original iteration of in its study course, which was 1934 and they come up with this believe it or not, you know, and perceived to be their naivety.

thought would be a classless that, you know, in order for for envisaged to emerge, it would be keeping with their pet rights.

idea after observing cow herds they noticed that, you know, dominant than others, and it their physical strength or seem to be more dominant.

So that was the same in across the society, and that we we should.

same kind of thing.

And so who Peck rights?

Well, that would be of resources.

So the people that oligarchs, basically, and people know, the resources that we need people that would have the peck envisaging what they were was, it was not classes at all.

about was one mass class of they refer to is the human one, one mass of us, and lives and controlling our our efficiency as A function, Who?

Who would, you know, make to their design?

Now, you know, and Kissinger writing Warning, potential for this kind of you then have to think, Well, while warning us about these creating precisely that system.

thought for a moment, certainly, Thiel and Musk are, are racing the kind of, you know, social other hand, people like Schmidt against, you know, and obviously involved In in rolling out that while it's, while it's nice, warned about it, well, surely think about it first then.

But actually getting, is it, you acceleration towards, towards without, without anybody really about it.

Yeah, well, I think, you book, they frame it as a But if anyone's familiar with figure, or Eric Schmidt, either, as a warning, especially when basically like, all of this will society we'll have, and there AI, or the other outcome is, is are deposed by a popular think Schmidt and Kissinger clear.

And considering that Kissinger's air.

And Kissinger builder, at the Bilderberg consistently a major topic.

On Bilderberg is Peter Thiel, as Palantir, who still leads the is basically becoming a global national security state of the services of both the UK and the America and Wall Street now, all quite interesting there.

I don't warning, but I think you know, kind of a way to maybe little bit, being like, well, we what was going to happen.

Oh, they have to tell us don't they?

Apparently?

Yeah, apparently.

But they don't, had any intention of stopping their history, and also, you Schmidt, their current actions and and finance and seek to problematic stuff.

Well, we've for a while, and before we move Curtis Yarvin and the Cathedral Enlightenment and all of that, I of the technate, which would be system, and what that would sort technates would look like, course, in your piece, and the technate model for the encompasses Greenland, which has and JD Vance after the.

promise at all, make Greenland that.

Definitely something that around inauguration time and expound a little bit on what a for technates are are, I think illuminating as well.

Yeah, so a Tech Night is a engineering and behavioral saying earlier, with a the top of it.

So it's and be a very small number of people surveil and distribute all it would have its monetary controlled, or power everything would be centrally continental control, this, this, everything.

You know, in the proposed, you know, as I said, would be no names of towns or Everything would be designated grid reference.

So you would five.

You know, this kind of but, but, but interestingly, in study course, they put a map on cover, I think they put a they called the North American Tech Greenland and went all the way all the way down to Northern northern tip of South America.

made, seemingly, you know, prior his inauguration, started making know, building this North would encompass, you know, most Central America, I think, and had never really been mentioned like, you know, the North that.

Well, I feel like Trump made it pretty interested in basically de facto Greenland with the United beyond Mexico, he really spoke worth pointing out that there is country.

El Salvador is prison for the Trump deportations, you know, or you eventually American citizen or people that are vandalizing be sent to these El Salvadorian the El Salvador government.

So dollarized nation also, so it possible that it would expand Mexico, to be sure.

Well, I'll defer to you on did, but I but I may be right.

probably, I guess, with Panama, he about Panama.

So I guess if you Salvador through dollarization And then you take the Panama and El Salvador.

And the Panama just be like, well, well, you Yeah, yeah.

And I think the when the original technocrat really explain how that would would all these countries just with your crazy, hair brained that was never made clear.

And I was drawn, that was that was North American technate, in appearance, that in terms of me, that was a signal, you know, really, it's almost like an that the technocrats we are in I mean, it's, it's, you know, North American Tech Night.

Now, know.

And as you quite rightly people like ourselves or and some of the plans for Greenland, just signaling their intent.

But notable that that that map was was.

And I think also, you know, technique might be, I mean, one technocracy, as I alluded to originally proposed, it couldn't technology did not exist.

To the technology does exist today behavioral control system a ironically, the nature of the enables that to happen, and the enables that to happen kind of a kind of geographical technate you know, by its nature, this transnational.

So, you know, you many different regions in the communicate, you know, and have doesn't, that doesn't physical, you know.

So, so the technique could operate now based on kind of control of we certain markets, control of control of certain political can be done without, troops over borders is what I'm I think that's absolutely look at the case of just North know, in terms of just like technology, like fiber optic sense, but also, you know, like of like the PayPal acquit.

Well, I would argue, Mercado Libre is significant control over, over already happening, and already compared to, like the Amazon of much is, but they're making a the digital financial with stable coins and crypto and they're now tied up with the linked to Howard lutnic and that, and kind of, you know, ultimately tie back into PayPal.

PayPal used to own a majority of stuff, and came out of Stanford, things.

And is tied now to the that, which is sort of yoking to Trump, and also Elon Musk in So you know it, I mean, that's example you sort of bring up in of these same entities have Ukraine.

And as soon as peace is will be run by essentially those of them tied up with either Musk know, Black Rock, JP Morgan, and of that nature.

So it becomes these, these, you know, what, corporations, even if, in the Anduril, they have very America tether together a lot of could say, well, yeah, and, I mean, that's another, of bait and switch idea that we obviously, that they've been Project 2025, they've been being anti elitist in many know, the certain control of when we think about the Bezos building a network state, and srinivalaji...

We'll just call him Balaji.

it's obviously referencing his work.

these freedom cities being kind considers the US to be outdated that that you know that this think he's questionable.

I think control, pro maximizing their accelerate towards, you know, their own minds.

Yeah, Balaji is an he's been saying a lot of stuff Twitter into, you know, a course, Elon Musk's ambition is American version of WeChat.

And system.

And the idea would be, shopping and all sorts of things supports that model, but says it step further, and that people instead of like, necessarily, that, they should monetize their or on on models like that.

Um, content for them.

And he had where he said, In 2023 uh, AI is crypto is about building a new the context of the whole network develop.

And I think ultimately will come even though it's, as centralization of power, it's attractive to sell it base, and under these that they're using as a greater have to market it as so if you have a network of knit themselves into the largest into a technate Then, I mean, that way, but have sort of what decentralized patchwork of of that's the case, because, as you example, in our joint work on work on, you know, the fight the whether it's stable coins or to have sort of a vendor have a patchwork of companies or providing the programmable, a stable coin or whatever, but from that would be harvested in ultimately centrally controlled necessarily visible to the Yeah, no, absolutely.

And the Dark Enlightenment and what patchwork of realms, so the idea to decent from these guys because it is predominantly men, decentralization is a process decentralize everything from, economic systems to financial but as long as it, as long as is interoperable.

I It's in a be centrally collated.

Then by this network out, you know you know, financially, or you can spread this network out, you know to a certain extent, in their relative realms or if you can then gather that data machine readable format, which can then do at something like a if we're talking about the, you forward this idea for a global think it's called, you know, about ideas here, rather than already been established.

But are going, you know, then, then give you what.

Harvard, McCall control, of a patchwork of manipulate each realm.

And if technocracy that would done, through the allocation of a kind of centralized power much the kind of in terms of how very good example of that would the C40 Cities Network is, you other side, you know, when we're juxtaposition between the right political kind of terms, the kind of oligarch, kind of that, you know, the Schwabian you know, like setting up things supposed to decentralize power.

the increasing power at a who are often members of this they're all linked centrally to, particularly from their from realms, so that that's what this, this, this kind of to, they want to roll out, which decentralized, but will actually sources as possible.

Something I to add to that, since you're Unified ledger here, I mean, some sort of blockchain ledger.

been signaling, of course, from putting, for example, major blockchain.

And it's very likely eventually happen at a much potentially have, you know, all you know, financial transactions something that actually Larry desire for, and says that, you said this around the time that ETFs, there would be basically a blockchain for finance, and number or CUSIP, not just the they were transacting.

And in they're trying to tokenize all including the natural world, you his vision will have, you know, obviously this has the, as you data aspect to it, but there's to it too, where people are sort enabling it will enable extreme my colleague Mark Goodwin has points about that.

You know, in Catherine Austin Fitz, basically you publish everything on a someone looking at a blockchain you can the data is there, and I if you don't have access to all anonymized identifiers or other you know all of these.

I you going to make sense to the have to have access to a litany Palantir, for example, in order money flows are connecting and money's really going and what's Yeah, yeah.

And I guess if rather than a permissionless permissioned ledger, then you you?

So, I mean, I wouldn't, I intent on moving money around.

I in the UK, for the UK is kind of is that these payment into they will agree to be, you know, banks and store it on the controlled through, you know, and so forth.

But that will be the central bank, and they will rules.

Well, that's those are know about, that they're given, Barclays or whatever, are given permission algorithms.

So what's other permission algorithms sure, you know, I mean the idea, mean, it's the same, you know, I and that, in fact, the whole everything and moving everything platform is it's like the there it seems to me to be more like you know, the the mythical image more like that than than a kind everything, you know, I mean, this kind of harvesting of data my view.

I mean, I you know?

I heading towards something that of criminality.

I mean, I think that looks quite a lot worse.

But I think the sales pitch to sell it as a better system.

was more left leaning more sustainable world.

And I that, you know, now that they've right leaning dialectics, you same thing too, that it'll be a transparent system.

And I think it's a permissionless ledger, the low hanging fruit of easy of been framed as publicly but I likely that ultimately you're permissioned and permissionless, people think that transparency doesn't necessarily mean that financial practices will stop, that our world and in our are run by people who have a dealings and money laundering It'll be money laundering for will be the outcome, yeah, I mean, I even crossed my mind that we will, that we're heading possibility of, for example, smuggle to, you know, proxy ever envisage that happening.

there, if there was a system wouldn't be rolling it out.

Yeah, well, I think the it will stop those things.

paradigm of programmable, which this particular PayPal to it's going to basically liberty and security.

You're financial privacy entirely and a the system.

So in order to trade off.

Will be ending money sorts of things, and the your money anymore, like DOGE is these financial ills will the programmable, surveillable that we are now.

You know, like the cbdc at all, even really not that different at the civil liberties perspective.

So, no, not at all.

No, it's, the same.

I mean, the the Trump fondness for stable coins is better in terms of its potential control.

I mean, you know, a cbdc.

So it doesn't, it that, in that regard, yeah.

I mean, I don't know.

think that it is different not what you said, just as but that also, Trump has Wall Street bankers.

And that's It's true from his own history.

out by the Ross child banking know, it's just been kind of a know, pardoning long notorious collar criminals like Michael I mean, he seems to have an ear know, people like his upper.

and good friend, Larry Fink, for Fink is a on the way out, guys, here anyway.

Sorry, it's just see what narratives have managed in reality.

In my opinion, yeah, no.

I mean, I think, I know, something that we spoke idea of, of, you know, the kind that the you know that they're, to free us up, and to free up benevolent benefactors.

this, this notion, yeah.

I certain extent, the things that were angry about, you know, this would consider wokeism, this shutdown, of freedom of speech know, that is not inherent to thrown at and and considered to progressivism.

It's you know, tantamount to identity politics.

comes from that, which, of you think about what, you know, it's that is very much about much about, you know, women's gay rights.

It's about, you moving society forward in a come with it, like the shutdown censorship of people online, comments online, that's got Moors that, that is that has ideas being exploited by, I and their network now, now, and with that.

I mean, ultimately, and it's intimate.

It's legislation.

But the thing that know, certainly the Republican things like Project 2025, and so bridling against something that set of oligarchs.

And the something which is being oligarchs.

In this case, you talk about this, this kind of underpinning of all this.

In towards a privatized form of government, government itself, intents and purposes, a private, isn't going to facilitate, I if that enables kind of more like poverty, inequality of things that people care about, that kind of thing that there's Towards a privatized form of anything about any of those they're finding solutions for kind of a mutated form of they're not.

They're just, you perceiving the threat in those well, I've always seen this effort to mainly keep the left that are unhappy with establishment left.

So instead policies, for example, in the US this candidate is from this religion, and has done, you that same you know, identity, ultimately, like, how many can diverse, and thus the better, but it prevents a which, in the case of the not that different from policies Yeah, no, absolutely, yeah.

And group and and the politicians Or affiliated with them, have diversity in our in our you dismantling that now.

But effort to put push this was ultimately an effort to policies, and now, because know, the quote, unquote erected all of this while implementing the, you the real policies, you have the focusing so much on dismantling still no discussion of the yeah, you've said it better than that's what I was trying to get you've got an artificial doesn't really exist, and then artificial construction of a exist because the underlying that they've always been and the economic situation that you get health inequality, you opportunity.

You get all poverty, all the all the people, none of that ever that there's, then, there's nothing from, you know, Thiel and Musk that is likely to address any of saying that you know the other know, certainly not in the UK, we've got at the moment, who are forte.

You know, they're doing, of addressing those issues.

And it's even it seems mean, I think that's the problem political kind of to and froze, about, you know, basically important things that we need to government, and they're addressed by a new surging ahead with these pretty would add too, that that these new media paradigms we continually made on these issues that actually have more lives, and the ones that are, You know, anyway, I, in the talked about him a few times, them.

I'd like to bring the and Nick Land, who, in the described as the house and in the case of the PayPal is more more known for being close to them, though, lot of influence on them as Nick Land, of course, for his Enlightenment.

And Curtis Yarvin retire all government employees cathedral.

But of course, you thus far some of these other less associated, perhaps, with GOV Corp and the sovereign Corp make of Yarvin's and Land's the PayPal Mafia, and are their their Proponents claim?

No, I mean, it's they cloak libertarian language.

But about what they're proposing.

It an unbelievably autocratic, top they're proposing.

So back in place called the cybernetics University, where Nick Land was looking, they were looking at Destruction.

So some Schumpeter, that that there's a cyclical, inherent to capitalism, where advances in economics and mean that old markets are ones emerge.

So, you know, good carriages destroyed by the one market is.

Destroyed a new attached to those markets are financial interests.

So this, tends to also have an impact on, because, you know, and on, you'd interests, because, because the fore, and others and others they they were looking at this Schumpeterian's Creative that we are rapidly approaching Singularity, which is the which becomes self perpetuating, or AI, which, you know, they argued because AI will ultimately will venture off into The cosmos this notion.

So what they called Accelerate or an idea called accelerationism, which is startup investment and idea is just to use chapters every opportunity from every apart the institutions of reformed into a better system of as a species to cope with the rushing singularity.

So what was that they thought that into what Curtis Yarvin called a these patchwork of realms should corporations or sove cause of a CEO King managing a realm innovation and enable the kind technology that we all have to able to survive the inevitable wrote as this, this character, that, that was happening kind of 21st century, he he wrote from about 2010 2011 initially Land and he wrote something called expanded on the ideas that Moldbug and those ideas, he kind them to even further extremes.

Enlightenment that we have to to survive.

He said that once we technoplastic beings that could us to, what he said, cross the that and that once we've crossed able to pay what he calls call tax.

So sovereign rent.

It sounds so much nicer when doesn't it?

You've sound yeah.

So you're so but in do that, to this song, to pay wouldn't be able to function in just be like these useless kind know, could don't know anything, us to stay pace with it, with singularity world, basically we We have to become cybernetic his notion, and that, with the he further presented was this like, you know, there is a big and this Neo reactionary having continental control, you of sovereign cause, the kings of would over be overseen by a core, which would be a kind of, government.

I mean.

That.

And I the difficulties we have in understand these ideas is that creating new structures that we envisage.

So one of the things listening to this would like to, is there being no government, entity that oversees the of your life, because, because, suggesting, instead of a instead corporate structure, because So that's that is basically and influential by Land when he specifically cited Thiel.

Thiel Yarvin.

Yarvin and Thiel watched together.

Yarvin calls Thiel we're talking about the, you there The Dark Enlightenment.

So got in mind.

And when we way that they envisage rolling then we combine that with their the ideas of this, that that been presented in The Dark edifying.

Well, what, what, you they're basically appear to be horrendous totalitarian control Yeah, you know, it's funny, the risk of, I'm a little nerdy, but I have been playing seven.

And basically, in that that runs every aspect of the planet to power its systems Shinra corporation, but they're the game, you know.

And it's this would be somehow a fair sector tyranny, as opposed to a kind of impressive, really.

And it's been so successful in sort masquerading itself as sort of from tyranny and departure from of people are sort of but really, it's really, you more entrenched even, because he Yarvin sort of frames, you know, between a CEO and a dictator.

put a CEO in charge of you know, the technical continental director, you know, you know, they would rule as, yeah.

I mean, one other thing.

I Americans need to get over their think, within a couple of weeks speech at Stanford, I think that dictatorship was, that was was talking about startups, you new industry and starting up new said, you know that we that we that need, there needs to be a you know, a company for innovation, Iain innovation, of innovation.

Every I mean, that's the thing that oppression of the public or innovation, right?

Unless you're tyranny, which then perhaps Yeah, yeah, they've been think, I think one of the things I've written these two articles, these seemingly off the wall, that are being adopted by some Earth.

But it's not new, is it?

idea.

It's the same old idea should completely dominate mean, I mean, it's as old.

It's not new, you know, it's interesting that, you know, the PayPal and we've talked, we haven't discussion about it, but the touch on it that a lot of these particular, are joined at the state.

And, you know, the US when it goes in at coups system of government does it be, you know, libertarian military dictatorships.

So, you at the CIA, as I do, is sort of Street bankers and organized know, intelligence agencies as were, it would make sense that would like to have now in the dictatorships around the world.

think about this in particular.

lands work.

Is that the sales tyranny, or in technocracy, and want to call it, is this, this to do this because of the because of AI and because of And it kind of reminds me of the right don't like from the left change, for example, and how we changes because this terrible terrible thing will happen, and the whole species will be wiped everything about our lives.

It's similar, isn't it?

Yeah, yeah.

And, I mean, I basically that, you know, the, I not that, you know, the the left things like, you know, combating development and you know these yeah, we do have to accept this sustainable development goals that's the point of them.

To a The left accepts that because, catastrophe, the impending less so they're far more in in Europe and in the UK and more skeptical.

Don't kind of the left claims.

Realize what a have on the economy and they reject it, but they are things, such as immigration, know, the cost of living, that matters.

So up steps the other time represented by Thiel and others and and to provide the and the Republicans to provide exactly the same thing, which earlier, is not a new idea.

It's moving into a technological era kind of dictator's point of just really stamp down on us and they've already got the left on right on board.

Hence Trump it bait and switch to take place.

that's, that's the way I view no, I can't put a cigarette sides of the coin, they're path, you know?

And this kind of what you just brought up, of how how Teslas, which were Very concerned about climate US you know, are now being toting libertarians and Trump mass.

And you have like, you also Howard lutnic, basically publicly while in public office, framed as like the car of the isn't it, because since the this technocratic model, and you interested in an EV only cars, Musk has pointed out, is not a AI company.

But really, Teslas and they can be remotely turned and the government decides you your car against your will to a or into a wall.

Yes, the Michael Hastings necessarily better, but now it's think, you know, I used to think stuff, you know, these shifts in people on the right on board unquote, globalist policies that being engineered to love under minute cities, Freedom cities, examples that we've discussed coins.

You know, I used to sell Neuralink?

And now I'm going to tell the conservatives own the libs, and then a bunch that's a little cynical, but social engineering stuff has in getting people that were reset of the COVID era.

You job in sort of framing it, that plot, and it was just Klaus people.

And now that we've put it's even though people for and whatever in our you know, Bilderberg steering committee.

are fine, and it's not really people tend to focus so much on not the policies being no, absolutely.

And one of very interesting, was it Mark Horowitz.

He wrote this thing manifesto, in which he now not officially linked to the key, a key influencer in in was, an advisor, an advisor to appears to have been selecting positions and everything.

Now in manifesto, he openly says, we obviously the network that he's, accelerationists used in the way everything that he's written in has come is pure.

So the people Enlightenment would call And it is pure, Neo reactionary he's written there.

And, you Philosopher's Stone.

They're, already, elevating it to, you know that.

So these people are twisted, I would say, ideology, obvious, and they are very current US government.

So, you it's whatever Republican voters we, if we look at things like, orders, that that's, that's that these, this oligarch network, to construct this technocratic government and and everything really, all these, certainly his much facilitates that.

So or is, that.

So, yeah, sure, while you know, making its efficiency that, I think that remains to be supposedly making its efficiency the beginning of this, what it is in it is deploying AI to lives.

That's what it's that's people that are behind it, that's what they that's the kind construct.

But as we, as we also idea that the fundamental idea 1000s of years old.

It is about what it's about.

Well, yeah, I think it's you know, the oligarch families Middle Ages, when they were a ruled by kings, wasn't that that, but then prevent the serfs of thing.

But, I mean, I don't right?

They're techno optimists.

against optimism?

Are you black kind of funny, but that's the is we'll just call it optimism.

When terrified, but we'll call it It's more like the would be, era that instead of oil barons, barons.

They're very optimistic this.

Yeah for themselves.

Yeah.

But to just talking about, about you that they're, they're cajoling along with it, with the with the Republic and the conservative techno optimist manifesto, load of things.

I think he lists the World Economic Forum, uh, and a whole, whole load of as the enemies, the enemies of techno kings, which is how they enemies.

And then says because, doesn't say it outright, but he kind of infers it that they're thought was like what we go back this just kind of, that's what happened during the that were promoted very heavily unquote, or thought leaders of lot of them claimed that and of the global promoter, self partnership, yeah, and ignored what stakeholder capitalism basically became kind of this sense.

But again, it was about sort of in the same line of what identity politics and not really underlying policies, which great reset in the West is fourth industrial revolution, biological and digital selves, group is also arguing for, oh, well, we've defeated the communists.

We are something give you the Fourth Industrial of the great reset.

We're just pitches for them, which is, where we are in that sense, the time to focus on the policy not the celebrity, not the politics, or these, you know, or, you know, front men that richest men in the world, or Policies, because you'll find a same, and someone like Elon Musk ostensible right, but he's a basic income, of carbon pricing.

great reset policies, but I it's it's different now, or you, you know, in your piece, about the humane alternative to have come out of any of these with the WEF.

Or Yuval Noah era, this idea of basically instead of killing them.

They worlds enjoying themselves, like that.

But I guess in this case, will put you in the pod and feed you'll get your UBI Liberty they'll change the names of all minute cities are, are freedom know, just have to cloak it the And, you know, and be like, own the LIBS that way in your of the policies they advocate It's just the sales pitches and people to consent to them are like the COVID era, where so people to consent to things and things they otherwise want to same thing is happening now.

And I think the interest, I quote, I just took a section out wrote, the lead up to the quote because it does stand out in the talking about converting us into the most useful thing that a lot is to be converted into bio mean, when he's talking about I think it's important to he means.

He means all of us for the the singularity.

You equipped for it.

So we're you know, the best thing for us, was that we should be turned then he said he was just joking.

about that.

So what he really this, but it says our goal, in to genocide.

That is the ideal result as mass murder, the from society, but without any of Yarvin's main problem with that's his, that's his.

Yes, it other really, he's really, Yuval Noah like the more I think about it, so, so bearing in mind that very close to Yarvin, you know, spent a lot of time to together.

number of times.

They share the know, when you think that how current Trump administration and across I mean, look at look at what we've just heard Yavin say Palantir in Ukraine and then And stab ruler perhaps wrote an the Palantir, you know, used not just Palantir, you know, there were, there were a lot of it as a test bed to develop AI, targeting and and things like were invited to really kind of for, you know, a real genocide, the Israeli occupation forces to So, so although, and then I of the things that I've tried to use of language that these often, and, you know, do it in a You know, that's the way, that's ideas.

Oh, it's all just a the culmination of those ideas, Gaza, it's not so funny after No, not at all.

And I think overlooked entirely in talking influence in the United States, these things are intended to be is the repurposing of a program purpose.

And it's meant to be a Palantir ever since, you know, information awareness and has been at the forefront of called now, you know, throughout beyond as well.

And the idea, determines if you may be guilty that you can be prosecuted, might do something that you obviously horrible and this whole idea of, well, you effectuate this, this idea that, eaters and all of that, because which used to use Palantir for moved to this other program, the recently, called PredPol, was accurate, half a percent.

Yeah, than a coin toss.

It's basically send as many of the people there you know are Yarvin, and you undesirables?

Well, you know, right?

Or perspective, combination of these algorithms, algorithms have your social is now, you know, hate speech was before too, but they're sort people, to deport people, and on what they've said about, you war, more specifically, what kick that up a notch and it can a pre crime paradigm, staying is an indicator that you may the future, or something like absolutely bonkers, and it's people just don't really realize know, in my case, you know, I've and Thiel, and then later JD of his ties to, you know, Thiel you know, quite vocally, and I doesn't seem to resonate with meant to become, and now, with the health system in the Us the UK, with NHS, they have And in the first Trump create a program called Safe your social media and determine signs of neuropsychiatric know, put on, placed under house know, preventatively and Trump, this thing, like we have to stop happen in all of this.

And it's to say the least, um, but would see where that could easily viewpoints from yard and others, undesirables in the pod.

Well, but we can put them under house in the metaverse or whatever.

I dark, but unfortunately, being constructed that also weapons and the generation of AI to slaughter whole families in happened, and Palantir has now government is allowing that to international condemnation or from continuing, shows that it fact that Palantir was always in.

Or against, you know, you know, its previous should be very, very aware of, is, and how and how much this certainly not cheerleaded.

And I Yeah.

And I think you know, would sort of stress as well is potential that they are of the system that they are all the way back to a guy called was the kind of, the initial driving force for the for the said the system must be first system.

And one of the questions it's not intended for the discussing, and we're already kinds of terrible reason, it?

Why are they constructing it constructing it, if they don't that they do intend to use it for, for that, for that kind of know, terrible, terrible kind of using this, this, these systems though, that I would point out to accept it.

We just don't have compelled to go along with any we but unfortunately, I mean Certainly I would suggest that US in this lead up to the recent as you rightly said earlier, is with it, based on based on a what, of what is being proposed.

proposed is not what I would thought was being proposed.

It Well, certainly not.

And now, uh, trying to keep people it more time.

Trump needs more remember, we've heard this his first term, the trust the basically want you to sit and giving your consent until what been built.

And exactly they're system.

They've been very lot of that is because of how media.

And something I've said very true, is that the PayPal media voices in attempt to, even they attempt to recruit them to involve the Thiel Foundation, personally because I was had just written a book slamming thanks.

But if I got an offer did not even respond to, I'm as well in independent media.

there's Thiel funding people and also, you know, via rumble, shareholder in and a lot of at these big promoted voices and alternative media, they're not they they're extremely boosted it should be abundantly obvious you know, those voices to keep all of these things are suppressed or controversial is, sit and wait.

Trump will fix of these other figures will fix us to extricate ourselves from Trump or Thiel or Musk or anyone is it must be first, right?

It's we don't want to live under the extricate ourselves from it and possible.

Because if we're become.

And even more dependent over the next, you know, four to You know, it'll be much harder the future.

And you will, you be programmed by these people, effort ultimately is leading us of time.

Iain, any last the topic of discussion at one thing, there's no doubt You know, the land spoke about treated with that they've got functions of society that's part they would audit everyone's our sovereignty was so pitiful, be treated with derision so and that that is how we are seen.

the inarticulate pros.

Javin in a virtualized world like bees seen as genocide is bad.

PR, you unthinking demos.

These people to be very clear on that.

Well, so much for your time.

Iain, listeners know where to find mentioned earlier, you're a Hangout.

But of course, you have own books and and other you know our listeners and would be greatly appreciated.

you can find me at name's spelt with two I's.

It's at Substack, which, again, is fortunate that a number of my offGuardian, which is a great lot of writers there that are offGuardian.

I'm very fortunate yourself, Whitney, at Unlimited articles published with book, my latest book is The freely available to subscribers purchase a physical copy if you Well, thanks so much, Iain, particularly on the elites now obviously poised to have a major just because of the unipolar post world war two era.

And also topics, there were other things I wish we had time to talk synthetic hegemonic currency, new digital finance paradigm into, among other things.

So I people to check out not just Hangout, but some of his past more relevant than ever.

And listening and for especially to podcast, and we'll catch you on our series on the PayPal