Unknown: Hey everybody, welcome back to now Season Two of the marketing perspective.

I'm James tonella, and I'm so excited that we're back.

It's definitely overdue.

We have now added video into what we're doing, which we're very excited about.

You get to see the faces along with the voices.

Season One was a lot of fun.

Thank you so much for being a part of it and helping us grow it.

I hope this continues on.

Please get out there and share it, especially if you see value in the advice that's being given.

There's no sales happening on this.

This is all educational.

What we're trying to do is open your eyes as business owners, to these category by category.

This is what you need to do to help your business.

If you could do it on your own, great if you need help.

Sometimes these professionals can be the ones to help you.

If it's out of your market, if you're in another part of the country, find somebody in the same category of what we're talking about to help you, to come alongside you, because it's important, especially when navigating what we have to as business owners, especially in today's world, what's going on out there, which we'll get into in a little bit.

I am very happy to have Doug Eberhardt on today from Eberhard strategies.

He's a business coach, business coaches.

What's the difference between a consultant and a coach?

We'll get into that a little bit, but I can tell you personally that I have seen some of the clients that he serves, and outside looking in, knowing what I know as a marketer, and watching these companies, I am positive that somebody is by their side.

I can see the difference in how they are navigating the waters as business owners, their businesses are thriving.

They're not just surviving.

They're growing.

He is definitely very good at what he does, and that's just from the outside looking in.

Let's we're going to get a little bit under the hood today, so it's going to be a little bit of fun.

I'm definitely looking forward to that conversation, but I want to tell you that we have a lot of special guests coming on this season, a couple of surprises that I'm very excited about, and I a couple of people that will definitely lend insights to categories that I am sure you're going to get a lot from.

So please continue to tune in.

Again.

We are bi monthly.

We are topic driven.

You'll never hear me give any kind of advice other than marketing.

That's why I'm bringing on these experts because that's what they do, which is one of the things that I wanted to chat about real quick before I bring out Doug.

Why I like business coaches and consultants and professionals in that world?

Because a lot of times as a strategist, I get asked some of these questions, hey, can you fix this problem?

Well, I can identify it, and I kind of understand it, but that's not what I do for a living.

I stay in my lane.

I'm good at what I do, and I don't do the other things.

So I love being able to say, Listen, I have somebody else.

Well, I don't want to have to pay for that.

I said, Well, then I don't want to have to market you.

I don't mean that badly.

I just know that you heard me talk about it a lot.

Talk about internal culture, I know that if they don't solve the problems internally, that all the money and effort and time that we spend outside driving traffic back in the door will fail, because we just spent a lot of money driving them to the competition, because when they come inside the walls, what I said out there doesn't match what they're doing inside.

That's one of the common things that happens now.

That's the only, not the only reason to bring on a business coach.

There's a lot of things that they're going to look at.

They'll get under the hood.

Look at your finances.

They look at your business plan.

What business plan you say, well, we'll talk about that too.

And inside that business plan is needs to be a marketing plan.

There's a lot of things that really, if you're going to thrive as a business and you want to grow it beyond today and not just pay bills and have it be a company that is worth more money down the line, there's a lot of steps that have to happen.

So I'm really looking forward to having Doug on today, because I know, I know he knows what he's talking about.

As a business owner.

Now, for 20 years, I've always kind of been an entrepreneur.

I've always in my career, as I came up, they once I got senior level, they really couldn't afford us on staff, so I was always an independent contractor.

I just didn't realize it.

I worked at production companies for months at a time, but I was, it was 1099 I wasn't staff.

You know, I and I enjoyed what I did.

I loved what I did, as a matter of fact, until I crossed over to the agency side, because production started to die in New York when I learned the other part of the industry.

But the last thing I would say about this is that 911 ended my career in New York City, and that's a long story.

A couple of beers offline, and I happen to tell you what it made me was an entrepreneur.

Now, I loved what I did.

I traveled a lot, made a lot of money.

It was awesome.

I really am passionate about what I do for a living.

I still am, but that life change made me an entrepreneur, officially made me a business owner.

Never wanted to be a business owner.

I like going home at night and sleeping well and not taking work home and not thinking about, Hey, am I.

To make payroll this month.

Hey, how come that person hasn't paid their bills?

Hey, why didn't that person sign that contract?

Yet?

You know, as business owners, we stress, and we take it with us.

You know?

What will make us stress less?

Having the right people around us, having professionals that can advise us correctly so we sleep better at night, and this is one of the things I highly recommend is, if you don't have a coach, if you don't have somebody by your side at helping you grow your business, I think it's a big mistake, personally.

So with that said, I'm kind of laying the groundwork for Doug.

I'm going to bring out Doug Eberhardt of everheart strategies.

Welcome Doug.

Hey, good morning.

How are you, James?

I'm doing good.

I already had a little bit too much coffee, so I apologize in advance.

It's a kind of day.

I was looking forward to this.

If you heard what I was saying, I kind of paved the way for our conversation.

I think that you have an important role in what you do.

And we're going to get under the hood now and talk and go deep, and you don't have to give secret sauce.

I just please don't say any names.

And, oh yeah, right, most definitely, yes everybody.

Well, that's the thing about coaching business, if a coach is not for you, and working just to support your own business and keeping everything confidential.

You need to find that coach.

You need to go find somebody else very quickly.

You know, that's because that is just part of the culture of coaching is making sure everybody is comfortable and being able to share what they need to share with you and with each other back and forth.

So it's kind of, it's a it's a great thing to be I love it.

Doug, let's take a few minutes, if you will, and just tell everybody about yourself, how you want to be in a business coach.

Okay, so I've been a CEO for more than 20 years.

I was running organizations up to $25 million and I had staffs as large as 5060, people.

And about six, seven years ago, I decided that I just was wanted to do something for myself, and I wanted to work for myself, and so got trained, went to several classes, became a certified coach, and became the ability to help other people and understand the difference.

And that's the challenge with coaches in this day and age.

Right now, there's several people just saying, Hey, I'm going to be a coach.

I'm going to hang my shingle out and say, I can help people succeed, and many times they can, but a coach has specific skill sets that you're looking for.

You're looking for somebody that can help answer questions by encouraging you to learn more, by looking at what your business is doing and moving forward.

And so ask people when you're coaching, ask them, What trainings Do you have?

What trainings are you currently going through today, and are you continuing to stay up to date on the coaching, coaching trends and the coaching skills that you need to move forward and help my business grow, and that's the key to being a good coach, when?

So when everybody, anybody starts a business, right?

They identify there's a need for it.

There's an opportunity.

I think I could do this, and I can help others, at least.

That's why you would think somebody would start a business.

So what, what need Did you see out there?

I saw a huge need on CEOs.

Primarily, it's one of the loneliest professions you could ever get and ever have.

Your spouses, they don't understand your family doesn't understand.

Co workers definitely don't understand because they're reporting to you.

And so you have no one to talk to, no one to share the ideas.

And I joke you say, a coach, you can share all your ideas with them and never fear that it appear on the front page of the newspaper.

And, and that's really crucial for a lot of small businesses, and for business owners, CEOs and C suite type individuals, is that they don't have anybody to share their ideas and concepts and help them grow without appearing that it'll go out publicly to everybody around them.

And and that's the need that I saw, and that's something that I can bring to the table, the confidentiality, the ability to hear and to listen to what people are saying, and then to really develop a concept and idea to help that person themselves go from point A to point Z, and anywhere in between, where do they want to go and, and I absolutely love it to see the light bulb go on and and to be able to help people achieve their ideas and their goals, for their themselves or for their companies.

It's probably the most satisfying thing I've ever done in my life.

It's, it's, it's, it's very hard for me to explain the great satisfaction I get out of their successes, but it's cool.

It's really nice.

That's awesome.

There's a couple of stories that popped to mind, but I don't want to take us too much off a tangent, but let's tangent just a little bit, just to get us warmed up.

Can you just share what was the oddest job you ever had?

Your.

Whole Life.

Oh, my goodness, this, see, the oddest job I ever had, janitorials.

I cleaned bathrooms and cleaned apartments for a while.

I worked with a with a cleaning company, and that was a little strange as far as being able to get in there, because my problem was, I was taught to clean extremely, extremely well.

And I was told by my boss that, Doug, you're costing me a fortune.

You're cleaning too well.

Move on.

Let's go.

Just keep moving on.

And so I had never been chastised for doing a job too good.

And that was the strangest thing that I've recalled from that job in reverse.

My I would say my oddest job was probably when I was a PA the very first job in my industry, the production assistant, lowest of the low.

You know, every poop, you know, they say poop goes downhill.

Well, literally, it went downhill one time.

One example, we were doing a commercial for Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey Circus back in the day, and I was shoveling poop behind the elephant because we were on set and couldn't leave the poop there.

Goodness gracious.

I said, Then why have animals?

I don't understand.

So, yeah, we, we have all done some things in our life that it's kind of interesting.

One, one other question, if, if you wrote a book, what would you write it about the pillars of business?

What are the three legs of a stool that will keep your business standing strong and really making sure that you can be successful?

And you know when you really start looking at a business and you can have great operations, but if you have that's just one leg of a stool, and it doesn't mean you're gonna be successful.

If you don't have a great marketing and sales and lead generation part out there, that's another little key to what you're having.

And then you gotta have that good management side of the business as well, that entrepreneurship, that vision, that leadership moving forward, and when you start capsulating Each one of those components of that stool, then you're going to have a stable foundation where you can grow and really build your business up and moving forward.

And it's having that strength and having that strong foundation is crucial to having your business grow.

There's many people who've started their business and they're doing a fantastic job, they're making money, and they're doing everything else, but I get told time and time again, Doug, I started this business to help other people, but I also started it to make money, my profits are not where they need to be.

And one of the things that I suggest to people, I said, you have to develop a process that can be replicated by each individual that joins your firm and your team, whether that's a two person team, whether that's a 12 person or 100 person team, if you can't find some way to replicate and create a process that can be repeated time and time again, you're never going to be able to grow your business to the next level.

And so most businesses are missing processes and systems and Doug, I don't want me to interrupt Actually, I'd like to dig deeper and talk about process so open Pandora's box.

So let's just go in.

That's it.

Let's go through your process as a coach, if you don't mind, okay, one of the key things that every coach should be able to do is first listen and hear what that person's saying again.

So time and time again that one of the skill sets of a good coach is not coming in with a preconceived process or preconceived notion as to this company needs X, Y and Z and they're going to be successful.

I had one my clients look at me and said, Hey, listen, Doug, every time we've talked to somebody, they said, we need to do more lead generation.

We need to do more of this.

But he said, You're the first coach that's actually listened to what we wanted to talk about.

And we talk about that issue, and then we move to the next one.

And I said exactly.

I said, until you're comfortable as a CEO, as you're comfortable as a business owner, having your questions answered.

You can't ever move to the next step.

And so that's the first process, is listening to what that individual says and really work with that.

The second thing I strive to work through is a communication style, really looking at how people communicate.

How do they hear things, and how do they verbalize things back to others.

Went in one company, one business, and I asked this gentleman, and he called me.

He said, Hey, Doug, I've got a C suite problem.

They don't hear me.

They don't listen to me.

They don't do anything like that.

Well, after a few moments of conversation, I realized it wasn't the C suite people that problem.

It was the owner of the business, and so we had an in depth conversation with him about.

How do we improve your communication style moving forward now, he was not very receptive of that idea, and because he still wanted me to work with the C suite, and it wasn't his problem.

And so we ended up agreeing that I wasn't the coach for him, you know, because if he's not going to listen and start at the very top and trying to improve his abilities and his skills, then they won't go down further down the line through his C suite.

And trying to manage C suite people, is a astronomical challenge in itself.

The next process is really identifying where his challenge points are, where the challenge points are in the business itself.

And I can go from anywhere from operations to employee handbooks to strategies and strategic planning, and whether that's a functional strategic plan by area.

So maybe they need a strategic plan for operations, or maybe they need a strategic plan for sales or marketing and get to high level, 50,000 foot items in out of the way, or come back and do an organizational strategic plan and look at each one of those groups and find out where the goals want to be.

I find most people are so involved in the business, they're not working on their business.

And when you hire a coach, you at least have that one hour or two hours a week or month, whatever you contract with that coach for to work on your business, which is imperative to growing your business.

So that's kind of the process that I use and working forward.

I can tell you, from my perspective, in marketing, the client that's in front of me, or the potential client, sometimes, after listening and hearing, here's where they want to go, and you got to get the big picture, you know, the next steps.

I mean, if you're doing it long enough, and you know, this is what we want them to do, and this is how we want to guide them, and this is how we know they'll grow.

But when they're not on the same page as that, and they they don't really make that choice to dive in, it's very difficult to be able to how do I help you if you're not going to let me help you?

You know?

So I imagine you have nights when you go home little frustrated, you know, when that when you've identified the problem, and let's say it's a CEO, and that's a tough situation, because it happens more than not.

It's a it's a really common problem, and if they don't see it, how can you effectively do your job?

You've identified, this is what's going on.

And they're like, oh, no, it's not that.

It must be something else.

Let's fire Bob.

Where Bob gets blamed, you know?

So it's, I imagine, even though, I mean, you're, you're a business owner, an entrepreneur, but you're also taking their pain home.

I don't know about you, but I know I do my clients, if they're having a bad month, or if they're in some kind of financial strain for whatever the reason, or they made some bad choices, or there's a PR problem, I lose sleep, you know?

I try not to.

I try, Hey, I didn't cause that that's their problem, but it's mine, because I feel like I'm a part of them, like we're part of their team or their extended family.

Do you go through the same thing?

Oh, definitely.

But you know, that's what makes you so good at what you do is, is I tell everybody I said, you're not just getting me for the hour or two as a coach here, you're getting another brain that as I'm driving down the road or I'm sitting there trying to watch television, all of a sudden, I'm thinking about your business.

How can it grow?

How can we make it better?

And that's the same way that you do with your clients and customers.

And so we take both the good and the bad home with us, and everybody do that.

And I feel sorry for some people that that I have to consult with my coach because I give my some of my, some of my challenges that I'm running through, because I have a coach as well, and I've worked with other coaches across the country to where we bring up these challenges.

Say, Okay, what are some solutions you found that have worked?

And how does this come into play with you all?

And so you get not only a coaching perspective, but a good coach will have assets and resources further out that they can reach out and help solve the problem.

I've got groups that have wanted specific things, like, I'm not a marketing person.

I can't give you a marketing and branding plan.

I have to hire somebody else to do that.

You know, I'm not an accountant.

We have to go to somebody, a CPA, an accountant, to make sure that you're staying within the laws and regulations.

You know, we have specific companies, specific businesses, that focus on items because of the integrity, because of the qualifications and the continuing education that they need to move forward.

And so that's the reason why, as a coach, you got to be able to identify what you can do and what you can do and really move forward.

So taking it home with you is just part of the business.

And some nights, it's, you know, you lose sleep for somebody else.

And just like you, I tell myself, I didn't create this.

They were the crazy people that did that.

Why am I losing sleep?

But.

But it's our job, to me, that's just part of what they get to get when they get us.

That's right.

I agree.

That is very well said.

Thank you.

I want to back up.

I realize, I know we jumped into process because you took us there.

But can you differentiate a coach and a consultant, just so that people understand?

Oh, definitely.

And, you know, that's one of the questions that people think when I introduce myself to my friends, I say, oh, you're a consultant.

I go, No, I'm not a consultant.

A consultant is somebody you hire to come in and fix your problem for you.

I have been a long term consultant with companies.

I come in and they will hire me.

I will work through this stage, and I will go take a project from point A to point K, and get it done and finished, and then I leave.

And so consultant comes in and does that part, but at the same time, that company has to hire me again the following year, because they didn't learn how to do it.

They didn't learn the processes.

They didn't learn how to solve their own problem, and so they have to hire another consultant to come in the next year to deal with the same issue time and time again.

That is one huge distinction.

A coach comes in and works with the decision makers to help them learn how to solve their own problems moving forward.

And that's a huge distinction.

So was a coach.

We come in.

Yeah, I've got 20 years of CEO experience.

I can sometimes tell you the answer to your problem immediately, which will be a whole lot easier sometimes.

But that's not always the best solution, so sometimes the best solution is helping other people learn how to do it.

Well, bless your heart, because you have a lot more patience than I do.

I make a better consultant.

I'm a better consultant than I am a coach.

I I can come in and so I I'm A to Z.

I want to solve the problem.

Listen, and if you're not going to listen, if I've said it 1000 times, it's why I couldn't be a pastor like I've been.

I was encouraged years ago to be a pilot.

I said I would not.

I'd be a good preaching pastor because I was a worship leader, but I could not be the let me sit down with you and listen to your problems, because if we've talked about this once, twice, three times, by the third time, I'm smacking you like solve the problem and let's move on.

You're You're wallowing in the same problem, and business owners do that all the time.

We and we expect a different result, but we keep doing the same thing, you know.

So being a coach, it's got to be difficult, right?

For you to watch them go through this.

Yeah, it is.

And that's the, you know, recognizing it takes 90 220 days for somebody to change a habit.

And so one of the questions a lot of people ask me is, so how long has this coaching thing got to last?

And I go, Well, that's really up to you.

And they go, I don't understand that.

I said, Well, how quickly are you in ability to change habits and change processes and everything moving forward?

And they go, Well, I'm quick at changing.

I said, yes, you're quick at changing.

How about sustaining?

That's the question.

Then I go, Oh, so a minimum of taking 90 days to change a habit that you've had.

Let's say I've run my business for the last 15 years, and I'm doing fine.

You know, I'm making 5 million a year, but I want to take it to 10.

I can't seem to get over that hurdle.

How do I start growing my business?

How do I start getting to that location?

Well, you're going to have to change some habits that you've had in the past.

You're going to have to be open to new concepts and new ideas that you've never thought about, and you're going to have to probably invest a little bit in this pain point moving forward.

And so that's where that growth comes in and really looking through that.

So the patience is is, yes, it's hard sometimes, but now it's also times that you can fire yourself as a coach.

If I've told somebody three or four times they're not listening and they're not doing it because they're too busy, their life isn't in the way, whatever the reason, you can just look and go, you know, I don't think this is the right time for you to have a coach.

I think it's time for me to step back, and when you get ready, to really focus your energies and time, then we'll come back and we'll do coaching session.

And many times you just say that, and they go, What do you mean?

You're You're quitting.

I go, Yeah, I said you're just not working out.

You're not listening, and I'm not wasting my time.

No need for you to pay me my fee if you're not going to be able to be able to do it and to them.

And some people, that's a wake up call.

They're like, you're right.

I've not been putting my energy into this.

I need to do so and for others.

So, yeah, Doug, you you know, right?

I'm excessively busy right now, and I'm just not going to, I'm not going to spend time doing it.

I know I need to, but I'm not going to.

And that's acceptable answer.

I mean, you're their own business owner, so you do what you want to do and but that's those things, so you have to be willing to fire yourself if you don't have patience, and if they're not listening to what they're doing.

And so listeners, if you don't know.

So we didn't, we'll end with it.

But I want you to know that Doug is he's lives in Bowling Green.

Am I correct in in Kentucky, right?

I'm in Nashville and but he spends a lot of time here.

It's not that far away geographically.

If you're geographically challenged, look at him out.

I'm just saying so we, you know, we know each other, and we were recently in a meeting together, and I brought up a topic.

So I just did a blog recently about what is called stagflation.

Stagflation is when recession and inflation meet.

And I, in my opinion, I'm not an economist.

I don't play one on TV, although my undergrad had something to do with economics, but whatever we are in a bit of what I call a stagflation, and nobody's talking about it out there.

It's the weirdest thing.

I've never seen this, but it's happening.

And then we had a lively discussion, and a couple of points that I took away from that.

It was an economic development meeting, and Doug and I participated in a round table.

It was, it was, it was spirited.

Well, we'll say yes, it was, it was a good day.

That's right.

I love those.

Yep, the best point that I took away from it was actually from the fractional CFO.

And he said, so.

So I think what I see behind closed doors is cash flow is an issue with some businesses.

And he said, which was very insightful, that, and it was Craig Cook, by the way, I don't know if you're listening, you're in market.

Craig Cook's a great CFO, if you ever want to kick his tires.

He mentioned that it's not he thinks people are just sitting on their money right now, which is more of a common problem, especially in a recession, people just get really tight and again, shameless marketer in the room.

I get a little stressed, because some businesses will literally stop marketing in this kind of a market, and it's the worst thing you could possibly do.

I could tell you, they absolutely did that in the 2008 recession.

Did not come out of it very well.

Some of them didn't survive.

It was a mistake, and it's hard watching it.

So what I want to bring up not just marketing Doug, but your opinion, what you're seeing with your clients, and how you're advising your clients right now, based on what's happening in our economy, yeah, right now so many people are there, if they've got good cash in the bank, they're continuing to spend the work and move forward.

There's still some in what I've seen right now, this is just my opinion, and it could be just totally off board, but what I have witnessed is that people with cash are holding on to it.

They're spending some and they're investing it somewhere.

Those who don't have a strong cash flow, my recommendation right now is to cut expenses, increase revenue, as strong, as high as you possibly can.

Now the kicker here is, if you increase revenue, you're going to have to increase your marketing.

You're going to have to increase your lead generation and your sales.

It's a brown it's holistic approach, your branding, your marketing, your sales, all that come together.

And it has been proven time and time again that anytime you have weakened economy, the groups and organizations who spend on marketing, who spend money driving that actually come out of the weakened economy, much, much stronger, and they'll see exponential growth moving forward into the future.

And so I'm advising my clients to start spending on marketing, wrapping it up, finding those people that can help you sell, finding those organizations to get lead development and really make a difference in what your business is doing.

But now also at the same time, if you're going to do that, you need to make sure on the back office, you're ready, prepared for the growth that you're going to have and and that's the key part, and that's where a coach could help you make sure that you're set up and ready to go.

Let me flip that a little bit.

So what we try to tell clients in this kind of a market is, unless they're the big bear, unless they want to own as much market share as they can, and like, beat on their competition.

At this time, we we kind of back off on brand dollars, and we focus on lead gen, or I call it direct response, and we get a little more concentric geographically.

So we tighten the belt a little bit so so to help their cash flow.

But we still have presence, and we're still driving today's business in the door.

Now the the flip side of that is, if they have a the wherewithal and the and the cash flow to really gain some market share at this time, it's a great opportunity if you can do it to because your competition is going to back off.

So if you're able to add dollars.

And we've talked about, you know, my model, like, I don't believe you should go two to 6% of gross anticipated revenue is what I believe established businesses should spend beyond six is you're not going to see the ROI.

I know that agencies are telling people do seven, eight, 10% it's a mistake, and any.

Educated bank, a commercial lender, will tell you that you just won't see the return.

So if you're that company, you can get up to 6% and gain some market share in this kind of a market, but if you don't have the cash flow, this is not the time to try to do that, because you may not get it back timely to be able to pay those bills.

So you want to stay in that three or 4% range.

So I, as much as I appreciate you telling your clients spend money in marketing, I try to be very fiscally responsible to clients that we serve, you know?

Because I'm not, we look at the long game, you know?

I don't.

We're not here to for five minutes to just take money and run I want that client for 20 years, and I want to grow their business with them.

I want to benefit from watching their company grow, because I get my ions that way, sad but true.

So I've got a question.

So when you say companies right now, and I've got my own opinion about this, do companies have a holistic marketing idea concept, or do companies pick and choose?

You know, they'll do X and they'll do Y and Z, and they try to make it all come together, doing a small little things here and there.

Do you see the same thing?

Or holistic plan?

Most times I do not see a strategy behind the curtain.

Most times I don't either they're throwing darts, they're some of the things that the tools that they're picking are good tools, but there's no cohesiveness.

They're they're not in or the tools have to come together and work in a circle like I don't.

I don't want to make this about marketing, but content marketing, for example, theoretically completes a circle, and everything one points to the other, and it all goes back.

And inherently, for the most part, it drives the site.

Some companies don't do that, but in general, it'll drive to site at the end of the day, all the different aspects of content.

And there's so many different things that you could do there organically.

But the same thing happens in your marketing strategy.

If you're doing digital advertising, if you're doing TV or radio or billboard, whatever it is that you have out there, there's a reason for each tool that you've chosen, and there should be a measurement of success for each tool.

Not all of them are direct response.

Some of them are brand messages, and I do recommend up to about established businesses, up to about 20% of brand dollars.

Why is that important?

Because people need to know who you are, know what you stand for, know why you're different than the other guy.

And if you don't say those things, the lead gen, the direct response that you're doing, will fail.

It won't be as glorious as it could be.

You'll get 5% as opposed to 30% as an example.

So I don't want to park Great question.

Well, that's that's one reason why I asked is because, as a coach, you know, when you go in, you look at companies, and you start evaluating where their needs are and where they're growing.

You know, I mentioned earlier about strategic plans.

Strategic plans is functional areas, and so if you don't have a strong strategic concept around your marketing and branding, then you're not going to be as good as what you could be.

And I tell people, you spend $100,000 on marketing to get zero ROI, or you can spend $10,000 or $20,000 and get a 10% ROI on or 100% or, yeah, you have to be able to as a coach.

You have to be able to look at those items and give them an evaluation of how well they're doing.

The matter the most people that I that I talked to, is they don't measure their return on investment.

They don't lead generation.

You can spend $40 for every lead, or you can spend $1 for every lead you get.

Measure how many leads you getting, what you're doing.

So that measurement, part of return on investment, takes time.

It takes effort.

And a lot of companies, especially small businesses, say they don't have the bandwidth.

So you really get that done?

Well, if you don't have the bandwidth, then you need to fire and find somebody that can make that bandwidth, even if it's just some kid, you know, fresh out of high school looking to get into the business world, get them and set up some parameters for them, to do some evaluation, and then send it out to the experts in the field and to get that return on investment.

So good point.

I want to flip it on you, because, yeah, I don't see holistic approaches.

But one of the first questions I ask is, do they have a business plan when I meet a new company.

And you probably come across this all the time, right?

Yeah, and the answer is no, they don't.

Or if they do, it's like, it's on a shelf and it's gaining dust, and it's just kind of, Oh, yeah.

We had it done a long time ago.

Nobody looked at it, yeah, when I went to the bank to give my startup cash, I had a good business plan.

I said, have you looked at in the last 10 years?

No, we're good.

I said, Okay.

The other question I ask people is, how many do you have an employee handbook?

And the vast majority say no, and I go, fantastic.

If you don't have employee handbook, you're the company that's most likely to be so.

Sued, and if you do have an employee handbook, probably won't be sued, because you've already figured all the different things that you need to be doing as a company to protect yourself and and really look at that.

And you mentioned earlier about commercial insurance, or insurance for a business, if you have not looked at your insurance on an annual basis for your business, then you're slacking.

And that should happen just by your insurance agent calling and saying, Hey, we need to review your insurance policy again this year.

There's so many write ons that you could help save your money, save money and increase your protection.

You need to have somebody of that skill set evaluating what you're doing every year.

So those are the things that I'll talk about when we get to his business coach.

I may need to talk to you about that offline.

I just got my commercial insurance bill.

It was more than double than it was last year.

And I called I said, to be a mistake.

Well, you know, insurance everywhere is going up.

And their answer was, well, you know, some people are paying even more than you.

I was like, you know, that's not an answer, right?

Yeah, I don't want to hear that.

That's not, that's not what I'm looking for.

Yeah, I want to know why, what caused this thing to go up that much?

And I got no real answer.

So Guess who's shopping?

Yeah, they don't.

They don't want to talk about all the natural disasters across the country, out west and in the south that's causing our challenges, correct?

Well, I mean, even look at residential insurance, you know, on the coast, they don't even want to share it anymore.

You know a lot of them.

Hey, you know the major we have a couple of more questions before we jump.

I In the very beginning of the show, I talked about internal culture a little bit.

I would love it if you could expand on that just a little bit today.

What internal culture could be in business today, whether it's their people services, their consumer What are your thoughts on that.

All right, one of the biggest challenges we have is a multi generational communication inside a company of any kind.

You have a bunch of people that are my age, that are running companies and and really good 50s, 60s, and in some cases, 70 years old, that have a specific mindset, that this is how you're supposed to work, this is how you're supposed to do things.

And then you throw in the younger generation, the Gen X's the Gen Y's disease, and the millennials, all those different alphabetical generations that we have that are out there, and they approach life totally and completely different than what our expectations are.

And so as internal culture, you have to create something where everybody feels safe, everybody feels like they can share their information.

I give you one example, so the latest people that are coming into the workforce feels like that they can have a direct one to one conversation with the CEO and send them an email or letter anytime they want to, and jump 2345, people over their supervisors and go straight to the CEO.

And that can't happen.

You know, they have specific criteria.

They have the chain of command intentionally on purpose to do that, because if you've got 200 employees, you can't have somebody even on direct to the CEO, unless that's the culture you've created.

But at the same time, that's the expectations that they have coming into the workforce, that they can pick up the phone and talk to anybody if they want to at any given time.

And that's not necessarily accurate.

Now it can be if that's the type of culture you want to do, but you also, as a CEO, you have to be sensitive to that, and maybe have open Hall, town hall meetings to where they do have that aspect of having that one to one, ability to communicate with you as a CEO, instead of just blocking it out.

Say no, this is what they desire.

This is what they want, and also the flexibility of being able to work.

How does that internal culture interact?

You know, we're growing up.

We think everybody has to be in our office for them to get something done between eight and five o'clock, and they've got to be sitting in a chair somewhere.

Well, that's not the case anymore, not with the outset of technology office setting, especially, they're taking work anywhere they can be, sitting at the beach in Florida doing the same thing they can do, sitting in the office, doing the work there.

And so you've got to really look at your own internal culture.

But it's imperative.

The one thing that has to happen is they've got to feel safe.

They've got to feel like everybody wants to be heard, that they want to have some ability to hear that.

I'm concerned about this.

I'm concerned about that, so they've got to be able to hear that.

And lastly is that the CEO has the last word, but the CEO needs to understand that they have to lead with compassion and humility.

Moving forward, it used to be the CEO had an iron fist.

They'd come down with their hammer, and we're going to do it like this.

You need to shut up and move on.

And everybody got in line, you know, we just right behind.

We're ready to go.

That's what the man said.

That's what the woman said.

As a CEO, we're gone.

But that's not what happens today.

And if that's your mindset, you're going to have a high turnover rate in your company.

And keep in mind minimum cost of training someone, according to everything I've studied so far, is around 4500 $5,500 and that's the bare minimum to cost to train somebody to come into your company.

And so every time somebody flips over, you just wasted it.

45 $5,500 or more.

Some companies could be upwards of 2550 $100,000 depending on the level of ever since you got turnover with so.

So yeah, so internal culture is hugely important to the satisfaction of the company and to growing and I say this also the determining who your primary customer are is, are, who they are, is really important as well.

Most people as a CEO thinks they're in their customer is the inline user.

Let's say I run a clothing store as a CEO, my customers are the people coming in the door buying clothes from me.

In reality, that's not true unless I'm working the floor, interacting with those customers.

They're not my primary customers.

My primary customers are those forward facing customers that are coming in my staff that I've hired that's my primary customer to make sure they're happy that they know what they're doing, they're knowledgeable and experienced, and that's an internal culture, and that's how you grow your business, by changing who your primary customers are as a leader and owner of the business, that is great advice.

You know, my humble opinion in leadership is good leaders empower others to rise up in their roles and and makes them better.

And that's a good leader, not just the dictatorial stuff that you're right.

That's I grew up in dictatorial leaders as a kid.

So die, right?

And then at some point it transitioned, and they it kind of even corporate America changed a little bit, not a lot, but a little bit Exactly.

We're not in corporate America for a reason.

The companies I see thriving today are bringing up their key people that are that are senior in their positions, and they're the ones really running the company.

And the CEO winds up doing this at the end of the day, if he's good at what he she is good at what what they do.

Couple more questions.

That was a really, that's probably the best interpretation of internal culture I've heard in a long time.

So thank you for sharing that.

I want to know what your opinion on what is effective growth look like today, and you and I have spoken about this, so I'm really curious.

Yeah, I want to see where you go here.

Yeah, me too.

So effective growth, the effective growth I'll just simplify this for me.

If you are maintaining your company and you, let's say you're a million dollar company, or $20 million company, and you can stay within that million dollars year after year after year, that's maintaining, but you're actually losing ground because you've had to recoup new clients to gain that million dollars.

So you've got some new thoughts coming in.

Just to get to that million dollar mark, where do you need to go from there?

So growth is looking at what is your your loss of customer rate, how many people you never see again, and then compared to how many you some new customers you have to get, it is always best to maintain the customers you have, if you if at all possible, it takes less money to keep a customer happy.

It takes less time to engage them and move forward.

And if you want to grow, then you can ascertain how much growth you want to have, 1020, 30% but you determine that based on what your ability is.

Let's say you've got a group of sales people, and you know that you budgeted that everybody's going to sell a million dollars a year.

Well, every sales company is every salesman is only selling around 700,000 so each one of them's got the capacity to sell 300,000 more dollars.

And so what does that look like if they everybody maxed out a million dollars?

How does that generate your leads to get them to help to do that?

How do they need to generate leads to get there?

And then.

What is your back office growth look like at the same time?

And so good, healthy growth is a balance of growing your revenue and maintaining your operational capacity to achieve that growth at the same time.

One of the most dangerous times is too much growth too fast.

Everybody says, Doug, you're crazy.

You know, I can grow 50% in a year.

I go, that's fantastic.

And I hope you never do because in year two, you'll lose 60% 70% because you're not ready for that.

You know, now, if I have hired everybody and kept up with the growth and kept of the customer service and all that kind of stuff, great on you.

If you've got the cash flow to do that, and you've got the training specific ability behind you, have the training ability behind you to do that and really looking forward, then yeah, Grow.

Grow like crazy.

But good, consistent growth takes time and money and energy to do it, and forethought when we build strategies.

That's what I look at.

So from my chair, I want sustainable growth.

I want something that I know it.

And I hate to say this, but it's true, whatever plan we put together, within two to three years, I know that we can back off on some of the traditional ad spend that we're doing, because now we've got it going and it's humming along.

We can it's more marketing, a little bit less advertising and or more intentional advertising, and not as much broad stroke.

So we can save the client money over time.

Once a strategy is in place and they we can get to the sustainable model at first.

There's got to be that.

We need to kick it off, and there's always a big jump start, and then all of a sudden, it takes probably four to six months, it kicks in, and then, oh my gosh, we're growing.

And then we have to find that sweet spot of all right?

Well, we have to back off the pedal here a little bit, because Can y'all handle?

How much growth can you really handle at one time?

Because at some point, service suffers.

You know, you're not Amazon, not everybody's not everybody can just throw money at it and just hire 1000 more employees.

Yeah, well, that's it.

And then looking at what that looked like in that sustainability model, and how you deal with the operations and the finance mind, that's the reason why having the processes in place that is replicable, that you can continue to do it with the least talented person on your team, and they've got to be able to do it every time and time again and and that's how you're able to sustain it.

If you're able to reproduce that, then that way you just hire somebody else say, Hey, this is a process.

Go forth and do it accomplish and make tons of money for yourself and for us as well.

That's right.

Good point.

Last question, we talked a little bit about planning at high level.

One other thing I want to touch on to make sure we cover is budgeting.

I'm not even just talking about marketing budgets, talking about a business budget, like more time if they don't have a marketing budget, I'm pretty sure they don't have a business budget either.

You know.

So how often do you see that problem?

On a very regular basis?

Do I see that from a coaching perspective, good companies will have a budget.

And what a budget does?

It allows you to plan where you spend your money and allows you to plan on the amount of profit you have the following year.

Nobody likes to pay taxes, but nobody also wants to go in the red not to pay taxes.

They want to be a little bit of money and work for that, or you plan for it, and you put a bunch of money in to pay your taxes and plan for the profit.

That's what a budget does.

It allows you to give a month to month, or at the very least quarterly, view as to how you're standing.

And so when it comes to the end of the year, you're not surprised.

Like, what do you mean?

I lost 100,000 or I made a quarter of a million this year.

Yeah, you know, you don't know which way to go until you get your from, from information, from your county and and that's huge.

So the budget is critical to helping you understand and manage the business, instead of business managing you.

Now, I've seen businesses be highly successful and never have a budget.

So we'll have some people on here go, Ah, I've done this for 30 years.

I've never had a budget.

Well, imagine how good you would have been if you didn't know where you were spending your money from year to year, and how much more you'd have as a business owner today, and and that's what I encourage people to do, is just look at it, analyze it, and decide if could it help my business moving forward?

Could I budget better?

And could I help control expenses and know when I need to generate revenue and where I need to do that, and also, if you're a larger business, good budgeting and good oversight will keep embezzlement from happening and keep people from stealing from you too, and that's really a crucial thing for a lot of businesses.

I've had acquaintances that have stolen money from businesses because they had to do in that and in several different cities in several different states and, and that's part of that budgeting process that you see and, and that's how, that's how it works.

Unfortunately, people are not going to get and I joke to tell people, I said, if I can get my hands on about 600 million at one time and one failed swoop, you better be sitting.

In the seat next to me, because I might have to take it and so, just joking, I can, I can back that up.

I see the same thing from my side.

Marketing.

People get to see a lot of things under the hood, you know.

And I've seen a lot of embezzlement.

I've seen people just fall asleep at the wheels, what I call it, not paying attention.

They have no idea.

You can ask a person, hey, that was a big project you worked on.

What was your profit on it?

They don't know.

No clue.

That's a big red flag, yeah.

And the other red flag is, if you're working with an accountant and they're doing your bookkeeping every month and stuff like that, and you ask them, send an email, say, hey, I want to see my monthly statements.

If they don't give them to you, say, I want to start seeing monthly reports on this, and they don't give it to you, that should be a huge red flag.

Immediately.

You should have concern of who's who's who's got your money and who doesn't.

So, yeah, so, so just understand where the red flags are.

Been there.

Done that.

Got the t shirt.

Let's put it.

That's never fun.

That's not a t shirt you want?

No, sir, no.

So I want to.

I asked everything I wanted to know what I think listeners want to hear.

But is there any other insights you want to add before we wrap up?

Is there anything we didn't cover?

Yeah, just, you know, coaching is extremely personal and extremely knowledgeable, where they have to get into your business life.

But also, when it comes to coaching, some of your personal life is going to blend in there as well.

So you're going to have to have that comfort and that trust level to share the information that they need to be there if you are not ready to be completely open and honest about your financial financials, your work habits, what you're doing within your company, how your profit sharing is going, what your internal culture are, and everything you could possibly think out about Your business, then you need to hold off hiring a coach.

Be prepared to answer those questions when you hire a coach, find one.

You can hire somebody come in and meet with the coach for an hour for free, in most cases, to get to know them a little bit, find out who they are as person, and then move forward with something along those lines, if you feel comfortable with them and and that's my biggest advice in any coaching relationship, is you've got it's very personal, and every personality is different.

And I tell everybody that you know, I'm a specific time kind of coach, my personality is, is one way.

It may not jive with what you've got going on, and that's okay, but there's another guy or another woman out there that may be the perfect match for you, and that's where you need to go.

So find that perfect match.

And in my last statement is, remember a coach is for a sporting team.

The role of a coach for sporting team is to take a average team and turn them into regional, district, regional and state champions.

You know, anybody can take a high performing Class A people and turn them into state champions.

That's the easy thing.

A good coach takes those individuals abilities and makes them better.

And that's what a business coach should do for you.

It should take what you're the great things you're doing in your business right now today, and turn it into something that's more profitable, more fun, and to give you more time as an owner, free up your time where you can enjoy life a little bit better and more succinct, and just maybe go fishing or whatever your passion play golf, you know, one one day a week, instead of that 70 hours a week that we all tend to work as business owners.

And how do you enjoy life?

And that's what a coach can do for you.

Now, of course, my mindset, you stopped at states.

I wanted you to go to Nationals, because I've coached, I've coached sports.

No, we're going like we're going for it.

That's exactly right, the World Series.

I mean, we watched College World Series.

Just go there.

Quick, short, little thing.

Just to close this out, a while back, I was people were kicking my tires.

To coach high school.

I played a sport.

I played volleyball competitively, 30 years ago.

I've coached since then.

So somebody introduced me to a certain high school, I won't say who, because they'll feel bad.

And the athletic director, the athletic director, and I were having a conversation about it, and he was asking me questions, and he actually laid out, because I don't want to say which county, but you can kind of figure it all out.

And he said, in this county, we don't have a team in any of the schools that'll ever go to Nationals.

And I went, I said, ever?

Because that sounds like a challenge, you know, because I'm that person.

He said, We barely get the states.

It's very it's rare.

And like, we just.

We can't pull the talent.

We don't have the pool of kids.

I was like, You're not believing in the possibility that you put a certain group of people in the room together, and you put somebody leading them and guiding them.

Anybody can get there, anybody can win on any given day, right?

And he's like, No, you'll see, you'll see, I say.

So I actually walked away going, I don't really want to coach for this school, because me and him are going to butt heads all the time.

Because my mindset is going to with these kids is going to be, hey, we're going to states, you know, and here's, here's the steps we're going to do to get there.

I mean, I've played nationals twice as many years ago, you know, I know what it takes to get there.

Give me some credit and let me give me the tools to get there.

But if you've already made the decision, this is where bad leadership comes in, clearly, we're not going there.

You know, like, one of my favorite books is Andy Stanley's visioneering, right?

Great Book sound if you ever read it, and that a leader has to guide the ship in a direction.

Has to cast the vision of where you're going.

And here's this person casting the vision that we're gonna like, you know, plummet.

We're working.

We're going down the blaze of glory.

So what?

Where does that leave you?

Yeah, what the difference between management leadership motivates and inspires and takes people just like you were talking about, takes them to the level that they had no idea they could get to a manager just manages the day to day.

They look at the project, say, they go, yes, we manage from A to B, you know, like a manager would be a volleyball coach.

Yeah, we got a game today.

We're gonna manage this thing.

You're gonna be the setter.

You're gonna be the and, but the leader comes in and inspires him this we just have to work with this team.

We're going to do this so we can get to national Let's go.

Let's go, conquer the world.

And that's the difference between leadership and management.

And most CEOs are involved in management and not the leadership side of it, but you can find those leaders, and when you do, hang on to them, because they are a gym to have when they can do both manage and inspire people to move forward, and a coach can help you get there.

Well, that closes us out really well, because how I look at you not know getting to know you better and better as we're building relationship is that's what you're doing to the people that are their CEOs of these companies, you're empowering them to go out and do exactly that, and outside looking in, that's how I see it.

I think you do a great job.

I would highly recommend Doug Everhart to anyone that I'm doing business with.

He is a consummate professional.

If you haven't figured that out from our conversation today, you need to learn a little bit more about him.

So Doug, how can they do that?

Can you please be shameless for a second, share your contact information so that they can reach you directly?

Yeah, you can actually send an email to me.

It's Doug at everheart strategies.com Doug at everheart strategies.com and my phone number is 86441599908644159990, and you can text or Kyle, either one, I'll be happy to get in touch with you.

And please feel free to visit my website at ever art strategies, and that gives you more insight into who I am and what I do accomplish within the coaching world.

So thank you so much.

This has been a great, enjoy, great I just finished my cup of coffee, so we're gonna have to wrap up.

Are you home today?

Are you are you in Kentucky?

Are you in Nashville?

Plane?

I'm both, yes, I will be home for a little while, and then I will be in Nashville this afternoon plane.

I've got, a matter of fact, a strategic plan.

I'm working with one of my clients with and trying to work with them.

So, so yeah, I'm looking forward to that.

I love strategic planning.

Yeah, me too, when it's taken seriously, yeah, I agree, yeah, that's it, yeah.

Well, thank you again for the time today.

Doug, I appreciate you being on listeners.

Thank you so much for being a part of us today.

I hope you took away some nuggets.

Reach out to Doug.

If you need help.

Every business needs some kind of help.

Everyone.

Everybody needs their different categories.

You just have to get to the place of knowing that you have that need and identifying it.

Happy if you can't reach him directly, I'm happy to help you do that, by the way, if you want to ask questions about this show, you can type them.

You can reach out to us at marketing perspective, there's multiple ways that you can reach us, and you'll see it at the end of the show.

Please do that and ask any questions you want.

And I can get them to Doug, and Doug will happily answer any of your questions.

You know me, I'm going to do the same thing for a marketing question.

I'm happy to answer it.

Don't feel like you can't ask a question.

Get I mean, if you need bigger help, fine, there's people here for you.

If you're in another state, it's we both work all over the country, so I don't think we have any limitation.

We're happy to at least talk to you and take it from there.

Thank you so much for listening today.

Doug again, thank you for being on I look forward to our next show, and we'll see you again on the marketing perspective.

Thank you.

You.