Greetings and welcome back to Moving Right Along, a Muppet Movie podcast brought to you by toughpigs.com.

This is the podcast where we watch Muppet Treasure Island 2 minutes at a time usually, and talk about it a lot.

I'm your host, Ryan Rowe.

I'm your other host, Anthony Strand.

And today we have a return guest, one of our favorite guest.

If you have ever listened to this podcast before his chances are you have heard him Guest.

Please tell us who you are.

It's your old pal Hennis Comma Joe.

Talk about Muppets with my two best Bros.

And it's 3 and 4.

Visited the bed and boat in for five and six.

He brought me back again.

Now we're here at the end of the movie where life for Tim Curry ain't so groovy.

He paddled off in that leaky boat.

Shouldn't have that.

Shouldn't have trusted that dimwit goat.

And now we're talking about the credits.

Oh man, more reading.

Heavenly already taken this beating.

Got to see some names.

They all have families.

Maybe one of them is Timothy Chalamet.

Sing along with love power.

Ziggy Marly's creation.

Was he Marley and Marley no relation?

Let me wrap this up.

Finish my freestyle and Anthony can finally finish with Muppet Treasure Island.

I'm just jazzed to be here, right where I belong, on the penultimate episode of Moving Right Along.

There it is, our last episode with a guest.

This was the last opportunity to have a guest come in with a wrap and then you did not disappoint.

I I was just so jealous of everyone who did a rap on this season, and I was on the season so early that I, I, it didn't even occur to me to do 1.

I did my surprise rap the first time you were on.

All right.

Right, yes, exactly.

But I didn't know it was going to be like a thing and not the thing.

And then I spent so much time writing this rap that I didn't like take notes on the actual clips, so oops, whoops.

I don't even remember who actually sort of set the precedent of it being.

It was Genie.

It was JD.

OK.

'Cause he, 'cause he said in his episode, it's a requirement for.

Oh, right.

This is now required of every.

Yes, yes, yes, that's right.

OK.

Well done.

This was for you JDI.

Dedicate my rap to you JD and.

You rhymed.

Was it family with Chalamet?

Yes, I did pretty good.

So today we are not just talking about two minutes like usual, we are almost at the end of the movie.

And today we're talking about minutes 93 and 94 and 95 and 96 of Muppet Treasure Island in which the rats find something underwater and the credits roll.

But Please note that this is not our last episode of the season because Anthony and I will be back next week to wrap things up.

So they're they're still more fun credits to talk about.

I already told everybody that because I used the word penultimate in my rap song.

Yeah, good job.

Most people, I think, probably don't know what that word means, though I've seen that word used.

They do now.

This is an educational podcast.

Are we going to teach the kids?

I would guess that most listeners to a podcast hosted by you and me where we watch Muppet movies 2 minutes at a time do in fact know what the word.

Penultimate.

The problem is that the word penultimate no longer means what it means.

Like people hear ultimate and it's like, yeah, the ultimate.

I mean, the first, the example that comes to mind is in that book A Year at the Movies by Kevin Murphy, when he talked about going to the concession stand and ordering ultimate nachos, which was slightly alarming because ultimate in the dictionary means last.

And he was like, I hope these aren't the last nachos I eat.

I hope these nachos don't kill me.

I think, yeah, most people don't know that ultimately means last.

Therefore they don't necessarily know that penultimate means second to last.

But maybe I'm wrong.

Listeners, please let me know.

Yeah, listeners let us know.

But I think people use ultimate to mean cool, rad, super big.

But people don't use penultimate unless they mean, unless they mean.

People might misunderstand it, but I don't think people use.

I don't think people are like this is the penultimate size.

Kinds of people who would use the.

Word Yeah.

And don't get us started on anti penultimate.

That's a conversation for another time.

This is technically our anti penultimate episode about Muppet Treasure.

Island.

Oh, that's true.

Bonus episode about the sing along.

That's true, yes.

So stay tuned.

So Big Snort will make his appearance.

Oh yeah, that's a good piece.

Who's big snores?

Keep listening to find out.

Anyway, these minutes began with the rats who we saw last week.

They are underwater.

Some of them are scuba diving.

Some of them are riding around on what appeared to be rat sized jet skis.

I don't think you're actually, I don't think you can take those things like all the way underwater.

Humans can't.

Humans can't.

That's how things were in the 1800s, you know, that's.

Great.

Of course, back in the Yeah, there's also some fish, I don't know if you mentioned last week, some fish swimming around that appeared to be real fish.

That's a cool touch.

Makes it look more like it's really the ocean.

I really like that we that we end on the rats here.

Like we've talked over and over about how they're the best thing about this movie in my opinion.

And so it's fun that we get that like that's that's basically what we close on before the credits start is like who gets the treasure?

The rats.

Yeah, yeah.

Among several things that I have gained even more appreciation for in this movie, the rats are at the top of the list, I think.

Yeah, everybody loves the rats.

Well, and you want people to like leave your movie with like that feeling of like, oh, what a great, what a great experience that I had.

And like, the best way to do that is by like putting one of the best things right there at the very end.

So like, forget all that, you know, nonsense that you just spent the last two hours watching.

Look the rats.

They're underwater.

Look at the dude.

Scuba stuff doesn't love that.

Yeah, they're gonna, they're going to be able to afford so many more cruises.

Oh yeah, that's I guess we're assuming they're going to keep that treasure for themselves, like finders keepers.

They're not going to give that to Captain Smollett.

Yeah, they don't work for him.

But how are they going to get it back?

Back onto the ship or back home?

No, like back home.

Because like, that means they're either taking the treasure onto the Hispaniola where like everyone else is like, oh, hey, treasure, great, let's maybe have some of that, or they're gonna have to find another way home, you know what I mean?

Maybe they can jet ski all the way home.

They could, yeah, Tie all of their jet skis to the treasure chest and pull it behind them back to Bristol.

So the steel drum arrangement of Sailing for Adventure that we've been hearing now gives way to a new song.

This is Love Power by Ziggy Marley and the Melody Makers.

Ziggy Marley is the son of reggae singer Bob Marley and this was his band the Melody Makers, that he worked with until 2002.

He continues to record as a solo artist.

His first real name is David, and according to Wikipedia, the nickname Ziggy was sometimes reported to have been given to him by his father.

And it means Little Spliff.

That would be an interesting nickname to give to your son, yeah.

I thought Ziggy was was a reference to that guy who stands in the complaint line.

See.

Yeah, I'm too.

Short then I was wondering like, wait a minute, Ziggy the the comic strip character?

Does his name mean Little Spliff?

But but Ziggy, the comic strip character was originally drawn by Tom Wilson and is now drawn by Tom Wilson too, the son of the original.

So.

So which is a father son legacy just like Ziggy Marley.

Wow, it's exactly like that.

Didn't we talk about this the last time I was on your podcast?

Was that with you?

Talk about Ziggy and not I was with me.

Ziggy at length with somebody I couldn't remember.

If it was anyone good, I.

Mean, I may just be internalizing it like I just listened to it and thought I was in the room.

But I know that we talked about Mort Walker on the spot.

Yeah.

So we could talk about Ziggy then.

But anyways, do you think, do you think Ziggy Marley got involved in this?

Because it it there's that joke about his dad Robert Marley in the 1st in the previous movie.

It never occurred to me until taking notes on these two minutes, but maybe I don't know how we would confirm that.

I guess we could ask Brian Henson somehow, but yeah, yeah, that seems possible.

Are you, I'm sorry, are you saying that it's possible that that the Marley brothers were one of them was named Bob Marley?

Is that what you're saying?

That is, That is Brian Hanson or Jerry Jeweler, who, like makers of the film, are on record as saying.

That's why his name is Robert Marlin.

That's why.

Oh sure, yeah, you know, but you but but in my but.

Well, in my rap though I said no relation.

Right.

It was Orion and you are technically so you guys.

Know everyone knows, yes.

Sorry, your rap just went by so fast and I was just so just marveling at your, your flow that I, I didn't absorb all of the useful information in the rap.

That's, but that's what wraps are best for, you know?

It's it was my real Hamilton moment.

That's great.

Yeah, absolutely.

But Ziggy Marley himself later explained that he chose the nickname himself because of David Bowie's Ziggy Stardust album.

His name is David, and David Bowie's name is David.

Right.

Oh yeah.

And the original name of the Ziggy Stardust album was Spliff Stardust Little Spliff.

Little spliff Stardust.

And David Bowie was in a movie directed by a Henson.

That's true.

Wow.

More father, more father son shenanigans.

Has Duncan Jones ever worked with The Muppets or the Hensons?

I don't think so.

No, I don't think so.

And Duncan Jones was named after a yo-yo, I believe.

Is that?

True.

No, I wouldn't believe you if you said that.

That's like, I mean, she name our child.

True, but should we name our beloved new baby?

And they look around the room and they see a kid in the hall playing with the Duncan Yoyo.

There is a music video for this song, Love Power, which includes footage, new footage of The Muppets made especially for the video.

Kermit wears dreadlocks in the video, which is probably not something they would do.

Yeah, there's a little gag where he's like.

Just like Adrian Brody on Saturday Night Live, yeah.

Yeah, but not that bad.

There's a gag where Kermit is like like flipping his head back and forth, dancing to the music and then the dreadlocks like get stuck on one side of his head and he makes a little face.

Any thoughts on this song?

I like it.

It's, it's a good, I think a good bouncy song to to go out with.

It I it is.

It's pleasant.

It's I Yeah.

I only remember love power.

A little love power.

That's the only lyrics I could tell you.

Stronger than the hurricane?

Doing other stuff with a ring.

Yeah.

Yeah, it's fine.

It's pleasant.

I have no.

I have no problem with.

It in my mind, I just I sing love power, little love power.

Let's get together and feel all right.

And just mixing my Marley songs.

Sure, yeah.

Like, that's that's what plays because I don't know the song quite so well.

This song is not on repeat on my iPod, you know what I mean?

You don't listen to it that often, so that's that's what I hear in my mind.

I think the song is kind of nothing.

I'm not a huge reggae fan, so that doesn't help.

But it doesn't feel like anything from the movie.

It doesn't feel Muppity to me, I think.

That's why I like I think I.

Like someone who like, didn't really work on the movie at all.

I think it's supposed to feel oceany.

Yeah, it's an island song.

Yes.

And it's I like that.

It's a sure conventional choice for a Muppet Movie.

Sure.

I, I, I get that.

I, I think I would have preferred if it was something, something that I, I don't, I don't think I care about like tying something into the movie thematically as much as I do tying something into The Muppets.

You know what I mean?

What if it were some of the Muppet Pirates singing Cheeseburger in Paradise?

I would have loved that.

I would love to hear the the pirates singing their own song or even like, I don't know, like something like if the rats were singing a song at the end or like if it was another like version of the I know we're going to talk about this a little bit later.

But the those giant tiki heads, you know, if we brought them back because they were such a highlight from the the first part of the movie or I don't know what it just like it felt like I don't know, the soundtrack wasn't long enough.

So let's Commission someone to make a song and we'll just play it over the credits and then we'll put on this on the the cassette.

Soundtrack, right?

I actually did have this on CD.

This is probably an early CD purchase for me because my family took a long time to go to CD player, but it would have been fun.

You're right to have the rats get a full song at the end.

I don't know exactly what that song would be or what it would be about, but that would be fun.

One other one of the complaints about this song, I, I get a little frustrated with songs that don't really mean anything.

And it's like, oh, it's love power, you know, you know, love power.

It's the power.

It's the power of of love.

It.

It's just a little bit of it, Yeah.

So are you suggesting like it has no power meaningless?

I'm suggesting that the power I'm I'm suggesting that Huey Lewis already said everything we need to know about the power of love.

It's a it's a curious thing.

Makes one man weep.

Sure is.

That's that's the chap.

Yeah, yeah.

That's.

Also in a movie.

It's just too darn loud.

Back to the Future rules.

Let's watch that.

OK, I'm I'm pretty sure somebody's already done it Back to the Future Minute at a Time podcast, but.

Probably it's called 88 minutes per hour.

I don't know what it's called.

Something like.

That it's called 1.21 minutes there it.

Is there?

It is, yeah.

Yeah.

What if it was?

They they watch, they watch it 1.21 minutes at a time that.

Would rule.

You have, yeah, there's got, there's so many references to time.

There's so many possibilities for the title of a Back to the Future Minute at a Time podcast.

So while this song is playing, there's still this rope in the center of the frame.

Last week we saw the rats lowering a hook at the end of it, and now they are pulling the rope up.

It takes a while, but I guess whatever's down there is was way down there at the bottom of the ocean.

And now we do see what they've caught.

It's a treasure chest.

It's overflowing with coins and jewelry.

So good for them.

And then something I always love to see at the end of a movie, The words, the end.

Yeah, same.

Yeah, I always love to see it.

Not enough movies these days have the end at the end.

How do we know that the movie's over?

Never know, it just shows the title.

Yeah, that's what it is now, yeah.

Yeah, like you go see a movie and it just comes up and it's like, oh, I've been watching Deadpool and Wolverine.

I didn't know what this picture was.

Yeah, I know.

Yeah, weirdly so often now they don't even have the title at the beginning, right?

How do you know if you've walked into the right theater?

Yeah.

How many Muppet movies have the end at the end?

Like I know there's the end of the Muppet movie and I know there's one in the the fireworks at the end of The Muppets 2011 movie.

Do the other movies have the end?

Yeah, we talked about this.

I don't remember if it's all of them, but it's definitely most of them.

Yeah, I don't.

I don't think Christmas Carol does, does it?

It just has not.

If you like that, you should read the book.

And then you think it's just the credits I'm.

Not sure.

I'm yeah, I don't know.

I'm trying to see it in my hand.

Should we go check?

I just, I can't picture it.

Oh, and they, they, I, I can't picture it for Manhattan or or Caper either.

Manhattan.

Doesn't it spell out the end?

Oh they do.

Then Carmen and Piggy are on the moon like after they're.

You're right.

Yeah, Yeah.

Like it writes it out like the like Tinkerbell kind of like.

Right.

It's spelling out the the letters, yeah.

Well, I wanted to mention something about the this this rope and and treasure chest.

So I I was not here last week, so I had I'm just watching this clip cold and I'd forgotten that.

Like you see the hook go all the way down first, which you guys I'm sure talked about last week.

So this time it's like just seeing the rope.

And I thought for a minute that something was wrong with the screen.

Like it was a like a tracking issue.

But this line just kind of zig like, like, you know, 'cause it's not perfectly steady, but it's also not like waving around a bunch.

It just, it doesn't feel deliberate.

And then I don't know, what do you.

So what do you think is lifting up this very heavy chest of gold?

You know, like whenever the top.

Yeah.

Well, yeah, do the rats have a a jolly boat?

Because then that's probably what they're going to use to get the treasure home.

But yeah, it would be heavy, especially for rats.

So yeah, they got to have some kind of boat or I don't know, maybe Sweden's is up there helping them pull it up.

I hope so.

Yeah, I don't know.

Yeah, he's buddies with the rats.

Yeah, right.

I just checked on Disney Plus and they do.

It does have the end at the at the end of Christmas Carol, right after, right after.

If you like this, you should read the book The Young Comes Up.

Good that that puts my mind at ease.

And then it goes into the reprise of It Feels Like Christmas.

Yeah, the one that I'm that I'd be least certain about is Muppets from Space, but I guess we'll find out next season.

Yeah.

Can't wait.

I'm excited.

Can't.

Wait to hear you guys talk about text on the screen.

That's my favorite.

I'm a librarian, so that's my favorite activity topic.

You do love text you.

You.

You love words.

I'm a words, a word, a word Fen word orphan.

Is that your way of saying word fiend?

We're supposed to be word fan.

Oh yeah, of course, obviously.

Better better a word fin than a Plagueman.

Hey guys, so I still I still have Mr.

Plagueman, I still have Muppet Christmas Carol running on my iPad.

Guess see if you can guess what Disney Plus says.

You may also like.

See if you can guess.

Muppet Treasure Island?

Oh man.

Oh, are you referring to something that's not Muppets?

It is not Muppets, it is not Christmas Carol, it is not Christmas themed.

Is it Deadpool and Wolverine?

No, it is.

Is it night?

No, that just came out.

They've been pushing that.

I think.

I think technically.

That's a Hulu.

Thing I don't know if that would show.

Up yeah, but it's but if you have the Hulu, if you have the Hulu Disney book bundle now it's all on there.

But no, it is Spidey and his amazing Friends season 1 episode 8 Rocket rhino slash Trick or trace E OK what an episode of Spidey is amazing friend watching not even the 1st episode.

Let's watch it and see if there's if there's Muppet references in it.

Yeah, kids like Muppet Christmas Carol, kids like Spidey, you know?

And yeah, and Miles likes that show.

So like, we've certainly watched it on the account before.

Yeah, there you go.

But I have not seen it, although every time I go to CiCi's Pizza it is playing on the TV's at.

CiCi's Pizza.

I mean, here's the thing about that show.

It's cute, but it's also just one of these like PJ Masks or sure, a bunch of identical cartoons that all have the same character designs and they're just like about a group of kids, like using gadgets or whatever and like not like.

Conflict, but very low.

Yeah.

Tension.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, Green Goblin has pumpkin pranks, you know.

Of course did did.

Spidey and his amazing friends have like an episode about Uncle Ben dying in his arms.

No, I don't think so.

He does live with.

He does live with his Aunt May though.

OK.

And, and how old is Aunt May?

Is she is she elderly like like in the original movies?

Or no, she's like a she's like a Tomei.

Marissa Tomei.

Yeah, she she's younger than that.

Is there an episode where the green Joblin pranks Gwen Stacy?

Well, probably.

And Gwen's one of the leads, so yes.

OK, she's she's ghost spider.

Oh, as ghost spider.

That's one of the amazing.

Friends.

Yes, Right.

Yes.

It's Gwen is.

That what happened in the comics?

Was that just a prank that he pulled on her?

I mean, to him it was.

I guess, well, according to man Michael Straczynski, it was so.

Well, we don't.

We're not talking to that guy.

And now, the moment we've all been waiting for end credits.

Yes.

But hey, we start with the Muppet performers.

We love those guys.

Yeah, I love that.

I think this is probably well, no, this is this can't be the same order as Christmas Carol because two of these guys were not in that movie.

We have in order Dave Gold, Steve Whitmire, Jerry Nelson, Kevin Clash, Bill Beretta and Frank is gets the special and credit.

So can I say one thing about the closing credits font in this movie?

Yeah, I was so glad I was gonna bring this up.

Please go.

Yeah.

Are you talking about the letter V?

Yeah, Joe.

Yeah, the letter V in this movie looks very much like AB, the way that it's it's supposed to look like, you know, old, old antique bookman style or whatever.

But it wouldn't be that big of a deal except that three of these six performers have VS in their first name.

So.

So basically it looks like Dave Goals, Steve Whitmire and Kevin Clash.

You know, Am I wrong?

Wait, maybe?

You're 100% right, yeah.

Maybe it's different puppeteers, maybe it's not Dave and Steve and Kevin.

It's Dave Kevin who worked on this movie.

And yeah, I mean, I consider myself like a a very minor font nerd.

I'm sure there are people who are like really into fonts.

I like fonts and I like caring about fonts and I'm, I like, I have you ever seen like the Photoshop work that I've done for tough pigs, especially like the stuff that where it's like movie poster parodies, like I do my very best to match fonts because I feel like that's important.

And I can't imagine doing something like this, especially for a kids movie where like, you know, you want the kids to like, see these words on the screen and be able to read them where you would take you, you were you wouldn't be taking so much care to make sure that they're like as legible as possible.

Yeah.

It's illegible and I thought this was supposed to be a kids movie.

But anyway, good for Bill Beretta, especially for getting his name in this this main group of Muppet performers because this is so early in his time with the Muppet.

This is his first movie as we mentioned.

I mean, you know, like he's got a couple of characters that like have a lot of screen time.

So it'd be weird if it if it wasn't like is there anyone that that puppeteered on this movie?

Maybe not even as much as Bel Beretta, but like that that was significant that didn't get their name in the in this part of the credits.

I don't think there is.

No, not with that role as clueless.

Those those six guys have pretty much all the speaking parts except for Sweetums, right?

John Henson and Sweetums.

Yeah, and if you like minor hot stuff, lines by pirates here and there.

Louise Gold has a few lines right early on, things like that, but yeah.

But you're right.

And then, yeah, the rest of the credits, yay.

We don't need to go over every person credited here, obviously.

Well, and and so many of these are people back from Christmas Carol like it, a lot of them.

It really must have been like a reunion on the set.

Oh yeah.

Because.

They're going back to to England.

They're yeah, using a lot of the same crew.

I noticed the next person after the performers was second unit director David Lane.

He has the same credit on Superman, Superman 3, Supergirl and Superman 4.

The quest for peace.

And Santa Claus the movie which is the Sulkins like attempt to make a Superman movie about Santa Claus.

Right, and which I believe Brian Henson worked on as one of the reindeer puppeteers, which was something to do with him working on this.

But I would love to know why he skipped Superman too.

I do.

Want to correct you on one thing though.

His name is actually David Lane according to these, not.

David, right, of course.

David Lane, I thought you were going to say Ziggy.

Yeah, his name is Ziggy Lane.

That's his.

Nickname.

His friends call him Ziggy Lane.

That's what his friends call it.

Means a little spliff.

A little.

Spliff Lane, Yeah.

No, but it's funny that he worked on all those Superman movies.

And yeah, his last name is Lane.

That's Lois's name.

Whoa, I didn't even think about that.

Yeah.

So he was.

Yeah, that's.

Sam Lane's brother, the perfect.

That's Lois's.

Perfect second unit director for for Superman movies.

Yeah, but yeah, it's weird that he didn't work on two, although, you know, it's one of those things where he probably did work on footage shot for the first movie that's in Superman 2.

Yeah, especially because, yeah, so much of what's in the second movie was filmed at the same time as the first one.

In that case, yeah.

Superman 2 is like a weird Frankenstein's monster of a movie, so that's probably why he didn't work on it.

You know, like Richard Lester brought in different people for that second.

That's very likely, yeah.

The puppet coordinator is Kevin Clash.

I assume this is the same thing as the puppet captain, like sort of assigning assigning puppets to various puppeteers?

Probably, and we're going to see a little bit later, that assistant puppet coordinator was Nigel Plaskett.

Well, that's the next thing I have in my notes.

Yeah.

Because then we have the cast credits.

But we've kind of talked about most of those people.

But yeah.

I do have one quick thing about the cast credits though, is Oh yeah.

And this is more of a question for you guys because this happened in when you guys talked about the end credits of Muppet Christmas Carol, is that there was like, weird, like, like, weren't there like characters missing and like a weird, like, some characters were credited as their character name and some as their Muppet name, You know what I'm talking about.

Yeah.

And so I was wondering if you guys spotted anything here that was similar, You know what I mean?

Like obviously, you know, we've got, we've got the like, you know, Piggy, Fozzie, Kermits, Bunsen and Beaker, like they're they all have their Muppet names and knots, you know, Captain, Oh my God, Smollett's and Benjamin Agon and etcetera, etcetera.

So I don't know, like obviously some thought was put into that.

Yeah, I didn't actually wasn't looking out for that.

So I don't know.

I don't have an answer to that.

Anthony, did you notice?

I did not notice.

OK, well.

Well, let's notice now, together as a family.

Are you gonna, are you going back through it, Anthony?

No, no, it's OK.

No.

No, I still have Christmas Carol running.

Oh, I can, I can pull it up.

I was thinking about going back and looking at the Christmas Carol credits to compare.

I have a couple of notes about this.

In the meantime, Frank, did you notice the Muppet performers?

All are just it will say Dave goals and then it says Konzo fonts and Honeydew, whatever.

And then it says Steve Whitmire and there's no space until you get down to Frank Oz.

There's a space between Kevin Clash and Frank Oz.

Like the performers are all just like in a row and then Frank has a little space in between.

To set them off.

I assume that's similar to the and credit where it's yeah, distinguishing him as yeah, because he's.

Do you think that was in his contract?

Oh, definitely.

Actually, he's like, I got a space.

Yeah, he's very important.

He's like I directed Indian in the cupboard.

By that logic, when in Muppets Most Wanted, when Constantine says my name's Space bar, space bar, Space bar, your name, it's he's actually saying no, no, your name's really important.

You get 3 old.

Spaces.

Wow, I guess.

Yeah, Constantine didn't really think that through.

He's never been involved in Hollywood contract negotiation.

That's true.

Interesting.

And then the other thing is under the human credit.

So we have the four main humans first at the top, Kevin Bishop, Tim Curry, Billy Connolly and Jennifer Saunders, and then the mother performers.

And then the other humans who have speaking parts right are are Easy Pete's and our Calico Jerry's and so on, who are credited under those names in the closing credits.

They aren't just listed as pirate, which I think is interesting.

Yeah, good.

But then also Jerry Nelson gets a second credit as Butler.

It is.

It is not listed under his characters with his Muppet performances.

OK.

Well, yeah, that makes sense.

That's an on screen role.

That's different.

Yeah, but Jerry Nelson is not credited in Great Muppet Caper, where he also has a line, you know.

Yeah, that's interesting.

It is interesting that some of the pirates are not credited.

You said it's the one with the ones with speaking lines.

So, but like you do have Captain Flint gets a gets a credit, even though Captain Flint, we never hear him speak.

But then, but Bug face baby eating O'Brien is not here.

Even though she technically has a line.

Even though it's not her voice.

Yeah, yeah.

Is Black Eyed pea credited?

Yes, he is.

Yeah.

OK.

Only four of the the pirates are credited, not counting Captain Flint.

And then that we got the Butler and that's it.

Those are the only humans besides the celebrities that are that are credited here.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, that makes sense, I think, because yeah, those are the pirates that we kind of with for the the whole movie.

But in the end, now I'm trying to think, yeah, other than like extras in the the Bristol scene or maybe at the Tavern, there's not really anybody else, right?

Yeah, yeah.

Are there only four pirates, 4 human pirates on the ship?

That's that's the part that like, I feel like there's a bunch of them.

Maybe there's only four of them.

Calico, Jerry.

Easy, Pete.

Shortstack Stevens.

And who's the other one?

Yeah.

Short test, Steve.

Oh yeah, he's.

Black Eyed Pea.

Black Eyed Pea.

Yeah, yeah.

Those are the four that are that are, yeah.

Yeah, like I'm looking, I'm looking at Cabin Fever now, the song.

And we got the big group shot.

Oh yeah, the whole, the whole crew at the end and Fozzie Bear.

There he is.

Not a human.

And and Mudwell, the mud mud Bunny, he's human, right?

That's a human actor.

He's a he's a human man in my heart.

Here we go.

Yeah, there's only the looks like 3 humans at the back.

I don't think Short Stack Stevens is there.

Oh wow.

So yeah.

Well, so.

So it's just bug eating O'Brien that got left out.

Right.

Yeah, like that's kind of sad.

Give her a credit you cowards.

Yeah, I don't know why they didn't.

Yeah, especially because it would have been funny in the movie theater to see the name Big Fat Ugly bug face Baby Eating O'Brien in the closing credits.

Yes, you know.

Yes.

And her name escapes me, but we did mention The Who played that character when we covered that scene on the podcast.

So then we have assistant puppeteer coordinator Nigel Plaskett.

We've probably talked about him before, but he's a British puppeteer.

He's worked on a bunch of Muppet and Henson productions filmed in the UK, including Tale of the Bunny, Picnic, Labyrinth, Muppet Christmas Carol, Secret Life of Toys, Moppetop Shop.

Yeah, he was.

He was.

He was mew on Secret Life of Toys.

To go for Steve.

Yeah, that's that's cool.

And he is.

I mean, I think they kind of all do now.

But he's one of the Muppet performers with his own gallery of characters on Muppet Wiki.

Now you can go to a page called Nigel Plaskett characters and see every character that he's ever played, all his Muppets and creatures then.

Good for him.

Yeah, so just just kind of going through the credits, noticing a few things.

Here we have Pat Garrett back, his choreographer.

She worked on Muppet Christmas Carol, one of the two people credited as assistance to Brian Henson is notable and I don't remember if if she was also in Christmas Carol, but.

She was not.

OK, it's Debbie McClellan.

She stuck around with The Muppets Henson Company for years and then eventually became the Vice president of Muppet Studio until 2019.

So good for her starting out as Brian Henson's assistant on this movie.

And Muppet Wiki says that under her credits it has Muppets from space to the first one.

So, just so Danny knows, just so Danny Horn knows I'm speaking directly to him, I'm going to edit it to add Muppet Treasure Island.

Good assistant to Ryan Henson, yes.

And then the other assistant, I just do you think?

Wait, yeah.

Do you think the other one, Francis Patterson, do you think that they're really jealous that Debbie had all this like like long lasting work with The Muppets?

Well, yeah, I don't know because.

What are where Francis is?

Yeah, she doesn't have any other Muppet credits.

She has several other credits on various movies in different capacities.

But yeah, I don't know, maybe The Muppets just wasn't her thing.

Maybe she.

I was going to say maybe, maybe like Francis ended up being, you know, vice president at Warner Brothers or something.

It's like, well, she had a great career.

Yeah, yeah.

Then I noticed a credit that says Drafts Person Toad.

I know, I saw that too.

According to indeed.com, a drafts person is a key member of a construction team that built produces buildings or items that require technical design.

They also assist different construction professionals to ensure their designs are accurate and their manufacturing plan is efficient.

So presumably this has something to do with designing and building sets.

But yeah, Toad.

Is this just a person And that's their nickname?

Is it Like a little mushroom guy from Super Mario?

Is it a a company mascot like a a real pet toad?

What'd you say?

Is it a village from the X-Men?

Oh, could be.

Do you think toads expands like those frogs expand?

I think that's a myth.

What a what?

You know, you know, meth, MYTH meth.

Oh, Oh.

Myth.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Got it.

OK, how many people are screaming at their podcasts right now?

People are going meth.

Myth.

It's a reference.

They know it.

Yeah.

Good for them.

And then we have the Muppet Workshop credits.

We like these people, too.

The project supervisor is Mark Zezotek.

I think we probably talked about him last season as well because he had a similar credit there.

Once again, he has a bunch of Muppet and Sesame Street projects on his credits, including The Animal Show, Elmo Saves Christmas, Elmo in Garage Land, The Muppets of Walt Disney World, and While You're a Cartoonist and Muppet Wiki.

Yeah, and Muppet Wiki says he designed Sherry Netherland, the Sesame Street character who managed the Furry Arms Hotel.

So good for him then.

More people.

Any other credits here?

Stick out to you workshop people.

Let's see, did I have anything else?

Like there's a lot of names that we know and they're all extremely talented and they all have families.

I I love that Fred Buckholtz is credited as Muppet stunt supervisor.

Yeah, which feels like, man, there's got to be like maybe three people in the world who've ever had that credit.

Right, Yeah.

And from what we know and what people have told us about Christmas Carol, he was responsible for a lot of the this sort of, yeah, really tricky technical tricks with with The Muppets.

So that that's a good credit for him.

Muppet stunts.

So the more credits and then wait a minute, the credits are pushed to the side of the screen because we're getting a mid credits scene.

We have Long John Silver on an I what?

Is this a Marvel movie?

Yeah, really.

Are is, is Nick Fury going to show up and tell Jim that he's putting together the The Captain initiative?

And then it's going to be like Long John Silver will return.

Yeah, well, because that's what's happening here.

He's he didn't drown.

Don't worry, folks.

He's alive.

Yeah, he's alive.

He's on an island.

I guess I always assumed that this was the same island that he swam back to, but I'm realizing that it's not necessarily.

What do you think?

You think it's the island from the opening song you mean?

The I mean the same island from the rest of the movie.

That's what I always assumed, but what do?

We see these heads on that island.

I guess it's where the treasure was buried.

Yeah, exactly.

That's why, yeah.

Yeah, we did at the beginning of the movie.

Yeah.

So I think.

Yeah, right.

Because it's a, it's a.

It's a pig tiki, which is It seems specific, but.

But also there could be other pig tribes on other islands.

That's true.

But when they're sailing to the island and we get that, that big, you know, shot, you know, the big land hose shot, it's not like there's other islands in the background.

I I presume so, yeah.

It's probably the only one that he's going to reach with that leaky boat.

Right.

Well, and then he's swimming eventually, just.

So.

Yeah, I think it's probably the same island, Right?

And he's about to enjoy a banana.

But now he might be wishing he had drowned because one of the tiki pig head statues performed by Jerry Nelson is telling him jokes, he says.

So, Johnny, may I call you Johnny?

Stop me if you've heard this one.

Why does the ocean roar?

You would, too, if you had crabs on your bottom and oysters in your bed.

And Kim Curry plays his reaction perfectly.

He's just so annoyed by the statue and this joke.

It's great.

It's so fun.

Yeah, but fortunately he does have the rest of the island, so I guess he could run away from the statue and not have to hear these jokes anymore.

Muppet Wiki has a page for this character.

His name is Sheki the Tiki, which comes from a draft of the screenplay, not the one we have.

It's a later draft, but this is pretty clearly a reference to the old timey stand up comedian Shucky Green Muppet Wiki says the original script included additional bad material, such as asking what sound a Polynesian wristwatch makes, tiki talk, singing camp songs, the old Grey Goose is Dead and kumbaya, and suggesting a game of P Knuckle.

The script called for Long John to hurl a banana at his would be entertainer, but she could have done here.

That would have been funny.

He's eating it.

Yeah, I like that he's eating a banana.

Like, I don't know.

I think yeah, he's just.

Trying.

He's trying to, yeah, Before he gets really interrupted, yeah.

Even though it is a historically inaccurate banana, I presume.

Oh yeah, that's like wild bananas have seeds or something like those seeds.

The bananas that we eat.

Anyway, I'm starting a new band and I'm calling it Historically inaccurate Banana.

Oh good.

Yeah, yeah.

Do you want to be in the band, Ryan?

OK, I'll play the instrument.

Do you want to play?

I'll play vibra slap, that's the.

One Ryan Anthony, what do you want to play in in historically inaccurate banana?

Oh, I'm in the band.

I thought I was just going to be a fan.

Yeah, I will play.

You can be both man.

I'll.

Be the block and Spiel player.

Good, great.

And I will play lead slap bass.

I'm just just going to slap the bass.

But it's going to be bass.

It's going to be right up in front.

It's going to be great.

Slap out of bass, man.

I do like him suggesting a game of Pinochle.

And for some reason that I I've never played pinochle.

I don't know what the rules are, but the name of the card game Pinochle has always struck me as funny.

It's just a funny word.

But yeah, so shucky.

The tiki laughs.

He says he loves that one and he promises that he's got a million just like.

Yeah, this is really fun.

I'm glad this is here before you know it's the end of the the movie, but then there's one more little check in before the actual.

And this is the tikis of the beginning of the movie are are genuinely one of my favorite things in this movie.

I think, you know, like the obviously the rats are #1 but like, I love that opening sequence and I'm glad that we got back to it a little bit.

And also these puppets are great.

I love the design of this, you know, But my question is, do we think that every single native pig on this island went along on the Hispaniola?

Like do you think they cleared the island with all the pigs and now it's just Long John and the tiki heads?

I That would be a lot of pigs, but.

Well, it's a big boat.

Yeah, it's true, I guess.

Sure.

Although, wait a minute, what?

What happened to the rest of the pirates?

Are they still there like is?

They're in the Brig Morgan decks.

Oh, they put him in the break.

That's right.

Oh, but wait, what about the elephant?

Who's going to take care of the elephant?

So there has to be at least one pig to stay behind to take care of the elephant, right?

Well, it's Long John's job now.

I guess so he's going to.

Elephant herd her.

Oh yeah, he's just going to ride the elephant around State Island.

That's pretty cool.

The adventures of it is but.

He's got to clean up after it.

Elephant rider he's.

Got to feed it.

He's got to feed it historically inaccurate bananas.

Sure.

What if the What if the elephant in this movie was played by Horatio the elephant from Sesame Street?

Well, I would love that.

What if Miss Piggy came riding in on that guy?

That would be very funny and confusing to most of the.

Audience is did Flaubert make it onto the Hispaniola at the end?

Yeah, I had forgotten that, but Flaubert is there at the end, Miss Piggy says to Kermit Flaubert, meet da da.

Oh good.

Oh good, good.

I'm so glad for Flaubert.

Yeah, but is Flo Bear there the character from the bear named Flo?

The.

You did sesame.

Street character.

We did a tough pig on social media that was just a picture of Flo Bear the anteater and Flo Bear from Sesame Street that said, if you know, you know, did you write that right?

You did you write that?

Right, that wasn't me.

That was that was, that was Shane.

That was a shame.

That makes sense.

Shane loves Flo Bear, so that makes.

Sense and how many people knew.

That but hates Flo Bear.

How many people fell in the category of If you know, you know.

Very.

Let us know in the comments.

Very.

Few like and subscribe.

If you love Flo Bear or Flo Bear, tell us.

Yes, and it's kind of funny that this scene is is making us appreciate Jerry Nelson's performance because it takes attention away from the credits of additional Muppet performers who also did a good job in this movie.

But there are 50 of them, so that's a lot and we can't possibly talk about.

All of them.

Cats Yeah.

50I I wonder if this is the most it's I guess it's not the most ever to work on a Muppet movie, but it's maybe the most credited so far.

Yeah.

And next, the credits continue as a new song begins.

This is a country version of Love, Let Us Hear.

Sung by John Barry and Helen Darling, apparently their real names.

Are we going to talk about them this week?

I ran out of time to.

I think we'll.

Take more notes on this song.

So I think.

We'll do.

We'll do a deep dive on those two names you just said.

Yes, next week, but right before this clip ends, we hear John Barry sing Was I dumb?

So next week we'll find out whether or not he was dumb.

We'll have to wait until.

I will tell you right now, I think, I think, I think everyone who made it this far in the movie was pretty dumb.

Should have left an intermission.

So.

Too late to save the movie.

I have several things I've been saving up from the listener comment treasure chest, but before I get to that, anything else on these 4 minutes?

Joe, starting with you.

The only other thing I had because we skimmed over it pretty quickly at the beginning of these clips, these minutes when the rats are swimming around, you know, they're they're scuba diving or whatever they're doing.

Well, number one, I don't know how they did any of that because like it looked really looks like the rats are swimming.

I didn't see any strings.

It's just like the puppetry is so good.

They made it look so real.

I don't want to know.

I don't want to dive into it just because I like the magic on this one.

But like, yeah, like it looks great.

And I don't know how they filmed it where like if they matted the rats on top of an aquarium or if they filmed through like a like an aquarium to get the fish and the water texture over the rats.

But the way that they did it makes it look like the that they're like giant fish.

Like the fish are basically the size of the rats.

Yeah, yeah, I assumed it was the.

But I don't know, it was like an.

Aquarium, like you say, and that that was a separate, you know, a separate layer or separate element that they, they composited everything together.

But yeah, it, it all looks, it beats really.

Yeah.

Anthony, anything else on these 4 minutes?

No, that is all I had.

Long John Silver does not end up with a joking tiki head in the book.

No, he does not.

OK, good to know.

So, listener, comment Treasure chest.

On the episode we did with Iris as our guest, we speculated about the history of postage stamps and how far back they go.

Regular listener Diad commented.

Postage stamps were invented in the 1820s, so it would be anachronistic for George Washington to use them even if they weren't Bugs Bunny ones.

Because we had wondered, would it be an agronistic for George Washington to use postage stamps at all?

And what if he used stamps with Bugs Bunny on them?

Diet also said something I've been meaning to mention for a while now is that I read an article I can't find now which I think said that the average pirate hall in a movie is greater than all the gold Europeans took out of the Americas in the 18th century.

Put together a pirate booty.

Yeah, I guess because in a movie you have to, like, show so much treasure for it to really be effective.

He said pirate booty was mostly stuff they could sell easily, like rum and tobacco, rather than quote treasure, which I think one of our guests asked about what are they planning to do with all this treasure?

So I guess in real life they would have been looking to steal rum and tobacco and other things they could sell.

A few episodes ago, we realized we weren't sure where the phrase Bildrat came from.

Our friend and recent podcast guest, Actually Eric, said a ship's bilges are the bottom.

Most compartments of the ship were water pools, so the water would be stagnant.

A bildrat is a rat that lives down in the bilges and is therefore an insult.

So let that be known if you ever want to call somebody a bilge rat.

It's it's a really gross thing to be tough pigs.

Discord regular Jessica had an answer to another recent question.

Revisiting the dangling Rizzo scene reminded me there was a conversation over what the turning device was called.

That's the the gag where Gonzo is turning that thing with his hands and Rizzo is just hanging from it, she said.

I knew the answer, but I think I forgot to reply.

It's a capstan.

Capstan.

That's what you call the tourney thing on the ship Rizzo is dangling from after a recent episode Adam from Muppetergy said I enjoyed Ryan saying Beaker lowering the net reminded him of Beaker being a stagehand on the Muppet Show.

Because back in the day, sailors were often hired as stagehands because they knew rigging.

That's why it's bad luck to whistle in a theater.

The fly men and sailors would communicate by whistling, so an errant whistle could get someone hurt.

Nautical theater trivia.

But that's very interesting.

I had no idea, but it makes sense.

Yeah.

That's fascinating.

Yeah.

Sailors have spent so much time pulling ropes and stuff on a ship, so they would they would have a pretty good starting point for pulling ropes in a theater.

When we talked about the fight scene on the beach, I guess Cam Garrity saw something moving in the background.

We were trying to figure out if there was a live animal on the set.

Possibly.

Regular listener Zach explained that that is actually just an incapacitated pirate.

And I went back and looked I I think that's true.

I think it's just a pirate sort of like like a human pirate, maybe even a Muppet pirate, yeah, but like someone who's been knocked out and it's just kind of very slowly moving around.

And then finally two more from Dyad.

We were trying to think of any previous examples of a hero using a sword to slice of villain a villain's costume apart like costume no like Kermit does to Long John.

And he said.

The main reference I can think of for a swashbuckling hero showing his superior swordsmanship and disdain for the villains by slicing up his outfit rather than pressing his advantage is the 1982 Scarlet Pimpernel with Anthony Andrews, where he unties Shravulain's cravat with his rapier tip and then cuts off all his waistcoat waistcoat buttons.

But I'd be amazed if there weren't others.

Zorro choosing TO/AZ on his foes is a similar idea.

Yeah, Zorro, I really should have thought of like, yeah, that that's obviously as soon as I read it.

Like the same kind of like, yeah, showboating swordsman.

You know that that animated GIF of Kermit drawing the letter K from an old Sesame tree thing that Yeah.

A lot of people use it as a sarcastic response.

I feel like if Kermit had used his sword to to to swipe AK into Long John's shirt, that would be a very shareable gift.

Oh yeah, that would be great.

Yes.

I wonder if if you could like chase the outline of his sword.

Would it?

Would it look like a letter?

Would it spell something?

Although I'm also realizing his name isn't Kermit in this movie.

He'd have to do an A or an S.

This.

This whole thing's falling apart.

Forget.

It C for Captain S for small, yeah.

Well, I did.

I say CI said.

Yeah, I said.

A.

Oh A because his a.

For Abraham.

Abraham Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

We also had talked about the word butterfingers in the scene where Kermit is waving his sword around and his lips out of his hands.

Diet also said Etymology Online dates Butterfingers to 1837 and butterfingered to the 1610s.

Wow.

So wow, yeah, I guess it's possible that Captain Smollett could refer to himself as butterfingered.

I mean, it, it it makes sense.

Like, because people had butter in those days.

So if you have butter on your fingers.

Your fingers are slow.

They had fingers back then.

They did.

They had fingers.

It's true.

It's.

So they had fingies.

What's the What's the etymology of fingers?

How?

How far back do fingers?

I don't know, that's another one for the listeners to to write it and tell us Anthony is showing us his fingies.

Anthony, do you have a gin and tonic in there again today?

No, I don't.

This is just water.

OK.

I'm serious.

I'm just.

I don't know, man.

I just I'm.

We're we're so close to the end.

It's just.

The buddies.

So I'm getting loose.

Yeah, yeah, that's what happens.

So Joe, you've already been here with us before and answered the questions that we usually ask, so.

I did.

Do you want to ask me other questions?

We don't.

Need to Joe, I'm going to ask.

I'm going to ask you some other questions.

Yeah, go you.

Asked me some questions.

What's?

Your favorite?

Who's your favorite pirate on this movie?

Human pirate?

Oh.

Human pirates.

Oh, that's a good question.

Which one is the one that that goes?

I've got it too, like the older guy.

Easy Pete, right?

Calico Jerry says I've got cabin fever, and Easy Pete says I've got it too.

He has light brown hair, correct?

Yeah, that's that's one.

Yeah, yeah, easy, Pete, I.

Think.

I think so.

That's probably what I would say too.

Yeah, my favorite human pirate.

Yeah, yeah.

If you were going to be on the Hispaniola, what job would you want?

Oh, that's a good question.

Well, my first thought.

So OK, I asked So my my nephew, he's 15 years old and I asked him recently what does he want to be when he grows up?

And he said passive income.

So that's the job I want.

I want to sit around and get paid for it.

Passive income.

All right on a.

Sailing ship you want to somehow have a a position on the crew that gets you passive income.

I mean, I guess that would be that would be Squire Trilami, right?

Like he doesn't really.

Have a job?

Yeah, I guess just Squire Trilami's dad, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And last one Long John Silver could cook you any meal.

What meal would you want him to make you?

Oh, and Long John Silver.

What?

What would I want him to cook me?

Well, I know he's really good at like, like fast food, like fried fish.

Yeah.

So I guess that's my specialty.

I think I'll go for that, yeah.

Good.

All right, little coleslaw on the side.

Yeah, wow.

Yeah, a side of hush puppies.

They still hush puppies there.

I believe so.

I.

Think so, Yeah.

I don't think there's any of those left around me anymore.

I could go for those hush puppies, though.

Yeah, I have to go somewhere else for hush puppies.

Anthony, that was really impressive that you came up with those questions spontaneously.

Here's the thing.

I'm a school librarian, and I teach the same thing to classes four days in a row.

Yeah, and sometimes you run shorter than you did in previous days, so you just have to come up with material to fill out the clock.

Yeah, and so you got a vamp?

Yeah.

OK.

Well, then if that is everything, we can wrap things up for this week.

Joe, thank you so much for joining us.

Thank you for having me back, especially, you know, coming back a third time on this podcast.

I, I always say when I'm here, this is my favorite podcast of all time and it's such a joy to get to be here and to get to hang out with you guys and gave me an the opportunity to write a terrible rap.

So thanks for that.

Yeah.

It was good.

As always, we want to thank Morgan Davey for our show's logo.

Listeners, you can find Tough Pigs on the Internet at toughpigs.com and all of our social media.

We're on T public.

We're on Patreon.

We have our Discord server.

Anthony is on Blue sky at Durwood Clapper.

I'm on Blue sky at me Ryan Row.

Anthony is on letterbox that Zeppo Marxist.

I'm on letterbox that Movies are neat.

Joe, where can people find you?

I am also on letterbox which I was not the last time I was on the show.

Yes, this is an exciting update.

Get ready for this you guys.

You can follow me on letterbox at Tough Pigs Joe.

And if you're not a Letterbox person, I also post my movie and TV and book and other media reviews on my sub stack, which is free called Joe Consumes Media.

And that's it for social media for me because I'm done with it.

Yeah, that's that's very everything else is just tough pigs and movie reviews.

That's it.

And and what are your top four favorite movies on Letterboxed?

So I didn't want to like spend the time to actually like go through and try to decide.

Like I remember how much stress it was back when we did the Myspace top 8.

So So right now my top four are, predictably, The Muppet Movie, The Great Muppet Caper, Muppet Safe Manhattan, and Muppet Christmas Carol.

Yeah, yeah, you're nothing is not consistent.

You know I have a brand.

Yeah, absolutely.

Recently posted a great review of Santa Claus is Coming to Town where you just said how much you love I'm a man now Tanta that's.

The best line.

Best line in cinematic history.

Oh, everything's good and fun.

Been so long since I saw that as we record this, it's we're we're just after Christmas.

So I should I should watch that show?

You should watch it, it's on.

It's on Amazon Prime as of this moment.

Probably not after the end of the.

That's how we watched it, just put.

Right now I think they just put them up for like the season.

That makes sense.

So listeners, seek out Joe's letterbox and all those things and make sure you tell all of your friends, pirates and tiki statues alike, to listen to this show.

And join us again next week, because we're not quite done yet.

Next week for another episode of Moving Right Along, Love Power.

A little love power.

Historically inaccurate banana coming at you coming.

At.

You going on tour?