A global criminal conspiracy, a prince, a jailed socialite, and a billionaire who may or may not have been murdered.

Welcome to the world of the Jeffrey Epstein, The Prince and the Pervert podcast journalists Lisa and Jan bring you the ultimate deep dive.

Hello everyone, it's Jen here from The Prince and the Pervert.

This is part one of one of those unsealed documents from the two thousand and fifteen onwards civil case the Virginia Dufray brought against Galaine Maxwell for defamation.

First off, Sarah Ransom, another Epstein survivor.

I'll be reading out her deposition that she made in early two thousand and seventeen.

In this case, her deposition is four hundred and sixty nine pages long.

So there's going to be quite a few episodes, and it's probably best not played in the car of there's children around.

There are some true green things that are talked about, and of course, just a reminder, Gallaine Maxwell settled this defamation case.

In other words, Virginia du free one.

So let's get started, and apologies if I pronounce any names incorrectly.

Page one, highly confidential deposition of Sarah Ransom, New York, New York, Friday, fab seventeenth, two thousand and seventeen, Page two.

February seventeen, twenty seventeen, nine am.

Deposition of Sarah Ransom held at the offices of Boys, Shriller and Flexner, five seventy five Lexington Avenue, New York, New York, before Jeremy Richman, a shorthand reporter and notary public of the State of New York.

Appearances Boys, Shriller and Flexner l LP.

Attorneys for the plaintiff that's Virginia by Sigrid Stone mcaulay Esquire, Haddon, Morgan and Foreman PC, attorneys for defendant by Laura A.

Manager Esquire and Jeremy S.

Polluccia which is spelled p A G.

L i Uca, so I often refer to him as PAG.

Appearances continued.

J.

Stanley Pottinger p LLC, Attorneys for the witness which is Sarah by J.

Stanley Pottinger Esquire.

Mints and Gold LP attorneys for the witness by Peter Gergis Esquire also present Gallaine Maxwell via Teley conference page five.

It is hereby stipulated and agreed by and between the attorneys for the respective parties herein that filing and Ceiling B, and the same are hereby waived.

It is for the stipulated and agreed that all objections, except as to form of the question, shall be reserved to the time of the trial.

It is further stipulated and agreed that the within deposition may be sworn to and signed before any officer authorized to a minister, an oath with the same force and effect as if signed and sworn to before the court, Miss Manager.

If we could have counsel and to their appearances for the record, please mister Gurgess sure.

My name is Peter Gurgis.

I'm appearing on behalf of the witness today, Miss McAuley, Sigra McAuley on behalf of Virginia Duffrey, the plaintiff in the action, Mister Pottinger, Stan Pottinger on behalf of the witness, Miss Maninger, Laura Manager, and Jeffrey Polluccia on behalf of me Smaxwell, who is appearing by telephone, Sarah Ranson, having first been called as a witness, having first been duly sworn by a notary public Brackets Jeremy Richmond close Brackets of the State of New York, was examined and testified as follows.

Examination by Miss Meninger.

Good morning, Miss Ransom, good morning.

Can you please give us your full name, Sarah Emma Ashley Ransom, and what is your birthdate?

Sarah's answer is fully redacted?

And what is your current address?

Gurgess, I'm going to object to current address?

Meninger.

You can answer, Gurgess.

You can give your last permanent address.

Sarah answers, but it's all redacted brackets and off the record discussion was held.

Sarah answers again, which is completely redacted?

Manager?

And what does that mean?

That's your last permanent address?

Sarah?

I reside there?

Do you rent an apartment?

My partner does?

Who is your partner?

Gurgess, objection, Manager, who is your partner?

The witness?

Do I have to answer that?

Gurgess?

Yes, answer redacted redacted?

Meninger, I'm sorry, Sarah, redacted, redacted?

Manager?

How do you spell that last name?

Answer?

Redacted?

Manager?

And how long has redacted been your partner?

Gurgiess, I'm going to object.

I'm not sure what the relevance of this is or where you're going with this, Manager?

How long has redacted been your partner?

Sarah, Sorry, can I just ask a question?

I would like to just clarify.

When you say objection, does that mean I actually have to answer the question, because that's irrelevant, Gurgess.

Right, unless I'm telling you not to answer, you need to answer, Sarah, So I don't need to answer, Gurgess.

No, you do need to answer this.

Okay, we've been together almost a year.

Manager, And what is your current occupation?

I'm a writer.

And what do you write?

Just stuff, you know, just about factual stuff, you know, just a bit of this, bit of that.

Have you been paid for any of your writing?

No, it's more of a hobby.

Really.

Are you employed?

No?

Do you have any any source of income?

My partner, Gurgess, I'm going to object to that.

Income is out.

You don't have to answer that, Manager, Do you have any source of income?

Gurgess, I just objected to that.

You don't have to answer, Manager.

Is there a privilege you're asserting, Gurgess.

I'm not sure what the relevance is, and I'm not going to allow.

Manager.

Do you believe that relevance is a proper objection during a deposition?

Gurgess, I believe that if you go far afeel with this witness that the judge is not going to appreciate it, and that I'm not going to just sit here and be a potted plant and allow her to answer any questions on any subject that you see fit.

Manager, on relevance, you're instructing her not to answer on a relevant subjection.

Is that what you're saying, Gurgess, I just objected, Miss McAuley.

I'm going to object on behalf of the plaintiff, Virginia Duffrey, to the extent that you're requesting from a non party financial information, which is not allowed under New York law.

Manager, I have asked her whether she has any source of income, and you're going to object, Cigarett McAuley, Yes, Manager, and instruct her not to answer as well.

Cigarette, I'm not instructing her not to answer.

I'm just making a record, Gurgess.

It's financial information, manager, and whether she has a financial motive is relevant.

So I'm going to ask you a last time do you have any source of income?

Gurgess, I'm going to instruct you again not to answer.

Manager.

Has any of your writing been published by anyone?

Sarah?

No?

Have you sought to have your writing published by anyone.

No, what is your partner's occupation?

Gurgess objection Macaulay objection, Gurgess, I'm going to object your same objection.

Manager.

If you are going to instruct the witness not to answer, please say that contemporaneous with your objection, because there are two different things.

There are objections and instructions not to answer.

So are you instructing her not to answer what her partner's occupation is?

Gurgess, right, same objection.

I'm instructing the witness not to answer on the basis of both relevance and because she's a third party non I'm sorry, non party witness.

Who you are asking for financial information about?

Manager?

No, I ask for an occupation Sigram McCauley.

I'm going to object that relates directly to financial information, so it's covered by the New York law with respect to non party witnesses.

Manager, what are the names of your parents Sarah's answer fully redacted?

How do you spell redacted?

Answer redacted?

And where do your parents live?

I'm not comfortable giving my mother's and my father's addressed to you.

Manager.

Are you instructing her not to answer?

Sigra McAuley, do you want to confer, Gurgess, give me a moment on this, Sarah, we're really well organized.

Time noted nine twenty one am.

Recess time noted nine twenty three am.

Manager, Miss Ransom, there was a question pending when you took a break with your lawyers.

Can you please answer the question, Gurgess, I'm instructing the witness not to answer questions regarding current information about her own location, her family's location, things of that nature.

The witness has expressed to me bears of harassment and the belief that she's being followed, and my understanding is that there are other witnesses that have had similar fears and concerns.

And unless you make some sort of proffer of the actual relevance of her parents' addresses, wherever those are, I'm not going to have her answer.

Manager.

Okay, where does that understanding come from?

Please, mister Gurgess.

Mister Gurgess, where does your understanding come from?

You just made a factual representation.

I would like to know where you're standing comes from.

Gurgess.

Yeah, I'm not being deposed.

I'm not going to answer your questions.

Manager, All right, Miss Ransom, did you agree to be a witness in the case of Dufray versus Maxwell.

Yes?

Did you voluntarily agree to do that?

Yes?

Were you promised anything in exchange for your testimony in the due Fray versus Maxwell case?

No?

Were you provided legal counsel?

Sorry?

Does that mean, Sigrid you have a lawyer?

Yes, Gurgess, Yes, Sarah, yes.

Manager, Okay, how many lawyers do you have?

Now?

Three?

Manager?

I would like the record to reflect that the witness is checking with the lawyers to get answers to these questions.

Pottinger, Wait, wait, wait, objection, Gurgess.

There is absolutely no exchange.

No words were spoken by manager, mister Pottinger.

Did you put up a number of fingers?

Did you put up a number of fingers?

Mister Pottinger.

Pottinger, you said, I'm going to object because the witness is answering these questions in the plural, Manager, m Pottinger, that is inaccurate.

When she looked at me to ask how many lawyers she had, I said three with three fingers.

That is a single request on her part and a single answer, not multiple.

Manager.

No, she has looked to her lawyers for previous answers.

We'll just make a record as we go along, Thank you, Page nineteen.

Sigra Macaulay, you could have had a videotape here so that we would have a record of that, because I think your verbal record is inaccurate, So Pottinger, and in fact she this is mister Pottinger speaking, And in fact she has not looked at me during this deposition except one time, which was for what I took to be a request to know how many lawyers she has?

Manager, So are you being deposed mister Pottinger?

Pottinger, I am not manager, Miss Rancer.

How many lawyers do you think you have?

Three?

Can you please name them?

Peter, SIGRed and Stan.

Is mister Bradley Edwards representing you?

Yes?

Is mister Paul Castle representing you?

Know?

Is mister David Boys representing you?

Yes?

Secret Macaulay.

I just want to be clear for the record if you're talking about representing generally or you're talking about a particular matter, because we have a couple of matters.

Manager, I'm asking questions here, Sigared, No, I understand that you have to make the record clear.

Manager, Miss McAuley.

If you want to ask her questions later, you are more than welcome to do.

So, I am going to ask questions the witness I am deposing cigarette.

Well, we want the record to be clear that there are more than one action.

Manager.

You can ask questions when you're doing your questioning.

I'm doing my questioning now, and so I will ask the questions, SIGRed.

I'm going to object.

The record should be clear there is more than one action pending here.

She is represented here as a non party witness, and she also has her own action pending.

Pag.

Thank you for that speaking objection, miss McAuley and communicating that information to the witness, which you know is totally improper.

Cigarette.

Now that's two people objecting right now.

Is it going to be Laura taking this deposition or you?

Jeff?

You guys have done this to me before, and it's not a position where you're allowed to object and she's allowed to object.

You guys pulled that at the last deposition, So please do not do this here, Pag.

I was just thanking you, Manager, all right.

So the number of lawyers we're up to so far is Gurgus McAuley, Pottinger, Edwards, boys.

That's five, correct, Sarah?

Can I just ask you a question?

No, you cannot Okay, are those five lawyers that are representing you?

Gurgess objection, Yes or no?

Yes?

All right?

Anyone else representing you?

No?

Miss Schultz?

Is Miss Meredith Schultz representing you?

No?

How much are you paying for any of these lawyers?

It's on a pro bono basis.

Do you know what each of those lawyers normal hourly rates are?

No?

Do you know how many hours you have spent with your attorneys?

No, Gurgess objection.

How many hours have you spent with mister Gurgess Gurgess Objection Manager without communicating to me any information you and he have shared?

Sarah?

A few?

Maybe?

How many?

About eleven hours in total?

When is the first time that you met mister Gurgess Gurgess objection, Cigarette You can answer, Gurgess, You can answer Sarah yesterday.

Manager, you met mister Gurgess yesterday?

Was that your answer?

Yes?

And who is paying for mister Gurgess's fees?

If you know, I have a pro bono arrangement.

Do you know if he's receiving money from anyone else in exchange for representing you?

No, No, you don't know, or no, he is not.

I don't know how many hours have you spent with miss McAuley.

Can I just clarify that question?

Does that mean on the phone, Like, what are you referring to in person or either one?

How many hours?

How much time have you spent with miss McCauley in person?

I met Miss pauley for the first time in person yesterday, but i've spent Yeah, we've been.

Miss McAuley was the first person I actually spoke to.

And how many hours have you spent with her on the phone?

Many?

Many hours?

Approximately?

How many?

I don't know five Gurgess objection more than five?

Ten Gurgess objection, manager ten, well, ten, fifteen.

She's been with me the whole way since when I came forward, So she's been a very prominent person.

And when did you first speak with her on the phone?

I think it was without telling me what you said, I think it was November November.

What I can't remember the day, early November, late November.

Gurgess objection.

I can't remember she speaking to you on your cell phone or a landline, cell phone, a mobile number or a landline a cell phone?

Okay?

And what's that cell phone number?

I don't have it anymore, that's okay.

What's the cell phone number.

I actually don't know.

I can't remember my cell phone number.

I don't have anything with me, so I can't remember that number offhand.

How long did you have that cell phone?

About eight months?

What happened to it?

I got rid of it?

Why?

Because I fear for my life because of Jeffrey Epstein and Colaine Maxwell.

What did you do with it?

I sold it?

When November?

Before or after?

You first spoke with miss McAuley before?

So, then, how did you speak with miss McCauley over the phone on my partner's cell phone?

What's his cell phone number?

Cigarette objection?

What's the relevance of her partner's cell phone?

Again?

This is irrelevant, it's harassing.

It's you're seeking information to be able to The witness has already expressed fear about her people currently going after her, so we would object to that intimidation of a non party witness.

Manager.

What is your partner's cell phone number?

Gurgess, I'm directing the witness not to answer.

How many hours have you spent talking with mister Pottinger.

I've been speaking to mister Pottinger from November.

When in November?

I can't remember on your same cell phone that you got rid of.

No, on my partner's cell phone.

And when did you first meet mister Pottinger in person?

It was in the beginning of January.

And where was that meeting?

Barcelona?

Where in Barcelona?

Barcelona?

It's Barcelona we meet.

I can't remember the area.

In a restaurant, in a hotel, in an office in a hotel.

And how long did you spend with mister Pottinger on that occasion?

Two days?

How many hours over the two days?

Gosh, about sixteen?

How many hours did you spend with mister Edwards cigarette objection, The same amount he was with mister Pottinger.

Yeah.

Yes.

And mister Boys, how much time have you spent with mister Boys.

I haven't spent any time with him yet.

Have you met him No?

Have you spoken to him on the phone?

No?

And you have not paid any money for any of these lawyers time?

Correct?

Yes, in addition to your free legal counsel, were you given anything else in exchange for your agreement to be a witness in this case?

Gurgess objection.

No.

Did you fly over here yes?

From Barcelona?

Yes?

Did you pay for the plane ticket?

Yes?

How much was the plane ticket it was.

I think it was a thousand.

It was a thousand, I can't remember the exact total.

Has anyone agreed to reimburse you for that?

No, and you're staying where while you're here?

Gurgess objection and direct you not to answer that.

Manager.

Are you staying in a hotel while you're here?

Gurgess, you can answer that, Sarah, Yeah, are you paying for that?

Curgiess objection, and I'm directing you not to answer.

SIGRed you can answer, Gurgess.

I think you can answer, Sigrid.

Yeah, I think you can answer Gurgess.

That's fine.

I agree.

Cigarette.

You're a non party witness.

You can answer that question.

Manager.

Who is cigarette?

I am representing Virginia.

He is representing the witness.

Manager.

Well, you're representing the witnesses.

Well, right, Sigaret, I'm not manager.

Well did you just tell her she can answer a question, Sigret, I did, manager?

Are you paying for the hotel?

Sarah?

No, who's paying for the hotel?

It's on expenses.

I think of a witness.

It's expenses from Yeah, I don't know.

Actually you don't know who is paying for your hotel?

No, it's not you.

No, and how much per night is your hotel?

I have no idea.

How long are you staying here on this trip?

Just for the deposition, Okay, when did you arrive?

It was Tuesday, late Tuesday night.

And when are you leaving tomorrow evening?

In addition to your legal counsel and your hotel?

Is there anything else you've been given in exchange for your no to be a witness in this case?

You have to wait for me to finish my question before you answer.

Sorry, have you been given anything else?

No?

Have you been promised anything else?

No?

Have you been promised that you would have counsel to help you bring a lawsuit against a number of people?

Cigaret objection To the extent this gets into attorney client privileged information, you're not allowed to answer.

Manager.

Have your lawyers agreed to bring a lawsuit on your behalf against a number of people?

Yes?

And are you paying for that counsel?

No?

Have you reached any agreement about a contingency fee for that case?

Can you explain what contingency means?

Sorry?

Do you expect to receive money as a result of that lawsuit?

Oh?

No, No, you're not asking to receive any money as a result of that lawsuit.

No, No, all right.

So have you had any agreements regarding writing a book?

No?

About your experience.

You have to wait for me to finish my question.

Have you had any agreements with your lawyers about media rights in any form?

Gurgess objection to the extent that you're asking about communications with the attorneys, Manager, I'm asking about her arrangement with her attorneys, which is not privileged.

Sarah.

Can you please repeat the question, manager?

Have you reached any agreement with your attorneys regarding media rights for your story?

No?

Have you talked to anyone about publishing anything related to your story?

Can you repeat the question please?

Manager?

Can you read it back?

Brackets requested.

Portion of the record was read back, Sarah, Yes, I have.

Who have you spoken to the New York Post?

Who at the New York Post?

Maureen Callahan?

And when did you speak with her?

I think it was later October.

Have you spoken with her since?

No?

And how long did you speak to her?

I spoke to her, for gosh, about thirty minutes on the phone once.

And what was that?

What did you tell her in your phone call?

I told her what Jeffrey Epstein and Colaine Maxwell did to me and the other girls.

Did she give you any money in exchange for that interview?

No?

Did she publish anything related to that interview?

No?

How did you get in touch with miss Callahan?

I emailed after I read an article that she had written about Jeffrey Epstein, and the last sentence was it was on the sixteenth of October, And one of the last sentences I remember was will we ever know the true extent of Jeffrey Epstein's victims?

And I wrote her after that, because well it still continues, doesn't it.

Where is the email that you wrote her?

It's on my computer, okay, in your yahho account.

Yes.

Did you have any agreement with her to have an additional conversation?

Yes?

And what was that agreement?

It wasn't an agreement, per such.

What actually happened was I came forward.

As soon as I came forward, there was where I live in Barcelona, there's quite a lot it's quite busy traffic with people.

I came forward to Maureen Callahan.

I wanted to tell my story and I want to run a campaign in which all the girls that have been abused by Glen and Jeffrey can come forward.

And I wanted to run a campaign with The New York Post to get these girls to have the courage to come forward, because I know a lot of them are frightened, like myself.

The email correspondence I with Maureen Callahan.

She was going away or something, and she was going to write a piece in The New York Post about my story.

During that time, it was the elections, so there was a lot more other things going on.

There were two people following me.

After I came forward to Maureen Callahan.

I went to I walked downstairs, I walked around.

I have a usual routine that I do in the morning.

I went out.

I saw the same two people.

Later on that afternoon, I saw the same two people again.

I was frightened.

I'm frightened for my life, absolutely frightened.

So there you go.

So that's what I was.

Communication stopped between Maureen Callahan and I.

I got really angry with Maureen because she had obviously told someone being the New York Post.

So you know, so you had an email to miss Callahan and an email back from her.

Yes, more than one, yes, how any I can't remember more than ten or less than ten, less than ten, And you had one phone call with her or more than one, just one?

And it lasted about thirty minutes.

About that And was that also on the cell phone you got rid of?

That was on my partner's cell phone?

And what had you read in the press that caused you to get in touch with miss Callahan?

Sigra mcaulay objection to form.

Go ahead, Sarah.

You can read the article yourself.

It's on the sixteenth of October.

There's an article in the New York Post written by Maureen Callahan.

You can read it, and that's what inspired me to come forward.

What do you recall about that article?

Oh, I can't remember.

The one thing I do remember is the last sentence of the article, which is stuck with me and quite prominent, and that is, will we ever know the true extent of Jeffrey Epstein's victims?

Do you recall anything else about the article?

It's just the same.

When I read the article, the stuff that I had experienced myself with Jeffrey, it's just same old stuff, just continuing.

I thought he had stopped abusing girls.

What do you recall reading an article that Jeffrey Epstein was doing?

I can't remember anything at all.

You can read the article.

I can't remember.

The question is what you remember?

I can't remember.

You remember nothing else about the article?

Cigarette asked an answered objection, Manager, except it was related to Jeffrey Epstein and it ended with the sentence that you described cigarette objection asked and answered Sarah, Yes, Manager, What do you know about other girls being frightened?

I know that the girls on the island and in New York during my time with Jeffrey and Gallayne that they were frightened.

Okay, what are the names of those girls?

Redacted?

Redacted?

Redacted?

I don't know her surname.

I can't remember her surname.

How do you spell the first name?

Redacted?

Redacted?

I'm just taking a guess.

Redacted.

I'm guessing.

I think gurgess.

I'm going to remind the witness.

I told her not to speculate, but that's okay.

Manager.

In addition to redacted, redacted and redacted, what are the names of the other girls who you believe are frightened?

Redacted?

There were a couple other girls I met during my time with Gallaine and Jeffrey that were frightened.

What were the names of the girls that you met that were frightened?

There was redacted, redacted, redacted redacted, And there were two other girls.

I can't remember their names.

Okay, please describe them.

The describe all the girls or no, we're talking about the girls that you met on the island that you described as frightened.

Okay, on the island, Gurgess objection.

You seem to be suggesting that all those girls are from the island.

I'm not sure that's the testimony.

Manager.

All right, you said girls on the island and in New York who were frightened.

I asked you for their names.

You gave me three.

Correct.

Yes, you said there were two others?

Correct?

What did those two other girls look like?

I can't really remember.

One had blonde hair, long blonde hair.

Anything else about that I can't remember.

The other girl?

Can you remember her hair color?

No?

I can't remember.

Do you know the height of either one of them?

No?

I can't remember.

Do you have a photograph of either one of them?

No?

And where did you meet these two other girls in New York?

Where?

In New York?

I can't remember.

You don't know the location at all?

No, it was ten years ago.

Was it in a home or in a commercial setting?

I meet girls commercially and in home settings.

Where did you meet those two other girls you described as being frightened?

I can't remember what is redacted's last name?

I don't know what does redacted look like?

She's got long blonde hair?

How long?

Long?

Long hair?

Longer than your hair?

Now?

I think so.

I think it was longer so middle of her back?

I can't I can't remember on how long her hair is.

Where did you meet redacted?

I met redacted first in New York?

Where in New York?

I can't remember anywhere in New York?

You can't remember at all.

I can't remember the location.

Was it at mister Epstein's home?

Gurgess objection.

You have asked her now almost twenty questions about where she met those girls, and she has consistently said that she does not remember.

Manager Was it in mister Epstein's home?

No?

Was it at a club?

Gurgess?

Are we going to spend seven hours with her saying I can't remember where she met these two girls?

Was it at a club?

One?

Was at a club?

Which one redacted?

Redacted?

Where did you meet redacted?

I first met redacted on the island.

Did you meet her a second time?

Yes?

Where?

Did you meet her the second time?

I can't remember state, can't remember country?

Well us?

Sorry?

Can I have a break?

I actually need to go to the bathroom?

Sorry?

Manager, Yes, I don't think I have a question pending.

We'll go off the record now.

Time noted nine fifty two am recess and that's at the top of page fifty.

I'll be back soon with more of this deposition.

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