[UNKNOWN]: you [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome to Marvel Vision, a podcast about Marvel, the MCU, and right now, eyes of Wakanda, the eyes have it and eye and Alex.

[SPEAKER_01]: I am Justin, eyes and Justin.

[SPEAKER_03]: On Pete, and we are going to be talking about all four episodes of Eyes of Wakanda that dropped Friday, pen this past Friday on Disney+.

[SPEAKER_03]: So if you haven't watched it, definitely going to be spoilers here as we get into the episodes.

[SPEAKER_03]: And because this is a MCU canonical show that's different from, say, what if, or your friendly neighborhood, Spider-Man, or X-Men industry, seven or any of the others that take place throughout the MCU multiverse, this is on the sacred timeline.

[SPEAKER_03]: So it counts.

[SPEAKER_03]: It matters, okay?

[SPEAKER_01]: And then you have a sacred timeline, personally, for your lives.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no, I just call it my life.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it does take, really.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I'm on a different timeline.

[SPEAKER_01]: I need to jump back to the secret line, you know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, wow.

[SPEAKER_03]: So anyway, we are going to be talking about the show.

[SPEAKER_03]: And it is canonical and it does matter as much as that matters to you for the MCU.

[SPEAKER_03]: So again, just going to give a second spoiler warning here because some stuff does go down in this show in a surprising way.

[SPEAKER_03]: But as usual with these sort of things, I want to talk about where you were when you saw it.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm kidding.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not that dangerous.

[SPEAKER_02]: We don't need to talk about that.

[SPEAKER_03]: I do want you not to get elected to the business wonky stuff first though because I think this has been a big part of the conversation here is how eyes of Wakanda dropped and how that sort of ties into generally how Disney plus has been dropping Marvel shows because this [SPEAKER_03]: As it's actually been sitting on the shelf for a while, but certainly it's been sitting on the shelf for at least a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's been in the works for years at this point.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was surprised it announced a couple of years ago and animation takes a while, but I think not to call it anybody out, but it was mentioned by an animation insider on our Discord Slack.

[SPEAKER_03]: Discord Slack, I keep saying that.

[SPEAKER_03]: on our Patreon Discord that it's been ready for about eighteen months at this point.

[SPEAKER_03]: We had Todd Harris, who's the showwriter on our live show a couple of weeks back and he is awesome.

[SPEAKER_03]: You should go listen to that interview.

[SPEAKER_01]: Great.

[SPEAKER_03]: That clearly was like [SPEAKER_03]: Excited to get this out here, excited to have this on.

[SPEAKER_03]: So this has been sitting around for a while and then it was supposed to come out August, twenty-seventh, I believe.

[SPEAKER_03]: And instead kind of at the last second they were like, nope, coming out August first, all of it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Here we go.

[SPEAKER_03]: So what's going on here?

[SPEAKER_03]: What's your take on it and do you think any of this that I just talked about really matters for the greater view of the MCU?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I just feel like for a like [SPEAKER_00]: hype or at least I just feel like marvel is just like dumping stuff out of a truck and being like maybe like it I didn't hear I was excited about isoconda and then there was no promotion of it leading up to it you know what you mean like I felt like oh, it's out I normally you have like ads for it or you know or there's you know and I just felt like oh a cool I'll go check this out, but it was [SPEAKER_00]: It felt like they didn't even care like, I don't know, I was a panda.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well the thing is like I think there's two ways to talk about this like there's the business side that you were just talking about Alex and then what Pete saying is like hey I know this is stress and you guys out on the corporate side but I like this so tell me about it be excited like I feel like it's if you're stressed about something and then you suddenly turn around to someone like if you're like stress about making dinner and then your kids come in to eat and you're like [SPEAKER_01]: It's here, hurry, sit down here.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, wait a second.

[SPEAKER_01]: What?

[SPEAKER_01]: I like dinner.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, give me that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tell me what it is or whatever.

[SPEAKER_01]: So like, I think they have a problem with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's been true for years.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's what they're, it's been plaguing the Star Wars side of the Disney Model where they are like, clearly don't know what to do and are stressed and they can't talk about it in any way that doesn't betray their stress.

[SPEAKER_01]: From a business perspective, it reminds me of the Spider-Man series we talked about earlier this year, where it's like, this is cool, but like, and you're dropping in in a way that doesn't make sense and not even from on the insider tip, telling us why you're doing it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think there's a way to generate excitement, like Pete Wands, where you're just like, hey, great series coming out, four episodes in Canon, this is like, where Black Panther, we're not gonna get another move for a while.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you love that, check this out, you're gonna love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then or from an insider perspective, it's like, hey, we decided to drop this because of X reason.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have anything coming here.

[SPEAKER_01]: We think it's a great summer sure to get people.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, give us enough information to make something rather than having it just hearing the vague beeps of a dump truck pulling up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then everything sliding off into the front lawn.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I mean, I think that's a really good take on it.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I'd also throw in there.

[SPEAKER_03]: I know you went to all the way back to Spider-Man, but I think it's part of just a pattern, even Daredevil, which did have a lot of hype on it.

[SPEAKER_03]: The fact that that was two episodes, one episode, one episode, two episodes, one episode, one episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's just a weird rhythm when people are like, oh wait, what's happening?

[SPEAKER_03]: And that you don't want that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like you want from a general audience perspective, you want the comfort of like, this is coming out of your every week.

[SPEAKER_03]: Even if it's only four episodes, put it out, be like, here's one episode a week.

[SPEAKER_03]: We are going to let you know this is happening.

[SPEAKER_03]: Same thing with like iron hard.

[SPEAKER_03]: Where it just came out, also tied to black that there.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they're like great news.

[SPEAKER_03]: Iron hards been sitting on the shelf for a while.

[SPEAKER_03]: We're going to release it three episode three episodes of that never talk about it ever again.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think you guys are one opportunity at all the money like whatever the actual quality of the thing.

[SPEAKER_03]: There's a certain element of flop sweat that comes off of the MCU with these sort of releases that just don't help it.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's all.

[SPEAKER_03]: So then all out of the way, let's talk about the actual show itself.

[SPEAKER_03]: Pete, you're probably the biggest Black Panther and Black Panther adjacent fan here on the podcast.

[SPEAKER_03]: So what was your take?

[SPEAKER_03]: What did you think overall about Isabel Condun?

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, I would have liked, and I'll also throw out there that, like, you are also very critical of animation style.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm very, I'll give it a good.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's part of my rant.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I do think that I love hearing a little taste of the rant before we get there.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, like a little amuse bush, uh, spikes just pierce spikes, like so much blow and try and pepper into your mouth for your meal.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But speaking of that, it would have been nice to know that like, okay, we're going to focus on the war dogs.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, if in the lead up, I could have had information because it was like, I'm watching it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm kind of like, oh, man, what's this going to be about?

[SPEAKER_00]: And then like, oh, okay, we're just going to focus on the war dogs, which like, as Wakanda war dogs, you know, give me something.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's like, I was like, are what, what are we doing?

[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think like, [SPEAKER_00]: Part of the thing for me was I was like so excited about this, but not knowing what parts to be excited about.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then by the time I figured it out, it was almost heartbreaking a little bit because I was like, oh man, and being a spy is you're just really lying to people and then like, holy shit, this is fucking heartbreaking.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I was like, man, I used to think spies were cool as a kid, but now I'm just like, man, he lied to that lady for years.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I mean, oh my god.

[SPEAKER_00]: But anyways, I do think that the animation, uh, all the way.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just sorry, sorry, but for you, I'm okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just have to talk about this for a second.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you had known them about it, it was a war dogs.

[SPEAKER_01]: You would have been more emotionally prepared to deal with the last time.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, because I was like, [SPEAKER_00]: There's so much about Wakanda that we don't know that is amazing and futuristic and style and like all sorts of cool stuff.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, what are we going to get into?

[SPEAKER_00]: What part of Wakanda are we going to be chilling with?

[SPEAKER_00]: This is going to be the door of my way.

[SPEAKER_01]: So let me ask you so then this makes total sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you in to take that further, the next James Bond movie, you want it to be like James Bond.

[SPEAKER_01]: I fuck strangers.

[SPEAKER_01]: just to get your motion prepared for how James Bond goes and like has sex with the woman.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because then you're thinking like, oh, man, they're going to be together forever.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's like, Jets, what do you do it?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my god.

[SPEAKER_03]: James, I mean, I will say to the credit of Marvel.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I hear you like, night, general audiences aren't, you know, necessarily plugged in.

[SPEAKER_03]: But they've been very clear about the concept of the show since the beginning where they said, by Brady and has been lost throughout the world, the war dogs go out to get it back.

[SPEAKER_03]: And these are four anthology style adventures about that.

[SPEAKER_03]: So they've been straight up with that.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's my fault.

[SPEAKER_03]: I understand it may not have been paying attention to Marvel or during the interview we had with Todd Harris.

[SPEAKER_03]: The showrunner where we explained the concept as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's completely a check that was like we talked to.

[SPEAKER_00]: Did we come in something like that?

[SPEAKER_00]: It ain't your defense.

[SPEAKER_03]: Who said it?

[SPEAKER_03]: Very interesting art on his wall and I understand why your pay attention to the stuff behind him instead.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's very distracting.

[SPEAKER_00]: But also like speaking of the art, I really loved the kind of like color choice and the like it almost looked like they took like a watercolor picture [SPEAKER_00]: and then kind of had the animation going like they had this really cool backdrop style that was just like a beautiful picture that and then had stuff happening within it so like really impressive animation kind of like style tone vibe like I liked [SPEAKER_00]: all of that now it was a little blocky and that kind of bothered me a little bit but artistically I was blown away by the because they would they would like each episode started with this kind of like beautiful painting [SPEAKER_00]: And then we kind of like zoomed into and then action happened.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, oh, what a fun way to kind of start it up episode and have this kind of vibe in tone.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I think artistically it was great show just for the kind of like the color choices, the artistic stuff and kind of the vibe in tone.

[SPEAKER_00]: So those kind of things jumped out to me the most watching this.

[SPEAKER_01]: I like the art as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was a nice, like you're saying, pretty nice blend of a sort of hand-drawn aesthetic that is then fleshed out with CGI and all that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I do think at times, you know, you have to, from a cost point of view, probably lean more into the CGI stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I think the color palette and I really liked, especially in fight sequences, they made some strong directorial choices about where light was coming from.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought you could call me the actual.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was great.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can see the action, and that's nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: I thought it was interesting.

[SPEAKER_01]: It felt different from other Marvel animated shows, and it more dignified by my eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's a sort of a smart show, I think, unlike to compare it to the Spider-Man show again.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was a very specific comic book, aesthetic choice.

[SPEAKER_01]: This felt very animation coded and in-world on Disney Plus, which I thought was smart.

[SPEAKER_01]: tangled series that the extended adventures of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, that's seriously just an animation stuff.

[SPEAKER_00]: You've been going to back from the Staglitz series, so it's good.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's good.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I watched all of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It has a deep mythology and gets into some darkness.

[SPEAKER_03]: I know you're without kids.

[SPEAKER_03]: You just love.

[SPEAKER_01]: My kids are just bothering me like, Dad, we want to watch our TV and I'm like, this is my show.

[SPEAKER_03]: And that's because you're a huge fan of Zachary Levi and all of his beliefs, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like, no, no.

[SPEAKER_01]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't actually, is he to the voice?

[SPEAKER_01]: That's it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if he doesn't have a cartoon, but he is flint writer in the movie.

[SPEAKER_01]: He, I believe is not.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm going to look that up because now I'm mad, but that's it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I agree with you guys, so the animation style, and I definitely agree with you on the Disney style characters, which I thought was interesting.

[SPEAKER_03]: It reminded me a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not a one to one, but it reminded me a little bit of predator killer of killers, which is from Tony Hulu, which [SPEAKER_03]: I think we talked about this maybe on our live show or we can geek, I don't remember which, but the idea there was, they wanted to come at it from a storyboard art perspective so that if you stopped it, this is the director Dan Tracktonberg said this, but I'm paraphrasing that if you stopped it on any frame it would look like a storyboard or a piece of art and I wonder, we didn't talk about this not to keep it up with Todd Harris, but he is a storyboard artist first, that's the main gig.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I imagine that's kind of where it came from.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's like, let's create every frame whenever you stop it.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's going to have like you were saying, Pete, these gorgeous watercolors in the background, these beautiful watches.

[SPEAKER_03]: So it was really nice looking show.

[SPEAKER_03]: I also, I love the title sequence.

[SPEAKER_03]: The music.

[SPEAKER_00]: The black and white, the music.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: So that was great as well.

[SPEAKER_03]: My, my issue with it was less with the overall concept.

[SPEAKER_03]: And this is [SPEAKER_03]: Well, all that.

[SPEAKER_03]: I was just going to sort of talk about it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like my issue with it, which is kind of a good problem, but there wasn't enough of it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like the first episode was very clearly a pilot, which I thought was great.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like you set up the concept, the conflict, how it's going to play out throughout the years.

[SPEAKER_03]: Awesome.

[SPEAKER_03]: You shake things up in the second episode with like [SPEAKER_03]: It's not historical.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's mythological.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, OK, cool.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then the third episode is, again, like, a sort of a done-in-what-adventure you introduce.

[SPEAKER_03]: Iron fist grade.

[SPEAKER_03]: But then the fourth episode is another mythology episode where it wraps up the main conflict of the show, or at least brings it to a close for the season.

[SPEAKER_02]: So by the time it kept going, got going, it was done.

[SPEAKER_02]: And to me, that I don't know what went down there if it was budget or time or whatever, but like, [SPEAKER_03]: It's the sort of thing that I really, I like this idea.

[SPEAKER_03]: I would have loved to see eight episodes, but like ten episodes, twelve episodes, fifteen episodes, something like that.

[SPEAKER_03]: So you could have more recurring characters.

[SPEAKER_03]: You could get hooked into people emotionally, because every episode, and I understand this is part and parcel with an anthology, but you jump in, get to know the people, get to know what's going on and that they're done.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they're like, for the most part, dead, because you've jumped forward.

[SPEAKER_03]: two to three hundred years or in the second episode, Doty for the first episode shows up, but she's old now and it's just kind of a cameo.

[SPEAKER_03]: So you miss a little bit of like the texture of it as a TV show because it's such a quick run.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I hear one thing I just want to kind of point out that you almost talked about was it ends with an animation of a live action which shot we saw in Black Panther.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's a cool kind of book and to be like, you know this and it's like, oh shit.

[SPEAKER_03]: I thought the last episode in particular was great.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I really liked a lot of the stuff they were working there.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was exciting to, I know were jumping towards the end there.

[SPEAKER_03]: But it was exciting to see a black path there.

[SPEAKER_03]: I was definitely like, ooh, who is it?

[SPEAKER_03]: Is it Cherie?

[SPEAKER_03]: Is it to Charles?

[SPEAKER_03]: Is it somebody else?

[SPEAKER_03]: And the fact that it was a black path there from hundreds of years in the future [SPEAKER_03]: you get the hoard, which is straight from the comics, they're just like alien insectoids, consuming everything, that was cool.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then that shot at the end that you're talking about, Pete, where they set it up like, oh, this actually does have a very specific tie to Black Panther through a bunch of time travel weirdness.

[SPEAKER_03]: I thought was really a cool way of wrapping it up, but anyway.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, yeah, because it also talks about that like that acts like as soon as you see the acts you're like, oh crap.

[SPEAKER_00]: And they talk about kind of like taking a part and it's like, well, you can't because we know it's in perfect condition to when it gets to the museum.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's an interesting kind of thing they played with a little bit, but Justin go ahead and make a cut shot.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was gonna say that even beyond that, I think it just it built out the idea of Wakanda into a much larger thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like these themes we've seen of like hiding from the world and then revealing yourself here that they paid off really well in the final episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: I thought we really got to be in that philosophy for the first three episodes and the sacrifices that people were making for the sake of Wakanda remaining Wakanda.

[SPEAKER_01]: At the same time, we saw all the like unbelievable technology at these different pin points in history that they had.

[SPEAKER_01]: And first episode, the falling sand sort of projector thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, this is so cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: And to have it back in twelve, sixty, I thought was really nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the second episode that had the emotionality paid off of Agamemnon or Memnon, is what he's called in this Memnon.

[SPEAKER_01]: proved going there and sacrificing his friendship for the sake of the country and it was really just I thought the scripts for each episode were great like we got to it was very much show don't tell it took the core police of Wakanda as granted without having to be like [SPEAKER_01]: no no you need to bring that back so that it's not shown to the world and like it didn't over explain it just did it and we got to see it through the eyes of these characters who are out in the world doing their thing even the tonal shift into the third episode which was much more of a like let's have fun again to talk about a Disney comp like he felt very basha felt very Aladdin style where he's like I'm just out here doing a thing and I sort of mess up but it's okay I'm fun and I'm still good at what I do [SPEAKER_01]: So like all of that to have it be to get to your point Alex in four episodes felt like a lot and yet still it didn't feel like enough My guess would be this was originally like a six or eight episode series that when Marvel started to be like uh-oh things are bad now They were like let's just make the ones that were already animating and Whatever however far along they were with the other ones those ones are on a shelf somewhere [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I wonder if it was a run on a money situation.

[SPEAKER_00]: One thing I would like to talk time before we get to and deep into the episodes is the it was great to see the Marvel flip back.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: Let me just find this animated flip.

[SPEAKER_00]: The animation flip.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll take it counts.

[SPEAKER_01]: You don't like most of these shows.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, but you know, you've got to plug Marvel zombies.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's important that the Marvel zombies is plugged in the animation flip for some reason.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they can't put up October.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna keep hitting it.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: Just really just a slipper.

[SPEAKER_01]: So let me, again, that's a key dissecting your sometimes insane points of view, but like you like the Marvel flip.

[SPEAKER_01]: You don't like most of the shows featured in it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you're just like the concept of a flip.

[SPEAKER_00]: I, I love, uh, the, you like, see, quickly.

[SPEAKER_00]: I like, oh, to the comics and the shout out to what got this all started.

[SPEAKER_01]: But none of the things were, oh, you, the idea that it's a flip that it's happening again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, actually, really interesting.

[SPEAKER_00]: Cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: You like pages.

[SPEAKER_01]: I like the turning of pages.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let me touch on them a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: We'll talk about the individual episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: So the first one is written by Jeffrey Thorne, directed by Todd Harris, titled, Into the Lines Den, set and Crete in twelve, sixty B.C.

[SPEAKER_03]: and to give a little bit of historical background here.

[SPEAKER_03]: I will mention that this is partially inspired, I think, by the battle of Setupuzy in twelve, sixty-three, where the Byzantine Genoese fleet [SPEAKER_03]: captured for ships and then sailed on to capture Chania, which is a city in Crete, which I thought was kind of neat.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, the second episode, we'll get into this.

[SPEAKER_03]: The second is mythological, but like where they can riff off of real history they do, which I thought was a cool little layer of the series.

[SPEAKER_03]: But I thought this was really good.

[SPEAKER_00]: intro I thought no need was an interesting character Chris Williams voice as the lion was also a brilliant voice so this was the in my mind a very cool way of starting off the show yeah agreed you get to meet a very interesting cool character someone who uh...

turns down the dorm allowed you which we've kind of up into this point been like dorm allowed she's the best like why wouldn't you want to so that was an interesting kind of [SPEAKER_00]: choice you know something that I thought was in cool twist but yeah I thought they did a great job of setting this up and cool having it kind of be this pirate kind of readers type of thing and all the ships and stuff was yeah like into the lines then I thought great start [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I liked it too.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like he said, very lot of pilot energy here to get us into the world.

[SPEAKER_01]: I thought the fight sequences were really nice.

[SPEAKER_03]: Kind of fight sequence.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Come on.

[SPEAKER_03]: I was very surprised.

[SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't necessarily bloody, but like how directly violent it was like we actually people getting killed and stabbed, which particularly given the Disney style figures, I was not expecting.

[SPEAKER_03]: But I sort of appreciate that they went [SPEAKER_03]: that way with the world because that's what Wakanda is and that's what we've been shown in the movies.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is crazy to think about Disney plus when it's first start, I was like, guys, we do really chill stuff for kids on here.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're still like, don't worry, go crazy.

[SPEAKER_01]: And now they're like, now we kill when we want.

[SPEAKER_01]: In each kid's style shows, which are animated.

[SPEAKER_01]: And now I turned on Disney plus and I'm like, I was looking up twenty eight weeks later to watch and I was like, on my TV and it was like Disney plus I was like, what the?

[SPEAKER_01]: Featuring twenty eight weeks later.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, and that's a horrifying violent movie, so kids get loose on there.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's your life part.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's what the past is all about.

[SPEAKER_03]: We can move on, I guess, and talk about episode two legends and lies.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is written by Mark Bernardin, directed by John Fang.

[SPEAKER_03]: And this is set during the Trojan War.

[SPEAKER_03]: Interesting thing that I ended up at a log conversation with my wife about which you guys might know, but the Trojan War probably isn't real, and neither is the Trojan horse.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if you guys do that.

[SPEAKER_03]: This she was like, no, what?

[SPEAKER_03]: What are you talking about?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I, good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I, as a kid, I learned it as truth, so it's interesting that that got debunked.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, it's, it may or may not be, apparently it's a huge debate with historical scholars, whether any of that happened.

[SPEAKER_03]: We do know, in fact, the Troy burned down, which is what they're showing towards the end of this episode, but the rest of it, as detailed to the Aliad, [SPEAKER_03]: probably a mix of some truth, mostly fiction, mostly mythology, all mixed together, and that's something that's just become accepted over time.

[SPEAKER_03]: What were you gonna say, Justin?

[SPEAKER_01]: I was gonna say, watching this, I was like, this is not real.

[SPEAKER_01]: The idea of the like, they're like, you know what I got an idea, let's make a giant horse, they love horses.

[SPEAKER_01]: They all definitely think this is a statue for them, made out of shotty wood we found.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's very much like a kid's idea, but a cool story.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I definitely buy that it is not a real thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: But something that has been sort of mythologized out of some perhaps real fight and pillaging of a town or burning [SPEAKER_03]: So a couple of quick things about this.

[SPEAKER_03]: One big fan of like Greek myths and stuff.

[SPEAKER_03]: So generally I like these stories.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like these characters very fun to see all of them.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think overall it was a fun and like you said, ultimately heartbreaking episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: Bye.

[SPEAKER_03]: It threw me a little bit to have this as the second episode in the MCU.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like the first one, like we talked about based on real historical fact that I did not know until I started looking at a researcher yet and tried to figure out what they were basic and on.

[SPEAKER_03]: I kind of wish that they had gone with like interesting pockets of history for the second episode versus like, nope, we're jumping straight to myth on top of myth is kind of what it struck me as because you've got like [SPEAKER_03]: this mythological comic book story of Wakanda and the Afro Futurism going on there at the same time as you've got the stuff of the Iliad it was just a little too much for me like if we were going to do that if we were going to hit niths throughout history and this is how Wakanda caused them I think that would be neat but I don't know there's something interesting a little [SPEAKER_01]: So it was, it was the fact that it was in a slightly mythological world.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it wasn't the healing spray he shot on his arm or the other stuff that happened.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, if you're already taking the work out to stuff, I'm not immediately thinking about a thing that would make sense.

[SPEAKER_03]: But like throwing cats at American World War II and being like, oh, now we have Hydra here.

[SPEAKER_03]: And if this extra thing beyond everything is going on, while World War II is really going out of the background, I'm like, yeah, all right, that's fine.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's that class to have that hat is too many for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Too many hats.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was like it was like a fleece on a fleece is the way I would call nice golden golden on top.

[SPEAKER_03]: You think a golden underbeat would be flashing your bronze just like real dark hair fleeces if you [SPEAKER_01]: You're really sweating it out no matter what you're doing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Here's the thing on the opposite side.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love this.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is my favorite episode of series.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoyed it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I thought this was the most emotional episode by a long shot.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was I was shocked by the way that it went down.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can't believe he killed.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can't believe his buddy.

[SPEAKER_00]: But it was really heartbreaking.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm setting up break.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I can't believe also they came in and they were just like straight up stabbing the Trojan soldiers in the in the back Or then sorry the other to help soldiers the Trojans were stabbing the other soldiers in the back I was like guys you're not supposed to do that from a good guy point of view [SPEAKER_01]: And then, but it really worked the coins on the eyes at the end.

[SPEAKER_01]: It just felt like such a nice composed piece.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, brought the Wakanda technology in in a cool way at the same time.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's being held secret.

[SPEAKER_01]: and the danger of exposing this to the outside world felt really like that ring true in this episode and just beautifully done fight sequences.

[SPEAKER_01]: The fight sequence at the end when Memnon's on fire at a point like it was just awesome.

[SPEAKER_01]: Really great.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was a it was really heartbreaking because you know you have these two great friends and they're going on adventures together.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think they're gonna be the best of buds till the end of time and then I was just like oh [SPEAKER_00]: You got to tell him better in this man.

[SPEAKER_00]: Not like this.

[SPEAKER_00]: Not like this.

[SPEAKER_01]: I killed UP because you had a special comic book in your background that I needed to get from like people.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that would be, that would be a great foreshadowing, by the way.

[SPEAKER_03]: Two quick things that I wanted to say about the episode, one before somebody else would be in the comments, we're never going to make it out alive, Justin, just so you know.

[SPEAKER_03]: Because your house's death trap is that wild.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's got home alone style traps.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just know it.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is living a home alone adult lifestyle.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can guarantee there's traps in his house.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that is that way.

[SPEAKER_03]: I keep talking to you about the audio on the podcast and I keep hearing.

[SPEAKER_03]: Keep the change.

[SPEAKER_03]: You feel the out of the background is that what's going on?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a different bandit being murdered by people every day.

[SPEAKER_03]: A dry bandit.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't have any other texture.

[SPEAKER_01]: Moist different gradations of moisture.

[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously lukewarm.

[SPEAKER_03]: Two things I was going to say one before somebody else would be in the comments about this.

[SPEAKER_03]: Technically the Trojard War is already canonical for the MCU because Gilgamesh and Turtles.

[SPEAKER_03]: I guess I think this was a bench and I haven't got about this.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have the LAU about referencing Turtles on them.

[SPEAKER_03]: And anyway, he talks about giving the soldiers to one of the Trojan War, a combination of beer, wine, and beer that he figured out, I don't know.

[SPEAKER_03]: So that came up there.

[SPEAKER_03]: The other thing that I wanted to mention that I thought was pretty not purposely funny, but made me laugh was the after the at the end of the cold open would then nod and Achilles come over the wall and Achilles is like, we're gonna win this for Greece and then Nebdan is like, I'm going to win this for what?

[SPEAKER_03]: God, and I was like, yeah, we know [SPEAKER_03]: We know it's for a condo.

[SPEAKER_03]: You have a condon accent.

[SPEAKER_03]: You're the guy from what condon has a little secret with us.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's just giving himself a popdog.

[SPEAKER_00]: Why do you hate people talking to themselves?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like how we say when we start the show, I'm gonna win this for Justin.

[SPEAKER_03]: But you do do that.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's what you see.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about the third episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: This one is title lost and found it said in China.

[SPEAKER_03]: Fourteen hundred A.D.

[SPEAKER_03]: written once again by Mark Bernard and directed by John Feng and Todd Harris.

[SPEAKER_03]: The big thing here is the official introduction of iron fist to the MCU.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is Gerani.

[SPEAKER_03]: She is a iron fist to his not from the comics entirely original for the first.

[SPEAKER_03]: Fresh fist and not to get too complicated, not to bring up another thing that I should not bring up.

[SPEAKER_03]: But Iron fist, Danny Rand, I guess technically, has been grandfathered in because Daredevil is canonical now, but I sort of feel like until they mentioned him on Daredevil port again.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not like they can go in that direction.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like a cousin that's definitely in your family, but like, doesn't he's an invited?

[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, yes, technically he's a part of the family, but he's not coming to the picnic because he messed up.

[SPEAKER_00]: The fight sequence and this were just fantastic.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was so great seeing her walk past and like every time like they were like, oh, it looks like she's in trouble.

[SPEAKER_00]: She's like, I'm the item first.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I, this was my favorite episode.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was a great choice for IronFist, great kind of, yeah, this was really some fantastic fight sequences and just awesome.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was very excited.

[SPEAKER_00]: This was like very rewarding as a comic book fan to be like, oh, what a cool, you know, IronFist story, this is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Add it to the flip, I say.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, please, come on.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love the way they animated the fest itself and the way the power was sort of pulled out here.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I also think just in the series of four, this was really cool in that it was sort of the first opening of Wakanda like letting her go.

[SPEAKER_01]: These guys sort of conspiring to cover their tracks here.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's gave us a little crack in the door to show where this series and sort of the story of Wakanda in the larger MCU was going to go.

[SPEAKER_03]: I also appreciated to sort of contrast what I was saying about the book.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is for Wakanda reveal episode two.

[SPEAKER_03]: Whereas as an audience, we know it's the iron fist is comic book fans.

[SPEAKER_03]: So we are ahead of the game when it comes to the character saying it out loud as well as the folks in Wakanda.

[SPEAKER_03]: But they played it out, I thought perfectly.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like it's still every moment, every single reveal hit really nicely.

[SPEAKER_03]: Just well done episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: Forgive me if I don't remember this from the Iron Fist Television series.

[SPEAKER_01]: In that story, does he say, yes, I defeated a dragon and that's why my fist is hard.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think he says fist is hard.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's iron.

[SPEAKER_00]: For the right sense of freedom.

[SPEAKER_00]: He is hard fist.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then it isn't until that last episode where he's like iron fist.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that's clear.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that.

[SPEAKER_03]: I if I remember correctly and it's been a while since I've gone back and rewatched iron fist aka never I believe they never show the dragon they're just so I'm sure I never show but I can guarantee that yeah he it happened and he talks about it but I think it was one of those things where it's like he goes into a cave if I remember correctly and it's like well fought a dragon [SPEAKER_01]: really cool because that's the thing to your point like to that we we saw in phrase we knew it was going to be unfist but I was like how far into the actual comic book legendary we're going to get and and we did get to hear it which I thought was really cool and a fun solution at the end with her big life you're going to talk about just taking the vibrating of the talk from the statue [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they talked it out.

[SPEAKER_00]: It just be fucking honest about what you need here, and we can get it to a reasonable solution.

[SPEAKER_00]: Great.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, please.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: I also liked because he couldn't get Basha couldn't get the tongue out in the, and when he initially stole it, it was very much like, can you help me open this pickle jar with your iron fist at the end when she ranks it out?

[SPEAKER_03]: And we talked about this a little bit already, but let's discuss the last episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is the last Panther.

[SPEAKER_03]: It said an Ethiopia city of Ottawa, AT-N-D-Six.

[SPEAKER_03]: We're in by Jeffrey Thorne directed by Todd Harris, and we get a lot of stuff here.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'll just mention on this turkled bent.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is very specifically about a battle that happened really in history on March first, AT-N-D-Six, the Battle of Ottawa.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was a decisive blow in the first Italian Ethiopian war, and the Ethiopian forces successfully stopped the Italians from taking the horn of Africa, and that's where Prince Defarie and Kuda find themselves in the middle of, which I thought was [SPEAKER_03]: pretty neat and get like not to talk about the mythological episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'd love to see more of that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like more pockets of history that to be fragged us as Americans probably don't know about quite as well.

[SPEAKER_03]: That is a cool thing to see at a series like this.

[SPEAKER_03]: So if they do get to do a season two.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you want more like four scum tile like where it would just be like something happening and then it would be like.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, I like my young Indiana Jones Chronicles style of adventures.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me say guys, those are both bad references.

[SPEAKER_01]: Neither of those is a good idea.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good luck pitching either of those ideas to anyone.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, thanks.

[SPEAKER_03]: Anyway, like I said before, I thought this was really cool.

[SPEAKER_03]: All of the last Panther stuff was awesome.

[SPEAKER_03]: I liked Christmas for Vari and Kuda.

[SPEAKER_03]: I thought there were great characters deep to song to great actor, awesome to hear of his Kuda.

[SPEAKER_03]: So cool episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me ask you, Alex, in your research, did you find did the watch a show up at the Battle of Adwa?

[SPEAKER_03]: No.

[SPEAKER_03]: Wait, did the watch a show up that I totally missed it?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, right at the beginning.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's a frame.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it might be like truly right at the beginning when they're just riding in.

[SPEAKER_01]: The watchers in the deep background and they ride past and sort of he vanishes.

[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe your brain was deleting that because you were concerned about the hat on a hat of having a watcher be there.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I thought that was a nice little nod.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, oh, what a fun Easter egg.

[SPEAKER_01]: He kind of thing referencing another Marvel show.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it really was because [SPEAKER_01]: This was such a pivotal moment in the history of Earth because they saved the planet from the future.

[SPEAKER_01]: And again, I like the way that they were able to pay off the idea of what kind of opening up being essential to this survival of.

[SPEAKER_01]: humanity.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes Justin same season.

[SPEAKER_00]: I thought that was such a cool thing to circle back and talk about from the Black Panther movie and the things that we already know.

[SPEAKER_00]: So what's what a cool idea of like something we did really helped the future was such a great idea.

[SPEAKER_00]: Also just hearing somebody say, what kind of forever like that was just heartbreaking and amazing.

[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, just cool stuff cool stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought they to tie the series together in a lighter touch way where it wasn't that everything built to this moment.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was that she went back in time and looked at these moments and then found the one that was the most important feature in this episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it made it cohere as a series about feeling a little too forced or gimmicky.

[SPEAKER_03]: I also, I haven't, I definitely haven't got back and watched this.

[SPEAKER_03]: I wonder if she shows up in the previous episodes.

[SPEAKER_03]: I feel like she's got to, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, got to be somewhere in the background or something like that, checking out these moments, but I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I thought you said, move got to and I got real scared for a second.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they're ever going to do this, but I like the idea that the hoard is going to attack no matter what, so if that is [SPEAKER_03]: something they want to return to and like anizable condos season two or some show or movie down the road.

[SPEAKER_03]: Somewhere around twenty three ninety six.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's still going to go down.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's just that what condos part of it.

[SPEAKER_03]: So it's going to turn the tide.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe the eyes of Cicovia.

[SPEAKER_01]: Secret series.

[SPEAKER_03]: Where can these go next?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, what do we talk about this if there aren't any other, any other moments from the episode you guys want to call out in particular?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, feel very good about.

[SPEAKER_01]: I really enjoyed this as a series.

[SPEAKER_03]: Great.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, why don't we talk about vision board where we think likely there is not going to be an isomocod disease and two just because of everything going on with Marvel Studios, but if there was or what would you want to see in the future?

[SPEAKER_03]: What's coming up next?

[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe what's coming up next in general for Wakanda or would you want to see?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I feel like, you know, there's so much of what kind of do we explore.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would love to just kind of hang out with some scientists or get some inventors, you know, just all sorts of like young people.

[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, any of that stuff, you know?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the anti-psychle team, you know, like really digs ending.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know, but I do think that there's a lot of Wakanda to explore, and I don't know, more would be, would be a lot better than none, so, yes, please, to Mar Wakanda.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I agree like I feel like it would be a surprise if they did more of this, but I wish they would.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know what the larger plan it feels like.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think we're going a full year without getting a Marvel movie, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: So there's their space for stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think Marvel maybe learned a slightly wrong lesson from having too much content on TV in between all of the movies they were doing and like I can't do any of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think you can do that stuff and we have a hunger for it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's just when it feels like homework when it feels so tied together.

[SPEAKER_01]: that's less interesting.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I be curious what the animation viewership is across the board.

[SPEAKER_01]: If that's any way for them to keep making stuff for us to enjoy in between these movies.

[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, not to get too wonky about it, but I think they spend too much money on these animated shows, particularly for the return they're getting, which is not much.

[SPEAKER_03]: If they did it like more traditional animation, cut the budget down a little bit, did more episodes of it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think that might work out better for them, but I don't think they're going to do that at any respect.

[SPEAKER_03]: But as a fan, like I said, I'd love to see more eyes of Wakanda.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'd love to see more episodes.

[SPEAKER_03]: The one thing that we do know we're getting is they are actively working on Black Panther three.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's one of the only movies we know that they have in development.

[SPEAKER_03]: Ryan Coogler is coming back or should be coming back.

[SPEAKER_03]: Denzel Washington is in it in some sort of role, which is interesting.

[SPEAKER_03]: So beyond that, I don't think we have any actual confirmed information about it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think though we'll necessarily work in any of the stuff from Isopalconda, but like [SPEAKER_03]: I do think dumping it or not, they clearly have shown, they know they want to be of the ride Googler business, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: Like Black Panther three is a sure thing.

[SPEAKER_03]: Ironheart followed by Isabel Condod did come out.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I think it's the sort of thing that like, [SPEAKER_02]: If Ryan Kougler has an idea or somebody who works with has an idea that's going to flesh out the world of Wakanda in some way, I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility even if the stuff hasn't hit that we will see more side projects with Wakanda down the road potentially.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, I don't know from what I've read that this people are a little bit mixed on their enjoyment of this.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think we're more positive than a lot of people.

[SPEAKER_01]: So like, I don't know if this will be considered a win, but anything more is exciting.

[SPEAKER_01]: If this part of the MCU is working and it seems to be or at least Ryan Couglar is working just as a person.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the more he will probably make more stuff somewhere, hopefully here.

[SPEAKER_03]: And if you like to support this podcast and on the podcast, we do patreon.com slash comic book club, also we do a live show every Tuesday night at seven p.m.

[SPEAKER_03]: to YouTube coming out.

[SPEAKER_03]: We would love to chat with you about Marvel Apple Spotify Android or the app of your choice to subscribe, listen and follow the show.

[SPEAKER_03]: Comic book club live.com for this podcast and many more until next time stay marvelous.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I looked it up and it is Zachary Levi doing the voice.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks Alex.