[SPEAKER_01]: Hey guys, it's Ali, welcome back to InForLiftThePodcast.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is episode 344 called Jessica Bell Vanderwell.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, friends, if you're listening to this and you're going through some sort of infertility journey or TTC journey and you're looking for extra support, please come check out FertilityRally.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They're both available on my website infertilavegroup.com and the special thing going on right now, where if you get both books, you'll be able to get both books.

[SPEAKER_01]: there's a special duo price.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So check them out both the books at InferlifeGroop.com.

[SPEAKER_01]: As always, let me know if you have any questions and thanks again for your support.

[SPEAKER_01]: Alright, so today's guest is Jessica Bell Vanderwal, who's the co-founder and CEO of Frame fertility, which is a fertility care platform that she built alongside her husband Cory after facing their own challenges in starting a family.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to get into all of it today.

[SPEAKER_01]: She's going to talk about having PCOS.

[SPEAKER_01]: going through IUI, some of the other health problems she experienced when she was trying to family-build and then she's going to talk about frame in exactly what they're doing and how they are changing the fertility space.

[SPEAKER_01]: You guys know I love female founders who started something because they went through their own fertility journey and they saw a need for something new.

[SPEAKER_01]: So this is what happened with Jessica.

[SPEAKER_01]: Without further ado, this is Jessica, on Infertilif.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hi, Jessica, how are you?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's so good to talk to you today.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, likewise, good to talk to you too.

[SPEAKER_00]: So honored to be here.

[SPEAKER_00]: Such a big fan of your work and your podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for having me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I love what you're doing.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll get into all that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But before we get into what you're doing with frame, I would love to start with your personal story.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I always like to ask, have you always wanted to have kids?

[SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, gosh.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's so many things that come up for me because funny enough today.

[SPEAKER_00]: I actually took my daughter to her first kindergarten class.

[SPEAKER_00]: Um, so I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my god.

[SPEAKER_00]: A funny like question for a day like today.

[SPEAKER_00]: That is why I did you cry.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, a little bit in the car mostly, you know, I kept it together and she was like, bye.

[SPEAKER_00]: Um, you know, no hesitation on her and it's when you realize how fast.

[SPEAKER_00]: time goes 100% the moments where like, wow, how did I get here?

[SPEAKER_00]: But also to your comment, I mean, it's, it's wild too to reflect because, you know, she, she just turned five.

[SPEAKER_00]: She's going into kindergarten.

[SPEAKER_00]: And when I think about how did I get here, you know, it's very much entangled with [SPEAKER_00]: all the struggles that we went through within fertility, and it's hard to separate the two, just like frankly, it's hard to separate the reality that I gave birth in the early part of the pandemic.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like a lot of things are in our woven here, and you know, to your original question, I end in flowed on wanting to have kids.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think from the probably early days of my life, like I know I wanted to build a family, but I wasn't sure what that family was going to look like, [SPEAKER_00]: She will always be on first baby, but I wasn't sure what what the family would look like.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think over time, I realized that I really wanted to have children.

[SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, even when I did, I was like, I don't know what this family will look like.

[SPEAKER_00]: How big I wanted to be.

[SPEAKER_00]: So there's a lot of things that, you know, we're kind of the waves that you go through as you age, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's what's so funny is that as a result, I probably didn't think to ask questions about if I want to plan ahead, what should I be thinking about?

[SPEAKER_00]: What should I be asking?

[SPEAKER_00]: And I also feel like when I was in my 20s, it wasn't very common for people even talk about this with people like I want kids.

[SPEAKER_00]: How do I think about this, et cetera?

[SPEAKER_00]: Whereas now, I feel like it's such a topic of conversation for better words, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and so I, [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's interesting to watch this evolution.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I would definitely say, you know, after I found my partner, my husband, Corey, it definitely became more clear to me that we were going to build a family together.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that we have children together.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that ironically is what led to my first conversation about fertility.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was right after we got married.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was in my early 30s.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I [SPEAKER_00]: went into my OBGYN during my annual well in the visit and said, I'm thinking about having kids one day.

[SPEAKER_00]: What do I need to worry about?

[SPEAKER_00]: Or what do I need to think about?

[SPEAKER_00]: And she was like, Oh, no, no.

[SPEAKER_00]: Don't worry about it.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're healthy.

[SPEAKER_00]: Try when you're ready.

[SPEAKER_00]: Come back.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, we'll have that conversation.

[SPEAKER_00]: If you have any issues.

[SPEAKER_01]: Interesting.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: No other dialogue.

[SPEAKER_01]: And what did you learn growing up about fertility?

[SPEAKER_01]: Did you know anything about it?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because it's a very common theme on the show.

[SPEAKER_00]: It really was not a thought in my mind for a whole host of reasons.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I grew up in Carolina and I feel like most of the people around me, you know, my generation and previous to that had kids younger than me for sure.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it seemed like it was easy.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, ironically, what's so fascinating is once I then did start struggling, I talked to my mom.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I learned that she had a lot of challenges and went through miscarriages, et cetera.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that was eye-opening because again, I didn't think to ask my mom or even think that her history was going to be similar to my history et cetera.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so, no, I didn't think about this at all growing up.

[SPEAKER_00]: I also grew up Catholic.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, for whole host of reasons, just not have these conversations.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, it was, it was definitely shocking to then, okay, struggle and be told, well, you're a little older.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was like, older.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, my mid 30s, like, yes, it feels spot on.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, let's talk about that after you left your OBGYN and, you know, they, she was like, no problem.

[SPEAKER_01]: Go for it.

[SPEAKER_01]: What was the next step?

[SPEAKER_01]: What happened with you and your husband?

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, when you guys did start to try.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, so after that conversation, as you can imagine, we kind of put it in the back of our mind.

[SPEAKER_00]: We didn't think twice.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so then, you know, four, five years later, you know, once we've had some time, you know, post wedding career, et cetera, then we did start trying and it was shocking to me that a couple of things surfaced.

[SPEAKER_00]: One is tracking my ovulation was really tough, like the standard kind of.

[SPEAKER_00]: OPEKs did not work well, like the LH surge was not showing up correctly.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was really struggling with that whole set of data and understanding how to track ovulation.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, frankly, I should have known I have really had irregular cycles my entire life.

[SPEAKER_00]: But again, it just didn't connect those dots.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I struggled for, you know, the better part of a year by myself.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then finally I asked for help, and that's when it almost feels like this Pandora's box of things was uncovered.

[SPEAKER_00]: So then I found out, I have PCOS.

[SPEAKER_00]: I found out I have a my own thyroid condition.

[SPEAKER_00]: I found out that you know, a lot of the history that I had, you know, having a period very late in life and very irregular cycles, my mother's history, all of that played in.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was just [SPEAKER_00]: shocking to me because I never heard a lot of these turns before, but I just didn't connect any of these dots.

[SPEAKER_00]: And right, did you find up by going to an REI or like, what, well, it was kind of, it was an interesting dynamic where I went back to my OB-GYN because that was, you know, I was very regular.

[SPEAKER_00]: I always like went to my annual Wellham visits.

[SPEAKER_00]: I always did all my taxpayers.

[SPEAKER_00]: I like felt like I was checking all the boxes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so just the same, I kind of brought it up in my annual Wellham visit.

[SPEAKER_00]: I left that that doctor's visit and then I got a phone call where somebody actually left on a voicemail that I had cysts on my ovaries and that I needed to follow up with a reproductive and a chronologist.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so then I scrambled to try to find a fertility clinic and, you know, fortunately, I did find one, but, you know, was a four month weight list.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was panicking every day on that weight list.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think I called them every day to see if they had cancellations.

[SPEAKER_00]: So they finally got me in with somebody who was like on the edge of their retirement.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was just, [SPEAKER_00]: right.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lot to get this to get this removed.

[SPEAKER_00]: You had to wait that well I didn't so I never got this this removed and more of a check out I guess well I guess it's you know when you have PCOS there's a variety of different symptoms you can have and one of those is you can actually have this on your ovaries which again it's not like they need to be removed it's just okay polycystic ovaries and so again got it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't that, in fact, if anything, what's so ironic is, we kind of moved past that all that really quickly.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was more like, it looks like you're going to struggle, you know, looks like, you know, you've been diagnosed with infertility because you've been trying for a certain amount of time.

[SPEAKER_00]: But the underlying conditions were not really addressed at that point.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was more just, let's focus on number one, which is getting you pregnant.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so it was really, [SPEAKER_00]: a kind of a quick shift to getting to an REI and having it a discussion about what we do from here.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then, man, so much terminology.

[SPEAKER_01]: So many other side of the acronyms.

[SPEAKER_01]: What was the diagnosis and then what was the treatment plan?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So frankly, like the diagnosis, I still don't know if I fully understand today, but in general, and again, you know, I basically was not ovulating on any kind of regular schedule.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's a variety of things also going on for myself and my partner.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so as a result, we were told that IVF was probably going to be our next best option, especially if we wanted to have multiple kids.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we went back and forth on this, because I did, as you can imagine, [SPEAKER_00]: I feel like I called every doctor that I knew because I come from health care.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like I worked in health care in my entire career.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I went tried to dig in and figure out, you know, should get a second opinion.

[SPEAKER_00]: What's happening, et cetera, long story short.

[SPEAKER_00]: We actually ended up going down the IUI route for a whole host of reasons.

[SPEAKER_00]: And fortunately, I did get pregnant through IUI.

[SPEAKER_00]: Now, that also was interwoven with our...

[SPEAKER_00]: expected decision that we were likely only going to have one child because at this point I was also in my late thirties we were dealing with some other things in life and we decided we only wanted one kid so okay that was the path we went down I also had no fertility benefits no no coverage so [SPEAKER_00]: Say, imagine a lot of things play into that, and I still feel in many ways like I was one of the lucky ones that kind of got through this in a way where I didn't have to try with multiple cycles, et cetera, but no question like it was so anxiety inducing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I struggled with a lot of it decisions and yeah, can we talk about that a little bit more I love talking about the mental health aspect of all of this and again I've been very open about how you know I was very depressed and lots of mental health issues and saw a therapist and you know my husband and I weren't doing well all these things so what did it look like for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was really tough.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I, I will say, you know, one of the things that I struggle with a lot and I worry that a lot of women do is this feeling of like guilt feeling like I did something wrong here.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like I, I must have missed a step.

[SPEAKER_00]: I must have eaten something I shouldn't have.

[SPEAKER_00]: I must have been too stressed right like there's all this information.

[SPEAKER_00]: flowing to you, especially on social media, it can make you feel like it is your fault.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I carry a ton of shame around with this.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that definitely, you know, now knowing what I know is not the right kind of feeling to have in the way that we shouldn't have to feel that way, but no matter what that is how I felt.

[SPEAKER_00]: And [SPEAKER_00]: as a result.

[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't tell anyone.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like we didn't talk to anybody in our life about this.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I really tell my family.

[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like one of my friends kind of knew because she was going through something similar, but like, yeah, really tight.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a lot to carry.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a heavy load.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was really hard.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you know, [SPEAKER_00]: at night in social media and, you know, Google were not good friends either, right, and it's a very dark place to live on your own to read articles where you feel like each article contradicts the other one and you see all these social media stories and ads that just again make you feel like well, maybe it's [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it's just another vitamin I need to take, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: It just, it felt really hard and very isolating.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I feel like as a result, I don't know about you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I, I were treated in life in general.

[SPEAKER_00]: I just kind of pulled back from a lot of relationships, a lot of friends, because I didn't want to have to answer questions.

[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, frankly, a lot of my friends were pregnant.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that adds to, you know, the knife in your heart, basically, like seeing it happen, quote unquote so easily for other people that was a hard one for me to and, you know, we talk about this in our fertility rally groups a lot to is just feeling like you're getting left behind or feeling like you're being passed up by friends and it does affect friendships too, you know, as much as you don't want it to.

[SPEAKER_01]: So did you have to go to like baby showers and things like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Was that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I muscle through it, you know, for better words, I don't know if I should have just removed myself from the situation, but I tried to muscle through it.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, a lot of these were my very close friends and I support them.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was excited for them.

[SPEAKER_00]: That was totally part is that you, you can carry both.

[SPEAKER_00]: You can carry happiness for a friend, but like also anger that like it isn't this way for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's just no.

[SPEAKER_01]: both things can be true, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's exactly, exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: It took me a long time to wrap my head around that, too.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just the mental gymnastics of feeling jealous of someone, but happy for them at the same time, and then being like, what?

[SPEAKER_01]: I've never felt these conflicting feelings before wrestling with that in my own, am I a jerk?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because I'm thinking this, you know, like, exactly, and beating myself up just right now.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: you know, you've gone down those spirals too, I'm sure.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's, yes, it's, it's so hard.

[SPEAKER_01]: So back to the IUI, so you did get pregnant.

[SPEAKER_01]: How did that feel to, to get that, you know, news that that had been successful?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, what's so funny, I think, is when you've struggled and you've tried and you've gone down these paths, it's, it's weird how you almost don't let yourself fully accept it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that is something that I see so often with the people that we work with is you feel like you're constantly holding your breath like yes, I see what you're seeing on the screen.

[SPEAKER_00]: I see an ultrasound with the baby, but I don't know if I can actually can't accept it yet because I'm still terrified.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm still terrified.

[SPEAKER_00]: This isn't real.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm still terrified that we've tried and tried and tried and now you're telling me I should be happy and that that light switch is not immediate to turn on and so as a result like yes I did feel happy in some ways, but I also still felt like I was clenching right like guarding your heart Yes, exactly like oh, but I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean we've been down these paths before and totally it didn't work So again, it feels hard to accept and I think that is [SPEAKER_00]: another thing that is really tough about those of us that have been diagnosed with infertility and gone through a fertility treatment, you feel like you're still waiting for the next thing in the next and the next thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then when the baby is finally there, you do start to feel some relief, but I will say what was really challenging is, and I can imagine so many [SPEAKER_00]: people went through this, you know, COVID hit on the third trimester of our pregnancy.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so we didn't, we didn't have any baby showers.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we didn't really celebrate it.

[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, nobody even really saw me pregnant.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that, I mean, that layered in a whole set of other things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because I think to some degree, you start to unravel, you know, some of those feelings over time as you start to get further down the path.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I never really did feel that much relief [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think what was so tough is like you feel like maybe over time as you get from like first trimester to second trimester to third trimester like some of the anxiety starts to unravel but you know when the pandemic hit in the middle of the process I don't feel like that unraveling was ever really possible and so you know even when I was there on the other side of it holding a baby it.

[SPEAKER_00]: it still felt terrifying in some other different ways.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so as a result, I did struggle with postpartum depression on the other into this and I always wonder if like a lot of these pieces are in a related of course.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so again, yeah, I think when you've gone through this, you just you still feel like, oh, man, I hope we can get through this.

[SPEAKER_00]: I hope we can get through the other side of it.

[SPEAKER_00]: But it, it really colors a lot of the kind of anxiety that you carry throughout the journey to.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do you feel like to just cut that after going through your fertility struggles, did it change you as a person?

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's so many different ways that I think it changes you.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I would say like, in many ways, I feel like it changed me for the better.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, obviously, I'm overjoyed that I'm on the other side of this.

[SPEAKER_00]: I have a child that I look at and I [SPEAKER_00]: And so grateful, but I also like remember the struggle and I know that we like battled through it and did get to the other side of it so it's a feeling of like we can be resilient, we can overcome and as a result, I have a company as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: So in some ways, it did make me stronger as a person and that I'm very grateful for.

[SPEAKER_00]: But on the other hand, I think the thing that it also changed in me is like this desire and hunger to want to understand my health better, to want to understand what's going on in my body, in ways that act.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think you almost assume yourself to be somewhat invincible in your 20s and when you're younger and you feel like I am kind of quote unquote healthy everything is going to kind of work out it really brought to the surface this like desire to understand my hormones to understand fertility just all of these questions popped up in my mind and I was like, well, these all seem so interrelated how how does this puzzle not come together earlier and more clearly for women so.

[SPEAKER_00]: exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: Definitely changed me from that perspective too and I will I will absolutely carry that and I am now as I start to think about Perry medical as a medical.

[SPEAKER_00]: I want to understand these pieces.

[SPEAKER_00]: I really do and so I think I think to brought that down to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, such a good point.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think so many of us are so shocked to find ourselves in the infertility world.

[SPEAKER_01]: I never thought that was going to be me, you know, though that happens to other people and you know, I hear that time and again too.

[SPEAKER_01]: So let's talk about frame fertility.

[SPEAKER_01]: Frame was founded in 2020, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we were the same with fertility rally.

[SPEAKER_01]: We found in 2020.

[SPEAKER_01]: This podcast was 2019 just before.

[SPEAKER_01]: But you know, it seems like a million years ago, but it also seems like it's gone by so quickly.

[SPEAKER_01]: So tell me first of all, let's just start with what is frame?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, frame is evolved so much too over the last five years as you can probably guess.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, really what frame is doing is providing a platform and really [SPEAKER_00]: support of patients at every stage of the fertility journey and now even beyond.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so we think of ourselves as virtual care and concierge for again every stage of the fertility and family building journey and every type of person or a couple obviously too.

[SPEAKER_00]: So we.

[SPEAKER_00]: We really, in the beginning, really wanted to focus on how do we help with early risk screening, how do we help with early conversations about fertility, education, et cetera.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then over time, as you can imagine, it led us to kind of the full scope of the fertility and infertility journey as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we now do support patients at every stage, whether they're just curious, planning, [SPEAKER_00]: trying to conceive or struggling and going through infertility treatment.

[SPEAKER_00]: And again, we're starting to even bridge beyond that.

[SPEAKER_00]: But it's it's really a place for patients that want to understand their fertility and need additional support.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: So how do they get involved with you and like, who are you trying to reach?

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, is there an ideal patient or is it all infertility patients?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a great question.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think the core philosophy of frame is that everything we do is integrated into your existing care journey with your providers.

[SPEAKER_00]: So one of the things that, you know, I think I've learned more and more over time and I've been, you know, educated by patients, but also our medical director, OBGYN's reproductive and acknowledges is, [SPEAKER_00]: They're a fantastic people, I have never been more in all of the physicians and other clinicians I work with and in this role.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think what I realize now is like everybody's trying to do the best they can, but they have limited time and they have limited resources.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so we're really about extending their care.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so we integrate directly into the care of your OBGYN office, your primary care office and your fertility clinic.

[SPEAKER_00]: and really function in terms of like bridging the gap in between and kind of extending their care after hours and in ways that you can't accomplish in a, you know, 10 to 12 minute annual well will visit.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like it's, it's wild that we actually assumed that that conversation and all of its richness can happen there.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so it's really embedded in your current care journey.

[SPEAKER_00]: And to your comment, when I think about the ideal patient, because we support patients at every stage, like, there really isn't one because I do think that there should be a place for anyone that wants care and support on this journey to walk in a door and to feel like they are heard and they are seen and they are navigated to their next steps.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I would say about a.

[SPEAKER_00]: Almost like a third, a third, a third in terms of our patient base, some are just curious and planning for the future, a third or like in it, trying to conceive, maybe even struggling a little bit in the early stages and then a third are actively in treatment with a fertility clinic in some way, shape or form.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's fantastic because as a result, we now have seen patients, I mean, over the years, my great all the way through.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's really fantastic.

[SPEAKER_00]: We've been working with many of our patients for years.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so it's really wonderful to watch their journey fully evolve.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: that's so cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's so fun.

[SPEAKER_01]: It reminds me yesterday.

[SPEAKER_01]: So at the rally, we've had members same as you like that kind of come to us when they're first starting out or, you know, they're first round of whatever.

[SPEAKER_01]: The treatment may be.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then if they do have a baby, we have these onesies that we send out that say my mama rallied for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I just sent out like an our latest batch of onesies.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it is so it's so cool to see people, like you said, going through the whole process.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then leaving the rally because we don't want [SPEAKER_01]: you will kind of stay, but you know, like the churn, as they say, you know, we're like, okay, that means you don't need us anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: Great.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's break it down even a little bit further with what you guys are doing at frame and what's offered to you, say that I'm like totally new to this world and just feeling really overwhelmed.

[SPEAKER_01]: I come to your website, like what do you think are the the couple of things that are going to be the most valuable for somebody in that position?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, great question.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, again, our primary method of bringing patients on to frame is through a referral from your healthcare provider, or you being part of their practice and raising their hand to use our product.

[SPEAKER_00]: But again, people can come directly to our website, and we provide, again, ahead of a full scope of services.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that can take the form of full service virtual care.

[SPEAKER_00]: So if you were to come in and say, I don't even know what I need.

[SPEAKER_00]: You would go out our AI-powered intake that would [SPEAKER_00]: learn as you give it information.

[SPEAKER_00]: So where are you in the journey?

[SPEAKER_00]: What are your goals for your family?

[SPEAKER_00]: Do even want a family?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like what are you here for?

[SPEAKER_00]: And then would ask you a series of questions.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then from there, you would be then matched with one of our care team members.

[SPEAKER_00]: It could be a clinician.

[SPEAKER_00]: it could be a coach or one of our care coordinators based on what you need.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because at that point in time, it could mean that you need additional testing.

[SPEAKER_00]: It looks like you may have signs of underlying chronic conditions or PCOS as an example.

[SPEAKER_00]: We need to order some labs and figure out what's going on there.

[SPEAKER_00]: So we can actually do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Additionally, though, we can also coach you as it relates to lifestyle factors.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it could mean that at this stage in the journey, [SPEAKER_00]: diet exercise, alcohol intake, smoking, maybe your partner's health.

[SPEAKER_00]: So again, it might mean that you're working with one of our health coaches or somebody on the nutrition side.

[SPEAKER_00]: Or it could mean, you know what, based on what we just learned, you actually need to get to an OBGYN or a reproductive and a chronologist yesterday.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we're going to navigate and coordinate your care.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because that's one of the biggest elements of frame is we don't want to further fragment your [SPEAKER_00]: We don't want to live on an island and your data with frame doesn't talk to the healthcare providers that we work with.

[SPEAKER_00]: Everything we do is integrated.

[SPEAKER_00]: So we can actually kind of marry the electronic meta pieces together.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so if you need an OB-GYN, great news.

[SPEAKER_00]: We work with thousands of them across the United States.

[SPEAKER_00]: We'll help to bring you into their care and help to make sure you have an OB-GYN.

[SPEAKER_00]: You get your annual well-woman visit or pap smear.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it just depends on what you need.

[SPEAKER_00]: What is so essential to me is you need a personalized lens.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is not a one size fits all in my experience.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's going to be based on where you're coming to this conversation today.

[SPEAKER_00]: And again, that's why you're journey with us can Evan flow because you could just be wanting to get labs done today, but then we'll see you in maybe two to three years.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's whatever you need at that point in time and what the kind of early screening shows.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can't tell you how much I wish something like this existed when I was in the midst of it because it was so I mean anybody listening that's in it knows it's so overwhelming there's so many options there's so many like forks in the road there's so many like I remember thinking I just want someone to tell me what to do because I don't [SPEAKER_01]: No, you know, and I think that having somebody there that, you know, obviously you created this because you have been through it and you know what people need or, you know, you know what was missing.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think those are, that's been the best part I think of doing this podcast is talking to all the women frankly who have gone through some sort of fertility struggles.

[SPEAKER_01]: and then build something, whether it be a product or a place or, you know, a doctor or their clinician or, you know, like it's just been so cool because people understand how hard it can be.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so what can I do to make it suck less?

[SPEAKER_00]: for people coming after me, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, it's so true.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: You and I both have probably tried like all the things out there on the market too, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like I ordered every kid, I tried every 100%.

[SPEAKER_00]: Every tracker I could, and I was like, oh my gosh, why, I still don't understand what this says.

[SPEAKER_00]: I still don't understand what this says.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, I know.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, like a red yellow green light, but like can I talk to anybody?

[SPEAKER_00]: So it just totally.

[SPEAKER_00]: It is so soul-crushing because we work so hard.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like we want to do the right thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what was so fascinating is I saw a patient base that really wanted to do the right thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And frankly, I also saw a provider base that really wanted to do the right thing.

[SPEAKER_00]: but they're also burning out a rapid rates and are like drowning in patients.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so that's where I just saw this opportunity to bridge it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like I'm not trying to replace your OBGYN.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not trying to replace your fertility clinic.

[SPEAKER_00]: You actually need both of those things to have a baby end to go through potentially in fertility treatment.

[SPEAKER_00]: I just don't want you to get stuck in the middle.

[SPEAKER_00]: and wonder where do I go.

[SPEAKER_00]: The other thing that I would say, you know, obviously I have a male partner and to watch him go through this too was quite eye opening as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, we were well down the path before anyone asked him any questions.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that.

[SPEAKER_00]: also quite surprising.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think it's been great to see so much education and awareness about male factor infertility.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, for multiple reasons one, because a lot of times that actually is telling for their health.

[SPEAKER_00]: But two, because again, women so often shoulder the burden of all of this.

[SPEAKER_00]: And 100%.

[SPEAKER_00]: It is not even us and so it's just that part has been so eye opening as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I will say from day one, we also built this with partners in mind.

[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously with people that are going through this solo as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: But like we wanted to make sure that there was a broad set of testing, care, and support.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I would say the kind of male factor testing side has been really phenomenal to watch grow too, because we work with obviously OBGYNs, but also primary care doctors.

[SPEAKER_00]: And this has been just incredible to see that now we're hopefully starting to bring more men in for this type of screening as part of their regular testing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I just think there's so much room for growth here.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, there's so much room for just better education across the board.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hello again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much for listening everybody.

[SPEAKER_01]: You guys are absolutely the best.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for checking out Fertility Rally.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you want to check out one of our groups as I said, please just shoot me a DM.

[SPEAKER_01]: Shoot me a note.

[SPEAKER_01]: We are happy to have you and you can see if it's your jam.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also, thanks for supporting my children's books.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which can be found on my website, which is infertileofgroup.com.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's work of art.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's beautiful bird and there's book number three, which is at the printer right now and I'll tell you more about that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Very, very soon.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, I wrote this series and I'll continue writing it to normalize conversations about family building in so many different ways.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want everybody to feel seen and heard and I want kids to recognize their own stories in these books.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, go check them out at infertileofgroup.com and also check out more of frame on Instagram at meetunderscore frame or their website which is frameyourfeature.com.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can see more in the show notes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you as always for listening and I'll talk to you guys soon.