Jared with five of the play clock, takes the ball back, looking throwing middle of his car.

I'm going around Saint Brown.

He's gone baby ten five end zone touchdown.

Detroit Lions up to Saint Brown's twenty seven yards in the Lions strike car.

It is week nine of the NFL season.

That's crazy.

I cannot believe it.

But I am Tim twenty and this is twenty in the Huddle podcast and this week I am joined by Colton Pouncy does a great job with the Athletic.

Had a great piece in September, got with all the Lions management about a pack they made and kind of have stuck to that.

Most recently did a breakdown of Calvin Shepherd and John Morton stuff, so you can check out all his stuff on The Athletic.

Also does the Lion's Collective podcast.

So you got a lot going on.

Yeah, it's been a busy season, but it's always a lot of fun.

Bye week.

Did you get a chance to get away a little bit?

We always talk about the players and coaches needing a little time, but the beat guys sometimes need a little reset and rest.

Dude, did you get away at all?

Absolutely?

It's important to us too.

I did get away.

I went to Chicago.

I grew up like Chicago suburbs, so I got to see my family.

My parents are out there, a lot of friends.

One of my best friends just had a baby a month ago, so I got the right there.

So it was a good time, nice and relaxing.

Cubs are white, SOX, I'm a Cubs guy, all right.

My dad grew up on the North Side, so I'm a Cobby guy too, so that that makes my heart feel good that you were a Cubs guy.

All right.

Let's look back to Tampa Bay real quick.

What jumped out about that game to you?

Positive?

Negative?

Obviously it was a great win, probably more positive, but what was what did you come out of that game kind of liking about this this team heading into the.

By Yeah, I think going into that one, you know you're looking at the depth chart, especially in the secondary, and you're like, oh man, this could be a little rough, right, Like Tampa Bay has some really good receivers, you know, Mike Evans and Abuka were playing in that one, and you saw the line secondary with the injuries and Bryan Branchin suspended and whatnot.

So I think going into that You're just like, Okay, this could be a little bit of a toss up, you know, maybe a you know, we see the lines bounce back so often from losses, but this one just based on the injuries and whatnot, and secondary you're a little bit more like, Okay, let's see how it plays out.

But to see those guys out there dominating the way they did, you know, shutting down the past game, uh the legion of whom as they're calling it now, which maybe a little bit disrespectable, but I kind of liked it.

I think it fits the mentality out there.

So I think those guys have embraced that.

Let's good too.

But I mean they got it done, man, and a lot of people probably doubted, you know, el Baker's gonna throw for three hundred and whatnot, but they really stepped up to the plate when when called upon.

And that's when Kelvin Sheppard kind of told us, you know, the week leading into that game, like you hear this overnight celebrity, overnight success, all these stories, but really that was just the night you learned about those guys.

This is what he told us.

So you know, all those guys out out there, Nick white Side you know, Thomas Harper, those guys that were getting done secondary really stood out to me.

Next man up, right, And I think that was a game that that you know, you can say it, but they lived it.

And I think that's so huge for this team moving forward that they now know that they've got some guys if needed to and we know how it went last year at the end of the year they were needing guys to step up, and that they've got guys that are experienced now that can do it and guys they trust.

I think that's huge for your football team.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

I think that trust goes a long way with this coaching staff.

As long as you can go out there and execute when called upon, they don't need you to be a star.

They have stars, and we saw those stars step up in that game.

Aiden Hudgson had twelve pressures and when the pass rush and the coverage are working together like that, you can have a pretty good day.

So I do think that trust goes a long way, and those guys definitely earn the trust of the stuff.

All right.

Coming out of the bye week, one thing, first seven games lines are five and two.

What's one thing that's impressed you about the start with them.

Yeah, I just think this group is so confident in who they are.

And you know, there's a lot of talk, you know, coming into the season, like you got a couple of new coordinators, you know, Frank grag now retired, like is it going to look different?

Are they going to take a step back?

And you know, I think most of us that cover the team probably didn't believe that narrative out there, but there was a lot of that out there.

But I just think this group is so mentally strong, and you can see it because of just how they've been built over the years.

They draft and developed these guys for a reason.

They bring these guys in because they're mentally tough, and you know, they're not worried about outside narratives.

So you know, a lot of teams might crumble with some of those expectations or the loss of you know, so much coaching talent and one off season.

But I think the way these guys are wired, it's like, well, no, of course we're going to be just fine because this is what we do.

Yeah.

So I think that's kind of where my mind goes in a more broad landscape.

But you know, I've been really impressed with Jamier Gibbs the season he's been putting together so far, and he saw it on that Monday Night game, two hundred and eighteen yards of scrimmage.

He was awesome.

Hutch coming back to form the way he has probably not surprise to a lot of us, but there were some questions out there.

You know, you had to see it.

You had to see it.

For sure, and he's been amazing, so uh, just a lot of the same, you know, this is just the standard that they've they've kind of showed over the years.

I love that clip of Gibbs laughing as he's going and how many guys would do that.

I would be laughing.

I just and it just shows the kind of mindset that how these guys love to have fun.

But the confidence too, like he knew he was gone, Like he was laughing as soon as he hit that angle, he was gone.

I love that about this football team.

For me, it's the depth.

You know, we talked about a little bit off the top.

I think they've dealt with some injuries, you know, early on this season, not to the extent they did last year.

But Monday Night showed the depth that this football team has and that's so huge.

It caught up with them at the end of last year and certainly in that playoff loss.

I think that's one thing I take from these first seven games is you've had different guys step in a lot of different spots and they've gotten pretty good production out of it.

And I think that's huge for this football team moving forward, especially after what they went through last year, to know that they've got some guys that can step in and play, and this is a deep roster with sixty nine guys they feel pretty comfortable with.

I think that's been huge through the first seven games.

All Right, what's one thing coming out of the buy you maybe want to see, you know, a little bit more consistency with something they need to improve.

Yeah, you know, it's hard to nitpick an offense.

That's what third in the league scoring, averaging thirty plus a game.

But there are some instances, and it's been talked about a lot this week, just third down conversions.

That's kind of been the big story and Dan Campbell talked about it yesterday.

Really third and medium, third and long is kind of where they struggled.

I believe they're seven of thirty six on third and long, this year, which is not great, but I'm sure they spent a lot of time at during the by kind of self scouting and finding ways to correct it.

It might just be one thing here and there per play you can look at like, oh, man, if Jared had an extra half second on this row, that's probably first down or even a touchdown.

You know, little things like that that can really affect everything that happens on a play if it's just one thing.

So that's probably one thing I'm looking at.

And then offensively, you know, Jameson Williams, I would say getting him the ball more consistently because he's a talented player and they paid him and kept him here for a reason.

And I think the little things he does, which is like you know, stretching the defense and you know, creating those opportunities for Saint and Sam Laporte over the middle, that's always going to be a part of this offense as long as he's out in the field.

But just finding more ways to get him involved in the passing games probably what I'd be looking at.

Yeah, those are two good ones.

The third down one is really interesting to me because they were forty seven point six percent last year.

I think it was third best in the league.

I mean they were converting almost half the time on third down, Well, Colton, that leads to more plays, that leads to maybe ten more opportunities to get Jamison Williams the football.

You know what I'm saying.

They're at thirty seven point six percent.

I think that's ring twenty first in the league.

That's just not the standard that we're used to here.

So that third down one, I'm glad you brought that up because that's a huge one for me.

I just think it's gonna make everything better offensively.

They can get that number closer to forty five percent, I guess where you kind of want to be your top ten in the league at that point.

I think that's gonna be huge, not only for getting more plays, getting more guys involved, but just continuing drives.

I think last year they had twenty five three and out drives on offense the entire year.

They've got sixteen through seven games, and so again, it's it's converting that third down, continuing that drive.

I think that's the one thing I certainly want to see them prove on offensively.

We'll talk to Jered Goff this week.

It'll be interesting to see kind of what his take is on those third downs.

Do it seems self correctable?

At least that's what Dan Campbell said, So you hope that's the deal going forward?

All right?

What concerned you the most about the Minnesota Vikings.

Something tells me maybe number eighteen is involved in this, or look, when you're scouting this team.

What concerns about a three to four Minnesota team that is coming off a tough loss and really needs to kick this thing, you know around, if they're going to compete in the NFC.

Maybe a little desperation even this early in the season.

Yeah, I think you just said it there.

I mean there's a dangerous thing about a desperate team.

Yeah, and when their backs are against the wall.

And I think Kevin O'Connell is a tremendous coach, and you know, there's a reason the Bikings have been pretty successful under his watch, and he gets guys to buy in and play for him, and even when things look rough, you know, they tend to kind of dig deep and find themselves in those moments.

So I would not overlook this Vikings team in terms of personnel.

I definitely think it starts with justin Jefferson.

He strikes spear into a lot of defensive coordinators.

I'm sure she will give us a line later in the week.

Like I'm losing sleep trying to think about ways the number eighteen out there, So they're gonna get j McCarthy back.

It sounds like and I liked him a lot coming out of Michigan.

I still believe in him.

I know it's been kind of rough early in his career, the injury whatnot, but I think he's got a lot of talent, so I would not overlook the Vikings.

Lions get the sixth straight win over the Vikings if they do what Sunday night.

Yeah.

I think it starts with pressuring a young quarterback like JJ, and the Vikings have not been great handling pressure.

I think they've allowed the eighth highest pressure rate among teams this year, and I think the second or third highest sack rate.

So turning those pressures in the sacks, I think that's gonna be a big thing for this game.

Hutch had twelve pressure in the last game, but no sacks.

I think he's probably gonna be able to peel back and get after JJ in a game like this, So if you can create pressure and you know, kind of fluster young quarterback like JJ, I think you can have success defensively.

Offensively, just sustain those drives, get to the red zone convert, which they've done a really good job at this year in the red zone, turning those drives into touchdowns.

To your point about JJ McCarthy too, I think three interceptions in his first two games and a loss fumble, you know he's I view him kind of a gun gun slinger a little bit.

He wasn't that at Michigan because it ran the ball so far.

But now he gets some weapons on the outside and he's got a chance and obviously one of the great minds offensively in Kevin O'Connell.

But I think he'll put the ball at risk.

At least he showed that those first two weeks.

He's still young.

I know it's a second year, but it will only be his third start, and so I think that's a good point by you if you can get after him.

Me too, I think a key there.

You look at their defense and they're gonna pressure you.

You know, they lead the league in blitz percentage at forty two percent.

They're gonna get after it.

I think the one great thing is Jared Goffi one twenty eight passer rating against the Blitz this year Golden pro.

I mean, he's been pretty good.

Not they can protect Jared.

He's shown, you know, the willingness in the ability to get the ball out of his hands into weapons in space.

And you put Jamo and Saint Brown and the port of some of those guys one on one, I think it's gonna be uh, pretty good for the Lions.

All right.

I'm curious you're opinion about this.

The ESPN rankings came out this week and they it's got the Colts number one, the Lions number two, Philadelphia three, Buffalo four, Tampa Bay five, Kansas City six, and Green Bay seven.

Is that a little high for Green Bay?

Colton?

Do you agree with kind of the top five?

They're Colts, Lions, Philly, Buffalo, Tampa or does somebody else maybe deserve to kind of be in that mix.

I think it's about right.

I mean, if you're just looking at records, what are they five to one and one?

Now, I mean, yeah, that's pretty good.

It's hard to be there are a lot of teams with a better record than that.

The tie game is kind of weird to me, the Cowboys.

It's tying the Cowboys and losing to Cleveland.

Yeah, like it's a weird.

But then they've got some other really good wins, obviously Detroit being one of those.

They're pretty I feel like they're pretty in consistent.

You don't know which Green Bay team's gonna show up, where a lot of those teams, maybe higher on that list, are more consistent.

You can know what you're gonna get week to week.

Chiefs are hitting their stride now.

They look like a great team, So I think for the most ID agree with that.

The Colts.

I'm still not convinced.

I need to see a little bit more from the Colts too, that's the only thing.

But it's hard to find another team to put them above right now.

You look at the NFC, and Dan talked about that this week is I think there's nine teams that are at least five hundred or better in the NFC.

But this is the month usually where you start to see some separation.

Detroit Sivy's got road games in Washington and Philly, gonna have Green Bay on Thanksgiving at the end of the month.

Is this kind of where we see the team separate themselves in November.

I think so the real teams will rise to the top, the pretenders will fall to the bottom.

I think that's just how it works when you get to those later months in the season, and again, depth will be tested, like injuries are starting to pile up around the league.

So I think the teams that are equipped with the rosters and the talent and just the belief in themselves.

I guess in a team like the Signs team that just has so much trust from top to bottom, I think those teams tend to rise when you get later in the season.

So I do think this is probably a big month for separation.

All right, let's finish with this one great division matchup Sunday.

What's what's the matchup you'll be watching the most.

What's the one you're you're eager to see?

Yeah, I mean going back to last year, that that Week eighteen finale, that was a lot of fun between a Meek Robertson and Justin Jefferson, So those.

Guys high school.

Yeah.

I had a meet on the podcast a couple of weeks ago, and he was talking about like going and doing Nike Camps against Justin Jefferson and and do an LSU camp against and they go back along ways and that was one of the more underrated performances last year.

It was awesome.

Eighteen and Terry and Arnold is back.

But I would probably think it's going to be a meek over there, given what he did last year, and that's going to be a justin Jefferson.

It's very motivated too, right Yeah.

I mean again, Vikings backs are against the wall.

But a meek I mean man, he's he's he's a dog man when that mentality comes out when the lights come on, uh, he rides to the occasion.

So that's a matchup.

Definitely interested in watching well.

It should be a fun matchups on a division rival.

As November breaks and these teams try to separate themselves lines, we'll be looking for two in a row.

Get that record at six and two.

And among the NFC leaders, he is Colton Poundcy does a great job with the athletic You can check everything out from him there and we'll be right back with i'mine Ross Saint Brown.

Welcome back to the twenty Mahaddle podcast.

The Man next to Me.

It's a little introduction.

He is I'm on Ross Saint Brown, the All Pro wide receiver, one of the best wide receivers in the league.

I'm on Roth, thanks for taking the time.

I appreciate it.

You have me.

I always love when you come on once a year here.

First off, happy blated birthday twenty six and you spent that last week.

I thought it was really cool your first Red Wings game.

How was that experience?

It was good, it was fun.

It was my first hockey game ever.

So I've heard a lot of stories about you got to go to hockey game, it's unlike any other sport.

I was like, all right, I'll try it.

So I told I told Ellie, I want to go to a hockey game this year, right Wings game particularly, And they set it up.

And the first thing I know is when I got there, was like it was pretty chilling.

And I didn't know it gets that cold and hockey and so I had a jacking on with luckily, but it was it was cold inside.

They got they got me hooked up with a jersey and everything and got to pull the horn watch the game.

It was it was fun.

You get you get a more appreciation for how fast that game moves when you go and watch it live firs on TV, don't you.

Yeah?

I mean I don't even know they subed like every like during the game.

Like, yeah, your shift is like forty five sacks because it's so intense and you're skating so hard.

I didn't know that new appreciation for those guys for sure.

All right, another little birdie told me you were a big Halloween guy.

And since it is Halloween week, two questions?

What are you going as this week?

Is it?

Are you in Brooklyn?

You get you a couple.

I'm gonna be a werewolf and she's gonna be a little red riding.

I think it's okay.

Yeah and yeah, and we got a little little team party, so that should be It should be fun.

What's the best Halloween costume you ever had?

I would say the one I was most excited about.

I remember I was a kid.

It was a power Ranger.

I was you know, I couldn't wait it on.

It was a blue part Ranger.

Okay, yeah, I couldn't wait to get it.

I remember I put I got it at Target.

I put it on as soon as we got out of Target.

I was running to the car and I just slipped and fell out of my face.

But that was one of my favorite costumes in last year.

I got the face paint done and all with Chuck you I was pretty cool.

What is it about Halloween that's always been a thing?

I think it's a time to have fun, dress up, you know, wear something out of the ordinary, and just you know, celebrate, just have a good time.

What about those black unis?

I love them.

It looks so good to day night.

Yeah, that looks nice.

Where you're at team wise five and two.

You got a chance to kind of reset after the by How important is that bye for you guys, especially where it landed middle of the week.

We talked to players and coaches all the time in the middle of the year, I should say, and they say, you want that right in the middle of the season.

You guys have been unfortunate to have some early season ones.

How perfect was the timing of this and just how refreshed do you feel it's good to kind of reset the body for a little bit?

Yea, I think we feel great.

Like you said, I feel like the past few years has been a little earlier in the year, so it's nice to have it at this point in the season, just because for like you know, some guys are beat up.

Get some time to rest, recover, get back, get some time away from football, whether it's with your families, with your friends, whatever it is.

Take your mind off before we get on this you know next stretch where you got We got like four games, and we got a Thanksgiving game, then we got Cowboys right after that, so we got a lot of games back to back.

We got a Christmas game coming up, so a lot of time that you spend with family.

Usually sometimes we don't get to spend because we have games.

So during this by, that was a perfect time.

And you know, get that all that out the way and then just really, you know, get back to ball and and get on this last you know home stretch.

Was it a chill by for you?

Did you get away?

Yeah?

It was pretty cool.

My girl through you know, it was my birthday last Friday, so my girl threw me a surprise and me and like twenty of my friends and you know, their girlfriends and wives and whatnot, we went to Vegas.

And oh nice.

Yeah, we had a blast.

So it was fun.

That's awesome.

All right.

I'm gonna know you're seventh right now in receptions with fifty I think you're ninth in the NFL in yards, first in touchdowns.

Do you feel like you're having one of your your better seasons?

I mean, statistically you are, and we know where you end up every year, but it just seems like from from some of the big catches, the big performances, it seems like you're on the top of your game right now.

You know, I would like to think so.

I just feel like this league there's so many guys, there's so many good players, so many good receivers, and honestly, it's like every year there's a feel like there's a couple receivers that maybe you didn't think of there before that are you know, in the top five categories and stuff.

So that's something I feel like.

This sport is so amazing because no matter what you've done the year before, you got to prove it each and every year.

And there's teams that are good the year before that aren't good you know this year.

There's teams that were good last year that are still good.

I mean, there's so much parody in the NFL that even as a player, you gotta, you know, make sure you prepare each and every week throughout the offseason because each and every week.

I mean, guys are teams are game planning.

If you have a good week the week before, they're gonna do everything.

They kin'd of stop you that next week.

So it just gets harder and harder the better you play, and so you know, you respect the guys that can do it each and every week.

And that's always been my thing since I've been here, is I want to be consistent.

I want to be able to produce each and every year, each and every week and help my team win.

And that's huge you because I think the receiver position may be more than any other position.

You're seeing guys step in and have an impact early in their careers at Buko, who you saw a couple of weeks ago, is a perfect example to your point.

If you want to stay up in the upper echelon of a receiver that consistently is so huge, isn't it.

That's huge?

I mean you look at a guy like Justin Jefferson.

He does it.

I mean each and every year, each and every week, he's whether the team's winning or not, feel like he's going out there and competing and he's putting up your ards, he's moving the chains, he's scoring touchdowns, Jamar Chase, Mike Evans.

I mean, guys, I've been doing it for so long.

It's that consistency.

I think that really separates them.

They do it each and every year, and so you know, for me, that's something I like to, you know, think myself at I want to, you know, continue to be consistent and be there for my teammates and most importantly win games.

I think that's the biggest thing we've been doing that.

We've We've been doing a pretty good job with that here in Detroit for the past couple of years.

So as long as we're winning, man, I think everything else is going to take care of itself.

You're in that group though, of guys that you just mentioned.

I hope you know it was funny.

I listened to an interview with Kevin O'Connor the Minnesota Vikings said, coach, you guys play on Sunday, and he said the exact same thing.

He's He was just like the consistency of that guy just every week.

When you hear that from outside people, that that's got to make you smile because that's what you were talking about, right, That's what you want to be.

That guy's one hundred catches.

You guys win football games every year and you're a big part of that.

I think, you know, the player can be as consistent as he wants, and you're gonna respect a player that's, you know, putting up numbers stats playing well on Sundays.

But I think when you add you know, the team winning, it's a whole nother factor.

I mean, you remember guys from teams that win and that are playing well, So that's the biggest thing.

I think winning cures everything.

Winning heals everything.

And a team that's winning, I mean you're gonna look at their players and be like, their players are the other players that aren't winning, teams aren't winning.

So for us, you know, I think our team is super unselfish.

The guys that we have in our locker room on our team, all we want to do is win.

No matter who's catching the ball, who's scoring the touchdowns.

We want to help, you know, whoever we can to get open block and I think that's what makes us so special.

And so for us, it's like whatever we got to do each and every week to win is what we're gonna try to do.

Yeah, the celebration with with with Gibbs the Superman Spider Man one.

How did that one come about?

And have you seen the shirts and some of the stuff.

Do you own a shirt yet?

Because I thought it was the coolest thing.

Jeff our photographer, I think, got a great shot of it.

Do you collect those things like the photos, the shirts, all that kind of fun stuff that comes from you guys in the fun times you have once you guys get in the in zone.

Yeah, I think so that that celebration actually came from Jamire was his idea.

Okay, he he brought it up to me like two two three weeks ago.

I think it was maybe Bengals week or maybe even the week before.

But you know, I didn't score those two weeks.

Jamier scored I think one of those weeks, but he ended up doing He had another celebration of mind that he wanted to do, so he did that and so whenever really got off, and I told, you know, I told Jimmy, I reminded him money, and I said, if I scored, I'm gonna do the six seven because it was my six touchdowns.

I had six touchdowns and I was my seven.

So I told Jimy, if I scored first I'm gonna do that.

But if I scored second one, we're gonna do that celebration, I said.

And if you score, we're gonna do it right away.

And so Jimmy's let's do it.

And so I scored the first one.

I did the six seven, and then you know, Jamier scored after that, and I was like, I was running down because I knew it was gonna happen.

Of course he had to run seventy Yeah, the celebration.

I'm chasing him down.

I'm like, here we go.

And so we got the celebration.

I knew the picture of regret it was.

It's a perfect shot.

Yeah, and so it actually just came out with my own shirt too, of a low design too.

Really.

Yeah, of that, you know that touchdown we had.

So I have where can people get it?

They can get it on Saint brownshop dot com.

It's a link is in my Instagram bio.

But yeah, I mean I have pictures on my phone.

I wouldn'tay I collect like, you know, memorabilia, but have all the pictures on my phone.

Yeah, celebration in the videos and stuff.

You guys take that seriously.

Yeah, I mean you like it, which I think.

It makes it fun.

I feel like for me as a kid growing up, I always wanted to celebrate when I scored.

Like I watched the NFL.

I see Chad, I see Deshaun Jackson.

I see all these guys celebrating when they score.

And when I was a kid, I was a pop one or they threw a flag for anything, you can't celebration.

I was like, oh, this is kind of boring.

Got to high school, couldn't you know celebrating, I was like, it's still boring.

College.

I feel like now in college, I celebrate more than they did when I was there.

Getting a little better, right, Yeah, But when.

I was in college, it was like, you can't really celebrate either as a flag.

So I told myself, when I get to the league and I scored, like, I'm gonna make sure I have fun, Like I always want to celebrate the end zone and do cool stuff and funny stuff.

And so now that I'm here, I mean, we go so hard throughout the week.

We're hitting each other during the play, we're taking hits.

So when we score, as the time for eight, one.

Not far and you guys certainly do a couple more.

For you, I'm a ra look.

Offensively, you guys are the third in scoring, your eighth in total offense.

But I talked to a lot of guys on offense, and you guys collectively feel like there's more left on the table, don't.

Yeah, I mean that you guys haven't even reached your heights.

I know.

Third down is an erie.

Dan Campbell talked about this week.

You're at thirty seven percent.

I think last year around forty seven.

That's just kind of one statistically that that that stands out.

But do you guys feel like there's still a lot more on the bone offensively?

So I think there's a lot more I think just execution wise as an offense, I think we can be, you know, a lot better.

Third down is one of the we know, one of those points that you know we got to be better at and we will be.

But I think just in general, I think we've been taking care of the ball pretty well.

But other than that, you know, third down, red zonef like we've gotten stopping the reds one a few times and we get there.

We want to be one hundred percent with touchdowns, you know, No.

Three and now it's obviously that's big.

Getting that first first down then just being explosive.

I think that's the biggest thing.

We want to be an explosive offense.

I mean those eighteen play drives, they're cool to have every once in a while, but you'd rather not be out there for eighteen plays because.

You'd rather be running chasing behind seven seven.

Y everyone's side, especially a line man.

So just being explosive, being you know, executing good communication.

No you know, no penalties, no negative plays, and I think you know, I think we'll be just wind steered.

Playing at a you know, an all pro at an MVP caliber level.

I mean, second in completion percentage, second in passer rating.

I think he's third in touchdowns.

Obviously had to buy so he's going to be behind a little bit for some of those guys that have played eight games.

Is that connection between you and him is is so good and you guys have worked so hard at it now it seems to be really paying off.

He's having a terrific year.

You think he's in that conversation for sure.

I think he's I mean with the he's and plays, so he's top in the league in my in my eyes, the way he you know, his time and his ball placement, his command the offense, him taking care of the football, I mean, winning games, just everything that he's done this year, even last year.

Just since he's been here, I feel like he's only gotten better each and every year.

And I think for us, I mean, he's without him, I don't know what offense would look like.

So we're we're lucky to have him.

He's he's won the best in this league and as long as he's here.

And for us, I know, you know, I love for him to win m v P when all those you know, all the awards that he can.

But I know the biggest thing that he wants to do is when the super Bowl, and that's I think what we all want to do.

And so that's the biggest thing is we just got to keep you know, keep winning games and all the rest, all the rest will come.

Congratulations on the podcast, by the way, yeah, you and you'll probably really do a good job with that.

Who's been the favorite guest so far this year?

That's a good question.

You know, we just had we just had Michael Pittman on yesterday, so that's gonna come out this week.

I would say favorite guest this year.

I love having my dad on every year we do it.

I feel like we do him once a year.

Oh that's nice.

Yeah, he's fun.

Demo and Jamiir I mean I think Demo is.

I had Demo on a couple of weeks ago.

On this one, Demo he's games on you.

You haven't, No, I haven't.

He's been dodging me.

Really.

Yeah, we got to say something.

We gotta get him on.

I love Demo.

I mean, I love Jamiir too, but Demo is just you know, he cracks me.

He just he's a jokester, the driest humor ever, like you don't see covid.

Well.

I think the podcast great.

So you can catch that.

You can catch him catching ball's Sunday against the Minnesota Vikings at Ford Field.

I'm on Ross Saint Brown, keep this sing rolling.

Appreciate you taking the time, Thank you.

Welcome back to the Twin Huddle podcast.

I am now joined by Kevin Seaffert.

Does a great job covering the Minnesota Vikings and the league for ESPN.

Kevin's been doing it at a high, high level for a long long time.

So you need any Minnesota Vikings information, he is your guy, Kevin.

Thanks for joining me.

I appreciate you.

Thanks for having Tim.

All Right, well let's talk about this one first off, A little bit different situation we've been so used to last couple of years.

These two teams fighting right down to the end of the year, terrific records, this meaning the division championship.

And this is a Minnesota Vikings team that sits at three and four coming into this one, just lost to the Chargers.

I believe last week thirty seven to ten, not their best outing.

They said a three and four.

I don't want to say desperation in week nine, Kevin, but do you get a sense that this is kind of leaning toward that that must win With nine teams in the NFC currently at five hundred or better, yeah, I.

Think a lot of their games are gonna be must wins.

If you look at their strength of schedule really starting this week, moving to the end of the year, it's the most difficult in the NFL according to ESPN's FPI Football Power Index.

And so whether it's playing the Lions twice, whether it's playing the Packers twice, some of it has to do with the division.

They also play Baltimore with Lamar Jackson probably coming back, and so the Vikings have gotten themselves in this position where there's they're gonna be up against it pretty much every week starting this week, but it's gonna be the case for the remainder of the season.

I think, do you think JJ McCarthy can give them a spark?

What did you like about the first two weeks there with him under center?

Kevin O'Connell.

Obviously, it is a guy that that's kind of been the quarterback whisper the last few years.

Gonna get JJ back?

Is that a good thing from Minnesota?

What'd you like about him early in the season.

Well, you know, and people in your area know this from his time at University of Michigan.

I mean, he's got some spunk to him now.

Like that first game, the opening game of the season for the Vikings on Monday night and Cago like, he didn't play that great, The whole team didn't play that great in the first three quarters, and then he just leads this furious comeback where he throws two touchdown passes, he runs for a third off, a read option of all things that really hasn't been in the Vikings playbook.

And we saw that moxie, We saw why he almost always wins as a starter going back to high school.

I think when the season began, his teams going back to high school were like sixty four and three and so like whether and obviously it's not just because of him, but there's something to be said when you play over that period of time, your teams are always winning.

And so we absolutely saw that competitiveness, the ability to kind of raise things to the level that's necessary.

But following week it was it was again pretty bad, and then he heard his ankle, and so we really haven't seen a whole lot of him.

I mean, I think he's played ninety five snaps, he's thrown maybe thirty forty passes, tops didn't play at all last year, obviously didn't even practice in the regular season because he was not on IR the whole time, and then he really hasn't practiced here for most of the past six weeks.

So we really haven't seen a ton of them.

But in terms of the things that I liked, I think that's that's the number one thing.

And I think just in terms of his competitiveness and the rest of it is it appears like he is a twenty two year old trying to play NFL quarterback without a whole lot of experience in college throwing the ball, and without a whole lot of practice time, and so he's just he needs to play and that's that's the bottom line with him.

And so there's going to be some development in real time going on here for the remainder of the season.

And that's just the position they're in with him.

You know, Kevin looking at some of the statistics league into this one.

You talk about what Kevin or what JJ McCarthy did have in college that was run game at Michigan, and they did that a ton.

Really uncharacteristic seeing this Minnesota offense.

I think of thirty four yards rushing last week, the lowest in the league this year.

I think they ranked thirtieth, correct me if I'm wrong in rushing going in the season.

Really uncharacteristic.

That's something with JJ coming back and the inexperience you talked about, that's got to get better for them, doesn't it.

They've got to support JJ a little bit better with that run game.

You would have to hope.

So Aaron Jones, who started the year as their starting tailback, got hurt his hamstring in the second week and he hasn't been.

He just got back last Thursday, so he missed four games and so he's now back and that should help.

Jordan Mason actually has been a pretty good addition.

From San Francisco.

I mean, he's.

A hard nosed runner, you know, a lot of yards after contact.

They've just had They've had a lot of offensive line issues, a lot of injuries.

First and foremost, Christian Darisol has not always been able to finish games because of his recovery from that ACL MCL he had last year.

Ryan O'Neill has been in and out of the lineup because of a sprained MCL.

They lost their center, Ryan Kelly.

He's had two concussions already this year and now he's on IR and they they're using a converted guard in Blake Brandell at center.

And so there hasn't always been you know, certainly not the ideal situation at offensive line in some cases just a really leaky one.

And so that's a little bit of the of the running game issues.

And the other part is, you know, you mentioned Kevin O'Connell earlier, and he has done great things in the passing game, and that's kind of his philosophy and you know, I think he would have to make a significant turn in terms of like just committing to the run from a play calling perspective, from a game planning perspective, from a scheme perspective for it to make a sort of a material difference here.

And it's probably what they're gonna need.

I mean, if they're going to ask JJ McCarthy to do the same thing that they were asking Carson Wentz to do here in the past five games, where they asked Sam Darnold to do last year or Kirk Cousins before that, then that's going to only add to the level of difficulty that they're already asking of him.

Ken, what do you think is a key matchup for Minnesota heading into this game Sunday?

They go in Detroit upset the Lions get back to five hundred if they do what really well Sunday afternoon.

Well, it's not dissimilar from some other times and other opponents against the Lions, But the past few games the Vikings have been really had a hard time against the run.

Their run defense has just been really bad.

Their pass rush has not been able to get through either, and so there's been a lot of time for people to get open, but against the Lions, and this has been the case in several of their matchups.

Like if they're not able to stop the run against the Lions, which they haven't been able to do here in the past few games, then they're going to be in for a long day.

And so I think that's the first matchup I'll look at is if their interior.

You know, they went out and signed Jonathan Allen and Javon Hargrave to be new defensive tackles for them.

Those guys have had kind of mixed results, and they've been using a lot of younger players to mix in there.

A guy named Jalen Redman has actually been a fine He was in the XFL a few years ago and now he's here in the NFL.

But for the most part, they've struggled to to stop teams from running the ball, especially when they're not ahead.

I mean that that's the other part of their defenses.

Last year they led the league and plays defensively when they have the lead, and there's certain ways you can play when you have the lead that you can't win you're trailing or tied, and so they haven't had that nearly as much either.

But the first thing I'll be looking at is to see if the Vikings can stop the Lions running game.

If they can't do that, it's hard to imagine that anything else will will be successful for them.

Yeah, because you know, then they get into some situations where they get teams behind the sticks.

They're so good obviously lead the league with im blitz percentage of forty two percent.

They can get after the quarterback.

But in order to do that, Kevin, we both know you got to stop the run first so you can get into those favorable situations.

That's what they want to do, right.

They want to get you in second long and third and long.

They want to double a gap blitz look and they want to come after you.

And but they've got to get to that point, right, Yes.

And the other part against the Lions at least is they you know, they when they're in those situations, they like to try to create you know, whether it's dropping out of the last second or they're gonna blitz.

They're not gonna blitz Harrison Smith's on the line now, he's dropping back into a cover two or something.

And so they like to try to confuse the quarterback essentially, and Jared Goff has not been one who's been susceptible to that.

He's seen it before.

He's a veteran guy and a smart quarterback, as you know, and it definitely works on some of the younger quarterbacks that you face.

But that's been something that they've also not had as much success against with the Lion again when they play the Lions as some other teams.

Is that I think Jared Goff is way above the curve in terms of figuring out some of those mental games that the Vikings defense plays.

To your point, one hundred and twenty eight is golf's passer rating this year when he's blitzed so good point by you.

He's great at identifying it, seeing it and getting the ball out of his hands.

And that young offensive line in Detroit's playing pretty well to what's maybe a key matchup we talked about the run game.

Is there maybe an individual matchup?

You know?

I know last year that Week eighteen game Meek Robertson versus Justin Jefferson was such a terrific matchup for Detroit.

They had to get that performance from a Meek and and they did.

Those two will probably see each other again this week with with DJ Reid not expected to be back this week for the Lions, is there one that jumps out to you maybe that that's important?

You know, I would say, you know, whether you know, whether you want to say Kelvin Shepard or whoever, like is sort of coming up with the defensive scheme, you know, when you have a young quarterback like JJ McCarthy, I mean, they're they're trying to find ways to give him easy throws and easy answers against whatever the Lions do.

But the Lions, you know, this is not their first rodeo against the young quarterback, and they'll have a lot of things up their sleeve as well.

So how much you know, because JJ hasn't played and like you know, we're looking at almost seven weeks now, and so he's just in terms of like getting into the rhythm and timing of the NFL speed of the game, like all that is like kind of back.

To square one.

And so there are a lot of things that I could foresee the Lions trying and maybe succeeding at when they're facing a quarterback with the inexperienced level of JJ McCarthy.

And so from an offensive perspective, you know how much is McCarthy going to be able to sort of sift through that and get the vikings to where they need to be.

And not only like mentally, because I do think he's pretty good.

He knows the offense, and I think he's pretty good at reading defenses, but there just hasn't been a lot of opportunities for him to quickly process that into action, and so he's been laid on some throws.

He's been, you know, a little hesitant to make to make the decision until the receiver pops open, and sometimes that's too late in terms of the timing of this offense.

So I'll be interested to see, like the extent to which the Lions try to attack JJ McCarthy, they just sit back and wait for him to take the safe plays or will they try to take even take those away and see if he makes a mistake looking elsewhere.

It should be a fun matchup.

Injury wise, Minnesota is pretty good shape.

Anything of concern heading in.

You know, they're getting healthier.

You know, I think they expect both of those tackles that I talked about, Christian darasan Brian O'Neil to be able to play the one The one injury issue that we're still tracking is Andrew Van Ginkel, who's been a really successful, you know, pass rusher and just all around defensive player for them last year and really hasn't played a whole lot this year because of my neck injury, and he's not on injury reserve, he's going through practice on a limited basis.

That's one that that may or may not be able to get to fruition in time, but he's the guy to keep an eye.

On this week.

Perfect Kevin, appreciate you, as always do such a great job covering everything Minnesota, vikings for ESPN and safe travels up to Detroit.

We'll see you on Sunday, my friend, Hey

Tim, thank you,