Golf works out of the gun, gives to his right, Jared takes back looking broly got the man touch down Detroit.

Lyons Jamir Kids Football is back in Detroit, and that means I am back with another edition of the twenty in the Huddle podcast.

We're gonna get you guys all set up for training camp, and I've got a very special guest to start out.

She is very much in touch with everything going on with the NFL and especially the NFC North Stacey Dale's from the NFL Network.

Thank you so much for joining me, Stace.

I appreciate it.

Tim, you know how much I always love to join you.

And we're right on the costs.

Man, It's about to start the chaos, the frenzied chaos.

Like I'm kind of baking here in Chicago.

It's been a really warm summer, really hot, humid summer.

But it's about to get more intense because I think this division is going to be even more fiery than it was last year.

You know, it's crazy to think that July I'm already back in training camp thirty one.

The Detroit Lions are playing a football game in July.

You know, they're the Hall of Fame Game, like there was no off season, there was no summer, like we're back at it.

But La Lion's fans are excited obviously with what's gone down, you know, in Allen Park here the last two years, with the success the team has had.

Let's start with the stage.

Can anybody in the NFC North knockoff Detroit?

Do they head in in your opinion, as the favorite, as the top dog, the two time reigning division champion.

Is it theirs to lose?

I think until somebody gets them it is.

I think that's the case in a division of this magnitude.

I was just doing another deal with somebody else, and I kind of look at this division like a truly a marathon where you have that cluster of runners up front and they're kind of staying together.

And that's how it was and how it all shook out, Tim as you know last season, I mean, Detroit goes fifteen wins, Minnesota fourteen, Green Bay eleven.

They all go to the playoffs, and all of a sudden, people would argue the best play caller currently in the NFL, I mean, there's a good.

Handful of them right now.

He's now the coach of the team that finished five and twelve in Chicago and Ben Johnson.

So it's going to.

Be a race, I think, once again, but until somebody knocks off the Lions.

Even despite the changes, right, we're all going to talk about every year.

I feel like there's something that people come to criticize with the Detroit Lions and Dan Campbell, but he always finds a way to battle through some level of attrition, and I think it's just because of you know, I go back to specific calls he's made in games tim and he's the ultimate decision maker and when he says we're going for it on fourth down, they're going for it.

And guess what, they got most of them last year.

But he's going to tell his guys we're going for it this season.

With a new offensive coordinator in Johnny Morton and Kelvin Shephard, who's obviously you know, coming from those linebackers over to the defensive coordinator spot, it's going to keep it super aggressive, just like.

We saw.

With coach Aaron Glenn and so I have all the faith in Dan Campbell because of who he is, even though there are some personnel.

Changes both sides, players and coaches.

You know, It's a good point by you, because Detroit was really lucky over the last three years.

I mean, I think they were the only team that had the same coordinators for three straight seasons.

I mean, it's unheard of in this league, especially when you've had the success that Detroit has had.

So it's something a little bit different.

But I think Dan has kind of talked about it's a little bit exciting for him too.

There's the newness of it right where I think for the first time they were in the in the coaching room at the combine together, you know.

I mean that was the first time that they had all gotten in the room together and started this journey.

And so you look, they're gonna get a ton of guys back from injury.

They've got some, you know, new coordinators.

I think it's fourteen different coaches in terms of guys that shuffled around new guys with the position coaches and everything else.

But Dan's the one constant, right And as long as you have Dan and as long as you have that message in his way of playing football, Detroit should be just fine.

I really do believe that.

You know, the more time I've just been around Dan and his energy when I'm standing down on the sideline because I had so many Detroit games last year and those final waning minutes, last two minute drill, and just watching how he operates in the conviction with which he coaches.

I think he's really set a standard.

And I mentioned that word attrition what I saw last year manifest with that defense to have a rash, not just a rash, but a complete wipeout of your best players and to still be able to and some of those play calls offensively were because of that defensive attrition.

We're going to go for it.

So we're not going to.

Force our defense with maybe a brand new player this week, like is there a Desidarius Smith, for instance, to have to go win a game for us.

We're going to force our offense that averages thirty two per game, the highest mark in the league, over four hundred yards per game.

We're going to ask them to go do it.

And that's what he did.

I also just love the fact that Jared Goff is now truly the coach on the field.

I mean, he is just so savvy.

In what he does.

And I'm really loving some of this Netflix QB stuff that I'm seeing clips of with him because it just shows how brilliant he is at the position, and I think everybody's feeding off that energy.

I'm also I'm also though, very concerned about, you know, how this team goes directionally with their center position.

It's a big storyline for me.

Because of how good Frank Ragnow has always been in the National Football League.

I mean since he became a guard, which took place he was drafted in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen.

He's graded out PFF as one of the best centers at his position, top five every single season.

So whether that's Graham Glasgow, whether that's Tate Ratledge, the rookie, it's going to be interesting.

But I trust in Hank Fraley, Yeah, one hundred percent.

He's one of the best position coaches there is out there, bar none.

Was great that he's back in Detroit.

You mentioned Chicago, you mentioned Ben Johnson.

I know there's a little bit of sigh from Lions fans when you talked about the best play caller no longer in Detroit.

But look the states you live in the Chicago area.

What is the buzz right now with the Chicago Bears team, Because I'm assuming it's pretty high, not only getting Ben.

But look, Caleb had a really good rookie year.

Now it was over you know, I mean it was overlooked by because Jade Daniels was just so good.

But I think twenty touchdowns, six interceptions for a rookie who was pressured and sacked the most in the NFL last season.

They have really good skill weapons over there.

You mentioned Ben Johnson.

He's trying to change the culture a little bit.

They went and fixed their offensive line with three veteran interior guys.

What's the buzz in Chicago?

Is this one of those teams that you look at like, hey, maybe this team can can make a big turn on be one of those teams that goes from last to first or make some noise in the NFC playoff picture.

It's a great question, Tim, because it's it's an important question because I've seen all the different turnover from coaching staff changes, personnel changes over the years with the Chicago Bears and all the coaching turmoil, and you know, every few years it's somebody's out, somebody's in.

Well, they just extended Ryan Pohls, so you know he's going to be kind of manning the fort and has done some really good personnel things.

One of those decisions was bringing in Ben Johnson.

And when you're able to, because we've seen the Bears over the years, maybe not go out and try.

And this is with all due respect because this profession is so hard, but Ben Johnson was not just this cycle, but really the last couple cycles, arguably the leading head coaching candidate.

Out there, and the Bears stopped at nothing to get him.

That was their guy.

That's who they wanted.

They were willing to spend the money to get that guy.

Why Ben Johnson.

He's a detailed freak.

You know him.

Around him NonStop for the last however many years.

He's he's a he isn't He's a.

Mathematician, right, I mean, you know, a walk on quarterback at UNC, but just really smart, very intelligent.

The thing that I think is most underrated when it comes to Ben Johnson is we talk a lot about pure progression offenses and how you know, how he can make a quarterback comfortable.

But to me, like he has a real knack for really uncovering coverages and in game, his his his adjustment to defensive coverages and what they're throwing at at at his offense as a play caller and being able to then translate that to the quarterback.

And you go back and watch tape, go back and watch the Vikings games from last season, and you'll see his in game adjustments to those coverages.

A guy like Brian Flores is gonna empty the you know, the kitchen sink on you, and Ben was ready for it at every turn.

And I think that's how he's going to help this young quarterback, besides getting him to play really detailed and make his pocket movement more streamline and make that cadence I think more understandable for him, and therefore the offense.

Yeah, and that protection is going to be big for me too early on in camp watching that.

Can they protect him better if they can do that.

Ben's offense is very much timing space, get the ball out here on time.

Now.

Look, Caleb can improvise with the best of them, and that's going to be part of his game and Ben's going to use that.

But it's a timing offense.

It's be here at this position at this time, protect him, get it out.

I'm going to create the space and the matchups, you know, And so it'll be interesting to see if they can protect him early.

That'll be one thing I'm looking at.

There's no question.

I mean, Braxton Jones two is coming back from an injury on the left side of that offensive line, and you're going to see some young players competing, maybe even into training camp.

We'll see when Jones is ready.

But in Ausie Tripp Pillow their second round, I believe pick at a Boston college.

He is massive in frame.

And then Karan Amagajie, who's you know, he's now had some time here in Chicago and they've had a little bit of a competition with Braxton Jones out, so they think they have some depth with that offensive line.

But I would say too, Tim, I mean, you know this one thing you have to do in this division is you got to get the ball out and Caleb Williams is responsible for holding it on, hold on, holding on to it too long at times.

So it's not just on that offensive line.

But I certainly think that because of the veteran presences they've brought in Tony Dolman and you know, Jonah Jackson, there's some brain power that I think has now added to this unit that will make the job of the quarterback easier.

And for second year quarterbacks, it's just so critical to have that stability and then have a coach who's gonna give me some gimmes.

And I think Ben Johnson is going to give Caleb some gimmes.

What do I mean when I say that when it's fourth and one, or when it's you know, third and long, or it's third and five.

He's going to have some built in answers for Caleb Johnson because of his vast understanding of what defenses want to do and because he has been so successful calling plays.

I think some of those gimmeis are going to help Caleb and that offensive line will kind of marry with that.

Stacey, I have to say, your dog looks completely content and comfortable in that spot right behind you're there.

I don't think he or she has not moved yet.

That is one of the most content She's something.

This is my this is my like, this is my little my dwelling of football, this room.

And so she's so soothed by football because I go into a happy place when I talk about football.

But yeah, she's my little sidekick.

And watching me do it on because I'll be back on the road.

Again Minnesota fourteen wins obviously came down Week eighteen last year for the division for the number one seed Stace.

When you look at that team, you know, fifth in points allowed last year.

They've got skilled weapons to rival Detroit.

Is it JJ McCarthy or bus?

Is it really all about the quarterback position in Minnesota?

Because you look at the roster, the defense, the coaching that they have there with McConnell, and it all seems to be in place.

But you know as well as I do, if you don't get great quarterback play, it really doesn't matter, especially in this division.

Is it all about JJ McCarthy in Minnesota?

Yeah, but they sure have built a roster to make it easy for him to slide in there and be a good quarterback.

And you can be simply because of Kevin O'Connell.

It's the Kevin O'Connell factor.

Tim.

I will never forget just sitting with coach O'Connell last year at a production meeting ahead of one of the games I was covering, and I think we were overseas, but he was talking about Sam Darnold and his his resurgence and we all thought, Okay, this guy's cooked.

Where's he going in the NFL.

He's probably going to be a backup along the way.

Well, from the moment that Sam became a Minnesota biking on that one year deal and I think it was one year, right, and the moment they stepped on grass together, but even meeting rooms, it was like, how can I get this guy can really throw the ball, he can take hits, he has the ability to move outside the pocket, But how can I get him to be disciplined and really condense have a checklist on every play he talked about, and really condense the pocket for him and make this thing see through the rush he talked about.

But the most important thing is how much can I fill his cup every week?

That's Kevin O'Connell is an incredible master at teaching the quarterback position.

Josh McCown is there too, and then so there's all this knowledge, but Kevin has a really good way of making the quarterback position easy.

And so I feel really confident about his marriage with with JJ McCarthy.

And I'll tell you this, every every Minnesota game I had last year, talking on the.

Sidelines to coaches is a golden retriever.

I mean, he is just lapping it all up right like that that was actually said to me.

He is lapping it up.

He loves football.

He's going to operate the offense just the way Kevin wants him to.

So he's not a quarterback that's going to just rip it outside of script.

And when you have a retooled offensive line.

They've got a brand new offensive line.

I mean Christian Darris I didn't play last year because of his injury, so he'll be back.

And then you've added Will Fries, Bryan Ryan Kelly on the in the middle at center, and Donovan Jackson's going to be an absolute baller their first round pick to one of those guard spots, likely left guard.

We'll see.

But I just think they got all the pieces.

They've got justin Jefferson, They've got Hawkinson, Like, they're pretty loaded.

I mean, Addison came on big last year.

They've got the running back.

I mean, they are their skilled as Detroit I think, and the skill position.

Yeah, and their defense is gonna only be better.

They've added a couple of guys there, Javon Hargrave, Jonathan Allen via Washington Like they added more beef upfront to an already vicious pass rush.

So Minnesota is in good hands.

I feel, all right, let's go to Green Bay.

You get Matthew Golden, you get Savon Williams.

You look at that Green Bay team last year, Stace, and they were a top five defense.

They were a top five rushing offense.

But they led the league in drop percentage seven point five percent total drops twenty five.

They just didn't have that guy that stood up.

You know, when I look at Green Bay and I'm like, what receiver are they going to pay?

Like, who would they want long term?

You've got to think about that for a minute and decide which one it would maybe be.

That's not a good thing.

So obviously they went and got the receiver help.

Is that really what they were missing?

Was that the piece?

If they can get that number one guy to step up, if they can get a couple guys to step up on the outside from that receiver position, they can be more consistent passing.

Are they as good as anyone in this Division two?

Of that part of the of their team is much better in twenty twenty five?

Yeah, I mean, I think with Green Bay they turned the ball over at an extraordinary rate just defensively last year.

Gave it back to the offense, Tim, But if their pass rush can be more effective, like just just that front group, if they can be more effective, like get something more out of Lucas fan Ask for instance, that could be a whole different level.

Of a defense if that's the case.

But offensively, Jordan lom has to be healthy.

But here's the cool thing about Matt Lafleur, another incredible play caller in this NFC North right, they lose them and Malik Willa steps in and there's no drop off.

They run the ball as well as anybody.

In the league last year with Josh Jacobs, and you know, now they get Marshawn Lloyd back healthy, who's going to be a serviceable backup I think for Jacobs.

So here's what hope I kind of hope and you touched on this, Tim, for the Packers, We've now watched this what has been the youngest offense in football evolving for the last couple of years.

With this, it's almost like wide receiver by committee.

So when you say who are they going to pay?

I kind of want and hope for a declaration of a tier in their wide receiver group.

What do I mean?

You've mentioned the drops they dropped the ball at an extraordinary rate, which.

Wasn't all on Jordan Love last season.

I just think a little.

More certainty and clarity with who are our guys?

What plays are we going to have for those specific guys, because they can go eleven personnel.

I mean you're going to see with the talent they have at receiver, Tucker Craft's going to be incremental in what they do and obviously Jacobs.

So you're going to see a lot of eleven personnel where they have three receivers.

What three are those guys going to be?

Christian Watson's going to be out for a little while.

But you mentioned in Matthew Golden, he had an awesome, awesome mini camp series with this team.

The rookie.

Why they took him in the first round, I don't think they could.

He was probably right there on their board and they were like, we got to get Matthew Golden.

He's really he's really technical in his routes, he's a sure player.

I think that they probably saw a lot of good stuff with him.

But now I'm looking four two didn't hurt either.

I don't think yeah, yeah, right, But I'm looking at their receivers.

Tim I'm looking at Romeo Dobbs and Jaden Reid who's a slot machine.

And you mentioned Savion Williams, the rookie who is massive in size and might be a little bit of a developmental guy.

But Dontavian Wicks, like when when Christian Watson comes back.

Who are your guys gonna be to?

Where Dobbs knows co Ball's.

Coming to me like and there's no, there's It eliminates a little bit of the of the thinking and now it's okay, this is the play Jordan love loves.

Let's let's get to it.

I hope for them just some more because I think they're heck a talented team and they've got a really good offensive line, and I think Jordan loves a really good quarterback.

Good points by you, Stace.

Let's finish with this.

When when you look at Detroit and what you talked about the offensive line and that being a storyline replacing Frank and is it gonna be Tate or Graham or you know, who are they gonna be?

Is there anything else that you look at this team going in like, what's the biggest question mark to me?

What's one thing I'm gonna you know, focus on maybe outside of that into your offensive line spot that that you know Stacey's gonna come into training camp and you're gonna have an eye on something.

What's maybe like a question mark for you with this Detroit Lion team heading into twenty.

Twenty five, I think for me is to me, they have one of the best secondaries in football.

Oh.

I love that you said that, because I've been trying to tell people that too.

You are so spot on.

I'm kind of actually obsessed with their secondary a little bit.

I'm not gonna lie.

I love Kirby Joseph, I love Brian Branch.

I think they could be the best safety tandem in the National Football League.

A healthy defense is a dynamic defense in Detroit, and you can't predict health, right, you can't predict how.

That's all going to unveil.

But I'm really anxious to see how this defensive front changes with just these guys healthy, Aiden coming back and Tyler Williams integrated.

He's a really good, big, big body that I think is going to be really good on the interior.

I like the linebacker core.

And by the way, Ahmed.

Hassening, Yes, good job.

I try to.

Say Ahmed Hassening, he's going to be a fireball, a spitfire for this team.

And you know how like Brad Holmes drafts these rookies, so they get him in the what sixth round or whatever it was, I don't and then like you think of a Malcolm Rodriguez and how he was incorporated as a rookie and who's this guy?

You're gonna have that from Hassening in training camp.

So I think there's been some depth pieces added.

But I'm really really curious to see how this defensive front comes together.

For me, that that is the X factor, because I think the secondary is really good.

I think Kelvin Shephard is fantastic.

I mean, he's phenomenal.

Just have a conversation with him about football.

Players love him.

And then I'm circling Aiden Hutchinson.

Tim I think he can be He had seven and a half sacks through five his five games last season.

Okay, he was on pace for fifteen sixteen seventeen sacks?

Are you kidding me?

I mean the way he comes off.

The edge Alah, like TJ Watt, I think he can be the best defensive edge in the NFL.

I truly believe that I think he's he hasn't even touched his potential, meaning what eleven and a half the year prior.

He is.

He is a game changer.

He changes everything you can do, and he affects the We always talk about how the interior offense defensive rush affects the exterior defensive rush.

I think he's going to affect every gap that can be attacked for that defensive front.

That's where I want to see things shift the most for the Detroit Lions because I think they have They're kind of layered across the board, both sides, really good and really talented.

You know, it's so huge to get him back too, because what that does on the opposite side too, Like if Marcus Davenport can come back and be the player he was a few years ago when Dan was in New Orleans and they saw him there.

Obviously he's dealt with health.

You mentioned hasan En.

You know they get Derek Barnes back, wholl they only had for three games last year.

Just who's that guy on the opposite side, because you know Aiden's going to bring it and he's going to have all the attention.

There's going to be so much of that single one on one coverage on the other side that if they can just stay healthy there and get some production in that, then you get a lean back you mix him with ty Leak on the inside.

In November, you mentioned a very veteran linebacker group and then Terry and arm It's going to take the next step in year two.

They got DJ Reid, who fits perfect in Shep's man coverage scheme of Meek Robinson proved he can be one of the top nickels last year, so I'm on board with you.

I think this secondary is gonna be great.

I think the linebacker cord is a veteran group that obviously knows Shep and the expectation.

He was in that room for three years.

And then if they stay healthy up front, get all their guys back and hutches Hutch.

I agree with you one hundred percent.

This is a Lions team that has been so offense oriented, at least the outside perception is offense oriented, and they earn that because they have been so good.

But I think there can be a switch this year where this Detroit defense surprises a lot of people and they are better than people expected, and that will be huge for this football team.

I think Stace as always.

Thank you so much for doing it.

You are so in tune with the NFC North.

I think you're one of the best in business and I always enjoy having you on.

We're gonna have a conversation with Sam Laporte and next, but thank you so much, Stace.

Enjoy a little bit of vacation before you get rolling, and hopefully you'll make a stop in right.

We'll see at training camp.

We'll definitely see there.

I'll be there right out of the gates.

Always great to be with you.

Tim.

Welcome back to the twenty l Huddle podcast.

The guy next to me he needs a little introduction.

He is a Pro Bowl tight end Sam Laporta entering your third season.

It's a little crazy that we're back in camp in July, on July twenty right, I mean, you're playing a football game.

You're not going to play a football game, but the team is playing a football game July thirty first.

A little crazy, isn't it.

Yeah, I can't believe it's the start a camp already.

It's only the twentieth of July today, and the Hall of Fame game it's coming up quick.

It is coming up quick, and it's probably a little quicker just given the off season that you had.

Sam, congratulations on the marriage.

First, thank you.

Where did you and CALLI meet?

We met like our first week in Iowa.

She was a rower obviously I played football there.

Yeah, and just mutual friends through the athletes, so we may.

And now I celebrated my twentieth this year too, So congratulations.

Have fun.

It's a beautiful thing.

And not everybody gets to get married and then on their honeymoon in Italy.

Oh you know, let's go ahead and just meet Pope Leo and get get our marriage blessed.

Tell everybody how that came about, short version, Probably there's probably more to it, but how crazy was that situation?

How fun was that that?

I mean, not everybody gets to do that.

Yeah, that was a blessing for sure.

So a friend of a friend put us in contact with a priest over in Rome and he notified us that every Wednesday, Pope Leo does a papal audience, and it was about three weeks out at this point.

He said, typically you need some more time to get these tickets, but I can try to, you know, get you to the front of the line and get your tickets.

In long story short, we were going to Rome, going to Italy on our honeymoon regardless, and that came up.

And what a blessing it was.

He's a Bears fan, I know, Chicago fan.

I think none of that came up, right, There's no no controversy, you know nothing.

Were you nervous?

I mean I would, yeah, I mean a guy like that, let's like bigger than Meetia by president of a leader of the world.

Which, yeah.

We sat out in Saint Peter's Square for like four hours.

It was every bit of ninety ninety five degrees by the end of the day and I was very sweaty.

But yes, finally getting to meet the popa it was.

It was a blessing, getting our marriage blessed.

I'm curious because of the honeymoon everything did were you able to do tight end you?

It was not.

I was, Oh, I was bummed out, but I'd rather have been on my honeymoon.

Yeah, of course, yes, And you're supposed to say that to make sure you say.

I told her that.

Over and over.

But tight end you is interesting to me because I know you've done it before, and you know Greg Olsen, Travis Kelsey they do a great job kind of organism, and there's some other guys too, But as a tight end this league, how valuable is that week working with those guys and just all you guys getting together.

What's it like and how valuable is it for especially a young guy like you early in your career.

Yeah, it's fun just to be around the group that is the tight end position in the locker room.

I feel like we're such a great such great characters make up the tight end group.

So the collection of guys that are down there at tight end you great personalities, and then of course everything you get to learn from the guys that have played the position at the highest level over the years.

You know, you get Greg Olsen down there, you get Travis Kelcey, you get Gonkowski, you get George Kiddo, you get Hockinson, you get Dallas.

Go down the list, right, there's a zillion guys down there that have played at such a high level, all pro level, gold jacket guys, and to learn from them over the course of the week.

It's the little things you get to pick their brain.

Hey, Trav, what do you think about this release?

Here?

George, what do you think about this footwork on this blocking scheme.

What do you you know, it's just an amazing opportunity.

So guys that get that opportunity, I really suggest they go down and do it.

Kudos to Olsen and Kelsey and those guys two for paying it forward right to the young guys and just putting that together that those are trade secrets so you don't have to do that right.

Well, the fact that that's such a close knit group of tight ends, it was that the way Iowa to because I was becoming, you know, the tight end you kind of play.

Yeah, when I first got there, Dallas Clark, my first fall camp, took a liking to me and he became somewhat of a mentor for me in the four years that I was there and beyond that coming into the NFL.

But like I said, there's a collection of guys, a lot of which come from Iowa, but there's a bunch of tight ends down there that just want to help give back to the younger guys and push the position forward.

Really, speaking of young guys, you know, he got a few young guys in the mix here.

Still looking for that maybe number three tight end.

How is this room coming together?

What do you think of the young guys and once you start camp and kind of get into it, how long does it take for that room to kind of gel with the different personnelity.

You got veterans in there, you've got some new guys.

Just how long does that take?

And what do you think of that competition between you know, the young guys.

Maybe a couple of vets for that number three.

Yeah, we have a great group of guys this year.

Two rookies and Luke dil and Zach Cordon provide a lot of value to the group.

We get a new player in Kenny Eboa coming over from the Jets, and experienced guy, played a lot of football, and you know Shane and Brock of course to round out the group.

Just a fantastic group, great guys, better better friends of mine than players.

Really, at the end of the day, I love lining up next to those guys and competing with them.

But by the end of camp you can start to tell who's going to add value and in what area.

Guys start to stand out within the position group.

There's there's varieties of you know, is this guy going to be more of an HF, Is he going to be more of a true y inline blocking guy, What what sort of value do you add?

So by the end of camp that.

Number three spot is versatility key to that spot too.

Of course you'll not be so much of a one trick pony, be able to do a different and play different spots there because you never know when you're gonna have to hop into that number three spot.

What you're gonna have to do, of.

Course, I mean when you play the numbers game, which they always tell us not to.

The number three tight end typically plays a lot of special teams and is very versatile.

Like you said, what do you think of Tyler Roll?

He's a guy that's gotten a lot of kind of steam ahead of time when he's got in here.

Popular guy.

I know Dan talked about really wanting him.

Just how is he to the room?

What does he bring?

First impressions?

Very fiery.

I love the attitude that Tyler brings every day.

He'll be great in the middle of camp when days are getting long, you're in pads for like the tenth day in a row, maybe you don't want to push yourself.

Tyler is gonna be.

He's gonna be for us, so he'll be amazing bringing.

Us that motivation and just pushing us to bear best.

And then new offensive coordinator too in John Morton's just maybe first impressions of him as well.

Uh, doesn't seem as fiery as Ben.

Maybe that's just my first impression watching him and OTAs and in the first practice you laugh.

Maybe you have a different you obviously, but just first impressions of him.

Maybe just what you think and is, is the casual fan gonna be able to see a big difference in this offense, Because when we talked to John in the spring, he said, look, it's number one offensive league, but I'm not changing a whole lot.

Obviously, He's got some things that he likes to do, some principles that he's developed over his many years in this league.

But will the common fans see the difference and maybe just version persons of John taking over that oc?

Josh sure, Yeah, I feel like it's kind of a two part question in terms of like what the common.

Fan we'll see.

We have a lot of guys back from last year, especially like this core skill position players, the guys that are going to see touching the ball, you know, start with the backs, best best duo in the league, Dave Montgomery and Jamier Gibbs, you got the wide outs, you got Khalif, you got Jmo, you got Saint Brown, you got Tim Patrick.

Jamo fastest guy league.

I mean, it's crazy.

You got a new face in Tesla and then the tight end position is basically the same as well.

Yeah, and that's that's really exciting for a coordinator like Johnny to come into in my opinion, You've got a set group of guys that have played at a high level, with Jared Goff at the helm conducting the offense, and he gets the opportunity to call what he's been learning his entire life as a coach, mostly a past game coordinator the last couple of years, and he's done a fantastic job and asking for help from Hank Freeley, who's been a fantastic run game guy the last couple of years with the offensive line, you know, going falling back on his position, coaches as well, and his players, like what do you think of this motion?

Where do you want to be on the field when we're calling this play?

How do you want as a player.

Of course, you want to have input because you're the one out there trying to execute your job at a high level.

And when you're getting those questions asked from the top down with Johnny and Dan, you just have a lot of confidence in yourself as a player.

You almost feel like you're taking ownership of the offensive bit too, right.

I know Jared's talked about that and has.

Said that over the years that he feels they built this around him, And he asked this, heading into your third season, Sam, there's going to be such a comfort level having produced at that level and now just knowing the drill, just where are you at in terms of your comfort level heading into year three?

I want to say this.

I don't know if if you heard this or not, but we talked to Aman Ross Saint Brown in the spring and somebody asked him, so, who's catching your out here?

Who looks great?

The first name he said, with zero hesitation was Sam Laport.

Oh, thank you, he said, he looks great.

And so when somebody like that says that too, and you've had the production, just your comfort level heading into year three, it's.

Kind of it's like angel on one shoulder, Devil on the other.

In one position, you're very comfortable and how you fit into the offense.

But then again, being comfortable and complacent, You'll never be your best, so you kind of have to.

You have to dribble both balls at the same time.

And I'm very comfortable with how I fit into the offense.

The production that I've had, I think has been fantastic.

There's only one football on the field, and you love to have it in your hands, but we have so many guys that deserve it.

So at the end of the day, I try to do my best, contribute as much value to the team as possible, and continue to get better.

Don't be complacent.

I'm gonna go ahead and just ask one of those questions that you know what the answer is going to be, just because I know you from being around you for two years.

But you know, because I want to ask you about goals, right and I know you, and the first thing you're going to say is I don't care.

I want to win games.

I want the super Bowl, and that's what it's going to be, you know.

But I just individually, do you do you set individual goals catches stuff like that or is it just team stuff for you?

And do you think it's important maybe for players to do that just to have something to shoot for.

I don't.

Discourage guys when I hear them set statistic goals, I want to have this many catches, this many yards.

I don't think that's a bad thing to shoot for.

It's just not what I shoot for.

Like you said, the number one goal is to always win as many games as possible, win the division, win the super Bowl.

It's always the team goals first, and then when you when you think about your own individual goals.

I think there's nothing cooler than being All Pro in the league, to be voted upon by your peers that you're playing the position at the highest level there that year, so to have gotten I was second team All Pro my rookie year, which I was really proud of.

If I could do that again, be first team All Pro, I think anybody would want to be that well.

According to Aman Ross Saint Brown, a lot of different guys I talked to, you are looking really really great out there.

Obviously huge expectations for this office with all the skill guys that you talked about back it's camp, the grind begins, but I think everybody here is excited about the season that you you're gonna have, the offense is going to have, the team is going to have.

Thanks so much for joining me.

Put your head down, grind and uh we'll catch back up in a couple of weeks, a couple of weeks.

Thanks Mat, I appreciate you.

Welcome back to the toy Laha Podcast, and I am very happy to welcome in Tom Pallisero.

You guys know him NFL network insider.

He has his pulse on everything the NFL and he's well pretty well connected here in Detroit as well.

Tom, thanks for joining the podcast.

I appreciate you.

You got Sam.

This is my first media obligation post vacation.

So got back from.

The lake having really fully shaved or gotten a haircut, So you're getting the real This is the off season me, but hopefully this will help my brain get into getting into training.

Camp mode here.

I love that this is the podcast to preview training camps that we're all getting in footback in football mode.

Look, it's crazy that you know we've got first practice comes Sunday.

It comes quick, but you know, I mean, you've been doing this a long time.

The NFL is really a twenty four hour, three sixty five deal nowadays.

But Tom, let's get right into it.

You look at the lines, they obviously have Super Bowl aspirations.

When you look at the NFC in totality and the teams that are at the top there, who do you think are kind of those you know, three four teams in the NFC the head into the season, you know, really having good Super Bowl aspirations and good shot of being that team to represent the NFC.

Great question, Tim.

Because I think that as you proceeded through the playoffs a year ago, you know, it was pretty apparent if you watch the Super Bowl that the Eagles were in a class by themselves, though there were some other teams that pushed them, you know, through the course of the season and the playoffs.

The Packers were right there.

Obviously the Commanders reached the NFC Championship game.

To me, it starts with the Eagles, and then it's all right, who are those other if you want three, who are those other ones going to be?

It has been the Lions over the past couple of years.

They played just their worst game at the worst possible moment in that playoff opener last year.

But certainly you have to look at them being in that mix.

You look at, you know, the Vikings coming off a fourteen win season but with a new quarterback.

That's going to be a major question hovering over the whole division.

Certainly, a team like Green Bay is really really talented, and it's a matter of you know, Jordan Love is banged up last year he missed some time, but now year two, going into the same defensive scheme should help them.

And then the Bears are you know, the team that everybody wants to talk about.

You know, I've seen some of the analytic projections where all for these teams are considered likely to make the playoffs.

You know, it really to me, a big part of it starts in the NFC North and who is going to emerge from that battle Royale?

It may well be the Lions again.

Dan Campbell has obviously had a ton of staff turnover through the course of the offseason.

We'll see exactly how much their schemes evolved from year over year.

But they've got a lot of the same core players back.

They still have the opportunity to be really explosive from an offensive perspective.

And then getting back a guy that they sorely missed Dallas stretch last season, Aden Hutchinson, who everything seems to be on track with him.

That is clearly going to be a huge boost for a Lions team that if they're going to beat those those good teams in the NFC, they're going to need that pass.

Rush down the stretch.

Washington, for real?

Has Jayden made them a team in your mind?

That is?

You know, they obviously showed with the win and getting to the NFC Championship game, Like you talked about, they have staying power.

Is Washington one of those teams?

Now?

Maybe a lot of teams entering the season didn't think a lot about Washington, But what Jayden did and how far they got, are they one of those teams now we have to think about every year in the NFC.

Well, credit to Dan Quinn and that staff for the culture and the shift that they were able to make.

Jane Daniels was plainly a big part of it.

I always say, the most dangerous thing that a new staff can do in year one, a new regime can do in year one is overachieved and the commanders, I mean, listen, if they don't have a Hail Mary hit, they are losing a game to Chicago, and I want to say that was Week seven.

It's the Bears that are in the mix in the NFC North and the Commanders all a sudden take this, this brutal loss at home on national TV.

Do the seasons go differently?

Obviously they didn't.

The Commanders were better trained for that moment.

I just wonder now will they be able to continue to press forward here or was that one of those years where everything went their way and that maybe covered up some of the deficiencies.

You think of some of the breakthrough teams that we've seen in recent years.

I mean, the toast of the town in twenty twenty two was the Giants who made the playoffs and won a playoff game in Minnesota in Brian Dables' first year.

They regressed to the mean that following season.

Same thing with the Vikings.

We've gotten into the playoffs that year, and they regressed in twenty twenty three, albeit with some significant injuries at the quarterback position.

You know, this could be a team that Jayden Daniels is that good and he can elevate the level of everybody around him.

They got to sort things out with their top wide receiver Terry McLaurin.

That's something to keep an eye on here.

After he skipped midicamp and the run up to training camp kicking off next week.

But certainly, you know when you have the quarterback, tim that's a big piece of the equation, and it sort of seems like they've got a.

Really good one and lounched him.

Tom.

You mentioned Dan Campbell and the staff turnover here in Detroit.

Obviously, two new coordinators with John Morton taking over the offense and Calvin Shepard the defense.

I think there's fourteen different changes, either guys in new roles or new coaches on that staff, but the one constant is Dan Campbell.

And just you talked about the culture there in Washington, obviously Dan has built the culture here in Detroit.

Just your perception on the outside looking in of the job Dan has done, and when you've got a coach that's as well respected as that, when you're having two new coordinators and you've got so much turnover on the staff with a guy like Dan, you just kind of don't expect it to be a big issue because you know he's going to find the right guys.

Is that kind of the impression from the outside looking into Well, first of all, let's.

Talk about how rare it is to have the staff continuity that had.

This is the place point.

It took a few years for them to have to pay that price.

If I'm not mistaken, the Lions were the only team last year that had had their offensive and defensive coordinators in place for three straight years.

So when you have that, that just allows you to build a level of continuity that you just don't see in the NFL a whole lot.

Having said that, yes, Dan Campbell is not just a culture setter, but he built that offense with Ben Johnson.

Ben is obviously brilliant, and we'll see how brilliant two times this year when he goes up against his old team.

Lions fans are hoping not too brilliant.

He's a really really smart guy.

And the creativity and the unique plays that he would draw up, you know, that's something that we're going to have to see how the Lions, you know, kind of adjust to that.

You remember, you know, the shift began for.

Detroit midway through Dan's first year when he took the play calling duties from Anthony Lynn.

Ben became more involved, but Dan was calling it himself.

That's when you got that run first physical mentality, and they ran for whatever was three hundred yards against Pittsburgh I think it was in that opening game.

Dan's going to be heavily involved, and John Borton's been around the block.

I mean, he's coached with some really good people, Sean Payton certainly chief among them.

He was there in Detroit at one point previously here.

I don't think that there's going to be you know, a beat skipped, per se.

I do think that any time that you have again this level of turnover, because it's not just your coordinators, but there were a bunch of other staff members, Tanna Engstran going on to be the the jets OC and J.

T.

Barrett following Ben to Chicago.

There were other dall as well.

I mean, that's that's a lot, and so we'll see.

The one thing I know.

About Dan is he is never afraid to confront whatever his realities are.

And you've seen it with some of the we might say incremental moves, but certainly they've been swift moves.

When it was you know, again taking away the play calling duties from Anthony Lynn, whether it was making a change to his defensive staff, you know, moving on from Aubrey Pleasant at the time.

If there's something that he doesn't feel like is right, He's not going to hesitate to change it here, but this will be a big test, There's no doubt about it.

And maybe you would hope after this many years now, the player leadership also is going to be able to rise up at whatever void might need to be filled with some of those guys, namely Aaron Glenn as well as Ben Johnson moving on, maybe there's some of those players too that can help bring that entire thing and keep it rolling in the right direction.

Yeah.

I think that's a great point by you, because it is a core that's now been here and established, and you saw on the Netflix just the leadership that Jared Golf has been in his tenth year and running the show there.

Look talking about Dan a little bit, Tom, he doesn't get enough credit for the offensive mind that he is.

You know, everybody sees the opening press conference and the grit and some of the speeches and stuff, but he is a very apt offensive mind and he doesn't get enough credit for it.

And to your point, that offense turned when he's started taking over the play calling, and it's him, Ben and Jared that built this offense.

Ben deserves a lot of credit for it.

But Dan had a big part of building that offense around.

He doesn't need a lot credit for it, So it'll be fun to see how this kind of goes knowing that Dan's the constant there.

Yeah, I think that was one of the misconceptions.

I know that was one of the misconceptions about Dan when he came to Detroit was.

Yeah, he had the press conference that people still quote to this day.

But the thing that I kept emphasizing on TV was hink Ambill work for Sean Payton, who is a partyment, offensive mind and as demanding as any coach in the NFL.

But Dan was presenting parts of the game plan.

Dan was speaking to the team on a weekly basis.

If Sean had something else going on, Dan was the one who was stepping in and running the show.

You know, that level of trust.

I think really spoke volumes about how smart Dan is and again we're gonna see, you know, does his stamp come.

Through even more this time around.

I don't know if it's possible to run the football more than the Lions are already, but you know, maybe there's there's more of an emphasis into certain areas of it.

Every year is an evolution.

I bumped into Dan at the coffee shop in one of the hotels in Indianapolis at the combine, and he was, you know, probably getting his fifth coffee of the day, but he had been He was like, oh man, I'm rolling with the coaches.

They were because they had never been in the same room together because it took so long.

The hiring process takes so long, not just for for instance, Ag and Bendaland, but then Ag had to hire his staffs Now Angstrand's gone.

The combine was the first time the Lions had their new staff together.

But in talking to Dan, yeah, you know, you us talk about we lost seven coaches or whatever it was.

But it's like, but I'm fired up, Like this is new, this is freshest and different challenge.

I fully expected to embrace it.

You know, I could tend the Lions could be a better football team in twenty twenty five than they were in twenty twenty four.

And look, they won fifteen games, they were in the number one seed.

They could be a better football team and lose more football games.

You know, they've got one of the toughest schedules in football.

But when you look at this team, what's one thing you're excited about what what do you think is a strength heading into this season?

So I want to give you one strength and then one area maybe where you have a question mark with this football team heading into twenty twenty five.

Well, the question mark, if we start there, is probably just going to be do they have sufficient amount of pass rush?

I think that you saw that last year.

They obviously, you know, brought in Zadarius to try to help fill the void here.

Aiden being back.

And hopefully being himself is going to make a huge difference, but they've sometimes lacked that that complimentary piece, and so you know some of that going to come.

You know, Tyler Williams, who's the biggest man anyone's ever seen on a football field.

Can that internal you know, whatever you can do in terms of pushing the pocket, can that make a difference?

What other stuff, you know, Mike Kevin Shepard want to draw that they weren't doing previously.

There's a lot of different things they've They've tried different fronts in the past.

I know they've had attacking styles, they've had more play on the block styles.

You know, how does that thing kind of evolve through the course of this season.

I think that just do they have enough pass rush.

That was the question all last year, even before Aiden got hurt, was do they have enough you know, around him?

And then it was after he got hurt, it was obviously, well or is it going to come from that?

To me?

Is still the number one question mark?

The biggest strength of the team, you know, I still think is just the the offensive playmakers.

You know, Frank Wraigan now retiring, that's a big deal and you're gonna have to, you know, do some adjusting on your offensive line.

Which if there was one strength left over from the Bob Quinn Matt Patricia days, it was that offensive line and they have had a lot of continuity in that group.

If the offensive line can come together, then you know, you just think of the levels on which they can beat you.

You know, both in terms of running the football.

With Montgomery was healthy enough to play down the stretch, should be a lot better this year.

Obviously, Jamier Gibbs, everyone you know in the fantasy football community is talking about, this guy can be a top five type of performer this year.

And then it's a'm on Ross Saint Brown, and it's Jamo, and it's Samuel Porter, who you'd hope is a little bit closer to being himself now a little bit further removed from the injury.

They've got tons of playmakers and obviously Jared Goff, who's played at a really high level.

This is the first time now too, Jared's not going to have been around.

How does that dynamic work here in addition to having your passing game coordinator moving on as well, I think they've got the chance to be really, really dynamic again, which is saying something because you're talking about a team that, if I'm not mistaken, led the league in points last year.

Well, they're really dynamic because of their general manager Brad Holmes has done such a terrific job of building this roster.

I mean, what GM around in his first four draft cycles drafted seven Pro Bowl players are all pros, That's what.

But Brad, did you know with guys like Hutchinson and Saint Brown and Penny Sewell and the list goes on and on.

But you know, and Brad talked a little bit about this at the league meetings.

Is when you do that, that's great and you have a nice young core, but also you have some bills that come doue and we're talking about hutch You know, going into his last season next year, Brian Branch has become one of the best safeties in the league.

He's going to be on his the final year of his deal next year.

You've got Jamison Williams, You've got Sam Laporta, You've got Jamior Gibbs.

These are all guys that are in line Tom for you know, maybe set the market at their position type deals.

Some tough decisions are coming down the line.

What do you think, Hutch, let's maybe start there contract might look like.

And then just.

The position that Detroit's in, having so many good young players.

But our tough decisions headed headed this way.

I mean, that's that's the problem that every team wants to have, is you've got too many great players and you push it as far as you can for as long as you can, and sometimes you have to make hard decisions.

Look at the other teams that have been, you know, in the mix for a long period of time, the forty nine ers that Bill can do.

As you put it, this offseason, when it was we just we can't have of whatever it was, fifteen eighteen to twenty million dollars Deebo Samuel on this team and we can't continue to paye von Hargrave.

We're going to have to make some you know, some tough moves here because now we're paying brock Perty at the top of the market.

The Chiefs have gone through multiple different it or I mean, who thought going into the offseason a few years ago that they would trade maybe the most dynamic weapon in the entire league in Tyreek Hill.

But what they were looking at was we need to rebuild a multi offensive and defensive fronts.

Well, if we're now paying Tyreek wants a new deal, and he thinks DeVante Adams got twenty eight million a year in Vegas, even though on realistically it was like twenty two.

But now he's asking for thirty.

We can save that thirty million per year and get a first round pick and another pick and use those resources to rebuild everything else.

Okay, we're gonna do the hard thing.

Those are some of those types of decisions that you have to make in terms of a Naden Hutchinson contract.

You know, the longer he waits, the more the number is going to go up, particularly if he comes back in camp and shows he's fully healthy.

The bar said at forty million a year, that was miles Garrett, I would anticipate, I would fully expect that Naden Hutchinson deal comes in significantly north of that because you also have TJ.

Watt, Trey Hendrickson.

That one's probably not going to be at least as of now, it's not gonna be north of forty, but it's gonna be another top of market deal.

Master Crosby, the Neil Hunter, a bunch of guys got in that thirty five million dollar range through the course of this offseason.

So as some of these other deals start to get done Michael Parsons as well, that's going to push into the forty two to forty three range.

Aiden Hutchinson, if they're not doing that deal until the end of this year, that could be forty five.

You know.

We'll just have to see with the cap going up, how much that market expands and what some of these other deals end up looking like.

In terms of Brad you know, and what he's done with the roster.

I think that the Lions have done as good of a job as anybody at being able to walk the line between getting really good players and getting guys who fit.

There are times, and you saw this when Bill Belichick had full authority over personnel in New England where they were drafting guys who were fits.

But eventually you end up with a bunch of like average athletes from Navy who might be really sharp and they're on time and they can learn fast, but they're just not going to be competitive with a team like the Bills that's just loaded with talent.

When they draft, you know, a Jack Campbell.

When the Lions take Jack Campbell in the middle of the first round, and a lot of people had him in the second, the question was, Okay, you know, can this guy can play three downs?

But they had a vision for him.

Jack Campbell's a really good and productive football player.

Is he the off the charts athlete?

No, But they saw within their scheme, this is what we can do with this guy.

Ad Hutchinson's the other one.

The Jaguars took Trayvon Walker over Aiden Hutchinson.

Why because of traits?

Because Trayvon Walker tested, as you know, better than anybody, better than Genevian Clowney, better than anybody who's ever been at the combine.

He didn't play a ton, he wasn't a starter at Georgia, he didn't have a lot of sacks, but they thought the upside is there.

Well, we're now going into year five I believe of Trayvon Walker, and he's were still waiting.

He was better last year, he had like nine sacks, but we're still waiting for him to have anything close to what Aiden Hutchinson did, because Aiden Hutchinson may not be the athlete, but he was much closer to being a fully foreigned football player and also a guy the Lions knew they could count on from a leadership perspective, from a culture perspective.

You know, Jimmior Gibbs, everyone in the league loved him, even though people were shocked that they took them where they took him.

A lot of coaches loved Jamiir Gibbs.

But again, it's the fortitude to say, even if they couldn't have traded down in that first round, they were gonna sit there.

I think they were in six or eight, they were gonna take them there.

Even if they hadn't been able to trade down, they were gonna take Jamiir Gibbs.

That's just the you know, That's how Brad was trained with the Rams.

It was very much about we need football players, we need guys who love football and they're really good at it and they're productive.

A lot of times.

That's gonna skew toward taking players from bigger programs.

I mean the guys I just listed off, almost all those are big program types of guys, Big ten guys, SEC guys.

They they've found their bread and butter.

And I don't know that anybody, you know, just off the top of my head, I don't know that anybody has drafted better than the Lions have drafted since Brad and Dan got there.

And they've been terrific duo.

And that's so important to a franchise into the success.

And that's the most important relationship in an organization is a relationship between your head coach and your general manager.

It's a terrific one.

Here in Detroit.

They are very much in tune with what the roster needs, get talent and develop it.

That's how you stay a winner for a long time.

Tom, I love the conversation.

You are one of the best in the business, sir.

I thank you for being your first media responsibility after vacation.

That means a lot to me.

You did a great job and as always, we're gonna have to have you on again.

Great stuff.

Tom Paellasero from the NFL Network Insider has a touch on everything in the league.

Tom, thanks for joining the podcast.

Appreciate you.

Dim.

I always owe you for those radio appearances you made with me in Minneapolis like fifteen years ago.

So anytime, anybuddy,