Reaching five million subscribers on YouTube is a milestone I could never have imagined when On Purpose first began.

Over the years, I've had the honor of sitting with some of the most extraordinary people in the world, artists, world leaders, athletes, visionaries and experts.

These conversations have offered us glimpses into how greatness is built, how vulnerability becomes strength, and how love and resilience shape our lives.

I'm truly grateful for how far we've come, and it's all because of you.

It's also just the beginning.

So today we're celebrating our community and this milestone by revisiting some of the most significant moments from incredible guests along the way.

The Number one Health and Wellness podcast set Jay Shet.

I remember this one really well because I was in France.

I flew to London to take a flight to the US, and then flew back to London to interview Tom All within twenty four hours.

When I spoke with Tom Holland, he shared something deeply personal, his decision to quit drinking.

In a world that celebrates alcohol.

He stepped away to protect his mental and emotional health, and he's not alone surveys show more young people are choosing sobriety than ever before, with many saying they feel healthier and more present.

Here's Tom on how that choice changed his life.

One of the things that you mentioned recently was that you gave up drinking about a year and a half ago.

Yes, and you said it was the hardest thing you ever did.

Yes, And I wanted to know what was so hard about it for you?

Why was it so hard.

It's interesting I didn't one day wake up and say I'm giving up drinking.

I just like many Brits, had had a very, very boozy December Christmas time.

I was on vacation.

I was drinking a lot.

And I've always been able to drink a lot.

I think I get my genes from my mom's side in that thing that.

I can drink.

And I decided to just give up for January.

I just wanted to do dry January.

And all I could think about was having a drink.

It's all I could think about.

I was waking up thinking about it.

I was checking the clock, when's it twelve, And it just really scared me.

I just was like, Wow, maybe maybe I have a little bit of an alcohol thing.

So I sort of decided to punish myself and say, I'll do February as well.

I'll do two months off.

If I can do two months off, then I can prove to myself I don't have a problem.

Two months go by, and I was still really struggling.

I felt like I couldn't be social.

I felt like I couldn't go to the pub and have a lime soda, I couldn't go out for dinner.

I was really really struggling, and I started to really worry that maybe I had an alcohol problem.

So I decided that I would wait until my birthday, which is June first.

I said to myself, if I can do six months without alcohol, then I can prove to myself that I don't have a problem.

And by the time I had got to June first, I was the happiest I had ever been in my life.

I could sleep better, I could handle problems better.

Things that would go wrong on set that would normally set me off, I could take in my stride.

I had so much, such better mental clarity.

I felt healthier, I felt fitter, and I just sort of said to myself, why am I enslaved to this drink?

Why am I so obsessed by the idea of having this drink, and I would look back and recognize that I would go to events for work and be like, I can't enjoy myself until I've had a few beers, and I just felt so much pressure.

And this is one of the things where I've sort of distanced myself from the rugby community because so much of it is about how much can you drink.

Let's get you as drunk as possible.

And it's honestly been the best thing I've ever done.

I'm a year and a half into it now, it doesn't even cross my mind.

I found amazing replacements that I think are fantastic ones that are also really healthy.

I found this one beer that it's full of electrolytes and it's you know, the carbohydrates in it are long lasting energy.

So like having a beer is now actually like a really healthy thing.

I'm really lucky that all my friends are super supportive about it.

I've never run into that scenario where my friends are like, oh god on, just have a beer, like you're fine.

They've always sort of really supported me, and I don't want to be that person that's saying to people you should get sober.

You should get sober.

If I could encourage someone to drink less, then that's great.

But I don't want to start getting into the world of you need to stop drinking, because I just it's not for me to say I went on my own little journey.

I'm really enjoying it.

I'm delighted that my mum's as also given up.

She's loving it, and it's been amazing.

I can't believe the difference that I feel from not drinking.

Yeah, I feel amazing.

That's amazing, man.

I love hearing that, and I love hearing that it's been great for you, right, I think, yeah, that's the point.

Not everything has to be like, look what I did, you can do it too.

It's kind of like, no, this is just what's been great for me.

Do you think it was partly that attitude for you, at least in the beginning, where it's like, well, I can drink, I drink a lot comes from my mum jeans and it doesn't affect me, And then all of a sudden you realize, well, wait a minute, it's more than that.

Because I think there is that, like I was like that as a young man as well, like for me, it was it was easy to drink.

I didn't drink daily.

For me, I drank a lot more socially sure, and I love playing drinking games with my mates.

Yeah, that was really what I enjoyed the most, probably, and for me when I quit, I could just quickly see how it just got me into doing things I would never do if I wasn't drunk.

So for sure, for me, it was more that.

But yeah, I wonder for you, did you find that?

It's there's a really fine line between like, I know, I can drink a lot and then all of a sudden you're kind of not addictive.

Beyond that, I'm happy to say a lot.

I was definitely addicted to alcohol, not shining away from that at all.

I think anyone that wakes up and has not wakes up, anyone that has a beer every day, it's probably got a little bit of a problem.

But yeah, you're right.

I would drink and drink and drink and drink, and then you would just reach that moment where you're like, well, I shouldn't have had that last beer, and you wake up the next day and you have a terrible headache and you're suffering.

I bought one of those rings that will tell you about your sleep yeah orring yeah, And it was amazing because I couldn't sleep.

I was like, why can't I sleep?

I'm working fourteen hours a day, I'm doing two hours in the gym, I'm eating really healthily, and I can't sleep.

What's wrong with me?

I bought this ring and it was booze.

It just it was completely affecting my sleep.

And since I've given it up, I can sleep anywhere.

You know.

It's also interesting as well, going on nights out and having a great time as the sober person and then getting to that point in the night where people start, you know, spitting in your ear and everyone's I love you, man, I love you so much, and you're like, yeah, brilliant, I love you too.

I see tomorrow I'm going to bed.

I love being that person now.

I love seeing my friends on the golf course at eight am in the morning, feeling fresh and ready to go and they're sort of crawling out their car and so yeah, so I am over the moon to be sober.

I love it.

Yeah.

For anyone who is listening right now and is going tom I love that for you.

I want to do it too, like they're listening, going I'm having too much every day.

I can notice some of those things, but I'm just stuck.

And it's hard because we know that addictions that way, we know that this is heavy.

It's not easy.

But if someone is watching, Going Tom, tell me what did you do to even get started?

How did you have that courage to say, I'm going to do January, I'm going to stick at it.

Were there any moments where you actually fell back and then I had to get back on the horse again, Like, we'll just walk us through that a little bit more.

For anyone who is watching, Going Tom, Mate, I want to be in your position in like six months.

I didn't fall back on it.

I have done in the past.

I've had periods of my life where I'd given up drinking and then gone back to drinking.

But this time, I don't know, it was just different.

I really worked to sort of change my mindset.

I really asked myself, like, why do you drink?

Why are you drinking?

And a lot of the time my answer would be to feel more comfortable in the social environment, And I just put myself in those environments and just would force myself to be there.

I'd force myself to hang out and go to a club or go to a bar, go to a dinner, as.

We weren't avoiding those places.

I was at the beginning because I didn't feel like I could go and not have a drink because of the stress of it.

But then after a while I sort of was like, mate, you've got to pull your socks up here, and you can't just live in your house all the time.

You've got to go out and enjoy yourself.

And if you're only enjoying yourself because you're drinking, then you really do have a problem.

But I just changed my mindset.

I found really good replacements.

Things that I could sort of attribute to having a beer.

I often found with me.

Most of it is just the ritual of cracking something open and sharing it with friends and drinking it, whether it's sparkling water or a beer.

I now can't I don't associate like I don't see a difference, but I think it's different for everyone.

I had a great support system.

Jack is one of my best mates and we travel all over the world.

He doesn't drink, and doing it with him was a really helpful experience for me.

My brother is always on the road with me.

He was very supportive and yeah, I just really set my mind to it.

I was like, I really want to do this.

I want to prove to myself I can do it.

And then once I'd felt the health benefits and started really feeling like my full.

Self, My god, this is this is the best.

But do you not drink?

I haven't drank for seventeen years.

No way, amazing, Yeah.

It was, It's incredible.

Wow.

So one of the best feelings in the world, and it's my biggest like worry when I was about to quit, was like, how am I going to hang out with my mates?

I was like, my mates knew me as the guy who was like first of the game, last to get out, that you know, the clown when I got drunk, like life of the party, kind of like that kind of guy.

And then all of a sudden, I decided I wasn't gonna drink anymore.

I was like, crap, I'm going to fit in.

And then I remember I went into the corporate world for a bit and I didn't drink, and I was like, God, am I going to miss out on opportunities and networking?

Like, you know, all the guys afterwards are like going to get drinks and I'm like, oh, come, but I'll have a water or I'll have a soda, whatever it is.

And what was really interesting for me is not relying on drinking made me rely on qualities and skills I had.

Sure that were actually better.

So now that I couldn't drink as an excuse to hang with the lads, I was bringing out parts my personality that probably would.

Have just hidden away.

Yeah, surpressed, And all of a sudden, you were actually getting respected and liked for who you were rather than the person who you were when you were drunk.

Sure, and actually that worked in the workplace, and there was no one at the workplace going r J doesn't drink, so he's not getting promoted, right, It wasn't like that.

People were like, oh yeah, I really like hanging out with J, or he's a really good guy, or whatever it may be.

And I was still getting the same opportunities and I was still getting promoted at work and whatever it was.

And I think that's why I'd like to remind people that don't feel like your career or your work is going to suffer even for you like you've I'm sure as a you know, with your career path, you have to be at parties, you have to be at events, of course, and the fact that you're able to do that now without having alcohol and you don't, it doesn't sound like it's negatively impacting your career.

If anything, it's the opposite.

But may I honestly cannot believe like the amount of times I've sat down with an actor that I've really admired, or sat down with the producer or director and been like, oh, you know, well, I don't drink anymore, and they go, I don't drink ten years and You're like, oh my god.

And I've had so many insightful conversations with people like yourself where you've heard their story, their.

Reason for giving up.

And there is a wonderful community of people and I love it.

I love being a part of that community.

I'm really proud to be a part of it.

I hope that, you know, I could meet other people and chat them about it, because it's really nice.

It's lovely to be like, let's go to.

Get a lime cione together, you know.

Yeah, let's get a juice, let's get a smooth yeah.

Yeah, No, it is true.

It's true.

And it's really interesting because they I can't remember.

I'm trying to remember.

There was this blog that came out years ago.

I can't even remember it now, and there was this girl on Instagram who was getting a lot of likes and a lot of comments and a lot of attention, and one day she just disappeared, like she stopped posting, and everyone's just like all the comments were.

Like where are you?

What happened?

Are you okay?

Like what happened to you?

You know, everyone was frantic trying to figure out what happened to her because they loved her, they were following her and all the rest of it.

And what they didn't know is that it was built by a team that was trying to show that what people didn't notice is that in every picture she posted, she was drinking and it was a made up It was almost like original AI that was made up to prove the point that you can love someone and you can think you're really close to them, and you you could think their lifestyle looks amazing, but actually they've got a drink in every picture they post, and you didn't.

Realize that an alcohol problem.

So there was no real person who died, but The point was that this your friends could be struggling even when they're posting these beautiful lifestyle pictures.

But are you aware, wow, and are you conscious of how much it affects you?

And I can't can't remember who built that?

Well, that's I think that's one of the problems with alcohol is that if you came out with alcohol right now, if alcohol wasn't a thing, and you like, I've invented this drink that is going to make you like either really happy or really aggressive or really stupid, and we're going to just sell it to the masses.

People be like, now, mate, keep your funky juice, Like, we don't want that.

That sounds terrible.

And it's one of those things because it is so socially acceptable that the addiction side of it, the bad sides of it, really do fly under the radar.

Yeah, and that's really interesting.

I'd say you something I do love about being a Nundrey.

I love being the designated driver.

I love being that person that makes sure that everyone gets home.

I don't know, I just I like being a dependable person.

I think I'm quite dependable, and I really like that that thing.

And I saw this crazy YouTube video once this was years ago, of a guy that went to a bar, he got drunk, and he drove home and he crashed his car.

And I don't know if this is real.

It could have been fake, but it's really impactful.

Basically, what his friend had done was set up the room as if he had been in a coma for like ten years.

And his friend wakes up hours after the crash and his friend is there and he had all like old makeup on to make him look older.

And now I'm thinking about it, there's no way this could have been real because how would they have been able to pull that off.

But he basically is saying to him, like, you've been asleep for ten years.

Everyone's missed you, Like we can't believe you're awake.

This is amazing and it shows like how a stupid decision like driving drunk can affect the future of your life.

So I do love being the designated driver.

That is something I enjoy see my friends have a good time being like, don't worry, Tom will take you.

Yeah.

I used to love being the designated driver until I realized that next girlfriend just had me do that because I was the one who didn't.

Do that right.

That wasn't a fun design driver.

Yeah, but I've always been that guy since because so I lived as a monk for three years.

Yeah, and when I came back after that, obviously I never went back to drinking alcohol and everything, and so but I went back into the workplace, and I remember everyone would always open up to me and give me advice.

But it's what you're saying.

When someone was drunk, they tell me their whole life story.

Next day they'd come and go, Jay, you'd actually remember what I said.

I remember everything.

Please don't tell anyone, Yeah, you know.

And I loved I loved that part where I was like I was able to be there for people, just hear their stories and someone that had context the next day, because if they told someone else who was drunk, you'd both not remember then it'd be gone.

No.

I think the benefits that you just pointed out of good sleep, good health, mental clarity totally huge.

But there's a couple of things I want to point out for everyone's li just as takeaways, because Tom makes it so seamless when you're talking about it's really beautiful as well.

But one of the things you mentioned was finding alternatives and during my month life.

We always talked about how there was there was something that we called the higher taste, and it was saying, you can never give up a lower taste unless you had a higher taste.

Sure, and so there has to be a switch, there has to be a replacement.

And the fact that you found alternatives.

I think that's half the battle, because most of us are trying to take something out of our lives and then you're just trying to fill it.

Yeah, and then you have to go back to what you had before because you're not finding a replacement.

So that was beautiful.

And the second thing you said, which I loved, which was having this conversation and dialogue with other people, someone who's one year ahead of you, someone who's ten years ahead, someone's twenty years ahead, who's gone through that process, and they're open and honest and vulnerable about you.

Know, I did have a weak moment or you know what.

This was really tough for me, and I think having those communities where you can talk about these things makes a massive difference.

So if anyone struggling, I hope that those two things can kind of, you know, give you the support you need.

Tom's honesty reminds us of a key takeaway that strength doesn't come from fitting in, but from making the choices that protect your piece.

Whether it's alcohol, overworking, or any habit that no longer serves you, Sometimes the bravest thing we can do is to let it go.

One of the most inspiring conversations I've ever had and that I'm deeply grateful for, was with the legendary late Kobe Brian.

I got to interview Kobe Bryan just a few months before his tragic passing with his daughter.

Kobe described his mindset for excellence what he often called the Mumba mentality.

It wasn't about talent alone.

It was about obsession, discipline, and showing up every single day.

Psychologists studying mastery of skills have found that consistent, deliberate practice is the strongest predictor of peak performance.

Talent is valuable, but without consistency, something Kobe embodied in every area of his life, it's rarely enough.

Let's take a look.

Have you been able to in your life see past the cloud of emotion to actually execute on things?

Because I think what we were speaking about earlier, this challenge that young people afterday, everyone has today have just so much information, so much cloud of emotions, so many feelings, so much childhood baggage that you're bringing, Like, how have you always cut through that and execute them?

You know?

What I try to do is just try to be still and understand that things come and go, emotions come and go.

The important thing is to accept them all, to embrace them all, and then you can choose to do with them what you want, versus being controlled by emotion.

You know, a lot of times I've seen players, even myself, you know, when I was younger, being consumed by a particular fear and to the point where you're saying, Okay, nah, it's not good to feel fear.

I shouldn't be nervous in this situation like that, and it does nothing but grow, versus stepping back and saying, yeah, I am nervous about the situation.

Yeah, I am fearful about the situation.

Well what am I afraid of?

And then you kind of unpack it, and then it gives your ability to look at it for really what it is, which is nothing more than your imagination running its course.

You know, Yeah, absolutely, I love that, because what you're saying is that when you're dealing with something it's almost like, how can I get to the root of it?

Yeah, because sometimes what we're dealing with, like you're saying it's an imagination and illusion, it's not really.

It's not really a thing.

You know, Like you think about game winning shots and or game winning free throws, and people go to the free throwing and they're nervous about it.

Well, what are you really nervous about?

If you unpack that?

Okay, you're nervous that you're going to miss the shot, all right, So you missed the shot, then what happens.

People are going to be embarrassed.

You're going to be embarrassed because thousands of people, millions people say you missed a shot, all right, and then what people going to talk bad about you?

Okay?

Right?

And so you're looking at it and go, are those things even important?

You know what I mean?

If that that is my fear?

Like, what is you're worried about letting your teammates down?

Okay?

Have you let them down before?

Oh?

I'm sure?

And practice and things of that nature, right, they're still there, you know.

And so when you're able to unpack it, you kind of look at it for what it is, which is really nothing.

Yeah, I love that breaking it down.

I think that's so important.

I think everyone who's listening and watching right now.

Next time you're facing a fear, next time you're going again something, do that, like, literally unpack it.

Don't just settle for your first answer, because the first answer is really the right one.

Don't hide from it.

You know, you got to be able to look at it and you know, and and deal with it head on.

Yeah.

I love that, man.

And you talk about that because you talk about you know, when you talk about missing five throws and you talk about getting over yourself.

Yeah, right, like getting over yourself.

How did you get that mentality of just being like I need to get over this, like I need to get over myself?

You know, trial and error.

You know, you grow up and you make game winning shots and it's awesome.

You come back the next day and miss a game when it's shot and it's misery.

And then the next day comes and you're back playing again, and you understand that life has this cyclical nature where it's you know, what you do on Monday, it's fantastic, but then Tuesday's a bad day.

But guess what, there's Wednesday.

So are we just supposed to live our lif like this the whole time, you know, versus just staying like this and understanding that it's really just a journey of evolution every day.

It's just constant improvement, constant curiosity, constantly getting better.

The results don't really matter.

It's the figuring out that matters.

Yeah, And we all get obsessed about the results that we get obsessed about, like the output, not the input of not figuring it out and not like changing things what you said, trial and error, like the experimenting.

We forget to do that.

It's unfortunate, man.

Like I've seen a lot of players, especially now, you know in youth basketball dealing with that.

You have players that are like bigger and.

Faster and stronger, and you know, their coaches or just coaching them for results.

You know, we're just going to use your size that because you're bigger than every other twelve year old out there to dominate today.

But they're not growing right, So they're just based on that result.

But they're not focused on growing this young child into becoming a better athlete and through that teaching them how to become a more well rounded person.

And we're missing that.

Yeah.

See what you've said there, just I want to ask you this, And I'm not saying because I you know, like you know yourself best and you know how you've got there, So I'm asking it from a place of humility of learning.

When I look at you, I'm like, you know, your superpower isn't just your work ethic.

Your superpower isn't just like figuring things out.

Your superpower is like you think strategically, Like that's a very strategic thought of saying, this person could be this in the future if they were developed as a whole individual rather than just like let's use them for.

The short term.

Right, And where did you develop that?

From?

That ability to see beyond, to think deeper, to reflect deeper.

Where did that come from?

Well?

I had to do that because you know, I grew up growing up in Italy.

When I first moved over there, it was you know, I didn't speak Italian, I didn't have any friends.

You know, I had the game of basketball, and through sport and playing soccer, I was able to make friends and build connections.

But it was a lot of time spent the loan and when I came back to the States, I wasn't the most athletic kid.

I was really scrawny, like really really skinny, and have like major knee issues because I was growing.

So I was the dorky kid with high socks and big old knee pets.

Fashionable now, it's fashionable now and then and then, and so I had to look long term because in the here and now, I couldn't compete with these kids.

I mean there's kids that were like twelve years old with beards, Like what I was supposed to do with that?

Like they're doing windmills and dunking backwards and I'm happy to like tap the backboard, you know.

So I had to look at it from a long term because I wasn't going to give up on the game.

So I had to say, Okay, this year, I'm gonna get better at that.

Next year, this and then so forth and so on, and then patiently I was able to catch them.

Yeah, Kobe taught us that greatness is in an accident.

It's built through discipline, consistency, and the willingness to go further than most are willing to go.

His words and wisdom live on as a challenge to bring our best to whatever we know.

When Emma Watson called me to be on the show.

I was thrilled.

One insight in our sit down out of the many that she said, that stood out was her view on building relationships from wholeness, not need.

In her younger years, she might have chosen from uncertainty, but now she seeks love from peace and self knowledge.

She also spoke about asking the hardest questions, Am I really happy?

Am I aligned with my values?

Questions that push us beyond appearances and towards truth.

One of the hardest questions you talked about asking you answer it asking yourself difficult questions, and I want to ask you something about that.

But one thing I've said to my wife is, if you ever fall out of love with me, please tell me, because I don't want to live a day without love.

I'm really confident about the fact that I'm worthy of love and that I want to experience love in my life.

If you ever fall out of me, just tell me.

It's okay, because I don't have the desire to stay somewhere for any other reason.

And it sounds risky saying that in extreme but to me, it's a greater risk to have spent ten extra years with someone and then they tell me, I haven't really loved you for the last five ten years.

And then I'm like, I've lived without love for ten years in my life, and I don't want to be in that place because I've seen people go through that and not be happy.

And so it does come with a humility and a openness to have very difficult conversations and not to force something that, oh, it's been going to get great for twelve years, it has to it should do, it must do, and it's like, well maybe no, Like, yes, if it does, it's great and it is right now, but why should it right now be a prediction for how you feel in fifteen years with everything else that's going to change.

I think if I knew I really couldn't meet the need of someone and they couldn't meet my needs, if I really couldn't make them happy and they couldn't make me happy, like forcing them to stay in that situation, it's really that like makes love impossible, like the gates.

So I totally get what you're saying.

And my mum said this thing to me, which was like, you want to be with someone because you want them, not because you need them.

And I think maybe another reason why I didn't get married younger is because I think maybe I would have married someone not knowing who I was, and I would have needed them, maybe not wanted them.

And I think now I have a life that's whole and complete as it is, and I would be making a choice from a place of I just want you and I don't need you.

But I just want you and I don't.

I don't think I was that woman five years ago.

Yeah, I love that.

And there's so much, so much to be said for attracting from a place of peace, because you know what peace feels like, and so then anyone or anything that comes into your life.

And what feeling satisfied feels like.

Satisfied is probably even a better way, and that feeling of I know what it feels like to be satisfied, and so I now know whether someone makes me more satisfied or less.

I know what my baseline.

You don't know what your baseline happy is, then how do you You've got no idea of knowing what's going on at all.

And that's not feeling of being complete or having it all figured out.

It's like I know what satisfies a great word, It's like I know what it feels like to be at peace with myself or satisfied with myself, and now everyone can show me, yeah, where that pendulum swings.

Yes.

One thing you said which I which really resonated with me, is that you've had to ask yourself so many hard questions to do the work.

And I want to ask you, what's one of the hardest questions You've ever had to ask yourself?

If you could, well, the first one that comes to mind, and then maybe I'll dig for a deep or a different one, is like to have to admit to myself or ask myself the question of like you right now have the career and the life that like looks like the dream, but are you really happy?

Emma?

Are you really healthy?

Are you really happy?

Like is this really what you want?

And to be at that point and like realize and have to admit to myself that I wasn't and I didn't was one of the scariest things I've ever had to do, because you know, I basically had to ask myself on a daily basis, like I felt like I was crazy and walking away from something without knowing what you're walking towards was not having the answers, but leaving something that was that the world considered to be of such high value, such a high value kind of moment in my professional life and career.

I think that was a real sitting with that was a real moment of reckoning of like, can you tell yourself the truth?

Can you live with your truth?

Can you accept the fact that for most other people your truth is pretty confusing and unpalatable.

That was definitely a hard moment of sitting.

More recently, because I've been being my own partner asking myself are you really living your values things that you preach, are you actually aligned and actually looking at some spaces in my life where I was like, shit, no, not at all.

I'm actually not doing what I talk about, And I need to create some sort of urgency or a deadline for that so that I make sure that I'm a persitive integrity.

I purport to be someone that cares about the world and about the planet and sustainability.

And you know, there are some things I was doing.

Was it enough by my own standards, not by anyone else's, just by my own?

Probably not?

But what's nice is I actually have the time now to be like, okay, we could do about it.

Get on with it and like those are.

Thank you for those.

Those are great questions, really really great questions.

Emma's bravery and honesty reminds us that real love begins with knowing yourself.

When you're complete on your own, you can choose someone because you want them, not because you need them.

And just as importantly, fulfillment comes from having the courage to ask hard questions, to walk away from what looks good on the outside if it doesn't feel right on the inside, and to realign your life with your deepest values.

Now, it's a given that Madonna is a cultural icon, but what struck me most wasn't her ambition or longevity.

It was her devotion to spirituality, even at the height of fame.

The success she felt avoid and what sustained her wasn't the limelight, but the rituals that gave her peace and purpose.

From yoga and Sanskrit study to kabbala.

Spirituality became the compass she realized she needed for herself and for her daughter.

What are your.

Spiritual practices and rituals that have been so supportive and emblematic of your journey, that have kept you going at the times, As you said, there were so many times you could give up, or things could go wrong, or you kept pushing and they kept you locked.

What were they?

What are they?

Well?

One really important thing is studying, making time every week to sit down and study.

I mean, you can study the Bible, you can study the poetry of Cahil Gibran, or you can study the Vedas you you know.

And you did that right.

You actually studied different traditions.

And I mean to be honest, before I discovered Kabala, I was looking for answers.

And why do you think that was?

Why were you looking for answers?

Because I had everything that people would assume would give you happiness.

I had successful career, I had fame, fortune, monetary things, physical things.

But I wasn't happy, and I naturally sought out well.

When I was a dancer, I had a roommate.

She was a Buddhist and she would get up and chant every day, and so I was very intrigued by that.

Like nothing bothered her, you know what I mean, Everything bothers me, Everything bothers me.

I'm you know, I'm a Leo, I'm Italian.

I'm very dramatic.

I wouldn't say she was peaceful all the time, but I was just struck by her confidence and her knowingness that everything was happening for a reason.

She never got upset about things.

And this is in the beginning of my career when I was living in New York and I was broke and a lot of crazy things happened to me.

It's really scary, traumatic things.

And I would always ask her her name is Marianne would always say what, like why are you like?

Never upset?

So I attributed that to her spiritual life, but it didn't speak to me.

And then later on I started practicing yoga Ashtanga yoga and my teacher, Eddie Stern, he still has a you know Eddie, Yeah, he's amazing.

I got quite caught up in and competitive about like first series, second series, third series.

But one thing I noticed is that a lot of people would come into his practice, his studio where he taught, and they wouldn't even do the posts.

They would just go and sit in front of the statue of ganesh or light candles or prayer.

And I really and Eddie pointed it out to me because sometimes I would have injuries, I would or I would be traveling and I couldn't practice yoga and he say, look, are you breathing And I'd say yes, and he said, you're practicing yoga.

So I realized that I.

Was too still, too caught up in the physical poses.

And he's like, no, you don't understand.

You're missing the whole point.

The poses are just something that you do to breathe through, to calm your nervous system down and to bring you back to your center.

And that really spoke to me.

There was a big no.

It was a painting on the wall of the yoga studio.

It says desire and detachment.

And I said, what does that mean?

And he said, well, of course we want.

We want all the beautiful things in life.

We want all the pleasures, we want all the happiness, we want every we want it all.

There's nothing wrong with that which can't be attached to it, because then if you're attached to it and you don't have it, what's going to happen to you?

So I studied that for a while, and I studied Sanskrit.

I had a teacher, and you know, I learned that the vibrations of the letters, you know, had a calming effect on your nervous system and centered you and placed you firmly rooted in the earth, and all of that made sense to me.

But then again, nothing happens by accident.

But I was pregnant with my daughter, Lola, my oldest daughter, and I suddenly realized I was living in la I suddenly realized, I'm going to be responsible for an other human being.

What am I going to teach her?

I'm just I'm like a meteor like making my way through the you know, the on this planet.

Like you know, I have great survival instincts, I have a great work ethic.

Yes, I'm very ambitious all of those things, but I was never like I was just knocking them down, you know what I mean, and not like looking back, I'm going to be somebody, because that's you know, that's why I came to New York in the first place.

I will never go back to the nobody life I had.

When I was a child growing up.

So I definitely was fueled by an inner drive, but I would not say that I was spiritual or conscious.

When I was pregnant, I suddenly realized I knew nothing and I was a slave or a victim of other people's opinions of me.

And I didn't have really.

Even though it looks like and looked like I was confident, brave, audacious, whatever, you know, I deep down Insiday was not.

So.

I was at a dinner party.

Were pregnant.

Yeah, I was at a dinner party at my friends in La and there was a woman sitting next to me and I knew her vaguely.

She's a costume designer.

She was a costume designer.

Her husband's a director.

And she said, oh, you should come with me to class.

And I said, what class.

I'm open to classes, by the way, I love being a student.

So what's the class all about.

She said, there's a teacher there.

It's something called Kabbala.

It's next to a synagogue.

And I was like, wait, so he's Jewish and she said yeah, but it doesn't have anything to do with being Jewish.

It's just a belief system.

Not a belief system, like a philosophy about life that you know, you could learn a lot from.

And I said, okay, I'll go.

So I did, and that's how I met my teacher.

And I literally would sit in the back of class for years.

Mostly men were in the class at the time.

It was but everything that he said seemed to make so much sense to me and gave me courage to be who I am and who I meant to be, and made me actually think about intention and a real sense of purpose, because my sense of purpose can't just be I want to be rich and famous, or I want to be popular, or I want to sell a lot of records, because none of that lasts.

But it wasn't until I went to class that I actually started thinking about those things.

So I just kept going and here I am today.

But you know, motherhood are being a parent is really what made me start asking questions that I most likely I should have asked them sooner, but I didn't because I was just caught up in my.

Self.

I love that story for so many reasons, one of them being that my journey to my spirituality had certain similarities in that not that I was pregnant, so definitely not that one.

But I had a friend and friends who were starting to get interested in spirituality, and they invited me to hear a monk speak.

And I'd seen monks while I was growing up, but I'd never really engaged with one or really understood what they did or meant.

And I'm so glad I said yes to going along, and I was very young.

I was eighteen nineteen years old.

I wasn't even seeking.

I was open, and I was curious, right, And to be honest, I was doing what everyone else was doing at that time when you're eighteen nineteen year old kid like experimenting, experimenting, and doing everything else under the sun.

But I'm so glad I went because now, looking back, I find that after meeting the monks that I met, it gave my life a compass at a very early age that I'm so grateful for because it changed the entire trajectory of my life.

I can't imagine what I would have ended up doing in the same way as you did.

And it sounds dramatic, but it's true that without the group of friends that invited me to go along and meet my teachers, it would become my future teachers.

I can't imagine what life could be like.

And are those teachers still your teachers?

Yes?

Absolutely, still since that time, so it's been nearly twenty years now.

That's meaningful, yeah, very meaningful.

And are your friends that came with you still also studying.

Or one of those one of those?

Yes, absolutely, one of those friends, was my best man at my wedding and he studies under the same teachers.

It's cool.

Yeah, what about the woman who took me to class?

No, okay, no, stick with it.

Are you still there at all or not?

Yes?

I am sometimes.

Yeah, it's amazing to hear that you had this ambition and this drive to become successful, and at the same time there was this spiritual calling.

Yes, that was almost happening simultaneously.

How did you reconcile the two when to the external lie they could look very opposite.

How did you actually look weird?

You mean, not weird in the sense of I think a lot of peopeople assume that spirituality and success don't go together.

A lot of people would.

Think that's absurd.

Those are narrow minded people.

I mean, you need to be spiritual to be successful.

Success is having a spiritual life period.

It's interesting because I had this boyfriend some time ago, and after we broke up, we saw each other years later and I was telling them about Cabala.

He's like, oh, yeah, that makes a lot of sense because you grew up as a Catholic.

I know how religious your mother was.

And I was like, no, no, that's not what it is at all.

It's got nothing to do with religion.

Everybody has to find the path that speaks to them and resonates with them.

But I do think it's important to have one.

And I dare say if you didn't have a spiritual path, you wouldn't be as successful as you are today.

I will make that assumption in your work, in your marriage, and your friendships, all your relationships.

It honestly, it sounds like a really like a cliche your spiritual life.

Even I was like the reason, but it's just got a bad rap.

You know, you, like one hundred percent can have a spiritual life and be successful.

I wouldn't be here but I didn't have one.

Madonna's story is a reminder that success without inner grounding can feel empty.

True resilience isn't fueled by ambition alone.

It comes from a deeper sense of purpose and doing the internal work to find fulfillment.

She demonstrates the takeaway that spirituality isn't separate from success, it's the foundation.

When Benny Blanco and Selena Gomez sat down with me, it was evident that their love wasn't just playful, it was mature.

They shared how they handle conflict, take space, and return to one another with honesty and respect.

Research shows lasting couples on those who never argue, but those who keep respect and practice repair.

Real love is imperfection.

It's creating a safe space through communication and trust.

Sometimes she'll say this is so funny.

Oh boy, no, no, no, She'll do this and it's really cool.

She'll go, I'm feeling a little irritated, and I think I need like twenty five minutes.

And I'll say okay, and then I give her her space.

And then after like five minutes she text me.

She's like, hey, will you come back.

But it's knowing that and we have the proper boundaries set with each other, Like I don't have to be on top of her every second, she doesn't have to be on top of me every second we're together.

I just want to know she's in the house so I can say like, hey, I love you and then go back to what I'm doing.

You know what I mean, Because look, we're both highly independent people.

Okay, but we're both little MUSHes who just need to be attached.

Yeah, we are so cheesy.

It's so fun.

Yeah, but it's like, but I feel like I think it helps us too that we're both you know, on my list a thing was I wanted someone to be driven and inspired by something.

I didn't care if they made any money or anything.

I just wanted someone to be so into something that they did every day.

And when she comes back from her day and she tells me what she did, I'm like, I'm not sitting there like, yeah, like when you're talking to your mom, you know, when you're talking to your mom and you just say, your mom just keeps talking to go yeah, uh huh yeah.

Like she comes back and like my eyes light up because I see the enthusiasm.

I see what she did, and I'm like it inspires me, and I'm like, I gotta do more in this thing.

And it's like we're in this place where we're inspiring each other and we're so inspired by what the other person's doing.

And and she'll help me out.

I'll be like, well, what if you did it like this, this and this, and and then she'll say something I'll be like, well, why don't you handle the situation?

Because we have such different personalities that are also the same, but we're the thing that one of us is really good at the other one maybe lax a little bit and vice versa.

And it's so cool to be able to like workshop like little conversations or how to handle the situation and it.

And I just feel so comfortable with her like that I can say anything and she won't ever say I don't know.

I love the maturity.

I mean hearing you both talk about it.

Yeah, there, we are not the perfect No, that's not perfect.

You're just sing no, no, no.

But I think the maturity of and I agree with you.

I think I think that's actually the difference.

And I'm glad you brought that up.

I think there's a big difference between maturity and perfection.

Yeah, perfection is saying we never have a disagreement, we never have to take space from each other, which you're not saying.

You're saying, hey, I.

Just asked for twenty five eight space, and then I was like, wait a minute, I need to And I think there's a maturity in that, because it requires maturity from both parts for you to first say hey, I need space, for you to say I get it, I respect you, and then for you to have the maturity to say actually I want you back, and for you to be like not like oh, I told you, so for you to be like I'm here for you, that's not perfection to me, that's maturity.

And I think that's I really want people to get that from it, that you are going to have disagreements, you are going to want space like me and Raley went through that.

She at the beginning of our relationship, if we had a disagreement and we were the same, we never we made a rule that would never raise our voices at each other because I came from a home where it was not great.

She comes from home where her parents don't raise their voices.

But I was just like, I never wanted them in my home.

I wanted the energy of my home to be so sacred, and I wanted the energy of the home to always have a space where everyone just walked in and felt like a warm hug.

And I was like, we can't argue and then expect.

That to happen.

But it took a long time for us to realize that when she at the star of our disagreements, she wanted space.

And I used to say to her, well, if you don't want to talk about it right now, that means you don't care about me, and that wasn't true.

She just needed space to process.

So it took time for us to mature, for me to realize, wait a minute, you wanting space?

Is you carying?

Yeah, the relationship some people, I get it.

They want to talk about it right then, they want to The one thing that also works for us so much is like we're not chill people, but we're like we're not We're never going to get like I'm not gonna yell at anyone in my life, yes and yeah.

And you know, I came from a home where a lot of that was happening, and I saw like at a young age, and I was just like, well, like my parents weren't speaking the same language.

Obviously they were speaking the actual same language.

They weren't speaking the same language to each other to communicate.

And if someone comes at you like hostile right away, the first thing I'm going to do, and I know she's going to do is shut down.

So you're not getting anything, you know, And I always say this, Guys are so quick to like they got to win, they got to win the argument, and it's like what are you doing?

What are you winning?

Like you're going to argue with your wife and like make her cry, and then you're like I won that argument, and then she hates you and resents you like wait, like, don't be an idiot, and it's like I.

I've been guilty though to start, Yeah, I don't know.

I'm mad of you.

Sorry.

I think for me, I necessarily felt like in other situations of mine it was I was very reactive.

I think that's why I was alone for five years, because I really needed to collect myself.

I think in the past that's why I say to him all the time, and ten years ago, it's not that I wouldn't have wanted to be with you.

I just wouldn't have been in the right headspace.

And I don't think that you deserve what I had gone through before.

So I've learned a lot of less and I've made mistakes, and I just want this to be right.

So for me, that was a lesson that I had to learn, because I think girls can equally want to be right.

That for me, it was really difficult in the past, and he's made it unbelievably easy, to the point where if I even get to the point where I'm so frustrated, he's like very quick to understand.

I hear you like you're allowed to feel that, and that helped me shift where my mind used to go, which was a little bit of anger.

So it was the validation of how you felt in those reactive moments.

Yes, that allowed you to not be reactive?

What was it that allowed you?

Because I feel like, as Benny was saying earlier, you carry this baggage from all of our relationships into this one.

I respect Benny because he's done nothing but respect me.

I again trust him.

I can tell him any even if it's about something that's uncomfortable, and maybe she should just talk to your girlfriends like he is that and that helps calm me down to say, Okay, so I'm going through these things because of maybe what I had before or whatever it is.

It's nothing is ever bad, Like nothing in my life.

I regret and I'm so so happy for my journey and I'll continue to be.

It is a lesson that you have to be patient and learn.

And I just I could never picture myself disrespecting him.

I think, well, it's also just a different thing because it's like, look, none of us are perfect.

Like she gets spicy sometimes and when I see something happening, it's about guiding the missile, not adding a jet pack on top of it with a with like machine gun artillery, Like I want to make if I see her getting to a place where I'm like, man, in five minutes from now, this room could explode.

I'm never gonna let it get to that.

Five minutes from now.

I'm gonna say, what are all the tools that I know that work for her, that I've learned over Like, I'm not gonna exacerbate a situation.

I'm gonna try to calm it down, because why do I want to be in that position where we're both just like upset about something.

I don't want to just calm it down and tell her what she wants to hear.

I'm not saying that.

I'm not saying like to your partner.

Be like yes, you're right, You're totally right.

Like everything you know.

I think you listen and you say like okay, Like sometimes I even I'll say like, let's not let it get there, let's like just talk about this.

And I do think physical touch is always like a very big way, like if you're in a conversation with your partner, like it's like sometimes just like a hand helps or just holding their hand while you're telling them, or giving them a hug while you're telling them, and if someone's upset, let them talk it out first, and then after they talk it out, be like, Okay, well here's what I think you know, and you can work through these things together.

It's such an easy way.

It's not always easy, I can tell you that.

And sometimes we just someone wants to be frustrated, and it's like, sometimes she'll tell me that.

She'll just be like, I know it's gonna be okay, but like, I just want to be frustrated in this moment.

And I'll have to redirect because I'll be like, you know what, you have every right to be in this moment, and she'll say this is why she said, this is why I want to be frustrated in this moment.

She said it the other day about something I can't even remember, and I was just like, oh my god.

I was like, yeah, I was like, that makes so much sense.

I was like, I don't agree with the frustration.

We'll get there afterwards, and I was like, but I get it.

I get it, and it's so cool and I've never quite had a relationship like with her, and we're the furthest thing from perfect in the world.

We're perfect for each other, not perfect for everyone else.

But I think the thing that's cool is that we've had.

All these experiences.

I've had all my experiences where it wasn't right, and I'm like, oh, okay, I'm going to change that the next time, you know, with this person or with that person.

And I think that's when you really grow is when you take all your experiences, good or bad.

Like I'm like her.

I take every experience in my life, my past partners, my family, my everything.

It's like everything happened for a reason, and I'm not going to sit here and mope about like things that could be better or different.

What I'm going to do is I'm going to say, Okay, I learned this, and now I'm going to put it into practice.

You know, for me, I always always said to RADI.

I always said to my wife, do you want me to listen?

Do you want me to fix this?

Or do you just want me to go through it with you?

Because they don't want you to fix it right away.

And I'm not saying I'm saying men or women, sometimes it's not about fixing, you know, everyone is.

You know, I'm such a problem solver, and you are too, so it's like your first thing, I know, the first thing in your head is like how can I fix this situation?

But sometimes it's not about fixing it right there.

Sometimes it's about just like you know, especially for women who are like strong, like both our partners, they don't have a lot of time to be vulnerable in all the areas of their life.

They have the world on their backs.

Your wife has.

There's so many people that rely on her.

There's so many people that rely on her, So sometimes they just want to complain about something and that's okay, that's.

Okay, Yeah, it's okay.

Who else are they going to do it to?

They might as well do it and you just listen.

Well, Benny and Selena show us is that love is less about avoiding conflict and more about how you navigate it, taking space without abandoning each other, listening before fixing, and validating feelings instead of winning the argument.

That's what creates trust, respect, and growth.

Their story is proof that lasting love isn't built on perfection, It's built on continuing to choose each other.

And finally, President Biden, it was the honor of a lifetime to be invited to the White House to interview a sitting president.

When I sat with President Biden, our conversation turned to loneliness, grief, and the role of family.

He reflected on how small gestures of presence, a call, a visit, simply showing up can ease the anxiety many young people face today.

Think of all the young people today, I think that there's more anxiety and loneliness today than there's been in a long long time.

You know, my friend I appointed Admiral by mcmurthhy, he was telling me about, you know, the percentage of young people today who are feeling lonely alone, and sometimes it's just touching just showing up.

I used to get the son Bo, who should be sitting here instead of me, would always say, Dad, you know I have time to make that call.

You know, I'd get in a plane and go home.

And because someone had a serious problem, lost a wife or daughter, and I said that you don't have time.

When he passed away, the hundreds of people told me how he called, he showed up, he was there, And because the people have shown up for me too, it just really matters.

Yeah, you've been through you mentioned it.

There You've been through so much tragic loss in your life.

As you just mentioned there, you didn't run for presidency in twenty sixteen, shortly after the loss of your son.

You've lost your first wife and daughter in a horrific accident.

I can't even begin to understand how someone has the courage to process that much loss in grief, let alone move forward in the way you have.

It's truly admirable.

How did you begin?

I had an overwhelming advantage in the loss, and that was I had a really close family.

Was there, for example, when my wife and daughter were killed, my first wife and my two boys were very badly injured.

Attractor chail and brought side.

I was not in the accident.

When I got home from the hospital.

Well, my sister and husband already gave up their apartment and moved in.

Helped me raise my kid my brother.

We lived in a suburban area.

It was more country than suburban, and there was a little barn on a prock garage bar and my brother came and he turned the loft to the barn into an apartment for himself.

They were there for me all the time.

That was a gigantic difference.

My best friend of my life and my sister and my brothers.

And.

So I had an enormous advantage.

And I think that when you see people who were going through something tough, it does matter if you reach out.

I mean it does matter.

Like, for example, you know you have a one you're a senator.

For all the years I was in a small state, you know so many people, and people would pass away to show up at the wake of the funeral, no matter what was happening.

I learned it early on.

People would stop and just come and throw their arms around me because if they know you know the pain they feel, they get some solace in it.

It's not always easy, but it just matters just to just to reach out, let people know you see them.

How did you allow yourself to receive that help too?

I feel like, as you were mentioning earlier, with the loneliness and anxiety that exists, a lot of people either struggle to know what to say.

I think we live in a society where people are like, but what do I say if they've gone through that?

And the opposite end what you just said.

Being able to be open enough to actually receive help requires a certain amount of courage and strength as well.

Well, I was raising a family for real extended family, my grandparents as well, where my dad in an expression, families beginning, middle and end.

There's a rule of the family growing up.

Not a joke.

We didn't notice the time, but whenever you wanted to speak to your mother or father, I mean, they said, can we he had a problem.

No matter what they were doing, they stopped.

No matter what they were doing, they stopped and heard, listen to you.

And I did the same with my children, and they did the same with theirs, because it's a matter of them knowing that they are the most important thing in your life.

Have they got a problem, You're there to listen.

I have seven grandkids, four of them all five and mold enough to talk on the phone.

You know, every day I either text them or call them.

And a matter of factor in the campaign, they were having a I didn't realize they're having an interview the four oldest grandchildren, they said, and just at the time, and they said, they call me pop.

Pop calls us every day or text us every day, and I call them phone right.

Well, I give my word.

I had no idea, but it said, look, I just think being there is important it makes such a difference.

I think knowing that someone's going to be there for you, just to listen, just to hold you, just to hug you.

Yeah.

After his own losses, he shared how family and community carried him through.

Research confirms it social support is one of the strongest predictors of resilience in the face of trauma.

What the President reminds us is that helping doesn't require perfect words or solutions.

It can simply require presence to reach out when someone is struggling, to show up when it would be easier to stay away, and to listen fully so the people we love know they matter, because sometimes the greatest gift we can give is simply not letting someone go through it alone.

These conversations are just a glimpse of what this community has built together over five million subscribed.

On Purpose has always been about learning and growing together.

Thank you for being a part of this community, for listening, watching, and carrying these lessons into your own lives.

I'm so incredibly grateful and I can't wait for the next five million.

Thank you.

If you enjoyed this podcast, you're going to love my conversation with Michelle Obama, where she opens up on how to stay with your partner when they're changing, and the four check ins you should be doing in your relationship.

We also talk about how to deal with relationships when they're under stressed.

If you're going through something right now with your partner or someone you're seeing, this is the episode for you.

Now, wonder our kids are struggling.

We have a new technology and we've just taken it in hookline and Sinker, and we have to be mindful for our kids.

They'll just be thumbing through this stuff.

You know, their mind's never sleeping