Everyone.

I'm Mike Dell, VP of customer relations here at Blueberry.

And I'm Todd Cochran, founder of Blueberry.

And I'm Mackenzie Bennett, marketing specialist.

Welcome to Podcast Insider.

And today, we're diving into a topic that's core to podcasting and to Blueberry's mission, keeping podcasting independent.

And we're gonna explore why independence matters, what's at stake for creators today, and what technical and business decisions help you stay in control.

And we'll also share how to market yourself as an independent voice in a space that's seeing more and more influence from big media companies.

You're listening to Podcast Insider hosted by Mike Dell, Todd Cochran, and Mackenzie Bennett from the Blueberry team, bringing you weekly insights, advice, and insider tips and tricks to help you start, grow, and thrive through podcasting.

With all the support of your team here at Blueberry Podcasting, welcome.

Let's dive in.

You know, this is, a topic I've been thinking about a lot lately, especially with the you know, everyone is just basically saying, oh, you have to do video.

And the realization is that, no.

You you don't have to do video.

And I hear from our new clients and potential clients that, you know, they're concerned about this and, you know, think they have to put in a big production and be one of the the big boys or girls.

And, you know, and, you know but I in my response to those podcasters is, you know, this this has always been a space where where creators can find their own voice and an audience and share their message.

But what a lot of the big media, you know, narrative is that, you know, you just it's they're trying to change a narrative and it's and then in effect is, in my opinion, kind of suppressing some folks considering becoming a creator.

So I think that, we need to make folks understand what independence really looks like and why it's worth protecting.

And, you know, we've been on this bandwagon for twenty years now, so we can probably talk about a 100 things in this regard only.

When the podcasting first started, it was, hey.

There's no more gatekeepers.

There's no more you know, you don't have to be with a radio or TV to get on you know, to broadcast your show, your thoughts, your whatever.

And now they're trying to get it back to having gatekeepers, and that just isn't what podcasting is all about or at least in my opinion, it shouldn't be.

You know, being independent lets you control what you say.

You don't have to ask permission.

You just do it.

And if it takes off, it takes off.

If it doesn't, it doesn't, but it's on you.

It's your thing.

It's you're not a broadcaster on Spotify.

You're a podcaster that can also distribute to Spotify and all these other places.

And I think a lot of those platforms are people are very cognizant.

They're very careful in what they say because of the, you know, the the moderation constraints.

Constraints.

And this is one of the beauties of podcasting is there's really no moderation constraints.

Now, you know, this not very many shows have ever been deplatformed in the podcast sphere because they can't be because they go into some things we're gonna talk about here in a minute.

But, again, I think it's important that you understand as a potential listener that, again, as Mike said, you control your content and message.

My biggest thing is the way that you monetize Because when you are deciding how you're gonna monetize, whether that is, you know, with with traditional ads that we're used to hearing at this point, doing premium content that a select user group is paying for, asking for listener donated support or all of the above, Signing with specific companies will limit what you are allowed to say.

That's just that's just how some advertising goes.

You know, you're not gonna gel with every company out there that is looking to do an ad deal specifically with podcasting too.

There's dozens of companies I wouldn't go near or touch, and there are companies that would do the same to me if I was putting out my own podcast with my own content.

And that is one of the things that is solely your choice.

And even if you are joining something like a network, that is also something that you are letting go.

You can still be in control of it somewhat if that's unprivileged enough to be able to to negotiate in your own contract for your show.

But if not, that is something that you were just acknowledging that this is gonna be different.

You know, for me, having done this for so long, it's really truly about controlling my brand, controlling my not controlling, but building my audience on my own terms where no one can dictate to you the direction of the show, the content of the show.

And I and I think that sometimes is often lost is that you you have have to be able to do that.

If you're gonna put your creative effort, your blood, sweat, and tears into something, you know, you you wanna build your brand and you wanna build it your way and do it and do it as you so please.

And I think that's the power of being independent, power of being a a true podcaster.

And, you know, it goes a long ways when it comes to audience.

They crave it.

People wanna find independent creators, across all mediums at this point.

And with podcasting, you know, that's something that they're absolutely used to and expecting that you might be an independent creator and not, you know, part of a news network.

Because so often nowadays, it's these things are a monopoly, and there's the exact same rhetoric going from one thing to the other.

So they are looking for something that is going to stand out to them.

That is someone expressing and giving them, you know, what they want without just blending in.

Yeah.

I think listeners can detect when you're being non authentic and and not being transparent.

I I think they can smell that a a mile away.

So being able to be yourself and saying what you wanna say and how you wanna say it literally, I think that is the power of this medium.

And I go back to stories about different organizations and stuff that started a podcast largely because their words were being manipulated, and they wanted to make sure they put out media so that they heard their voice and that their message couldn't be misconstrued.

So it's not just individuals, it can be companies or organizations too that are trying to, to put it out there.

Mike, if there's a tip you can give someone, what would be the tip would be?

Just be, you know, if a place that you're gonna be podcasting from limits where your podcast can appear, who can access it, or how you can monetize it, it may be undermining your independence.

If they have rules that go against what you wanna do, or you may not wanna be there.

Now if they write a big enough check, you might want to.

But I think, I, you know, I think being independent isn't just about the AKA technical decisions, you know, control your feed, control your brand, all this.

It's also anything that, that's gonna allow you to stand out in a crowd.

And there's a lot of podcasts out there, you know, probably around 400,000 that are currently active.

So, you know, you being that independent voice, again, it goes back to that transparency telling your audience you're an independent creator that, you know, you basically, even if you have a sponsor, you can even say how I am not my message is not controlled.

And if it is controlled, make sure you divulge that.

If your sponsor doesn't let you talk about someone else in your same category, then you say, hey.

I'm kinda obligated not to talk about this.

I'll let you guys make up your own mind on a specific topic that's come up for me even in my own show in the past where my sponsors well, someone on my sponsors team did something really dumb and, you know, I kinda had to address it.

And I had to be you know, find that line, but, again, that transparency is super, super powerful.

Yeah.

It did just you know, being independent also helps you, you know, build a direct relationship with your listeners, viewers, whatever, if you're doing video.

And the beauty of that is that they know you.

They don't need to know that you're on, ABC network, and I don't mean ABC the broadcaster, but, you know, just as a generic network or generic platform.

I'm not speaking for say, you're on Spotify as your your platform.

You know, you you don't speak for Spotify.

You look at Joe Rogan.

He was he's exclusive to to Spotify.

I mean, now he's out there more open, which is good, and they don't mess with him as much as they would the the average person.

But the the beauty of, of not being tied to one platform is you've got if you got something bad to say about a platform, well, you can say it.

And, you know, but but keeping that relationship with your listeners directly helps.

I I have listeners that have been listening to me for twenty years.

I know them by name, you know, and sometimes I'll call them out on the show and say, what do you think of that, Wes?

And, you know, I'll get an email back.

And you you just can't get that if you're not truly independent.

I think this this definition of independent needs to be a little more refined.

I think independent means you are just not constrained by someone.

You don't have to answer to someone.

I would say Rogan has to answer someone.

Yeah.

So he's not independent.

So if you don't have to answer someone, this show, we're really not independent because what do we answer to?

We answer to the company, but we also are pretty free flowing in our thoughts and ideas on here too.

Yeah.

So as as an independent creator, you you got that real like you said, you have that ability to build a relationship, and I think using you know, there's lots of language you can define yourself by.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So much of that relationship that you are setting and really defining is saying that you are independent, you are listener supported.

That that go goes across the board.

That's on your website.

That's on your social media.

That's on your show that's in your show notes.

That's in the content that you were speaking out into the world.

It's it goes into the newsletters that you're putting out.

The, you know, the Reddit channels that you're in, all it's everything.

And, you know, I go back to the early days and, you know, there really wasn't this everyone was pretty independent in the beginning.

And why did why did they choose independence?

It was pretty simple because we could for the first time.

We didn't have to get on a radio station very easily.

No.

Or or you couldn't be distributed.

That was the thing.

That's that's what I mean.

You know, you couldn't you couldn't get on a a network, a a radio network or even a radio station without, you know, going through a whole bunch of stuff, and there's lots of rules.

And when podcasting first came out, like I said before, the big thing was you don't have to worry about the gatekeepers.

You don't have to worry about the FCC rules.

And there was a a saying that that we won't say here about the FCC.

But I think That was a big thing in podcasting back then.

But I also think that most of us had no desire to be on the radio.

And but at the same time, if you wanted to be on the Xbox or you wanted to be on the sites of the day, there was a gatekeeper there.

And, you know, I think independent creators often have the strongest listener loyalty too.

So lean into that and invite your audience to be part of that that journey.

There's also more reason to be independent as a business than just your own personal preference, maybe.

You know, it it might be best for your for you as a whole, for your podcast as a whole, if you're doing this, because you're in control of your revenue streams and how you're functioning and structuring and and overall the brand.

Yeah.

No forced ads, no revenue splits, all that kinda goes into into that play.

And You are the you are the one designating whatever is in that contract.

Whatever, you know, legal stuff is happening, you are the force behind it.

Yeah.

And a 100 Go ahead.

And as, you know, as you as you grow or something, you know, you could always, you know, flip it around, do do something different.

You maintain that flexibility if you're not under some contract, you know, and remaining independent.

You've got that you know, I look at, Dave Ramsey.

Okay?

It's a big company.

He's a big company, but he is an independent podcaster creator.

He's not beholden to these big companies.

Now he does have an ad sales team and all that stuff, but a lot of that's in house.

And so you can get really big and still be independent.

You know, he protects his brand.

He protects his company's name, protects his IP, and his audience remains under his umbrella.

And, you know, and Dave has actually added shows to his network, so those shows that grow may have to follow the rules of Dave Ramsey.

Yeah.

But They own.

But at the same time, that's a choice they made.

And I think for most businesses out there, you know, by default, you're largely gonna be independent unless you're doing a legal, finance, some sort of showing you join some network that has that type of content, then you may not be as as independent because you have to follow the rules of whatever that network has set forth.

And I think too there's the ability to diversify.

You don't have to run ads.

You can run ads.

You can do premium content.

You you really can do whatever you want.

Value for value, you know.

I'm treasure and talent, you know, that whole thing.

One of the things that you can do by yourself as opposed to working for a network or a business or whatever the case, this allows you to be incredibly creative and try whatever it is that you want to monetize.

It can be a little scary if you don't have that backup of, you know, whoever is finding this for you, finding ways to monetize, but it does mean that you are able to try whatever it is that you want.

Some of the technical choices that, can support independence, and, you know, the technology behind your podcast plays a huge role in maintaining that independence.

So you wanna make intentional choices about where and how you, host your show.

And one of the big things here at Blueberry is owning your own RSS feed.

You know, don't let a platform control it.

Of course, here at Blueberry, we ensure that you can always take your feed with you.

So that you know, that's one of the the biggest things.

I just had one today where somebody was working with a consultant and, didn't own all her stuff.

And, so there's a little bit of a fight going on there, and and you don't wanna get into that.

Make sure you own the stuff.

You you can hire people to help you, but you keep control of your RSS feed, your logins to the different accounts, and so on.

At the same time, I think, you know, this you know, we've we've pushed this for years as, you know, having your own domain.

And, that's ideally with a full site a full site that we offer, you know, either with the WordPress or or one of your own.

So, you know, owning your website is super, super critical to having that origin of content.

But, of course, you host your media independently, so you don't have to be on a platform that inserts ads or or locks your content.

Hosts like Blueberry, it's your choice on what you what you participate in and do.

So, you know, we're we're just kinda here to get that media up, get it hosted, get it delivered, but it's your decision then.

Okay.

Do I wanna run ads?

Do I wanna run Go Premium?

Do I wanna have, programmatic advertising?

You know, we, we don't touch that audio file.

You make that decision, independently.

We stay a 100% out of your content unless you ask us to.

And then, we don't touch your content, but we will analyze crap out of it.

We will we have a lot of analytics going on, for your Blueberry stats that are gonna give you a actual real true picture of your audience.

And I think one thing that's really important too of free hosting solutions, If you're not paying, you're basically probably the product, and you may be paying with your content or audience success.

And as we see here every day, we graduate podcast into Blueberry that have been on platforms that either limited their success, limited the amount of analytics, limited their freedom to be more diversified.

It just runs the full gamut of decisions.

So as we kinda wrap this independent discussion up of being an independent podcaster, which I feel in my personal shows I am, any last thoughts?

Again, just be careful of who you partner with for your podcast.

Just, you know, the the the more you control yourself.

And, yes, it's a little more work.

We do our best here to help you, you know, get through the technical stuff, and then you create the content.

You get to choose what you wanna say, when you wanna say it, how often you wanna podcast, how long the episodes are.

Everything about it is yours, and we stay out of your way.

My last thing is there's really no podcast failure.

You know, if you wanna start this up and remain a 100% independent and not move on to a big platform or network, then that is your choice, and there's there's really nothing that can go wrong.

So that's a wrap on today's episode.

I hope this gives you some practical ideas to keep your podcast truly independent.

And we do want you to remember that independence isn't just about the technology itself, but it's about how you build your brand, your business, and the relationship that you have with your audiences.

Yeah.

Of course.

We always have to put this in here.

Don't forget to follow or subscribe Podcast Insider.

Never miss anything that we put out here from the Blueberry team.

We'll see you next time.

Go check us out at podcastinsider.com.

Thanks for joining us.

Come back next week.

And in the meantime, head to podcastinsider.com for more information, to subscribe, share, and read our show notes.

To check out our latest suite of services and learn how Blueberry can help you leverage your podcast, visit blueberry.com.

That's Blueberry without the e's.

We couldn't afford the e's.