[SPEAKER_03]: Hello everyone, welcome to the Delta Flyers, journey through the wormhole with cork dacks in their good friends, Tom and Harry, join us as we make our way through episodes of Star Trek, Deep Space Nine.

[SPEAKER_00]: Your hosts for today are my fellow Trek actors, Garrett Wong, and Robert Duncan McNeill.

[SPEAKER_00]: And myself, Terry Farrell.

[SPEAKER_01]: for the complete and exciting version of this podcast where you get tons of cool, fun, extra stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sign up for patreon.com forward slash the Delta Flyers and become a patron today.

[SPEAKER_01]: Woohoo!

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey!

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, how cute was our teaser for the last show?

[SPEAKER_00]: Are the teaser?

[SPEAKER_00]: The oat milk thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: The one that aired Yeah, but there was a teaser for it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, God.

[SPEAKER_00]: I said I drink milk and Robbie said he drinks.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, milk Yeah, I love it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's so makes you laugh And I was trying not to yuck his yam and then I did later which was so bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm so sorry Yeah, okay, everybody likes different milks.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think [SPEAKER_03]: Making a Rebecca are really good at that and finding the funny in the teasers to move out there.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, that's that's what we see.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well done ladies, let's talk about some birthdays.

[SPEAKER_03]: What do you think?

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, let's do it.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's the case.

[SPEAKER_03]: All right, the first one would be September 30th.

[SPEAKER_03]: And that happens to be a birthday for Christians.

[SPEAKER_03]: So happy birthday, Christian.

[SPEAKER_00]: Happy birthday, Christian.

[SPEAKER_03]: Happy birthday, Kristen.

[SPEAKER_03]: Happy birthday to Kit Marie on September 29th.

[SPEAKER_03]: Happy birthday, Kit.

[SPEAKER_00]: Happy birthday.

[SPEAKER_03]: Happy birthday, Kit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Have a great day.

[SPEAKER_00]: We have Alexander Ray on October 3rd.

[SPEAKER_00]: Happy birthday, Alexander.

[SPEAKER_00]: Happy birthday, Alexander Ray.

[SPEAKER_03]: October 3rd.

[SPEAKER_01]: Happy birthday, Alexander Ray.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hope it's a great one.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's just jump right into this folks.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's go with that poetry synopsis.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: Harry is going to grace us with another one of her beautiful bombs.

[SPEAKER_03]: Starting with Robbie's Limerick, then my hi-cu, and then Terry's beautiful bomb.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, here we go.

[SPEAKER_01]: My Limerick adjacent.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's Limerick adjacent.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not technically, it's not a Limerick.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh.

[SPEAKER_01]: There is a rhythm to Limerick's.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have broken that a long time ago.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've accepted myself.

[SPEAKER_01]: Five.

[SPEAKER_01]: Warf's in big trouble, and Cisco's his lawyer in the trial.

[SPEAKER_01]: The cling-on lawyer has a real nasty style.

[SPEAKER_01]: Cisco knows something's not right, so Odo finds secrets they can cite.

[SPEAKER_01]: For Warf, this lesson on command was truly worthwhile.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's so good, it's just a matter of what label it is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_00]: It really is label.

[SPEAKER_03]: Beautiful.

[SPEAKER_03]: Wow, here's my high coup for rules of engagement.

[SPEAKER_03]: Warf is on trial.

[SPEAKER_03]: Cisco, the defense lawyer.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's break the fourth wall!

[SPEAKER_00]: Awesome.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was very good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love that you added that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you because that to me was the highlight of this episode, so I had to put that in there.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have some issues with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know you do.

[SPEAKER_03]: I already know you do, Robbie.

[SPEAKER_03]: I already knew that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's but before we get into that, let's let us please hear Terry's poem, please.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my goodness, um, worth.

[SPEAKER_00]: How dare you question his integrity, stripping his leadership with gravity, his soul, the embodiment of honor, a warrior in battle, I leave you to ponder.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah!

[SPEAKER_01]: Nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: Really?

[SPEAKER_01]: Terry's all the same.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Was great.

[SPEAKER_03]: Deep.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was well.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it makes you ponder.

[SPEAKER_03]: Literally, but it does.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Good job.

[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, thank you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Good, good job.

[SPEAKER_03]: OK.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's jump right into this.

[SPEAKER_03]: This story is by Bradley Thompson and David Weddle, tell play by Ronald D.

Moore and directed by our friend, [SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it's so good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's very good.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why he doesn't direct more these days.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's like he did for a while, and then he's not doing it as much anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I get it's hard, it's hard.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a lot of work you guys do.

[SPEAKER_00]: Are you earn your money?

[SPEAKER_00]: It's you work before the show and the show and after the show, it's a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was talking to Bob Ricardo recently about his directing on Voyager and [SPEAKER_01]: he was just saying I knew after two episodes of Voyager that that was not my job.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just could not do it like it's just stressful and exhausting and he's like I can't imagine walking on to a show with a crew and a cast of strangers and trying to do that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like it was hard enough.

[SPEAKER_00]: with people that were supporting it well and yeah yeah well on top of it too you have the intelligent the executive producers are really the directors directing you on what they want which is not the same as having like an independent film that's yours and your literally telling the story you want to tell as a director it's got to be a big [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Alan Tudick directed this year on Resident Alien this past season and he said after it was done he goes, I don't think I'm going to direct TV anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love I like the directing part, but the TV part where you've got studio notes and network notes and producer notes and you just have to be overwhelming.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, especially when you're so creative, I mean, I didn't get to meet him this weekend, but obviously from his work as an actor, he's an incredibly creative human being.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he has lots of ideas and to kind of squash that or sit on that and have to work within [SPEAKER_01]: a corporate structure.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and even as an actor, I felt like I was with when they were trying to figure out who DAX was.

[SPEAKER_00]: I started to feel like I was being painted in a corner, like because to struggle to find what fit right for me with the notes, [SPEAKER_00]: So sometimes it stops your creativity from flowing because not that it's not that it's only negative.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's an environment of no and kind of fear.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh, I don't want to make a mistake.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to make a wrong thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want people to be happy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, which then it makes you question yourself and everything that you're doing it's like why are you okay all that critique Yeah, I'm doing the right thing.

[SPEAKER_03]: I might yeah, so you're creating me is Strangled yeah, yeah, okay Let us talk about the guest stars.

[SPEAKER_03]: We have Ron Canada as [SPEAKER_03]: But I say that right, ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch-pock ch [SPEAKER_03]: kind of poisoning, like leaving, you know, all types of poison as well.

[SPEAKER_00]: I've got to watch the show Voyager.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you do.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, you do.

[SPEAKER_03]: So he was fessic in the Voyager episode, Juggernaut.

[SPEAKER_03]: We also have Deborah Strang, as Admiral Tolara, I guess the judge in this trial.

[SPEAKER_03]: Coastars, we have one, Christopher Michael, as Helm Officer.

[SPEAKER_03]: Helm Officer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Was that on the defiant?

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, it had to have been like where else you've been.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't remember.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, Christopher.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, me too.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was so focused.

[SPEAKER_01]: There was so much talking to the camera that it distracted me from real acting.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm getting my opinion about the talking to the camera.

[SPEAKER_03]: it was creative look as experimental okay yeah like can we talk about yes we will talk about that I know not now not now I'm gonna keep going there let's go trivia rock again is not in this episode I'm always bummed when I don't see sarak so I don't know yeah he's so good yeah [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so let me just read you a little bit about the origins of this episode.

[SPEAKER_03]: They are to be found in iris Stephen Bears' love for the films of director Sam Peckinpa.

[SPEAKER_03]: So in 1994, iris Stephen Bear read a new Peckinpa biography written by David Wettel.

[SPEAKER_03]: He was so impressed with the book that he invited Wettel down to Paramount, the Paramount lot, [SPEAKER_03]: to have a look around.

[SPEAKER_03]: While touring the DS9 sets, Wettel suggested to bear that he pitch a show and bear was thrilled with the idea.

[SPEAKER_03]: Wettel then contacted his film school writing partner Bradley Thompson and asked him if he'd like to join him in putting a show together.

[SPEAKER_03]: At the time, Thompson was studying computer failures and what happens.

[SPEAKER_03]: when major computer systems don't work the way they're supposed to.

[SPEAKER_03]: Now, a particularly good example of this was the Iran Air Flight 655 in 1988 in which a U.S.

[SPEAKER_03]: Navy vessel, the USS Vincent's shot down an Iranian passenger aircraft.

[SPEAKER_03]: killing all 290 passengers and crew.

[SPEAKER_03]: The U.S.

[SPEAKER_03]: government claimed that the computerized missile system mistook the aircraft for a fighter jet because it wasn't where it was supposed to be and because the pilot wasn't listening to the frequency on which the Vincent's was broadcasting a warning notification.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was upon this incident that Weddle and Thompson based their story.

[SPEAKER_03]: A Starfleet vessel destroys a civilian ship because it enters a combat zone so that it all started from that Very cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's that is very cool.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's a very cool.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can I just say something, Gawa?

[SPEAKER_00]: This, what, what you share the investigative work you do to tell us all of this is one of my favorite favorite parts of our show.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, this is fascinating.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, whatever know this information.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, no, and also when you were filming, I'm sure they didn't come over and tell you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Hey, Terry, this is why this episode exists.

[SPEAKER_01]: It would be really helpful if they did.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my god.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, wouldn't it just all of a sudden, it adds gravity.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's gravity and a responsibility for the real people that are involved in these things.

[SPEAKER_01]: I remember once I was directing, I was directing an episode called The Unity about some board that had gotten separated from the collective.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I had recently read a book about the fall of the Soviet Union and how confusing it was after communism fell [SPEAKER_01]: lost.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I would tell the actors as we're doing this, I'd say, oh, this episode for me is very much about the fall of communism, about the confusion in the streets.

[SPEAKER_01]: And suddenly the actors were like, oh, thank you for that, because it gave them something concrete to grab onto.

[SPEAKER_00]: You are fantastic.

[SPEAKER_00]: I had were the worlds.

[SPEAKER_00]: I had three parts.

[SPEAKER_00]: I spoke to Robbie before I did it.

[SPEAKER_01]: At a convention.

[SPEAKER_00]: At a convention.

[SPEAKER_00]: At the circuit convention.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: and Robbie and I had a chat about my performance and he really helped ground me.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm glad.

[SPEAKER_00]: He really did and it went great and I had so much fun and I realized too.

[SPEAKER_00]: I had this habit of saying I'm nervous.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I thought about, I reflected on my demeanor that day and I wasn't nervous.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was excited, I was happy all day.

[SPEAKER_00]: I had so much energy, I never ran out of it, [SPEAKER_00]: but I was so excited to perform those three characters and but it was very grounding speaking to you and it's so lovely when you trust someone and you go a head and ask for a little help.

[SPEAKER_00]: It just I was so proud of myself for going head and asking you and I just really grateful as a friend that you offered and your [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thanks.

[SPEAKER_00]: It is.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Now I know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure that work with you are very lucky actors.

[SPEAKER_03]: They are.

[SPEAKER_03]: Now I know what was the, and how I know what the combo was about.

[SPEAKER_03]: Robby and I were walking when we bumped into Terry and they said they went off for a second and started talking and it must have been about this.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm clearly because it was a bit of a in-depth combo and it seemed about work possibly and it was about the war of the worlds that you ended up doing.

[SPEAKER_03]: Awesome.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll just, since we're giving feedback, I will say, Terry, I love that you don't just think these nice and wonderful and kind and appreciative positive thoughts, but you say them to people and that not everybody does and I appreciate that about you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, always.

[SPEAKER_02]: Always.

[SPEAKER_01]: Very great.

[SPEAKER_01]: Very great.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love all of you, okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: Here we go.

[SPEAKER_03]: Another little bit of trivia.

[SPEAKER_03]: In the original version of this story, it was Cisco who was on trial, not worth.

[SPEAKER_03]: The episode also had a different denomal, and so far as it turned out that the clean on ship which had been destroyed wasn't actually a ship at all, but a fake holographic projection.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was Iris Steven Bear who suggested switching it to a warf show and removing the holographic conclusion.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like that better.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't like a holographic ship.

[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was a clever detail and, you know, um, detective work for Oda to do and it actually makes sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like the plan you kind of go, oh, of course.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was a genius wrap around.

[SPEAKER_00]: I liked it a lot.

[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't see it coming and I was thinking, how the heck are they going to get them out of this?

[SPEAKER_03]: And Cisco being on trial, no, I like Cisco being the defense attorney much better.

[SPEAKER_00]: He was a really good attorney.

[SPEAKER_00]: You did a good job.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, he could have had his own show.

[SPEAKER_00]: He could have, you know, like instead of ballet law, New York law, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Belmont, New York, so he can be with his family.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hello, he's a attorney.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's using people getting him out of trouble.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: the firm of the firm of Cisco Cisco Cisco and Odo so it could be Benjamin's and Jake and Odo joining in that law.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, right.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: Alrighty, what else do we have?

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, this episode is the second time that a DS9 crew member is wrongly accused of a crime by a foreign government.

[SPEAKER_03]: as a means of discrediting Starfleet or weakening their position.

[SPEAKER_03]: The other being O'Brien in tribunal, remember against the Kardashians, we have a roughed-up and everything, similar situations also occur in the TNG episode a matter of perspective, which Robbie and I have not seen, as well as the Voyager episode X post-factor which Robbie starred in, and he was accused wrongly in that one.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, I was.

[SPEAKER_03]: You are.

[SPEAKER_03]: Urr.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it reminded me of Dax, that episode in the first season when I couldn't speak, because I was, oh yeah, that's right, when I needed to take it over on trial.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because where wasn't saying anything, I was like, [SPEAKER_01]: I know, I said, yeah, I, I, I felt that in the middle of the episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, he hasn't said anything.

[SPEAKER_00]: I know.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's all about war, and he's hardly spoken this episode.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Not even with Avery, like, but that was good because it kept us like waiting for him to speak was huge.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it did really.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's my art.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's also what the writers were upset about.

[SPEAKER_03]: They weren't happy with the final thing.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the final product yet because they felt that Warf is the focus But he didn't speak and they felt that was a injustice to his character that this episode would have been better if they had more warf lines And so I didn't bother me to be perfectly honest.

[SPEAKER_03]: I was okay with it But I think maybe that might have bugged Robbie [SPEAKER_01]: It bothered me a little in the beginning and then as Harry said, it became so apparent that he's not defending himself with anyone.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're not hearing any of his opinions.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so apparent that I was like, okay, we're waiting.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're waiting.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to come out.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm on the edge of my seat.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's what I want to hear.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want to hear.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, Robby, let's jump into it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let's jump into it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's start with the defiant and basically we're in Worf's nightmare.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's this great stylized scene, lots of great camera movement, red alert, a worf is running around with a bat lift, the bridge crew is dead, and a group of clean-ons are celebrating with bat lifts over their head.

[SPEAKER_01]: The clean-ons are thrilled about this, and then Worf enters the bridge and he sees [SPEAKER_01]: dead clinging on children all around instead of the federation crew and kind of switches over and then suddenly we go to a close-up worth pops up out of the nightmare.

[SPEAKER_01]: I loved his sat the sound of his wake up though.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was like oh yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: I've never heard Michael Dorn Well, it'd be an effective Yeah, it'd be an effective I was impressed and I made the same note I said when he made that sound It were used to hearing warmth With a very low voice like this And all of a sudden he's like I mean it was the highest octave I've ever heard Coming out of his mouth I was like my gosh He's got something [SPEAKER_03]: someone gooseed warf and that's not it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he's in a holding cell.

[SPEAKER_01]: We cut wide.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's in a holding cell.

[SPEAKER_01]: Odo's there.

[SPEAKER_00]: That was weird.

[SPEAKER_00]: What's that weird?

[SPEAKER_01]: It is.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, there's a belief.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was confused.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, there's a deleted scene.

[SPEAKER_03]: There's a, what they didn't film or deleted.

[SPEAKER_03]: See, I can't remember which one.

[SPEAKER_03]: But [SPEAKER_03]: Cisco says, I would like to request that Warf stay in his quarters and not the holding cellity longer.

[SPEAKER_03]: So that was something that never was shown.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, interesting.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yeah, at this point, we don't know why we don't know why.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know why he's in the holding cell.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Odo does say it's 4 a.m.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're hearing starts in four hours.

[SPEAKER_01]: Go back to sleep.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's basically Odo's like, go back to sleep.

[SPEAKER_01]: What is Odo doing up?

[SPEAKER_01]: Shouldn't he be in a bucket?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, it's 4 a.m.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hi, what the heck when does he buck it when?

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, Terry that just okay, that gives when you said when does he bucket that made me laugh, but it also gave me an idea for sure.

[SPEAKER_03]: Do you remember those white shirts with black lettering back in the 80s or 90s?

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how many ideas I've given.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my god, it's amazing.

[SPEAKER_03]: And instead of saying got milk, we said got bucket and then was your mark.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I like it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, good.

[SPEAKER_00]: I like it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Remember those t-shirts in the 80s that were big like Frankie goes to Hollywood Yeah, giant.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, just like block.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well, just like that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody had those t-shirts and they like a bucket on the front.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I'm the back.

[SPEAKER_00]: The big holly.

[SPEAKER_00]: The big.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, got bucket on the back huge.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, big bucket on the front.

[UNKNOWN]: Yeah [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, everybody needs a little bucket time.

[SPEAKER_01]: We do.

[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Look at time.

[SPEAKER_01]: We go into the word room, and there's a Vulcan judge.

[SPEAKER_01]: We meet named Tolaro.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there's a big bell.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was interesting.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I like the tone.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was very warm.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was like a sound.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, right.

[SPEAKER_01]: The trial begins, hits the bell with a sound bath.

[SPEAKER_01]: The trial begins.

[SPEAKER_01]: We learned that Warf engaged two cling on ships in this.

[SPEAKER_01]: We get some of the facts.

[SPEAKER_01]: Basically, this is like laying out the case.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Opening statements kind of.

[SPEAKER_01]: We learned that these two clean-on ships were firing on him, and Warf was in command, and he took aim at a ship and ended up killing 441 clean-on civilians.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: And to be specific, the clingsons were using a tactic where they decloke fire then recloke and disappear.

[SPEAKER_03]: And so he started getting the pattern of the, of the, of the cloaking and un, uh, recloking ships, and he said, okay, it's going to be now go.

[SPEAKER_03]: And as it was coming in, then that's the freighter.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he's in a battle.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's in the middle of a battle.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, in this scene, I don't know Garrett not to correct you, but in this one, I don't know that we learn that pattern yet.

[SPEAKER_01]: That comes out later.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, yes, yes, yes, you're right.

[SPEAKER_03]: You're right.

[SPEAKER_03]: I jumped in.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we're just kind of told the basic facts of...

[SPEAKER_01]: there were and he killed a civilian ship.

[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, it seems bad for war.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it just seems blatant and yeah, yeah, black fold and not like war.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, not at all like.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's yeah, more confusion.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, 441.

[SPEAKER_01]: So 141.

[SPEAKER_03]: We do see that Cisco is his defense attorney.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, or advocate, I guess, in this, and that's a term, that's a military term, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, instead of saying lawyer or a candidate, they advocate.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I forget the name and in the military, Jack.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jack.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I, but I like it because it, it sounds protective.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you have to be your own advocate.

[SPEAKER_00]: So.

[SPEAKER_03]: What did you send for?

[SPEAKER_03]: Brush.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jack stands for something.

[SPEAKER_03]: judge advocate general.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know what the truth.

[SPEAKER_03]: Something like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it is judge advocate general.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I got it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, I had an audition for that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, there he is.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my God.

[SPEAKER_00]: I did a guest star on quantum leap.

[SPEAKER_00]: Same executive producer.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, but didn't realize it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sorry.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yes, Don Bellissario.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, sorry.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my God.

[SPEAKER_00]: Love Tim had a great meeting with him, but then I got DAX and he hadn't realized because we hadn't aired yet.

[SPEAKER_00]: We were.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I was going through all this craziness, right, almost being fired.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was thinking, shoot.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: So now we're on the prom and odd.

[SPEAKER_01]: Cisco's walking with Ono.

[SPEAKER_01]: He asked Odo to find out everything you can about this cling on commander.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like this commander of this ship must be the guy.

[SPEAKER_01]: He must have been doing something nefarious and risk, you know, putting these civilians at risk.

[SPEAKER_01]: It has to be the [SPEAKER_01]: Check it out.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says it feels like a setup or the sense is this feels like a setup.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like there's something we don't know Also, I'm in note they're walking and talking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, don't just go and Normally with background you have people in the prompt.

[SPEAKER_01]: You should have people from an outgoing both ways [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Behind Odo and Cisco, it's like everybody is heading the same way as Odo and Cisco.

[SPEAKER_01]: What?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, I was like, they must not have had enough background to, because if you send background the other way, they're only on for briefly and then they're gone.

[SPEAKER_01]: Whereas if they're walking behind them, they're behind them the whole time.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's the Pied Piper.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we find it.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're afraid of a parade of background with maybe one or two people going the other way.

[SPEAKER_01]: But there must have been something.

[SPEAKER_01]: heading down to where Odo and Sisgarroa was really fascinating.

[SPEAKER_00]: Would that be a system director's job?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's a first lady.

[SPEAKER_00]: First lady?

[SPEAKER_01]: It just grabbed my attention because I'm like, where is everybody going?

[SPEAKER_01]: They're all going the same direction.

[SPEAKER_03]: That would have been funnier, Robby.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, whenever they were talking, they pause and everyone behind them stops.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: Freeze.

[SPEAKER_01]: Freeze.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then the cling on lawyer arrives, Chapak.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, advocate the jag, um, the Klingon guy says, uh, you know, finally it'll be, uh, like a tables are turned because now the Klingons have sympathy, usually everybody hates Klingons, but it's 441 died.

[SPEAKER_01]: they're going to get some sympathy.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is new for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he does comment with to Cisco he says, you know, it seems like Federation Justice is all about process.

[SPEAKER_01]: He mentions that the truth must be one.

[SPEAKER_01]: He seems very confident in this story.

[SPEAKER_01]: We've got sympathetic victims.

[SPEAKER_01]: How are you going to get out of this, you know?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's not in search of the truth.

[SPEAKER_01]: He feels he wants to send the thing in the story.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like the story speaks for it.

[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to destroy you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I got that vibe for sure.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Which maybe.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a special satellite.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: We go back to the ward room.

[SPEAKER_01]: The trial has begun.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm in a note here.

[SPEAKER_01]: What's the actor's name again, Ron?

[SPEAKER_03]: Ron Canada.

[SPEAKER_03]: Ron Canada sounds like Ron New York actually.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he sounds like Ron from Brooklyn.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's not a real name.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, you know, Robbie, I do, I heard it too, but I honestly feel like it's because of the teeth.

[SPEAKER_00]: He has to work around the teeth that, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, [SPEAKER_00]: It's interesting.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, better and better, but like yeah, and that's a, that's a necessary evil when you're Franky or uh, going on.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: God, I work with the teeth, but maybe they came in late.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, they have to make them for them, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: To fit their own over their own team.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and Westmore was always working under the gun, but you could tell, you [SPEAKER_03]: Like it made my mouth salivate, watching him like going, Oh, for sure, for sure, but it's, I think that's unavoidable because there are times when I listen to, uh, nog, Aaron Eisenberg speaking, there's, there's certain words that come out very much like you're from New York because you're trying to get around the ground, yeah, ground, everything, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, then also he didn't wear them as much as quarked it or it's true, yeah, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: So it is getting your mouth used to it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the trial has begun and our lawyer from New York is laying out his case and basically tries an angle of, you know, we can talk about the facts, but that's not important.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's what's in his heart.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was a bloodlust.

[SPEAKER_01]: He just, you know, basically puts his heart on trial and Cisco's like, that is way too subjective.

[SPEAKER_01]: We can't litigate what someone was feeling or thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the judge sort of defends the lawyer and says, well, the motive is relevant.

[SPEAKER_00]: So let's hear what he has to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: Here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's let's try to figure this out.

[SPEAKER_01]: So DAX is our first witness.

[SPEAKER_01]: Starting with you.

[SPEAKER_01]: No pressure.

[SPEAKER_00]: No pressure.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can I just say right off the note?

[SPEAKER_03]: The color of the dress uniform, the medical green is a different green than the everyday uniform that you're wearing.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's a deeper green, like a forest green.

[SPEAKER_03]: And that is a very complimentary color on you, Terry Ferris.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh my.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you very much.

[SPEAKER_03]: Gosh, it's very nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, you looked great.

[SPEAKER_00]: Boy, did I look angry though?

[SPEAKER_01]: You did, you were not happy to be there.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man, I went to kick his ass.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: He goes after you right away.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to talk about a turn.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, we are.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, he goes after your expertise right away.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says, you're an expert, and you say, no, a curse on was the expert.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm familiar.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you're already kind of trying to play your cards close.

[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: She does, DAX does admit that Klan culture is highlighted by a warrior culture.

[SPEAKER_01]: And she admits that she fights him in the hall of suite, but that he always shows restraint.

[SPEAKER_01]: and we cut into the caves in the middle edge, you know, testifying.

[SPEAKER_01]: We cut into the middle of a fight when, suddenly, in the middle of this fight, Dax turns to camera, [SPEAKER_01]: I'm the first, you're the first, you're the first, you're the first, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one, you're the first one [SPEAKER_01]: But I was like, oh, no, we're not going to do this.

[SPEAKER_03]: Are we, we're Oh, yes, you said, oh, no, and I went, oh, yes, I was so too.

[SPEAKER_03]: I did, I didn't.

[SPEAKER_00]: I did, I honestly, I knew it didn't fit with art.

[SPEAKER_00]: So there was a moment of, I forgot we did that.

[SPEAKER_00]: And, but then another kind of [SPEAKER_00]: it feels more modern like what people do now.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but it would have been, that's a different show.

[SPEAKER_00]: It is, but I'm trying to, I was, yeah, me too, but I was kind of excited that they were brave enough to try.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, most definitely.

[SPEAKER_03]: Let me read a little passage to both of you.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was Iris Steven Bear who came up with a concept of having the character speak to camera, effectively breaking the fourth wall.

[SPEAKER_03]: He was determined not to do just another trial show, like the measure of a man or DAX, and while trying to decide what to do to make the show stand out, he saw the 1995 Spike Lee movie clockers during that film in a flashback.

[SPEAKER_03]: Detective Rocco Klein, played by Harvey Kytel, speaks directly to camera.

[SPEAKER_03]: Bear thought this was an excellent idea and suggested it to Ronald D.

Moore, who concurred and who wrote it into the tell play.

[SPEAKER_03]: Moore describes this device as sort of breaking the fourth wall, but sort of not because the actors aren't talking to the audience.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're actually talking to someone [SPEAKER_03]: which is very interesting, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: So it's not.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like that it got killed.

[SPEAKER_03]: I did too.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I thought that was cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_00]: and it worked.

[SPEAKER_00]: It did work if it was a standalone show that wasn't, if it were a movie, it worked.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: But you're talking about art.

[SPEAKER_01]: In the life of the series, it's something that just seems out of place to me.

[SPEAKER_00]: it's out of place to the normal storytelling of our show.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: But definitely.

[SPEAKER_03]: Unlike Robbie, I had no problem with it at all.

[SPEAKER_03]: And Lavar said that device the writers employed was for a director a lot of fun to play with.

[SPEAKER_03]: When I read that, I got excited.

[SPEAKER_03]: I got excited because it's not often that you break that fourth wall and have characters directly address the camera.

[SPEAKER_03]: Certainly, I don't think it has ever happened on Star Trek before.

[SPEAKER_03]: It rarely happens in one hour dramas, so it was a lot of fun and very, very challenging because we had so much take place in that one room courtroom set.

[SPEAKER_03]: My approach to the three major sequences in that room were all completely different in terms of the way we moved the camera.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's what I love about directing.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's an absolute challenge.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: He did a great job.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's really good.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's a really good director and he's fantastic to work with.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's calm.

[SPEAKER_00]: I've never seen him lose it when he's directing.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's very calm, very together.

[SPEAKER_00]: He knows what he wants.

[SPEAKER_00]: He is the epitome of focus and being open.

[SPEAKER_00]: being available to everyone around him.

[SPEAKER_00]: I just, he's very elegant.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's an elegance to live our burden.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I just love that about him.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: OK.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we're back in the word room, back in the trial, and Chapak has some personal records of words, which it's funny in this trial.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like they're breaking so many legal rules.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like Cisco is his attorney, [SPEAKER_01]: on on the stand like it's kind of there's a lot of blurred boundaries.

[SPEAKER_01]: Getting personal records without a a warrant of any kind.

[SPEAKER_00]: But also, when he asks for them, or if just as I have nothing to hide and give him a whole and you that Cisco doesn't grab it from him.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And object or something is kind of [SPEAKER_00]: I just found that when you don't, it didn't make sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: Those boundaries, it doesn't make sense if you don't keep those sort of process boundaries, then you can sort of twist the truth into anything you want rather than it being the truth.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's, that's the danger of that.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's why there are those rules to protect people.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because you can, it doesn't get twisted.

[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly, because to say how you feel doesn't mean that's how you acted.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Warf does agree.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like you said, Terry, he says, I don't have anything to hide, so the cling on lawyer asks Dax about the Battle of Tongue Bay, and this is a holiday game that they had played together, Dax, and Warf.

[SPEAKER_01]: This famous battle and after the victory, the Emperor killed everybody in the city, and Dax was a weightless, not the same thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: And she finally admits, yeah, and the game worked at like, the history and did the same thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: He killed everybody too.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Cisco gets really angry there.

[SPEAKER_01]: He objects, it was very angry.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's very passionate, Cisco, as the attorney.

[SPEAKER_00]: Back to, he needed to have his own show and play the lead for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, Cisco Cisco and Nodo.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: The firm of Cisco Cisco and Nodo.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we're just a totally different character, not unlike, well, what a shatter do with running.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's illegal.

[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: New York legal.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, for New Jersey legal because he likes lives in New Jersey.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, right New Jersey legal.

[SPEAKER_03]: I want to be the judge on that show Okay, so when he objects he objects a couple times the second objection when Cisco stands up and says, you know Objection the close-up on Cisco Somehow one of his pips is falling off or something because it's really you notice that [SPEAKER_03]: Well, you'll see it if you really want it.

[SPEAKER_03]: There's only three and everything before that.

[SPEAKER_03]: There's four like earlier in the scene and it's the same scene Robbie earlier sitting down.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's got four pips.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I almost feel like wardrobe someone got reprimanded after that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wonder if maybe [SPEAKER_01]: You know, sometimes the, um, the fabric can fold or something.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wonder if it was there, but just hidden.

[SPEAKER_01]: We got to look back.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it, I thought they were all attached.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't remember them being sold together in one piece, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: So then I don't understand.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, maybe it fell off.

[SPEAKER_00]: It could have fallen off.

[SPEAKER_03]: The lapel.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, it could have, that's what I think happened.

[SPEAKER_03]: It must have fallen off.

[SPEAKER_03]: It could have broke.

[SPEAKER_03]: Is that what had been glued on to the single solid piece, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it could have just just fallen right on ran out of glue or maybe he was maybe he was demoted in between takes.

[SPEAKER_03]: No, I'm going to go with Terry's the structural integrity of the glue failed.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well next it is Cisco's turn to be questioned.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love this shot.

[SPEAKER_01]: We see Chipac ask him a question.

[SPEAKER_01]: It racks focus to Cisco in the foreground.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Lavar's got great instincts on these kind of things.

[SPEAKER_01]: If he does, transition, great eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: Great eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, really good.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're x-forward to Cisco and Cisco says, yes, I sent work on this mission, then we're in the captain's office and Cisco is sending him on the mission.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's a bit of a flashback.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: We learned there was a plague at this Kardashian colony.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was the redeliant plague on Penteth.

[SPEAKER_01]: three this colony.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so Starfleet is sending humanitarian aid and Warf is going to escort this convoy and they discuss in the captain's office that the claimons are probably going to try to stop him.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then Cisco turns to the camera our next camera speaker.

[SPEAKER_00]: Talks to the camera again just to remind you this is Robbie's favorite part.

[SPEAKER_03]: I, again, I disagree, Robbie.

[SPEAKER_03]: I liked it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Sorry.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, Levard did a good job with navigating it and, yes, you know, I thought it was seem like a perfect, yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: Perfect.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it was a clear.

[SPEAKER_03]: Perfect.

[SPEAKER_03]: Seamless is a perfect definition.

[SPEAKER_03]: Descriptive word to say.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's exactly what it was to be.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, Galois.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you're welcome.

[SPEAKER_01]: But he said, you know, basically he says to the camera that he thought Warf was a very distinguished officer and could take on more responsibility and he obviously understood the cling on so he'd be the right choice.

[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of good reasons to send him there.

[SPEAKER_01]: and then we come back to reality in the middle of this information.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is where I made the note that it's kind of weird to have Worf's attorney testifying for or against him because you would never do that.

[SPEAKER_01]: You would recuse yourself as the attorney if you had real you know.

[SPEAKER_00]: An investment, a personal investment in a person.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so he wouldn't be able to be as the attorney period.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, well, I'm choosing not to [SPEAKER_01]: But it did sort of bother me like I felt like playing fast and loose with like if we don't do a trial [SPEAKER_01]: We're talking to the camera now.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're putting people on the stand that probably wouldn't be there.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're getting, I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm starting the negatives for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're starting to add up already.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you know what?

[SPEAKER_00]: Did you ever, I'm curious, have you ever directed legal shows?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So that's another reason why it's in your crop, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Or crop shows, you know, if it's a law enforcement show [SPEAKER_01]: They're rules and even if it's like walking into an abilting like there's Yeah, how you hold your gun?

[SPEAKER_01]: How you hold your gun?

[SPEAKER_00]: First job I had holding a gun.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a troll all that stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and go off the trigger Or you don't pull the gun up unless you've got a target and you're ready to fire [SPEAKER_01]: yeah if you're going in a dangerous place how you kind of check yourself and you've got back up and you move there's all kinds of things that when you do those shows cop shows or lawyer shows that I didn't see it play in this legal procedure.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, it was a little night at the horse.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to [SPEAKER_00]: Whatever.

[SPEAKER_00]: Whatever.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's good.

[SPEAKER_00]: When I had to hold a gun, I went to Culver City Police Department and had a police officer we went down to their shooting range and he showed me how to shoot the gun, how to hold it.

[SPEAKER_00]: We walked around with, well, obviously unloaded guns, but we walked around the precinct.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was empty.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was very generous of them.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was doing Red Sun Rising with Don the Dragon Wilson.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was playing a racist cop against Don that's hard-breaking, but then I felt my character fell in love with him.

[SPEAKER_03]: Okay, that's correct.

[SPEAKER_03]: As redemption.

[SPEAKER_00]: Redemption.

[SPEAKER_00]: But the thing is, I guess what I'm trying to get to is, if I had to play a lawyer, I would go sit in a trial to see a real one, not just watch TV.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, a little research for that can help you really understand how serious the gravity of what it is.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And, and I think, you know, experimental film creativity wise.

[SPEAKER_01]: This was a fun episode talking to the camera and all that stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: But from a just a reality-based kind of storytelling, there was a lot of, for me, there was a lot of things that was like, ah, [SPEAKER_01]: My cobalt shit on that, all right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: By that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, I agree with you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I agree with you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I still enjoyed it because this is our world.

[SPEAKER_01]: And great performances.

[SPEAKER_01]: And again, Lavar did a great job creative with the camera work.

[SPEAKER_01]: The actors were all good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ron, can you?

[SPEAKER_00]: You're talking about like a rewrite to the logistics of what is legal process.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know it sounds.

[SPEAKER_00]: I hear you.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, I hear you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Completely.

[SPEAKER_01]: It may sound dry, but in a way, it keep anything to me that reminds me that I'm watching people pretending, it takes me out of the story.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's why they're talking to the camera.

[SPEAKER_01]: the legal process flaws, it all kept reminding me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I'm just watching everybody pretend.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I want to get lost in this story and really it's hard for me to go 100% rooting or caring if I've called bullshit too many times.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely because it's taking you out of the story.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and the whole point is to suck you into the story from your heart.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you have an emotional experience.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so the next scene is and the next witness is quarks and so we are actually in quarks quark now speaks to cats.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is this work for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to say that it was so hilarious.

[SPEAKER_01]: The comedy premise works for me.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was a nice break.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was beautiful art music.

[SPEAKER_00]: There's a little break in it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It just it was a beautiful perfect the timed moment for quark to show.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: here's the levity here's the levity in this episode right so cork talks about setting up the scene he's cleaning up he goes oh yes it was Dr.

Mishir Dr.

Mishir talking to one of the dobo girls which one was it he starts going through each of them and then it's oh it's them not that girl and then the way the way that [SPEAKER_03]: He didn't have that.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was shot by Levar was awesome.

[SPEAKER_03]: There was a girl would pop out in the camera, moved away.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it was on a cut.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it was on a cut.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes it was on a cut.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: We'll just kept moving in and out with that moving.

[SPEAKER_00]: Great.

[SPEAKER_03]: But then the unknown twist is at the end.

[SPEAKER_03]: He was like, no, no, no, no.

[SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't Bashar.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was more and actually.

[SPEAKER_03]: And he said, and right before Morn's about to speak is when it goes back to Chapak, can we return to the matter at hand, please?

[SPEAKER_03]: I love that.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think you did laugh at that, Robbie.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I did.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I would have, I would have paced it up at a tutorial a little, but yeah, but yeah, but yeah, I agree yeah, I agree there was a law where I was just like [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like we get the comedy premise now, just play it, just play it, just play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it, play it [SPEAKER_01]: You know, he was in a good mood for a playing on.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wouldn't call them ever having good moods.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're pleasantness.

[SPEAKER_01]: He would as he say, not not that you're anything but a pleasant charming race.

[SPEAKER_01]: Very confident.

[SPEAKER_01]: We learn Warfordard prune juice.

[SPEAKER_03]: That's his regular, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_03]: He always drinks juice, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, if your body was that big, you might need to drink juice.

[SPEAKER_03]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't think about that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Kork admits that Warf says he hopes the clingsons go after this convoy.

[SPEAKER_01]: So he's looking for a fight.

[SPEAKER_01]: He does admit this to Kork and Kork.

[SPEAKER_01]: you know, under oath in this proceeding has to tell the truth and so it doesn't look good for, for war, no, it's looking for a fight.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we get back to our scene, Tripox, very happy with that answer.

[SPEAKER_01]: He seems very confident.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we are not happy.

[SPEAKER_01]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this is where Warf has not spoken at all.

[SPEAKER_01]: So this is where I'm starting to go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Come on, dude.

[SPEAKER_00]: Getting anxious.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to hear this.

[SPEAKER_01]: That delay is starting to work for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Go to the security office, Odo.

[SPEAKER_01]: confirms that the captain of the ship is not suspicious.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was a civilian, a very quiet man, actually, as people at Noom said.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the Klingon say that this this civilian ship had wandered off course, and that is possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: Very close to where this conflict was happening.

[SPEAKER_00]: But holy cow, there are worships all around and you just accident.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's like driving through, you see an accident happen.

[SPEAKER_00]: You go, I'm going to drive right to that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Especially when you're cloaking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, you know, ships are cloaking all over the place.

[SPEAKER_01]: These worships are cloaking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oda does say in the scene that he's very suspicious about one thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: The clingsons are all very eager to help a police officer.

[SPEAKER_01]: And usually that's not, that's suspicious.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a red flag for him.

[SPEAKER_00]: for any race.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: But the clingsons?

[SPEAKER_01]: But the clingsons.

[SPEAKER_01]: Why are they so eager to talk to me?

[SPEAKER_00]: That's not a clingson trait.

[SPEAKER_01]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: So Cisco says, all right, thanks for the Captain Info.

[SPEAKER_01]: Take a look at all these passengers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Go through every passenger, see what's up with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then we go to the bridge.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Miles is looking directly into the camera again, telling a story.

[SPEAKER_01]: But this time, Levar kind of wraps the camera around.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a very long speech with O'Brien talking about, what's happening that we're too cling on ships, a bird appray, and a battle cruiser.

[SPEAKER_01]: And one would engage us while the other went after convoy and then they'd switch and they'd cloak and decl cloak.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so this is what we were talking about earlier here.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is where we learned.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, they were setting up a...

It's here.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and we...

Yeah, and we...

Yeah, and we kind of feel like we're in it in this scene.

[SPEAKER_00]: Because O'Brien takes us, or Lavar takes us to the bridge of it happening as O'Brien's explaining it, which is really cool, too.

[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so a Brian's in the scene, but he's also narrating the scene to the camera and the camera's moving a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's well done.

[SPEAKER_01]: Levar did a great job like this.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_00]: Is this the only time we see Kira too?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think so is on the way.

[SPEAKER_00]: She doesn't go on trial.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that was a deleted, either.

[SPEAKER_03]: They didn't shoot her.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was a deleted scene.

[SPEAKER_03]: There was a trial, a trial.

[SPEAKER_03]: She was on trial, she was a witness.

[SPEAKER_03]: She was a witness and she was the only one that sides with warf.

[SPEAKER_03]: She's like, I think he made the right decision and then Chippock comes over and completely destroys her credibility by saying she's a freedom fight like he goes back into her terrorist rebel past, you know, and says like of course a rebel would say that so that's it's Did the show run long?

[SPEAKER_03]: Is that where they just what it sounds like to me?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, just a nod to the story.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah [SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is the scene where from Miles' recounting this story, we realized, this pattern was set up, cloaking, harassing, and so that the last time they decloped, he thought it was one of those two warships, and they would have shields and all of that, and so he just fired as they were decloking.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it wasn't a murder prey.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was this chivalent ship, all of them are dead.

[SPEAKER_01]: But Miles stands by Worf's decisions, said Worf, you know, would never have fired on an arm ship.

[SPEAKER_01]: If he knew it was an arm ship, he supports him.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then Chepoch starts pushing him.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says, imagine you're in the captain's chair.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they do this sort of dramatic reimagining now in the past.

[SPEAKER_01]: In the imaginary version, Miles is in the chair.

[SPEAKER_01]: We see the thing reenacted.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Miles is starting to get wound up about this and Miles ultimately admits, no, I wouldn't have fired.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, such a heartbreaking moment.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ugh.

[SPEAKER_01]: But he says things look different when you're sitting in that chair.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I made a note here just as a director, as what Lavar is doing in this episode or when I've directed.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will after the fact go, oh, why didn't I do this?

[SPEAKER_01]: I should have done that, or, you know, it's e-re-seeth.

[SPEAKER_01]: But when you're in the heat of the clock is ticking, and this, you know, so many things are happening, you've got to make a decision as the director of a episode or director of the scenes, and you make decisions, and sometimes you [SPEAKER_01]: regret them, but you got to stick by it.

[SPEAKER_00]: But that's a lesson, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: You have to switch the regret to a lesson for the next show.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And often when I'm producing and there's a director who may be struggling or, you know, having a tough time, I'll see people, you know, other crew members going, you know, well.

[SPEAKER_01]: that would have not been a problem.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like they have all these criticism and I'm like, you know what?

[SPEAKER_01]: You direct.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me see what you do.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's really easy to be cocky and judgmental when it's not the one in the chair.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like Miles says.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because you're not in the mindset.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, miles is paying attention to totally different things.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's his job.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody has a different job.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's why we all have the different jobs on the set, too.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Not to hyper criticize anybody else, but focus on your one job.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, he gets him to admit he would not have fired, and so, yeah, it doesn't look good for a warf.

[SPEAKER_01]: Our silent warf.

[SPEAKER_01]: We go into the replamette, and Chapag comes to find Cisco, and he says, you know what, if you just concede this case, I will make sure that they don't put warf to death.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, that he's not put to death for this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thanks.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, thanks.

[SPEAKER_03]: But then he says I'll defend him myself.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh my god.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh well, thanks a lot You know for nothing.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's like that's terrifying.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, and then Cisco also brings up.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, that'd be a great win for you guys cuz [SPEAKER_01]: I know you want the pent-out system for the Klingon, so it's a win-win, and Cisco does kind of suspect.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says, I think you're offering this because you're afraid of what Warf is going to say on the stand.

[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a bit of like a lawyer game playing going on in this, and that's what I'm asking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now we're out in the corridor, this is where Odo sees Cisco, he says, I haven't found anything anyone suspicious on the crew manifest, so they're looking at names and [SPEAKER_01]: backgrounds, but nobody looks suspicious.

[SPEAKER_00]: And as if one of the passengers could have implemented this whole thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this conspiracy, and none of them looks, they all look innocent.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Cisco finally says, you know, Wurf is going to have to help himself in the scene.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I was like, finally, Wurf's going to say something.

[SPEAKER_01]: He hasn't talked to the whole episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we cut to the bridge and Wurf is talking to the camera this time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, times for me, um, but he released her twinning right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know you guys love it.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is a new moment though, because I know I honestly I loved every time they spoke to the camera because it's so different.

[SPEAKER_03]: We'd never see that.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'll get it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'll get it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Continue.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Worf is reliving this moment, the engagement started.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says the murder pro just declaw or Kira says the murder pro is just to cloaked off the port quarter, Worf raised shields, then we cut back to the ward room and Worf does say in this, it back in the trial that he respects miles, but that miles was not in command.

[SPEAKER_01]: He wasn't in the sitting in the hot seat when he had to make that decision and that's easy to look back in second guess what people [SPEAKER_00]: and he said time to think about it and contemplate it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he says, I would do it again.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like knowing why he didn't get it right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then Chipoco's after his personal, him personally.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he says, well, you're an outcast.

[SPEAKER_01]: The clean-ons aren't you?

[SPEAKER_01]: and Worf admits that he is, and he's angry about it, it was unjust, and Chipbox trying to push his buttons in this way.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, boy.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, also, Robbie, I mean, it's important to note that when he said yes, I would do it again.

[SPEAKER_03]: Worf clarifies, he says, if I hesitated, I would have been negligent.

[SPEAKER_03]: I would have been risking my ship, we'll crew, and the entire convoy.

[SPEAKER_03]: So he had to make this split second decision.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I agree and to keep also placing it that he was in battle.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: He was in the middle of battle.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's not real.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're not down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, Trapak keeps pushing, like, just needling him.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says, tells Wurf, you know, he asked him, would you attack an unarmed man?

[SPEAKER_01]: And Wurf says, no, never, never, never attack an unarmed man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you're not truly a cling on.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're more human.

[SPEAKER_01]: You've been with humans too long.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's going after that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the judge even jumps in and says, hey, cut it out.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is out of, you know, out of bounds or whatever.

[SPEAKER_01]: and then Chapak continues, he brings up his son.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, he's just his son to trigger him at work.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's attacking his integrity, his honor, his child.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, he's a child, don't mess with him, family.

[SPEAKER_00]: Don't mess with him, family.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to kill him.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ah, ah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Wurf just loses it, gets up, punch, punch, punch, knocks, and down, Chapak down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well done, Wurf.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, well done.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, inappropriate but he had some good moves.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he did.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was like three moves and she was down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah He's almost my man at this point, isn't he?

[SPEAKER_01]: Almost.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah Chipac is very happy though that he got worth to react this way.

[SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't even say at the end like oh you I thought you said you'd never [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he says I thought you said you'd never attack an honor man, perhaps you should have said none unless I get angry, none unless I have something to prove Making it even worse.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I hate this guy.

[SPEAKER_00]: I hate people like that damn you chapak [SPEAKER_01]: We have a captain's log.

[SPEAKER_01]: We learn the hearing is in recess, and the judges were tired to recorders, to deliberate, and he's not very optimistic.

[SPEAKER_01]: Cisco's not happy.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then in the captain's office, Oda walks in and says, good news, hands in a pad.

[SPEAKER_03]: Finally.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yay!

[SPEAKER_01]: Hey!

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Love, I would out.

[SPEAKER_01]: We go to the ward room, Cisco calls Chippock, so the other attorney goes on the exam.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd make some sense, but anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that doesn't make sense at all to me, but I have to cast and pay other actors if you really want witnesses and they didn't want to do that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Does that ever happen in the real court where the prosecuting attorney goes on?

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think he's dead.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_01]: Well, he calls to talk to the sand, asks him what the status of the clingsons and the Federation is.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they sort of talk about that a little.

[SPEAKER_01]: He goes, well, we're not really friends, but we're not really enemies either.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there's some things, you know, we can trust you to an extent.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can trust us to an extent.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Cisco says, well, it's in your interest to deceive or lie to the Federation if it helps you, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because we're not allies.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ultimately, Cisco pulls out this list of victims from this event.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he says this list is the same as a list of victims from a crash that happened much earlier on Galore Prime.

[SPEAKER_01]: What a coincidence that all the victims are exactly the same is people who were, you know, declared dead after this crash.

[SPEAKER_01]: They couldn't recover any bodies.

[SPEAKER_01]: But now miraculously, they're declared alive before this accident.

[SPEAKER_00]: And they're every single one of them is on this next.

[SPEAKER_00]: And they don't know each other and they're all in the same transport.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very unlucky group to be in two crashes or two tragedies back to that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Cisco basically says, look, this was all staged.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you know, it was to destroy the only cling on officer who was in Starfleet.

[SPEAKER_01]: And is that possible that this was all staged?

[SPEAKER_01]: And Chapak admits yes, it's possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: So he gets into break.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we go to the Worf's cabin.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's a party to celebrate Worf's innocence in quarks.

[SPEAKER_01]: This guy comes to get him weren't you in the party?

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm celebrating you.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this is a nice scene.

[SPEAKER_01]: Worf talks about his feelings of resentment and vengeance.

[SPEAKER_01]: He admits he's got those feelings.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he admits he should have checked when the ship decloped.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Cisco reprimand them for that.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's like, yeah, you should have.

[SPEAKER_01]: You should have checked.

[SPEAKER_01]: Cisco says Starfleet doesn't ever risk harming civilians.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you made a military decision.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is very different than a Starfleet decision.

[SPEAKER_01]: I like this distinction that Cisco made in the scene about what Starfleet is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, they have to fight and defend themselves.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if it's another military vessel, sure, rules a military makes sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if there's ever civilians involved, that's a different decision than a military decision.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I thought that was a nice distinction.

[SPEAKER_00]: I did too.

[SPEAKER_00]: I have to say though, I felt like us as viewers getting to see in that moment when Warf is describing what he was actually seeing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that the clingon bird appraise are doing that on a regular de-cloking [SPEAKER_00]: I think he made the right decision.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think he made the right call.

[SPEAKER_00]: If he would have paused, and it was a bird appray, they would have been on.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So I just want to say about the scene, there's an intensity to Cisco's tone.

[SPEAKER_00]: uh that the the reprimand I felt like he was talking to someone who didn't know better.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it felt like there was a lacking of camaraderie or Warf just said what was down.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: So he didn't need to be You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was just a little it felt off to who [SPEAKER_00]: I just felt like the tone was a little too.

[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like Avery does harsh.

[SPEAKER_01]: Avery does that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, too harsh.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm a regular basis in my opinion.

[SPEAKER_01]: He can sort of [SPEAKER_01]: He can jump his energy and intensity, can jump in a moment, and then can pull back.

[SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes that can be often very effective and interesting and keeps our attention.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I agree with you in this scene that it felt a little unmotivated, the level of that jump, too.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, so Warf doesn't even want to go to the celebration, but Cisco's like, listen, you know, they're trying to have a release here.

[SPEAKER_03]: These are the troops you need to show up, you know, I'm going to be a captain.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to do things they don't want to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I show up for other people.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes, and my favorite two lines in this entire episode, Worf says, life is a great deal more complicated in this red uniform.

[SPEAKER_03]: And Cisco says, wait, do you get four pips on that collar?

[SPEAKER_03]: You'll wish you had gone into botany.

[SPEAKER_03]: Which made, oh my god.

[SPEAKER_03]: That may be the last of my dad got his PhD in botany.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I was like, oh, really?

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, oh yeah, it was a good look button at the end or a blow as we say a blow some time All right Did you ever say that on Becker when you were doing sitcoms talk about the blow at the end of the scene like a joke at the end of the scene [SPEAKER_00]: I don't remember, maybe I didn't catch it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't catch it.

[SPEAKER_03]: I've never heard that, Robbie.

[SPEAKER_03]: I've never heard that, really?

[SPEAKER_03]: What is so, that's a tagline work?

[SPEAKER_03]: What does that mean, a blow?

[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, if did you ever get directed by a director to say, hey, we need a button at the end of the scene?

[SPEAKER_01]: But yes, we need you to, like, say your line and really land it as like a cliffhanger line or we need you to, you know, you're looking off of the distance.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and give me a button at the end of my go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's in a dramatic scenario.

[SPEAKER_01]: You might use the word button in a comedy, how far a comedy is, especially would you use the word below?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not just a button.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a joke.

[SPEAKER_01]: It has to be a...

Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: You want a big hard laugh at the end of the scene because somebody...

Right.

[SPEAKER_03]: you know somebody they said that I would have said what does that mean and honestly now it's been decades well button and blow both begin with bb yeah okay bb bb bb already well that's it guys we got to the end of it we did we did we solved the case [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to start with Robby.

[SPEAKER_03]: What is your theme lesson for this episode?

[SPEAKER_03]: What would you say?

[SPEAKER_01]: I wrote down, in the heat of battle decisions are hard, so be prepared.

[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm.

[SPEAKER_03]: Hmm.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Territ, you have a theme or moral?

[SPEAKER_00]: Hold on to your integrity.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, maybe?

[SPEAKER_03]: I like that.

[SPEAKER_03]: Mine is going to be the truth.

[SPEAKER_03]: We'll somehow rise to the top.

[SPEAKER_03]: Great.

[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good lessons.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And don't have your lawyer testify against you on the stand.

[SPEAKER_01]: That would be another.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Or give away your personal life.

[SPEAKER_00]: You give away your personal information.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_03]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_03]: Lake.

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh.

[SPEAKER_03]: Dairy, what's our Patreon poll winner for the moral of this episode?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, this was submitted by Alex Ray.

[SPEAKER_00]: Just because you're not guilty, does not mean you're innocent.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, interesting.

[SPEAKER_00]: I liked that.

[SPEAKER_00]: It does.

[SPEAKER_00]: That too.

[SPEAKER_00]: Make me go back to my poem.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's ponder.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: Ponder that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Nice.

[SPEAKER_03]: I like it.

[SPEAKER_03]: Good lessons.

[SPEAKER_03]: It is.

[SPEAKER_03]: All right.

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, thank you everyone for tuning in to our recap and discussion of rules of engagement.

[SPEAKER_03]: Join us next time when we will be recapping and discussing the episode hard time with Armin once again.

[SPEAKER_03]: Thank you to Terry for joining us for this one.

[SPEAKER_03]: And for all of our patrons here.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks, Terfa.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you guys.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love hanging with you.

[SPEAKER_03]: For all of our Patreon patrons, please stay tuned for our bonus material with Robbie, myself and Terry.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know what?

[SPEAKER_03]: Well, they will.

[SPEAKER_03]: And for everyone else, we'll see you next time.

[SPEAKER_02]: Bye.