Back for another edition of the Giants Little Podcast, your Normal Friday Pod.

It's all brought to you by Citizens, the official bank of the New York Football Giants.

I am John Schmilk.

A normal show today, folks.

We are going to start with our player interview.

We're also gonna have Matthew Koller from Purple Insider, and then Bob Papa will be joined by the head coach of the Giants, Mike Kafka.

But our players of you comes first.

This week, I had a chance to do a lengthy, entertaining and fun interview with Giants second year running back Tyrone Tracy Junior.

Joined by Giants running back Tyrone Tracy Junior.

Tyrone, what's going on?

Man?

How are you no good?

Doing good?

You know obviously during the week of practice is trying to just bang out these days and you know, obviously get ready for this game.

How do you guys kept spirits high?

Because you know, I was in the locker room the last couple of days.

You wouldn't think this team's record is two and twelve if you're walking through the locker room on a daily basis.

Yeah, I mean, I mean first and Foremo comes with confidence.

You know, we have confidence in our players and our coaches.

And then secondly, we have to understand that, like you know, it's the NFL, like one is, the winds are hard to come by.

But you also have to look yourself in the mirror and understand that, like you know, your your wins, the losses doesn't really define you as as a person as a team.

So and we understand that.

So, like I said, we can't walk around open because that's really not gonna help anything.

So we try to keep the energy high, keep the you know, positivity throughout the locker room, throughout practice, throughout the meetings, and just understand that.

Like we got to go out there and h Q on game.

Day, Tell you're through the two touchdowns last week?

Yeah, it was.

It was good.

It was a good game.

It was it was I I enjoyed.

I enjoyed.

It was my first time obviously scoring two touches in the game.

So, uh, take us through the two plays.

How'd you do it?

The first one, I mean, obviously is a run.

I mean I saw, I saw a lane.

It was kind of like the I don't know if you remember the one I had Broncos.

Yeah, it's nothing like that one.

Obviously bron was a little more clean.

That one was clean.

It was me versus versus the.

Bronco and that's when they were really overloaded on one side or right and you cut back on there.

Yeah, it was.

It was the same basically the same play, same type of play, but the safety came down on this one.

Obviously, make a miss, made a move on Louis who I believe, and then obviously getting there had a little extra push, little help, you know, on the two push just to get get in his own.

Now on the second one, we knew that Bobby Wagner was going to have me, man, So it was basically like, hey, go win your one on one, you know, I told I told Jacks during practice, like, bro, like, if you see this, you see him guard me, you just throw it up.

Just throw it up, man, I got you outside.

I don't I'm not gonna promise you it was gonna be a catch, but ninety percent is gonna be a catch.

But it won't be an interception.

I promise you that.

How much meat is still left on the bone in terms of how they can use you as a receiver out of the backfield that they mean you haven't seen them used completely yet.

Yeah, I mean a lot.

To be honest, like you said, they haven't really got dug into that, you know, So I think that comes with time.

I think that comes with obviously trust.

Sure that comes with you know, showing them that I can you know, I can do that stuff.

So hopefully that was a little glimpse of some of the stuff I could do.

I'm in the past game.

And then also, like in a game, I got to I got me personally, I have to take advantage when the opportunity comes.

You know, I'm gonna ball comeing all way.

I got to make those plays.

So yeah, I got to think.

You know, it's really the tip of the iceberg when you're talking about the receiving game.

I'm not sure if maybe you did this in the bye week, maybe having yet, if you take a twenty thousand foot view of your sophomore season, how would you evaluate it or think about it?

How are you thinking about how you're playing this year?

Just how do you look at your year in general?

Yeah, I mean I think I'm playing well.

It's just off of off of injury towards the end of the year, getting back on get back on giving back to work, coming in obviously at a different role with SCAT and me trying to figure that out, and then hopping back on homing back on a horse.

You know, when I'm getting more touches, all said, I think I'm playing well.

Think I'm doing my job and king out of high level when the opportunities do come.

So yeah, I mean, just looking at it Overallice, I think as the season has progressed, I think my game has progressed as well.

I during which game it was was a few games after you came back from the shoulder injury.

I feel like you lifted your physicality level a little bit, Like you were running over guys.

You were really grinding out some extra few yards.

Did you have a mentality shift or change?

Was it a health thing where you just felt more confident with the shoulder that you banged up, where you felt like you've gotten a little bit more physicality to you as the season's gone along a little bit.

I mean I wouldn't.

I mean I always run like that.

Even last year, I felt like I ran like that.

It was like said, I think it's more so just me getting comfortable.

Like I said, Yeah, I definitely had the injury, and that was I was just you know, trying to baby I guess at the beginning, just because like I didn't want to re injury it.

Of course, so I would do the same thing I had him.

I didn't want to re injure it.

So I was definitely baby in a little bit.

But after getting more comfortable absolutely practices and you get a couple of games under you, you you know, you get tackled, you know, you got these different blocks that you got to take on because it's hard to replicate a game in practice.

It's hard to do that that obviously, like before you get clear, you have to do some things so that you know the trades that feel comfortable senior out there, but it's hard to replicate getting tackled in certain positions or landing on your shoulder or just blocking with your shoulder.

It's hard to do that stuff in practice.

So like after I had those game reps and just like obviously trust in my head and and and within my shoulder, Yeah, some of the physicality definitely came back.

Yeah, I think you looked a lot like you to as a rookie.

To be totally honest with you, do you think you took a jump from your rookie ar to your sophomore year or was it more small incremental progress in a bunch of different areas.

I would I think I took a jump from where I would say, like mentally, obviously, I think that, like I said, if I had a full season from starting to finish, just being healthy and just being who I am, I think it was that.

Uh, the numbers would say the same.

But obviously a lot of stuff happened throughout the year.

Who played it really well, Well.

That's sort of started.

I'm saying.

Yeah, I would say, you got to understand that, like football is football, Like people ask me about, you know, this gas situation and everything.

But man, dude's balling.

I want he wants me to ball.

I want him the ball you can only control with you control, you know.

At the same time, like I want him to play well, of course I want and I want him to want me to play well, Like whoever's in there, I want both for us.

I think there's enough touches for both of us to go out there and have really good games every single game.

He doesn't want to win games ever, and.

Foremost exactly exactly, And I think that I think that at the end of the day, I think my mental my football IQ, the game has slowed down a lot.

I think that just the way that I see the game when I'm playing, how I see the holes, like I'm being more patient and understanding, like when my blocks are coming from.

Again, this is all just like you know, football Talk football Q.

So I think that's like my biggest jump from rookie to now.

When you spoke to the media in the week, you made the point that you think you run better the more touches you get.

I wonder why you think that is, and if it has something to do with what you gave in your last are talking about how you start seeing things more when you get more comfortable with any game in terms of how they're trying to kind of run a little bit.

I would say it's like chess.

For those of you who play chess, you understand it like it's a strategic game.

Like your first your first move is never going to be a last move.

So you know, we may run a do a run three times, but like the run may be three different ways.

Of course, my my first move that I do on you is going to be different than you know, my third move that I do.

So that's why I say, like, the more touches I get, because now it's kind of like a puppet, like you're you're making them do what you want to do.

And towards the end of the game, I would say this last game, if you ever watched some of my runs, it was like I was like manipulating the defense to do what I wanted it to do so that I can.

Get You want to move the light back?

You're a different hole, right yeah, right, Just so again that's what that's why I say I play better and more touches I get, just but I also feel like that's any running back because you know, I said you you're never gonna come out and first play like it's going to be you know, a sixty yard bond down to feel less like the defense messed up or something like that.

Like you gotta understand it's gonna be some runs that it's gonna be two yards, three yards, four yards and then down in the fourth quarter, third quarter like dad, those and when you know the ten plus and the twelve plus like those are when those those type of players come out.

No, that makes sense.

You talk over the way two about how you pointed out three specific coaches you talked about Tim Kelly, carl And Bricello and Ladell Bets as three coaches that you think have really helped you.

But I think the way you talked about it helped the run game as a whole.

Talk about how those coaches, you could take him as a group even individual if you want, how they've contributed to the run game that's allowed you and your group to have success.

Yeah, I mean, I think the first thing is that they're very detailed on their work and how they do things.

Like individually, I think each and everyone of them are really good coaches, but together the way they work, the way they really just put in a game plan, like it's never you know, the same play.

It might look the same to you know, the viewers, but it's very detailed down to the front, down to you know where the defense is going to be line there with the linebackers, who's getting who you know the fits and where the running backs should hit it.

And then like again like LB the running back coach, you know, we'll be in there.

He'll tell us like, hey, this this play is going to is going to hit here if you have this guy over the tackle.

The tackle's going to do this and this is where it should be.

So like pre snap, when you're going out there, you should have an understanding of what's going to happen before the ballsy even snap, just based off of the knowledge that the coaches are giving you throughout the week and the formation of the defense exact yes, yes, and that's what I'm saying formation on the defense, like prior to even getting after the game.

The coaching staff is doing their due diligence and making sure that they're giving you the right information that you can go out there and perform at a high level.

I think that that's key to the run game, especially when you're talking about you know, getting five six yards of carry.

You know you're you're making everything efficient as it can be.

I think they do a really good job.

Carm he does a thirty presentation like every day on run game, short yardage, like ball security, everything.

So I think they work really well together just to make sure that we have an efficient run game for running back.

How valuable was it to have the same five starting offenses One of the thing back for a second year where you can build on the momentum and the rhythm and the field you developed with them last year and not have to develop that from scratch in a second season.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's I think it's huge.

Man, It's huge because as a running back, you got to get a feel for your office on lineman.

Everybody is not, you know, a bulldozer.

Every office in Lineman is not a bulldozer.

So you have to understand, you know, who you have in front of you, who's blocking for you, and the type of lineman that you have.

So for me to come back and already know that I don't have to figure that out like that was.

That was big for me.

They and they know the type of runner I am as well, because everybody, every running back doesn't run the same.

You know, some running backs are you know, straightfor straight ahead, Some much last year, Some make moves, some as patient.

Like a lot of things has to go together and flow for the offensive line and the running back to have that camaraderie and relationship within the run game.

So, like you said, I mean, I think it was huge.

I know, I hope the office of line think that it was huge that you know I could come they do they do, you know, So like I said, I don't want to give price to the Office Line because they do a great job each and every week, you know, creating scenes for me to run through.

And I think that it's it's it's paramount.

And when you're going back watching the film and you actually see what's going on, you actually see like the Office of Line doing their job at.

A hot low and you guys run every run scheme, maagicable.

You got to do everything.

Is there something that you like the best, that that you think is really like customize this is like what Hyron trees he's really good at.

Yeah, Like I would like counters personally, like counters.

So the gaps game, any any polar one polar too, Like it really don't matter to me, but just because like one it flow gets a flow of the defense until it opens up, seems as well.

And the same thing I like, I like to run outside zone but from the gun.

Look I did it in college.

That was what we ran in college.

And I also think that I get the ball faster.

I could, like I said, see different things after I get the ball, because like when you're under center, it takes you a little bit longer.

Did he get the ball?

So I like, yeah, those two and those two concepts.

It's funny.

That's gonna make Tiki Barbara very happy.

I do the pre improde game with ten.

And it was also going to make happy when you did your media and the week you called yourself a slasher.

Yeah, that's what he calls you.

And when Scott got hurt and you moved in, he goes.

I want to see him do a lot more gap scheme stuff because I feel like that's what's going to be his strength, right, So I think the funny that you guys are writing the same page on that.

It's funny you mentioned a lot of running backs, like being under center rather than gun.

Do you like being out of the gun just for the outside zone or does it depend on the scheme whether under center or shotgun?

And maybe why do you like one or the other based on that?

Yeah, well, I mean I like it just because I get the ball faster, and when you have the ball, you can make moves.

And like I said, every running concept is not gonna be perfect.

So a defensive lineman might break through and be two yards in back of people, But if I'm in gun, I can see that and react right now.

But if I'm under center, I have to wait till the quarterback give me the ball to even make a move.

Sure.

So that's really the only reason I like gun a little bit more than under center and the other concepts that I wouldn't.

I don't really prefer either or.

But if I had a choice, I would definitely choose under center.

If we was, like I said, gap scheme, because again, like the defense don't know which.

Way you're going, you can create better angle.

Yeah, right, yes, that was my next point.

You get better.

You are good.

You know ball man, you know ball.

So I say, you get better angle.

So you know, if I'm going to the A gap, you know we run to the right, I'm going to the right A gap.

The middle linebacker, Mike linebacker, he has a choice to make.

Am I going to run over top?

Or am I going to sit right here in the middle, Because if you run off the top, I'm gonna just keep running straight to the A gap.

Now if we don't, if he says staying a gap, I'm following my puller to it.

Right.

So, like I said, it's just different schemes that will work.

You know a little bit better from under center or you know, in the gun.

What's been darks impact on the run game just kind of the extra physic Uh.

You know, Juicy gives with the legs and you haven't done as much read options since he came back from percussion and stuff like that.

But just his athleticism what he brings.

How is that impact of the run game.

It's at all.

Yeah, I mean it's tremendous.

Man to be honest, if you watch the games, they have to account for his legs.

If they don't, you know, he's gonna make them pay.

What is past or run shure regardless, And like I said, when he's in the game and when he's doing what he needs to do, which is affecting the defense, they have to they have to respect them.

I mean, for me, that takes one less guy off my plate, you know, because if you know the d N is respecting the quarterback, he's not coming down on me when I'm running outside zone and air size zone.

And at the same time, it also allows the officer coordinator to call, you know, certain plays and feel comfortable calling and plays as well.

And that's where you know, some of the gun stuff comes in and the pistols, so because you know you can either read it and even if you're not really you can make it look like a read to, you know, influence the defense.

Mike cav Get, Tim Kelly, and Jackson Darto will have been asked this week about how he's going to handle Brian Flores and what they do.

And obviously the owners is always on the quarterback, right, but I feel like the owners is also very much on the running backs of a game like this too.

You know, they line up those sets.

I watched that whole Cowboy game last week.

They line seven or eight guys up in the line of scrimmage.

They don't give any signal if they're coming or if they're not.

It could be four, could be five, it could be six, it could be seven.

You don't know how many guys are gonna bring as a running back, how much extra preparation and what is the preparation like getting ready for this Brian Flora's defense where the front is always going to try to get two on the back or make you decide on my blocking this guy, my blocking that guy and kind of put you and try to mix you up a little bit.

Yeah, I think.

I mean, obviously you have to do a lot of studying.

You have to do a lot of studying, wouldn't say, give a lot of a lot of clues to what they're doing.

But we have rules and within our offense, within our past game that we follow.

So I think, if I trust my fundamentals and understand the rules that you know, we're calling whatever the quarterback is saying, whatever old line is calling out, understanding who I got Because again, if we all work together, see everything, do the same set of eyes, see everything through the same set of lenses, and understand you know who got who, and the quarterback understands who may come free right here, I think, and you know, we'll be fine.

I think that, like I said, they have a good defense, they have a they do.

They blitch the most in the NFL.

They blow the most NFL.

It's not close, it's not say it's not close, and it's on any.

Given down, whether it's first or third down, they blitz a lot.

So it's it's for me.

I have to make sure that you know my eyes are correct because they do a lot of corner corner blitzes, and not a lot of teams do that in the NFL.

So they're one team that they do that a lot.

I think last game or two games ago, they did blitt the corner like seven times, So that's something I have to be ready for when I go out there on Sunday.

I said, I think as long as we see everything through the same set of odds, I think we'll be fine.

It's two quick follow ups.

One.

I feel like the pass pro has been very on point this year just as a unit.

Whenever you don't see free runners, I think you know that the unit's coached up really well and the players are listening and taking that coaching.

Well, do you agree with that?

Yeah, yeah, I definitely do.

Like I said, I think carm he does a great job of making sure the information that we're getting is legit.

He's not giving us no bs.

He's not like he's giving us some having us chase ghosts.

You know they might do this.

He's not.

He's not doing that.

He's giving us stuff that they run that we want to see on Sunday.

And he understands that, like we have, we already have a lot on our plate.

So you don't want to give us extra stuff to study when there's no.

Need for it.

Well, if your rules are sound enough, that will then prepare you for the stuff that they.

Haven't seen that for right exactly, And that's that's really his his his motto is just hey, follow our rules, like our rules will get us through whatever they bring, like and that's that's really the truth.

Because sometimes like they they do come out and they have some mystery stunt, some mystery blitz that we haven't seen on film from them, but they have it for us, and we follow our rules, we get it blocked up, and like you said, like it's I'm not gonna say never, but it's a lot of the time it's not a lot of free runners coming through.

It's you know, if someone gets to be someone gets beat, is football have to but yeah, yeah, but but for the most part, it's it's everyone's blocked up hat on the hat and you know and Minoly mino our guys versus theirs.

And then finally can again like this be a little frustrating few because it takes you out of the past game a little bit because you have to be back there so much ready to protect, so you can't even release late for checkdowns or you know, just get out into the flat to give jack to an option because you're needed in pass pro so much.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, obviously, you know, protections first, making sure Jackson just happen to be as that's number one.

So I definitely I don't take that for in it.

Obviously I like catching them ball, but you know I'll block somebody so Sleigh and one Dale can catch a seventy yard bomb down the field.

I mean I'll do that, you know, the one hundred times out of out of one hundred.

So I don't I don't really think much of it.

I'm to be honest with you because, like I said, I know my responsibilities.

As you know, running back is for past is past protection first.

Just like you know when I running ball, I want the receivers coming there and block the safety.

So absolutely, that's.

That's the same that's the same same thing, you know.

So uh, I'm gonna do my job and just like you know, everybody else doing theirs.

Tyrone good stuff.

That always quick luck on Sunday, thank you, huddle up.

Get in here.

If you're lined up here, you gotta go over the middle with at the score great.

How do we make that happen?

I don't know, but citizens does?

It makes sense of your money with citizens Official Bank of Eli manning.

Really good stuff from Tyrone Tracy Junior.

There, don't forget the Giants of The podcast is brought to you by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants.

From game day celebrations to your everyday financial needs, Big Blue fans can get the most out of every moment with Citizens.

Learn more at citizens bank dot com slash Giants.

Let's turn our attention to the Giants opponent this week.

Matthew Coller covers them for Purple Insider.

Here's my interview with him.

All right, now we turn our attention to the Giants opponent this week.

We welcome to Matthew Coller.

He covers the Vikings for Purple Insider.

Matt, I feel like this is like a once or twice yearly thing we do now.

The Giants and Vikings just keep playing each other.

I know we've become friends because of it.

So, by the way, with both teams in last place, we'll probably be doing this again last year too.

Yes, yes, we are the old last play schedule, which is you know, supposed to help.

So no, but it is great to be back on your show.

I do wish it was under a little bit better circumstances.

I gotta say I've had some severe jealousy watching games around the league this year, knowing the Vikings.

We're in a lot of those games last year, those big games that have playoff implications.

And not so much.

But you know what, but there is a surprising amount of intrigue for this game in Minnesota.

So I'm excited to talk about it with you.

Yeah, Viking six and eight, they are officially eliminated from the playoffs.

The Giants are two and twelve.

They've been long eliminated from the playoffs.

Why is there intrigue for the Vikings, Tommy.

Talk to me?

Why that would be?

Mister nine is the reason.

JJ McCarthy, who probably should have waited a little bit longer to create an alter ego for himself, has over the last two weeks really played well.

And he I think had a very very tough season for multiple reasons.

I mean, one, he was coming off that injury last year, thrown onto a team that won fourteen games the year before and had huge, huge expectations with tons of veteran players, And what became pretty evident pretty quickly was that this kid's gonna need some development.

That he probably needed the season of sitting behind Sam Darnold and being able to practice every day, but because he had a meniscus injury that kept him out, he was not able to and then we saw the fundamental issues of throwing the ball, but also just the experience stuff and how to protect the ball in the NFL, which I think is something that you know in college you can make certain plays and get away with them, and in the National Football League these are the best of the best.

The game moves at a completely different speed and he really had to learn that throughout this year.

But also another unfortunate incident set him back, which was an ankle injury where he was out for five weeks.

They played Carson Wentz.

They went two to three in those games, which put them back, you know in the NFC North Race.

But then when he returned it was sort of like resetting the clock again.

And so finally he's been able to string together some games.

Some have been okay and they found some ways to win, like against Detroit, and some have been an absolute nightmare, like when he went to lambeau Field, and the most recent have been much much better of not turning the ball over, not taking sacks, and then pushing the ball downfield.

With some success, as we saw him do against Dallas.

So the Vikings are trying to do something that's not so easy, which is to figure out in the next three games what they really have in JJ McCarthy.

So this is thirty three percent of it, and for them it's viewed as a big game because of that.

Yet he still cannot seem to get chemistry with Justin Jefferson.

And I realize it's an impossible question to answer because if you had the answer, you'd be having a much more lucrative job than the one you have now.

But what's going on there from what you've been able to see why, even as he's improved the last couple of weeks, McCarthy and Jefferson just can't seem to build that chemistry.

Yeah, if I had that answer, you know, Justin Jefferson might give me a couple of his his chains and his clothing you know that he wears and everything.

No, truly, I think the answer is pretty simple, which is so I think that they know the answer.

It's just how do you execute it When you have Justin Jefferson on your team.

The other team designs their entire coverage around trying to stop Justin Jefferson, so you have, you know, teams bracketing him, teams pressing him.

And the way that Kevin O'Connell has solved this over the years is a lot of like dagger concepts where you're trying to use one player to clear out some space, but the windows close really really tightly around Justin Jefferson because everyone knows where he is on the field at all times, so you have to have the ball out into a specific area of the field on the way traveling to him as he's coming out of his break.

You cannot wait until he gets out of his break and he's running across the field open and then throw him the ball.

You could do that with other receivers because you know other receivers are getting open one on one, but that just doesn't happen with Jefferson.

And I think what we have not seen much of from JJ McCarthy is those anticipation type throws where when Carson Wentz the old vet was in there, you'd see him release the football before Jefferson broke out toward the sideline and then it hits him for a first down.

And I just don't think McCarthy is really there yet And the other part is that he doesn't have a lot of touch on the football.

It's a one speed thrower.

It's everything is ninety nine miles an hour.

And that was a big part of his scouting report coming out to the NFL, and the big question was how much can you fix that?

And they've worked on fundamentals and he's had some touch throws, but I mean, you need to really trust that ball, and Sam Darnold was great at it.

Kirk Cousins was always as an anticipation thrower because he didn't have the strongest arm in the world, and that really works for Justin Jefferson.

But this has not but we have reached like a okay, no more excuse this type of moments with that, because if you can't get the ball to Jefferson, you can't operate this offense on a week to week basis.

Okay, you know, you beat Dallas they have one of the worst defense is in the league.

You beat Washington, same story, but like, all right, now it's time to figure it out how to connect with Justin Jefferson or I don't know that there's gonna be a ton of confidence going forward.

And where they're at and unfortunately the Giants.

I would slide into that similar category with how their defensive plate as well.

With Washington and Dallas.

What's going on the offensive line?

Who should we expect?

Brian one on the injury report, Ryan Kelly on the injury report, they are both limited on Thursday.

We're recording this on Friday morning.

And then Christian Darisaw with the knee, he's been out a bit questionable last week, didn't make it.

Who should we expect to see on that Vikings offensive front?

Yeah, So with Kelly and Brian O'Neil, I think there's a really good chance that those guys play.

They probably are just needing a little bit of veteran rest coming out of the Dallas game, where both of them were really good.

Especially Ryan Kelly has been a complete game changer when he's been in for the Vikings.

I mean, he just commands that offensive line.

He's helped JJ McCarthy so much.

He is absolutely excellent at picking up and stunts and twists and all those things that the defenses are trying to do up front.

So his status is huge for them.

But I think he'll probably play the Darisaw thing.

How long do we have on this podcast.

I mean, it's just it's just been very frustrating for everybody.

I mean, because he had the ACL tear last year, but my understanding is that it was much worse than your run of the mill ACL tear.

That's nine months and you're coming back and you're just fine, and the recovery has just not been like, oh, he gets a little bit better every day and then he's one hundred percent and then it's good to go.

And it's been a week to week type of thing where he plays against Washington and he's absolutely excellent and nothing looks like it's wrong, and then he doesn't play the next week, and what exactly is happening here?

And I think that he has not fully come to trust where it's at.

I think that the recovery has dealt with and some swelling has been mentioned, the soreness has been mentioned to it, and you know, I think if you're in Darisaw's position and your team is six and eight and out of the playoff race, if you don't feel really really good about that knee, I don't think you want to play Brian Burns because you know, what are we playing for here?

I mean, we're all playing to find out if JJ McCarthy's good.

But I mean, Christian Darrisol has got a long career in front of him, so that whole thing I think has really been tough for him and really been tough for the team.

And the backup justin school has tried as hard as you can try over there left tackle.

But John, how many how many great backup left tackles are there?

Probably as many as there are backup great quarterbacks right like zero, So it's a tough task.

And then you know Brian Burns Abdual Carter like, this is the this is the biggest edge of the game by far, if Christian Darrisaol does not play, because the drop off is as big as from a franchise quarterback to a backup when we're talking about Derisaw to School.

Yeah, jihnny fans have seen firsthand when Andrew Thomas is not in there, everything looks different for the offense.

So I completely get where you're coming from.

Defensively, a couple big losses.

Jonathan Gernardi was kind of playing through that that shoulder you know, peck thing.

It looks like he's now he's out for the year.

Josh Mattelis, you're kind of, you know, versatile second level defender.

He's out for the year.

Javon Hargrave did not practice both the first two days this week.

What are we looking at health wise on the defense and how do the losses of those two key pieces affect what Brian Flores wants to do.

Yeah, I mean Grenard is kind of where the entire defense starts.

It's I mean, the things that Floraes does are incredible, the different blitzes and his connection with Harrison Smith, who's essentially a defensive coordinator on the field and is you know, kind of making checks and changes in real time.

I mean that's great.

But where it all begins is one guy who wins his matchup versus the best left tackles in the league and creates pressure.

And you can look at Grenard's sack numbers and say, well, what are you talking about?

But look at his pressure numbers.

As you and I as data guys, we understand this pass rush win rate.

He's top ten amongst starters.

Pressure rate, he's top ten amongst starters.

So he's been in the backfield causing problems.

Just one of the main issues is they've played a bunch of running quarterbacks who are hard to sack, I think, but he's been every bit as good as he was last year.

Now it's it's intrigue for us because it's gonna be Dallas Turner, who when he filled in for Grenard earlier this year, had four sacks thirteen pressures in a three game run.

But you know, he hasn't gotten to do that a whole lot.

He's often been trying to emulate Andrew Van Ginkle, who was injured earlier this year and plays a completely different role, who's more of a true like outside linebacker, drop it back and coverage line up in different spots.

Grenard is a pass rusher and starting to get the sense that Dallas Turner really is just a pass rusher.

He can do the other stuff, but he's not Andrew Van Ginkel.

So this is a huge opportunity for him and kind of show what you can do at that position and then maybe they'll know what they have.

Overall, his second year as a first round draft pick, I think has been progress, but I would not say that he's become the you know, the next bake star rusher in the NFL yet And there's a chance here in these final three games for him to kind of show yeah, like you guys made the right draft pick and you know you there you have something to work with here for the future as a pass rusher, but maybe not quite as much as a versatile player.

But losing Grenard is absolutely huge.

And Mettelis, Look, I mean, that's a guy who you never know where he's gonna line up.

He's played all sorts of different positions, and they've been playing mostly three safeties lately rather than you know, a nickel corner because they lost Jeff Okuda.

So yeah, I mean, Jay Ward's gonna get his opportunity.

But you know, Mattellis is one of the smarter players in the NFL.

So these are these are big losses and chances for the Giants to face a Vikings team that does not have its full breadth of players.

I kind of like Brian Flores takes the point of blitzing and kind of turns it on its head a little bit in terms of what he's trying to do.

And I'll try to explain the fans what I mean, and you correct me if you think I'm off face here.

But it's funny you look at.

One that I like look at every week is how the opposing team's pass rating versus the blitz.

And I think the vikings are like next to last in the league is like one twenty five, right, But then you look at this, then you say, wait a second.

They given a fewer twenty plus yard passes than any other team in the league.

Said, you're trying to figure out what's going on here, And it's funny.

A lot of people think if you blitz a lot, you're very susceptible, it passes over the top.

Well that's not how Brian Flores does it.

He literally blitzes to force you to do what you're supposed to do when a team blitzes, which is to throw like a two yard dump off.

But the problem is that it's third and six, so you gain three yards and then you have to punt.

So I like the way he's kind of designed this where it's like, all right, I'm gonna blitz a lot and pressure not to get sacks, but just to make you run your offense that you cannot have successful plays and move the chains.

I think that's a tremendous description.

And the other thing is too sometimes you blitz to then set up not blitz this ye.

He shows so many different things at the line of scrimmage where if you are quarterback, you're looking at it and going, Okay, they had this look before, here's what they're gonna do, or here's what I saw on tape, and then oh, that's not even close to what I saw.

And really the lynchpint to this is always Harrison Smith if you watch him, especially the last couple of weeks, he's been at full health.

Earlier this year he dealt with, you know, kind of a personal illness that was held back for playing entire games.

But now he's back to full health and you see him lining up at the edge and then right before the snap running all the way back to a deep safety spot.

Or I saw another play where he was an edge rusher and then drop back into like a hook curl zone and you're like, wait a minute, he just played linebacker on that play, you know, after lining up as an edge rusher.

Like, there's so many different things that they do off of him.

And then real the revelation player this year, which I didn't really see coming even though I was a believer in this guy, was Eric Wilson, who previously was with the Vikings, and I thought, hey, this is a great special teamer, great depth linebacker.

If he needs to play, you're gonna be in good shape.

But what Brian Flores discovered is if you can get this guy blitzing, he will run over running backs.

He is one of the stronger players that they have, and he has just trucked running backs in the in the blitz.

So they've used a lot of those cross dog type blitzes where you have the two linebackers go in the opposite ways.

He's gotten free a couple of times, one on one with a That was the game earlier this year where Jamiir Gibbs gave up seven pressures because they just rushed Eric Wilson up the middle over and over and over again and it caused so many problems.

So that's something I'm sure that the Giants are preparing for.

But it's hard to prepare for when you have so many guys that are so good, uh at blitzing and at deception.

So it's gonna really test the young quarterback Jacks Dart.

Yeah.

And then in the secondary, they have the slowest cover one rate in the league.

I think it's set them in front of me.

I think six percent something ridiculous like that.

That's so far the least in the league that like the next team is not even that close to them.

It's just a lot of different zones, and they'll I imagine they they they disguise those zones.

They don't.

You don't, you don't show what you're in.

That's kind of, you know, the new in vogue thing in the National Football League.

And you got a couple of corners.

I think Isaiah Rodgers is playing well.

By m Murphy's playing well.

You mentioned Harrison Smith obviously has been doing this forever.

You know, he used to pick up Eli Manning fifteen years ago.

Yeah, talk about what he does in the back half to compliment all those you know, double mug shows.

All right, we're dropping, we're coming.

How does what he do in the does How does what he does in the back end compliment what he's doing up front.

Yeah, it's so interesting because there's always going to be two deep safeties.

But the question usually that the quarterback has to figure out is is there also going to be the Tampa player there?

And I don't say the Tampa linebacker because the Tampa player could be anybody.

And what I mean is in the middle of the two deep safeties, you have another player in the middle of that zone, and where is that guy even coming from?

Because sometimes that can be, you know, a linebacker.

Sometimes that can be a traditional type of middle linebacker, could be outside linebacker, could be you know previously a Josh mittelis a box safety who suddenly arrives there and then they rotate somebody over.

They do the inverted stuff where you have the safety come down on a cover two and then the corner go back to where the safety is supposed to be.

It's it's all versions of coverages that everybody uses, but how they get to that point and then with who's coming on the pressures, it all ties together to just look like you know, the conversation it's been happening with the peer progressions and everything else like that one.

They're trying to get you to, as you said, like go to the quickest option possible, but also they're trying to make that quarterback drop back and look at the defense in the first second of it and go I have no idea why this player's over there, Where this player's going is my guy open.

But it's not an invincible defense though.

That is one thing that I should say is it's not certainly they can be run against Javon Hargrave.

If he misses this game, we'll make that a little bit tougher for them to stop the run.

Josh Mattelis is always one of their best run defenders.

Jonathan Grenard is great at setting edges.

Dallas Turner I would not say that he has reached that point in his career yet.

And if you can get these guys one on one.

Byron Murphy has not had the same year as last year.

And you know, Isaiah Rodgers is blazing fast, but he's not the biggest guy.

So if you can get some matchups with bigger saw him struggle with Devonte Smith.

We saw this team struggle with aj Brown.

You know.

So when they've played bigger or better wide receivers, they've had some trouble if the quarterback can find enough time to throw.

And this is the thing that they've struggled with with that.

Jackson Dart does well is quarterbacks with some mobility.

I mean, if you're able to like a Jalen Hurtz or a Kleb Williams, slide around, move away from the rush by yourself a little extra time.

This team does not have players in the secondary who are going to hang on for four seconds if they get manned up, It's just not gonna happen.

So Jackson Dart's playmaking, I think really goes into this.

Matt.

Awesome stuff, my friend.

Tell the folks, we think you'll find all your great work.

That would be a Purple Insider on YouTube, Purple Insider wherever you get your podcasts, and Purple Insider Dot Football is the newsletter.

Enjoy this.

I enjoy the game on Sunday, my friend.

Thanks, Jean, appreciate it.

Man.

If you want to know how to manage two minutes of crunch time football, I'm your Matt.

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Hey, I can also talk long care.

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Really good stuff from Matt.

We appreciate him joining us right here on the Giants Total Podcast, brought to you by Citizens.

Now let's hear from the head coach of the NYG interim head coach Mike Kafka with the voice of the Giants Bob Papa.

As always, were joined by the head coach of the New York Giants, Mike Kafka and coach you get this football game against the Minnesota Vikings.

This is a team that has gotten hot as of late, the averaging thirty two half thirty two and a half points per game over there last too, when you study this Minnesota team, what are some of the things that jump out at you as far as the way they've progressed as far as McCarthy's concerning their offensive productivity.

Yeah, you're seeing the evolution of JJ and you know, just starting off as a young player and having some opportunities, you know, early in the season and it's kind of being up and down.

Then he can continue find his groove and find some consistency on offense.

And obviously they have some skill guys on the perimeter and in the backfield that can obviously make an impact.

And I think JJ's is just doing a really nice job of not only just managing the games, but also giving this guys opportunities and putting the ball in their hands.

Although the numbers aren't there as far as what we're used to seeing from Justin Jefferson.

Talk about the impact that he has on your team defensively because of the threat that exists on literally every snap.

Yeah, I mean, he's a guy, he's an elite player, one of the probably the best receiver in the league, and you have to you know, you have to respect that and you have to know where he's at in every single snap.

You know, they're going to try and find ways to get in the football and he's going to be primary receiver for I said, the majority of their routes.

But they compliment him well with the other guys around in the offense, you know, Naylor and.

Addison, Madison, you.

Know, like they had Hockinson.

I mean, these guys are these guys are well built.

So you know, you have one elite player or you know, a really elite player, I shouldn't say one, a really elite player, and then you compliment him with a bunch of different other skill sets.

Makes it hard to depend down coach.

The running game.

Obviously, they've used Mason a lot this year.

They have Jones.

Both of those guys their threats in a lot of different ways.

Is that something that a lot of teams are comfortable with as far as having multiple backs to use.

I'd say, yeah, I think I think a lot of teams are just mixing up their personnel.

They're complimenting their backs, you know, whether ones are kind of a speedback, ones a downhill back.

You know, every I think every team kind of carries a different philosophy.

But yeah, I think I think you see that across the league on certain uncertain teams that they have kind of a you know.

A little bit of a flexibility there.

I'd say, let's go to the other side of the ball, right, Brian Flores's defense is one that they blitz a lot.

They bring pressure, and sometimes it brings the illusion of pressure.

How do you go about deciphering it as a young quarterback?

And Jackson Dart's got to deal with it.

And I know, look, he's played a lot of ball this year.

He's played against a lot of good defensive coordinators.

But each step is a learning process.

But what are some of the keys in trying to sort of diagnose this team defensively?

Yeah, I think it starts with just your base rules and fundamentals on offense, you know, you we try to create a framework of of your movement keys of your identify your the individuals on defense that you need to identify that could be put in conflict.

So in just any pass game that we had, we'd have, Hey, we're looking at a flat defender, We're looking at a crooked curl defender.

And yeah, that body type may be a dB one play, maybe a linebacker one play.

Shoot, it might even be a defensive end dropp into that play.

So it's but it's about putting your eyes on the right spot, trusting your eye progression, trusting the base rules of that concept, and then own just let your natural ability show.

And if you work within the framework of the offense, I think, and be able to stay on time and in rhythm.

I think all that stuff put together is going to give you the best opportunity.

And so when you have someone that you're going against that has a multiple way to get to different different looks and different coverages and different fronts, I think it all of us goes back to your base rules.

Coach.

You know, last week against Washington, there were a lot of opportunities in the football game, and it was a one score game, and you had some chances late in the football game and some things were just like a little bit off as far as communication or what everybody was seeing down the stretch.

When you're coaching them during the course of the week, what are some of the things that you go back and try to reinforce to kind of clean those things up.

Yeah, all the fundamentals and all the communication.

That's the one thing that we stress every single day and trying to find that one little that one little nugget, that one little piece that each player can work on and hold on to can to get consistent improvement.

And so when we look at our guys, when we look at our group, you know offensive definitely in special teams, you know, you look at those things and you say, all right, right, here's where we can really get better this week.

Here's what we gotta have to do.

We have to improve.

And it may be you know, a new player in a new role, maybe you know a couple of different players in a different role.

So you know, you're getting those guys caught up the speed, and our coaches do a great job of doing that.

But yeah, I mean it starts with our base, our base rules and fundamentals.

Coach Andrew Thomas, I know he's up for consideration for the Pro Bowl.

And I know you look at things in a team totality, but this guy has been absolutely fantastics this year and whenever he plays.

How impressed have you been with his ability to come back from what was a pretty severe injury that forced him to miss a lot of time and to play at the level that he's played at this year.

Yeah, Ri, it's really no surprise to me.

Since the day I got here, he's been, you know, a pillar of consistency in terms of his play and execution and and how he approaches the game, how he approaches meetings, how he approaches you know, his teammates in the locker room.

It's all consistent.

And you know, he's a guy that we lean on as an offense and certainly as a coach and as the head coach, the guy that I lean on in terms of leadership and showing, you know, young players and how the group, how this thing should be, how it should look.

Coach, We appreciate a couple minutes.

Best of luck this afternoon, and Merry Christmas to you and your family, and hopefully Santa delivers victory here this week.

Thank you you as well.

Happy holidays, Great stuff.

There from Bob, from Mike Kafka, we thank them, We thank Matthew Kohller and of course we thank Tyrone Tracy Junior for being our guest this week on The Giants Toutle Podcast, brought to you by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants.

I am John Schmelk You and of course Chake Got Big Blue kickoff live Saturday at seven am on w FAM, Mark Lewsis and I Talk Giants, take your calls, and then Tikey Barber and I'll have the pregame show for you on Sunday at eleven am on the Fan, getting you ready for Giants and Vikings.

Thanks so much for being with us, everybody.

We'll see you next time on The Giants Total Podcast, brought to you by Citizens