Stories from Super Touring.

Hello and welcome to this week's episode of Stories from Super Touring.

I'm your host Levi Riley and this week we are diving into a meeting that shaped British Touring Car Championship history, the very first BTCC race at Scotland's legendary Knoxville circuit in 1992.

As we all know, 1992 was a season packed with high octane action, fierce rivalries and some of the most iconic touring cars of the era.

But when the championship made its debut at Not Hill, a tight undulating track known for its unpredictable weather and dramatic elevation changes, it became an instant fan favourite.

To help us look back at this race weekend, we are joined once again by motorsport photographer Greg Denton.

Greg, welcome back to the pods.

Great to have you on again.

How are you doing this evening?

Yeah, very good.

Thank you.

And it's really great to be invited back for another episode and to reminisce on the Nokia 192.

Fit and we'll stick with you first for our usual opening question, what first comes to mind when you think about the very first not kill event back in 1992?

Yeah, I think it's two things really.

First of all, as you said, it was the first visit to Knockhill, so it was a brand new circuit.

So we, you know, all the fans went there not really knowing what to expect when we did get there.

I think the weather was something that dominated the the weekend and I'm sure we'll talk about that later because it got very, very wet.

Yeah, it definitely did.

And that's a a common theme of not kill meetings normally.

And 92 was the start if you need to go on exactly.

And Alan with us, as always, is Alan Clark and Alan coming to you.

What are your memories of this race meeting?

My first overriding memory is that iconic footage from John Cleland where they cut to the in car and it is as Greg just said, the weather was teeming it down and all you can hear is a bewildered John Glennon.

We cannot see a thing where the Hell's the track?

And you can't if the wipers go in the fastest speed you've ever seen a wiper go and it still isn't clearing enough water feature actually see.

And I did wonder how at that point did they keep it on?

And we've mentioned it before about bad weather.

Certainly Brands 95 we've talked about it.

Silverstone 99, the finale again.

I think this is another race where, had it been held these days, they would not have run in those conditions.

Yeah.

As always, we also asked our faithful listeners what they thought of this race meeting, and they've come up with some of the following.

Alistair Sloane remembers going to his 18th birthday party.

He said it was very, very wet, which we've already mentioned a couple of times and we'll get into much more about that later on in the episode.

Andy Taylor got in touch to say his memory of this race is John Cleland going down the back straight towards the hairpin ranting about not being able to see a thing and you guessed it, the driving rain.

Whilst Dougie Dowson got in touch to tell us that he spent a whole week up there playing golf and had a great time, which I can imagine some brilliant golf courses in that part of the world.

Dougie Dougie is Roger Dowson's brother and this was by far the strongest weekend that Mazda that Roger Dawson's team were running and obviously the first year they were in the championship in 92 Mazda.

By far the most competitive showing for the three 2-3 in 92 was here, and Patrick does feature a fair bit in in this episode so.

I think he was near the front and then he threw it off again, didn't he?

Yeah, yeah.

Which doesn't sound like Patrick, does it?

Oh, Patrick.

Ahead of the first ever BTCC meeting at Knock Hill, the biggest news circulating in the paddock was Renault's potential entry into the series for 1993 with their 19 model.

The French manufacturer was reportedly evaluating the championship as a platform to showcase its competitiveness and touring car racing, with the Renault 19 seen as a strong contender against the established grid.

Their entry would complete their involvement in the new Super meeting package that Toker had recently announced.

No decisions have been made yet, said Renault's Tim Jackson.

It would certainly be the final piece of the jigsaw to have BTCC entry, though if confirmed, Renault's arrival would have added further depth to an already fiercely competitive championship.

Greg, we obviously now know that this rumour was indeed true and that Renault ended the series at the start of 1993.

Was this the first manufacturer seeing what benefits there were of being involved in the championship?

Yeah, I think we'd already seen manufacturers that were mainly specifically in touring cars, you know, Vauxhall, BMW, Ford, but I think Renault was the first one that was involved in other motorsport, obviously Formula One, and this was their first move into a touring car racing campaign.

So I really think it showed that, you know, where the focus was and the benefits of entering the British touring cars was was clear to see.

So yeah, I think it was a real signal of intent.

And then many followed after that.

Prior to the meeting, Peugeot confirmed that their works team would not be making the trip to Scotland, the team instead preferring to remain in England and concentrating on the development of the four O 5.

The project had lost valuable time after the car was damaged at the previous meeting at Donington Park, team manager Mick Linford told Autosport.

By doing this, the car will take a definite step forward when we head to Pembrey for the next meeting.

Alex, this Perjury team were having a really tough debut season in the Championship world and they may be a sign of things to come as well for the.

Era, yeah, I mean, we all know now, don't we?

Having heard from the horse's mouth about just how bad or how tough things were bad makes it sound like it was a bad team.

It wasn't a bad team.

It was a team full of great people, Mick being one of them.

But a tough environment.

And, yeah, Persia were struggling.

They hadn't done anything, really with the 405.

In fact, later on in this series season, Gary Ailes would come over to the Donnington meeting.

That's it.

Yeah.

And score more points in one meeting with the Persia Italia car than Persia had scored up until that point that season.

As we know, that was all a very political argument that they were having no data being shared.

Yeah, You see, you know, listeners will know exactly why Peugeot was such a a tough place to be in in this era, but a wise choice to to not make, not make the trip.

It didn't happen very often in this era.

It sort of reared its head again in the mid, mid 10s.

If you remember, quite a few teams used to skip, not kill, just because of the cost of getting up here.

But if Peugeot felt they were better suited to take in some time out and testing at Pembrey to try and get the car sorted, then you know it's worth it.

It's worth a go.

I really think that the, the programme probably suffered with only having one driver at this point.

I think it it got stronger that 93 car by mid season was actually quite, quite decent.

And as we know Patrick got some good results in the 94405.

So yeah, I, I do think that they needed, they needed something whether that was going to, to, to Pembrey and testing, I think it probably sorted one problem.

But from what we can gather, you saw one problem here at Peugeot.

And three or four of others arrive.

Others pop up in another part of the team.

So yeah, I don't know about anyone else, but when I listened to that Meek Linford episode or when we when we were speaking with him, I just felt really sorry for him.

Yeah.

Just wanted to give a big hug.

It still staggers me now why they've got no support.

It wasn't as though they were competing with France.

There was, I could never, ever see any reason why it was like it was.

It just made no sense.

It's as though they entered it against the will of the French team and that's what they were being punished for it.

But it wasn't like that.

It just just never made any sense.

No, no, it never, never ever, ever made any sense.

Every other works programme when Honda entered MSD built about 10 Accords, 11 Accords and two of them went to Germany, three of them went to Britain, 11 spare, two of them went to to Japan and whatnot.

They were all the same cars.

It was the same when the Vector launched every, every championship had the same car.

In fact, that's why Vauxhall struggled.

If you listen to to certain people is because they reckon that the the error of the Vector was more suited to the European circuits.

I don't know, it's the whole Peugeot thing was a very strange and very odd setup and yeah, it didn't do much good, but it it was worth a go, I guess.

Making a one off appearance at Not Kill for BMW was British rally champion Colin McRae.

Prodrive entered a guest car for McRae as part of the promotion for the inaugural race at the Scottish circuit.

Scott had minimal circuit racing experience and did not test the BMW until the day before the start of the weekend, with the team noting that Mcrae's focus was fully on rallying rather than racing in the BTCC.

Alex Colin might not yet have been a huge style that he became later on in his career, but he was already by this point a British Rally Champion and had already finished on the podium in the World Rally Championship.

So an exciting guest appearance that is for the championship?

Yeah, exciting.

For people within motorsport, if you're a motorsport fan, you would have known who Colin McRae was.

It wasn't to the level of, say, Mansell the Toker Shootout.

It wasn't a well known name.

We're not, we're not talking Colin McRae post 95, you know, and he would say when, you know, when he had his own computer game and he had all the all the image rights and Colin McRae was like just cool, you know, it wasn't to that level.

But if you knew MO, if you were into motorsport, you would know Colin McRae.

Well, yeah, he's Jimmy Son and he's doing great things in the British championship.

He's finished on the podium in the world.

He's going to be a great rally driver.

So it wasn't it might have drawn a few more in on the on the on the gate at Knock Hill, especially up in Scotland.

An exciting guest appearance for motorsport fans, but not not one that would bring in, you know, Mansell at Donnington in 93 levels then, if you get what I'm saying.

But definitely an exciting driver.

I mean, everyone knows what what what how exciting Colin McRae was to watch on a rally stage and there was no reason why he wouldn't bring similar levels of excitement to the BTCC, especially when he refuses to use ABS.

Yes.

And was it right in the Matt Neil episode he said he didn't actually have a licence to race.

Yeah, for somehow he got onto the grid.

Yeah, I mean, that's mad isn't it?

You think about that now.

It would never happen though.

But yeah, he didn't actually have a a racing licence to to race on the circuit Accord.

I'd never heard that before.

But yeah, I I was shocked when Matt said that, which probably angered Steve Neil even more than not.

Not that I want to drop any spoilers, but Steve Neil does get a little irate in this episode.

The Saturday practise sessions were both dominated by the weather.

The mixed conditions shook up the order and a Curia cost were the biggest beneficiaries, with David Leslie taking pole and teammate Bobby Verdon rose securing a front row lookout for the Scottish squad at their home race.

Team manager Ray Malik explained the result.

The balance of the cars has been good all weekend and we're on the right tyres at the right time.

It was important to stay out there whilst the track was drying.

I'm surprised that Moore didn't do the same.

Leslie was delighted too.

An Arcuria cost 1-2 in Scotland, What more could you want?

Verdun Roy, meanwhile, thought he could have had the pole.

I had to lift off at the chicane on my best lap when John Clement got in my way, explained Bobby after the session.

Greg, that's a great start to the weekend for the Arcuria costume, isn't it?

Yeah, I think you've heard of I wrote that script before and they'd have been very, very pleased.

But I think also it's like the the emergence of a Curia cost as a team into the British Touring Cars.

It was their first year, obviously run by Ray Malik, the start of Ray Malik's journey into the British Touring Car Championship and also really the start of David Leslie's career as well.

So, you know, I think there's a number of things that this was the emergence and I can only imagine that the the works Vauxhall team of Dave Cook, this was probably the first sign that all someone might be looking for our work still for the future years, which we know is what actually happened.

So yeah, new team of Vauxhall, old Dave Cook cars on the grid and outperforming the works cars.

So yeah, quite a, quite a shock.

Jeff Allen's recent fine form continued as he set the third fastest time, with Steve Sober four fastest, just ahead of his Bickley Most Sport teammate Tim Harvey.

The pair were well clear of the rest of the BMW 318IS contingent, all of whom benefited from recent rule adjustments which had narrowed the weight differential between front and rear wheel drive cars by 25 kilos.

Mcrae's debut in the championship was one of the struggle in the practise sessions column.

Was really quite blase about the whole thing, said Tom Hunt, team manager to Most Sport magazine in 2006.

At the time we were running ABS and sucked in a menu.

Was saying during the test that they couldn't break over the bump.

Colin told them if you want to break there, just break there.

He maintained that he'd be better off without the ABS so we removed it for one of the sessions.

Within 3 laps he'd put it into the gravel.

That's quite an interesting first aid for Colin isn't it?

Behind the wheel of a circuit racing car.

Yeah, well, I think again, it was his like approach to rallying.

I think many, many times he said the only way to find the limit is to go over it.

And I think we saw that in in his early rallying days where cars were absolutely wrecked and in pieces.

I remember one RAC rally and then Rs Cosworth, the whole car was nearly destroyed.

Similarly Subaru Legacy.

So I think it was just him applying the limits, finding where they were, stepping over them and then adapting his driving style accordingly.

But that was what made him such a such an amazing talent, I think.

Yeah, Yeah.

I mean that's, it's very Colin McRae, isn't it?

That so if you just want to break there, just break there.

And to sort of say that he would be better without ABS and then within 3 laps putting it in the gravel.

I mean, but as you say, Greg, that's just him pushing the limits, finding out, you know what, I'm going to try it without and see where we go.

And yeah, that's what he became famous for.

You know, you know, later on in his rally in Korea, we've we've seen Ford Focuses with wheels collapsed and he's just dragging them along.

In fact, the other day it popped up on my socials feed, a clip of him.

And I think Nikki Grist was talking about an incident where they done something to the suspension or they bent an arm really quite badly.

So Colin got out, got the car up, took the arm off and he's literally with a boulder slamming it back straight, put it back on the car and got to the got to the timing line.

Very, very, very short amount of time before he would be penalised.

But they got there and he didn't get penalised and it was just incredible.

That's just the the the the nature of the man that he was.

Yeah.

The thought of just him throwing it around in A318IS Super Tour or two litre car at this point, Yeah, it's just quite funny really isn't it?

Yeah, yeah.

Patrick Watts had the Mazda going superbly again as Roger Dowson's efficient team continued to make good progress with the 323.

He was a head of championship leader John Cleland, who was eighth.

We were on the right ties at the wrong time or vice versa, said John after the sessions.

Alan Menus, Peretti intermediates were on the point of coming good when the rain came down again.

His ninth fastest time was a great effort set on wets when the track was well past its best.

For other reasons he wouldn't start the race.

A story we will cover shortly.

In 10th and 11th were the Toyota pair of Andy Rouse and Wilhoi.

Both were struggling to find a good wet setup.

Willard also had a very big accident at Duffer's Dip on Thursday.

Sterling work by Rouses crew had the car straightened on the jig at a local dealer back in shape by Friday evening.

But Will was suffering.

His helmet had hit the steering wheel in the impact and he'd pulled a lot of neck and back muscles.

He was trying herbal remedies, frequent massages and even acupuncture to put himself back on form.

Greg not kills.

Not really the place you want to be if you suffer from neck and back pain is it?

No, I definitely not.

I think, I think with the the undulated nature of it, it's a really fast lap.

I don't think there's really any straights apart from the start line straight, which doesn't last very long where you have any time to to rest or so forth.

So yeah, I can only imagine that was a tough, tough weekend for him after his crash on the Thursday.

Talking of injuries, Ala Menu season was over on the Saturday night when he suffered a compound fracture of his right leg along with ligament damage after kitting a car horse riding a quad bike through the paddock.

Menu had moved across to give an oncoming Volkswagen room but lost control and hit the car head on instead.

He underwent an initial operation in Dunfermline the following day, with experts suggesting that the ligament damage would see him out of action for the next 6 months.

Alex, that's a big shame for Menu.

He was having a really decent debut season.

Yeah, he was, and a lot of people forget that actually our Menu made his debut in the series in a BMW.

Lots of people associate Menu with starting with Renault, but he was quietly getting a decent return from that BMW.

If you remember, this was the BMW that A was struggling at the start of the year and B was the pro drive BMW, which as we have learned since was, even though looking very similar, were definitely very different under the under the under the bonnet in the sense that the teams went their own way.

They didn't, they weren't collaborating together and that is why the VL, the VLRVLM, sorry, BMWs went on to be so dominant, whereas the other works team, because they were both BMW supported entries, the Pro Dr entries never really matched that dominance.

So yeah, Alan finished on the podium before this accident.

And yeah, he was having a good, a good debut season, clearly one to watch.

He was still harbouring dreams of single seat or Formula One at this point.

But yeah, I mean, this accident, from what I'm led to believe, for a very long time afterwards, Alan wasn't able to go running or jogging or anything.

So it it, it sounded like it was quite a, quite a nasty incident and it left quite left him in quite a bad way.

It's a shame because obviously they would have had three cars out this weekend with McRae as well.

So, yeah, I just feel for the Volkswagen driver as well, because yeah, you, yeah, you know, nobody wants to, nobody wants to run anyone over in the in the in the paddock.

But yeah, just a very unfortunate accident.

Sadly that that meant that Alan's season came to a halt and with BMW leaving the championship at the end of 92 originally, it was only when they fell out with the DTM bosses that Steve Super mentioned a couple of episodes ago the BMW then returned that Alan had lined up his contract with Renault who as you just said Levi were looking at entering the series at this point.

Makes me wonder how much contact Alan had had with Renault at this point you know.

But had this not happened, would he have stayed with BMW?

Would be would he have been a BMW driver?

Who knows?

I love these little, these two segues.

Yeah.

What if this had happened?

And what if that happened and all these alternate universe type things, You know, would he have stayed with BMW?

Would he have been champion in 93?

Would he have knocked Winkle?

Or would he have, you know, would Winkle out not have come across, you know, all these things?

Interesting.

But yeah, a shame that his debut season was cut short in what sounded like quite a nasty accident.

Race day morning was drier and the 15 minute warm up session was a slick shot affair for all.

Ralphs proved quickest ahead of Super and Alum.

It was still dry for the first race and the whole grid started on slicks.

Leslie got away with Elm from pole to leave comfortably from his teammate Vernon Rowe so you could dive down the inside of Verdun Row into McIntyre to move briefly up to second.

Verdun Row was pushed wide and dropped welm back while Soap was also delayed and alum snatched second at the end of the first lap.

With that in mind, at the end of the first lap Leslie led by 1.12 seconds from alum Super Harvey Watts and Cleland Alex.

The first lap at not kill one that would become the norm over the years at this circuit.

Not kills, not kill, isn't it?

I mean, you just have to look at it and say and, and, and know that it's going to be a bit of carnage, isn't it?

You know, we were talking last couple of weeks ago about Aiello and, and how impressive it was that he got used to British tracks in in that one season he came and won.

You know, I'd love to have seen his face when he first rocked up at Noch Hill and thought, what?

Where am I?

What is this?

Where am I, you know?

And yeah, no kill.

It's just, it's just wild, isn't it?

You look at it, you don't think they don't race around here, surely.

But yeah, no Kill, as we now have come to know very well, is definitely a track that causes a fair bit of chaos, certainly on opening laps and especially in this era.

It wouldn't have been.

It wouldn't be the last time.

Allen immediately started to chip away at Leslie's lead, and by the end of lap three he was right with him.

Meanwhile, after a strong start, Watts ran wide at the final hairpin on lap 2, dropping from 5th to 9th.

Alex, It's another early visit to the Patrick Watts Sympathy Corner this series, isn't it?

Welcome to the Patrick Watts Sympathy Corner.

I I'd forgotten that Patrick runs so well until I researched this script, this race for them to to write this script.

I'd forgotten and I was watching it thinking Patrick's up in fourth.

Look, he's right behind so Prudential and and I was think he doesn't stay there shortly.

And then literally as I say that he wants off the track in the hairpin and I'm just like and in my head I'm going, Oh, Patrick.

And then you hear Murray going, Oh, Patrick, a real shame.

But it still ends up being a good weekend for this little master that as I said at the start of the show, it wasn't really the most competitive touring car a master produced as we know.

But at this little twisty knock hill, it seemed to suit it.

And Patrick really dragged what results he could out of it.

And interesting I think the only car in this era with pop up headlights.

Yes, you're probably right, yeah.

I'm trying to think of another one and a place like Knock Hill in the way in the rain.

I can't.

I can't think of another super tour in this era that had pop up headlights.

No, I think you'll be right.

I don't think there's many cars in that era that had Mazda was like MX Fives and so forth.

I can't think there was anyone else that actually had that as.

Well, no, no, You might have had some.

You might have had some in the mid 80s, but yeah, certainly in the 90s there weren't any mothers.

No.

Yeah.

Fill out the toy to Karina.

That was the only car with mudflaps.

Yes.

Not sure that was an aerodynamic device for the future, but yeah.

Also with mudflaps needed later on in the day.

Yes, absolutely.

Jeff Allen continued to nipple away at Leslie's advantage at the front until lap 7.

David made a bit of a mistake at the chicane and I seized my chance, explained Allen.

Greg, was that a good move from him there?

Yeah, I think so.

And I think it became a it's become a standard move at not kill.

So you know, you come down Duffer's Dip, you go through the chicane.

If you get a wide line there, then you you go out into the gravel.

Now if you get a nice line through there, you can cut up and then it's on.

Is it the railway straight and then into Denton's?

I think it is, I have to say, not named after me.

I wish it.

Was so yeah, yeah.

When we went there, we did think, well, actually has this been named after us as we were visiting fans, but clearly not, not the case.

But yeah, I think it's become a a classic not kill move.

So yeah, it was a it was good to see Jeff pull in such a move.

Wasn't it named after this at some point?

Wasn't it named the real radio hairpin or something like that if I remember right?

Now might have done, there's a little shed there as well that you could stand in.

So yes, this is like some of the quirks of Knockhill, some very strange stands and places to watch it.

Going back to the previous question, it was like when you turned up there, this circuit was in the middle of nowhere on the side of a hill.

You could stand in the centre of the circuit and see the whole thing.

Totally unique, no debris fencing anywhere.

The tyre barriers were agricultural.

I would say at the start it was just a fantastic experience.

Where you thought, is it really right?

These cars are racing here.

Padding was tiny, everyone was condensed in together.

But it was, it was brilliant.

Yeah, I remember later on in the year it was the only place where they didn't do the compulsory pit stops because the pit lane and the padding were just too tight.

It was just too small.

I've not been to Knockhill since 98 and I don't know if anyone's been later, but it doesn't look like it's changed a bit really.

No, no, my my friend went this year and again he said it's very much the same as what it was.

Yes, they've upgraded some of the facilities, but it's still got that really lovely close knit feel to it.

Yeah, yeah.

Leslie's race would come to an end on lap 13 with the Scott going off track.

I made a mistake at Duffer's and Tim went down the inside at McIntyre, said Leslie.

He didn't make a mistake.

I lined him up and took my chance, said Tim.

That wasn't the end of it because at Clark, Leslie tried to come back at him on the outside, was left with no room and skated off the track.

He managed to keep it all going but it picked up a puncture so returned to the pits to prepare for Race 2.

Greg that that unravelled into quite a hectic racer.

Let's do that, didn't it?

Yeah, I think after the start of the Saturday and the good qualifying, it all sort of started to unravel through a curia cost.

I've got a great picture of him in the dirt and car absolutely covered in in mud and so forth.

So yeah, it was AI guess a bit of the the baptism of the British Touring Car Championship to David, which I'm sure we learned a lot from them, how he carried on improving his racecraft.

But yeah, had a tough start.

Allen was left clear at the front and consolidated his position to win by a clear 5 seconds.

The next 4 continued to keep the crowd entertained as they ran close together.

Harvey was fairly secure in second but when Super Run wide at Clark Round slipped fast into third.

Cleland was fifth on the road but he was deemed to have ignored a black and orange flag shown to him as his back bumper was hanging off.

Cleland's race ended after 21 laps.

He was furious, pointing out that Leslie was unpenalised so much of the Grand Prix support race with the same issue.

Why am I black one?

Why am I black and on for that skipping never end it noise.

The bloody bumper won't come off it.

Alex, do you think John had a point there with the the direction of that race?

Yes, I do actually.

And it's this age-old motorsport problem that we still have today.

It's consistency among a long decisions.

John is completely right.

Someone else, I think it was Leslie.

Yeah, that was that was yeah, Leslie did have a very similar even the same car.

So, you know, had the same problem at at Silverstone and nothing was done about it.

So why should John suffer?

I mean, this inconsistency in in in decision making could cost, could have cost John the championship.

I mean, there's no good of about it.

It had an effect because John lost the championship by a number of points to Tim, didn't he, as we did?

Was it much of A decider that year?

I can't really.

Remember, I don't think people really remember.

So yeah, that's all.

Any driver fan team, that's all we want is consistency of decisions if this has happened and this needs to happen.

So say someone's bumper is hanging off, needs to go into the pits and get it taken off.

And if not, this is the appropriate penalty.

And if that's applied across the board every time it happens, fair enough.

You can't have any arguments.

The drivers know where they stand.

The team, the team managers, teams know where they stand.

The fans know where these rules stand.

It's when it's, it's when it's ad hoc.

It's like, yeah, well, OK, we'll penalise him.

We won't penalise him.

That's that's when it's not fair.

And I get why it happens.

I get why there's inconsistencies because you do have that.

You don't have the same steward at every meeting.

The same is not the same group of stewards.

But yeah, it's very frustrating and I can totally see where John is coming from when he's like, I mean, he gets quite vociferous.

He could, he called it stupid.

He called the organiser stupid.

So it's not like John.

I know.

But yeah, no, he totally had a point.

And what you've got to remember is that the, the, the, the championship, the way the championship was organised at that time, if you were at the back, if you were out in race one, you're at the back for race 2.

So it not only ruins you, you one race, it ruins your whole weekend.

And unlike now where you've got a race three with a reverse grid to aim for, you think I can get to 12 or whatever?

And see, see where I fall up on the on the reverse grid.

That was it.

Your second race, you're starting from the back again.

And that was it.

So I did feel for John.

I've not really thought about it in the terms of the context of the championship, but it very much affected John's championship chances.

If he didn't get black and orange flags, he would have finished in the points.

He would have been higher up in race to.

Do you see where this goes?

It's just, yeah, it's, it's frustrating, but it's, it's not just in motorsport, it's the same in football with penalty contentious decisions on fouls.

They still suffer with an F1 now so.

You know, I was going to say 33 years later, the.

Same thing happened this weekend exactly.

That really.

Yeah.

Is it consistent?

Is it fair?

Exactly.

We've just had a Mexican Grand Prix Where you know, not to go off track too much, but a bit like Charles Leclerc really, where he went off track and I thought that was a penalty and it wasn't.

And then a couple of laps later Hamilton does something similar and gets a 10 second penalty.

It's all all people want is consistency.

Yes.

All this attrition left Colin McRae to score a point on his BTCC debut in 8th place and despite all the drama there was still more to come as the second race was even more chaotic than the first.

There were a lot of unhappy people in the pits as they prepared for the second race.

John Cleland was as Anthony Reed would describe hopping mad whilst the Curia, Cost boys and Patrick Watts all discovered that as non finishes in the first race that meant they would have to start race 2 from the pit lane.

At the start was all action.

Alan got away well as did Sopa who ran side by side with Harvey through Duffer's and McIntyre.

As these two slowed each other rounds jumped both to be second out of Clark.

It all mattered little however because at the back Leslie had hit the tyre wall at the bottom of Duffers and rolled bringing out the red flag.

David was one of those who had joined from the pits without a warm up lap.

I was taking it easy knowing the tyres were cold, felt there was something wrong coming out.

The right-hander turned left and nothing happened.

Alex That's probably the dangers of racing on cold tyres rearing its head there, isn't it?

Yes, yeah, undoubtedly.

Cold tyres, Very, very tricky conditions.

Yeah.

He, he, he was already angry as well, so you'd have been riled up.

Yeah, it was a recipe for disaster almost.

And yeah, it meant that David's.

It's a shame, isn't it?

Because as we've sort of said throughout tonight's episode of today's episode, the curio costs were really doing things with a Vauxhall that let's not forget, these are year old Vauxhalls.

Yeah.

So David has gone from being on pole position in race one to having all that chaos in the first race and then ending on his roof at the end of the first lap in race 2.

It's a, it's a real what if because those cars were really quick and it's a shame that and, and David's really quick.

So it's a shame that that his race ended the way he did.

It took some time for Leslie's car to be retrieved and for the tyre barrier to be repaired and as the countdown sequence began a rain cloud approached.

The track was already damp as they started the Walmart lap and as they returned to the grid the start delayed board was displayed.

This time the first race retirees were allowed to do the Walmart lap and then re enter the race.

By the time the race was restarted the Scottish weather was doing it's worst and the heavens had opened.

The pit starters joined the Walmart lap and formed up on the grid.

At the green.

Harvey got a perfect start to lead, I took it away almost like a road car and it worked perfectly, said Tim after the race.

Alan tried a similar approach but his engine bogged down and it was Belm who was second into Duffus.

Greg, looking back, this is probably one of the worst conditions the championship raced in during this era, wasn't it?

Yeah, absolutely.

I think there's a there's a few that were on similar level, but yeah, this was pretty bad.

Obviously the Donnington 1993 European Grand Prix support race was pretty bad as well.

We've already discussed that one in the previous episode.

And then there was also the round at Silverstone that actually got abandoned in the end because of a like a monsoon that hit the circuit.

And this is the one where Frank Sittner thought it'd won because he was leading.

He started the race on on wet tyres and yeah, I think John Cleland was then declared the winner, but then it hadn't made enough distance.

But that was also pretty horrific.

But yeah, Nokia was was up there with one of the worst ones off I've been in and yeah, there was nowhere to shelter at.

Nokia was, I said, very few grandstands.

So I seem to remember we got a good good soaking like the cars did as well.

On lap 2, Super moved up to 3rd at the expense of his teammate.

I thought I'd better let him free, Belm said after the race.

Belm's race then continued to go backwards as Rouse moved past, while Super, moving across to defend his line from Rouse into Taylor's, found quite a large puddle.

He had complained off and rejoined at the tail of the field.

This meant Rouse was up to third.

Meanwhile, it was John Cleland who was the man on the move.

I was so angry after that first race, he said.

But I thought, I've got nothing to lose, I'll just go for it and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Will Hoy's miserable weekend fizzled out with terminal clutch slip.

My back will be back and so will I, he claimed.

Matt Neil was another star of the show, running as high as 4th until clowning got by.

He then came under increasing pressure from McRae, who was far away at home in these conditions.

The Scott spent almost the first half of the race trying to get past until he turned nil around at the exit of the final corner on lap 9.

Over the course of a lap I was definitely faster than him, so I was determined to find a way past, McCray told Motorsport magazine in 2006 when looking back at this meeting.

Then at the hairpin he seemed to break harder than usual and there was absolutely nowhere for me to go.

I couldn't help giving an attack.

I kept going and he didn't.

I thought that's what touring cars are all about.

Anyway, this is a fairly controversial 1 gents.

What are your views on it?

How?

I'll let you go first.

I mean, it's a proper show, isn't it?

It really is.

There's no, there's no two ways about it.

He shoves him and then doesn't back off.

And of course Matt's Matt's in a rear wheel drive car and he just keeps driving at him and the pendulum swings and Matt just ends up in the the the most boggy sodden ground that you could and he's never going to get out of there.

I feel really sorry for Matt because as you mentioned, just just at the start of this, of this section that he was up in 4th at one point in, in the old M3.

And yeah, he, he was, he was doing really, really well.

And for, for Mccree to come along and just just do that.

I just, I don't know, slightly disrespectful maybe.

I'm not sure the, the dismissive nature of the, I thought that's what Touring Cars is about anyway.

It's such a shame it ended in that way because because obviously Colin was doing well to be running as high as he was.

I mean, the conditions were ideal for him, I guess.

You know, it's, it suited him to a tee, these sorts of slippery conditions.

But yeah, a shame for, for, for Matt.

And yeah, I don't think I'd want to be on the end of Steve Neal's chat talking about anyone else.

I'm not sure about that.

Yeah.

I think just back in a while said I think it was a really naughty move, shove a tap.

I think that's going to look not really far enough.

It was a proper just push you out the way and then snow plough you and get get you gone.

I I think the irony of the whole thing, if you remember at the penultimate round of the championship, Matt had a big crash in his M3 and wrote it off and he turned up at the last round of the championship in a white 318IS coupe.

I don't track all the history of the chassis, but that was the third pro drive car that Colin drove.

And I'm pretty sure that the car that back then finished the championship in was more like most likely to be the car that he got shoved off and not killed by by Colin McRae.

So is that always a bit of an irony car that knocked him off the became his saviour because if he didn't get that car he had nothing to race at the last round?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The incident saw Neil retire from the race whilst McRae was disqualified having crossed the finishing line in an impressive fifth position before the stewards naturally had quite a stern word with him.

One thing I'd like to wonder, I'd like I do wonder, and this is only ever since Matt told us this, is that what licence did he get his points on?

Yes, exactly.

At the front, Holly kept a small gap to Alum unsure until they got among the back markers and the Cavaliers lights came on just exactly where Jeff was.

Alum settled for second.

I was much quicker than him through the chicane and Clark explained Jeff, but I just couldn't see anything there.

Meanwhile 3rd place had wonders for Clemens morale and also his temper whilst rousing Forth felt that the Vauxhall slightly different Yokohama wets worked better than his.

Mcrae's exclusion gave an ecstatic Patrick Watts his best result of the season and 5th.

But there was still more McRae drama to come.

Rimstone Racing team was Steve Neil wanted to have his own chapter Colin so that he could find McRae, RIP his head off and shit down his neck.

I can imagine Steve saying that as well, can't you?

McRae remembered Matt was none too pleased, but Steve was definitely the spokesman.

The quickest I went all weekend was probably that run back to the motorhome after the race.

Alex, Steve Nils.

Not exactly somebody you want to cut off the wrong side of.

No, no, no, he's quite.

I don't know if how many of our listeners had ever met Steve or, or stood next to him, for example, but he was a big bloke and very, very, yeah, he just had a an aura around him that was quite menacing.

Yeah, I can definitely imagine Steve not being very happy and wanting to have a little chat with Colin.

And I'm never sure, I don't know, ever.

I'm never sure whether to be surprised or not about Colin's reaction, because I always thought Colin would be the sort of blase.

I don't care.

You can say what he wants to me.

But you know from what?

From, from, from that interview there where Colin gave to I think, Motorsport magazine, we got the quotes from in 2006.

Yeah, he clearly was quite scared.

But yeah, he didn't want to run into Steve, let's put it that way.

And I can imagine Steve being because that would have been rim stock racing's best result of the season by some stretch.

You know, we talk about privateers and best finishing positions.

It wouldn't have been until 1995 where Charlie Cox finished fifth at Brands Hatch, where a privately A finish as high as fifth again.

So, yeah, so.

So that would have been some result for for Steve, Matt and rim stock.

So I get why he wasn't very happy.

Yeah.

I always remember being slightly surprised about Colin's reaction and possibly expecting him to be a bit more blasey about it.

Not Kills BTCC debut was one to be remembered with the legendary Colin McRae causing all sorts of drama in his one off BTCC appearance.

I'd like Frank Greg Denton for joining us once again to look back at this race and hope we'll see you on Stories From Super Touring again very soon.

Greg.

Again, I thank you again for inviting me.

And it's that it's always great reminiscing on the on these classic races from the history of the touring car championships.

And yeah, hopefully we can do another episode in the future.

Sure we will, Greg.

I'm sure we will.

Oh, thanks as ever, go to you guys to listening to the show and if you enjoyed today's episode, please make sure to give us a review five star rating and subscribe to the podcast feed on your podcast type of choice.

In the mean time, we will see you next week.

Goodbye.