Welcome to episode 412 of the Microsoft Cloud IT Pro podcast recorded live on 10/03/2025.

This is a show about Microsoft three sixty five and Azure from the perspective of IT pros and end users, where we discuss a topic or recent news and how it relates to you.

Microsoft Sentinel gets its own data lake, graph, and MCP server, and we have all the details.

Whether you're a seasoned SOC analyst or just getting started with cloud security, you don't want to miss the powerful new ways to detect threats, investigate incidents, and understand your security posture that these new features offer.

I have a problem, Scott.

Is that the first thing to having a problem is admitting you have a problem?

It's part of the steps.

Yeah.

Oh, weird.

Now Teams is kinda doing it for me, but I only see it in Teams, like, with your video.

Microsoft is gonna Microsoft.

No.

I squirrel yeah.

Squirrel.

Logitech MX Master four came out the other day, and I may have bought two, like, the day it came out for same day delivery on Amazon.

I have a problem.

I needed one for my desk and one for when I'm not at my desk.

Okay.

So you're gonna be living that haptic mouse lifestyle, I'm looking at my mouse as I talk about it.

The haptic to me is like, whatever.

I like the way they move the button though because I had the Logitech MX Master three s two, and they had, like, the thumb button that was like under your thumb knuckle, and that was just a weird motion for me to push down on the thumb knuckle.

They kinda moved it up so you can now push in with your thumb to get that button, which is kinda nice.

But I'm still it feels different than the three s, and I've seen some other comments about this.

I don't know if it's a little bit thinner or if it's not the rubbery.

But do you when you use a mouse, do you, like, squeeze it and pick it up sometimes and move it around on your desk because you run into your keyboard or run into something else on your desk.

All the time.

I couldn't tell you why.

That feels different on this mouse, and it's, like, not as comfortable different.

Like, it's a little bit harder for me to grab and pick up, and I couldn't tell you exactly why.

I'd have to, like, get them and put them side by side.

But I've seen some other people make some similar comments about it.

I've got a three an MX Master three and a three s, and because same thing.

Like, hey, like day mouse, night mouse, or you need one in your backpack when you travel, things like that.

I don't like how the rubber always, like, gives way on them, and they are actually kind of big.

So I think what I'm gonna do is rather than go into the MX4, I'm gonna go to maybe one of, like, the gaming mice, like a high DPI gaming mouse, and so so Logitech has some of those as well.

And then my honestly, my biggest nit about the MX Master in general is, like, it's got, like, great ergonomics with this, like, slant on the front of it.

But the slant for the right button, it slides right underneath the charging mat for my Ember Mug.

So, like, if I'm sliding my hand up because I'm gonna go grab my coffee and then but then I've got my mouse there too, and I'm just gonna, like, park my mouse up there, It gets all the way up, and it goes underneath, like, the little charging like, the charging pad for the ember mug kinda thing.

And then it gets stuck there or it just clicks, and every single time.

So I need a mouse that's, like, a little bit taller or where both the buttons are shorter, and then I can just I can live a different life.

First world problems when your mouse and your It's hard to be over here.

Yeah.

First world problems, for sure.

Your ember mug and your mouse are not compatible.

They're not.

Yeah.

So the one thing I like, I've tried other mice before.

I've played with different ones.

I haven't looked enough at the gaming mice.

Do any of the gaming mice have the horizontal scroll it's not real I guess it's a scroll wheel, the horizontal scroll wheel thing on them.

Some do.

So I've mostly looked at, like, the not I'm not talking all about, like, a Razer gaming mouse, but Logitech makes, like, a G series.

So if you go look at, like, the G series, they have the same thing with the infinite scroll and all they have a lot of similarities to the MX masters just without the ergonomics slash productivity thing.

And then I guess one other question for you before we move on.

So Logitech makes absolutely horrible software.

Like their software is the worst in Logi options and things like that.

My understanding was for the MX4 and what I saw in the reviews was for that haptic trackpad with the little, like, pioneer ish circle that that that comes up, that requires Logi options.

And I don't think I'm willing to reinstall Logi options on my Mac.

Like, I've ripped it off so many times and just don't use it.

See, I've always had it on because I use it for, like, my spotlight presenter and, yeah, I've just resigned myself to the fact that I need it on there.

So but that is I've seen the same thing, and I've had Logi options, so I haven't tried it without it.

But given how it works, it feels like it would not work without the software.

But the rubber thing that you said, that's the other thing that people have not liked.

Well, mixed reviews on it is that this one, they took away a lot of the rubber.

It's much more hard plastic than rubber on the four.

That's good though.

Like, because the rubber the other thing is, like, if you I mean, if you just Mine looks Yeah.

It's pretty bad.

Like, I'd be willing to throw them out just based on the and you can't really clean them either.

Like, they start to, like, eat away and disintegrate, and, yeah, they're just not Doctor.

Because it's rubber.

Like Doctor.

Not Doctor.

Whatever you'd use to clean it would disintegrate the rubber, make it worse, and yeah.

So it is much more hard plastic with the four.

But it again, because of that, I'm so used to the rubber on the three s.

It does it just feels different, and that might even be part of the grip thing as it just isn't as sticky.

I don't know.

I don't know if you want your mouse to be sticky or if that's just gross if you have a sticky mouse.

Not the way that you said sticky the first time, but, you you know.

Yeah.

Okay.

New mice are out there.

So if anybody has a suggestion for Scott on a mouse that is not the MX Master four or the MX Master three or the three s, but, you you know, maybe something to move on to next.

The other one I've been toying with, and not that I have it, I haven't had RSI for a long time, but thankfully, but I was thinking about, like, maybe going back to a vertical mouse for a little bit and trying some of that.

Doesn't Keychron I feel like Keychron did Keychron make, like, an knockoff MX Master?

They made something.

Yeah.

It's not that one.

Yeah.

They have some I haven't tried theirs.

This one, like, the Keychron m six wireless totally looks like a knockoff of the MX Master.

Yeah.

They've got some.

Anyways, yes.

Give Scott a suggestion.

Reach out to Scott on LinkedIn.

Let him know which mouse he should get, and we can talk about it.

Alright.

News.

Your news, my news, all the news.

We have, like I wouldn't say a bunch of news.

There were I wasn't sure what I was gonna talk about, and then yesterday, there were a bunch of announcements around a certain topic that I was like, oh, this is fun.

But then you had some too.

What do you wanna talk about first?

We start wherever you would like.

You want to start on the Azure side or the M365 side?

Or I guess kind of both, right?

So you had some Sentinel stuff in there, but Yeah.

Mine is more like crossover.

It's all Sentinel stuff, which could be either or.

Why don't we start with some Sentinel stuff and see where it takes us?

The first one, this is one let me go up to here.

Sentinel Data Lake.

Have you seen how you can start, like, just turning on Sentinel now to go into Data Lake?

This was in preview for the last couple months or so.

Lots of services are starting to do this, right?

They're taking their kinda their more formal structured data and then giving you the opportunity to, like, either export that structured data.

So, like, maybe Yep.

Like if Sentinel is being driven by a graph and a bunch of parquet files, things like that, or a Delta Lake, Delta Table in the background.

Why not just let you push those artifacts over someplace else or also start to do, like, more granular exports and all sorts of good stuff like that?

Like, got a storage account?

Export.

Here you go.

I've had it in preview for a little bit, and I'm like, for what I have done so far with Sentinel, it didn't make a big difference, but I ran it in preview.

Well, that is now GA'd.

So yesterday, Septem well, not yesterday.

This was September 30.

A few days ago, beginning of the week, this Sentinel data lake is now generally available.

So if you want to go turn that on, like, it's just a click click through the security center.

So I don't think you can do this, and this ties back to one of our other announcements.

If you go to Sentinel via Azure, like, if you go to Azure and search for Sentinel, I haven't seen this pop up there.

But if you go to your security center in or Defender, I guess, security.microsoft.com, where Sentinel's gonna live down the road all the time anyways, you can go connect Sentinel there.

And then once Sentinel's connected there, you get the option to go turn on data lake for Sentinel, and you still have to pick, like you're gonna still pay for it.

You pick an Azure subscription, you pick a resource group, and click, and it goes and creates the data lake and wires it all up and connects it all.

And based on what I've seen in Sentinel so far too, it isn't necessarily pushing it all over.

Like, if I go look through Sentinel now, I have two different icons for some of my data tables in Sentinel, ones that are still in the typical log analytics and then a bunch of them that are now in Data Lake.

Yeah.

I think it'll be good.

Certainly, there's there's there's that pesky cost component, right, of of being in the cloud and running those things through.

So there's things that I think customers would want to do with longer term trends based on some of these things.

So maybe like anomalous user logins over time is really nice for the past couple days, it's nice for the past month, it could be nice to go back six months or a year.

Maybe you wanna track some kind of like a KPI for yourself to improve your business or make sure that you're moving in the right direction.

So for these systems, things like Sentinel that are generating a large amount of what's really just time series driven data.

So here's a time, here's an event, and I'm sure the text of the event strippers, but to be able to go back in time over those things is important.

And then it's also expensive to generate a bunch of time series data and have it just sitting there, especially in, like, some kind of, like, really hot, like, queryable thing.

So Sentinel in the background, when you're writing, like, your queries, they're all KQL queries.

Like, you don't have to go too high too far to imagine that, oh, it's just Azure Data Explorer in the back end, right, with with all that.

So so you're dealing with those constraints and those things there.

So it's nice to have the option to export it out, but then be able to continue to query it and do those things that you need to do, albeit with additional latency and things like that.

But I think that's all good stuff.

Gives customers more options and allows you also to do things like have these kinda longer term initiatives that you can actually track over time without having to, like, oh, no.

I gotta export all the data for this month, right?

Lay it in a spreadsheet, and if I don't do it next month or I do it on a different day, then it's inconsistent, things like that.

That all goes away.

Yeah.

And there's some other updates that have come along with this.

The whole article's there around different use cases for it, but some upgrades and benefits too when it comes to some of those enhancements around your notebooks in Sentinel.

Yeah.

Like you said, some cost benefits there to going into Data Lake.

But then they also and this is what really caught my eye.

Like, I was like, okay.

Great.

It went GA.

But if you look on the GA announcement, it also you'll notice on the screen, and it talks about it in the announcement, they're also introducing some new platform capabilities built on Sentinel data lake.

So once you get your data there, you're starting to do it, there is now a Sentinel graph.

And we can talk about this.

I've played with this a little bit.

But then, also, an MCP server for Sentinel that's like a Microsoft native one.

So we had talked about MCP servers a few episodes back, like the loca that Merrill had created.

I think I mentioned I had gone out and found, like, a third party Sentinel one because I was like, oh, a Sentinel MCP server would be kinda cool.

And we talked about some of the security concerns, and, ironically, like, a week ago, I sent you an article as well from the first malicious MCP server found where it was stealing emails and rogue rogue postmark settings, and we kinda talked about that.

Right?

Like, you go grab a third party MCP server without looking at the code.

What is it doing?

Obviously, something like Sentinel you wanna trust.

So seeing Microsoft come out with this MCP server as well, that was all kind of rolled into Data Lakes, GA.

Now you can go look at this graph in this MCP server as well if you wanna go swing over to Sentinel Data Lake.

I wonder over time, I don't know if I think things will continue to like kind of churn and consolidate still.

So we've seen a bunch of this at least with the things like the Kusto MCP server.

Like, there was a Kusto one, and then it got rolled into the Fabric one.

Fabric one's out there.

Now you have a a Sentinel one.

You have all these different, like, flavors and variations as folks are chasing things.

Like, I do wonder or and I also kinda hope over time that it does consolidate a little bit.

I I I don't know how it's getting for you since we did that MCP episode.

I just have more and more MCP servers that are, like, going in.

And for every MCP server that's being added into my client that I'm working in that day, like Versus Code, things like that, it's also getting really hard to wrangle the servers, especially the ones that have lots of tools associated with them.

So I think the Azure MCP server is actually a good example of this because it's got, like, tools for a whole bunch of different Azure services.

And I think at one point, it had, like, 40 plus tools in it.

So you're sitting here trying to figure out, like, okay.

I'm having a chat with this LLM.

I wanted to form out some knowledge to this MCP or this set of MCPs.

But I now I need to be, like, really constrained and figure out how to get it into e even the right tool or the right space.

So stuff like this is gonna I wonder, like, do you find it confusing in this world of saying, like, hey.

I have an MCP for Sentinel, which is doing this graph thing.

I have an MCP for the Microsoft Graph.

I have an MCP for LearnDocs.

I have an MCP for Kusto, like, all these different thing or Fabric.

Right.

Are are you finding that hard to rationalize along the way?

Like, I've started like, I was just going in and, like, turning on all my MCP servers, like, every time I started Versus Code, and now I'm actually being, like, more careful about that.

Like, alright.

Always gonna start, like, the learn docs one because that's easy.

It's a remote server.

Boom, boom, out Yeah.

Out.

No problem.

But some of the other ones, like, you really do have to kinda pick and choose.

But then it makes me wonder, alright.

Great.

I had to do that just to make my own life easier, but now what am I missing out on by not turning them all out?

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Some of that the other thing I've seen and I just ran into this the other day when I started playing with this MCP server, and we can go talk about this a little bit more.

And how to turn this one on, because this was interesting, is I added this one and I went to go ask a query about Sentinel, and it hit my loca MCP server because I didn't at mention the specific MCP server.

So there's that trade off to, like, what you said is, one, if you don't turn them all on, what are you missing?

Or if you do turn them all on, as you ask AI questions, does it end up going to the wrong MCP server when you want it?

Like, does it go to Graph when you want it to go pull from Sentinel?

Or maybe it was just me.

I had to be a little bit more specific in my query, but there's it is.

One of them is just, how do I make sure I'm going to the right right MCP server at the right time?

How am I not missing out on it?

Absolutely an additional cognitive load there, I think, around MCP servers.

And the other one I found, and this was the first time I've kinda hit this one, is when you go look at this MCP server for Sentinel, they only give you steps on how to leverage this one with Visual Studio Code.

And this is a remote MCP server.

It's sentinel.microsoft.com/mcpdataexploration.

And I tried to go add this one to Claude, and I couldn't figure out a way to do it because it uses some it appears that it uses some of the underlying authentication mechanisms in Visual Studio Code.

Like, if I go add this to Claude and try to query it, I don't get the prompts.

Like, there's no way to, like, set up a authentication mechanism to it, no way to set up a service principle to it, nowhere to say, like, go enter a username that I could find or trigger in Claude.

But when you go add it to Visual Studio Code and the first time you add it, it's like, oh, go log in to your Microsoft three sixty five tenant with your account.

And I think there's some things going on there where I couldn't actually add this to anything but Visual Studio Code.

And then obviously you have to have GitHub Copilot in order to use it versus using another LLM that I have.

It's hard.

Like there's niceties to being in these systems that do require, like, authentication authorization, like, just to be able to do, like, the quick, like, fire and forget to enter, do your sign in, oauth and to end all the way.

So typically in, like, at least the way it works in, like, the SDKs for Azure and things like that is there there's a class in the identity SDK that composes an object, and it's called default Azure credential.

And it's just this magical thing where, like, you you put, I wanna use default Azure credential to sign in, and then it just kinda figures out based on the client it's on.

Like, you so you can write, like, an application, say, with, like, the dot net SDK for Azure for any Azure service, and say, I wanna use default Azure credential.

You put throw compile it as an executable, throw that executable on an Azure VM, and it will, like, automatically know that, hey, I'm on a VM in Azure, and I should try MSI authentication, and try and come through that way.

Oh, MSI failed.

Okay.

Let me pop up a user prompt and come through.

So sometimes it's the way, like, developers are building them, Randall.

Like, so if they use something like default Azure credential, then it's got, like, that weird underlying behavior, which has a bunch of niceties to it, but you kinda gotta, like, know how the niceties work and how to land your app in the right place.

So I wonder if it's some of that kind of stuff over just being, like, it's not, like, malicious intent to lock you out.

It's like, hey.

There's this ecosystem of stuff, and the people building the stuff also kinda leverage the same ecosystem.

So while you're out there maybe saying, hey.

I'm an Azure customer.

Okay.

Hey.

We're all Azure customers.

I hope We're all out there building our services on top of these things as well and building these capabilities and all that out there.

So it could also be things like the clients are also in in various states.

So the Cloud desktop client is constantly iterating, as is, like, the desktop client for Perplexity, for Copilot, for ChargePD, all the all these things.

Right?

Like, every single day they get an update, they might just need to update to allow things like the pop ups for authentication and everything else that comes through there.

The other place this will integrate to is Security Copilot.

Like, they also mentioned that.

The Sentinel MCP server is gonna have native integration with Security Copilot, but I don't know about you.

I'd rather pay $20 a month for Copilot GitHub than $20,000 for Security Copilot.

Obviously, other benefits with Security Copilot, people that have it, you'd wanna have this in there.

But to me, this was I'm still kinda curious to see where Security Copilot goes because while there's other functionality in there, as these MCP servers continue to grow and you look at GraphMCP server and now you have the MCP server for Sentinel, if other third parties that you can integrate with I don't know.

Like, if you integrate other third parties with Sentinel and you can do an MCP server with Sentinel, you lose some of the built in functionality in different places of Security Copilot, but to me, this lessens the need for something like Security Copilot.

Maybe I'm not supposed to say that, but that's what I'm seeing.

Like I have less and less of a need for Security Copilot because of MCPs.

I think the world of the iGentik stuff, it's going to continue to morph and continue to change.

It's one of those places where I don't even know that service providers, like none of us know where it's going to end up, basically.

So everybody's racing to create these kinds of experiences, but they're going to continue to change over time.

Like, this whole local versus remote MCP server, that's not fully baked, and that's not a done deal as to the way that composes.

But I do think it offers, integrates over there is just add a tool.

Right?

Like, you're not adding an MCP server.

You're adding a tool.

What's it using in the background?

The MCP server.

So now we're starting to equate local MCP server with tools and resources and all the things in them.

That same kind of nomenclature and architecture is coming to these cloud based and SaaS based things as well.

I think you'll see more and more of this, like this mix of remote MCP and then some other piece of functionality in a part of the service itself or in, like, a parallel service.

Oh, like, great.

Now I can use that too and come across.

What'll be interesting to see is, like, a year from now, is, like, MCP server is even a thing, or did we all settle on just exposing, like, the tools through, like, some other endpoint mechanism or things like that?

Like, I don't know.

TBD.

We'll see where it all ends up.

It'll be interesting.

Shall be weird for a while.

It's kinda like a fun ride though if you're a technologist.

Oh, absolutely.

So and then the third should we dive into the third one?

The Sentinel Graph.

This was kind of a cool one, and this is also in public preview now where now within Sentinel, we've always been able to do KQL queries, right, where you can go in and query stuff and get your results however you query it.

And you could go look at incidents and kind of within different incidents, you're able to see connections between different events and different devices and all of that.

What this does is it allows you to go do a, essentially, a graph based query against your Sentinel data.

So instead of, like, waiting for an incident to occur and then seeing all the connections for the incident or instead of just writing a KQL query and getting data back, you can go in and this I'm trying to think if there's a screenshot in here where you can this is probably a decent one that I have on my screen.

But for people listening, I could go in and it's preview, so it was somewhat limited, but I could say, like, show me this device, and I just picked two devices.

You can pick two different entities.

But I picked my laptop and I picked my desktop, and I said, show me the relationship between them, and it essentially created a graph with all the different ways these two devices were linked together, whether it was through users or linked together.

I think it showed, like, my user account was one link.

I think it maybe showed, like, Intune as another link between them or other services.

So it was gave me, I would say, more of a proactive way to say, okay.

So if this device was compromised, what are all the ways it could be linked to this other device, or what are all the ways my user is linked to different entities?

And instead of giving me tabular data, it gave me a graph, a view of connections between different things in my tenant.

If I was reading between the lines on this one, because we're back to the whole, like, KQL thing and what's it used under the hood, what's a capability that recently came to Azure Data Explorer and to Kusto?

Well, a capability that recently came to Kusto is the ability to execute queries with graph models.

So taking database objects that represent your property graph and that are stored in Data Explorer and then being able to bounce those against each other.

So if you can do it in KQL and you can get at it, you might be able to do some even more interesting things with it along the way.

And if you're into it, I'd recommend going and reading the Kusto documentation for graph models and seeing kinda if you can wrap your head around a little bit.

How do I run that?

They have some good, like, work working examples and things in there.

So but absolutely.

So so KQL now has this it has a a graph, right?

So much like you'd have like a database or table name kind of thing.

You have a graph out there, so there's an object for graphs, and then you and you know how you have like where clauses and summarizes and and things like that.

There's also now a graph match, and so it's basically graph match, what's the pattern you input where these filters are true, and then output these fields based on the graph and how it comes together.

The syntax is really weird and kinda wild.

Like, it is not like other KQL syntax at all, when you especially when you're doing, like, the filtering and things like that, but it works pretty well.

I've been playing around with it for some other stuff.

I wonder if this is even using and this might be kinda what even you're getting at it.

If this is using that under the covers, if this is a little bit more of a UI interface, and then behind the scenes, it's creating those KQL graph type of queries.

It'd be an easy thing to do or a smart thing to do if the underline if the underlying database engine provides for it, why not?

Yeah.

Lots of improvements around Sentinel and different things you can do, especially with the data lake integration going GA.

They layered all of these on top of it.

So all of this does depend on you having Sentinel and Defender, making that connection between your workspace and Defender, and then enabling the graph, and then you'll be able to go light this stuff up.

And I've seen some things.

I'm in a few security groups where people weren't getting it necessarily right away.

It might take some time in preview, trickling out.

Yep.

SaaS rollouts, all that good stuff.

Yeah.

All that stuff.

So no.

These were some fun announcements in the last week or so that came out that I've started playing with.

The nice thing about those data lakes too is like you mentioned, you're provisioning those within your own infrastructure.

So, you know, it's your Azure subscription, your resource group, so you still get the choice over, like, where does that data lake reside?

So if you have, like, data residency requirements, anything like that, you could spin that up.

You can also choose your redundancy, every everything like that that you might wanna do.

So it's nice to have kinda that level of control too, but just watch out because it is a PAYGo component.

So it is kinda sitting out there now churning month over month or however long you turn it on for.

Yep.

And then I think Data Lake too, you'd get charged based on queries and how much you use it and yeah.

All those same things apply.

This is not a free data lake with your Azure subscription.

It's a PAYGo data lake that they automatically connect up and ingest all the data and do that for you.

Yeah.

Compute still costs money.

Yes.

Alright.

We've spent, like, a bunch of time on mine.

Do you want to talk about yours anymore today, or should we save those for round two?

Let's save a we'll do an I'm just going to talk about some Kubernetes stuff, so we'll do a kind of AKS ish day coming up in the future here.

Sounds good.

AKS ish.

Yeah.

There we go.

AKS ish.

Yeah.

All that said, if you're gonna be at any conf I Scott, I have a few conferences coming up.

I'm still trying to get you to one.

I'm down at Dev Intersections, Cybersecurity Intersections, which they added next week.

So if you're down in Orlando at that one, October, like, six through ten or something.

And then I did get accepted to go help Proctor Labs again at Ignite.

So I'll be out at Oh, nice.

Yeah.

I'll be out at Ignite in November if anybody's going to be out there.

And then I think I mentioned that I'm doing cybersecurity or not wow.

Workplace Ninja is down in Dallas in December.

So we're still working on getting you out to Ignite.

We'll see, Scott.

We need to get you out there yet.

Yeah.

Well, for the other stuff, give me some links, and I'll put them in the show notes.

I will do that.

So links to all those conferences will be in the show notes.

Come find me and hopefully Scott at Ignite.

And if you have any feedback for Scott, don't forget, let Scott know what mouse you should get.

And any questions, comments, thoughts, future topics, future guests, we'd love to hear from people.

So reach out.

LinkedIn has turned into our social media platform of choice or we do still have the contact form on the website if you want to go there and fill that out as well.

All good stuff.

If you have complaints, only reach out to Ben though.

Yes.

My email address is scott@msclouditpropodcast.com.

Bring on the spam.

It's a good thing your spam filter is good.

It is.

Hopefully, it won't get spam too much out of that.

Alright.

With that, Scott, go enjoy your weekend.

Thanks, Ben.

It's getting nice in Florida.

Go enjoy some time outside.

It's not It is.

Stupid hot anymore.

Although, it's we're under, marine watch tomorrow.

So a small craft device here tomorrow, so can't go out on the boat.

Oh, so enjoy time outdoors not on the boat.

Go fly a kite on the beach.

Marine advisory means wind for a kite.

Right?

It's getting windy already.

Yeah.

Well, thanks, Scott.

Enjoy your weekend.

We'll talk to you next time.

You too.

Thanks, Ben.

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