You're listening to a mom and mea podcast.

Well, here we are, and we're wearing the same thing again again.

I don't know how we're doing this.

Last week we looked like Siamese twins in our matching blue shirts, and this week we're all silky in our burgundy.

I think we're just on trend, you know.

I think we're h Hello, I'm here as well.

Yeah, just individual and cool mons.

It's fine.

I miss the memo.

Welcome to Parenting Out Loud.

This is the podcast for people who don't listen to parenting podcasts.

If you're wearing a silky skirt today, well done you.

We bring you the news, the culture, We bring you what parents are thinking about.

I'm on Eat Bowley, I'm Amelia Last and I'm Stacy Higgs.

We are perilously close to Black Friday.

I feel it.

I feel it in my bones.

I hate I hate saying this because it's just like, oh, buy more stuff, but it's everywhere I look.

And so Stacey has a recommendation at the end of the show that she reckons is the purchase of the year.

I have a lot of questions.

But before we get to that, what are we talking about today.

So Kira Knightley made me cry talking about something that is such a specific torture of being a parent, and I want to tell you all about it.

Look, school group chats are heating up.

We're getting towards the end of the year.

There's a lot of events happening, a lot of communication buzzing back and forth.

As the class parent for my sorry, yes, I am the class parent.

What is what type be among us?

Is the class parent?

This is the class This is a common misconception.

You can be type B and also bossy.

That's a common misconception about us.

Type B's okay on that telling other people what to do.

I've got some grand rules to that age about how to behave decorously and appropriately in the group school chat.

And I can already tell from Mont's face that she hates it.

You cannot be the CEO of the group chess.

It is what it is.

I want to talk about Melbourne Cup.

It's the race that stops the nation, but this week it's stopped a daycare center, and I.

Just wanted to talk four year old.

Yeah, four year olds betting on horses.

Is it harmless fun or is it actually kind of quite problematic.

The first What have we seen online this week?

Stacy?

So first up this week, My favorite story of the week is that Glamor named their Woman of the Year.

And if I could have voted for this person, I would have it is Miss Rachel.

This stopped me in.

My tracks because Miss Rachel is very much beloved, but she's been in the news a lot lately because she's been speaking up about the plight of children in Gaza.

Yeah, so she's become a political figure as well.

She has, like she could have been content with just selling merch.

Like, if you're not familiar with Miss Rachel, she is YouTube sensation.

She started recording her videos.

I didn't realize it was only six years ago that she started.

She just set up a tripod at home, started recording herself because her son was experiencing a speech delay, so she was doing videos help with his education.

And then from there she just exploded and now it's on Netflix.

But as you say, she's gone so far beyond that, Like she uses her platform now to help speak for children around the world.

And at the award ceremony, she wore this beautiful gown that was embroidered with drawings from Palestinian children that she'd asked to kind of share their tales.

There's footage of her.

It's so beautiful.

She names every child by name, talks about the drawings on her dress.

I just love her so much.

She's such a legend.

I saw something this week that sucks and I hate it.

Remember passing notes in class?

Yeah, that's probably the first and only time I like broke the rule.

Yeah, like, do you like Stacy?

Yes or no?

Obviously the ads it would be.

Yeah, Well, jen Z have hacked it and they've ruined it because of widespread school phonemn's.

The kids have gotten crafting.

The kids have found a workaround.

They are now communicating on Google docs.

So they open a shared dock and they type in white font so the teacher can't see it.

So it's insults, it's gossip, it's whatever.

So it's clever.

But I hate this because, like back in our day, sending a note was very slow and deliberate, so the stakes were higher, right, because it was a physical thing, like you had to write it, you had to pass it, you had to wait for the moment that they'd see it, you had to sort of own it.

And then there was evidence, like someone could keep it.

This Google Docs is just horseshit.

It's fast, like there's no thought, there's no paper trail, there's no pausing.

I think it's gutlass.

And also you can't draw a dick on Google Docs.

So true.

This is like their version of invisible ink.

Did you ever have that when you're like seven or eight and you thought it was so cool?

Except your right One's the beauty of passing notes is the risk.

It's the thrill that you might get caught.

You've got it in your hand, you can't make it evaporate, but on Google Docs you can, and I hate that for them.

There's something really wrong about breaking the rules when you have to invite someone to collaborate.

Yes, so true.

Okay, what I have brought to the table this week is a useful piece of information.

So we talk all the time about how raising children is very expensive, but exactly how expensive is it?

And I was shocked to learn that the last sort of official stats on this come from seven years ago.

Now a lot has happened in that time, including cozilives.

Yeah, we didn't even have Cozi lives seven years ago.

We just had lives.

And now they've done the numbers.

The smart people have done the numbers.

Can I get a drum roll?

Please?

The answer to how much it costs to raise a child in Australia in twenty twenty five is three hundred thousand dollars over eighteen years, assuming that is that you make around the average after tax income of one hundred and thirty thousand dollars.

Reactions does this seem about right?

That feels cheap to me?

What?

Yeh, that feels cheap.

That's a lot of money.

Well, I will say that there are economies of scale here because it's about seventeen thousand dollars a year for the first child, and then if you have subsequent children, each of them is about thirteen thousand dollars a year.

So the message I take from this is it is economical to have more children.

The message I take from this is that that is so classic of a second and third child that they just cost you less.

You just careless.

It's not often that I find that I have something in common with celebrities.

Believe it or not, that's not true, Stacy, Stacy, you have Kate Middleton hair.

Actually true, true, I do have shiny hair.

Okay, I'll give you that, but that is all we have in common until now, when actress Kia Knightley spoke on a podcast and I had such a visceral reaction to what she said because I've actually never felt something so deeply.

This is her speaking on the Happy Mum, Happy Baby podcast.

I just remember reading articles at the time of being like, how important sleepers?

You must get your eight hours?

Fuck?

I would like to I am.

Trying talk to her, But that's another pressure, isn't it, All those things we're told that we should be.

My man, I feel this into my day.

How am I man to sleep?

When I got told who doesn't?

Who doesn't sleep?

And doesn't seem to find it a problem that she doesn't sleep but doesn't sleep.

It's such a particular form of crazy torture.

There's something so pervy about hearing someone who's normally sort of reciting Shakespeare or Jane Austen in those dulcet tones telling us that her child just doesn't sleep.

Yeah.

I love that so much.

Yeah.

I think she perfectly captured what I found the hardest about motherhood.

I'm sure a lot of people found the hardest as well.

Is just that torturous tiredness you feel in your bones, like where you're like, I did not know that I could feel like this, and you start to feel crazy.

And the second thing I loved she went on in that clip to talk about they come out the way they come out.

She's like, you either get a sleeper or you don't get a sleeper, and she talks about the comparison between her two children, and I think that's something that we're never told, Like we're told if you just give them a good sleep environment, then you know, you'll solve all the problems.

And that is not true.

Like my parents used to put me to sleep under a table in a restaurant and I was just fine, isn't true.

Yes, apparently that sounds apocryphy or they just, you know, wanted to socialize and I was not going to get in the way of that.

And I love that for them, but that would have not been the case for me.

I could not have done that.

And I loved that she said that because it felt like, of course, there's certain things you can do that may move the dial slightly, but ultimately it comes down to the temperament and it's just a bit of a shit time sometimes.

But why I really wanted to bring this to the table is that she talks about the effect that broken sleep or lack of sleep can have on you as a person for years, and I feel like that's never really spoken about beyond the first three months.

People start talking about, Oh, your baby sleeps more from four months and then it's kind of forgotten.

But it's not like brain fog.

It's like literal exhaustion, and experts basically equate even one night of broken sleep to be equivalent to being drunk.

So if that is the case, I am sitting here doing this podcast with you absolutely plastered and probably have been the entire time.

Yeah, I'm so drunk as well.

We are all plasted here.

I am so tired that a few months ago I went to the doctor and was like, what's wrong with me?

What's going on?

I am so bone tired?

And this is seven years down the track from having a baby.

Yeah.

What I liked about this Kier Nightly thing was you can hear like this shakiness in her voice.

That sort of desperation took me straight back there.

I think what's interesting is like society doesn't give a shit, like when you're in it it is so hard and tortuous, but to the outside world there's this kind of like feeling of, well, you chose this, so you kind of got to deal with it.

We talk a little bit on this podcast about how parenting and motherhood is quite individualistic.

Now there's no village.

Everything's kind of on us.

And sleep plays into this in the way that if you have a shit sleeper, the undercurrent is, well, it's your sort of problem to solve.

It's on you, it's your fault.

You chose this, and the internalized feeling is, well, I've got to sort this out.

Enter the baby sleep industrial complex.

I feel so strongly about this.

There is this moment when you're in new motherhood where you are so tired and no one prepares you for it, and you become so desperate that you will buy an eight hundred dollars e course just to get like, I would have paid any money to have had a full eight hours.

Yeah, one hundred percent.

And I think you get to that point where, like, as we say, it's equivalent to being drunk, you just feel like you can't see the wood from the trees, like you don't know what to do, and so you're like, Okay, well, I just need to pay someone to take the emotion out of it and tell me the step I need to take exactly to fix it.

It's interesting because when you raise this with us, Stacy, at first, I didn't fully want to talk about it, like I had a resistance to it.

And I realized it was because I have repressed the memories of those years that I spent walking around drunk.

Yeah, and not a Margarita's like.

I have repressed them just the same way that anecdotally people repress the pain of childbirth.

It was because it was so difficult and I had to sort of consciously try and retrieve those memories of that time, and then it all came floating back, you know, like the one hundred dollar PDFs that I was buying, which were never very helpful.

I followed this particular parenting guru called taking care of Babies.

I was sort of halfway through sleep training my second child based on one of her overpriced PDFs, and it turned out that she was actually this big Maga person, which sent me through the spiral of whether I should be taking sleep tips from a Maga acolyte.

But in terms of how we should be thinking about it as a society.

One thing really clicked for me in researching this, which is that some experts are starting to say we need to be treating parental sleep deprivation as a public health issue.

And that's because it has concrete, tangible implications.

It increases the risk of anxiety, increases the risk of depression.

It has very real knock on effects for women's ability to progress in the workforce if they choose to take on paid employment after they have children, even like.

Immune function, like everything is effected by it.

Yeah, and that's because those effects last well beyond the newborn stage.

So I did come across this is, first of all, a delightful fact in itself.

There is a journal called Sleep.

I love that it's just called sleep, And there was a German study in the journal called Sleep which found that women lose on average one hour of sleep when their baby is zero to three months old.

Men lose on average.

Thirteen minutes sleep when their baby is to three months old, and then the women keep losing.

Sleep until the child is four or five.

Every year, every night they're losing up to an hour of sleep until the age of four or five.

So we are talking a long term problem that is disproportionately affecting women.

Do you think it's gendered in the way that if this was happening to men in their prime working years, that there'd be a royal commission into it.

Yeah, probably, like I think there would be.

And as you say that those figures speak for themselves that men aren't affected as much as women are by the lack of sleep, and I think there really is a lack of sympathy or understanding to your point.

One's about this idea of well you chose to have children.

I'm thinking in particular of this very high profile case in Boston in the US last year where a woman was on trial.

It was a very tragic case.

She had killed some of her children while she was experiencing postpartum psychosis, and clinical psychologists were called to the trial to talk of the fact that when you experience sleep deprivation on the level that she was experiencing it, that can trigger or lead to postpartum psychosis, thereby proving this is very much a public health issue.

It is not just about.

Women complaining that they have to put a more concealer in the morning.

Yeah, I agree with you, Amelia but that is the cultural shrug.

The cultural shrug is, well, you chose it, you deal with it.

So what's the answer for us here, Like we just have to go on feeling exhausted forever.

I think that the first thing to realize about it is that there's no point diminishing it if you're going through it.

It came across a quote from a psychologist called doctor Nihara Kraus, and she says that what makes this sleep deprivation a particular form of torture for women is that we don't know when it's going to end.

She points out that as a society as a whole, we went through that during the pandemic.

We didn't know when the pandemic was going to end, and look at how it unhinged our entire society collectively.

But for women going through sleep deprivation, they keep thinking it might get better.

Every night becomes a source of dread.

Is tonight going to be the night that we turn the page?

And it's that feeling of the unknown and not knowing when it will improve that makes it so distinctly hard.

So I guess that's the first step to recognize that what you're going through is psychologically designed to torture you exactly.

So I love that Kira has done this.

I love that she has just put words around that and just been like, it is torture, it is hard.

Thank you, Kira.

Melbourne Cup was earlier this week and I came across something really interesting on Reddit that I want to bring to the table.

It was a parent who picked up their kid from daycare and the kid said, ah, today we got to pick a horse and watch the horse race.

This was in New South Wales, not even Victoria, where the race is held, and the educators at this particular daycare got the kids to pick horses, showed the race on TV, and then awarded them prizes.

Now, this person that posted this is an ex problem gambler, and they said, Hey, I'm not sure how to feel about this.

Maybe I'm being oversensitive because of my own problems, but I'm not sure it's entirely appropriate to introduce kids so young to the gambling industry.

And I went, I think you're right, did you?

Because I'm not sure.

I understand that the gambling industry is a huge problem in this country nationally, and I also understand that animal welfare advocates have particular problems with horse racing that are valid and which I co sign.

The thing that makes me hesitate is that we have so few events now to collectively come together to mark as a nation.

And I think it's fun and also character building for kids to feel part of like a bigger thing that's happening outside their daycare.

Yeah, I mean I can see how, like you know, it's helping them, probably with numbers and colors and winning and losing, but sodas like playing a game of twister, Like I don't know, Melbourne Cup needs to be the thing that we introduced to them when they're four years old.

That's crazy.

So was their response that they didn't want this to happen.

Obviously, they said how should I feel about this?

A lot of the comments were we did this in primary school.

I remember doing this.

It was completely normal and uncontroversial to teach six year olds how to pick a box trifecta and it's fucked like this is symbolic of how deeply embedded gambling is in our culture.

And large amount of comments were around the animal welfare stuff that you mentioned, Amelia, like how you know this happened in our Queensland primary school, and my daughter came home bawling because one of the horses had been severely injured in the race.

Like the kids had to sweep in it too, Like I lost it at the school.

Promoting gambling and watching animals being injured isn't a school activity.

The thing about gambling that's interesting is that when I moved back here last year from the States, every country has its own endemic problems, and obviously in the US, guns is probably top of that list.

And I'm not equating guns in gambling, but I will say I think gambling is one of those things that's so deeply embedded in Australian society that sometimes it's even difficult to see.

And the example I would give is my children were never exposed to raffles before we moved here, and now everything is a raffle.

And this hit me the other day when my kid asked if we could buy more tickets to a raffle because he wanted more chances to win the prize.

I realized in the moment that that was actually gambling.

And I hadn't even thought about that growing up, because it was just deeply embedded.

But the raffle is the go to fundraising event at school and we're getting them early with it.

That's so interesting.

Similarly, there's a lot of lottery talk in my house, like when are we going to win the lottery?

Can we buy a ticket to the lottery?

And it's that wow, where does this even come from?

Daycare centers do a really good job of connecting with what's happening in the wider society.

Like I remember around the Olympicks there was lots of Olympic rings and let's do the Olympics outside in the backyard and all of this sort of stuff.

But there's a difference because there's no sweep, steak, there's no awarding prizes for first, second, and third.

If they're going to just watch a horse race on TV, that's one thing.

But having a sweep and prizes so he wins that, I think that's where it kind of crosses the line.

I guess, to be clear, I was less about the educational elements of it and more about and now I'm going to sound like a Liberal Party politician, so apologies to everyone, but here goes.

Nation building is something that is increasingly hard to do because there are fewer and fewer events that we can all come together to celebrate and to mark.

Now, I don't think that horse racing and gambling is an ideal form of nation building, but I do want to suggest that we have diminishing opportunities to do that.

So maybe let's take Melbourne Cup off the table, but then let's talk about what we can put in its place.

Nat oc Week Halloween.

We talked about Halloween a couple of weeks ago about how this is the chance to build community and maybe that's what we need to take from it.

But you know, stepping back from my liberal party platform for a minute, I think that really what's going on here is kids do find it fun because they just want to win a prize.

Look at how claw machines are kind of had this hypnotic effect on them, and you just throw good money after bad not getting anything.

So I think it's valid to assess whether or not the Melbourne Cup is the right event to be teaching our kids about.

But that innate desire to win little prizes runs deep.

I'm so hardcore about those claw machines.

I say to my kids, the people that make these are tricking us all and PEO will never win.

They design them, they design them so you can't win.

And so now when they see them, they have the dopamine pool.

But then they're like, oh, they're the tricky guys that I'm like, yeah, they fucking are.

I just say they're broken bonds.

Jeez, they're broken.

So one of the biggest adjustments that I had to make when my kids started school was one that I didn't even know I was going to have to deal with, and it is the class group chat.

Now I know, Stacey, we've discussed that, because you are not yet in the school years, this is not something that you're exposed to, So I just want to quickly describe what it is you need to warn me for others in the same boat.

I think of the school group chat that you are added to at the start of the year as kind of like the coal mine of emotional labor.

Like you know how we always talk about emotional labor and how much emotional labor women have to do, and in particular, mothers have to do.

The school group chat is now the place where information is exchanged, where everything gets done.

It's where the party invitations come, it's it's the place for correspondence.

But it's also the place where I feel like if we were back in the cave.

This would be like the water hole by the cave where all the women hang out and exchange like the important tidbits that the other women need to know.

Would you say that's right?

Moms?

Is that an accurate description?

Yeah?

I guess, so keep going.

What's your theory?

You look pained?

Oh?

I just I feel for Stacy.

I've got some to stay growing up.

You've got advice, I've got rules, which is in keeping with our personality love rules.

Thank you.

I don't want to make this a winge about notifications.

I just want to say that up front.

I feel like that's very familiar ground.

We've all had the winge about how we get too many pings on our phone and how it's annoying.

But what I want to.

Talk about today is what's unsaid about how we use the group chats and how we could be maybe using them better.

Okay, that's where I want to take.

You want to control the group chat, right?

Okay?

I do want to control the group chat, and I've got three golden rules to that point.

So you want to hear them?

Yes?

Please?

First, big rule, can we just think about whether what you are putting out there needs to go to the entire class, or if it can be a DM to a particular person in the crist it.

Sounds like the equivalent of a reply all on a work female.

They are not necessarily very much.

And I know it's super distressing that your kids reader is missing, and I know that you know the jumper being lost or potentially left at school is definitely something that we all need to know about.

But can we call it a little bit with those alerts to the entire group?

No, we can't.

I disagree, continue you.

Would, Mons, I can't wait to hear why, because I'm right.

Second rule, please read the official communications that are sent to a school before I ask a question that could be answered from them.

No, I will not continue.

Third rule, and this is even more controversial, so brace yourself, Monds, Please add your kids' names into your name in WhatsApp.

I can keep track of all of your children and their names.

I like that, and frankly, your name is way less important to me than your child's name.

So just cut us all some slack and put the names of the kids in the name.

I really like that.

That should be your number one rule, not the third.

It's not subsuming your identity.

I think some people still think that they are interesting and unique and that they need to tell us about their personality on the class group chat.

No, I just want to know what your kid's name is.

Thank you so much, Mon's Why do you hate my other rules?

You can't control the group chat, Amelia.

The group chat is this organic beast that just is what it is, and putting these arbitrary rules on it is just going to ruin it for everyone.

The rules are for the school newsletter.

The group chat is where we just have fun and play in the sampit.

I'm just going to warn you, Stacy, there are five types of parents in the school group chat, and you will be one of them.

And I think I know which one you're going.

Okay, tell me here, hit me with the personalities.

I love this, Okay.

So every group chat has a Nicole, and the nicole stands for the organizer of the group.

She's the logistical glue.

Okay.

If there's a casual day, she's on it.

If there's a bake sale, she's got a spreadsheet called Cupcake Strategy twenty twenty five and there's different tabs.

Right, she is the one tree hero of this group, and the group would collapse without her.

By the way, I'm Nicole.

I just need to make.

That see, thank you for your service.

This is the plot twist, this entire shy.

Rules man's But anyway, carry on.

Okay, that's crucial context.

I could have used that, because as the nicole of the group, you should be coming in at the start of the year and saying, here are the rules for my group chat.

Oh that's fascinating.

I love that.

I think I'll do that next year.

For every nicole.

Every school group chat has the Chaos, and the Chaos just treats the chat like her own personal message board.

She's like, hey, guys, like wondering if anyone else's little jackson has been coughing since they did swimming, or like, hey, guys, has anyone seen Jackson's sports jumper?

Can you check your kids bags?

Like you?

It's not me.

It's not me, but I'm offended you would think it was me, So I'm kind of pleased also that you think it would be me too.

The Chaos's messages are very frequent, and at the start of the year people will respond, but responses just start to dwindle as the year kind of goes on.

Chaos never knows when school goes back after the holidays.

I truly don't know how chaos even remembers to put their head on in the morning.

Guys, I think I think I'm gonna be chaos.

You know you're.

I know you think that's off brand.

I know I'm such a rule follow but I am hopeless with that stuff.

I sent my kid to school in uniform when it was a mufty date, Like, I'm that guy.

So this is maybe me, But continue on.

Another one I've noticed is like the local influencer and she or he, actually what am I talking about?

It's always a woman message sounds like it should be like sponsored content.

It's like, hey, lovely mammas, just popping on here to say it is always lovely mamas, lovely mammas, and then signs off always like a love hard emoji, and then maybe initials like she's running a brand.

Yes, there's always an outraged parent.

They have pissed, they are ready so true over anything.

Why weren't we told about sports day earlier?

Why weren't we told about crazy?

I've got to take example for Stacy to understand.

So an outraged parent got so mad because I guess some kids were talking about what they did over the holidays in my kids class, and she was like, why weren't we informed that they would be giving reports on their holidays.

Yeah, that's classic outraged parent.

Then there's the silent one.

They see everything.

They see the nicole hustling, they see the chaos being chaotic, but they just themselves.

They're a ghost.

They watch, they float.

They sometimes might accidentally hit like the thumbs up emoji, but then they'll disappear, but that's.

Their official emoji, actually thumbs up.

And then the final one is the off grid and they are the parent that never joined the group chat in the first place, and they are thriving.

They might be bringing their kid to school in uniform on Mufty Day, but they are glowing with happiness.

So which one do you think is Stacy?

I think Stacy is going to be the silent one?

Yeah, ided I.

Actually with you.

Now, I think I'll be the ghost.

Well, I'll read it, but I'm not contributing.

And what are you mons I'm the ghost.

You're the ghost because you raised so a good point when I was being dictatorial about group chats, when we were talking about them that for the I guess neurospicy amongst us.

Sometimes it is in fact helpful to be able to confirm dates and so on in the group chat.

And that made me feel bad about setting down my rules.

But wait, can I talk about that last group?

You said, are you allowed to not be in it?

Like?

Is that an option?

But I mean, you know anything.

As a nicole, No, you need to be in it.

But I suppose I'm not going to be able to send you to jail for it or anything.

You don't know anything, And that's where the bliss is stacy, Like I was talking to Maggie Dent about this, I might have already said that's a bit of yes.

I know the other day and we were laughing about how many apps there are now, and she said, in her day she got one note in the school bag, like once term that was it?

A note in the school bag?

Oh gosh, I love that simpler time.

That's so nice.

But I feel like what you're saying, like with all of these people, it's very much Yes, I haven't experienced it in a group setting yet, but this is also what you see in a workplace setting and in friendship settings a lot of the time in group chats, don't you think, like, especially at work, there's always, as I said, that one person that replies, all, I don't need to know your annual leave.

The whole company doesn't need to know your onnual leave, but you've told us.

I think I did that this morning at the mom and me a chat by asking how to use the printer.

That would be an example.

Yes, that would be an example of that.

And then there's always the people who are just there for the lolls, like they're really there just to get as many emoji reactions as they can.

That might be me.

That's an extra subset you could add mons someone who's just there for a chuckle.

I haven't seen that in my group chats yet, and that feels I don't know, but you're right then.

In general, I think there are some striking similarities between the class group chat and friend group chats.

And workplace chats as well.

The biggest problem with the group chats is I think it's It reminded me of this article I read about the Great friendship Flattening, and it talks about you sent this to me, Emilia.

It talks in this Atlantic piece about how all our relationships now live on our phone, so everything's kind of given the same level of importance.

So ping from the group chat is the same as like a message from your mom and a message telling you that your taxes you like, everything feels like it's equal importance.

And also those like gym texts you get that tell you there's like a sale of like the Pilates studio you went to once seven years ago, I was having fifteen percent off group packages.

Yes exactly.

So we're just getting all these constant pings all the time, and it probably feels like that group chat is so overwhelming because you know, yes, it's all just given that same level of importance.

I love this theory because I guess that's why I brought it to you, thank you, is because it does explain why class group chats can feel really overwhelming, because mon's when it was just that one piece of paper in the bag.

That's not overwhelming at all.

You're not having to figure out intra class dynamics.

You just get the one piece of paper in the bag.

So I think that idea of all of our relationships becoming flattened goes a long way to explaining why our phones have become such a source of anxiety for us.

Yeah, I think my advice to you, Stacy is not to join be the off grid mum.

But just read the news letter.

I see you across the key dates and just too cool chat.

I can't condone that.

How's she going to know important dates?

How's she going to build relationships within the class?

How are they going to know Jackson's jacket is missing?

Like life saving information mons.

I will be there, but I will not be contributing.

All right, it's start for recommendations.

This is the stuff we've watched, red, bought, worn, or scroll that we cannot shut up about, like the things we're loving sick and we reckon.

You might love them too, now, no ads here, no spon con is it.

It's just the real deal, like straight from our lives into yours.

So, Stacy, the pressure is on.

We talked earlier about black Fridays looming.

Is your recommendation the hottest toy of the summer?

It is?

So I've had this for My daughter has had this for a couple of years now, and I love it.

It's the Yoto player.

Can you explain what that is?

Because it just sounds like vows to me.

Yeah, it's basically like a little audio player.

So is it like a Tony Yeah, like a Tony box.

Yeah, so it's a version of that, but this one has little cards that you put in the top.

But it does all little different things they can use it for.

So you can use it as a night light.

You can set it so that it'll turn green when it's okay for them to get up in the morning, or when it's nighttime for them to go to bed, it'll turn red.

There's a toothbrushing timer on there.

There's also radio on there, so just like kids radio, so they can just play music when they're in the room.

But what I love about it is these little cards, so they're different story cards, and so they can sit and use it.

And it's portable, so you can get like a little version.

There's a mini version that's they're not cheap, so I would suggest this as like your main Christmas present.

How much it's one hundred and forty nine dollars for the mini and one hundred and seventy nine for the Gen three, which is what I have.

I don't know why it's called a Generation three, but that's what it's called.

The full size one.

More questions.

Do you have to buy the cards to put in it?

You do.

You do buy the cards for specific stories, but you can also just get playing cards that you can put in and you can record someone reading a story to your kid.

So my brother and his wife live into state, so they have recorded themselves reading bedtime stories to my daughter and whenever she misses them, she can put on the stories and listen to them reading her stories.

It's very cute.

This would be a good present for a grandparent to give a grand child, may he lives away, and then you could gift it to them with the blank cards that you've read the story.

Yes, yes, you could absolutely do that, and like you don't have to buy the cards if you don't want to.

That's the fun for them.

So of course it's good to have a couple.

But then yeah, as I said, you can put it on the radio channel.

You can, like there's just just a stream of radio, so you can just have it attached to your WiFi and it will just play music to them.

Can you bluetooth things into it, so like your Spotify?

Can you put it on that?

Is it like a Bluetooth speak?

Oh?

I don't actually know.

Okay, I don't actually know.

But you can control it from your phone.

Okay.

Is there a subscription that you have to pay for for the app?

Everyone?

No, Okay, so it's like one purchase in stuff.

Yeah, except for the cards.

Yeah, you have to cards, and there is all different ones.

Like they bring out Demon Hunter's soundtrack, you can have that.

My Daughters is the Frozen story, so there's one, and it goes through all the chapters, so you can be like you can just listen to five chapters before bed or whatever you want it to be, and then you can shut it off remotely from your phone if you want to.

Once they once they go to releep.

But they're also good in that they can do Bluetooth headphones to it, so they can sit in the car with this if you wanted them to, Like they could just be sitting there playing with it in the car on long road trips, or they can have it in their room for nighttime.

Like.

I just love them so much and my daughter uses hers every day.

And I contacted the Yoto people because I wanted to make sure, and they are going on sale for Black Front.

But I do feel like you're always saying the word yoto.

That's very important to you.

I know they should give me a commission for how much I rattle on about it, But I just think they're really good.

It gets them off a screen, but it gives them something interactive to be playing.

I just use the old Google speaker and just play shit off Spotify.

You can do that too.

You can absolutely do that too.

I think the disadvantage of that is we get a lot of like, hey, Google, tell me a fart joke like constantly.

I see this will get rid of that, Yes, it will priceless.

All right.

I have something to recommend that I almost wasn't allowed to tell you about now.

The reason is there are really strict guidelines about talking about anything that has to do with medicines or certain health products, and that includes sunscreen.

But I felt so strongly about this that I said to the team, please, please can I talk about this?

Okay?

So here it is.

Sunscreen is a really big battle in our house, and one of my kids is very sensory and very sensitive to how things feel on their skin and to smells, and so most sunscreens are just not write for this particular child.

I was tearing my hair out and then I found this one called whip screen.

It's Australian.

It's like a moose texture.

It comes out like a moose.

I've never seen anything like it.

It smells like bubblegum and watermelon, and there's also an uncentered one if your kid can't handle smells.

My child will actually put this on themselves, And the first time that happened, I just had this full body release of relief, like finally I have solved this problem.

So there are really strict rules around recommending products like this, So I want to say this is not an ad I'm not being paid to say this.

I bought it myself and this is not medical advice.

Just always follow the directions on the label and reapply as it says.

But if sunscreen time is a battle at your place too, for those sent three reasons, whipscreen might be worth a try.

I just wanted to share it because it's made such a big difference to.

Us my recommendation.

With a bit of a story, So, I have a friend who has just had her first baby, and I wanted to send her a care package from Australia.

She lives in the US of sort of the best of Australian baby products, so it was really fun to put together.

And among other things, I threw in some bonds wondersuits because that diagonal zip cannot be found outside Australia and it is so good for the nighttime crazy changes.

Yeah, you just can't get them.

They've ridiculous clips and things.

Did you put one of those?

Like Muslin raps?

I did the baby are Agami that I've recommended on this show before, which comes from a small business in Sydney, which I love because it's good for people who can't effectively swaddle.

I obviously put in a couple of books by mem Fox and I also put in a book called The First six Weeks.

It is by Victoria's own midwife, Cat.

Yes, her full name is Catherine Curtain.

I have written about her before because she really saved my life with my first baby.

You know how you get sent a lot of books from people about how to deal with babies basically, and it's very overwhelming.

So I said to my friend, this is the only book that you need to read in the first six weeks, and I dearly read it before the first six weeks.

And the thing that's so revolutionary about what midwife Cath does is she thinks not just about the baby, but about the mother and what the mother needs in those first six weeks.

And to that end, she suggests a particular method for putting the baby to bed in the evenings that will enable mum to sleep for six hours uninterrupted.

It's called her BBB method bath bottle Bed.

It's simple but genius, like all good ideas.

Like you hear it and you go, oh, of course that makes perfect sense.

I won't get into it here, but it is simple, it is genius, and I think that book is just such a gift to new mums who, as we've discussed the show, desperately need their sleep.

Yeah, that's great.

Well that's all we have four this week on Parenting out Loud.

You're about one friend that would have like jumped in on this conversation and had a bit to say about it.

You should send this episode to them, like tell them to come and join in.

That's how our little show's going to grow.

It's just like hassling one parent at a time, just like the group Chaos could put it in the group No, the Nicole could be in the group chat.

She would say this is helpful.

Please profile yourselves Okay, A big thanks to our team, Junior content producer Tessa Kotovic, our senior producer Eliah Porgies and Executive producer Sashatanic and the group ep is Rith de Vine.

Have a great week.

We will be back next Saturday morning.

See yah bye, Mummy.

Acknowledges the traditional owners of the land on which we have recorded this podcast.