[SPEAKER_00]: This is Cynthia Gannoff and you are listening to the mesmerized podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey friends, welcome to mesmerized.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, a couple things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Mike and I just got back last night from Las Vegas and Mike ran a marathon.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like he's been training and running half marathon's, all the things lost.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think he told me 50 pounds in the process and went and ran this marathon in Vegas.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I did not.

[SPEAKER_00]: There were some discussion that I was going to do like a smaller distance.

[SPEAKER_00]: They had like a half marathon.

[SPEAKER_00]: They also had like a seven mileer and well.

[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't.

[SPEAKER_00]: None the less.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so proud of him.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was an awesome couple of days to get to go and watch him do that.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was downhill is started up in this like Canyon and a ran downhill.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he said it was like maybe if you'd been skiing three days in a row and you hadn't skied in five years.

[SPEAKER_00]: His quads hurt everything hurt.

[SPEAKER_00]: I wouldn't sure we were going to get him on or off the plane.

[SPEAKER_00]: Literally someone told us we should have tried preboarding.

[SPEAKER_00]: They probably would have led us so that's how he was feeling afterwards, but [SPEAKER_00]: super fun.

[SPEAKER_00]: I also every time we get a vagus, which isn't very often, but I'm not a gambler, not a drinker, not a smoker, not a anything or really.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so, but I always want to try the slot machines.

[SPEAKER_00]: Now, I don't understand the slot machines.

[SPEAKER_00]: I really don't.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you're probably like, well, I think it's obvious, but it's not as all these different ways you can push different buttons and what max bets and I don't know.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I always am like, okay, well, I'm gonna throw $20 at it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so yesterday I put $20 in, [SPEAKER_00]: And guys I want $100.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I don't want to say I'm lucky, but I'm pretty lucky and I left when it hit 120 I gathered my $20 back and the additional 100 and that was that.

[SPEAKER_00]: So there's the tails of Vegas.

[SPEAKER_00]: Glad to be back.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's my birthday week.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's Halloween.

[SPEAKER_00]: All kinds of fun things you're listening to this on the week where we're releasing.

[SPEAKER_00]: Also, I'm going to have a big announcement coming up later this week and it is related to my next book.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I would be so, so appreciative if you wouldn't mind one following me on social, but also commenting, liking, even sharing the next.

[SPEAKER_00]: Several days and weeks as we begin to push to get this second book out.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's called Howd I Miss That and I will give you a lot more information on it later But let's just start with this by saying I'm letting you know first all the info is coming out later this week.

[SPEAKER_00]: Please please comment like share and [SPEAKER_00]: We'll talk more about this, too, but also pre-order would be amazing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I just want to give you the insider info later this week.

[SPEAKER_00]: The big announcement will be coming out.

[SPEAKER_00]: We'll be showing the cover of it, kind of kicking off the book launch season.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, you guys in, if that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Guess what?

[SPEAKER_00]: Max Locados here.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know this, you know this because you'll see this podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know how I feel about Max Locado, whole spiritual giant.

[SPEAKER_00]: Every time I talk to him, mind blown.

[SPEAKER_00]: Today is a no exception.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're going to love this.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's talking out, taming our thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: And he speaks in this term.

[SPEAKER_00]: At these terms that I love, he said, we got to be picky about what thoughts we allow in.

[SPEAKER_00]: picky thinking and that has been sticking with me.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be thinking about what thoughts I'm actually going to entertain and so you're going to love today.

[SPEAKER_00]: He's so great.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm the biggest fan ever.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's kick it off with Max.

[SPEAKER_00]: Look at him.

[SPEAKER_00]: Pastor Max, welcome back.

[SPEAKER_00]: How are you?

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you, Cynthia.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm well.

[SPEAKER_01]: I really am.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm doing really well.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a great season of life.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you look great, and I'm always, I say this every time.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure everybody says this every time.

[SPEAKER_00]: But to interview the spiritual giants that you've grown up, reading and learning from, and reading their material, just all the books, all the sermons I've listened to, it's always an honor, and everybody says this, and I tell you this every time.

[SPEAKER_00]: But everybody in the podcasting business says this, you're the best interview out there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh really?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_00]: You've got it down.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're the best interview.

[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you for doing this again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Curious.

[SPEAKER_01]: Curious what I do that works.

[SPEAKER_01]: But thank you.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a great honor to be on well you're humble and you're easy to talk to and you just fall we can ask a real dumb question and you somehow make it sound brilliant and just the way you relate to people that it's just well you're amazing.

[SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for being here and we're going to talk about this book [SPEAKER_00]: thrilled to have in my hands, and I've been reading, but before we get there, I was thinking about just all the books you've written, and I feel like I've read, if not all of them close to it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I've written now two books myself, and it about killed me the right, the second one.

[SPEAKER_00]: I thought the first one, I was, I mean, I really had something go in the second one.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I shall die before I actually get words on paper.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so here you are, how many books in, do you know?

[SPEAKER_01]: Hmm.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think this is number 44.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: Do you have, I'm just curious, do you have a favorite or one that like you still look back on and you're like, I love that book?

[SPEAKER_00]: And do you have one?

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not gonna ask you the title, the other one, but do you have one or more than one that you look back on and you're like, eh, it was okay, I did what I was supposed to do, but it wasn't my favorite.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like does that exist in your mind?

[SPEAKER_01]: Definitely, definitely.

[SPEAKER_01]: That number 44 does not include children's books.

[SPEAKER_01]: And actually it's a children's book.

[SPEAKER_01]: that I just love, and I love to give it away, and it's by far and above my best selling book, it's called Your Special, and it's a story about little wooden people who go around giving each other the dots and stars, and it's a cute little story I made up from my daughters.

[SPEAKER_01]: and the publisher was interested in another book and for kids and I said well I've got this idea and I'm just so thankful for that little book because it goes where I've never gone.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's actually used, believe it or not, in some of the school systems of China it translated into Mandarin Chinese.

[SPEAKER_01]: But because it's not an overtly religious book, it's a metaphorical book.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so that one has surprised me and pleased me.

[SPEAKER_01]: The very very first grown-up book I wrote, I would not give to anybody.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's called On the Anvil, don't buy it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not worth reading.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a look at over here.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think I have it on my myself.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure if I keep going.

[SPEAKER_01]: It would have come out in the [SPEAKER_01]: My daughter is 40 and it was born almost the day, I mean it was published about the time she was born.

[SPEAKER_01]: But you know what, it's a first book and just like any first, you do your best, but you learn with everyone.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you do.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I'll tell you something.

[SPEAKER_00]: I was I thought I was I wouldn't say I thought I was going to be some great author at all, but I thought I had what it took until I started trying to write a book and I'll tell you what I will never criticize a book again.

[SPEAKER_00]: That is hard work.

[SPEAKER_01]: What did you find challenging about it?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, for me, one, it's kind of, it's so quiet in the process.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it's so extroverted that I think living in your mind and all of that.

[SPEAKER_00]: But also, so I think for me, the quiet of it is hard.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I think the other thing is, is trying to write Christian on fiction and do honor to the Lord, but also not tell so many stories that you're talking out yourself, balancing it with making it interesting.

[SPEAKER_00]: pointing it back to the Lord like there's just this delicate balance and when I write I try to write funny and like okay Am I being too funny that I'm taking away from God's word?

[SPEAKER_00]: And so for me that it's just that balancing act all of the time I think for me alongside being such a quiet time But on the positive and I think you would agree with this it does make you really being a observer of life Because you write on everything you do and live and see yeah, yeah [SPEAKER_01]: and everything is a potential illustration or story, you know, but yeah, I get the part about it being quiet.

[SPEAKER_01]: This surprises people.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm really an introvert.

[SPEAKER_01]: By the time our Sunday services are over at church and I've [SPEAKER_01]: preached and I've greeted people and shook a hand and given hugs.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm done, you know, I'm toast, whereas other people say, man, that just energizes me.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I love the days of writing because it is quiet.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's just a difference in personalities, you know?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I do appreciate what you're saying, because you don't want the book to just be, I mean, we don't want our book just to be [SPEAKER_01]: one entertaining story after the other.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's a place for books like that and they're wonderful.

[SPEAKER_01]: But a good story really does cause the reader or the listener.

[SPEAKER_01]: to take a deep breath and let out a chuckle or say, oh, that's touching and touches emotions.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that then, I think, prepares the reader or the listener for that key point you're trying to make.

[SPEAKER_01]: Last Sunday, I was preaching and when I worked on my sermon, I realized, man, this is all just kind of meeting, it's kind of teaching, it's data, it's pedactic, [SPEAKER_01]: and I didn't have anything to kind of, you know, bring people in if they're zooming out, zoning out.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I put a story in there with about, you know, two or three pages still to go on the sermon.

[SPEAKER_01]: to be real honest, the story didn't fit exactly, but it's a funny story.

[SPEAKER_01]: When I thought I was putting on my wife's body lotion, but I put on bronzer.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I said, yeah, and that's the reaction I got.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I needed that from the audience.

[SPEAKER_01]: They needed to say, whoa, I need a breath, I need something.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so stories are good, they're good, but they should serve to embrace and empower the big point.

[SPEAKER_01]: and not be the big point, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you all just got like writing 101 from Max Locado.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be re-listening this over over, I've arrived at a third book and the bronzer, that's hysterical.

[SPEAKER_00]: I often say that I feel like if you can make people laugh, then you can speak truth to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so that's what, when I speak or write, I try to think, okay, if I can just get you to laugh, then you can be on the same side.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you become friends, you become friends.

[SPEAKER_01]: Anytime you make a person laugh, you can become friends.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, the new book you wrote just number 44.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's almost like a president.

[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like this is before calling it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Tamier thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I love this.

[SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I for some reason, I bought a copy that I got.

[SPEAKER_00]: I received a couple of copies.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I've been handing it out because I think it's so important.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm just going to read a quote from it to kick us off on the book.

[SPEAKER_00]: You wrote positive thoughts, generate positive actions, negative thoughts, activate negative behavior.

[SPEAKER_00]: Behind every angry Albert is an angry belief.

[SPEAKER_00]: Behind every kind gesture is a kind notion.

[SPEAKER_00]: Behind every jealous comment is a, well, you get the idea.

[SPEAKER_00]: We are what we think, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: No doubt about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And understanding that is essential to helping people in their own behavior and helping us ourselves in our own.

[SPEAKER_01]: We tend to go [SPEAKER_01]: straight to the behavior and not to the beliefs.

[SPEAKER_01]: But somebody pointed out to me once that in the epistles of Paul, he always dedicates the first portion of an epistle to belief, to belief, [SPEAKER_01]: And once he's established belief, whether it be, like in Colossians, the preeminent sea of Christ, or in Romans that salvation by grace through faith, once he's dedicated six chapters or two chapters to establishing that belief, only then does he get into behavior.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, of guarding our tone, of respecting authority, of managing our lustful desires, he didn't start with behavior, he always starts with belief, and that's really helpful.

[SPEAKER_01]: I could have used that tip as a young pastor, because I would go straight to behavior.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do think establishing the right worldview of belief then sets us up for talking about behavior.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: When I was reading this, I was thinking about it in the context of marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I love my husband and we have great marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: However, we are married.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we have a married 25 years.

[SPEAKER_00]: And we all know.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, you take the good and the bad and up and the down.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was thinking about how I realized in the last couple of years that I run a narrative when things aren't going high, want them to in our marriage.

[SPEAKER_00]: And there's one particular day.

[SPEAKER_00]: I believe it was a holiday.

[SPEAKER_00]: It may have been over COVID.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was, you know, I left the house to do something in the whole time and running through my head, all the things that he could have done differently.

[SPEAKER_00]: should have done differently.

[SPEAKER_00]: I do it all the things with the kids, and I'm doing the holiday, and I have to entertain his parents, and my parents, I mean, I was so mad about the whole thing, and I realized when I got back, I was like, then narrative was so much worse than the little action that he took, the thing, like, I built it 10 times bigger than what actually happened, and how it played out.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I blamed everything, everything short of world war too on him.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's so...

[SPEAKER_00]: I was thinking about that, and just these narratives we have, and you talk a lot, you have kind of a real practical approach, you talk about how we take captive our thoughts, which obviously is biblical, and we test it against scripture, and we interrupt these narratives, and I think what I realized at that moment was, I needed to do all three, I needed to take captive those thoughts, and I still do, I needed to test them against the truth of scripture, and really the truth of [SPEAKER_00]: What is happening in our marriage?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like the truth of the reality of the things, and then interrupted.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so let's talk about those three things that take captive tests and interrupts.

[SPEAKER_00]: When you were writing this book, was there one in particular of those three that was most challenging for you personally?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, what you struggle with?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm in that large population of people that has to battle anxiety.

[SPEAKER_01]: like your life, you know, I live with deadlines and I sometimes catch myself anxious about getting a deadline and getting a deadline met.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if I'm not careful that anxiety will spiral into a doomsday scenarios or negative consequences, Ellen Vision, terrible things happening.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I have to interrupt those thoughts and say, wait a second, we're not there yet, take it easy.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the two or three things that I point out in the book, first of all, practice picky thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: And just because you have a thought of anxiety, don't indulge it, take it captive, take it captive, measure it against the teachings of scripture.

[SPEAKER_01]: and if scripture doesn't agree that you should be anxious, then dial it back, dial it back.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do think anxiety serves a purpose, it causes us to take care of ourselves, stay out of traffic or avoid rattlesnakes, anxiety is an alarm system that goes off, but unhealthy anxiety is when it never gets turned off, and so learning to turn off the [SPEAKER_01]: the blaring alarm is really important.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we do that about practice, that practice picky thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just because you have a thought, you don't have to think it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So take that thought captive, second Corinthians 10, march it into the presence of Christ, and ask Christ if He's, if the thought is from Him or not.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if it's not from Him, then just get rid of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: really discipleship is picky thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's trying to think in a way that Christ would want us to think.

[SPEAKER_01]: Greatfully, we have the Holy Spirit to help us, and so we can have better thoughts tomorrow than we have today.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think half of the battle that I love about this book is actually thinking about your thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know about you, but I'm not sure until the last four or five or six years, I've actually started thinking about the thoughts that I have.

[SPEAKER_00]: I guess you're getting this mode of thinking, well, it's automatic.

[SPEAKER_00]: I can't control it.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, what am I supposed to do out that?

[SPEAKER_00]: And so you end up like you're saying, you think more about the behavior or the outcomes, or you just blame it all on anxiety.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I just have anxiety, or I just, you know, I come from whatever it is.

[SPEAKER_00]: We may have a diagnosis, we may not.

[SPEAKER_00]: We just blame it on the instead of stepping back into that and saying, okay, I do have some control over the thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: And for sure, the Lord has control of our thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: So let's talk about this on this taking captive.

[SPEAKER_00]: Um, did I read, did you say, is it about 70th research to say about 70,000 thoughts a day?

[SPEAKER_00]: Is that right?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing, yeah, but 70,000 thoughts a day.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of thoughts.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like we live in a meteor shower of thoughts.

[SPEAKER_00]: Right, right.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so taking them captive, I mean, kind of to your point, when we read that scripture, that can be overwhelming.

[SPEAKER_00]: But you're saying, get picky.

[SPEAKER_00]: Stop, stop giving the mic to the thoughts that don't deserve the mic.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, according to the Cleveland Clinic, four out of five thoughts are unhealthy, negative, self-critical.

[SPEAKER_01]: How they figured this stuff out, don't ask me.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I trust the Cleveland Clinic.

[SPEAKER_01]: So when those thoughts surface, here's what happened to me this morning, Cynthia.

[SPEAKER_01]: Black markings in the master bathroom, Rott beneath the mirror, where the cabinet touches the wall, right that little spot there.

[SPEAKER_01]: She said, I think that's mold.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said, no, I couldn't be mold.

[SPEAKER_01]: And she said, I think it is.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we did, we had it tested.

[SPEAKER_01]: The guy came out and looked at it and he said, I don't think it's mold, but I'll have it tested.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said, see honey, fine.

[SPEAKER_01]: We get the report last night, black mold.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, black man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, my goodness.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I woke up this morning.

[SPEAKER_01]: What's the first thing I think about?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, black mold.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have to tear the wall out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the insurance cover this, we're going to have a gap.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have to move.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have to go, yeah, I mean, before I, I mean, I had us relocating to Alaska.

[SPEAKER_01]: Within five minutes where the air is pure and there is no, I don't know why I said that, but you know, my mind took off, okay?

[SPEAKER_01]: So I had to practice what I'm preaching.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had to say, okay, what's the truth here?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, the truth is, yeah, it looks like we have mold.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, let me tell you the rest of the truth, Locato.

[SPEAKER_01]: These things can be fixed.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're not the first one.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a crisis.

[SPEAKER_01]: and there's about a billion homeless people in the world who would love to have your problems.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I was trying to practice what I'm preaching.

[SPEAKER_01]: All of us have these things happen, dozens of times a day.

[SPEAKER_01]: The key is acknowledging, okay, this could take me down a spiral.

[SPEAKER_01]: It could mess up the rest of my day if I let it.

[SPEAKER_01]: But let's practice picky thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's take the thought captive.

[SPEAKER_01]: as he's taken care of me, as he proven that he will get me, as this ever happened before, and so, of course, yes, I'm sorry, Lord.

[SPEAKER_01]: And just some, you know, gentle repentance is usually due, and we get back on track.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if we don't, it can get out of control.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Quickly, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think to your point as knowing God's word is so critical, and as a girl who grew up in church, [SPEAKER_00]: and spend a lot of time reading God's Word and reading a lot of people like you, writing about God's Word.

[SPEAKER_00]: I do find that in those moments, if I will take the thought captive for a minute, minute, and I will just take a breath, that the Holy Spirit will lay truth over, the overlay truth on those thoughts for me.

[SPEAKER_00]: And like an example the other day, something is going on with my little one, and a little bit stressful with him, and, [SPEAKER_00]: And I kept just feeling like it was dark.

[SPEAKER_00]: Like this is dark.

[SPEAKER_00]: And all of a sudden, I just kept getting like the Lord kept laying out my heart, light overcomes darkness, light overcomes darkness, every time.

[SPEAKER_00]: And all I could think was like, okay, yeah, light overcomes darkness.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I would love for you just to encourage people that [SPEAKER_00]: Um, the importance of being in God's Word and knowing God's Word and yeah, memorizing God's Word, but if you don't have it memorized, we still have the Holy Spirit and he could lay it on our heart.

[SPEAKER_00]: But, um, the practical nature of knowing God's Word and how this plays into it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, Satan traffics in untruth, uh, if lies or fentanyl, he's the pusher.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he wants to deposit seeds of untruth, [SPEAKER_01]: in your mind.

[SPEAKER_01]: He did with Eve.

[SPEAKER_01]: He did with Judas.

[SPEAKER_01]: He does with every person.

[SPEAKER_01]: Trace all of our over reactions back to an untruth.

[SPEAKER_01]: So deal with that untruth and deal with it with scripture.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, yeah, Cynthia's right.

[SPEAKER_01]: You don't have to memorize a whole Bible.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have any verses memorized.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, memorize three.

[SPEAKER_01]: Identify your particular Proclivity to negative thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe it's anger, maybe it's greed, maybe it's lust, maybe it's resentment.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so find that one Proclivity that particular gray cloud that follows you around and find scriptures that speak to it if yours is guilt.

[SPEAKER_01]: Memorize if we confess our sins.

[SPEAKER_01]: He will forgive his faithful to forgive our sins, or there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

[SPEAKER_01]: You don't need the whole Bible.

[SPEAKER_01]: You need a two or three index size, and verse, scriptures you could fit on an index card, put them in your pocket.

[SPEAKER_01]: And whenever those thought surface, take them captive, test them against God's Word.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you say, OK, this is not true.

[SPEAKER_01]: What I'm thinking is not true.

[SPEAKER_01]: There is forgiveness for someone like me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that thought then will lead to a healthy, [SPEAKER_01]: narrative and say, okay, Lord, I repent, I'm sorry, grant me the ability to do better.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then what the devil intended to evil actually turns into something good because you say, can you believe great marvelous grace that we have in Christ Jesus?

[SPEAKER_01]: And you begin to sense victory after victory instead of defeat after defeat.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, it changes the thinking and then even like in my example like all of a sudden I was just starting to thinking the Lord like you overcome all darkness And then praying light over my son and that that no darkness will overcome him and it just led to this opportunity really pray over him Versus what I would typically do is just spiral into what is what's gonna happen.

[SPEAKER_00]: I know one day He's gonna serve time.

[SPEAKER_00]: I can already tell because he lied about this this morning and you know down the spiral we go as as parents talk to us about UFOs [SPEAKER_01]: which is what you just envisioned isn't overreaction.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, UFO is just a little tool that I've used over the years as a pastor, not just in my thinking, but when I'm talking to people.

[SPEAKER_01]: So somebody comes to see me and they say, Max, I need to talk.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just can't get out of this slump.

[SPEAKER_01]: I keep beating myself up.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like a really failed mom.

[SPEAKER_01]: Kids I failed my wife, I just am in a slump.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, that's what I call an overreaction.

[SPEAKER_01]: this just the swarm of thoughts that you can't get out of.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, used to, I would say, well, don't think that way.

[SPEAKER_01]: Stop that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that doesn't do anyone any good.

[SPEAKER_01]: What I've learned is to trace the overreaction back to the untruth that leads to the false narrative that leads to the overreaction.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's the UFO.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the untruth is a lie [SPEAKER_01]: Let's say that lie is your failure and you've blown it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, maybe you failed, but you're not a failure.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's an importance, but if you buy into the lie this is, I'm a failure, I'm always going to fail, never going to measure it.

[SPEAKER_01]: That then leads to a false narrative, a narrative is what we say to ourselves and how we see ourselves.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's that voice that you hear over and over.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that then leads to an overreaction, a common overreaction might be self-harm.

[SPEAKER_01]: It might be angry outburst.

[SPEAKER_01]: It might be treating your discouragement with some type of escape, like overworking over drinking, overeating, overspending, anything like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so when you see that overreaction, [SPEAKER_01]: you can say, wait a second, somewhere back, somewhere upriver, somewhere, there's a cause for this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Where is it?

[SPEAKER_01]: And since we have the Holy Spirit to help us, we can ask Jesus, let's say Jesus, why do I, why do I get like this?

[SPEAKER_01]: Why do I react this way?

[SPEAKER_01]: My wife and I had to talk to a lot of spending practices early in marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was so stingy.

[SPEAKER_01]: And now I just, I would get mad and I guess I would get mad.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd say, honey, why did you, you didn't have to buy that?

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it was reasonable, we could afford it, but I just, I wanted to save everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I needed help.

[SPEAKER_01]: And someone helped me see what I should have been obvious to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: My parents were raised during the depression.

[SPEAKER_01]: My dad was 40 when I was born, my mom was 39.

[SPEAKER_01]: uh...

they got married right in the middle of the great depression it shaped thinking for the rest of their lives it really in a good way they were they were good stewards but they were tightwats and we didn't splurge on anything and so i carried that into my marriage and realizing that sentia help me help me i found the [SPEAKER_01]: The untruth said, if you spend, if you splurge, if you do anything fun, you're wasteful.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's really not true.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's really not true.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so I corrected that, and that then led to a healthier narrative, which then led to a more reasonable way of, I think I became a better husband.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, and let's wrap up with this because I know you have a lot of interviews and I want to make sure we keep you on time, but I think this book everyone tame your thoughts, three tools to renew your mind and transform your life.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think this is an [SPEAKER_00]: excellent book to do with a small group or with a good friend and that's kind of what I wanted to land on.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's just the importance like in your own life of how is it made a difference for you to surround yourself with that one or two of three people, even outside of your wife, the guys that maybe speak truth and to you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm thinking about this to my own life and so much of my thought process and so much my narrative.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so used to my narrative that I call my [SPEAKER_00]: is the guiding light for that, but also sometimes I have one friend of a particular.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be ranting about something, not even necessarily bad, but just kind of going on and she'll stop and be like, when did you start believing that?

[SPEAKER_00]: Or just recently, like the other day, something came up about our quiet times and spending time with God, and she's like, [SPEAKER_00]: Do you realize that you equate God's favor with how much time you spend in this word every day that you're still, aren't trying to earn something that you don't deserve, you can't earn it?

[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, gosh, and at first it kind of came off as harsh but the more I thought about it, I'm like, that's a biblical name, not even a biblical, that's an unbiblical narrative that is built into me.

[SPEAKER_00]: that I didn't realize in someone else of fellow believers able to stop and say, like, let's digest this a little bit, let's dive into it.

[SPEAKER_00]: And so I just want to encourage people listening that as you are taking your thoughts captive, also surrounding yourself by people that can help you, unwrap some of the narratives that you're so used to hearing.

[SPEAKER_00]: And maybe just practically, how's that look for you?

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, do you have a couple of people to have one person like, how does that work outside of your wife?

[SPEAKER_00]: that kind of keeps you on track and can speak truth over your thought process and your patterns.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I took some golf lessons some time ago and the teacher said, you know, you were smart to come because you cannot see your own swing.

[SPEAKER_01]: and that makes sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just never heard it phrase that way.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you think you're swinging right, but you said you can't see it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And really we can't.

[SPEAKER_01]: We need a person to help us, to help us to see it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Quite honestly, Cynthia, as we're talking, I think I could do better at that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I met a stage in my life where people perceive they can't.

[SPEAKER_01]: They shouldn't.

[SPEAKER_01]: correct me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so this conversation we're having today reminds me, I do have two or three really good friends.

[SPEAKER_01]: I need to remind them and say, hey, you've got permission.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, to call me, to, if you see that engaging in that behavior, if I'm being real critical, point it out to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, Cynthia, thank you for that reminder.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's a great reminder for myself too, but just having people around us at, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Like, they'll say what the Lord wants us to hear, that are so active in their walk with the Lord, that they can speak into ours, and I'm just grateful for those people.

[SPEAKER_00]: But if you don't have that, or if you do, again, everyone, this is the book, it's such a great read, and I can't help but think it would be so helpful going in the holidays, man.

[SPEAKER_00]: If anything, I'll send your thought life into orbit.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's a lot of concentrated time in the holidays, with relatives, bind gifts, and med expectations.

[SPEAKER_00]: So this would be a great one going into the holidays or even in the new year, but it's called Tamir Fauts, Max Lucato, and three tools to renew your mind and transform your life.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hester Max, as always, thank you, thank you, thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, thank you, you're so kind.

[SPEAKER_01]: So kind, you do a masterful job on these interviews, and they appreciate it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's been fun.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, we'll link the book in all the usual spots.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, how about that?

[SPEAKER_00]: I loved his bronzer story.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's hilarious.

[SPEAKER_00]: That will stay with me for a long time.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, you guys have said it at the beginning.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll say it again, please.

[SPEAKER_00]: This week, if you would follow me on social if you don't already and be ready to jump in there and like and comment in all the things and help me as we kick off this book launch season.

[SPEAKER_00]: You guys, I'm so grateful for you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for being a part of the mesmerized family.

[SPEAKER_00]: You're the very best.