Hi, I'm Kristin Davis, and I want to know, are you a Charlotte?

Welcome back everybody to are you a Charlotte?

Part two?

Thanks for joining us.

Here we go.

So Carrie struggles mightily.

She's Big through the binoculars.

Big sees her.

Oh so I just feel so angry at Big through this whole phase.

I'm just like, Big, you're a mess and you need to leave her alone.

A mess, a mess, And that poor.

Wife reminds me of He reminds me of Jasper in the Holiday?

Which one is Jasper?

Jasper is the man who comes to see Kate Winslet when she's on her Christmas holiday in La Right, is it Jude or the other?

No?

No, he's a I don't know some English because it's Jack Black and Jude Law.

Incredible actress.

And he is like, I've just missed you and let's go on holiday and this, that and the other.

And then she's like, wait, are you still engaged to be married?

I just wish you could understand how hard this all is for me.

I'm so confused.

I just watched it last weekend.

In my moment, it's very similar.

I watch it like four times every Chris West.

Wow, but my god, it's like you are with Natasha.

You chose Natasha, leave carry alone.

And by the way, if you think you made a mistake, then leave that woman and apologize and.

Then move on.

He's gonna do it, but he's gonna do it in the worst possible, messy, messy way.

I just don't understand it.

It's like, say the thing and go totally.

The mess is so unnecessary.

I agree, but I also feel they're not They're only as mature as they are, right, they can't, you know what I mean.

And she doesn't really get as much excuse because he's older and whatever.

But like Carrie, you know, and this is what I love about Carrie, So the thing that I love and I so relate to all of it.

Right, So she rushes out of the opera, and then she tries to call Aiden and she gets the voicemail.

And you know, this is before texting.

Really we weren't really texting a lot, right, So then she hasn't heard from him for two days, and she fully spins out because previously they'd been like joined at the hip, right, that's phase of the like the honeymoon of the relationship.

Weeping over every night, right, and now she's just spinning, spinning, spinning, and you feel so bad for her, like that's about her own you know, development, and like what she can't quite be with right, And so then she thinks she's She says to him like we just were too available to each other, which I kind of get, right, like when you're just totally with someone, kind of taking them for granted.

And she thinks, like, I just need a little space.

Whatever.

She gets a little space, and then he doesn't ed to the phone, and she's like, oh, what did I do?

I totally totally relate.

Okay, wait and then wait.

In the very end, she goes to see him with his adorable little parents.

Cute.

They're so cute, which is so rare.

We never see parents in our show never ever ever.

You know what I like about that moment She goes and instead of going in, yeah, the knock on the window, and she gives.

Him a choice.

She gives him the choice, and she's really vulnerable.

She runs him through her whole spin.

She doesn't try to hide it now, she doesn't play it cool.

Yes, she's like I thought this, and then I thought this, and then I thought this, and then I got scared and then I wasn't sure, and so now I'm here, and if you don't want me to be here, I'll leave.

Yes, it's amazing, it's it is.

Actually, you're right.

She's learning a lesson in real time and being honest about the lesson.

Right.

And when she says I flipped my stomach all by myself.

That's so good.

That's so good, big lesson, so so good, so so good.

So here, let's go to Charlotte for a second, because Charlotte, Oh, Charlotte, Charlotte, Charlotte.

She is a funny girl sometimes, you know, I look back at her and I'm just like, wow, I remember it, but I don't remember all of it.

JD.

I mean like, I didn't I remember meeting Kyle Trey and I didn't remember that.

I go to the bar where the Dennis is there.

Yes, I think Phil, the single guy's gonna be there, but the married guy's going to be there, and I'm like, what, Yeah, it's so funny to me.

And by the way, it's he's him and big same yeah, and it is that thing.

And it was so funny because as soon as you went to dinner with them.

I was like, oh my god, it's Dennis because I remember the storyline, and I remember thinking how crazy it was, you know, watching the show in college, because it was it was that like fall of two thousand that Brenna and I lived on the fifth floor together and we started watching the show and caught up, and then we'd watch it every weekend when the episodes were there, and I remember being like, that's insane, no one would ever do that, and then in my thirties being like, oh, that's happened.

I've seen this happen.

I've had it happen.

My friends have had this happen.

Like men are insane, It's true, and oh my god, like what is wrong with you guys?

And so there was something so crazy about watching the episode ahead of this and going or it's join us.

And then as an actor, I watched every little choice he made and I was like, there it is, there it is.

It's like the sixth sense when you know you go back and watch the movie and you see it everywhere, and I knew, and I was like then in my head, I was like, what does she do?

Does she hit him with her purse?

I feel like it's a scene push him or do I slap him?

What do I slap him?

I meant, which is so crazy?

I love it.

I generally, as an actor, I hate to slap people because I feel like I know how to do it.

I went to you know, acting school.

But I feel like, in life, how often do you slap or be slapped?

It's very rare.

I've slapped one person.

I don't think in life I've ever slapt anyone that I can think of right now, certainly not since I've been sober.

Yeah, people write it into film and TV to a fair amount, and I'm always like, oh, does it need to be that with this thought was great because also she she's Charlotte, right, she doesn't see this coming, no one little bit, And it feels like.

You really like tried to slap some sense into it, right, literal phrase right Like.

I liked the way I did it because it was like, you're just stop out of it.

It was a snap out of it share type moment, yes, right, which is ye.

She says that might be the best lap ever.

Anyway, Then this was the great part because all I remember about this was that my goal was to get to falling in the street.

I picked that lipstick skirt.

I was on the plane home to LA.

I was looking through the magazines like we used to do, you know, the paper magazines.

And I saw the product ad with the product lipstick skirt, and I called Pat.

You know, the plane hadn't taken off.

Called Pat and I was like, Pat, I need to get this Proda lipstick skirt.

She goes, oh, like, I don't think we can get it.

You know, if you ever meet has a very deep voice, you know, I was like, ah, I can't even really do it.

Justice.

She says, we have to have five of them because whenever you're going to fall into a street that's wet, because they have to wet everything down right, you don't know what's going to happen.

So she's like, we have to find five of them.

I don't know if we can.

I said, I'll go look because at that point I was already my protoholic self, and I had a discount at Product.

No, yes, I still have it.

Not the wood okay, not the wood man.

Oh, I know it's good, so good, it's so good.

And so I went I think I might have gone in LA and New York.

And then they had to call around and try to find them, like through Europe and down to the wire.

We didn't know if we'd have enough.

Noah, can I tell you something amazing?

Yes, I have one.

Yes, we should wear them together.

Oh I have it.

You have the lipstick?

Yes, amazing.

It was a thrilling acquisition for my little vintage collection.

Great job and you it's like safe, gorgeous good.

Yeah, because you can never find them.

No.

I feel so lucky to have it.

It's such an iconic piece.

And when we when we were solidifying today's date, I was.

Like, no, I'm already in LA and it's at home in New York.

I was so sad about it.

That's okay, we we know we each other had a wonderful thing.

I remember at the wrap party of this season, because we'd had five and I made sure to get one right.

One of Pat's friends came up and said, I'm so excited I got a lipstick shirt.

And I'm like what.

It was so mad.

It's like, wait, whatw I.

Know?

But I'm sure she's enjoying it.

Anyway.

When I fell in the street, we only needed one.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, nothing ripped, nothing tore.

It was all fine.

That bag I have a little Prada like bowling bag.

I feel like they called it is black and white that was borrowed from Prada.

The shirt I believe I have, it's like just a very basic I think the one I'm wearing there is just a very basic, like three quarter leafs length thing.

I think I still have this sleeve length.

I think I still have that too.

But I fall an adorable, adorable Cale is.

There to help me up every night and sh.

I know, and just so handsome.

But it's also so funny because we're very the way they filmed it, I'm sure it was five am.

I love like that we shot on Super sixteen, so like when the street lights go like wacky, that's why, right, because it's like old film, you.

Know, beautiful.

You get the haze and the pinwheel.

Exactly so beautiful, and they the way they pan around, I mean, and he just could not have been more perfect, obviously, like a dream come true, a dream come true.

And then I've said this many times.

I'm just say this in case someone hasn't listened.

The idea was that he was only going to do five episodes.

No, yes, the idea is that he was only going to do five know that, yes, and that he Trey was going to be very, very boring, and that all the friends would be like, oh God, you know who's going to talk to Trey, But he was Kyle and he couldn't.

It was isn't that just he's so yummy beyond and so interesting and he does things with such a very subtle twist.

And they knew that he was going to have a mess up relationship with his mom and that there was going to be some problems in the bedroom.

But also he was supposed to also be boring in regular life, but he just couldn't pull that part off because he was him and I was just like, this guy can't leave, you know what I mean?

And everyone else felt the same way.

So he stayed, thank goodness, and we did many different things.

But obviously he had to go eventually, which was said but needed to happen so that Harry could come and so that Charlotte could learn yes, yes, yes, indeed no yes.

Well to allow you to build the life you think you want and realize it's not for you, that's a profound lesson.

Yeah, And having been through that now as an adult, I wish, I wish the gravity of it had hit me sooner as a viewer.

Yeah, but I also feel like you don't.

You can't.

You can watch something and feel like, oh, that's amazing and so right on, but until you go through it.

If you need to go through that, there's nothing.

There's no substitute you really you.

Can't learn a lesson until you learn it.

And the thing that I think I've realized, and it feels very true for your story as Charlotte, is no matter what fear you feel, you can usually explain something away or work on it or whatever.

You can't know that you're in a cul de sact until you drive to the end of the street and realize you can't get out unless you turn around.

That's true for sure.

Yeah, And I think there are there are moments where winding up on a cul de sac in your life is really meant to teach you something.

And I think Charlotte had that.

I know I had that.

I definitely I can see that character journey for women I've played on screen as well.

And I yeah, I think it rings so true for so many people because so many of us have versions of it.

Are I agree?

Yeah, I mean that's well put and I think It's interesting because you don't necessarily know that you don't want to be on that cul de sac till you're fully, fully on it, right, Because some people want to be on a call de sac.

Yeah, you know, some people wants to get there.

It's harder than they might have thought.

But they do think all the things like I need to work on myself, I need to whatever it is right, and that if that is the thing that they really really want, then they do need to figure out a way to make that work out, I guess.

But then also sometimes that is not what you really want.

And that's the key I think to be most in tuned with yourself, truly deeply about that, you know, which is not easy.

I don't think that's easy.

It's and I also think the conditioning, it's very hard to separate your internal desires from your conditioning because you've been conditioned since the day you were born.

Well, and you think that's what you want.

Yeah, you don't need the difference, say this is my desire, this is my goal.

It's I don't think you know it isn't or that perhaps it's the right goal in the wrong iteration or whatever.

Until you're in it and the thing that's supposed to make you feel full feels hollow, and you go, oh.

No, Well that's the key, right, that's the key is when you're actually in it.

How do you feel?

How do you feel?

Do you feel miserable?

Do you feel hollow?

Do you feel like any of those bad things?

Because there's really no amount of work you can do on yourself that's going to fix feeling hollow.

No, there's no amount of work you can do on yourself that's going to ease the eggshells you walk on in the wrong house.

Well, egg shehlls.

That's a different situation.

Eggshells sucks so bad.

Yes, no, egg shells very bad.

Run any women who are listening to this run away from any eggshell feeling boo A million times of boo on egg shells.

Right, eggshells is different for sure than hollow.

I think right, like hollow and hollow.

If I were in a situation and I felt hollow, which is rare, I would I don't even know if I would even get myself into a situation that I felt hollow in it, But if I did, I would have to ask myself, am I blocking off?

Am I?

So?

Is this threatening me somehow where I'm having to shut off my feelings because I have so many big feelings at all times.

If I really felt nothing, I would have to examine that, right, Like why am I actually feeling nothing?

You know what I'm saying?

That would be an odd thing and worth examining.

But if I did examine it, and I realized, oh, that's because this is a like if Charlotte had stayed with Trey maybe and I have to I haven't rewatched yet.

When Kyle was here, we talked about some of the things that happened, like the Cardboard Baby and things I only vaguely remember it right, like it was a lot.

It was a lot of plot that I hadn't experienced in life yet, and my friends hadn't really gone through either, like the IVF for all of that later later on, many people I know did that, but and it's a whole thing, and I don't know that I did it justice.

I'm really anxious to rewatch.

But also he talked about something when we weren't sure, and I think the writers were trying to carve out what was actually going to happen.

And I know he was so great to work with and we were so connected that I was felt very connected.

I never felt hollow, but I do remember that there was that time, and I also knew he had to go right, which was sad.

But like that time when you just know that you and the other person don't want the same thing, and then no amount of love is going to fix that, or attraction or whatever it might be, right, no amount of perfectness is going to make you want the same thing.

Yeah, And if you don't want the same thing, you can't stay with that person, yes, because you will be giving up what you want in theory, right, and that's not something that you should do.

No.

There's a difference between compromising and compromising yourself, absolutely, And I think the conditioning comes in, especially for women, because we are often conditioned to compromise to the point of compromise.

It's true because no one says to us, don't do it.

Yeah, And when you realize it's shifted from healthy compromise, right too, I'm compromising, right.

You think, like, do I recognize myself?

I mean, I have been in those situations where you know someone's asking me to do something or to give up something or whatever, and I have to say, like, wait, I worked my whole life to create this and you want me to quit doing it?

Really Like I was in a relationship where my significant other wanted me to quit acting, and I was so burnt at the time.

It was after the show and just burnt out, so tired, so tired, where I was like, well maybe, you know, I had that tired thought of like maybe I could give it up and live this adventurous life with this person.

And then later on I thought what it was.

I thinking, yeah, I would miss it so badly if I actually give it up.

Also, you can't really give it up and go back.

It's not that kind of job, do you know what I'm saying?

Yeah, Like that's it.

If you walk away, you walk away.

And then I did also think that when when adopted my first child and I ran into Julian Moore.

This is another example of like the things I love about our business.

Yeah, Randa is Julian Moore, and she said, how is it, you know, how's it going?

And I said, oh, it's so great, it's so great.

I feel so bad being gone.

And she said, you know that's okay, They're gonna be fine.

You have to tell yourself they're going to be fine.

You're only gone for a tiny second in their mind, right, You're going to be back.

And I said, I just feel like maybe I should take a break from acting.

She said, don't do it.

I said, don't do it.

And she had two children at that point.

She said, do not do it.

I have friends who have done it.

They can never get back in.

It's like, oh, thank you, Julianne, thank you Julie, Because like you have those moments where you're just like tired or tired, an you do need time to recuperate.

And I think that's different though than going like me, I'm kind of an all or nothing right where I'm like, I'm so tired, maybe I don't want to do it anymore.

But that's just how tired you are, right, That's how tired you are.

And then you go like what was I thinking?

Right?

Because also sometimes the well gets dry.

Yeah, if your tank is empty, you can't give give.

Yeah, there's nothing to draw on or whatever.

You have to refill the tank.

But that's different than quitting.

Yes, very different, Yes, very different.

You can convince yourself like, oh I might just be permanently empty.

You're not right, But that's also like a just you're just so tired you can't you know, function or whatever.

You know.

Let's talk about Samantha for a second, because this interested me.

This storyline.

I didn't remember the storyline.

She basically is with this very hot athletic dude who's taking my aggro and he gives her some and then she has this incredible orgasm.

And I remember a moment in time where they talked about giving viagra to women for you know, pleasure, right, And I don't know what happened with it, do you I sure?

Do you do?

I do?

Let's hear it.

So this is actually really interesting.

Okay, My one of my girlfriends, Cindy Eckert, is an amazing entrepreneur, and she created Addie, which is the female viagra.

Wow.

And when they were working on, you know, advocating for this for research dollars for you know, the FDA to actually address the medication.

As we know, there's almost no research dollars given to women's issues.

Yes, women were not even included in a clinical trial until nineteen ninety three.

Wow, which is insane considering we are fifty one percent of the population and we also deserve healthcare.

Yes, less than three percent of all healthcare dollars go to women, So I mean, it's really it's so of health like research dollars.

I should say, someone's gonna yell at me for speaking incorrectly off the cuff.

But the fascinating thing I learned from Cindy is that, you know, her team learned that viagra had been given emergency clearance by the FDA.

It was said to be such.

An important medication, oh my.

Gosh, so important to humanity that it went through FDA clearance in six months.

And she said, well, if you gave it to the men, give it to the women.

And I won't say who, because I likewise respect other people's stories.

But an elected official like on Capitol Hill looked her in the eye and said, what do we want a bunch of horny women when around for ew And Cindy, to her credit she's a baller, looked at this guy and said, well, do you want your wife to want to have sex with you or not?

Yes, she's amazing, amazing, and yeah, she has been doing all this incredible advocacy for women's health, women's sexual health, all of it.

And I think it's so interesting that you know, the idea that men might not be able to have sex at any moment they want to.

It was an emergency, but women deserving health care for their sexual and reproductive function is still very brown, paper bag bottom Shelf inane conversation, and so she has a doc called the Pink Pill that's coming out, and she's just like out here doing this work.

And so through our friendship, I've really I've just learned so much about it.

And so I was watching this episode going, oh my god, I know, sweet, can you get it?

You can?

Oh, wow, that's great, that's great.

But it was essentially the medication was bought by a you know, larger company, and then Shelf and Cindy fought to get it back.

WHOA, Yeah, she's amazing.

That is amazing.

I want to see her job.

But it was such a cool thing to watch the episode thinking like, oh my god, I wish that there had been anything for women at the time, and I sort of love that, you know, Samantha's storyline and Kim being such a great committed actress, she really leaned in on it and to play the desperation of you can't take this away from me, because he's making this better for me.

She did it so comedically, but knowing what I know thanks to Cindy, I was like, Oh, there's a whole other layer to this and Darren Starr doing such a genius thing in the writing of this episode, connecting that like gorgeous high note at the opera, like going straight into Samantha orgasm.

I literally put in my notes, I go opera to orgasm is a ten out of ten for.

It was good.

It was really good, such a good hole.

Yeah, it was beautiful.

It was beautiful.

It did make me wonder because I've been remember it being discussed like in the news, I feel like, and then it just kind of went away, which is interesting, right, we didn't talk about Miranda and Steve, like try to talk about Miranda and Steve before time.

I know they're incredible, they're incredible, but but literally, but I vaguely remember the storyline because I was kind of horrified.

I was am was just like, oh God, I.

Know we're talking you guys about the skid marks.

Okay, everyone's gonna know who's seen it.

I know.

And the thing that's interesting about it, and I love the writing again, is that basically Miranda, who has been struggling with you know, kind of Steve's committedness and availability and all of the things that's also reflected in the Aiden Carry relationship.

So she there, he is at home, and you know, she's telling all the rest of us that he's predictable and safe, but she loves them about him, which is like, wow, right, big growth exactly, and that her favorite thing to do on Saturday night is to do is laundry, and we're like, whoa gosh, Miranda.

And then she's there.

They're eating lasagna and having sex and watching TV and everything's great.

And then she's doing the laundry and she comes across skid marks in his underwear, which is you know, just like, uh, you know, it's a lot, it's a lot.

It's a lot.

Yeah, and he it is.

To me, it's kind of and I don't have a lot of experience with this, but it's a little bit like, you know, the kid element of Steve.

The episode where he's watching Scooby Doo it's coming, you know, like there's a theme going on where she he wants to have a baby, and she's like, I already have a baby, and I think she's Carrie says that in voice over Marianda.

Really she already had a baby, already had a baby.

I think this is a little bit like that too.

Also, and also like my thought was, why isn't he doing the laundry?

Yes?

You know what I mean.

Well, it is that it's an elemental thing that it seems the writers want to weave in, which is is this man a little juvenile?

Yes?

And it's reflective of that larger thing, which we know that so many women feel like they become their husband's mothers, right, you know.

I read this whole read on Threads on the day before Thanksgiving, and this woman was like, I asked, I asked.

My husband asked me if he could help.

I said, yes, please handle all the you know or dervs, like the morning snacks.

And he said, what if I drive you to the store.

Can you go in and get them?

I don't know what to get.

And she was like driving me to the store isn't helpful.

Also, it's taking like I need to be here prepping.

I'm not doing nothing.

I'm prepping all of the food.

You offered to help, just go get something and he couldn't do it, And she was like, I've done this for thirteen years.

And it's kind of my fault.

And I'm also fed up.

And it was really interesting to watch all the women in the discussion, and I thought about it watching these scenes because she does love him and he is absolutely fine reverting to letting the woman do everything for him, and it is that kind of generational learning pressure.

Girls get one set and boys get another.

Well, look, I've got a seven year old boy right and he'll say.

I'll say, like, can you do X, Y or Z?

And he'll go, I'm kicking my ball right now.

And You're like.

And I'm like, yes, yes, I see that you're kicking your ball right now.

I mean, like, what I'm trying to say is you're, as a mom my feeling at this point in time at least, is that you're trying to create something that doesn't exist in them.

Yes, which is interesting.

I don't know enough about the science of their brain and where their brain is right now to know why it doesn't exist in them, because it would be sure.

I have an older daughter, right but if I would have said to her, you know, can you set the table?

I kind of think she would have said yes and just done it, do you know what I mean?

So it's interesting, and then you're in the mom position of going, Okay, intellectually, I know that I need to calmly reinforce that he needs to participate in helping, but also it is easier for me to actually do it.

Yes, but that is then the way this all continues.

Right.

But it's a very fascinating thing.

And I think about it a lot as being a mom, because you feel the responsibility.

Okay, I've got to try to raise like an empathetic functioning you know, kid slash young man who's going to be doing these things and not be expecting the woman in his life to do them.

Yeah, but it's hard.

It's so hard.

I don't know why, but it really is.

And I think it's a great thing that they did, that your writers did exploring this stuff with this relationship because they're asking this ex essential questions so much.

And you know, Miranda is talking about what it's like to have this healthy intimacy that she loves, and also when when does intimacy go so far that it cancels the intimacy out absolutely?

On their walk and talk, yeah, you know those great scenes, she's like, Oh, I think I think the intimacy is over now right right right, you know they're in it right, And I love the conversation between Miranda and Carrie on that side.

They're always so great, so great.

I know, they're so great.

I would love to cut all of those walking talks between Miranda and carry together from the beginning till the end.

I mean, if we are really done.

I don't know, but they're always so amazing, and I would have to throw in one that's not a walk and talk, which is this argument they get into and just like that after my birthday party, which is one of my most favorite scenes ever.

But I need to ask you about something, and I don't know if I should or not, but I kind of want you because you have a unique life experience where you can speak to a Miranda issue that I would love to know your thoughts on.

You have talked about this, so I feel like it's okay, but you can tell me if it's not.

So you to all the exterior world, were in a heterosexual relationship and then suddenly you were not in that relationship anymore, and you were in a lesbian relationship.

And this can happen, correct, So you know, Miranda, this happens to Miranda right, And it also happened to Cynthia, right, which they're different, they're different, they're not the same.

But when it happened to Cynthia and she kind of got outed, which we don't even need to get into because it's old history.

But one time I went on Letterman and I was supposed to just be promoting the show.

I think now one thing led to another, and he wanted to talk about how could Cynthia just wake up one day and be gay?

Wow?

Yes, so do I think because it's a man's worst nightmare.

I think that's exactly right.

I was like, are you worried?

Day?

What's the issue going on?

Who cares?

You know what I mean?

Right?

It is interesting the floating fears that people have and then project onto people, and many, many, many of our fans believe that Miranda, that that is not what Miranda would have done, or that that is that we were somehow being untrue to the character.

We don't feel this way.

I know Cynthia doesn't feel this way.

I know Michael Patrick, who wrote it doesn't feel this way.

What I'm saying, yes, but I just thought, since you're here, yeah, we love it, saying well, you know, I.

Think it's really interesting, and particularly because it was it was Cynthia's story and then Miranda winds up falling for this non binary person.

I think in my brain I always wondered when that shift happened.

I was like, Oh, I wonder if they're specifically choosing this, either because everyone loved Sarah so much or because they don't want it to feel like they're copycatting Cynthia's real life.

You know, like that's interesting, you know, there's there's there's something I don't know the answer.

Yeah, and and by the way, we don't have to.

It's like not always for us.

I think what's really important.

And I always say this to people.

When someone's like, oh my god, I'm Brook Davis's biggest fan, I'm like, no, I'm Brook Davis's biggest, your second biggest.

You know, when when people are like, Miranda wouldn't have done that, I'm like, I'm gonna I'm gonna trust Cynthia and Michael's opinions about what Miranda would or wouldn't do above anyone else's.

I think what's really interesting, And at least for me, it was a there was a dissolution of you know, the the thing that I worked so hard for and that I was so intentional about.

I actually think intentional to the point that I made it something instead of necessarily taking stock of what was.

In hindsight, I'm like, wow, I really produced that so beautifully.

It was a really.

Incredible almost like in a Charlotte like you were going to make that happen.

Yes, it was less for me about gender truly.

Like one of my best girlfriends was the one who was like, he's not your guy, and I don't think a guy is your guy.

And I had always been like, whoever is my person is my person, you know.

But it was really interesting to have someone who knows me so well suggest something so specific.

As it sort of started to dawn on me, was Oh, I've been trying to build safety, and I've been trying to build a life, and I've been trying to build build build, build, make make make And before I knew it, I was like, oh, I just have intimacy here.

I just I have someone who sees me and asks me how I'm doing.

I didn't have that.

Before, right, So it wasn't necessarily this is so key and interesting and this is what I do think.

Yeah, I do think Cynthia has said publicly already about her situation it wasn't about the gender necessarily was about the person.

Yes, and I think that's a very important thing to say.

But I do think that one thing that happens for people in life is that you get an idea of who you are and then you have walls up.

Well I can't be that person.

Yeah, well, and I think for me too.

You know, it's interesting the double standard for queer people in the spectrum, right, Like men that are bisexual are told they're obviously just gay and they have figured it out.

Yes, women are bisexual are immediately told like, oh, girls, experiment, that is what it is, right.

And so I think when if you think you're if you think, or you feel or you know that you're bisexual, and then you're told that that's not really a thing unless you're like absolutely gay, you go, well, I don't think I am, So maybe I'm not really at all.

Maybe maybe I'm like an eighty twenty, maybe I'm whatever right your percentages are.

And then for me, I think a real thing was all of a sudden, I was like, how could this be like hitting me?

It was like magical and really complicated, you know, and and became hard I think for other people's perceptions.

Whatever.

Well, listen, this is also what I'm talking about with Miranda.

Well, yeah, people project under Miranda and project still very intense.

It obsessed people.

Yeah, but when it dawned on me, it was like a light switch went on and I was like, oh, well, ever unsee that this is the most at ease I've ever been around a person.

And isn't that what we all want?

And it's so gorgeous and I feel so grateful and she absolutely saved my life.

Hmmm.

Part of the reason I ask you is that I do think each of us have such an unusual, unique experience if we're open to it, right.

And what upsets me when people talk to me or get on my Instagram and talk to me about Miranda.

I don't know why we have to keep things so closed.

It's so odd, right, And there's also this very weird thing and this this bothered me about the discourse of your second chapter of your show is people were like, oh, they're doing too much.

Oh, Like, Miranda's not just gonna leave Steve, She's just gonna leave Steve for a non binary person.

Oh, like, you know, of course the teacher is this person, and of course the realig or is it, And it's like shut again, shut the fuck up, like just get over yourselves.

The world is different, people are different, people have more awareness of each other, more overlap with each other.

Certainly in a city like New York.

You think this power lawyer isn't going to meet queer people in New York City, definite.

First, but also the other thing that cracks me up is that our DNA is to do too much.

That's what we did with the first show, do you know what I'm saying?

Love that it just evolved, right, and we couldn't do the same show because that wouldn't make sense, right, So we had to But then everyone was like, oh, but in the beginning of Sex and the City, everyone was also like.

You know, so, I mean, people couldn't believe.

Exactly, and everyone forgets that, right.

So it will be interesting to see over time what people if the discourse changes.

I have no idea.

Obviously the discourse has moved on because it goes very quickly, you know what I mean.

But thank you for answering that, because it was a really beautiful answer, and I feel also and I mean, Miranda's not a real person.

It's also important to remember that.

But I think that what we wanted to show was that you just don't know.

You don't know.

No, you never know what's coming.

Yeah, you never know what you never know what you're going to learn, you never know how you're going to expand.

And I think the most important thing for me, having been through my own version of it, is that as hard as it was to say we've made a mistake, it's harder to stay in a life that stifles your growth, that stifles your expansion, that that steps on your joy.

It's harder to live in a house where you walk on eggshells every day.

It's just not worth it.

And so what I think is actually really important, and for whether it's for a character like her or you know, for those of us who like for better or worse, have lives.

You know, in the in the public sector, you you get to not only be courageous, but you might get to be courageous in public and help someone else be courageous too.

I agree, because I think it's it's just important to remember that the world is large and you don't need to limit yourself.

No, no, and I think for all the young people, you know, that's important to hear as well.

You don't know what that means exactly, but just stay open.

Staying open so key, which brings me to my last question.

Are you a Charlotte?

I mean, oh my gosh, I didn't used to think so.

And let me tell you what.

Watching this episode, I was like, I didn't buy a book, but I definitely like, I made a plan.

You produced it, as you say, you know, yeah, we really like.

And you know, in the kindest way possible.

I think you can get lost in that, yeah, you know, and I think you know we did.

Yeah, I mean definitely.

I think that you're obviously a very you know, you're smart, and you're functioning, and you were together.

So when you want something, you're going to pursue it, right, which is how Charlotte, you know, and the way I don't know if you remember that Charlotte proposes to herself and then she's all upset.

You know, she basically makes him propose.

She very much intentionally, yes, she intentionally makes it all happen, and then all of a sudden she's like, oh no, it's not really what I thought.

But this is a great lesson to learn and I love it.

And I think so when you said that you wouldn't have previously said that you were who would you have said that you were before?

Because you can be different once at different times.

I've always sort of vacillated, you know, there are there are parts of especially I think, like we were saying, when we were younger, we all really identified with Carrie Moore.

As I've gotten older, I'm like, maybe there's I really it's a lot of Miranda in me.

Actually that's what you're gonna say.

Yeah, yeah, And it's funny.

I think.

I think, you know, you go back and like we were saying, to watch these sort of seminal shows from different life perspectives, to relate to different very interesting.

And what I think is actually so cool is that I can look at pieces of each of those women.

And go, oh, yeah, definitely I see.

Myself in that.

And I think I think it's the genius of your show.

There was something really magical that you all did where it's like you sort of gave us the Captain Planet women and their experiences, and when you got together, then like this extra magic thing.

Happened, right right, That's what we wanted to do.

Yeah, really cool and we did it.

I mean, yeah, I love I think definitely I think different things when I watch it.

You know.

Now, obviously, do you feel like you're a Charlotte?

I mean, yeah, you know, I guess because I am right, But I always felt Carrie related in terms of her searching.

Carrie is a searcher.

She's gonna search and examine and target out to her And yeah, I think, I think.

I mean that I think is such a really hugely important part of her but also so relatable and a part of love so much about her, you know, And yes, she doesn't have it all worked out obviously, but she's gonna know nobody does.

Nobody does, and I think why not try?

Yea, And to go and to and to search and to seek.

Sometimes it's a dead end and sometimes it's a discovery.

And I think the willingness to continue to show up, to remain in the arena right as the adage goes is really key.

And it's it's a thing that I cherish about those women that that you all played, and it's a thing I've like really had to learn to love and own about myself, Like I'm always going to try, and I've finally learned, I think not to keep trying just because I started.

Oh that's a good point too.

Yeah, that's that's hard.

Hard.

Sometimes that's hard.

I think people get stuck sometimes saying well, I chose this, so I can't undo it.

Yes you can.

Life is long, definitely, life is long, and you have but never know what's coming.

You don't, You don't.

It's so true.

Let's talk a little bit, Sophia about what you're up to.

I know you have your work in progress podcast.

John McQueen's is wrapped.

Yes, we wrapped.

We watched the whole show back.

Amazing, so wild and surreal.

Work in progress is evergreen and so much fun.

And I can't believe at the time we're recording.

My my guest last week was Vice President Kamala Harris.

Wow, I mean, totally nuts, amazing, amazing.

Monica Lewinsky's on this week, right, I just get to talk to all of these really fascinating women, whether it's like Chelsea Handler coming to make us laugh or Ava do Verne talking.

About filmmaking just oh a dream.

One of my favorite conversations ever.

So I just I love I love doing that so much.

I love this format.

You me too.

It is It's really fun.

And then acting wise, You're on Craze anatomy once.

Are you a doctor?

Fun?

I play a trauma surgeon, trauma doctor, casspack man okay, overlaps with Teddy okay again, stories talking about you know, awareness and intimacy.

Fantastic.

I'm so thrilled about it.

Kim Raver's a dream.

We have to dream.

I don't know the characters names.

I know Kim though, she's let me tell her.

We have so much fun.

She's great, that's fun.

Yay, yay.

I can't wait to see all your different things.

How wonderful.

Thank you, thanks for being here.