Hi, friends, and welcome to another episode of Your Bish Therapist podcast.

In today's episode, we have a very special, brand new guest to the show.

Please welcome from two very special podcasts, Vander Pomp Robs and have Zi's.

Please welcome my friend Rob Shelty.

Hi, Rob, Hello, Hi.

I'm so happy to finally be on Not that like I've been banging on your door you offered, I accept.

I'm happy to be here.

I always love chatting with you.

This is exciting, yeah, Sam, very excited.

And for those who maybe have heard Rob's voice before, but you're not totally familiar.

I so you've had a couple of podcasts for a while, and I went on your I went on vander Pump Robs podcast.

It feels like a long time ago, and I can't remember what it was.

Was it like four years ago?

Just kidding, It wasn't.

No, I think I think it was before twenty twenty five, So it doesn't matter, right, It was just right in the past, in the past.

But you are a huge Southern hospitality person.

You love Southern hospitality, which is one reason why I'm so glad you're here because I have so many you know, I don't really cover that, and what I did was to come on your podcast.

I just like watched one episode of it and then we covered it, and then I was like, you know, I should watch this, and then I just never did.

But like so many people that love the show love Southern Hospitality too, So yeah, please just share with people just the things that you genuinely love and what you cover on your podcast and how it all started.

Absolutely.

I like to say that I will cover any Bravo show that I'm currently excited about, except for Housewives.

There's too much Housewives for me.

I can't do it.

I watch some Housewives show this is my like my mystery.

Like the astrologer Channy Nichols, she doesn't like say what her birthday is so no one can know her sign.

Well, I don't say what Housewives I watch so that no one can know how deep I can get into Bravo.

But no.

I started off with just doing a Vanderpump Rules recap podcast, and then there was, you know, something jumped me into like you know what, I'm just gonna start covering the current seasons, like I started from season one, and then I was like, people want to hear about the current season so then I jumped to the current season, and when.

Did you start from the current season?

Which current season did you start at?

I believe it was you know what, I think it was season ten because there was the break with COVID that took a long time to then get from season nine to ten.

But it wasn't a scandaval thing.

It was like already planned, Like my friend Molly was my co host at the time.

Molly had to stop being my co host to be a mom and get married and all these things.

No, it's totally fun.

Molly.

Molly was great.

Molly is an incredible journalist too, So if anyone ever wants to look up Molly Schwartz's work, she's had.

She's written about vander Pump Rules.

She works in podcasting.

That's how I met her.

But Molly and I were like, let's really do this.

Let's let's like start covering it in real time, and Tom and Tom are gonna be on Winter House, so we'll cover Winterhouse before we go into vander Pump Rules.

And then by doing that, I was like, well, I can cover whatever Bravo shows I want.

So I started diving into Southern Charm Summerhouse.

Yes, we Southern hospitality, yes, and I fell in love with Southern hospitality.

And what is it do you think about Southern hospitality?

Because this is one thing that fascinates me about like what authentically drives each of us as content creators.

Like it's just it's so funny.

For me, I just could not get into it, but so many people are so into it.

So what is it for you that like draws you in specifically about that show?

And Now this might end up being a long winding road, but I think culturally Southern hospitality is everything Southern charm isn't right, but it has like the aspects that people might like from Southern charm and the aspects that people claim to always like from vander Pump Rules.

So we have a group of young people working in the service industry with interpersonal drama and relationships that don't necessarily have to revolve around work, but because they are all put in situations together like that, they're forced to be around one another.

Now that being said, the real thing I think, the thing that really locked it in for me though, is this change in influencer culture.

And most of the people who have been on vander Pump Rules now have a hamster wheel to run inside of to stay relevant to You're so right, not like did you ever see Ghostbusters too?

Yeah?

One, okay, you remember.

The huge Ghostbusters family.

Can I just say that, like my niece and nephew, we've taught them the whole song.

We've dressed up as Ghostbusters for Halloween.

So I am in on this comparison.

Yes, So at the beginning of Ghostbusters too, they're doing birthday parties because no one cares about Ghostbuster.

They've busted all the ghosts.

All right, Like you guys are wackados, no one cares.

Yeah, but you're like semi celebrities, so you could do children's birthday parties like a clown.

And I feel like that's kind of where Vanderpump rules.

Uh, the original class is at, right, except they're doing podcasts or America's Got talent, or.

Our books writing books and yeah.

And look no shade to writing books, but.

Not at all.

I don't know.

But it's these side hustles, you know what I mean saying you were doing.

But I do think in terms of Southern hospitality, these people their goal isn't to just be TV stars, whereas it became pretty apparent pretty quickly that everyone on vander Pumper Rules did not want to have any other job but be a TV person and have that easy access right, and that could change.

We've only done three seasons of Southern Hospitality and this is about the spot where things started changing for vander Proper Rules.

But it really feels like this is my job for three months out of the year.

But otherwise I'm going to be a personal trainer.

Otherwise I'm going to get into the service industry in this way.

Otherwise I'm going to do that now.

Now a few of them seem to be influencery types, but it doesn't feel the same way right now.

And that's what's really locking me in because I do think that generational difference too, because these people are still like late twenties.

They've seen what can happen to the Tom Sandervals, the Katie Maloney's of the world, and now they get to learn from that, like, is that what I want to be in ten years?

And I think they're planning accordingly.

Thing.

I actually really appreciate what you just talked about because I was just doing a podcast with Lindsay and Brady from Recap Rodeo and we were talking about kind of in the same vein of how next gen New York City we felt was better than Rony because there was like increased authenticity.

So kind of what I hear you saying is with Southern hospitality, it's not just mini Shenas who are just trying to be influencers.

These are people who, it rings a little bit more authentic.

Are they filming a show, are they on the show?

Are they utilizing the show for opportunities and things?

But what I hear you saying is that there's an authenticity that you appreciate, which, to be honest, I do too, because what Lindsay and Brady and I talked about as well is like these Housewives franchises.

I totally hear what you're saying about your love hate relationship there, because we were talking about how like, for example, some of these franchises that are in their eighteenth year, it's like culturally there's such a shift because it has to get bigger and uglier and you know, more monstrous, and you know, it's just like it becomes this rock gathering moss downhill, so to speak.

So I definitely that makes sense to me, and I think I wonder partly if like, I'm like, am I just too old for this?

Now that I'm middle aged, I'm like, am I too old now to watch these like twenty somethings, you know, like the VPR new season.

I don't know how I feel about that.

How what do you think?

Well, first of all, you're never too old to enjoy something new.

I just had a birthday and it was a significant one.

And do you want to share.

Yeah, I turned twenty five.

You look great for your I turned forty one years old, and I think, yeah, well tell that to my back now.

I'm just kidding.

I did not watch next Gin and Brady and Lindsay both said I would love it.

I'll tell you I know I will.

When I watch it, I know I'll like it.

Yeah, I don't know any of the people.

I know Brooks I guess from SELC.

But it's not like I was like, I gotta see what Brooks marks is up to, right, and I'd never I never really watched Jersey.

See, I'm leaving my little breadcrumbs of the Housewives I have watched.

I'm listening Rob, I'm going to find by the end of this episode, I'm going to know exactly.

I'm catching the clues.

And and so you know, I didn't really call to me because also, and I've said this before, I think to Lindsay and Brady as well.

Next Jen NYC does not tell me what the show is about.

Now it's the dumbest name.

Dumbest name.

Vander prop Rules doesn't really tell us what the show is about, either, but you can context clues.

Lisa Vander Trump Restaurant.

Next Gen NYC is a bunch of young people, like the promo photos are in New York City.

Great.

I don't care about that.

I care about people I know that are gonna like have to fight about shifts for like who's doing what or who's dating who?

And I just don't know what the show's about.

Like, oh, a bunch of like up and coming youngsters, Okay, great youngster doesn't seem very exciting, but I'm sure it is, and everyone does.

Everyone does say it's it's great.

They didn't land it through.

Yeah, the advertising didn't work on me, But one of these days I'll go back and watch it all I'll say, oh, yeah, I liked it from the beginning.

You know, listen, that's more than fair.

And here's The only reason I ask about that is just because it, to me, is a good example of like what a new younger cast gives when they're not completely hooked on fame, right when they're just living their lives and being regular people and the show isn't their life and they're not draped in Gucci from head to toe or whatever.

You know, it's before it becomes a costume, before it becomes a persona.

That's what I tend to like.

But I do agree the name was terrible and it wasn't I don't know if it was promoted like it didn't explain exactly what it was.

But because what I love most about it is seeing Meredith Marx Because on Real Housewives of Salt Lake City, to me, Meredith always seemed very histrionic, which I personally can't stand.

That's just something that annoys me.

But on Next Gen, you know, we get to see a different side of her With Brooks, she's very sweet and like they're very codependent, which is fine and a little cute, but also like, you know, wow, we really got to work on that.

So you just got to see I guess, a different side of Meredith Seth and Brooks.

If you know, if that's what people care about.

So I will say I am friends with Seth on LinkedIn.

Okay, well there you go.

This is he popped up and I was like, yeah, I better connect.

I may need someone who worked at Big Lots one day in my professional portfolio.

I will say, though, with the new cast of Vander Pump Rules, I have met one of the new cast members years ago at a barbecue at Peter's house, and she's awesome.

Now I don't know what's happened on the filming right, Like, I don't know how this person's going to be portrayed, but she was super cool to me, very nice person but also like didn't take any shit from Peter or anyone else at this backyard barbecue, and like like could give it as well as was given sort of person.

I was like when I found out she's going to be and I'm keeping the name quiet, but when I found out she's going to be in the new cast, I was like, that's perfect.

She's perfect.

Yeah, I love that.

I'm cautiously optimistic.

I think that somehow they will probably find a way to try and force something that isn't natural.

But that's kind of what I'm for I think.

Producer Jerry is on this season who I have a lot of problems with when it comes to vander Pumper Rules.

Now is producer Jerry.

So one of the things, by the way, that we're going to talk about for those listening is we're going to do a really fun thing today, which is a VPR rewind.

We're going to talk about season eight, episode seventeen, yes of vander Pumper Rules.

However, one of the things that I found when I was doing some research to get to that point is that the producer of this season that we're watching, season eight, it was revealed that they purposely edited Shena in a bad light and then they were fired for that.

That was one editor, but not like the show runner producer person.

And Okay, I'm so glad you brought that up, because maybe that's for I think that the scene in question is like an episode that comes up just after but you can see remnants of it in our episode and previous episodes in season eight.

But there is like one thing that crucially if you did not know that this happened, is so like just you know, the word toxic gets thrown out a lot these days, but it is disgustingly toxic to do that.

I don't care if you don't like someone or not, and maybe we should just say it.

There's a Now that's it where and it's not in this episode, but where it's edited to look like Sheena is flirting with Stossy's younger brother.

Yes, that it was.

It was in this episode.

That was in this episode.

Scene in the episode that we're going to talk about.

Yes, it was in this episode.

I've been watching them back to back to back recently for my podcast.

So but yes, today is in this episode because Bo proposes to Stas in this episode and then right at the.

Dimming for mausoleums.

Yes, yep, yep, yes, Okay, So we'll get into all of that because I just you know, when I was doing some research on the episode, I thought, oh wow, that's really interesting, and then when I saw the scene with Sheena, which you know, we'll get there and we'll talk about it, I was like, these people are trying to make her look like a child prod.

It was.

It was wild.

It was a very wild scene.

So the person you're talking about is a different person.

Yeah, this is the guy who got brought I think he took a few seasons off or was working on other shows, but was brought back for season ten.

He started off as like a show runner early on, and then like showrunner is a big role, but like also then became like a producer and showrunner like kind of to the point where like in season ten he was like running the shop, right, and season eleven and then both seasons of The Valley, So he's the guy who you here talking to Jax or anyone in the confessionals, right, And I feel like the Valley has its own problems that have been talked about ad nauseum and toxicity, and I've never had the job.

I don't know exactly who's responsible for what.

But what I do know is that if you're running a show, that's not how you end season eleven of vander Pump Rules, you know what I mean?

Like this is, yeah, there are some crucial mistakes being made.

And then if you even start tiptoeing into domestic violence, that's not a storyline.

That's not a storyline that needs to take played up for stories, That is a we're shutting things down.

If this is a route we're going, let's make it crystal clear.

At the beginning of episodes, you break the fourth wall, you do whatever you need to do to make this happen without the way that they had it done I think in season two.

And I'm not even like I'm pretty lenient on reality TV, you know what I mean, Like, yes, yes, but when you cross the line, you cross a line and it's glaring yes.

And I'm grateful to hear you and some other content creators say that, because you know, as a therapist, obviously this has been my super bowl.

This is what I'm here to do because it is abuse what we're seeing, and I'm disgusted with how all these people are aware they're watching this, they're seeing this, and they're still trying to make it a storyline instead of posting domestic violence resources, getting Brittany some help, shutting things down, doing the right thing.

And for me, that's what I feel.

I've been really angry and talking on my podcast about like this thing we love so much, what is happening to it?

Because it disheartens me as a woman, as an advocate, as a therapist, as a human that this is what constitutes entertainment.

I just it's it's well, let me ask.

You a quick question as a therapist, not my therapist, but as a therapist.

It's like that TikTok guy is like, I'm a lawyer.

I'm not your lawyer.

Ask me whatever you know.

Therapy speak is on the rise.

Yes, I'm sure is a if it's a pain in my cross.

Sometimes I'm sure it's a major pain in yours.

Major.

And I feel like there's this like level of audience member now that is like I took one semester of psychology and like occasionally see a mental health professional, So now I can leave comments or make content based on the knowledge I have, which at the end of the day is not as much as a licensed professional.

And I believe that it gives trying to like not be mean about this because maybe no one has listened to my show, and I can be really dry and cocky and make fun of people.

But I'm also like a serious guy, and sometimes the tone of my voice doesn't.

It's hard to tell the.

Difference I've been told, right, right, but the difference.

Series I get.

I just quite frankly, get really annoyed with people who want to psychoanalyze reality TV because they think they know what's best.

When an actuality that's creating a bubble of problematic language around actual serious topics.

And it's kind of hard because it's like pulling a rubber band so far that like you're you mean well.

I get that you mean well, but it's diluding serious problems, I think.

And I couldn't agree more obviously, because you know, one of the things I talk about a lot is you know you hear all you know you hear the term djuur is talking about a narcissist, and it's like, that drives me crazy because that's not a thing.

We all have traits and tendencies, narcissistic traits and tendencies, all of us do, but like a narcissist isn't a thing, Like what do you mean by that?

Let's talk about this.

I saw the other day there was a person who had a ton more views than I get on something on Instagram going on about Jax being a family annihilator, and I thought to myself, Wow, that's super irresponsible, could you?

And so what frustrates me, right is that I come here with this lens as a licensed therapist.

I'm not saying I'm right.

I'm not saying that I know these people like I don't.

This is just the lens that I see this with and people come for me all the time, they hate me so much, And here you are with these people out here, who are you know, they googled what a family annihilator is and they're just reading it like they have some sort of understanding.

And it's like that also is dangerous because do I like Jackson?

Is he an abuser?

Absolutely?

For sure, Like that's undeniable at this point.

But we also have to be responsible for the things that we're saying, which include not talking above our pay grade, which is like we should only be talking about the things that we really know about, and a lot of people really think what they know is greater than it is.

And so that is my frustration for sure.

Well, it's like it also bleeds into the like my diagnosis as personality trait right right, which is dangerous too, because I have been given a diagnosis of some sort.

This defines exactly who I am.

And since it's my lived experience, I can now talk about this as if I'm an expert because I live it every day, and that's danger well it is.

And again I can say this so I always kind of joke but it's true.

I'm a professional and i'm a patient, right.

I manage complex PTSD, I have depression, I'm living with a chronic cancer.

So I know what it is to be a professional on one side of the couch and a patient on the other side.

And while my own personal experiences have informed my education, right, they've informed my education and for my clinical skills, it's helped me see a lot of all sides of an issue.

What people make the mistake of doing is when you're a patient and you're being treated for something, you still have blind spots, so you move from a place of trauma, and that's why you end up hurting people and it comes out sideways because you're moving from a place of like your perspective.

But you know, I don't know if lots of people know this, but our perspectives aren't the only ones that matter.

Surprise, surprise, someone out there might like Tom Sandoval.

Don't ask me how, but they might.

And it's it's insane or Jack's for that matter, but yeah, and it's disheartening.

The fandom is I think they're in a place of growth, we'll put it that way.

I think that I don't know if you've seen the movie Eddington.

It's all I can talk about lately.

No, I have not.

I highly highly suggest you see that movie in theaters if you're able.

It's about to leave theaters, I think at this point.

But it is a movie that takes place in a small town in New Mexico during like March twenty twenty or May twenty twenty, So during lockdown, a lot of people are saying, like, it's too soon to be making I don't want to be thinking about COVID, right, it's too soon.

But really I left that movie going.

There's a lot of stuff I've compartmentalized about COVID that this movie brought back out.

And I think that the undercurrent of that movie are the big dramatic effects that COVID has on and that is not like the Bravo fandom.

And this may some people may think this sounds silly.

They are not immune to the trauma of the pandemic and what it did to our brains, whether or not you had COVID or not.

And absolutely I think that we are, like Bravo fandom is a microcosm of what's going on in other pockets of the world.

Because of that the way we see people hyper fixating on stuff like this and being really upset.

I think it has something to do.

I'm working on a bigger project, but like I do think that that is a movie that I think you would really respect in that regard.

For sure, I definitely appreciate the thoughtfulness and I can agree that.

You know, I, in addition to having a degree in clinical psychology, minored in sociology as well, because I think that you know groups and culture.

To me, like all of it is interesting individuals and groups.

But when we were going through the pandemic, I did remember saying to myself, this is a shift that is going to be written about that.

You know, it's going to take time, right like with anything when there's cultural shifts.

But I think the psychological impacts on individuals, on groups, on the world, on entertainment, on everything, it just changed it all so much.

So I definitely appreciate that heads up, and that is something I will definitely try to check out because it did change everything.

And again, whether you had it or not, I had it.

I was lucky to survive because you know, I was undergoing active cancer treatment at the time.

But what I can say is it changed my brain for sure, without a doubt in ways that like chemotherapy, immunotherapy, all this other stuff, it didn't even touch that.

It was like a chemical bomb to my brain that my brain just like never was the same.

Yeah, it's it's it's it's unfortunate.

Thank you for that recommendation.

And you know what, let's get into it.

Let me read the summary for the episode that we're about to cover, which, by the way, so vander PUMPERWLL Season eight, episode seventeen was titled First Comes Love, Then Comes Marriage.

The summary is that bos Don Stassy with a quirky but romantic engagement proposal.

Danica and the Sir staff go to head to head with Sandoval Schwartz and the team from Tom Tom during an epic softball game to determine restaurant dominance.

And the one thing that I'll say is interesting is that when I was rewatching this, the cast and everything, it was so it was like before the apocalypse, right.

We had all of these couples who were still couples.

We had Brittany and Jack's, we had Arianna and Tom, we had Kate and Tom.

We had Kristin Dodian Carter, we had La La and Randall and it was you know, it was just wild.

As I was watching this, I was like, oh, I got all these couples are together and they're now in really bad places.

It's wild.

Yeah.

Now, let me ask you a quick question.

And this is not me trying to got you or anything.

What did you Because I had a different title for this episode, same description, a different title.

Huh, it was not part.

Okay, So here's the thing.

I looked it up on Peacock huh.

And this is not the first time this has happened to me, by the way, this is why I'm like very sam right.

Yeah, so either way, same episode, the softball, the bow proposal, all of them.

Yeah, yeah, isn't that interesting?

And I did use AI to like get a synopsis of the maybe AI listen.

AI goes into psychosis.

This is what it's actually one of the topics of this week's haves these episode as AI psychosis.

So wow, And I didn't even know that.

So there's an accidental plug, honey, because I but you know why, here's why I've been coming to terms with us.

To a little side note, there are chatbots in mental health spaces that are using AI in very serious scenarios where they should not be and it is, yep, hurting people's mental health and it is causing problems.

You cannot replace humans with computers when it comes to therapists.

You can't do it.

No, there's a I know we're about to talk about the episode, but there is a big thing going on on TikTok right now with this woman named Kendra who has fallen into AI psychosis because she's convinced herself that her therapist was in love with her and stayed with her.

But it's the more she tells the story, the more it's like, yeah, and then I talked to Claude, and then I talked to Chad GBT and then the ones that were like verifying her story and the one that was playing Devil's advocate.

It's very scary.

Very Oh gosh, Rob, that is scary.

Oh my gosh.

Well, I'm glad we accidentally touched on this topic because you and I will have to talk about that more because there it's like with all these new shifts that happen, which AI is one of them.

You know, it's like the Wild West until you get some rules and regulations that the whole AI psychosis thing.

It's like, you cannot use that.

Like it's great to use AI for for example, looked up a little summary of this little ep.

Yep, you know, that's helpful.

It's helpful to write a resume, it's helpful for a lot of things.

But it can't it cannot replace.

It's not your the therapist doctors, you know, right, Like we still need humans.

Okay, we can't forget about humans.

So all right, Yeah, it's not going to take your job.

Just the people who know how to use it correctly might That's.

That's right, that's right.

Yeah, And if you want to have a job, a guaranteed job forever, become a therapist because people will always need therapists and we can't chatbots can't do it.

So yep, all right.

So the season eight cast again, like I said, it was truly.

I was watching this and I was like, these were the best days of our lives.

These were the VPR days where it was like Arianna, Brittany Jax, James Kennedy, Katie Maloney, Kristen Dodie, La La, Sheena Stassi, Tom Sandoval, Tom Schwartz, Lisa vander Pump.

And then it also included Bo.

You know who proposed to Stasi and obviously now they're married, Max, Brett, Dana Rachel aka Raquel, Peter, Charlie, Danica and Brett.

Whoo, that's a cast.

That's it.

Yeah.

Now, whenever I would bring up to people that I was watching season eight, they'd be like, oh, that's the worst season and I have to disagree upon this.

Rewatch for my Patreon and Maya Satis.

Yeah, what I will say is, so the whole first half of the season is Jackson Brittany's wedding.

Yeah, that is really good TV because it's insane, especially League.

Yeah, with everything we know now, but you've got the homophobic and transphobic pastor they have to like fire.

And then so Jackson Sandoval getting a huge fight where Jack's plocks exactly who we find out Sandoval is in season ten and eleven.

We get the Lance Bass, we get the Kentucky Castle, we get all of that drama.

But then after the wedding, it is kind of like, well, what the hell do we do for the rest of the season, And like it's in these kind of episodes where like there's like two episodes prior to this where it's like all right, we go to Vegas for Katie and Schwartz's second wedding, but it's really just a commercial for Leasa's like new Caesar's.

Yea her new restaurant.

Oh yeah, there's the the girls have a wine event that is just a fight.

It's all very awkward.

And then we get this episode where there's actually, I will still say, not a complete episode.

We have this fun stuff with the proposal, but then the last half of the episode is a softball game, so right, right, it.

Was so disjointed.

Also, I feel like at this time there's just so many people on the cast that it was like they were like, we don't know what we're doing here.

Well, and this is like supposed to be the last season before the original Valley, right, so it was gonna be like introduce these new people then like Stossy and Jackson, everyone who bought houses will go on.

But then they all got fired for terrible behavior, right.

And can you remind everyone what everyone got fired for?

Well, take a wild guess, everyone listening, guess what.

They wrote some terrible things online.

They went.

Stossy in particular, went on podcasts and bragged about how her and Kristen called the cops on a woman on faith because they saw a woman who they convinced them so Elf was faith in a police video.

But really they were just mad at her because of the Jackson Brittany situation, pretty much showing their bias and racist behavior.

Jackson Brittany were asked not to return, and I think that was a nicer way of not firing them for whatever reason.

Well, Jax gets a lot of breaks with that.

This is now his second break, right, he got to leave on his own and now he got to leave on his own after being an abuser on TV.

So make that make sense.

But anyway, well, Jackson'll be back in season four.

That's why I was literally he's taking this season off that.

Rob Literally, I swear to you, I will quit this show and Bravo if if this man is ever back on TV.

You heard it here first, abitious done.

I am not sure you're.

Gonna You're gonna be done.

That man will be back in season four.

I guarantee it, And yeah, I may be right.

Look, I think that you are very have very valid reasons there.

I will say no, one's beyond redemption.

X just doesn't seem like he's a man who wants to have it or wants to do the work.

I'd love to be proven wrong, right, I'd love for him to be to be proven wrong.

But I'm right there with you.

I think they'll probably try and bring in like a Sandoval and so that they can have a fight.

In season four, there was rumors that they were looking at Tom Sandoval for the Valley and some other folks and that wasn't there a rumor that like Sheena is and La La are definitely going to be on next season or something like that.

I've never heard anything official, but I think that's what people are leaning towards.

Look, and I'm not a Sena hater.

I think that like a lot of people give her a lot of grief, but Gina makes good TV and Sheena is at the end of the day harmless compared to a lot of people.

And four, I think there's look, here's here's me for sure.

I'm gonna be thrown out some therapy words real quick, so don't don't don't get angry.

But I think there's a lot of transference happening with Sheena.

Sheha.

Well, I love that transference.

I love it.

Yeah, yeah, Well so in specifically in this episode, or you just feel in general.

I think in general, I think that it's easier for people.

Well, and this is societies, right, I think it's really easy to focus on one thing that you don't like then like a systemic problem.

And yeah, I think that Sheena just has like Sheena has qualities that have been shown on this show that are not very like ideal.

And I think some people have seen or have had a friend that was like Sheena and they are no longer friends with that person, so they do not like Sena.

And I think in a different world that could have been our It just didn't happen to be Ariana, right, well, and.

The reason it didn't happen to be Ariana is because she became the golden the golden one, because of what Tom did.

Like people have to understand Ariana is seems like a wonderful person.

I don't know her, I've never met her.

She seems great, but she society put her up on this pedestal, like like you said, when women get cheated on, they projected all of their problems and stuff onto Ariana and they were like, she represents all wronged women, and we put her up on this pedestal, and so it's not that she doesn't deserve things.

I just think that societally everyone made her a queen and you know, listen, good for her.

Yeah, but yeah, I mean, I totally am with you.

And she was an audience proxy for so long, so it's easier, right, right.

But so essentially, what Rob is saying is that, like you know, and I talk about this on the show a lot, is that when we're dealing with stuff in our personal lives, we see sheen or someone on TV and we project our stuff, we transfer our stuff onto them, and then we see things in them that we don't like, but it's really more about us.

And so well, so we'll start out with the beginning of the episode is that it's so funny because the episode before this, Bo and Stacy got into like this insane fight and he was going to propose to her the next day.

And I remember watching this like in real time, like when the season had started, and I just thought, oh my gosh, that's so funny.

She was just like so awful to him, And then he had this whole plan too.

They were looking at mausoleums because it was like Stacy's way of trying to get Bo to commit because told her he wasn't going to propose this year.

So she thought, in her mind, well, if we buy a mausoleum together, he's with me for life.

And I was like, that's an interesting way to get a commitment.

Interesting.

It's very great storyline, Stocy, and we know you're good for like making that, and yeah, it's also one of those things where like in that previous episode, she's also like, Okay, well, we're also like not not trying to have kids, so one way or another, we're going to be together because we know we want children.

But if that happens before marriage, well you know we're going to have a family.

And I think it's you know, it's played up for the cameras, of course, but it is the whole Kristen fight in general.

I have a lot of problems with here, but that really comes into play after the actual proposal.

I think that Bo did a good job with the proposal in general.

I think the idea of doing it there having your friend hide the ring, like I think Stasi in the back of her mind knew Bo was going to be proposing this season, but I don't think she knew it was going to happen here.

I think she thought this was just like b roll footage they were.

Filming, literally, and that's why I think it was brilliant the way that he did it, because to me, it seemed like she was authentically shocked and like is this happening right now?

Which I love because someone like Stacy, you know, because the minute he put the ring on her finger, she literally morphed into a Bridezilla on camera, like it was just the wildest transformation.

She's like, let's go to literly.

We gotta do this, we gotta do that.

I'm like, you've been engaged for twelve seconds.

This is wild.

But you could tell that she did a good job of surprising her, which because I imagine that's really hard to do.

But it was sweet.

He was like, had a friend leave it by the bench and this really interesting case that it looked like an old bell, and you know, the ring was gorgeous and it's a family heirloom and she literally like just took it out of the box.

He's like, isn't that my job?

I also clocked that after it she was like, I'm engaged, motherfuckers, which is a callback to when Sheina gets engaged and Sina shouts down in her and shake, you're engaged, motherfuckers.

It's like, Pam, they're really all that back here.

Yeah, dang, that's pretty good.

I did not catch that, my gosh.

So then of course we see Lisa throws this huge engagement party, which here's here's the thing Lisa vander Pump.

For me, I'm not a fan of Lisa vander Pump.

I think that.

Yeah, for me, she does, like listen, she's got I think her and Ken they have such a sweet relationship.

I love how much she loves dogs at her beautiful home.

That it's like, I mean all of it.

I admire all that, but she does make it really hard.

I think specifically how she treats the male employees versus the female just you know, she's definitely got some misogynistic internalized stuff there that I hate to see women have.

And you know, she just seems really like you know, because I was someone who watched Real House, so I was a Beverly Hills of course, and there's just something that seems really disingenuous about her, and it's like her or the Highway.

And I think that's why she doesn't have a lot of connections to anyone who's not Ken, because Ken, what I've noticed, is always like an echo chamber for Lisa.

Yeah.

Absolutely, And the thing is like, I've been with my husband for twenty three years, and like, you have to have someone who lets you know when you're being an asshole, who lets you know when you're wrong, who lets you know when you're like speaking out of turn or just like whatever.

And Lisa and Ken they don't have that relationship.

So I just think Lisa because she's a boss because of being with Ken, she doesn't have anyone who really challenges her.

And then she certainly has escaped accountability from you know, the Jump on Bravo.

But anyway, she throws this big party to celebrate her engagement, and she surprised Dossy with her mom and her dad, who were divorced and rarely together at the same time.

So that was really sweet to see, and Stacy seems really surprised.

And then we get that weird scene with Sena that we had talked about earlier.

Yes, so let's explain.

It is well, go ahead, sorry, so I'll just say.

Really quickly, Shina is sitting down at the lunch at next to Stossy's brother, who at this point I think was fourteen something.

Does that sound right?

Something like fourteen but.

Clearly you're eighteen, let's put it out there.

Oh and very under like you're You look at him and he's like, you know, he's like a sweet boy that's growing and becoming his own person, and you know he's a teenager, but he's not an adult.

And you see Shina sitting next to him and she's drinking her drink and she's using this vocal fry that she loves to use, and it the way that it was edited, it really looked like she was flirting with this kid.

She's like, so do you have a girlfriend or you know, just like the way she was going about it.

But now we know that it was edited to look like look a certain way, which it did.

It looked to me like, uh, shena, come on, this guy.

He's a specifically cut confessional interviews as well.

So it's like, so do you have a girlfriend, And it's like the youngest I would ever date someone is twenty one?

That's you know what I mean?

Like, it's that's right, specifically edited to evoke a certain type of experience when watching it, which is inappropriate.

Look at how lame Sheena is.

I can't believe she's doing this.

And my biggest thing here is like to any critical viewer, like, obviously this is someone trying to make Sena look bad.

Like it's very apparent that this is not what's going on and could happen to anyone.

And so to go forward from this point, let's say you are naive and I don't mean stupid, I mean someone is naive.

They do not know how these shows are made.

They don't get it, they don't have all of the piece is.

That's fine, But the moment it's actually presented that an editor did this on purpose and you find out about that, it makes the discussion of these shows so much more nuanced going forward.

And I'm not a Janet fan per se, but it's just as easy to say in the Valley that the only things cut together from Janet is a specific storyline of her inserting herself in everyone else's business.

That's right.

Now.

Do I think that that's what Janet was doing?

Yes, because she's also admitted that in other interviews.

But the blind faith of what we're seeing is reality is frightening because we have this moment now where someone admitted to it and got fired for it, and so conveniently, when we want to call that into an argument as a fandom, we can, But when we don't like a person and don't want to have that, we can leave it out.

And I think it's, you know, to your point of what we had talked about earlier, is that we all have our own perspectives, our own that are formed by our life experiences, the things that happen to us.

And when you have someone on a show who's responsible for making a storyline based on one person who may or may have certain issues with that cast member, it's never going to pan out to be reality.

It's that person's reality, it's that production editor, whatever you call them.

And so I think that is one of the things that you become acutely aware of on these shows is that it's frank and editing, and it happens to everybody based on these certain perspectives that people have.

Well, some people like I'm not a Janet hater either, I tend not to.

I don't have like a on a strong feelings for folks because I look at people like everybody's human, except for Jax to me, that's a different level.

I have no empathy for him whatsoever, and it's rare to hear me say that I think everyone deserves redemption and empathy, not him currently.

But that you also don't have to give it, you know.

Right, not for me.

Anyway, he can get it from his other people.

It's not going to be from me.

But I do think that it's fair to say that, you know, these people are edited into characters, are edited in a storylines, and it's based on sometimes very myopic views of people who want the world to see them a certain way.

Yeah, I mean one hundred percent.

And I'm not saying like no one on these shows are perfect, and I'm sure Sheena has annoyed the hell out of plenty of people.

That doesn't mean someone can't just like have fun on their workday and be like, oh my god, I'm going to click together all these soundbites because this now makes this scene more fun for me to work on and entertaining for the people who are approving of this.

Right crazy, it is crazy?

And also, can I note that this person got fired for this, but Jack's abused his wife over and over and he was never fired and he got to walk away.

Can I just point that out?

Well?

And also this one person did this and now we sit here going and that hasn't happened to anyone.

No other editors have the ability to do this, like of course it's happening, and of course, like Bravo, Skew's misogynistic, like it's It's also been a big trouble for me in this season because I am not a Dana fan.

Yeah, I'm just like she's never like I'm not like a Jacks fan.

I'm not like any of these but I there are certain elements to me, like working in comedy for so long, where like I also like I'll see like the jokes staying to make and I'm like, this is not for me.

But then i have to also pull back a little bit because I'm like, but Bravo makes it so easy to like dislike women on these shows that like, I can't fall into that trap.

Yeah, I can say, Dana, that joke's not landing for.

Me, you know what I mean, that's fair, The jokes aren't landing.

You know.

Some it is funny because I with Dana, I appreciated her, but I know what you mean, Like I think she was trying really hard.

Which again, if I was going to be featured on TV, who's to say I would, I don't.

I think we would all do the same thing, right, It's like exact, here's the camera, do your stick, and she did it and it just didn't kind of.

And so it's.

Interesting storious for being like very very confident, and that is such a hard road to tow or what hard whatever that phrase.

Hard line to time?

I think, yes, I think.

It's like marching to the beat of your own drum.

That's also a phrase I screw up and have to think about.

But it's such a hard road to toe because of course you want to come off as confident and cool and collected, but there's that certain level where you can also clock like this confidence is so over the top that it's like you're you're hiding a little bit of shyness or not very confident.

It's that like phone.

Over compensating, yeah, a little bit, yeah, yeah.

And so it was interesting because speaking of Dana that there was like a period before Sheena met Brock and obviously now there's like a hole after she released her book.

There's a whole lot of information there, but there was like this love triangle between Max, Brett and Dana and then like Shina was involved with that too.

Yeah, because like before filming this season, Sena and Max had like hooked up and gone out briefly and then.

She bought him an Apple Watch.

Yeah, she bought him an Apple Watch.

And then Sheena and Brett like had a quasi think.

I don't think they ever actually hooked up, but they like were hanging out before filming and I and then the show starts with her like hooking up with The season starts with her hooking up with Max, and then she thinks Max cheats on her even though they very much were not exclusive, and that is like hamred in in the episodes.

And then she finds out that he didn't actually cheat on her, and she's like, oh yeah, and we weren't exclusive.

The timelines don't add up, and Max is like, no, thanks, this is I don't need that in my life right now.

She's like, okay, I'm gonna ask Brett.

Out right, So then they both move on to Brett and then.

Sheina's just like trying to talk to her.

She's like, this is weird, and like, from my perspective, reading between the lines.

It's kind of like Sheena being like, I already did this.

This is not a good idea, don't But also it's really weird because I did this and I know what it's like, because it's like, oh, now Max is gonna be like you're going to his friend, You're going to the coworker, you're going to the cast member, and like, now I'm also pointing out that like, isn't this weird?

And what they're not saying is is this just for the show?

Is this true for the show?

Because if it is, it's very very clear, and.

If it's not, we need to make sure that everyone knows that or you were gonna get in a world of.

Hurt, right well, and then and then yes, and then the episode after this, the preview was Sheena had Brett, like she did that like bedroom like faux sex scene with yeah.

Right.

That was like the next episode after this, and I was just like, oh, Shina, you're so messy, so so so.

So, so let's acting.

It's just acting right.

Good as gold, honey.

But one thing that I loved I love seeing Jiggy because even though I'm not a huge vander Pump fan, I love all her animals.

I just want them for my own.

And we got to see sweet little Jigster.

And here's the other interesting thing speaking of Sheena.

Sheena's aunt of course, like all roads come back to Shina she Okay, Sheena's aunt, you find out in this episode was a Rockford Peach.

And if you don't know what a Rockford Peach is, that is the women's female baseball team that was featured in a legal well it was the about a league of their own.

It wasn't the real team, but it was based on that.

I'm not explaining it well.

And of course you see Sheena like throwing her softball and you see like this old picture of her like aunt who is a Rockford Peach, And I was like, all roads lead back to Shena.

That was wild.

Sheena is lover hater.

She makes television and has like mysteries that are still left to be discovered.

And this was one of the good ones.

Yeah, I mean, she didn't you know, on the Valley this year.

She didn't really show up too much or make an impact.

But I obviously, like after you know, her book came out and we found out about the whole Brock cheating reveal I mean, I would imagine that next season on The Valley will get some more of this digging for good as gold whatever we're gonna find out.

Here's what I don't know.

I need season three of The Valley to go summerhouse mode, and like I need seventy percent of the cast gone and really hone on who the show is about and bring in some supporting characters that might be able to give us some crucial storylines in future seasons.

Because what does that look like for you?

I say keep See it's hard, I don't like, but.

I will say keep Jesse Lally.

I think he's a creep, but he's not dangerous, right, Jax is dangerous.

Jesse Lally doesn't seem to be dangerous at this point.

He's not a good person, but I think he can make good tea.

I think you keep Janet for the same reasons she makes.

I mean, arguably people were talking more about Janet than they were Jacks, which is insane.

That is such a solid point.

Do you understand how wild someone has to be for them to be talked about more than Jack's That is a very solid point.

Yeah.

I heard a rumor that Brittany might be getting let go too, and I think it's just a rumor.

Like, I don't think Britney's.

Going She's like the biggest person on the show.

I feel like she's the number one guy.

Yeah, but her storylines have always revolved about around Jack's shadow, So keeping her will allow her the space to, you know, maybe if she's available to be the star of a show.

Now is the time right.

Comment to her on see if you can do that?

Yeah?

Yeah, But when I made a TikTok about hearing that rumor, people are like, no, get rid of Janet instead, And I'm like, Bravo's never going to do that.

There, right, she's good TV.

Yeah, that's that's right, that's right.

So I really think that between that, like you keep Christy, you keep Brittany, you keep Jesse Lally, you keep Janet.

Right, mm hmmm, I don't think we really need.

Jason, but you can't have Janet without Jason.

They're like so co dependents.

No, but I didn't think you will have a smaller diminished role or an exploded one.

But I don't think I think he's in the weird gray.

Zone right now, right.

I think Zach's got to stay if Jasmine stays they're gonna need to give her she needs to have a significant discussion like point on the show, like like Jasmine, But there's the whole Danny situation.

Vallid was more about Danny than it is about Jasmine, and that's unfortunate because there were some I go back to the wine scene in the valley where Jasmine and Melissa actually explained to Danny, like more than that, it's like bad to touch a woman when she doesn't want to be touched, like the actual social implications of you doing that as well to write.

But don't you think it's so interesting that that scene that was Jasmine's they kept not showing it.

It was just a flashback, and I just feel like they used Jasmine and Melissa like token gay women and discarded them.

That's how I feel, and I didn't like it.

So I'm saying, like I think Jasmine, I don't want Jasmine to lose her job on this show, but I'm not strong.

I'm not confident in Bravo in like providing them the space to have a storyline that's gonna be compelling, and that's what I want.

But you know, other than that, like Danny and Nia.

I honestly think they can go Like I don't.

I don't think they're really bringing much to the show either.

Yeah, either way, that's what I'm saying.

So I guess I've kept like more than half the cast, but it is I think if if we had to keep people, well, Kristen, Janet, Brittany, Jesse Lowly are the people to keep right the main.

Right, and then everyone else could kind of be like Acoutremont right.

Yeah yeah, well listen, I mean, we're gonna find out, and it'll be interesting when we do find out.

But was there anything else rob about this episode that you wanted to say that we didn't get to?

The last thing I'll say about Season eight, episode seven, just to back up to what I was saying about how this second half of the season kind of falls apart.

M hm, it's it's it's tough that this season gets the look of it's bad because of all the new people, because Charlie's great and Charlie stays on.

Danica was awesome, and it's too bad she didn't get more seasons.

I you know, I think Max is actually good for the group.

He seems like a bad dude, but like Obviously, Katie hooks up with him in season eleven, so is he's still around you know, yeah, so he's actually seems to be part of the group.

Brett, no thanks, Dana, no thanks.

And I think this season suffers because people just remember those folks like, oh, they really tried to like pull one over on.

Us, right, right.

The whole first half is great, it's crumbling here.

I think towards the end we get some really good stuff though, because like Santoval and Jacks go at it again.

And this I'll stand by this.

The finale of this season was the first time when watching vander Bumper Rules that I was like, oh my god, I cannot believe I have to wait another year until I get it.

Because the finale of this season is the one where Jack's like screaming at Lisa and he's like, it's my show, that's.

Right, because and then that's what got him fired the first time.

Well, oh not that, but I think that didn't do him any favors.

Well, you're right, that didn't help.

But then cut to like the Valley season two where we find out that during that time, Jacks was actually torturing Brittany because he was fired and she was the breadwinner and his teeny tiny little ego couldn't handle that.

Yeah, so you know, and so it's just it was I appreciate you getting me back into like that VPR mode.

It was really fun, you know, for an episode to do that.

So Rob, let everybody know where they can find you, what you cover, and what they can look forward to right now from your shows.

For sure.

So the biggest way to find everything is to support the show on Patreon, which is patreon dot com slash vander pump Robs.

That's you get absolutely everything, full length, ad, free video, all of that.

But I understand that's not for everyone.

And quick tip, folks, if you do sign up for Patreon, though, you can get a feed that you can play in whatever podcast player you like, so you don't even have to use the Patreon app.

That's true.

If that's not for you, pop robs wherever you get podcasts, and I usually put previews to the episodes that are Look, you're not gonna get a full length episode unless it's very special on the main free feed no matter what, but you get a significant chunk of it, and you get smaller chunks of the bonus episode.

So like season eight is a Patreon exclusive, but I'll still usually put like fifteen or twenty minutes of those episodes up.

This will be a full length episode because I'm doing it as a feed drop, so that you're anyone who's not familiar with your podcast can now go over to your bish therapist and get all of your episodes what you can look for.

At the moment, we're kind of taking a little bit of a Bravo break except for these old VPR episodes, so we are.

We just did an episode as if this recording on the pilot of Viva Labam, which was I've a Chump, the last one of the funnest episodes I've recorded in months.

That's awesome.

We're also going to be watching My Life as Liz, which was a short lived MTV reality show about a punk rock girl in a small Texas town, and I will probably be alternating those, but the primary focus is going to be Viva La Bam, and I've got some fun episodes of that coming up, So if you want to get the taste, listen to me on Apple.

I recently lost all of my Apple followers, reviews, and ratings due to a catastrophic user error that was not done by me.

Folks, got yours, that's right, wasn't Robs.

Now.

I recently took the show independent and there was an accident when transferring it to my ownership.

So if you are not a Patreon person, try and leave me five stars or go follow on Apple and I'd appreciate it.

Thank you, Melissan, thank you for having.

Me on my gosh, Rob, of course, thank you for coming on.

This has been so fun.

We're definitely going to have to do this again.

I think going back to old shows is so brilliant and it's so interesting, and going outside of Bravo is so necessary.

But I've talked to my audience a bunch about the importance of reviews, and I know that was a really hard thing for you.

So if you could all do Rob a huge favor, go give him ratings on APPA podcasts please.

It really does make a difference.

I've just, like you know, every episode I talk to my audience about why this matters and it is a big deal and all of that.

We would love if you could please do that.

Thank you so much.

And so not only check Rob out vander Pump Robs check out Patreon, you could also check me out on Patreon.

I have recommended vander pump Robs on my Patreon and so I think there's a way to click to.

You can go to his patreon from mine, But either way we're going to be doing this collab and so we would appreciate spreading the love.

Thank you Rob so much for being here.

This has been a blast and can't wait to do it again.

So until next time, sending love to you and yours and tata for now.

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