[SPEAKER_02]: I think so.

[SPEAKER_02]: Great choice.

[SPEAKER_02]: Unless you weren't recording.

[SPEAKER_07]: Always be recording A-B-R.

[SPEAKER_07]: That was a great one coupe.

[SPEAKER_07]: I saw you missed it, Delco.

[SPEAKER_01]: I absolutely love those guys.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have since I was a kid.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's only two albums that I've purchased multiple times and that's the first president to the United States album.

[SPEAKER_04]: Same.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm an elastic firecracker by tripping Daisy.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've had to buy multiple copies of those albums up until they went digital just because I was wearing them out.

[SPEAKER_07]: What's how does Peach is hold out?

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you want to hear a real blast from the past.

[SPEAKER_01]: Peach is a still a fucking banger.

[SPEAKER_05]: What's a real blast?

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl by tripping Daisy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: Would you recognize that one?

[SPEAKER_05]: I don't do the Jack.

[SPEAKER_08]: The Jack Black, the Jack Black, Peach is.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh no, didn't he?

[SPEAKER_08]: Super Mario movie.

[SPEAKER_08]: Did you do a cover of it?

[SPEAKER_08]: No, he's doing it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach, Peach.

[SPEAKER_07]: What's it called?

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl by tripping Daisy.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know, but I do like when I'm like, oh, yeah, I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think you might remember it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's roughly the same areas as Presidents.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just photos for this one.

[SPEAKER_01]: recognize it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl who lives with me.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, this one?

[SPEAKER_01]: Got a girl.

[SPEAKER_01]: She smells so sweetly.

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl.

[SPEAKER_01]: She loves her.

[SPEAKER_07]: I wasn't as cool as you did.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ah, obviously.

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl who speaks her hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: I got a girl who claims it on her period.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, God.

[SPEAKER_01]: God, God, hope.

[SPEAKER_01]: This was a big hit.

[SPEAKER_01]: in the like Pacific Northwest during the early nineties, biggest on in the radio.

[SPEAKER_01]: But this one's still good.

[SPEAKER_07]: to the country gonna eat a lot of peaches moving to the country gonna eat a lot of peaches see talking about but or vaginas do I think back in that day it'd be it'd be vagina vagina yeah but's weren't real big guys yeah yeah yeah but's weren't real big back in the early nineties [SPEAKER_01]: They were put there by man in a factory downtown The fuck is this you know this one or you didn't want to what's crazy Ross was just seeing this song yesterday [SPEAKER_07]: This is when you didn't have to be good looking, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.

[SPEAKER_07]: I have a hip band.

[SPEAKER_01]: Every single member of this band looks like a cancer patient.

[SPEAKER_01]: The country, we're gonna meet in a lot of beaches.

[SPEAKER_08]: There's a blind spot for me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Really, never heard this one.

[SPEAKER_01]: When did this come out?

[SPEAKER_01]: This was like, ninety two, ninety three.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I was one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Probably, I was going to say you're probably listening to Baby Shark then, but I don't think Baby Shark was even out back then.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, Baby Shark's pretty old, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, lump had me already.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, lump had me going, and I love that Delco just like has a no idea.

[SPEAKER_07]: Because if you didn't hear it at the time, it must sound insane.

[SPEAKER_01]: Where does fuck?

[SPEAKER_01]: Bonkers.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of the music from that, that era of the nineties.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's still like my favorite era of music of all time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because like, but it's all so goddamn weird.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's so weird.

[SPEAKER_07]: Being dorky and weird and like, just nonsensical was the thing.

[SPEAKER_07]: Crash test dummies.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, God, that's another band.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know, Crash test dummies?

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm putting that on my Spotify playlist.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I don't forget.

[SPEAKER_07]: I gotta play just a little bit of this song just to see.

[SPEAKER_07]: You probably don't.

[SPEAKER_07]: Because you're a little tiny baby.

[SPEAKER_01]: There was an arrow.

[SPEAKER_01]: I actually I know the weird alversion of this song better than the real version.

[SPEAKER_01]: Where?

[SPEAKER_00]: Where?

[SPEAKER_00]: He finally came back.

[SPEAKER_00]: His hair had turned from black into bright white.

[SPEAKER_07]: No?

[SPEAKER_00]: No.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was from when they caused it crash so...

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, fuck, I know those guys.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, a little bit.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's so crazy that we know someone that doesn't know that song.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of...

It's not my child.

[SPEAKER_07]: And even then, he probably knows it.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's the name of it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Delco, if you ever wanted to...

Let's do it check it out.

[SPEAKER_08]: Revisit it.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's called...

Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think I got it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay, okay, it's just a bunch of ms in a row.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was gonna say it probably help if you spell it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Listen, I'll just send it to you, okay?

[SPEAKER_07]: I'll just send it to you.

[SPEAKER_03]: Authorities are desperately searching for a killer accused of going on a rampage.

[SPEAKER_03]: The search for a possible serial killer.

[SPEAKER_07]: An urgent manhood for a man of authorities believe is behind a triple killing spree.

[SPEAKER_00]: Police here speculating that a possible serial killer may have struck again.

[SPEAKER_00]: Toward to get out of the car and ask when she became afraid.

[SPEAKER_00]: And then a shelter.

[SPEAKER_00]: Welcome!

[SPEAKER_07]: What did you do?

[SPEAKER_07]: Welcome to Crime Corner!

[SPEAKER_07]: I am your host, Jesse Wiseman.

[SPEAKER_07]: As always, I am joined by my co-host, Koopaloup.

[SPEAKER_07]: We've got something for everybody.

[SPEAKER_07]: Koopaloup for the mom.

[SPEAKER_07]: Delco Dan for the gals.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's separate the moms in the gals.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know, like my mom, like Ross's mom.

[SPEAKER_07]: They just moms are just like fascinated with you.

[SPEAKER_07]: They love you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Koop for the coogers and Delco for the ladies.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can get behind that.

[SPEAKER_07]: For the gals, for the bros.

[SPEAKER_07]: for the ladies that are still out there doing it, you know, doing something.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, you get a lot of, like, from our moms, you get a lot of.

[SPEAKER_07]: Gosh, I just love that coup.

[SPEAKER_07]: So hey, I'll summon that voice.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do you know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: Kind of frightening to think that any given moment I could possibly become one of your stepdad's.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's so true.

[SPEAKER_07]: And then you have me, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm who am I for?

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm for like a middle age.

[SPEAKER_07]: Maybe like a thirty thirty six thirty eight that's kind of thinking I feel like I should settle down.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_07]: What's the kind of gal that I should you know?

[SPEAKER_08]: I don't think so.

[SPEAKER_08]: The kid that made a move on you and Miami was like twenty four.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's that's what I was going to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's what I was going to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: You could you could pull college guys all day if you were single.

[SPEAKER_07]: me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: If they're going through a phase of like, I think I want to settle down.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_07]: But I don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: But we try and we try and have something for everybody here, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Today we've got another fun and flirty episode for you that's got all of our favorite things, a failing marriage.

[SPEAKER_07]: a horrible mother-in-law, and a man allegedly killed in self-defense we love.

[SPEAKER_07]: This is the case of Catherine Ristelli.

[SPEAKER_07]: So if I were to tell you guys, like give you an example of all the things not to do, [SPEAKER_07]: Right, when you're like murdering or self-defying all of the things, all of the things, it would be this.

[SPEAKER_07]: And you guys would be like, come on, no one would do that.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I'd be like, you'd be surprised how stupid people are, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: This case is one of those.

[SPEAKER_07]: And a little shout out to my mother-in-law, Diane, big fan of the show.

[SPEAKER_01]: Really?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, hell yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think because she secretly is like, that's son of mine, my god.

[SPEAKER_07]: I just want to, I just, it's maybe cathartic when I'm like, oh, Ross.

[SPEAKER_07]: But I do have a message for you, Diane, if you could tell your son.

[SPEAKER_07]: So he insists on keeping the trash cans inside the garage and will not break down boxes.

[SPEAKER_07]: So if you could kind of, my gal, my girl, if you could kind of just ease into conversation that like, that's not what you do.

[SPEAKER_07]: So when the kids and I are going out to the car, there's flies and wasps, you know, coming from the trash.

[SPEAKER_01]: The big trash can inside the garage in the Texas heat.

[SPEAKER_07]: In the Texas heat inside the garage.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I've got poop diapers.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let's see.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, we're talking about a man that opens a bag of almonds and just leaves it open.

[SPEAKER_08]: I mean, I, you know, never reseals a goddamn thing in the office.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's true.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's true.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's true.

[SPEAKER_07]: Doesn't have the time for it.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I can attest to that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think there's a bag of almonds sitting in the kitchen right now that it has been open since we moved to the studio.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, Ross, we were just talking about you live on air.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, no, it's so kale just put you on speaker.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: Is everything all right?

[SPEAKER_03]: Child is missing for football.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I will text the neighbor.

[SPEAKER_07]: Thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: Love you, bye-bye.

[SPEAKER_07]: Love you, bye-bye.

[SPEAKER_01]: You say a child's missing?

[SPEAKER_07]: For football.

[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, not in your child or in child.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, our shot.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, since we have three, you're like one of them.

[SPEAKER_07]: One of them's missing.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: Don't know which one, but I know the head counts off.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is crime, colonel.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes, sorry.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: Live.

[SPEAKER_08]: Breaking.

[SPEAKER_07]: Breaking live.

[SPEAKER_07]: He should know that this little son of a bitch.

[SPEAKER_07]: They will try anything.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, I didn't know what time it was.

[SPEAKER_07]: Watch.

[SPEAKER_07]: There's times on everything no matter where you go.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're at somebody's house.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what time it is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, if there are anything like my niece and nephew, they're constantly glued to an iPad.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there's definitely a clock on those.

[SPEAKER_01]: Time for an ass.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we have a time for a minute.

[SPEAKER_07]: Anyways, Ms.

[SPEAKER_07]: Thott, Ms.

[SPEAKER_07]: Diane, if you can just, you know, slip that into conversation, he will listen to you.

[SPEAKER_07]: We'll not listen to me on that one.

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, right coup, did I set it up right?

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I think set it up really well.

[SPEAKER_01]: Horrible mother-in-law, got a marriage kind on the rocks.

[SPEAKER_07]: We got self-defense.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're gonna try and figure out if it is, if it isn't.

[SPEAKER_07]: with a failing marriage, you never know, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: So let's get into it, Koop.

[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, as always, we're going to start off with a setting the scene a little bit of history about where we're going, which surprisingly coincides with the case itself.

[SPEAKER_01]: For our case this week, we will be going to the land of God's chosen people, which is of course Utah.

[SPEAKER_01]: If there's anything that Utah's famous for, it's the Mormons.

[SPEAKER_01]: And modern times, Mormons are primarily known for their missionary work, magic underwear, and a sexual technique known as soaking, which is a different kind of missionary work.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if you travel back in time a couple hundred years, they were known as a dangerous Christian cult that wasn't above killing some people in the name of their Lord and Savior Joseph Smith.

[SPEAKER_08]: Well, Joseph Smith got it.

[SPEAKER_08]: In Missouri, [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, this was a little after the death of Joseph Smith.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, they got pushed out to Utah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Brigham Young was in charge when they when they started heading out west.

[SPEAKER_08]: You know, it was legal to like hunt Mormons until like the sixties.

[SPEAKER_08]: Pretty recent the nineteen sixties.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, I wasn't aware of that.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm going to look up the official lobby.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm pretty sure it was up until like the sixties or seven.

[SPEAKER_01]: They just had an open contract on there.

[SPEAKER_01]: It liked it.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to get a license or anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like to scape.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, damn up until the sixties.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of things went wrong in the sixties.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of decisions we made that we could we kind of walk back a little bit at this point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, we got a decent amount of information.

[SPEAKER_07]: It ended then.

[SPEAKER_07]: I would say that's a problem.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, didn't start in the sixties.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm sorry.

[SPEAKER_08]: No.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's like in Texas where you could just kill a muddy and be like passion.

[SPEAKER_07]: It was passion.

[SPEAKER_08]: And then a crime of passion is an actual legal deficit.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: And it was Missouri Order executive order, forty four.

[SPEAKER_08]: So maybe that was the inspiration for George Lucas and the Jedi with the Sith.

[SPEAKER_01]: Order sixty-six executive forty-foot that makes a lot of sense executive order forty-four kill all the Mormons this is Mormon to it until seventy-six well the beginning of its born and shit Missouri shit we'll get away from the more you know I'm saying the killing of them I guess would be christian ship right yeah that's yeah depends on what kind of christian you are [SPEAKER_01]: Anyway, between eighteen fifty-seven and eighteen fifty-eight, the early Mormon Church but it heads with the US government and a conflict known as the Mormon Rebellion that resulted in the deaths of over one hundred and fifty people.

[SPEAKER_01]: Surprisingly, in the majority of these deaths all occurred in a single incident known as the Mountain Meadows Massacre.

[SPEAKER_01]: This was an unprovoked attack carried out by Mormon settlers on a group of immigrants traveling through Southern Utah on their way to California, which is depicted in the hit TV show on Netflix American Prime Evil.

[SPEAKER_08]: Do they have it in there?

[SPEAKER_08]: That's like kind of the thing that sells everything off.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the Insighting Incident or something like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, well.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to check that show out.

[SPEAKER_07]: That show is unwatchable for me.

[SPEAKER_07]: But I'm sure you guys.

[SPEAKER_08]: You don't tell a kitch?

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't mind a Taylor kitch.

[SPEAKER_07]: But when it's surrounded by the actual scalping, like you guys are talking to.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Scalping's pretty brutal.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know that word, but at least I'm shooting on Mormons a little bit at the top of the episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've actually got a soft spot for him because when I was in basic training, I went to the Mormon Church services every Sunday.

[SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't because I was actually looking to convert to the religion.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just found out that it was number one.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was the longest church service.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was two hours instead of a single hour.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the people running the service would let you sleep through the entire thing if you wanted to.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're always so nice too.

[SPEAKER_01]: very very nice apple after the after the eighteen fifties and eighteen sixties they got a whole lot nicer and I think this so is so our Scientologist and so was the people from people's temple they were like come on in right I'm sure that apple white from the heavens gate called was also very very friendly guy oh my gosh big innocent blue eyes [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_08]: And then the Mormon's little key kind of run states you wouldn't think like Arizona.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, that's where the jodiarious thing went down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Wasn't her boyfriend a Mormon?

[SPEAKER_01]: The guy that she killed.

[SPEAKER_08]: They're just like all entrenched in local politics and Arizona.

[SPEAKER_08]: And like any type of desert state.

[SPEAKER_07]: There's yeah, there's there's weird pockets.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think in, yeah, desert states.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's like, say God that they're the only religion heavily in trenching themselves in our government.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think South Side of Chicago, they're pretty.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, you have to be white.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_07]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_06]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_06]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_06]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_06]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to have blonde hair.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have [SPEAKER_01]: That's where you go to get the good drugs.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do you still know it?

[SPEAKER_06]: No shit.

[SPEAKER_01]: You say you're native?

[SPEAKER_01]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: My certain members of my family say that we're part Cherokee, but anybody who who has seen the color of my skin, there's no way in hell that I'm anything but Irish Welsh and Scandinavian.

[SPEAKER_07]: a little bit of trees.

[SPEAKER_07]: The luscious hair.

[SPEAKER_07]: You might have like a Warren Elizabeth percentage.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know what that is, but it's very small.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think the measurement they use is, I'm like one quarter pocahontas of Cherokee.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So under a white flag of peace, they descended upon the immigrants with guns and knives.

[SPEAKER_01]: When the dust settled over one hundred and twenty men, women and children lay dead.

[SPEAKER_01]: Surprisingly, this wouldn't be the last time an unprovoked, unprovoked attack would occur in Utah under a flag of truce.

[SPEAKER_01]: In fact, it happened again just last year and a city known as American Fork in Northern Utah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And today, we will tell you that story.

[SPEAKER_07]: Love that name for a city.

[SPEAKER_07]: What's it called American Fork?

[SPEAKER_01]: Fork?

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Like the Fork of America.

[SPEAKER_01]: funny thing is I initially I didn't know that this was in Utah but when I saw American fork I was like that's that's got to be a city in Utah it sounds like a very Utah name for some reason yeah it's about twenty five miles out from Salt Lake City [SPEAKER_07]: pretty tight in it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know if it's a big, not like Provo or Salt Lake City, but there Utah is all.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, still has many influence there.

[SPEAKER_01]: And also Utah has some really beautiful city Salt Lake City.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's like the closest that we have to like a European city over here.

[SPEAKER_01]: At least the last time I was there in the like early to mid nineties and it was beautiful.

[SPEAKER_07]: went to Park City or you went to Salt Lake City.

[SPEAKER_01]: Salt Lake City's where they've got the was it the Tabernacle like the big big main Mormon Church as in Salt Lake, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Salt Lake City.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I don't know.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's one of European cities with that back scape though, you know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the general countryside doesn't look that way, but the architecture of the actual ornamental churches.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know what you're talking about.

[SPEAKER_07]: Uh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, well, I guess I'm primarily referring to the Mormon churches.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're very, very impressive.

[SPEAKER_07]: They really are.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's not in a mall.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, no.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's the center of town.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's huge.

[SPEAKER_08]: It doesn't look like a municipal building.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just after ten PM on July, twelfth, twenty twenty four, nine or one dispatch in American for Utah, received reports of gunshots coming from the home of fifty nine-year-old Tracy Grist.

[SPEAKER_07]: A few minutes later, police received a second call regarding the gunfire.

[SPEAKER_07]: This time, from Tracy Grist herself.

[SPEAKER_07]: She informed the officers that there had been an altercation in her home involving her thirty-four-year-old son-in-law, Matthew Ristelli.

[SPEAKER_07]: Sadly, Matthew had not survived.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, this is, I mean, crazy right out of the gate.

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, nice neighborhood, gated neighborhood.

[SPEAKER_07]: Things like this are not happening.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's telling that they received two nine one one calls in quick succession.

[SPEAKER_01]: Quick succession.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the type of neighbor had it.

[SPEAKER_07]: And one was right before one was before the other.

[SPEAKER_07]: The neighbors was before hers.

[SPEAKER_07]: But let's take a look at Matthew Rostelli, our victim.

[SPEAKER_07]: There he is.

[SPEAKER_08]: Which one?

[SPEAKER_08]: He's the adult.

[SPEAKER_07]: Thirty four year old.

[SPEAKER_08]: I would not do it a child getting shot.

[SPEAKER_08]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_08]: No, not this time.

[SPEAKER_07]: I know how much you love those.

[SPEAKER_07]: I just can't do them every time.

[SPEAKER_07]: Because you have no real feeling for children.

[SPEAKER_07]: Come on.

[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, no, I love kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: But no, of course you do.

[SPEAKER_08]: It would be tragic, yes.

[SPEAKER_08]: I don't want to cover a bunch of dead kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, I hate doing the kid stuff.

[SPEAKER_07]: Uh, but, you know, they're just always around.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm gonna get some bullets gonna sometimes happen sometimes they think they've got to come in a bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you smack him and they're still not listening, where else can you?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, listen, there's always room for those hypotheticals with how many kids could you take with your bare hands until you die of exhaustion.

[SPEAKER_08]: The answers, like, all of them, like, they can get all the smoke.

[SPEAKER_08]: As many as you can throw at me, I'll take them out.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, that's something you, you just think about.

[SPEAKER_08]: Fantasized quite often, how many like toddlers I could just beat up?

[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_08]: If there was zombies, though, you know?

[SPEAKER_01]: They're just a D.

You know, some of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I remember on on soccer history, you guys did have an ongoing debate for a while about whether or not you could take a baboon hand-a-hand.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm still up in the air about it.

[SPEAKER_08]: That was early.

[SPEAKER_08]: And I've kind of reversed course on that.

[SPEAKER_08]: No, I can't.

[SPEAKER_01]: Really?

[SPEAKER_01]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: Finally, notice the teeth.

[SPEAKER_08]: There's the teeth, but also I'm just like breaking down as a thirty-four-year-old man.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it's the age, not the will.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gotcha.

[SPEAKER_07]: They go hand in hand by the.

[SPEAKER_07]: We have another picture of of Matthew.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's him.

[SPEAKER_01]: Same guy looks like every adult member like every single one of my uncles on my mom's side of the family that that's what I have to look forward to.

[SPEAKER_07]: I got over forty six if he's a day.

[SPEAKER_07]: Whoo.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's in one of the fair for thirty.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's Delco.

[SPEAKER_07]: How do you?

[SPEAKER_01]: Thirty four.

[SPEAKER_07]: That guy's Yoray.

[SPEAKER_07]: Can we?

[SPEAKER_08]: Got like me.

[SPEAKER_07]: Hard living.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's a hard Mormon desert life dude.

[SPEAKER_01]: No joke.

[SPEAKER_01]: And one of the articles that I was reading, he was listed as being either forty-two years older, forty-six years old.

[SPEAKER_01]: The only way that I was able to contradict that was every other single source that I was using, listed him as being in his thirties.

[SPEAKER_08]: Listen, I have a skincare routine.

[SPEAKER_08]: All right.

[SPEAKER_08]: This guy doesn't.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, apparently his skin care routine is just laying out in the sun with nothing covered.

[SPEAKER_07]: Done and dry air as you can get.

[SPEAKER_07]: When officers arrived on the scene, they found Matthew lying dead in the entryway of the house.

[SPEAKER_07]: The front door was still open in the lights on the, and the lights on the ground floor of the house were all turned off.

[SPEAKER_07]: Upon inspection of the body, they found that Matthew was gripping a knife in his right hand with the tip pointing upwards in the blade facing his body.

[SPEAKER_07]: Inside the house, they discovered three adults and two children.

[SPEAKER_07]: alive.

[SPEAKER_07]: Fifteen-hine-year-old Tracy Grist, her thirty-three-year-old son Kevin Ellis, and her thirty-six-year-old daughter Catherine Rostelli, who was the wife of the murder victim and Catherine's two young children.

[SPEAKER_07]: As the forensic team secured the scene and began collecting evidence, the responding officers obtained statements from the three adults present.

[SPEAKER_07]: From their stories that appeared, they were dealing with a classic case of angry, estranged husband with murder on his mind.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which is definitely happened a lot throughout history.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's...

That's how...

Not uncommon at all.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes, that's a lot of the stories that we do.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's the premise, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: So we do have a picture delco of Catherine Ristelli.

[SPEAKER_07]: She's holding a mug, you guys, that says, does this ring make me look engaged?

[SPEAKER_07]: And that's her engagement photo.

[SPEAKER_07]: playing playing cute, but Mormon, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Utah, playing Jane?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, not sure if she was Mormon or not.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know that.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, I don't even know if the family was.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, none of that was ever mentioned.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I believe that she was from Utah, but her husband, Matthew, was from Northern California.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and I think we also have a wedding photo of the two of them.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, look at these two.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now they're he looks thirty eight.

[SPEAKER_08]: So a bit more.

[SPEAKER_05]: Younger you block out the kids face here, but not the other photo and look is that a sunglasses like tan line on him.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: He looks like one of the modern-day gold prospectors.

[SPEAKER_01]: Have you seen the people on YouTube who still have their prospects?

[SPEAKER_08]: Is he wearing a foreshare, momma?

[SPEAKER_08]: Vipers with that kind of tanline.

[SPEAKER_07]: I wonder if it's the, you know, he wears that big hat.

[SPEAKER_07]: So it wonder if it's like glass is plus bucket hat.

[SPEAKER_08]: There's a man with many hats.

[SPEAKER_07]: Many hats.

[SPEAKER_07]: But look at that.

[SPEAKER_07]: So sweet.

[SPEAKER_07]: Good looking family.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine and Matthew had been married since two thousand seventeen, but had recently begun having some issues in their relationship.

[SPEAKER_01]: For the first few years of their marriage, things have been going well.

[SPEAKER_01]: Matthew's mother, Diane Rostelli, had purchased a seven-acre wilderness property in northern California for the newlyweds as a wedding gift.

[SPEAKER_01]: Great fucking wedding gift, by the way.

[SPEAKER_07]: No shit.

[SPEAKER_07]: Any property in California?

[SPEAKER_07]: But northern California?

[SPEAKER_07]: Property, that's a good [SPEAKER_07]: Um, was there like a mo- there was some kind of dual-wide or mobile in there or something?

[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, not initially.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was- it was just the property itself, but- Oh, great.

[SPEAKER_01]: Although there was initially no house on the property, Diana, Diane surprised them once again by paying to have a manufactured home installed on the land after Catherine gave birth to their first child.

[SPEAKER_01]: And manufactured home is a nice way of saying.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's probably like a double wide trailer or something like that.

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, yeah, or it's a pre-fab.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know, the ones that you see driving down the street, I always like to say like, when's the barbecue?

[SPEAKER_07]: Just waiting for my house to get.

[SPEAKER_07]: It would just like a full ass house on the back of a truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's all.

[SPEAKER_08]: And oversized load.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, the found they just don't have like the foundation isn't fully, you know.

[SPEAKER_01]: You're one step away from trailer trash.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I don't steal valor when it comes to trailer trash because I grew up in a double wide trailer, which is not a mobile home.

[SPEAKER_00]: OK.

[SPEAKER_01]: Always well for the resteli family until their lives returned upside down by the COVID pandemic at twenty-twenty.

[SPEAKER_01]: Up until that point, Matthew had been making a comfortable living as a handyman doing various repairs on household items, but when the country was put on lockdown, the work began to dry up, leaving Katherine and Matthew in a tight spot.

[SPEAKER_01]: As the money stopped coming in, the tension between the couple began to grow.

[SPEAKER_01]: Once again, another tail is all this time right there.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: I feel like this happened a half the country.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: This is like a pretty tragic tail of the planned.

[SPEAKER_01]: I bet we could put together a COVID special that is just specifically murders that were the result of the lockdown.

[SPEAKER_08]: I guarantee there's married couples now to have the option to work from home and are like, now we'll go to work.

[SPEAKER_07]: One hundred percent.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: One hundred percent or I do know a couple wives that are like he needs to go back to the fucking off.

[SPEAKER_07]: You already mean like the office is right there.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just go.

[SPEAKER_01]: God, the amount of tension that that had to have caused in so many marriages.

[SPEAKER_07]: And then you can't think about spouses at home and no money together all the time without money.

[SPEAKER_07]: Cannot leave California.

[SPEAKER_08]: You couldn't go like like you had to be stuck in your goddamn house.

[SPEAKER_07]: That was the worst place to be.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, if they're up in rural North Carolina or North California, Northern California may be a little bit better, but if you're [SPEAKER_07]: in any of the cities you're doing for it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so go anywhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: Me and we'll Joel, obviously, we were both out in California for the beginning of the lockdowns and my buddy Adam was also out in California at the same time.

[SPEAKER_01]: What my buddy Adam ended up doing is kind of similar to what they did here just as soon as the pandemic started, him and his at that time, it was this fiance.

[SPEAKER_01]: They just went to Northern California and moved out into the middle of the wilderness and just wrote it out there, which was a good idea for them.

[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Good to be me.

[SPEAKER_05]: Good to be me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh god, I, firstly, I'm, I'm a fan of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine and Matthew did their best to overcome the financial strain of the pandemic, but fractures began to form in their relationship.

[SPEAKER_01]: He did arguments became a common occurrence and Katherine grew to respond and adding even more pressure to the relationship.

[SPEAKER_06]: The strike wasn't put now, though, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's, I mean, what are we stuck in?

[SPEAKER_01]: That's what despondent means as far as Amanda's concerned.

[SPEAKER_08]: They're fucking like rabbits for about two weeks.

[SPEAKER_08]: She wouldn't put out.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: Like, man, it was awesome for like the first couple weeks, man.

[SPEAKER_08]: We were fucking all the time.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_09]: Nothing else to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: I dare say, bro, one of them got bored and the other one was still like, oh, yeah, I love.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yes.

[SPEAKER_08]: Because there was nothing else on everybody like just got so hyped for two documentaries.

[SPEAKER_08]: That was all there was.

[SPEAKER_07]: And then we had that concert, we're all in it together.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, yeah, super, all in it together.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're all in it together.

[SPEAKER_07]: And then we were like, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Honestly, the theater, everyone can go fuck themselves, Lady Gaga.

[SPEAKER_07]: It needs to die in her mansion.

[SPEAKER_07]: What happened?

[SPEAKER_01]: That is a big ass spider.

[SPEAKER_07]: What?

[SPEAKER_07]: Where?

[SPEAKER_07]: How big?

[SPEAKER_01]: See it right next to the cable right there?

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: What?

[SPEAKER_07]: Where?

[SPEAKER_07]: I got it right there.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Delco's in flipflops.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had to fight one of those big redheads and a peeds over here the other day in flipflops.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's not fun.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I got regular shoes.

[SPEAKER_08]: My foot already got dead today by a fucking ant.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: it's I think it was a fire act because it it's just like hell where this studio is it's it's like we're we're living on on some fucking wildlife preserve or something the animals that I animals and insects that I run into out here it's actually making me less afraid of everything because I just have to deal with them on a daily basis [SPEAKER_07]: You're like, can you bring some waspray?

[SPEAKER_07]: Because every time I walk outside my door, I just get swarmed by huge red.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know, you're like, okay, Koop-Gacha.

[SPEAKER_01]: It had just tried to join me in my dog and bed last night, which was fun.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel bad that we had to kill that thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: That he's all the mosquitoes.

[SPEAKER_01]: That, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: True, but that was a team effort.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was...

You need to be honest about what happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Why I want to cut this up.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, you were tested.

[SPEAKER_01]: Those things are mean as fuck.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was pulling the aggro so I could sneak up behind it and kill.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, he was doing it.

[SPEAKER_07]: That was actually a team after.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think that's true.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's what happened.

[SPEAKER_07]: You they're not cut this shit.

[SPEAKER_01]: But also there is no way in hell.

[SPEAKER_07]: I need to know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Spider that big.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's no way in hell.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would have stepped on that.

[SPEAKER_07]: But you run away from the spider.

[SPEAKER_01]: Guy like me?

[SPEAKER_07]: Because that guy like that might endure them to you.

[SPEAKER_08]: No, it won't.

[SPEAKER_08]: It won't.

[SPEAKER_07]: It will.

[SPEAKER_08]: Our audience, not at all.

[SPEAKER_08]: But also I was just kind of getting up so I could stop it as well.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, okay, and you were gonna do that from the other side of the room.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was getting up like this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jessie, it was a hammer and involvement maneuver.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's been a part of warfare for thousands of years.

[SPEAKER_07]: Your delico character sometime.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I was, I was chasing that over to him, but it just so happened that I was able to flank it and take control.

[SPEAKER_08]: What else do you want from me?

[SPEAKER_08]: I already said I can't beat up a baboon.

[SPEAKER_07]: You already said, I don't know how many toddlers I can kill.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're a good friend, Koop.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think you're underselling yourself.

[SPEAKER_01]: You could definitely beat all the toddlers, and I think you'd last a decent amount of time with a baboon too.

[SPEAKER_01]: All right, where did I leave off?

[SPEAKER_01]: So the money was drying up and the issues and the relationship began to grow.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine Matthew did their best to overcome the financial stream of the pandemic, but fractures began to form in their relationship.

[SPEAKER_01]: He did arguments became a common occurrence and Katherine grew despondent.

[SPEAKER_01]: She wasn't put now.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, despondent.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's like how we used to refer hysterical back in the day.

[SPEAKER_07]: hysterical.

[SPEAKER_07]: She was under period.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Once again, bring back the red tents.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Worked for thousands of years.

[SPEAKER_07]: See a girl so open, you know, the red ants don't getcha.

[SPEAKER_07]: Delco, are you good, but?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, is a headphone cable.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay, you know, I just get distracted easy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so the striper's altered in Katherine becoming a strange from not only Matthew, but from his immediate family as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: It became clear that their marriage was in trouble when Catherine's cold demeanor led to the cancellation of a family trip to Las Vegas that his mother had planned for him.

[SPEAKER_09]: Oh.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I do kind of think that that is a bit of a red flag in a relationship if one of the partners is pulling away from the the other partners family.

[SPEAKER_01]: If if they already have a good relationship with them, it's to me it's the sign of the beginning of the end.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, but it does sound like Matthew's mom is doing a lot for them and that can feel, you know, I don't know, but I'm just saying maybe she's like feeling, I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, was she getting the egg?

[SPEAKER_07]: No, but she maybe was just like, you know, like, I feel like it's just us and your family only.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, I also have a family.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's quite well off by the way.

[SPEAKER_07]: Why aren't they helping?

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I'm saying?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: And they probably never get it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I see what you're coming from.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so I don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, that makes sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: I take back some of what I said, aside from the part of her being despondent, being the primary issue.

[SPEAKER_07]: You can't be despondent during the pandemic.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you will get murdered or divorced.

[SPEAKER_07]: A few weeks before the shooting, Catherine did something that nobody expected.

[SPEAKER_07]: On June, twentieth, twenty twenty four.

[SPEAKER_07]: Sorry, just a little crime.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just a little crime.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just a little crime, Jews for this one.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, shit.

[SPEAKER_08]: There's another sweater.

[SPEAKER_08]: What?

[SPEAKER_07]: There's not.

[SPEAKER_01]: God, it has already killed that fucking thing.

[SPEAKER_07]: He, he could have pretended and then ran over and just like slapped it with his hand.

[SPEAKER_07]: Hold it up and was like, I got that one cooped up.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it was like huge.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was about this big crush in my hand.

[SPEAKER_07]: It wasn't that big of a spider.

[SPEAKER_07]: I was thinking that one.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's right next to my foot now.

[SPEAKER_08]: There's right there.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's pretty big.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was as far as both spiders go which largest spider in Texas before tarantulas.

[SPEAKER_01]: As far as both spiders go, that was a good size wolf spider.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't see them that big around here.

[SPEAKER_08]: Have you seen any tarantulas around these parts?

[SPEAKER_07]: No, do we not do we just not have them?

[SPEAKER_01]: We do.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's because I'm out there stomping them all.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, exactly because both of you guys with this tag team like I distract and you and you kill them as we speak.

[SPEAKER_07]: Ben and Robin, if you will.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's literally a tiny little spider building a web on the light in front of your desk right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: There are so many spiders.

[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yes.

[SPEAKER_04]: I look at that.

[SPEAKER_08]: You can see it.

[SPEAKER_08]: I think on camera.

[SPEAKER_04]: I see that.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's just out of frame.

[SPEAKER_01]: It'll get back in frame.

[SPEAKER_01]: So everybody watch the spotify.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry.

[SPEAKER_07]: uh, we have gone off the rails.

[SPEAKER_08]: The visual show.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're getting right back on right now.

[SPEAKER_07]: So a few weeks before the shooting Catherine did something that nobody expected on June, [SPEAKER_01]: That should have been she.

[SPEAKER_07]: She took the kids and left.

[SPEAKER_07]: This came as a total shock to Matthew, who came home from work one day to find that his wife and children were gone.

[SPEAKER_07]: To make matters worse, his truck was missing as well.

[SPEAKER_07]: Matthew immediately called his wife to make sure she and the children were all right.

[SPEAKER_07]: She took his truck.

[SPEAKER_01]: Took his truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if you've listened to any country song, there's only three things that you can do to a man that's going to break their hearts.

[SPEAKER_01]: You take their dog, take their kids, or take their truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Much to his relief, Katherine and children were fine, but they weren't coming home anytime soon.

[SPEAKER_07]: Katherine told Matthew that she had taken the children to her mother's house in American fork.

[SPEAKER_07]: Utah, to which Matthew said, what the fuck is that of city?

[SPEAKER_07]: Mother's house in American fork, Utah, so she could have some time and space to think about the future.

[SPEAKER_07]: His shock turned to annoyance and confusion when he learned that she had done that with his truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: Instead of making the entire nine-hour drive to Utah, she had only driven it a few miles away before getting picked up by her mother.

[SPEAKER_07]: This forced Matthew to spend a few hours writing his bike in the dark to pick up his vehicle.

[SPEAKER_07]: What?

[SPEAKER_01]: That is a dick move.

[SPEAKER_07]: Why can't he Uber or something?

[SPEAKER_07]: They don't know anybody out there.

[SPEAKER_07]: Was this weird?

[SPEAKER_08]: Uber still going in California?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I guess you're right.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, for sure.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, twenty-four.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, but twenty-four.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're on the back end.

[SPEAKER_01]: But also, he had, I mean, the work's been drying out for you.

[SPEAKER_01]: If I'm being perfectly honest, overall, it sounds like he didn't work super super.

[SPEAKER_08]: But they're kind of booning California, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Norcal.

[SPEAKER_08]: So like it might be harder to get it over.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's true.

[SPEAKER_01]: Could be like if you're out by like outskirts of redding or something like that.

[SPEAKER_07]: So he wrote his bike.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm going to be able to get an Uber.

[SPEAKER_07]: In the dark to take up his vehicle, soups annoying.

[SPEAKER_07]: Over the next few weeks, Matthew and Catherine only had sporadic contact with one another while they came to a consensus on whether or not to end the marriage.

[SPEAKER_07]: Matthew was adamant about remaining together, but Catherine was on the fence about even seeing him in person.

[SPEAKER_07]: This process was greatly exacerbated by the involvement of the vain of every married man's life.

[SPEAKER_07]: His mother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: The villain in every story, as far as I'm concerned.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do you think it's worse for the dudes?

[SPEAKER_01]: For the...

Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, again, we have a good set with us.

[SPEAKER_07]: But it's a, it's a trope, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: I think my mom and like mothers in general for them.

[SPEAKER_08]: The male side might be harder to please.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's a that is a good point.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it can be bad on either side, but I think that the [SPEAKER_01]: Oh no, I mean the mom's gonna back him up either way.

[SPEAKER_07]: I've only really had to.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's usually with moms and sons, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: I've really only had problems with like two moms of girls I did.

[SPEAKER_08]: Everyone else loved me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm wrong with the problem with the parents of the girls I've dated.

[SPEAKER_01]: Never met any of their fathers for obvious reasons, but I was always boys with their fathers.

[SPEAKER_01]: A mom with the daughter.

[SPEAKER_07]: A mom with the daughter you kind of just want to do that's going to take care of them.

[SPEAKER_07]: And you know, if the daughter wants to hang out with their mom, that's really on them, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: You just want to make sure that the person that your daughter is marrying is cool with like hanging out.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like we're all gonna hang out.

[SPEAKER_07]: You just don't want to lose them.

[SPEAKER_07]: Mothers and sons, you want to make sure that the daughter is gonna take care of your son as well in different ways, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think the reason that it's a trope is because you never hear the same kind of story about the father-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: If anybody's gonna be meddling in the situation, it's generally gonna be the [SPEAKER_01]: the mother.

[SPEAKER_07]: The gal, the prod, of course.

[SPEAKER_01]: The hysterical one.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_07]: The respondent.

[SPEAKER_07]: So let's get a picture of this, uh, bruiser, the brother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Tracy Grist.

[SPEAKER_07]: Mother-in-law, the victim.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, boy.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I heard too is that they, her and her daughter, Catherine, were often mistaken, like people would mistake them for sisters.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let me guess, it was Tracy that said that a lot more than Catherine did.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I don't know where that information came from, but it was, I know where it came from.

[SPEAKER_01]: It came from, it came from the mother.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was the mom being lying.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, she doesn't look bad.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, she doesn't look bad.

[SPEAKER_07]: The daughter doesn't look great, and so you cut it in the middle.

[SPEAKER_01]: She's like the type of lady that you'd needed a dive bar.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, as a male, you needed a dive bar in her early twenties, and she's just right away super friendly and wants to get drunk and then tries to kiss you out of nowhere.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right, and by the way, American fork, we're not like it's a small community.

[SPEAKER_07]: She's high up there, as far as how most of them look, I'm sure.

[SPEAKER_01]: I bet you anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was a super fun mom to have.

[SPEAKER_01]: Love her all.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Catherine's friends.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_06]: You have to have one one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's how she wanted to party up.

[SPEAKER_01]: Catherine's mother, Tracy Grist, was a classic example of a tyrannical mother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this is actually based.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've got the information back it up.

[SPEAKER_01]: She loved her daughter.

[SPEAKER_01]: She hated her son-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: and she made sure to shoehorn herself into their relationship any chance she got.

[SPEAKER_01]: Her overbearing attitude had caused countless fights between Matthew and Catherine and her solution to every argument was always the same.

[SPEAKER_01]: Take the kids away from Matthew, file for divorce, and get as much money as possible in the process.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now does Grace, does Tracy, cool mom, Tracy, give me the four one one?

[SPEAKER_07]: Does she have a husband at this point?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, she's single at this point.

[SPEAKER_07]: I have divorced.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wasn't able to find whether or not she was divorced or whether she was dead or whether her husband was dead because it's a fairly new case.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, they're always single in this scenario.

[SPEAKER_08]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, with that involved in your kid's life at that age, you're single.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wonder if the husband did leave, I wonder, way left.

[SPEAKER_01]: Her meddling was so, oh, the answer's right here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Her meddling was so constant that even the most even tempered man may entertain the idea of helping her shuffle off the mortal coil.

[SPEAKER_01]: Considering the relationship between Matthew and Tracy, it's no surprise that the reconciliation process was difficult.

[SPEAKER_01]: With her in the picture, [SPEAKER_01]: Any attempt for Katherine and Matthew to work on their marriage was marked by negativity.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it was somewhat unexpected when Katherine suddenly reached out to her estranged husband and said she was ready to work things out.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, maybe she had enough.

[SPEAKER_07]: Tracy was just stage five clanger, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: A little bit too much fun with Tracy.

[SPEAKER_07]: Too much like, okay, we're good.

[SPEAKER_05]: I've got the, you know, no, let's go to brunch.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine told Matthew that she was going to rent a car and drive back to California along with the kids so they could finally have an earnest discussion about their future.

[SPEAKER_01]: This plan unfortunately never came to fruition.

[SPEAKER_01]: When Katherine went to rent a car, she learned that since she had an out of state license, she wasn't able to complete the rental without a credit card, which she also didn't have.

[SPEAKER_01]: As a result, the estranged couple came to the conclusion that Matthew would have to drive to Utah to pick her up.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just nine hour drive, not far.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're in bad.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's been on the bike all night.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's like, do I have to take my bike?

[SPEAKER_07]: He's like, no, you can take the truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: On July, twelfth, twenty-twenty-four, Matthew hopped in his truck and began the nine-hour drive to American fork, Utah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yep, that's a city.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, from his home in California, along the way, he passed the time by eating shitty gas station food and complaining over the phone to his mother about the aforementioned shitty gas station food, according to Diane, her son, [SPEAKER_07]: seemed to be in a good mood as he made the trip and mentioned multiple times how excited he was to see his wife and children again.

[SPEAKER_07]: Little did Diane know her son's reunion with his family was going to be far from happy.

[SPEAKER_07]: At around ten pm that night Matthew arrived at the home of Katherine's mother Tracy from there the only accounts of what transpired next.

[SPEAKER_07]: came from Katherine and her family.

[SPEAKER_07]: According to Katherine's family, Matthew didn't bother to knock on the door before he walked in.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, hello.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which is like you've known these guys for the last seven and a half years.

[SPEAKER_01]: Come on.

[SPEAKER_07]: What do you family?

[SPEAKER_07]: No, you're not.

[SPEAKER_07]: When Tracy and Kevin went to see who their unexpected guest was.

[SPEAKER_07]: So when Tracy, the mom and Kevin, Catherine's brother.

[SPEAKER_07]: So Tracy's son went to see who their unexpected guest was.

[SPEAKER_07]: They saw Matthew standing in the doorway holding a knife.

[SPEAKER_07]: It appeared as though he wasn't there to reconcile.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was there to get revenge.

[SPEAKER_07]: Seeing the weapon in Matthew's hand, Kevin ran into the garage.

[SPEAKER_07]: To retrieve his pistol from the gun safe, when he returned to the entryway, Matthew advanced towards him with the knife raised, acting in self-defense, Kevin then shot Matthew seven times in the torso, killing him.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, what a scene.

[SPEAKER_07]: And like this nice Utah neighborhood.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, he just had plenty of time to go to the garage, get his gun.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, he's at the door, so they'd like...

Interesting observation they had there, Delco.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it is, it is interesting.

[SPEAKER_07]: Look, I'm telling you, they're so stupid.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't want to like give anything away, but obviously the dumbest.

[SPEAKER_08]: He's coming around for us.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, they're saying that he went in without knocking, but he had time.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just saying.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, if you had, this is like one of those in-night Shyamalan episodes, you go back and listen to it from the beginning.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, you see all the holes in the story right from the start.

[SPEAKER_07]: right.

[SPEAKER_07]: So we're going to go through there account.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do you know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_08]: They knew he was coming.

[SPEAKER_07]: They knew he was coming.

[SPEAKER_07]: They had talked.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, yeah, they literally.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I guess they just were surprised by the knife.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right of it all, which anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, life's already pretty surprising.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure you're coming with them all.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now we've got a knife.

[SPEAKER_08]: To be fair, I knock up to my family's door.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm not having a knife ready to go.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, God.

[SPEAKER_08]: You got to meet my wife for the time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's surprising coming from Philly.

[SPEAKER_07]: We've got a brandish batteries.

[SPEAKER_07]: Brandish something.

[SPEAKER_07]: And really.

[SPEAKER_01]: At first glance, it appeared as though the shooting was a clear cut case of self-defense.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, however he's itch.

[SPEAKER_01]: Once investigators arrived, they began to notice that the details of the crime scene didn't match up with the story.

[SPEAKER_01]: Don't figure that first inconsistency they noticed was a position of the knife Matthew had allegedly been carrying.

[SPEAKER_01]: The weapon was found still partially grafted in his right hand with a tip pointing up in the blade facing towards his body.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this didn't make sense to the investigators.

[SPEAKER_01]: In most situations.

[SPEAKER_06]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, go ahead.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I have to give you a break.

[SPEAKER_01]: if let's say theoretically I know you've never thought about it before if you were going to stab your spouse sure and again have I have never never never thought it would be an over or it would be a right okay so i mean just just food for thought there yep [SPEAKER_01]: In most situations, an untrained person with murder on their mind will hold the knife in their dominant hand with the tip pointing down and the blade generally facing outwards.

[SPEAKER_01]: Not only was the knife not pointing the proper direction, it wasn't even in his dominant hand and if you think back to [SPEAKER_01]: You think back to what was it, twelve angry men?

[SPEAKER_07]: That was one of the defenses that if you think back to any time they catch anyone they go, but he was left handed.

[SPEAKER_07]: Every time there's so many, it was like, we found the cigarette in the left hand, but he would always, you know, come on.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you're going to stage a scene, learn something about the victim.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're not saying that they did.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just coup.

[SPEAKER_01]: The theoretically.

[SPEAKER_07]: This is what the investigators are observing as a walk-in, carry on.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, not only was the knife not pointing in the proper direction, it wasn't even in his dominant hand.

[SPEAKER_01]: Matthew was left-handed, which apparently his inlauded in no.

[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't make sense that he would choose to use his off-hand to hold the weapon, and to make matters worse.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the bullets had struck him in his right wrist, shattering the bones, and making it nearly impossible for him to have kept his grip on the weapon.

[SPEAKER_01]: Had he actually been holding in his right hand.

[SPEAKER_01]: As investigators gathered more information, they continued to find inconsistency after inconsistency.

[SPEAKER_01]: According to their story, Matthew had arrived with malicious intentions, but still took time to place a piece of cardboard under his car to prevent oil from leaking on the driveway, and took his shoes off before he walked inside.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a very polite murder.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was aggressively doing that.

[SPEAKER_07]: Cool.

[SPEAKER_07]: You don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: He could have been, oh, I'll kick his shoes off, putting the thing under him.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, God damn, I'm going to kill everybody.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, but I'm not going to put any dirt in this.

[SPEAKER_01]: My mother raised me right.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will commit murder, but I am not ruining somebody's drive.

[SPEAKER_07]: Not going in a house without my shoes on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, anything that I'll go.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_08]: I mean, he's a polite man.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, it could be, I mean, there's things where it's like it could be just second nature.

[SPEAKER_07]: Honestly, if that's just what you do.

[SPEAKER_08]: It was just kill into his like, uh, with their relationship with the N walls.

[SPEAKER_08]: He's like, ah, I take the boots off.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Just I'm going to get in and then you know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: Pavlovian on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, like most of them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that makes sense.

[SPEAKER_07]: We have a neighborhood where it's a shoes off neighborhood, which I, can I tell you I hate it?

[SPEAKER_01]: What does this Japan?

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_07]: Come on.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay, if you're if you're growing up in a place like fucking cleaning, lady, let me have my milk.

[SPEAKER_07]: I just hate like shuffling around like drinking without my shoes on.

[SPEAKER_07]: I hate it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hate taking my shoes off in a stranger's house because I mean for one, just kind of annoying.

[SPEAKER_01]: Number two, I never know when I'm gonna have to run out of this place.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I want my fucking shoes on.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, after you know, you know, mostly they used to take a lot of money from.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: These take shoes away from the slaves so they couldn't run away.

[SPEAKER_07]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm not taking my day off.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also Holocaust Holocaust.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, there's a pile of shoes in the museum.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: The only people that make you take their shoes off before they before you go on their house are fucking monsters.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_01]: God.

[SPEAKER_01]: As the investigators gathered more information, they continued to find inconsistency after inconsistency.

[SPEAKER_01]: He placed the cardboard underneath the card to prevent the oil from dripping on the driveway.

[SPEAKER_01]: Took a shoes off.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then after making his intentions clear by branching the knife at the family, Matthew had patiently waited by the front door while Kevin retrieved the pistol from the garage.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he was still politely waiting in the entryway when Kevin opened fire.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good catch Delco.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and that's um, he was just going by [SPEAKER_07]: dual rules, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: He's like, I shall wait.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Thinking that he's good.

[SPEAKER_01]: We drawn three.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes, exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, oh, pistol, shit.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't bring a pistol.

[SPEAKER_07]: But I brought you know I brought a knife.

[SPEAKER_07]: You saw my knife.

[SPEAKER_07]: Speaking of entryways, the condition of the front entrance of the house also struck investigators as suspicious.

[SPEAKER_07]: For some reason, Katherine's family had put a lot of effort into making the path into the house as welcoming and unobstructed as possible.

[SPEAKER_07]: The screen door had been removed earlier that day.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now, how they knew it was earlier that day and not just something that was being fixed, not sure, but it had been removed earlier that day.

[SPEAKER_07]: And all of the children's toys in the living room had been pushed aside.

[SPEAKER_07]: Even stranger, a drop cloth had been placed over a couch near the front door.

[SPEAKER_07]: Almost as if someone was anticipating an event that might leave stains on the fabric.

[SPEAKER_01]: In Matthew's defense, they might have been anticipating him being a little too excited to see his wife again and just wanted to take some precautions.

[SPEAKER_07]: Or they might have been anticipating him being the kind of guy that rides his bike, like in the middle of the night, lives in a dual-wide in North, you know what I mean, just a little dirty.

[SPEAKER_01]: A dirty boy.

[SPEAKER_07]: A dirty boy.

[SPEAKER_07]: Bucket bat.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know, fish points.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hold the point in the favor of Katherine's family.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll give you that one.

[SPEAKER_07]: Listen, I'm just trying to be like, what really happened here, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: We know Tracy is like, hates him, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Just put a cover on the couch.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't even want any of his, like, Northern Cal, he's been driving all night.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want him sitting on my couch saying hello without something in between him.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know he smokes too.

[SPEAKER_07]: He has to smoke.

[SPEAKER_07]: Maybe he does.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, unless he, unless he grew up in Sudan or something like that, where he was constantly getting sunburned after day, there's no way you get to that point without being a smoke.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes, he has to be a smokeer.

[SPEAKER_07]: So, as the investigation continued, more and more evidence began to point towards the shooting being pre-meditated.

[SPEAKER_07]: Within the first twenty-four hours, the detective shifted from documenting an attempted murder by an estranged husband to investigating the murder of an innocent man.

[SPEAKER_07]: Once the focus had been shifted, the evidence supporting their new theory began to show up in droves.

[SPEAKER_07]: Detectives pulled phone records from Katherine, Tracy, and Kevin.

[SPEAKER_07]: This is a family affair, you guys.

[SPEAKER_07]: All of which provided evidence of pre-meditation.

[SPEAKER_07]: From what they found in the message logs, the plan to murder Matthew had been in the making for at least six months, while she was still in the house with him.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, it started back in Northern California.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was only in Utah for, she went there on June.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was like just barely over a month.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: From what the detectives could determine, the death of Matthew Resteli had been in the works for months.

[SPEAKER_01]: The earliest reference they could find came from a text exchange between Katherine and Tracy's six months before the murder.

[SPEAKER_01]: In the message, Tracy referred to herself as a protective mama bear, which [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of them do.

[SPEAKER_01]: I.

Yeah, it's getting to the point where that's just like, Oh, you don't need no man do you know no wonder you're in your fifties and.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unmarried your other husband either killed himself or.

[SPEAKER_01]: You killed him.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_01]: In the message, Tracer referred to herself as a protective mama bear willing to do anything for her children, including driving to California to strangle Matthew with her own hands.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there was also a message from Tracer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, this is from the mother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: She had even sent, so the text conversation that we're referring to here happened after she had already sent a text directly to Matthew Ristelli.

[SPEAKER_01]: threatening him, and then she texted Katherine and said, hey, I told her husband off, and if I have to, I'll go out there.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll drive the nine hours and I'll strangle him with my own hands.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, toxic mother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not in every single situation, but in this situation, these are the ones that give the rest of the mother-in-law.

[SPEAKER_07]: Exactly right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Additional messages seem to show that Tracy was very much a driving force behind the murder.

[SPEAKER_01]: In the months leading up to the shooting, Tracy had offered advice on ways to get rid of Katherine's estranged husband and how to make it look like an accident.

[SPEAKER_01]: Web searches made from Tracy's phone even showed that she had been researching what since could be used to attract mountain lions to people, ostensibly in an attempt to try and get wild animals to do the job for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's insane.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's insane, but by the way, [SPEAKER_01]: kind of smart.

[SPEAKER_01]: That would have worked.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it would have worked a whole lot better.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're on the right track.

[SPEAKER_07]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_07]: Just scrambled.

[SPEAKER_07]: They were in patient.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do the searches at a library or if you're going to do any web searches, you have to do it from some sort of we do need to do this series that we keep threatening to do, which is how to get away with it.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, because well, this guy definitely wore kind of, you know, cargo shorts more than likely.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_08]: Any type of pant with multiple pockets?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_08]: It will just sprinkle some loose meat in there.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think that was probably discussed.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do you know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_07]: How do we get...

[SPEAKER_08]: We need to bait the man.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: It had to have been so pro tip.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've heard that there's a certain I believe it's either Calvin Klein or Tommy Hill figure.

[SPEAKER_01]: Cologne for men will actually attract tigers and also you know that Brazilian bum bum cream that keeps getting sent to the studio.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's actually huge in India.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's why they always get swept away by tigers.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're super in the Tommy Hill figure.

[SPEAKER_01]: The Brazilian bum bum cream that's been getting sent to the studio, there's one specific scent of it that has been reported multiple times across the internet to attract spiders.

[SPEAKER_08]: Is that why they're sending it to us?

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, it could be why that fucking spider showed up earlier because we still have a few containers of that shit floating around the studio.

[SPEAKER_01]: So she searched for ways to attract mountain lions to a person using sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: But in the end, Tracy came to the conclusion that the only cougar that could reliably bring an end to Matthew's life was Tracy herself.

[SPEAKER_07]: The evidence that the crime scene combined with data collection from the phones of Tracy, Catherine, and Kevin allowed investigators to paint a picture of what they believe really happened before Matthew's murder.

[SPEAKER_07]: While Catherine had been stringing her husband along with promises of reconciliation, she was actually laying the groundwork for her and her kids to move to Utah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Initially, she planned to [SPEAKER_07]: She planned on filing for divorce, but the prospect of losing custody of the children led her to choose a more drastic option.

[SPEAKER_07]: Instead of facing a lengthy legal battle, Katherine and her family decided it would be easier [SPEAKER_07]: to kill her estranged husband and avoid a divorce altogether.

[SPEAKER_07]: After doing some cursory research about the self-defense laws in Utah, Tracy settled on the plan of staging the murder to make it look like self-defense.

[SPEAKER_07]: Apparently, Tracy and Katherine weren't willing to do the dirty work themselves, though they turned to the only person they knew who could pull the trigger.

[SPEAKER_07]: Katherine's shitbag brother [SPEAKER_07]: Kevin, before we show this picture, do we talk about her calling all the divorce lawyers first, too?

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't get into that, but we can.

[SPEAKER_07]: So she also in this time is assessed with full custody for someone like she just wants.

[SPEAKER_07]: She's like, how do I get?

[SPEAKER_07]: She's calling all lawyers in her area where she's at, Utah, wherever.

[SPEAKER_07]: and is asking the daughter, Katherine, is asking, how do I get full custody?

[SPEAKER_07]: Every lawyer, everyone is turning her down.

[SPEAKER_07]: Being like, if there's no, there's, it doesn't seem to be like, he's done anything, there's no record of anything, seems to be a great, great dad by all accounts.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so that's a really hard, that's a hard hill to climb even if there is.

[SPEAKER_07]: shit that's gotten wrong, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: So she was turned down at every turn, but they do know that she was calling all the lawyers, divorce lawyers in her area asking, I need full custody, how do I get full custody?

[SPEAKER_07]: And they're like, well, I mean, damn, that we've got to have some real real evidence.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the day before the shooting, she had even told, like literally the day before the shooting, she had told one of the divorce lawyers.

[SPEAKER_01]: The divorce lawyer was asking her, is he abusive?

[SPEAKER_01]: Has he ever hit you?

[SPEAKER_01]: And she's like, now he's just kind of a normal dude.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's what the lawyer actually testified to when they were questioned.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't understand the obsession with getting full custody and less.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think if she was able to get full custody, he may still be alive.

[SPEAKER_07]: She just wanted to leave and have the kids and just have him literally go away.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like she was just like, I'm just done with this trailer in Northern California during a pandemic.

[SPEAKER_07]: I want to just go, I want to go and like, and not ever see you again.

[SPEAKER_07]: The problem is if you have kids with somebody, you're going to have to deal with them forever.

[SPEAKER_07]: And she just didn't want that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if she has only if you love the kids, so sure, you don't have to love those kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, God.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Don't go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a joke.

[SPEAKER_07]: You don't have to.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's not illegal not to love your kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let's get a picture of this brother.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good old Kevin Ellis.

[SPEAKER_07]: Heaven.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, wow.

[SPEAKER_01]: Something about that picture makes me think he's a criminal.

[SPEAKER_07]: Is this the only picture you have of Kevin?

[SPEAKER_01]: There is literally no picture of this guy where he's not in court or in a lineup.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I wanted to hold off showing the picture.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, no.

[SPEAKER_07]: Can we check on that light?

[SPEAKER_07]: My gosh, we've we have really been dealing with the elements today.

[SPEAKER_07]: Have we not?

[SPEAKER_07]: Whatever happens on the show happens on the show.

[SPEAKER_08]: We've been going through it today.

[SPEAKER_07]: We roll with it.

[SPEAKER_07]: You guys are here with us.

[SPEAKER_08]: The plug.

[SPEAKER_07]: So that's that's Kevin.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's the if you have a brother that looks like that.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think you would go, oh, like, who do we, who can we get to do shit?

[SPEAKER_07]: It's that guy, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: I do.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, he has nothing to live for.

[SPEAKER_07]: You guys have siblings, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I have a sister.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I got one, too.

[SPEAKER_07]: Would you?

[SPEAKER_08]: for my sister.

[SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.

[SPEAKER_08]: Uh, she has to be wrong, I think.

[SPEAKER_07]: They can't just be out of nowhere.

[SPEAKER_07]: Well, you would have to have real evidence that this guy was like, a shipbag, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Fucking with her beating her up, something like that.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, it was like a abusive yard evidence.

[SPEAKER_08]: But if she just wanted me to kill him, no.

[SPEAKER_08]: Right?

[SPEAKER_01]: If it was, if it was for no reason, then, I mean, no, I'd give her advice.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I'd try to avoid that as much as possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: But any, any situation where she was in the right, then yeah, no question.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd go to prison for her.

[SPEAKER_07]: I have two brothers, I don't have that.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, and I'm mostly neither one, neither one of you.

[SPEAKER_08]: No way.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'll mostly choose the guy's side, probably.

[SPEAKER_08]: You know, my sister.

[SPEAKER_07]: And my sister, you know, she's maybe asking for it.

[SPEAKER_04]: And listen.

[SPEAKER_07]: And by the way, how do you get hard evidence, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: It's like, I need to see him fucking beat you up, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Or like, send me the pictures.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: And even then, I'm sure you guys are level headed enough to be like, I'm gonna come there and fucking get you out of the situation.

[SPEAKER_07]: you would be like, why is this the only answer?

[SPEAKER_01]: That would be the number one choice, but if it, I mean, I think I've said it on the show before that I'm close enough with my sister that if she was in a situation where she did do something wrong, I would probably go out of my way to to help her with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: cover it up to cover it up if if it was something that I would do that uh you know maybe in an accident or maybe if I knew that which thank God she doesn't have a history of the horrible mental health that that all came to me luckily lucky bag stop bragging sister [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, outside of those situations, my primary move would be like, okay, well, let's figure out how to get you out of this without somebody going to prison because I know if somebody's going to prison, it's ultimately going to be me.

[SPEAKER_08]: I would be reactive.

[SPEAKER_08]: I would not, you know, be proactive to.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you wouldn't plan something out.

[SPEAKER_07]: But no, saw something.

[SPEAKER_08]: If it happened in real time for sure.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, all right.

[SPEAKER_07]: I hear that.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, agreed.

[SPEAKER_07]: You guys are both great brothers and spider killing team.

[SPEAKER_01]: God damn right.

[SPEAKER_07]: Look at you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Dude, new nicknames hammer and animal.

[SPEAKER_01]: Kevin had already displayed a habit of disregarding the law.

[SPEAKER_01]: Over the course of his life, he had racked up a few minor criminal charges along with a felony charge that forbade him from owning a gun.

[SPEAKER_01]: Luckily, Tracy had a gun that she could loan him.

[SPEAKER_01]: All they had to do was concoct a plan to get Matthew to drive to Utah so Kevin could take him out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, that is where I would draw the line with with my sister is premeditated murder.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's like, we're like, we've got nine hours.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're putting a cover on the couch.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're in the kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: So that's probably when you would be like, hey guys, [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe there's another way.

[SPEAKER_07]: Maybe not do this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was something that I was kind of curious to get your input on from the stuff that actually both of your input from the information that was available.

[SPEAKER_01]: It seemed like a major driving force in this entire situation was Catherine's family.

[SPEAKER_01]: sort of egging on everything and it definitely you know I'm not saying the Catherine doesn't hold she's not at fault in any way [SPEAKER_01]: But God damn, I have never seen a family considering the text messages.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have never seen a family.

[SPEAKER_01]: Encourage somebody so much to ruin their lives.

[SPEAKER_07]: If we have in here the messages she's sending on her Facebook group and the way that she's talking to her friends before and after, do we or not?

[SPEAKER_01]: uh we don't the the one thing that uh I didn't put it in the notes but she did start dating really really quickly after it's over and down.

[SPEAKER_07]: She she had been telling friends [SPEAKER_07]: before this.

[SPEAKER_07]: That she wanted to kill him, although, by the way, every wife in this that I know would be convicted of murder if we had a text saying I'm going to kill my husband.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: She who is without sin.

[SPEAKER_07]: exactly so it's not just that but she is sending messages to friends of like I'm I'm gonna kill him today I'm doing big girl she left a message on a Facebook group that said I'm doing big girl stuff today another phrase mama bear big girl stuff and panties [SPEAKER_07]: boss bitch.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean I bet she's I bet she says boss boss babe.

[SPEAKER_07]: I bet she's set it before.

[SPEAKER_01]: Takes off a lot of those boxes.

[SPEAKER_07]: Takes off a lot of them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so she is very [SPEAKER_07]: Callous in how she's talking about it to her friends.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now, this could be just like, I fucking hated it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm over it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm gonna kill him.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, I'm doing it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm doing it.

[SPEAKER_07]: What we'll talk about later is how she reacts after.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so even my mom, I think like she's battenethous and my mom is battenethous and when it comes to [SPEAKER_01]: making bailed threats of killing whether it's my sister's partners or my partners or anything like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: She always kind of puts that offer on the table where it's like, well, you know, I'll kill him, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll kill him for you.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, no, no, but she's never like encouraging it or playing along with it or anything else.

[SPEAKER_07]: She never takes it to the next level of like, [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, so I actually have a plan to do this.

[SPEAKER_07]: It would be like mom.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Put down the mushrooms and the wine.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: That's my mom.

[SPEAKER_08]: That's my mom's move.

[SPEAKER_08]: She gets the glass wine, the bottle wine.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, she's like, if any girl.

[SPEAKER_08]: It's not that she has the girl sit at the table with her and just psychologically breaks her down.

[SPEAKER_08]: Ooh, damn.

[SPEAKER_07]: Don't go.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's not good.

[SPEAKER_08]: A couple wine bottles deep.

[SPEAKER_07]: If she knows that she's not being good to you, or just in general, that's how she first meets the gal.

[SPEAKER_08]: Sometimes you get to interrogate, you know, to get to know her.

[SPEAKER_01]: She's, she's playing the role and play in the role of the father sitting on the porch, polishing the shotgun, right, before Corona.

[SPEAKER_01]: One hundred percent.

[SPEAKER_08]: No, my mom's like, everybody except like two.

[SPEAKER_07]: And what's the accent, sorry, do I?

[SPEAKER_07]: She has it, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: So it's like, [SPEAKER_08]: You think you're too good for my son?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so what is done?

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Her accent's not that bad, no?

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, it's not.

[SPEAKER_07]: She does say, what?

[SPEAKER_08]: She says water.

[SPEAKER_07]: Water, unlike water, your intentions with my son, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: We're going to make a homie.

[SPEAKER_08]: Going a little southy here.

[SPEAKER_07]: A little bit, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: But that's how I picture her.

[SPEAKER_07]: I know she's not.

[SPEAKER_07]: But like I picture her, kind of.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're going to make him a good homie?

[SPEAKER_08]: You guys going down the shore?

[SPEAKER_08]: What are you doing?

[SPEAKER_07]: Don't go down into shore.

[SPEAKER_07]: What?

[SPEAKER_07]: Ugh.

[SPEAKER_07]: I would be like, I just love, I'd be like, she'd be talking shit to me.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'd be like, I just love your accent so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I think the roles are kind of reversed between my mom and my sister because my mom will make the open offer like if she ever fucks with you, I will kill her.

[SPEAKER_01]: But up until then, she is going to be the nicest person that they have ever met in their life and invite them to everything, include them in everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Super welcoming.

[SPEAKER_08]: Delco's mom is very transparent she goes she's very close here it here it is right if you went over my mom she chooses you over me so that sucks oh God cuz that's how that's happened to I had my ex girlfriend like for her birthday this was like three months after we broke up my mom's like yeah, you can have our our little condo down in St.

[SPEAKER_08]: Martin for your birthday.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh damn down in St.

[SPEAKER_07]: Morton.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're helping.

[SPEAKER_07]: We have our can't condo [SPEAKER_08]: It was a time-share, obviously.

[SPEAKER_01]: How bitter was the, was the break-up, like, did you get out of that without a broken heart or were you upset about it?

[SPEAKER_01]: I was pretty checked out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pretty checked out, okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: It was just mom was probably like, well, she didn't, it was, you know, it was my son that hurt her.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I'm gonna, like, I feel bad for her.

[SPEAKER_08]: Well, she broke up with me, but I just continued to be myself for like six months, seven months, just a worse version.

[SPEAKER_01]: Did you kind of like, oh, you were stuck in the deck a little bit?

[SPEAKER_07]: Did you kind of do the thing of like, I'm just gonna do whatever I want and then she's gonna break up with me.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_08]: Cause like, I don't know, I'm not the bad guy here, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: You're non-confrontational as we saw with the spider.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was a team effort, Jesse.

[SPEAKER_01]: We've already discussed.

[SPEAKER_07]: I know, Batman.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was your Robin.

[SPEAKER_07]: Is he near you?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, it's still on me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was just going to say on the other hand, my sister, when it comes to a relationship, hates every single one of them and less work together for over a year, then she'll start giving him a chance, but she's still fucking hates him.

[SPEAKER_07]: Your sister, your mom.

[SPEAKER_01]: My sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, my mom always sort of.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love her way, but my sister is just ready to kill him.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't give it like she maintains that that level of distance.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like if it comes down to it and I got to kill this bitch, I'm not going to feel guilty.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was never planning on the one first place.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I'm going to tread lightly.

[SPEAKER_07]: But like she's not going to like anyone.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, not at all.

[SPEAKER_07]: So you've got it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think you've got to wait like a year before we're hanging out with the sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, minimum.

[SPEAKER_07]: No.

[SPEAKER_07]: She said intimidating gal.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I don't think she would, uh, I don't think she would be mad about me saying that.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, she's an intimidating person.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Even with me, I know she likes the show.

[SPEAKER_07]: She sat over there and was just like, what do you got?

[SPEAKER_07]: This one's gonna be good.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I was like, I don't know if it's gonna be good.

[SPEAKER_08]: Tell a joke.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_07]: Make me laugh.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, I didn't make her laugh the whole time I'm like, oh, it's kind of difficult to give her professional actor stage fright, but she has that effect on me.

[SPEAKER_07]: She really does.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So after some discussion, Katherine and Tracy decided the easiest way to get Matthew to Utah was to lure him out under the pretenses of fixing their marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: So Katherine contacted Matthew and told him she was ready to work things out.

[SPEAKER_01]: In order to get him to make the nine hour drive, she can cock at the story about not being able to rent a car as well as claiming that she couldn't borrow a car because an ankle injury prevented her from driving.

[SPEAKER_07]: If she said credit card, I have an ankle injury.

[SPEAKER_07]: What?

[SPEAKER_07]: I've got to come get me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've got an out of state license.

[SPEAKER_01]: They won't let me run a car with an out of state license unless I have a credit card.

[SPEAKER_07]: You want to reconcile?

[SPEAKER_07]: Like it was perfect.

[SPEAKER_08]: Her ankle tripping over all these lies.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, the lies.

[SPEAKER_07]: No shit.

[SPEAKER_06]: No shit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Matthew was eager to be reunited with his wife and children, whom he hadn't seen in weeks.

[SPEAKER_01]: So he was more than happy to make the trip.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine arranged for Matthew to arrive late at night in order to reduce the chances of their being any witnesses.

[SPEAKER_01]: She then told her a strange husband that her family would likely already be in bed when he arrived, so she would leave the front door unlocked so he could quietly let himself in.

[SPEAKER_01]: Katherine and her family then removed the screen door from the front entrance, cleared the children's toys out of the living room, and covered the furniture and dropclots to protect them from any ensuing blood splatters.

[SPEAKER_01]: which the, okay, so like you were saying earlier, removing the front screen door.

[SPEAKER_07]: On the face, it would be like, we don't know when that happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it doesn't really seem to fix.

[SPEAKER_01]: Play into it.

[SPEAKER_07]: And if you couple it with the mountain of others.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's, yeah, that's what it is, combined with everything else.

[SPEAKER_07]: Because even these were, these were just this or if it was just this, just this.

[SPEAKER_07]: But if you put all the circumstantial, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because any of those things, if you [SPEAKER_01]: uh, moving the front screen door.

[SPEAKER_01]: I, the police were using that as evidence.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't really consider it to be, and also moving the, the kids toys out of the living room.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's also pretty circumstantial because if you're gonna have guests over, yeah, you get the fucking kids toys out of the way.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think what they were saying is it looked like a, a path.

[SPEAKER_07]: Whereas if you clean up toys, it's like you put them in the thing, and it's, if you're cleaning up, you're cleaning up what it looked like to them was a path that was like pushed [SPEAKER_07]: to the side.

[SPEAKER_01]: They created a kill box.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: She's also fucking stupid.

[SPEAKER_05]: Like, like, nothing.

[SPEAKER_01]: No more men.

[SPEAKER_01]: They set up, matched up with the story that they were trying to tell.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's just, it's so fucking retarded the way they tried to pull this off.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's one of those things where it's like, if I could be a consultant, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, you see somebody doing like, if you want to publish this or something, you see somebody doing like the exact wrong thing.

[SPEAKER_07]: You go, girl, let me.

[SPEAKER_07]: So if you want to, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Like, if I were to be a murder consultant, which, ding, I just created that job, murder consultant, I would be like, okay, no, no, no, no, I know you want it.

[SPEAKER_07]: Don't do that.

[SPEAKER_07]: If this is what you want to achieve, this is what you have to do.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay, so instead of our series on how to get away with murder, it'll be Jesse Weisman, murder consultant, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: We could just, we could shift the entire direction of the show and turn it into like a house flipers kind of thing where you look at every single case and be like, okay, this is what you should have done.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I call in Catherine.

[SPEAKER_07]: And I just, we just do a, we do a one-on-one where I go, okay, so here.

[SPEAKER_07]: You should have done, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Anyways.

[SPEAKER_08]: And listen, if our clientele gets caught, we'll be like, actually, we had nothing to do with it because she didn't fall the steps.

[SPEAKER_07]: She didn't fall the steps.

[SPEAKER_07]: She didn't fall the steps and then be entertainment.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm entertainment, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Perduo.

[SPEAKER_07]: Sorry, Perity.

[SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I'm joking.

[SPEAKER_07]: I didn't think she was serious.

[SPEAKER_07]: We weren't here.

[SPEAKER_07]: There's no privilege, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: I'll get on the stand.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'll testify against you if this doesn't work out for you.

[SPEAKER_07]: But again, I'm testifying against you and that's love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's the only time that you would ever be called into the spotlight if it doesn't work.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think I think you've got a Fortune five hundred idea.

[SPEAKER_08]: And then if it doesn't work, you just go to the prosecution to like, all right, here's the deal.

[SPEAKER_08]: You guilty has charged if she followed every recording of the recording step recorded consultations.

[SPEAKER_07]: where I go listen, this gets destroyed if you do everything I say.

[SPEAKER_07]: Otherwise, I'm keeping it right.

[SPEAKER_07]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're working out the kinks of the business.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll register the LLC later.

[SPEAKER_07]: Murder consultant.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let's think of a different name by the end.

[SPEAKER_07]: Anyways, when Matthew arrived that night, Katherine hid upstairs with her children while Kevin and Tracy waited in the darkened living room.

[SPEAKER_07]: He parked his truck in the driveway and placed a piece of cardboard underneath [SPEAKER_07]: Underneath it so he wouldn't leave any oil stains, then took his shoes off on the front porch for quietly entering the house, aggressively.

[SPEAKER_07]: Again, we don't know if it was aggressive.

[SPEAKER_07]: As soon as he crossed the threshold, Kevin opened fire.

[SPEAKER_08]: Point of no return.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_07]: Your standard ground, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Once the shooting stopped, Tracy quickly placed the knife in Matthew's hand in order to stage the scene, it was later determined that the knife was obtained from a monthly subscription box service that belonged to the late husband of one of Tracy's friends.

[SPEAKER_07]: She had chosen the specific knife in order to throw police off the trail since that style of knife wasn't sold at any of the local stores.

[SPEAKER_07]: This lended more credence to their claims that you had brought the weapon with him from home.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just over your right shoulder.

[SPEAKER_01]: I see something there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we could plug that a little bit because if you want to if you want a monthly subscription box.

[SPEAKER_07]: You go bro box.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do we still a bro box, right?

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, yeah, we do.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: So this kind of maybe in one of the subscribers, we send you a husband murder knife.

[SPEAKER_07]: We're like, looks like maybe a knife that they would have, but couldn't really do any damage, which was this knife.

[SPEAKER_01]: You make sure that no matter what city it sent to, you can't purchase the same knife in that given city.

[SPEAKER_07]: Right.

[SPEAKER_07]: So there's no way, there's really no way to trace it.

[SPEAKER_07]: It can go to, because it wasn't, it wasn't their subscription.

[SPEAKER_07]: So how do you trace like a subscription and who gives it to who or, or what have you?

[SPEAKER_01]: Honestly, that was probably one of the smarter decisions they made in the whole plot.

[SPEAKER_07]: By the way, in our consultation, I would have been like, great, great idea.

[SPEAKER_07]: I love that.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do we talk about the air tag?

[SPEAKER_01]: Uh, no, we don't.

[SPEAKER_01]: We can fill that.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, so I think this landed more credence like we said to him bringing the weapon from home.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, and I believe it was during a previous trip to Disneyland that they added their tag to, uh, yes.

[SPEAKER_07]: We can do that in the, again, because this is not, this is an ongoing, [SPEAKER_07]: case, but a lot of people were doing that.

[SPEAKER_08]: We'll talk about that to the point that I believe Apple now has to put an alert on your phone.

[SPEAKER_08]: If someone that there is an Apple device that isn't connected to your phone that is nearby, that is constantly following you.

[SPEAKER_06]: Does it?

[SPEAKER_08]: Because someone people were putting air to it into their like ex-girlfriend's car.

[SPEAKER_07]: That must be this year though, because this is twenty twenty four.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a recent.

[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Nope.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can tell you it is a minimum of a year and a half to two years old because that it's a long story and I won't get into it.

[SPEAKER_01]: But that's how that's how I started finding out that one of my ex was cheating on me because she insisted that I ride in the car with her and prove that there wasn't an air tag in the car.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which there wasn't.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay, okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: So you're saying the alert to the phone is very recent.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, that's your ex made you ride in the car because it would connect to your phone not hers.

[SPEAKER_07]: So what he's saying is it will alert you on your phone if there's an air tag tracking you.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, that's that's what I'm saying.

[SPEAKER_01]: The same thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's I help her download an app on her phone that [SPEAKER_01]: would give you the same alert if you're on an android if you have an air tag going with you and even if the air tag doesn't belong to you like any time I would try was seeing if you were tracking her yes cuz she didn't want me to know what was going on but again she had the alert on her phone but she had android and yeah okay but anytime I would drive my sister's car over to Austin or anything like that I'd get the alert on my phone ever since I've been driving over from burning that there's an air tag in the car [SPEAKER_05]: have you tracked someone with an air tag before?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, I've never even owned an air tag.

[SPEAKER_07]: Has someone tracked you with an air tag?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, by sister apparently.

[SPEAKER_07]: That you knew about or didn't know about.

[SPEAKER_01]: Then I knew about that I don't know about.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have no idea.

[SPEAKER_01]: The only, only interaction.

[SPEAKER_07]: Sister tracking you with an air tag.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's the car itself.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not me.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: She doesn't give a shit.

[SPEAKER_07]: You could die, but I want my fucking car.

[SPEAKER_07]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: Fair enough.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're in it or not.

[SPEAKER_07]: I want my fucking car.

[SPEAKER_01]: The only interaction that I had ever had with air tags before that was because it was my parents because they use air tags to track their dog because it's a hunting dog and he has a tendency to get out of the yard.

[SPEAKER_08]: Do a dog.

[SPEAKER_08]: A lot of people do it with luggage.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, good.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's a good one.

[SPEAKER_07]: Children at a water park.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's what I got it for.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, do you just chip them?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, just like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: You just stick the air tag underneath the skin on the back of their neck.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, I put on the wrist.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I put it on their legs.

[SPEAKER_07]: I put it on their legs so they can't take it off.

[SPEAKER_07]: And if it's on their wrist, they'll be like, and like, take it off.

[SPEAKER_07]: So I put it on their leg.

[SPEAKER_01]: They can't reach their legs.

[SPEAKER_07]: No, which is not something that they would like.

[SPEAKER_07]: Look, look, look and listen.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're used to having the ankle brace, let's say anyway.

[SPEAKER_07]: Exactly right.

[SPEAKER_07]: My kids.

[SPEAKER_07]: OK, so as soon as he crossed the threshold, Kevin opened fire.

[SPEAKER_07]: So once the shooting stopped, Tracy quickly placed the knife in Matthew's hand.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like we said, the subscription box was a great idea so that the knife that was placed in Matthew's hand was not traceable.

[SPEAKER_07]: In the end, their master plan fell apart.

[SPEAKER_07]: The nine one one call came to late.

[SPEAKER_07]: The placement of the knife didn't make sense, and the entire scene had obviously been staged.

[SPEAKER_07]: Even if they had gotten all those details right, the months of text messages regarding their murder plot would have led police back to them eventually anyway.

[SPEAKER_07]: As a result, Catherine, Kevin, and Tracy were all arrested in connection with the murder.

[SPEAKER_07]: Other evidence that they had was the air tag.

[SPEAKER_07]: So there was an air tag put [SPEAKER_07]: in Matthew's car.

[SPEAKER_07]: Probably you said during a Disney trip I think it was probably when she was leaving and they put it in like a console under all a handyman.

[SPEAKER_07]: My dad's a plumber if you put it under a couple papers they will never fucking find it right because those papers in the console are going to be there for twenty years until the car sells so they did that and then [SPEAKER_07]: Tracy, Kevin, and Catherine all had access to this air tag.

[SPEAKER_07]: Subsequently, they were texting each other about the route that he was taking and texting each other about where he was [SPEAKER_07]: In the air tag, check find my, I'll tell you when the air tag is close.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let me know if you get any alerts from find my, he should be here.

[SPEAKER_07]: And so really, they all three are tracking this air tag of Matthew, who is thinking that he's coming to reconcile with his wife, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, again, it's an ongoing case.

[SPEAKER_07]: We don't have like the real.

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure there was a lot more text back and forth.

[SPEAKER_07]: But the absolute real evidence is them tracking him the entire way saying he's an hour out.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's about to show up.

[SPEAKER_07]: Get everything ready.

[SPEAKER_07]: Things like this.

[SPEAKER_07]: Um, [SPEAKER_07]: So, again, there's a lot more evidence.

[SPEAKER_07]: I guess it all would sound circumstantial, but piled on top of each other.

[SPEAKER_07]: the stupidity of the entire family.

[SPEAKER_07]: The fact, maybe because they're Mormon, they don't understand.

[SPEAKER_07]: Sorry, maybe because they're Mormon, they don't understand that all these devices that you're using to communicate with each other and track this person [SPEAKER_07]: is completely, uh, your witness.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's your witness.

[SPEAKER_07]: Technology is now a silent witness and in the reason why we don't have the hate a of the seventies.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh God, the seventies like you say where you could you even out to the eighties.

[SPEAKER_08]: Welcome to the Surveillance State, Jesse.

[SPEAKER_05]: I can't have a fun serial killer anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: Can't run off with a single kid without going to prison.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we can't have a fun self defense story right to get rid of your husband who will not stay out of the sun.

[SPEAKER_07]: My God, he's just going to keep getting older.

[SPEAKER_07]: I want to get rid of him.

[SPEAKER_07]: You can't do that classic self-defense.

[SPEAKER_07]: He was crazy story anymore because back in the day, it had to be a person witness.

[SPEAKER_07]: Now, you guys have a witness in your fucking pocket right now.

[SPEAKER_08]: Big brother, just listening at all times.

[SPEAKER_07]: And again, I'm fine with that, but if I was a murderer, I'd be pissed.

[SPEAKER_08]: That the family probably had an Alexa that was listening in.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, Alexa, the air tag Facebook group.

[SPEAKER_07]: They were fucking talking.

[SPEAKER_07]: The text all between them.

[SPEAKER_07]: They're all connected to the air tag.

[SPEAKER_08]: The brute brother probably had a fucking Xbox that's just always on.

[SPEAKER_07]: Always on recording him.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's always got the thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Alexa, what sense attract a mountain lion?

[SPEAKER_07]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_07]: The the mom is [SPEAKER_07]: searching previous cases of things like this where people have gotten away with it.

[SPEAKER_07]: I was trying to look for the exact case I couldn't find it, but she searched a specific case.

[SPEAKER_07]: in her recent history where someone had gotten away with a self-defense.

[SPEAKER_07]: Or hadn't gotten away with it, and she was going to be a murder consultant for herself, essentially, and do everything right where this person did it wrong.

[SPEAKER_08]: Just leaving all the breadcrumbs.

[SPEAKER_08]: We'd be a proper country.

[SPEAKER_07]: By the way, by the way, this is twenty twenty four.

[SPEAKER_07]: This is not somebody that's like in the infancy of surveillance.

[SPEAKER_07]: Like how stupid do you have to be in twenty twenty four to be like searching this kind of shit air tagging sharing that it's bonkers.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm pretty sure you can't kill anyone now.

[SPEAKER_07]: You can't.

[SPEAKER_07]: By the way, you can't.

[SPEAKER_08]: At least in a fluent neighborhood.

[SPEAKER_07]: Unless you come to murder consultant.

[SPEAKER_07]: All right.

[SPEAKER_07]: How do we end this go?

[SPEAKER_01]: I know one innocent little angel from twenty eighteen who did kill somebody in self defense and was innocent.

[SPEAKER_01]: Kayla.

[SPEAKER_07]: My future wife.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're sweet girl and she's out.

[SPEAKER_01]: My sweet little innocent angel.

[SPEAKER_01]: She's at a prison now and God bless her for it.

[SPEAKER_01]: She might end up going back for some fraud cases, but I mean, who amongst us, you know, who hasn't committed a little bit of fraud here in the year?

[SPEAKER_01]: A little one sided at this point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Due to this case being so recent, the legal battle over the murder of Matthew Resteli is still ongoing.

[SPEAKER_01]: As of August, twenty-five, only Katherine has stood trial.

[SPEAKER_01]: Following her husband's murder, she was charged with first-degree murder, conspiracy to commit murder, obstruction of justice, and two counts of domestic violence in the presence of a child.

[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know that they would actually charge you separately if there's two children in the house, but they'd charge your separate food.

[SPEAKER_07]: They'll do everything.

[SPEAKER_07]: They were, they were trying to get Karen Reed on DUI.

[SPEAKER_07]: Or along with premeditated murder, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: So they just do all of them and see, you know, see what you're going to flee or whatever.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, it did kind of work because she took a plea deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: As part of a deal, she pleaded guilty to murder and conspiracy in return for having the lesser charges against her dropped.

[SPEAKER_01]: She is set to be sentenced on September nine, twenty twenty five, and is facing anywhere between six years to life in prison.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if she doesn't get the murder charge, she'll only be getting six years for the minor charges.

[SPEAKER_07]: But I mean, so this points to me towards a Tracy and Kevin pushing like pushing for it a little bit.

[SPEAKER_07]: Although we will talk about her calllessness afterwards, but for her to confess right away, which is what she did.

[SPEAKER_07]: She just told them everything now.

[SPEAKER_07]: Again, murder consultant would have said leverage.

[SPEAKER_07]: testifying against your mother and brother for a way lesser sentence, which she may be angling, but I'm just saying she can one hundred percent say like my mom was really pushing for this and I just kind of went along with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, the evidence for a decent amount of the evidence does point that direction.

[SPEAKER_07]: It could be argued in court, except for her, like I said, uh, right after day, the day of day after she had friends calling her.

[SPEAKER_07]: uh, you know, giving condolences and she was so caulish.

[SPEAKER_07]: She was saying she was happy.

[SPEAKER_07]: She was showing them on FaceTime.

[SPEAKER_07]: Showing them the murder scene where the blood was.

[SPEAKER_07]: She had a date.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think two days after.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was within one to two days after the murder.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was already dating, which again.

[SPEAKER_08]: I'm sorry.

[SPEAKER_08]: How long should you have to wait?

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh no.

[SPEAKER_07]: There.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's not evidence.

[SPEAKER_07]: You're right.

[SPEAKER_07]: On the face.

[SPEAKER_07]: That's not anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: you break up you die I don't care like not to wait six miles like you anyway a back in the good old days if if like a king died or something like that there their their wife had to be learning for like a fucking year she couldn't even wear anything there was a succession plan for the next wife as it should be [SPEAKER_01]: So Tracy Grist and Kevin Ellis have yet to stand trial, both of them are facing first-degree murder charges as well as conspiracy to commit murder, obstruction of justice, and also to counsel domestic violence in the presence of a child.

[SPEAKER_01]: Kevin is also facing additional charges of possession of controlled substance and felony possession of a firearm due to his previous conviction.

[SPEAKER_01]: Their trials are scheduled to begin in January of twenty twenty six, realistically they will both be facing life sentences.

[SPEAKER_07]: I would thank, but do you think Katherine, I mean, depending on how they angle each other against one another, why is Katherine only facing six years to life because she didn't pull the trigger?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because she didn't pull the trigger.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's the first person that got arrested after the murder was Kevin.

[SPEAKER_01]: He got arrested right away.

[SPEAKER_07]: Kevin would be definite life.

[SPEAKER_07]: I think Katherine and Tracy even talked beforehand and was like, [SPEAKER_07]: This guy's fucking got felonies.

[SPEAKER_07]: He sucks anyways.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's gonna go to jail at some point.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let's have him go down and we will pin it on him.

[SPEAKER_07]: Again, updates will be coming with this case because it is so recent and trials aren't starting until twenty twenty six.

[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, Catherine will be sentenced next month and then we have to wait and tell.

[SPEAKER_07]: So she's going to get straight up sentence before they go on trial.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, she already went to trial.

[SPEAKER_01]: She pleaded guilty.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, uh, to conspiracy.

[SPEAKER_01]: To conspiracy, um, I have a feeling that she might do what you were recommending and she's probably, if she has any sense, she's going to try and get her.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, she's going to flip to flip on them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, probably get like between six and ten years of my guess.

[SPEAKER_08]: Like, it was your idea.

[SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Again, like I said, they have too many [SPEAKER_07]: Callous like horrible text messages video calls witnesses against her Catherine herself that she may not be able to do that.

[SPEAKER_07]: She could try.

[SPEAKER_07]: She gets a good lawyer.

[SPEAKER_07]: She can try.

[SPEAKER_07]: The mom and brother have good lawyers.

[SPEAKER_07]: But it's a messy weird case that like [SPEAKER_07]: It should just go, I mean, they should all just go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, my current prediction is Katherine's going to get between six and ten years.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think she's going to get the full life sentence.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think Tracy's going to have the mother is going to have a little bit harder time fighting the charges because a lot of the other she has the money through that that's true Kevin for sure he's fucked by and they knew that from the beginning [SPEAKER_07]: They knew that from the beginning that their fucked up little brother or big brother.

[SPEAKER_07]: He's, her little brother, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_07]: Fucked up little brother was gonna go end up in jail anyways.

[SPEAKER_07]: Let's just have him do it.

[SPEAKER_07]: So depending on the amount of money where this case is set, I'm sure it's gonna be Utah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's gotta be out in Utah.

[SPEAKER_07]: So you never know out there as you know.

[SPEAKER_01]: You never never know.

[SPEAKER_07]: You never never know.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know exactly what's going to happen.

[SPEAKER_07]: What did the Mormon, what do you think the Mormons are secretly into?

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm curious to know this too.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, I know.

[SPEAKER_07]: It's got an idea.

[SPEAKER_08]: I do have an idea.

[SPEAKER_08]: And I know what's going to happen to this.

[SPEAKER_08]: This young buck that pulled the truck.

[SPEAKER_07]: Kevin.

[SPEAKER_08]: What happened to Kevin?

[SPEAKER_08]: Oh, Kevin specifically.

[SPEAKER_07]: Oh, Kevin specifically.

[SPEAKER_07]: Do you think it's [SPEAKER_07]: Mormon related, but go ahead.

[SPEAKER_08]: It could be Mormon related, although I don't think you can really get a prolapse than us from sokin.

[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_05]: They only do, do they?

[SPEAKER_05]: Are they the ones that do anal stuff?

[SPEAKER_05]: That's Catholic, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's more Catholic, but yeah, if you, I mean, if you soak too long, you don't create a section.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just get a couple out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just get a couple out.

[SPEAKER_07]: Come right out.

[SPEAKER_08]: Mormons just, they kind of go into the vagina and then they have their homie jump on the bed.

[SPEAKER_07]: And then that could that pressure, right?

[SPEAKER_07]: Is that where you're saying?

[SPEAKER_08]: No, it's just so they can move like they technically as long as they don't thrust their fine.

[SPEAKER_07]: How are we getting to the prolapse though?

[SPEAKER_07]: Are we jumping on the bench?

[SPEAKER_08]: You get a heavy friend and you go in the butt.