We need to talk Conversations on wellness with co cfm's Tony Street.

Hello, welcome to we need to talk.

If someone needed you, could you save their life?

And did you know that a whopping seventy two percent of cardiac arrests actually happen at the home?

This month Mark's sh October hattele hornescent John's annual campaign to give more New Zealanders the confidence to save a life.

All through October, teams are heading out across them more two to teach CPR and how to use an AED, which I have to say I don't With one simple message at the heart of it all, learn for your loved one.

Today, I'm joined by three guests who know just how important this campaign is.

We have LeAnn Peprel, who is the clinical services business partner at hartelehrnessent John who's been on the front line of patient care and strategy for seventeen years.

Sarah Mason is a researcher at Huttel Horner.

And Casey Blakelock is a mum whose life was saved thanks to quick action in CPR when her heart stopped at home one morning.

Hello to all of you.

Casey, Let's start with you tell us about that day.

My goodness for me, it actually started a little bit prior to that day.

I've been feeling really unwell for months and in and out of the GP.

I was treated for what they thought was a chest infection.

And the day before this all happened, I was actually back in the GP and they'd put me through for some mental health support, which I was like, that makes total sense.

You know, I'm having difficulty breathing.

I'm really struggling to get myself feeling okay, So totally mental health, that's what it is.

The next morning, I woke up, sent my husband to work early.

He's a social worker at OT, so I was like, go and do your job.

You know, I've got it at home.

It was the morning I was dropping our three youngest and our neighbors too after school, so getting everyone ready breakfast, and then I felt my panic attacks come on.

So and with the rescue remedy I had in hey went outside, calmed myself down all right back to it.

Came inside, watched our neighbors children walk down the driveway and it had again, and this time I couldn't I couldn't shake it.

So I called my sixteen year old who was just about to walk out the door to take herself to school, and said, pop the five kids that I had into the car.

I need to go one and calm myself down.

So I went into the bathroom, splashing my face with water, really just trying to get myself back, which had worked every other time.

This time it didn't work.

So my sixteen year old got everyone in the car, came back inside through the keys.

I said, go get someone to take them to Tisco.

We live in a really nice neighborhood, close you know everyone, we know each other.

So she managed to get the neighbor to take the kids to school for me, and she came back inside.

By the time she came back inside, I said, I'm no good.

You know, this is beyond what I can control myself.

We need to call an ambulance.

By this stage, I'm going in and out of consciousness, really unsure what's happening, thinking this isn't like any other panic attack I've had before.

I really don't understand this.

Terrified.

I felt absolutely out of control, and I think the one thing that kept me calm was looking at my daughter's eyes, and she was like, I've got us, I've got us.

I'm on the phone.

It's okay, I've got everything sorted.

Ambulance was here within five minutes.

By that point, I'm turning blue.

I'm laying in my daughter's lap.

She's saying, I think my mum swallowed her tongue.

She's not breathing.

Help.

The first paramedic to come and said, drop her like, pot her down, let her go.

So I went down onto the ground in the bathroom, and pretty much instantaneously they realized I was in cardiac arrest.

Hailey, amazing shout out to Haley jumped straight on with CPR, just right in there.

She performed CPR so well that she actually not only broke ribs, which is the right way to do it if you can break our hear, so she did that, but she also managed to dislodge what was causing all of my trauma, which was blood clots and my lungs.

So she went so into it and just fully saved my life by restarting my heart and moving those clots.

She's just an angel.

Far I want to hear more about your story in a minute, but I'm just going to switch to Leanne here.

How common is it for women in particular to kind of shoe away our symptoms and say it must just be a panic attack, or it could be something else, and not actually identify that it is heart.

It's fairly common because as mums and women, we're generally super busy and we've got lots of things going on in our minds, and so I think it's really easy for us just to go, oh, I'll do with that later.

And carry on with the day to day.

You know, I've got to get the kids to school, I've got to get the lung, chest packed or whatever.

So there is slightly more risk for females to push it to one side than males.

Sarah, you might be able to come in with some stats here around women and cardiac arrests.

Well, I haven't got the hard numbers for you, but I can tell you that one of the problems with recognizing that women are in cardiac arrest is that they don't tend to have what we call the typical cardiac chest pain signs.

So men are more likely to have that classic central crushing chest pain that radiates to a jaw or down an arm, whereas women might have more vague symptoms like you describe.

Casey just feeling unwell, feeling like something's not right, and so it is less likely to be picked up.

And that's the case as well if someone collapses in public.

People are more likely to jump to cardiac arrest or heart problems if they see a man collapse compared to if they see a woman collapse.

So, yeah, it is a bit of an issue.

Yeah, it really is, and I feel like people want to be forearmed, but it's something that we kind of push to the background.

Casey, you must have been very, very proud of your daughter being able to do what she did.

How old was she when all of this was happening, But she.

Was and is still sixteen.

The I think one of the contributing factors to her being so calm as she is in the Navy cadets and so she is one of those people who in a stressful situation, she is your calm point, so being able to rely on her to you know, remain calm and do what she needs to do while she needs to do it.

At that stage, I was so out of it.

I had no idea what was happening except for her calm eyes.

So that's really what I needed.

From what I've seen on our security cameras around the house afterwards, not so calm, but that was okay.

She got to let go and we've had lots of talking about about it all.

She's actually gone back to her cadet unit and they're beefing up there their training from just your basic first aid to full comprehensive CPR and using ADS.

So that's really amazing that they've they've taken an experience of a cadet and are using it to better the training they give.

Yeah, and I think we'd all hope that is how we would react in the situation, but so much of that depends on Leanne, whether you have actually learnt CPR and how to use an AED.

Why is it so important, I.

Think because time really is everything.

So a person's chance of surviving a cardiac arrest decreases by ten to fifteen percent for every minute without CPR or defibrillation, and the average ambulance arrival time, dependent on you know, whether it's urban or a uroral, can take about eight to nine minutes, so that just makes the bystander CPR really vital.

You know, we can alert.

Local people through an app that we've got access to called GOODSAM so that basically alerts the five closest people to the cardiac arrest who are willing to assesst but it can still take time for them to arrive.

So I think that immediate bystander CPR is really where it needs to be.

Where do you go to learn these skills?

Ultimately, you know, if you've never you don't know how to do CPR, you can look on a video online, or you could pick up a resource just to give you a little bit of information.

But obviously the best way to do it is through somebody teaching you and coaching you through so you can do the three Steps for Life courses that are run by how To Honey sent John and ultimately a first aid course would be the most comprehensive way to get into that CPR to give you a bit more confidence.

So if you are faced with that situation, you'll more likely to jump in and start sooner rather than freaking out waiting.

Yeah, and Sarah, the aim is to train fifteen thousand people.

What's the impact of that, Well, we.

Know from our statistics that if somebody gives CPR or defibrillation in those critical minutes before the ambulance arrived, that the person's chances of survival more than double.

So having fifteen thousand more people in our community who are ready and willing to respond when they see someone collapse, who know what they're doing and are confident, could have a massive impact on survival.

Simple as that.

I bet it's changed your view Casey on CPR and AD after actually going through it and seeing how that quick reaction essentially saved your life.

Absolutely.

I think just as humans, we second guess ourselves a lot, you know, with our own health, and then especially when it comes to putting hands on other people, it's you know, just that first checking in with them.

You know, are you okay?

If they're not responding, you check for the pulse, You do your basic what is it the ABC's, And you know, I didn't know any of this prior, and now I'm like, well that's actually pretty basic.

You do your ABC's, you check that their airway and their breathing and they're conscious, and then you go in and you do what you need to do.

I knew basic CPR, just you know, your first aid training when you work in an office, and I probably would have second guests before going in, whereas now, nope, you need me I'm there.

Yeah, changes your whole view, doesn't it.

Now?

The three steps for life Leanne you mentioned Can you just run us through that?

What does that actually mean?

Three Steps for life is something that we promote here quite heavily at Hotel Honey Saint John.

And it's basically just following the three steps to save a life.

So call one one one, start CPR, and use an AED if one's available, And that's basically there's no complications, nothing fancy.

It's just remembering those three steps.

Call one one one, start CPR, and use an AED if one's available, And that really could just save a life.

You're listening, Do we need a talk with Tony Street.

One of the things I like about hearing your story, Casey, is that it was your daughter.

And you know, I think of when I think about people doing CPR, I don't think of the kids having to do it.

But the reality is sometimes you are all they've got.

I know, my mum, I'll tell this story about me now because I've got few heart issues in my family.

We were at a pastor making class.

We had got this vanana for her birthday and it was me and my three kids and my mum and she collapsed and suddenly, Yes, I was there as the adult, but the three kids were very present in this situation, and my eldest daughter was actually really helpful and we were trying to work out what had gone wrong.

In the end, she needed a pacemaker, a new heart actually had stopped.

But you never know when it's going to happen.

It can happen to anyone, and it can happen with just the kids, and I think educating them is so so important and that's why I like this a campaign.

You've got Savior Teddy.

How does that work?

Leanne, can you tell us about that?

Yeah, So, Saber Teddy as part of Hafehoney Saint John's Shoctober campaign, and it's aimed at the youngest learners within the.

School, so kind of like you know, early primary.

Ages, and the aim is to build the awareness of the actions that you need to take in a cardiac arrest and to help save lives.

So this is especially important, as we've said, you know, you're more likely to have a cardiac arrest in the home environment.

So on October the sixteenth.

Teachers in schools that have registered for the Save a Teddy campaign will have access to a video which will show tamariki how to save their teddy, and that's by practicing the basic instructions on the video.

So the overall message is obviously to call one one one and then to listen to the call handler for instructions as well, and then they take that home and they share their learning with the rest of their far now to help spread the message.

So this year we've actually got fifteen thousand tamariki registered to take part to save their teddies.

Wow, it's a huge amount, Casey, You've got six children of your own.

How has their perspective changed on all of this in terms of, you know, being able to help Like eg sisted it.

We've kept everything away from the youngest.

After everything happened, I ended up in a coma for a week and requiring an urgent emergency leparotomy because the CPR with the broken ribs had actually lacerated my liver.

And then when they gave me the blood thinners for the blood clots, then I bled out internally and they couldn't find out what They couldn't figure it out.

So my kids have been through quite a bit of me.

Yes, So they we've kept them quite quite sheltered from it, but hearing that the savior teddies in the school, I'll definitely be reaching out to our kuda and asking, you know, we signed up for that because they were very support they were sending meals around to our house.

We're really lucky where we are, so I think reaching out to them and seeing if that's something they're already signed up for, then I'll be signing up on their behalf.

How's your house now?

We're working on it.

I'm still going through testing to find out what actually has happened.

I can probably last a couple of hours doing stuff and then I'm back and back in bed.

I'm still recovering from the broken ribs and the scar that I have from my laparotomy is huge and it really slows me down.

So the that's probably the extent of what the kids know is that you have to be gentle with mum now and yeah, that's slow recovery, but we're getting there.

Yeah.

I think a lot of people listening to this will think I want to be that person that responds well.

I want to be the one that stays calm.

So what would be the first step the end if someone's listening to this and they think I want to upscool, I need to be better.

What is the very first piece of action we can take.

I think, you know, like we said before, it would be enrolling in one of the three Steps for Life courses or enrolling in a Hunt of Honey Saint John First Aid course.

But I think you know, one of the key messages to take away is that you can't actually make things worse.

So if you come across somebody who's having a cardiac arrest, their heart has already stopped.

There's already they're already in a life threatening situation, and doing something, even if it's not perfect, really increases those chances of survival.

So you could just be the difference literally between life and death.

So you know, just get in there, get it done, and follow those three steps for life of one one one, start CPR and use an AED if you can.

Sarah, have you done much research on the barriers what prevents people from undertaking CPR.

We've actually got some research underway at the moment, just in response to some international trends that have shown that women are less likely to get intervention from a bystander if they have a cardiac arrest and we're trying to find out why that is.

But what we do know from international research is that, particularly when it comes to applying an AED or defibrillator, there's a lot of hesitancy and even fear of removing a woman's clothes to attach those defibrillator pads onto the skin with they need to be to put a shock through the heart.

And we want to we want people to know that not only is it okay to do that, Late Leanne said, you can't make things worse.

This person is going to die if they don't get any help, But it's actually critical and people shouldn't be making a decision about whether to save someone's life based on hesitancy and fear.

And I think the more people who feel confident that they can recognize the cardiac arrest and they know what to do, definitely the better.

Yeah, what would you say to that casey is someone that has got pretty close to death and come out the other side, What would you say to that?

Hearing that, you know, some people might feel essentially embarrassed.

That's completely understandable.

Actually, my husband comes from a strong Catholic you know tongue and family where modesty is really important.

So him watching because he arrived home by the time I was getting the CPR, and him watching me have my clothes taken off and my bra cut off and laying their naked in front of a room full of men.

It took him a minute to go, oh, actually, this is right, this needs to happen.

He had that protective I need to cover her up moment, but the knowledge and experience of the people around him really calmed him down and made him super aware that cutting my brawer off and having me naked on the top half was exactly what needed to happen.

And to be perfectly honest, I mean I breastfed sitting in the middle of the mall, so I've had bits out forever.

But yeah, just it was his apprehension and need to feel that protective moment over me and then learning and growing through that.

That was really the key learning for a mass for that.

Yeah.

One of the things that shocks me a little bit sitting here is I'm looking at you and I don't know how old you are.

You don't look very old, and you're sitting here with six kids, and I'm like, how have you gone through this big heart episode?

I think there is still a bit of a notion that it's something that happens when you're older.

But that's not true, is it?

No, not at all, So I think being vajams.

So I'm thirty seven, and I really I was like panic attacks totally.

I'm a milliennaial.

Absolutely heart attack.

No, that's my grandma, that's not me.

So really having that moment and my friends around me, all around my age, all millennials kind of going oh shit, that might be a thing, and then learning what needs to happen if that does happen for them, and talking to their partners about you know, I might have boobs out flying if that does happen to me.

And it just has to be that way, because, as you say, it's the difference between life and death, and modesty doesn't matter at that moment, and they're not there looking at me as anything other than someone they're trying to keep alive.

Yep.

And I think that perception actually does follow you through life as well.

Well.

I lost my nana at sixty.

She had a sudden heart attack out of nowhere.

And I still looked at my nana and thought, well, Nana's fit and healthy.

I don't think of her as an old person that's going to have a heart attack.

Do you think that maybe gets in the way a bit the end with people their perceptions on taking symptoms seriously.

Maybe, Yeah, it definitely could be a factor.

You know.

I think from a personal point of view, I also feel the same.

I'm definitely nowhere near old enough to be even thinking that a niggle in my chest would be a heart attack or you know, any form of heart related thing.

You know, it could be indigestion, sure, it could be stress, it could be hay fever.

But I think.

Often in what we would call a younger generation, we definitely can brush off those symptoms more.

And it's interesting that, you know, we feel this way because I don't know if Sarah has any specific statistics on this, but anecdotally, when we're talking to our ambulance of who have been going to cardiac arrests, that ages do seem to be, you know, in that younger generation.

So we are seeing kind of thirty five to sixty year olds having more and more cardiac arrests.

In that kind of undotal setting.

I haven't really looked at the trends over time, but one thing that we've noticed is pretty striking is that if we look at our Marian Pacific communities, they tend to have a cardiac arrest at a much younger age.

So I would say more than two thirds of Mariya and Pacific people who have a cardiac arrest are still working age they're under sixty five.

So there are a lot of forty to fifty sixty year olds out there having cardiac arrests.

And we know that there are a myriad of reasons why you have a cardiac arrest, but surely the stressful lives many of us are leading now and we are working longer as well that lead to that.

So the messaging from your side of things, Leanne, what would it be to anyone out there that has someone in the life, the loved one?

And that's what this whole campaign is about.

Loon for your loved one that might be experiencing the symptoms that Casey has explained to us today, even if they are sitting there in their thirties.

Just get it checked.

You know, you've only got one heart and you've only got one life, so you don't want to be brushing it off to be seen as being stoic or you know, just kind of hiding in denial.

What you you know, you make the experience and oh, we'd definitely just always go and see your doctor, always get it checked, have an ECG, which some people don't like to do as well, because again it's exposing the chest to your doctor or your nurse, and some people, you know, it's a bit like breast screening.

Nobody wants to get their boobs out, so they don't go.

But we just really need to start to overcome those barriers and fears and go and see your doctor and just get checked out for anything that just a little bit off.

Better to be safe than sorry.

Absolutely.

In casey, a last sort of thought from you is someone that's been through it in their thirties.

I was hoping to add to Lane's comments there with you know, just you know, trusting your gut.

I think it's really important as well for the family around, for your far nough.

If you're feeling that your parent or your sister isn't being listened to or is maybe not getting better and something's happening, go in and support them, sit next to them, don't let you know, don't let oh, it's just stress, it's just you know, maybe have a cup of tea, like you know, you need to sit down.

Don't let that just be the answer for everything, because you actually never know.

It could be it could be life threatening.

And it is better to be that that squeaky wheel going back and going back and going back and getting getting an answer than just sitting with you know, for me it's mental health because.

It wasn't you know your self better than anybody.

Don't you so hush for what you feel is right?

Yeah?

And I also think the other element to that is you have to be the advocate for other people because I think traditionally some people don't want to go see the doctors and you can see that something's different or something is wrong.

I think about that with my mom My.

Mom's like I don't want to go see the doctor.

I don't want to cause a fuss, typical woman in her sixties.

And I think sometimes you've got to be that person to go.

No, you need to go and ring that specialist.

You need to go and check that out and actually be the person that they can't be for themselves.

Sometime.

So it is shocktober.

So let this be the shock this month to get you into action if you haven't luckily had an event in your life that has made you that way already.

Check out the Three Steps for Life program, the Savior Teddy and all of the information is at Sint John dot org dot nz, which is st John dot org dot enz.

Leanne, Casey, Sarah, thank you all so much for all of that input today, and let's hope, particularly for the women who are being overrepresented in these stats, that they take action and we have a more positive path for it.

We need to talk with Coast FM's Tony Street.

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To get in touch email, We need to talk at Coast Online dot co dot MZ