This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan Lazar and Alex Barth.

Blazarre and Lazarre.

He everybody nailed it, joined as always by our bar Ga Gavi.

Here is Evan Lazar and Alex bar So.

They're throwing the football almost seventy percent of the time with Burrow or Flacco.

It's the numbers are stagged.

Today, ranked second in the league in past attempts, thirty second in Russian house.

It's bizarre because their run game is not terrible, and Chase Brown's a good player.

Now, maybe he's more of like a scat back than a true downhill between the tackles back, and maybe they need a compliment to Chase Brown to be able to do that.

But you know the book, and this is with Chase, so I'll put that caveat on there.

But the book that's been forming against this Flacco iteration of the Bengals is all right, we're just gonna play two high safeties.

We're gonna put one safety over Chase.

We're gonna put one safety over Higgins.

Joe Flacco's not going anywhere, so we don't have to worry about him scrambling and we know you're not gonna run the ball tops tops.

To the Bengals credit out they ran the ball a little bit in this game.

Yeah, they adjusted, and I thought that they actually had And I'm not doing this to put lipstick on a pig or anything like that for the Patriots, not that I have to.

They still won the game.

But I actually thought the Bengals had a really good coaching performance in this game.

From a game plan perspective.

I know some people are nippicky about some of their decisions, some of their kick decisions and fourth downs things like that, but I thought that defensively they were buttoned up, had a good plan.

I thought offensively, buttoned up had a good plan.

They knew the Patriots were shorthanded in the middle of the defense without Milton Williams, and then Tonga goes out pretty early in the game, and to their credit, they handed the ball off to Chase Brown and let them run it downhill at the Patriots.

So I want to give the Bagels a little bit of credit.

I think that they they played a good game, they played desperate, They coached well in this game.

It was a good game for Cincinnati.

Now with that being said, the Patriots have won nine in a row.

If you've heard that, They're ten and two.

They are in a great spot right now, with one game left until they're bye week.

But at the same time, you know, I hate I hate being this guy.

I hate being the like, you know, the one that kind of like rains on the parade of the nine straight wins after a big w But at the same time, this injury to Will Campbell looms large.

It just does.

And at this point, between losing Will Campbell, Jared Wilson, and Milton Williams, I think Tongo will be all right, but losing those three guys, it is really going to be a challenge for this team.

And I'm surprised a little bit by some of the talking points coming out of this game.

I'm surprised how like calm everybody is about this, where now all of a sudden they have all this you know, built up trust in everybody in the operation and the coaching staff that oh, yeah, well, Campbell'll be fine, right, They'll put Viderien Low in there, they'll give him help, and it'll be fine.

And I think that there's some truth to that.

But at the same time, I do have to kind of go back to some of my prior feelings about this team coming into the season and not be completely jaded by a nine game winning streak.

And look at what we thought about this roster when it was assembled.

Was much better frontline talent, much better starting eleven on both sides of the football.

Do they have the depth?

Do they have the depth to with stand an injury to will Campbell?

Do they have the depth to restain, you know, with stand an injury to Milton Williams, two guys that I think that were at the very top of the list if you had to put on the list of the most important Patriots besides Drake May, I might say that Campbell.

And Williams were your two most important guys.

Well, we even talked about this last week that defensive tackle was the one spot that the Patriots could maybe absorb that and it was going to make a difference, And it did make a difference not having them now.

They also lost Tonga, which we obviously weren't factoring in last week.

We talked about like that was the one kind of position where they had the depth to maybe absorb that kind of loss.

Offensive line definitely not.

Yeah, and I don't maybe this is just knee jerk off of one game, but it's really two games because Milton Williams barely played against the Jets either.

But I thought, in particular against this this Bengals team, you know, we just talked about off the top of the show, how they ran the ball pretty effectively on the Patriots, and I didn't really think there was much of a pass rush until late in the game, on that last drive where they kind of started to heat it up a little bit because they had to pass.

You know, the Bengals had to throw the ball, so you start to accumulate pressures and things like that when you know the other team is going to drop that pass with no play action or no run game, it's easier to tee off.

So I want to talk a little bit about, you know, how they're gonna move forward here in the short term without Campbell, without Jared Wilson, But I don't want I'm just I guess I'm just a little bit surprised by how nonchalant a lot of people are being about these injuries, because again, I think that we knew that their roster was better, and we knew that they improved the roster, especially the frontline play at the top of the roster.

They had a better left tackle, they had a better defensive tackle with Williams, they had better players at the top of the roster.

But if I could go back to August and replay everything that all of us said in August, it was that they still don't have great depth on the roster.

Now we're twelve weeks into the season and they're ten to two, and all of a sudden, everybody's fine with it, right, And I guess I'm just a little bit surprised by that.

I don't know how you feel about it.

A little bit.

Look, I think when the team's going good, people are gonna feel more confident.

I remember, you know, back in the in the Brady days, with a little the flying elms on the side of the helmet, the flying elvis on the side of the helmet, the that'll we find the do they Brady yep?

Do they bill yup?

They'll be good.

And maybe there's a little bit of that creeping in.

Maybe some of it is.

It didn't immediately fall apart with Lowe and Ben Brown against the Bengals, and that may have helped.

So you know, I'm not entirely sure.

But I'm with you, I'm a little surprised how how confident people are after this injury.

Yeah.

So I think a lot of this confidence stems from Josh McDaniels, Doug Moron, Jason Hoddling, Ryan Coogler, and this whole operation that they have going on with the offensive line and the coordinator.

There's no doubt about it that Josh McDaniels is.

Much He's very very good and maybe one of the best I've seen at scripting pass protection, right, Like, how can we help tackles, chip help, you know, changing pitches, sliding, moving the pocket, like doing different things that you can do to avoid putting these tackles out on an island where they're you know, just one on one all game long against Abdull Carter and Brian Burns right on Monday night.

So there's some built up trust in mcdaniels's ability to scheme around a left tackle that is a backup.

And I get that, and I think that that's very very true.

I think we both probably feel that it's gonna be Verderian Low.

I don't see why it wouldn't be Vederian Low.

Here moving forward at left tackle.

I don't think that there's a huge drop off from Wilson to Ben Brown.

They talked about if.

It was just that, I don't think I would be all that concerned.

But obviously, you know, Vederian Lowe not just based off of last year.

It just it's based off of a lot of seeing Vederian low play and it's going to be a drop off there.

But mcdaniels's ability to you know, like I said, to support tackles, whether that's chip help, whether that's moving or sliding protection, whether that's moving the pocket, whether that's you know, scripting run and play action, and then not really getting into those traditional drop back settings as much.

You know, you don't want to get behind against this Giants team or a backup left tackle.

You don't want you want to play the games on your terms.

You want to play the games on schedule so that you can stay in favorable down in distance and that way there you're not in third and nine and just expecting these guys to pass block a lot uh one on one on islands.

There's all that stuff is fair, you know.

I think the other thing that kind of has a trickle down effect on this a little bit and I think it might go hand in hand with the Munford signing yesterday, is that I would expect the Patriots to want to load up in protection a little.

Bit more now.

So they've done this already at a pretty decent clip, you know, using six offensive lines, using like max protection where they're only sending like two or three receivers into the route at a time, and really putting like six seven guys in the protection to kind of load up the protection.

Munford in the past has been with Josh McDaniels in Vegas, and Josh McDaniels used him him in that jumbo tight end role in Las Vegas.

Now it was Ben Brown and now he's going to be starting.

Then it was Vederian Lowe, and now he's going to be starting.

So you know, now you have this trickle down effect of how do you get another offensive lineman on the field, and maybe that's Munford.

That would be my guess is what that's you.

Know, I think Marcus Brown, Marcus Bryant.

I think it's possible, but I feel like they they didn't really do that.

You know, like if they wanted to do that on Sunday, they would have.

Well, but they were practicing with Low as the extra lineman or Brown is the extra lineman, right, Maybe they weren't, but now this week that's something you installed just because he's been here.

Yeah, you could do that.

You could do that.

I like his athleticism in that role.

Yeah, you could do that too.

I think that that's you know, a big part of too.

And we'll get to you know, the good, the bad, and the stuff that gets to be here in a second.

That that's a big part of the goal line stuff to me as well.

Was Now Campbell was in it for both line stands, but you get into this position where you know you don't have Tonga, you don't have the package of the six to zero line or the seven if you want to count Tonga as an offensive lineman.

They use that against the Jets a little bit where they had Ben Brown eligible and then they had Tonga eligible, and they really had like seven beefy dudes on the field, right, and they were able to run it in with Traveon Henderson.

If you you didn't have that at your disposal against Cincinnati because of all the injuries, right, So you know that that's a big part of that as well.

So I think that they're going to have some flexibility there and try to figure out how to get back to some of those packages as well.

But my main, you know, big point, and I want to get to some of the more specific reasons why I'm a little small sea concerned about all of this is one, I don't know if this roster is ready to handle these types of injuries.

If they had an in and I don't want to name names because I don't want to like single anybody out that didn't act like, oh, that player is not important, But if they had an injury to a wide receiver, you know, Kashawan Boody, since he was hurt, Kayshawn Boody goes out.

Okay, you know, not ideal, But I think that you had some depth there.

I think you had some NFL players there.

I think this was the one spot they couldn't lose his left tackle, and I think Milan Williams was playing at such a high level that that was another player that kind of got created there.

The other thing that I would say is, and you know this is more of an US thing, ME thing.

Yeah, one of the biggest reasons to me why the Patriots have done a one to eighty here and gone from four wins to ten wins.

Is the improvement in the trenches, obviously, Drake May's improvement, the coaching improvement with Mike Rabel and Josh McDaniel's huge part of it as well.

But they have really done a great job and it's not perfect, but their level again on the offensive line, they're like league average again on the offensive line.

So instead of being the worst offensive line in football year ago in twenty twenty four, in twenty twenty five, they're probably like the sixteenth best offensive line, and that has just been such a huge part of what they've been able to do.

So now you're putting two.

Guys in there and Ben Brown and Vederian Lowe that you were trying to move on from, like you were trying to upgrade from that were on.

That line last year.

Now you have three out of the five guys that were playing for you last year and not going to be playing if you count on WHENU as well.

Right, and what at a different position, right, So like.

It's it's just a big difference.

Let's get to the good, the bad, and the stuff that gets you beat, because there is there's some good from this game.

And I don't want to be all doom and gloom.

And I told you, I hate I hate being that one.

I hate being I.

Hate being the negative guy.

I hate it.

No, I don't like doing it.

You don't like fun either, So what do you like?

I don't.

I hate being the negative guy, especially at ten and two.

But I just feel like it's it's important, Like I don't know, Like I said, I'm just I'm shocked that everybody's just kind of whistling past the graveyard here with this.

No, I it's it is fun, like they've One night, there was a I'm trying to remember exactly the stat they said on Monday Night Football.

Find it.

They they either tied or broke it's the longest winning streak and franchise history without Tom Brady at quarterback.

Yeah that's significant.

Yeah, that's very sick.

I don't remember which one it was.

Let me find it because I want to make sure I the right one.

But I heard them sound like they said it late in the game because obviously they're pumping up Patriots giants squeak, and I kind of sat up.

I was like, already, wow, Yeah, so no, it's absolutely significant.

Okay, So let's get to the good, the bad, and the stuff that gets to be from this win over the Bengals.

Still a win, still a win.

Keep saying that I thought that in this game, starting with the good Drake May stuff, and then we'll get to the not so good Drake May stuff, but starting with the good Drake May stuff.

Also, by the way, Yeah, it's now the longest winning streak in fra chi's history without a guy named Tom Brady under center.

Yeah, it's impressive.

It's their longest win streak since twenty fifteen.

That was arguably the Wheels fell off late with injuries, but that was arguably one of the best Patriots teams of the twenty ten.

The only so on Pro Football Reference, they have a box for limit streak to a single season.

Are we counting that?

Yes, so then it's only within one season like the three to zero four, So.

Okay, I just want to make sure.

Yeah, so Brady won obviously sixteen games in a row and O seven, they won twelve in a row and O three, and they won ten in a row and fifteen.

So Brady's only a three longer winning streaks in this Yeah.

Yeah, it's nuts.

Yep, it is nuts, and it's it's something not to take for granted.

It really and I don't mean that, you know, no, you're absolutely to sugarcoat it, but it really isn't all right, So go into you know, the specifics here with Drake May.

I thought what stood out to me in this game from Drake May didn't have his best stuff like this is like you know when Garrett Crouch has like, you know, an off night, but still gets through six innings and is still gives you a chance to.

Win the game.

Right, That's what Drake May did for the Patriots on Sunday.

He still made three high level great throws in this game.

The one to pop up the seam is one of the best throws I've seen any quarterback make all year.

I don't think that's hyperbole that that throw is that good.

The back shoulders seem you know, a layered throw to Austin Hooper beauty, the fade to Hollins on the sideline beauty.

You know, he still does this every single week even when he doesn't play quite at his peak.

You know, three or four throws where.

Your jaw drops and you say, you know that is that is why you know he's in the MVP conversation.

That's why everybody feels so great about where Drake May is at.

I still thought that those plays existed in this game.

I still was really happy with a lot of the things that he did in this game, even though it wasn't necessarily his best performance.

Yeah, it's just to kind of blend the two, because this one's kind of hard to do the good, the bad, and stuff that gets you beat because so much of it's intertwined.

I thought what you saw from Drake Man this game, I mean, he clearly wasn't right off the top, like there was something he was not locked in.

He was not not we're usually is mentally that that the pick.

We've seen him hit Hunter Henry on that through a number of times this year.

He was able to settle in.

And what I thought the story this game was for the Patriots offense was they were still able to produce explosive plays at the rate that they typically have this year.

They're a handful of them in there.

They had a couple of Henry, they had the one to pop, they had a couple two, or they had one of mac Hollins down the sideline right yep, it was the in between the explosives, like I found myself called them isolated explosive plays, and Mike Vrabel kind of talked about this after the game, that the coaches and the players need to be able to bounce back from the good as well as the bad.

And it just felt like what's made them so effective this year.

Part of what's made them so effective is they've stayed ahead his schedu Well, something we talked to a lot about in the summer, like for this offense to work, you've got to be in second and six, you've got to be in third and three, and you've got to stay ahead of that.

And look, they've bailed themselves out at times when they haven't, but yeah, they've generally done a good job I think of doing that.

They didn't do that in this game.

In between the explosive plays.

You didn't have the three to four to five yard games just kind of carry you down the field.

It was a lot of nothing.

Yeah, but then they still hit the explosives that got them the chunks when they needed them.

So again, I hate to jump ahead, but I like it's interesting when you look at it in that sense from Drake May that sometimes when a quarterback has an off day, the dink and dunk is still there, but they don't have the big play in them.

This was the opposite.

He's still the big play in them.

I think Henna in between.

But would you say that's more rare.

I've definitely seen both.

Not for a quarterback that plays like him, that's fair like I think Josh Allen's that's fairy right, where like with him, it's gonna be You're still gonna have some haymakers.

Like even in the Thursday night game against Houston where the Bills kind of got their butts kicked, Josh Allen still made some big plays.

But it's the consistency throughout the entire game that isn't there.

It's you know, a bad interception, it's you know, things like that in terms of the consistency of the offense.

And that was what you saw out of this game.

And I want to get to some of those things because I think, you know, one of the main things that gave Drake May problems not you know, now we're jumping ahead together one of the.

Main things that gave Drake That's how you have to talk about this game.

Drake May and the Patriots offense as a whole problems was blitzes you know, cover zero specifically, but also you know some well timed like safety and nickel blitzes as well.

And I think that that kind of goes back to where my smalleste concerns are about these injuries on the offensive line.

This was one of the first games all season long where I saw a defense kind of take apart their protections a little bit.

And to me, I don't know, you know, I'm not in the angles, you know, meeting rooms and game plan meeting so I don't know if they saw something that you know, they could manipulate or you know, a tendency or something like that about the way the Patriots pass protect and you know, load up in terms of protection when it comes to blitzes.

I don't know exactly what they saw that teed them off to this, but they generated more free runners, you know, unblocked pressures in this game than any other game the Patriots have had all season long.

Like that's a stat like that is accurate facts.

Yeah, So that to me is something that I think it's a combination of things.

One, it's like the old scarnekiism of like seeing the game through the same set of eyes and having five guys playing on a string.

Well, when guys get hurt and guys are in and out of the lineup, then it's harder to do that, right, It's harder to have five guys on the same string.

Like the last third down of the game, which is probably the play that Buggy the most the Patriots last third down of the game, the runner, you know, the runner comes through the B gap over Ben Brown and Vederian Low.

Well, Ben Brown and Vaderian Low haven't been playing and they haven't been playing a lot together.

That's I meant to say this earlier.

Sorry, we were talking about you know, Ben Brown and Jared Wilson.

How maybe that's not that much of a gap, but like, yeah, understated.

I think honestly my biggest concern with the offensive line.

Sorry to cut off.

I just want to make sure that's like I said.

I like Ben Brown is a solid player.

Yeah, And Vaderian Low I do think as much as he struggled last year.

We talked about sometimes that the group can be better than the sum of its parts.

I think the reverse can be true too, And if like the lines, if it's across the board not good.

It makes all the players look worse than they actually are.

They're in a better position out to maybe help out Darien Low a little more.

But the point I was gonna make the chemistry might be the bigger concern for me than the actual like schematic element though.

Yeah, I mean they've done a great job.

Look I say it all the time.

You're gonna have some one on one losses in pass protection in the NFL, Like those pass rushers are freaking beasts and they get paid two and when you lining up every single week against good players, like you're gonna get beat.

Sometimes you can live with those ones.

It's the ones where you're you're doomed from the snap right where the guys are coming free and you know there's blitzers off the edge or there's blitzers up the middle that are just unblocked.

Like, those are the ones you can't have.

If you're gonna have like one on one losses, it's gonna happen die slowly, right, so that like the quarterback should be able to still have a chance on those plays, is my point.

You know, usually you don't see a ton of pressure in like under two and a half seconds where the quarterback has zero chance to get rid of the football.

In this game, you saw a lot of that, and and that was concerning.

Now, I want to stick with the goods and then I want to break down some of that a little bit more.

But sticking with the goods, you know, we had Drake may still have some high level throws in this game that stood out a new career high for Hunter Henry one hundred and fifteen receiving yards.

Yeah, I thought he was excellent in this game.

You know, he got wide open on the touchdown, but twenty eight yard touchdown.

I thought the thing that really got the Patriots offense going after the pick six.

They went to a lot of you know, heavy personnel.

They actually ran one snap out of twenty two with the full back west Over and Henry and Hooper on the field altogether, and then they ran a lot of empty you know, empty formations, you know, running back in the backfield.

And they inverted the formation so the outside players were Westover and Henderson and then the inside players were the receivers.

And so that's an inqu You call that an inverted formation because you think that you know, traditionally you would think it would be the opposite right, that those guys would be in the backfield or inside the formation and the other guys would be outside.

So they inverted the formation and all they did was consistently get Hunter Henry on these Bengals linebackers in coverage.

And these Bengals linebackers we've talked to the tracks all last week.

That was the thing he kept pointing out about this Bengals defense is, you know, rookie linebackers, inexperienced linebackers that have struggled this year.

And whether it was you know, Barrett Carter, whoever it was, you know, Hunter Henry has beat those guys like a drum.

Like he was running inns, crossers, slants, you know, things like that into the middle of the field against that linebacker coverage and he just had a day living inside there.

I thought Hooper was big too.

I thought he made a couple of big catches in this game as well.

But a lot of what I felt like kind of settled them down.

They got into twenty one, they played right under center, they started running the ball, they got the tight ends involved like that was kind of what got the offense into this game and settled down a bit after this slow start.

Yeah, I think there's something to be said for you know, Hunter Henry's had a quieter season this year statistically.

I don't want to say he's had a down season because he hasn't.

He's still been good.

The volume's just not there because the last few years he's kind of been the only guy.

Yeah, and now there's other You start of Steph on Diggs, art pop Thuglis start kseh on booty, throw to mac Hollins, who, by the way, continues to make plays.

Yeah, but wouldn't you know it, things get a little tough off.

What has Drake may do?

He goes right back to the security blanket, right back to the guy he trusts, and it speaks to Hunter Henry like he hasn't had a game like that this year, but stayed ready when the moment came up.

I think the veterans, Henry and I want to give Steph Diggs credit to the veterans carried them.

Diggs did not have a very He kind of had the opposite of Henry.

He did not have a very statistically productive game.

Yeah, but he had a very impactful game to play.

I go back to him.

Mike Rabel singled this out in his postgame press conference.

They get backed up into first and twenty, like kind of back under their own goalpost, and he hits Henry on like an eight yard in and it was going to be like a nice game.

It was gonna set them up with a second and manageable.

But Steph Diggs sets this great block and creates an angle for Hunter Henry to run for the first down like that kind of play.

Thirty one year old receiver has been in all pros, done everything that is doing this league, steps up and sets that kind of block.

That's part of the reason this team is where they is because they have guys willing to do that.

So not gonna be a lot of talk about Steph Diggs after a game like that.

He had two catches and they were big catches.

He had one big third down con version late in the game.

But Steph Diggs deserves credit for the way he played in this game.

And you know, when you have a rough game like that, it's a young team, you're gonna want to lean on the veterans, and that's what they did.

Henry Diggs, mac Hollins like those guys came up big and helped get him cross the finish line.

On offense, we haven't really seen a ton of them, you know, being behind Lee lately.

I think that was the first time they.

Were being on behind Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that was the first time.

They haven't been in that spot that much, which is why I find it notable.

I feel like that was the first time that they were I think that it was since the Pittsburgh game.

Well, they've trailed a lot because they keep giving up these first drive touchdowns.

Right, but they haven't been down double digits.

They usually catch up pretty quickly.

Yeah, so I to see that.

You know, you get down ten to nothing on the road, you throw a pick six, McDaniel's going back to under center, full back in the backfield like that it's still that's still it, right, Like that's still the let's level this.

Thing off for Josh McDaniels.

That that's still his his bag, Like that's still what he's going to go to in those situations.

And obviously the tight ends are each part of that.

The other thing that I thought was, you know, really, uh good, good sign.

Good thing in this game from the offensive perspective them We'll move over to the defense.

They're gonna need this now moving forward, obviously with the backups on the left side, Morgan, Moses, Garrett Bradbury, Mike on wn Who.

I thought all three of these those guys are really good in this game.

I only had them allowing two pressures combined among the three of them in the entire game.

On when who I thought was particularly good.

I counted eight plus blocks in the run game from those three guys.

They're the starters, right like, they're the guys that have been the starters all year long.

Their right side is still intact, their center is still intact.

So they're gonna need those three guys to step up and play their best football without Wilson and Campbell and and kind of give them a steady side of the offensive line.

You know, if the left side gets you know, takes a little bit of a step back.

So I was encouraged.

I think on when Who was really starting to play a lot better.

Uh, he's kind of taken you know, He's to turn it on here a little bit.

I don't know exactly why that is, but I thought he started a little bit slow this season, and now that we're getting into, you know, the later part of the season, he's starting to really pick it up.

He had an awesome backside combination block on an outside zone run that was a positive play where you know, he got two guys and looked really good on the play.

No pressure is allowed in pass protection.

So I think that he's starting to pick it up a little bit.

And you can lean on that, and I think that one thing that's interesting or you know, kind of confusing.

I guess too, like why don't they just run it behind Moses and on Whney won the goal line?

Like I don't really understand it, like you have you have like seven hundred and fifty pounds of beat right on that side of the offensive line.

I get like the in theory, like maybe you want to run it, you know, up the mill or to the left and then kind of cut it back behind those guys instead of just going right behind him.

But when you have one yard to go, like just turn the turn around, hand the ball off and run it right down their throats behind two guys.

And I think on when who's probably, if we're being you know, nice about it, three forty three fifty and Moses is probably three thirty, right, you know, so we're talking about two guys that are almost to combine seven hundred pounds of beef on that side.

I get not wanting to be predictable, but when you have eight shots at it, right, you have to do it every time.

But maybe mixing it.

Yeah, absolutely all right.

Moving over to the defense on the goods, a couple of goods on that side of the ball.

Carlon Davis.

I thought this is probably his best game as a Patriot.

I think that's pretty clear.

Yeah, yeah, I mean the DPI was a tough call, and you know you'd have to mention it, but but.

You have to love it.

And he said it after the game.

He responded like it made him bounce back, which is the mentality you want.

I thought he had four really high level coverage plays in this game.

Obviously the three pass breakups on the final drive for the Bengals, but then on the pick six on Marcus Jones'.

Pick six, he has the coverage.

On T Higgins on that play, which is where Flacco and Flacco starts looking down the field, he wants to go to T Higgins down the field, and Carlton Davis smothered the route and was all over T Higgins and so he had to come off it and come to the check down late, and so I thought that Carlton Davis was a huge part of making that pick six happen.

Like, if Carlton Davis doesn't cover te Higgins there as tightly as he did, then maybe Flacco's throwing the ball to Higgins on that play instead of throwing the ball in the flat.

So really good game I thought from Carlton Davis really stepped up in this game.

I think I still have no real I know, he's kind of been a little bit of a lightning rod.

They paid him a lot of money in the offseason.

I've thought that he's been pretty steady for most of the season.

He gives up a play here or there, it's gonna happen.

But I don't think that.

I don't really have any major gripes and haven't had any major gripes with Carlon Davis.

And he's played.

He played really well in this game.

Yeah, No, I mean, has he like I thought he'd maybe be a little better than he's been.

But that doesn't mean he's been bad.

He's given you really good you know.

I think he's given you a really good number two corner play.

Yeah, maybe it's not the one A, one B we were looking for, but he's still been, you know, a legitimate cover corner and yeah, been waiting for him to have a game like that.

Glad he had it.

Maybe that kind of launches the second half.

I go back to, and this is an extreme example.

You remember Steph Gilmore's first five games in New England.

Yes, brutal, Yeah, and they got hurt in at Tampa game and came back and was the best corner in football for a year and a half.

So and not that I'm saying Carlton Davis is going to have this like wow dissension, but I yeah, I he hasn't been exactly what I thought he was.

Really he was really good in this game, especially down the stretch.

I think you summed it up perfectly.

If you had this expectation that they were going to have this one A, one B, you know, two number one corners kind of lineup with Carlton Davis, he probably hasn't been that, but he's definitely been a solid number two corner.

You know, number two corners are not expected to shut down their side of the field every single week.

That's what all pro corners like Christian Gonzalez are expected to do so.

I think that Carlton Davis has done his job on the whole this season, and I don't know why there's so much criticism towards him, honestly.

Next one up here on defense, both Klevon Chase On and Christian Barmore were basically the Patriots disruption upfront.

Like, those two guys are the guys that were creating the most chaos.

Seven total pressures.

Barmore had a couple of run stuffs, Chason had the pressure on the last play of the game on the fourth down.

You know he's locked a quarterback hit on that play on the all out pressure.

I thought those two guys, you know, I was disappointed on the hole with how the defensive line played in this game.

But those two guys continued to play well and stand out.

And Barmore was doing it with a ton of double teams without Milton Williams as well.

But if they were basically the pass rush, those two players were basically it.

Yeah, again, you could notice Milton Williams absence.

I think you notice in the game he didn't play just how good he's been so.

Ye, But those who get to that after it last thing here on the good side.

Uh, Kyle Williams kick returner.

I like it.

Finally saw it.

I liked it.

I think that this is a this is a role for him moving forward.

He had the thirty six yard return.

That's the Patriot's longest return since uh Antonio Gibson's touchdown in Week two in Miami.

So they it looked like he looked the part.

You can see the speed.

Obviously, the play hits a lot faster than what it did with fin chishm back there.

I understand when they had the injuries to create uh to Kishon Boody, that they needed him on offense more.

But now that all the receivers are healthy, uh, this is key should be your primary kickoff returner moving forward.

I actually think he's gonna be a little bit dynamic.

Back there, and it keeps him involved and you get something out of that unit.

And yes, we've been talking about this for weeks.

I think I've been talking about it since the training camp.

Love that we got to see it.

Love that.

I mean what I think doesn't matter that hopefully the coaches liked it.

I to me, he should earn an other shot.

I don't know.

And there's one more on the special teams the good How about Andy?

Yeah, Andy boorgallis four for four three kicks over forty yards.

That fifty one yard or at the end of fifty one to fifty two?

Was it at the end of the game?

Yeah, that was massive because the way their defense was playing there, if the Bengals it only needed to drive for a field goal or if he misses it and the Bengals would have gotten the ball right around the fifty right.

I mean, that was a massive kick.

Kind of reminded me to the kick at the end of the Miami game.

Yeah, and he can.

He had that little bit of a bumpy start.

He's been excellent since week three.

Very good.

You're right.

Uh, he had math favorite kicking there.

By the way, what's up math favorite?

The field goal?

Interesting because the other game, what was the Giants Lions game?

The Giants had an opportunity to kick up three to go up six, and there was a lot of talk in my my nerd world about whether or not they should have kicked or if they should have gone for it on four It down out of the Patriots.

I don't I don't remember exactly what the down and distance was for the Giants.

The Patriots were in a fourth and seven, so that that's a far fourth down.

If it was fourth and one, I think the math probably would have said go.

But fourth and seven is not a clear go by any means.

And so it actually favored field goal in that spot.

And you've seen this twice now down in Miami and then obviously in Cincinnati, where being up six in that spot instead of only being up three is a big difference.

Like that's the difference between over time or you know, a touchdown winning the football game either way.

But it's a big difference to be in that spot.

So I thought that was that was an interesting sort of thing there, And.

I want to add it too, just the element of it.

I don't think people realize this.

So when you miss a kick, the ball's not spotted at the yard line, the ball was on the ball spotted where the kick was missed.

Yeah, so when you go back to that play, that's a fifty two yard field goal.

I gotta find the exact yard lines.

I don't have to do that, he was like on the logo, for sure, it was Yeah, maybe the forty eight three thirty three plus seventeen is fifty right, thirty three plus yes, so oh no, but seven so forty yeah, yeah, so the Bengals would have gotten the ball on the forty yard line.

You saw the kick McPherson hit before the aft.

It was an absolute tank.

Sixty three yards.

So yeah, they're what two first downs away from tying that game, right if he misses that kick.

Whereas yeah, if you punt it, you might only net seventeen yards or thirteen yards, but some people might say with two minutes that thirteen yards is a big deal.

I'm not saying they should have punted.

What I'm saying is they clearly trust the kid.

Yeah, Like, it's not as simple as all right, we'll put you out there to try and if you miss it, no harm nor there is a massive risk if you miss that kick.

And same same situation in Miami.

So they really do trust him in that situation.

Yeah, absolutely.

I just really quickly aside, because I'm not gonna mention this with with the bads or the stuff that gets you beast.

I'll just mentioned it now.

I actually didn't watching it back.

I didn't really mind what they did at the end of the half.

The kid made a sixty three yard field goal.

I thought that the Higgins.

I minded it.

I didn't hate it.

So they went they went with a seven defensive back package and they went into prevent.

They did.

They went with a three man defensive line seven DB's.

The Higgins deep in was Jalen Hawkins was standing right in the window, and somehow Higgins won the ball, like I don't know how, but Higgins won the ball.

The play was covered, and Higgins made a play.

He's a good player, is a really good player, and he made a play on the football and Hawkins kind of got you boxed out there at the catch point a little bit.

So I don't really hate what they called in any of those spots, Like, okay, you give up the twenty one yard run on first down.

You're kind of conceding that there was like seventeen seconds or eighteen seconds left in the half, so they're going to run the ball.

You kind of let him run it there.

And then they give up a chunk play to Higgins where I thought that they had the right coverage and they had the right idea, and then the guy gives up it kicks a sixty three yard It was a franchise record, Like, you're not gonna You're not expecting the kicker to make a sixty three yard field goal in that spot.

So if they had given two chunks and now the Bengals are kicking the field goal and it's a fifty yard field goal, okay, now I'd probably get on the defense.

But you tip your cap when the kicker makes a sixty three yard field goal.

I'm sorry, there's probably a better way to execute that, but I didn't think it was some like agree and they'd probably tell you they could have execute it better, but I regis massive mistake.

Yeah, they could have executed the Higgins play better, no doubt.

Right, all right to the bats.

So I mentioned this earlier.

Going back to the offense, the lack of answers versus the Bengals blitz package was kind of shocking to me.

This is not typical of Josh McDaniels or Drake May or this Patriots offense.

So the numbers, Drake May was four or twelve against the blitz with a sack, but more specifically, he was zero for five against cover zero.

You know, zero completions against five zero blitzes, and really none of them had a chance like he had zero chance on any of the zeros like it was.

It was really just, you know, it was free run at the quarterback.

The two plays in particular that I think stood out to a lot, well three if you include the sack.

But I think the number one thing here first is just a lot of this is on Drake May's plate.

And this was one smalleste concern I had about this offense as a whole coming into the season was that you have a second year quarterback that is setting protections and supposed to read pre snap and you know, make decisions of where the mic point is or where the protection's going, and understanding where the blitz threats are and the packages and studying their pressure package as much as you're studying the It's a lot.

It's a lot to put on a twenty three year old kids plate.

And I'm actually pretty surprised at how well they've done it so far this season.

And I'm pretty surprised that it took this long for a defense to sort to play some mind games with Drake May and get them a couple of times, and these types of situations a testament to McDaniels to May.

But I also look at this for other teams moving forward, especially Buffalo.

Is this the blueprint that we've heard so much about it?

Right?

Is this is this going to start to be a repeat you know, blueprint type of thing, because if the Bengals were able to get some guys, you know, multiple guys free to the quarterback.

And I thought that a lot of it was pre snap, a lot of it was missing, you know, sliding protections and things like that.

So you know, the first one was on the very first drive of the game and he puts reminder up into the line of scrimmage over the overload side to pick up the blitz, and then right before the snap, the safety goes from over the right side to over the left side, and then they overload the left side instead of the right side, and the safety is just unblocked over the left side.

Then you know, later on in the game they blitz the nickel and they have a nickel blitz on that one.

You know, they have a cap defender, which means that behind the nickel behind the slock corner, the safety is standing behind the slock corner, which is what's called capped, which means that most likely they're blitzing because the safety is going to replace the nickel in coverage.

So when the nickel blitz is the slock corner blitz is, then the safety is going to take Stefon Diggs and replace him in the coverage.

So for a quarterback, that's typically a tell that that's coming from that side of the field when you see the cap defender.

And Drake made that.

They didn't slide the protection that way, and I believe it was Brown.

At this point, Ben Brown is blocking nobody.

So you have you have Ben Brown and Will Campbell blocking the same guy on the left side of the line, and nobody's blocking the blitz.

So that's to me, is just strategic, right, It's just moving guys around.

It's the chest match before the ball is snap.

And then of course the last third down of the game, you know they let somebody through the b gap unblocked and it's another pressure.

So there was a lot of that going on in this game.

The Bengals kind of took apart their protections a little bit in a way that I haven't seen happened to the Patriots yet this season.

So this is something that they definitely need to button up and get fixed because teams are going to keep doing it until they prove that they can block it.

And the issue just compounds that they're going to have to do it with a new group up front, right, and that's going to make it that the communication that side that much tougher.

Yep.

Absolutely.

The other thing that was a little bit disappointing in this game to me was the interior run defense, and as a whole, just the pass rush and the disruption.

I think the number one word I would use is disruption.

They just weren't making a ton of plays on the other side of the line of scrimmage in this game, or at the line of scrimmage for that matter.

So the Bengals only got stuffed twice on runs in this game.

They had twelve successful runs to two stuffed runs the entire game.

I also charted the pressure rate before the final drive and half or the final drive, So before the Bengals final drives.

In their first nine possessions of this game, the Patriots only had Joe Flacco under pressure on fourteen point eight percent of his dropbacks.

Now that skyrocketed on the last drive.

It was fifty percent on the Bengals, you know, game winning drive attempt.

So that's gonna push those numbers up for the entire game.

But to me, it's kind of fugazi.

It's a little bit inflated because it really came at the end of the game where they're sending all out pressure and they're they're heating Flacco up at that point.

So the big stats that stood out to me fourteen point eight pressure eight if you take out the last drive of the game for Cincinnati.

They also allowed three yards per rush before contact in this game.

That was the second highest mark in the NFL in Week twelve.

The only team that had it worse than the Patriots run defense.

You want to take a guess last week, This is an easy one if you think about it again, the only team that gave up more rushing yards before contact than the Patriots this week in Week twelve was the New York Giants right against Detroit.

Okay, so the Giants right now are historically bad run defense.

That's not company you want to be in because with the Giants.

You've seen that chart.

You know, I don't like the charts.

There's one chart where they had to explain the chart to fit the Giants.

And so you don't want to be part of that chart with the Giants.

So I just thought that they were a little soft up the middle in this game.

Defensively.

I didn't like seeing that.

You know, they're gonna need more from Dirden, from Gregory, from Farms.

You know, maybe Farmers active this week after being inactive in Cincinnati.

They're just gonna need more from that group.

You know, Barmore can't do it all by himself, and and Tongo will hopefully come back healthy and he'll be available.

But I thought that that was something that really stood out in this game.

Just the lack of Milton Williams was so obvious in this game, you know, the disruption.

Let's start Tonga in there too, because he didn't play a lot.

And and again we talked about last week, like they have the depth to fill in for Milton Williams, and part of that was Tonga.

Then you lose him too, is very apparent they didn't have those guys.

Yeah, absolutely, last thing here, and then we'll go on to the stuff that gets you beat.

I just don't like seeing Christian Gonzalez get beat by Mitchell Tinsley.

No, I don't look credit to Tinsley was a great release.

I don't know how much Gonzal studied him during the week, but yeah, you don't want to see that.

I mean, it's just it's not like something that I'm going to kill him for.

It's the first touchdown he's given up all year, by the way, in coverage and Mitchell Tinsley like some of the guys he's faced this year, Drake London, you know t Higgins in this game for most of it and you get beat by Tinsley.

That that was tough to watch.

You don't like to see that from your number one corner.

Now to the stuff that gets you beat.

Let's talk about the pick six.

So I think that what's being under discussed with the pick six was that this was like a trick formation that they ran.

It was kind of a trick play that they ran in this game.

On the pick six, they only had four offensive linemen blocking for me, right, they like faked a screen.

Yeah.

So they had Ben Brown, who was in the game at this point.

This was an eligible situation.

He was at left guard.

He was the left guard they had, you know the best way to say this, Hunter Henry was playing left tackle on this play.

They did the the who man yeah, you know, eligible moved the formation.

So Hunter Henry's playing left tackle.

Ben Brown is out on the perimeter with Trayvon Henderson offering a screen.

I don't know if he if the screen, if this was just a decoy thing and they always wanted to throw the seam to Henry, or if they were going to throw the screen and May saw the that Henry flashed up the seam and he just tried to take it.

I don't know, you know, I couldn't tell you, you know, I'd have to ask.

I don't know which one it was, but it was a tricky formation that my guess is that we won't see for a while because of how it was.

And it's open.

It's there.

You know, he's gonna have to layer it in there, but it's in there.

And he just airmailed it, you know, he does air mailed it.

Sailed it and if you sail it over the middle and this league, it's going back the other way nine times out of ten.

Right, So it's a combination of factors, you know.

I think that, you know, the simplest way to put it is he just he sailed the ball.

He airmeld the throw.

But I would also say that there was a little bit of trickery on the play that kind of was a unique formation, And I just don't know if they needed that in this game, Like maybe if they had practiced it more and they pulled it out in a playoff game like it.

You know, I always go back to the twenty fourteen Ravens, you know, playoff game when they were down by two scores and they needed to pull something out of their butts.

That was not this spot.

So he throws the pick six.

Bad throw.

Probably not the best formation or play to call in that spot, especially backed up there like they were.

And that was it.

I mean, I don't really have anything else to add I don't know if you have anything else to add about.

It just wasn't a good throw.

Maybe they were trying to set up they wanted to throw the seams so they could come back and throw that screen.

Yeah later down the road.

Who knows, sure can but can't be throwing pick sixes.

It's his first pick six of his career.

By the way, I should put that out there so you know it doesn't happen all the time to Drake May.

It's not like a problem a repeat.

Problem, all right, the last thing here.

And then we're before we take the break, we got we gotta break down whatever the heck happened on the goal line, Like, yes, so this was this was just it was kind of crazy to watch it back because of how many opportunities they had to score and they still couldn't score.

Like they had at least four or five plays in the first sequence, but that should have been touchdowns.

So I don't necessarily panic about it because I think this was all execution.

I really do.

I don't think this was anything the Bengals did.

I counted at least four plays that were there for touchdowns that for some reason did not end up in touchdowns in this game.

On the goal line, so you had the four yard little swing pass to Travon Henderson.

I can't remember if it was first or second down, but I said this yesterday.

I would like to see Travon Henderson Marstown make the guy miss there and get into the end zone like you're one on one in space with a linebacker, your scap back, your speedback, like make a cut and get upfield and get in the end zone.

Right, you have space out there, make a play like maybe Drake may could have put the ball on him a little bit faster to help him, but I still think he had time to kind of like break down, you know, size the guy up and make a little shimmy and get into the end zone.

You'd like to see your you know, explosive rookie running back score on that little swing pass.

Then the next one, Drake May is coming out from underneath center.

They run a little play action play.

Hunter Henry's open on the corner route.

They bite, they got it, and Drake May gets tripped, gets stepped on whatever you want to call it, coming from underneath center, stumbles out and he can't get the ball out on time.

So then that play gets wiped out.

Then you get the Hunter Henry touchdown that got nullified by the offensive pass interference.

So now I'm at three of plays that I think they could have scored on, and then you get to the fourth down play where I think Drake May had an r PO and probably made the wrong read on the r PO and it probably should have been a touchdown to Hunter Henry in the flat.

So they ran I think it was what eight plays from inside the five yard line.

I think they ran, yeah, six or seven fix from one six from the one, and I just rattled off four different plays that were there for touchdowns that they didn't score on.

Right, So to me, that's an execution problem, right, Like, that's not a tip the cap to the Bengals.

They got one on you.

I mean it's a little bit of both.

But yeah, no, you get eight tries and they kept getting back down, Like they get the OPI, they get pushed out to the eleven.

Next play, boom, they're back down on the one.

That nice little shovel pass Hunter Henry.

So yeah, you got you just got to score there.

You got to score and they got to figure something out with the quarterback sneak because they've been a good quarterback sneak tam.

Yeah.

So then the second one, you know, the second thing they get pushed back, you know, they get Hunter Henry and then.

Oh no, that was the first drive that they got.

The second one was just three and then they came.

Yeah, so I think they only got down inside the one or inside the five on second down.

I think they got down there on first down, and then they had second and third down from the one, right, and they got stuffed on second down.

They actually gained a few yards on second down, but Henderson literally got it to like the they kept getting tackled at the one yard Yeah, they literally got tackled at like the half yard line.

I don't even think it was just the one and then they obviously have the sneak and then were able to elected the kick on fourth down, so you know, not not good.

Well, it's the right decision to kick there though.

I think so too, even though the math would.

Have gone, well, does the math factoring you just got stopped eight times earlier in the game, and you might And this is this is why it feeling.

This is why Rabel and Stretcher are such a good combination, because Rabel's got enough of the feel and stretches the MAK.

So this is why you got why it works.

Because this is my whole thing about Dan Campbell's going.

I don't want to I don't want to do the rail against the analytics thing.

But this is where to your point, I think this is why they've had success because they manage it.

They don't let it either be all end all and it's hey, yeah, the math says go, but look at what happened earlier in the game.

We need to leave with points here.

Yeah they did that.

Yep, absolutely, I was perfectly fine with that.

But it just wasn't going well down there, right.

As Rabel said on Monday, you're gonna you're not gonna win a lot of games if you can't score from inside the five yard right.

And I think the bigger thing you know to me is you know along those lines, I'm sorry, but I'm gonna run it in from the one kind of guy.

If you can't get a yard in this league on the goal line to run it in on three or four tries like, then you have problems.

You have problems up front.

And you.

Said because I think a lot of people sorry to cut off, but I think a lot of people want the creativity, right.

They want maybe you know, they want bootleg.

May or they want a motion, or they want to bubble or like something creative right in that spot that goes beyond just we're gonna line up in the eye and we're gonna run it down your throats.

To me, the best teams can line up in the eye and run it down your throats when you need all the bells and whistles to get it in down there.

I don't think you're all that great.

This is where they missed having to fall back.

I'll just add to that.

I don't love the shotgun run on the goal line unless it's that direct snap play they've run, yeah, in playoff games to Kevin Falk and James White over the years.

A little surprised they didn't go to that.

Like there's two McDaniel staples down there, if you want to get creative, like you said, the bells and whistles, there's the direct snap for the running back, which they didn't do right.

And then are you surprised they didn't go back to the return route at any point after Booty got held a little bit.

I mean maybe because he loves that play down there, but it also.

Like it wasn't even really that open, uh, you know, because he got a help.

I know, but I don't love that on fourth down.

I didn't love that call.

That was the one call I didn't really like because it's the reason why I don't really like it on fourth down is because it's a one read throw.

So like, if that's not going back.

To any point, I mean, they had four more plays after.

That, Yeah, they could have, you know that.

I I just want to you got to be able to block a yard.

And Rabel's whole big thing is, you know, finish with your guy in the end zone like that.

That's his like rallying cry.

That's his like coaching parlance, and like that to me is the bit is the end all be all we can talk about, you know, all these bells and whistles, all these creative emotions or return routes or boot legs or whatever.

When you need a yard, can you get a yard?

Right?

And they're they're run blocking right now has not been good enough in short yardage.

They need to improve there.

And I'd also put a little bit on the running backs like Ramondra Stevenson, you're two hundred and twenty seven pounds, like lower your shoulder and get into the end zone, you know, like run through the guy's face and get into the end zone.

And I think, you know, it is frustrating to me a little bit to watch, you know, these running backs get like stood up on the half yard line, like you know, have a little push right, get your shoulder pads down.

And get in the end zone.

So as much as that you can harp on the blocking, and the blocking is a big part of it.

I think that's a part of it too.

Now they didn't tongue it down there.

I think that's that's a big miss.

Yeah, that that's a big element of it as well.

All right, So that's good to batten and stuff that gets you beat.

We're gonna take a break and when we come back, we'll do a little Giants preview.

We'll take your calls and emails and we'll open the show up from there.

We'll see you guys in a few seconds.

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Thank you to Aaron's for the swag I much appreciated, really quickly before we get into the nitty gritty again, because I feel like that was a very dense Yes, it was a very hour and I need to loosen it up a little bit.

So what the heck is this hard count thing?

So this is like, can you tell me this is like a new trend online.

I didn't think you're gonna want to do this.

I do because I just want to make fun of it.

So there's like these this goofy thing online where where guys are out and there hanging out and you just you're out with the poise hit the hard count.

And there's like videos on YouTube of people trying to get other people to jump or like there's this one account where they line up in front of like an ananimate object.

There's one of a guy trying to get like a pickup truck to jump off sides or a Walmart.

And so it came up because we were talking about the giants and I don't know if you saw Cam Scattapo the other night trying to get his chat to jump off sidees like the chat that was watching his lives.

Cam Scattaboy's gotta worry about it, and he started he started hitting the hard count.

I've texted you about the hard count.

I think you jumped.

I texted you a hard count and you say you didn't jump, but I think you jumped.

I think I think the real reason you hate this is because you don't have a good hard count.

And you know, the real reason why I hate this is because you people are so corny because it's fun.

Just relax, like, my goodness, let's her hard count.

No, I'm not hard counting.

There's no no, I'm not doing it.

And this is just like this all bothers me.

Like everything you just said bothered me, Like the hard count thing, like what are we twelve years old?

It's like doing like in middle.

School, okay, and we're not at football practice.

You don't play football.

I know.

I'm sorry.

I know you all want to be in the NFL.

You're not.

Okay, I'm not You're not.

No one is in this situation.

The hard count is lame.

Please stop doing it.

Also, the second thing I would say about this is just like I just can't believe, like you know, the whole culture, like you just when you're out with the boys and you know you just got a hard count, like.

What like a pillow truck to jump off side?

Come on, it doesn't really work without this.

It's horrible.

That's Horrible's your hard count?

No?

Absolutely, not.

All right, that's as much fun as I'm allowed to have.

That was that was two minutes of fun.

It was I don't.

I just don't lot of fun.

Yeah, I enjoy those videos.

I think my side on this right like this is, this is lame, like this.

Is I'm sweets man.

I don't take sides like this.

I just you.

You couldn't get anybody to jump off sides give a week hard count.

I think that's the problem.

And that's like I'm supposed to be like humiliated by that, like you clearly are.

Because you won't embrace this this fun thing that people do.

It's not because it's it's not fun.

I don't understand how what's fun about it?

Like this is unbelievable in a hard count?

All right, let's get to the phones.

These guys have been waiting on hold for a while.

Or are you afraid you would jump?

Is that?

Or you're not disciplined?

What you're gonna get?

You're afraid you jump off sides?

No, I'm not afraid.

Do you do you think I would jump off sides?

I listen, I never jumped off sides, never once in my life because I was too slow to jump off side, So that's what it wouldn't matter.

Nate is in Connecticut.

What's up, Nate?

Hey, guys, can you get through?

Well, yeah, we got you all right.

I got a couple of.

Thoughts for you guys.

First off, you know, the connection between May and Campbell, their chemistry this season on and off the field has been like unmatched to probably any quarterback left tackle duo in the league.

Then to have Campbell gone, first, I guess it's not season endings.

That's good, So he'll probably be gone for some weeks, but it's definitely gonna be definitely going to take a toll on May.

So it could be hard to.

Get some stuff going in the offense.

So I think could be a good idea to bring back Marcus Jones on the offense.

You know, when he was on the offense, he was able to get some stuff going and I really like that.

And you know, if the Darian Lowe and Ben Brown are going to be on the line, might be a little hard to get some stuff going that they were able to get going earlier in the season.

And yeah, uh, And then second off, you know, Evan, we all we all want to hear it.

Give us your hard count.

Nope, thanks Nate.

The people want it.

But Nate, Nate, I can understand these these grown men that are doing this in like the middle.

He's I know, he's not.

Somebody's got to call in in hard count.

Wasn't a knock on, Nate.

I yeah, they're gonna see it coming.

Now, you're gonna see it coming, but we need somebody call it in hardcount to see if you jump.

I don't think Marcus Jones on offense helps a lot of what's wrong right now.

I could see what he's saying, like if you get him in the screen game and things like that, you know, with a bad offensive.

Yeah, but I'm not saying it hurt.

But I don't.

I think he's got a lot on his place.

He's right, he's very important them defensively and in the punt return game on special teams.

You should be able to whatever you were gonna do with Marcus Jones, you should be able to do with Pop Douglas.

Yeah.

So I I hear Nate though, and I said it earlier in the show.

I think the big thing about this.

Moving forward, I think what you're going to see a lot of is those max protect play actions.

You know, let's get under center, Let's run the football, let's play.

Action off the run.

I don't I don't think that Vederian Lowe Darien low is probably a downgrade in both pass pro and run block and compared to Will Campbell, Ben Brown might be a little bit of a better run blocker than Jared Wilson, just because he's a little nastier.

Like Jared Wilson's a very athletic, very graceful player.

Ben Brown I think might have a little bit more power, a little bit more SNAr, a little bit more size for sure, just from a measurable standpoint.

So I think you get under center, you run the football, and then when you play action, you know you can leave seven guys in.

You know you can leave you know a go six to zero line, which I think they might do in this game against the Giants to help out against you know, Burns and Carter on the edge.

You know, you go six o line.

Now you put two olignement on one on one of those guys, you know, things like that, and then that's how you're going to try to push the ball down the field.

Once you get into the drop back game and you get into shotgun, you do have the advantage obviously of me being able to move around, which is which is helpful.

But when you talk about like their base early down offense, I think you're going to see a lot of two three man route concepts with hard play action underneath center.

Maybe move the pocket a little bit more than they have been lately, and I think that's how they're going to try to piece this whole thing together.

Ben is in Philly.

What's up, Ben?

Hello?

Hey, what's up?

Ben?

Hey?

Just kind of a question for you guys, kind of leaning towards special teams after that gaming Miami SCE and you know, Antario Gibson and understand go off.

I don't know, I feeling a little bit disappointed.

That might not be the right word, just with a hund return unit.

Just wondering what you guys are kind of seeing, you know, is that we're not getting enough defenders on their gunners on the outside or they're just really popping them up so Jones can't get a speak going.

And I'll take that off there.

Thanks.

Yeah, it's a good question.

I mean they haven't They had the big game against Carolina early in the year at the two punt returns and I don't know if it's been as dynamic now.

Marcus Jones is one of the best punt returners in football and everybody knows it.

He's fifth in yards per return.

Yeah, so that's probably an element of it as well.

But I, like I said earlier in the show, and I think you're in agreement, I'm looking forward to seeing Kyle Williams return more more kickoffs.

I think that's gonna ye remake that play dynamic like it was when they had Gibson and Henderson back there to start the year.

I think that that could go a long way of trying to get some hidden yards on special teams.

Also, big time knock on wood.

When I say this, there's like a it's an epidemic, right, That's what it's called, when it's like a big thing that's happening.

Widespread epidemic, epidemic, epidemic, epidemic, Like I'm just saying the right word, like, yeah, like pandemic.

Yeah right, Yeah, there's one of those going on with block kicks in the NFL this year, and knock done with the Patriots have not had a blocked kick punt or fields talked about.

I think it's something they're very, very aware.

Well, it's like, I think it's happening every week, So every week.

There's at least part of the reason it's happening.

The kickers are so much better.

Teams are kicking longer and longer field goals.

When you kick a long field goal, their trajectory is lower, so it's easier to block.

So the rise in block kicks in part.

It's not all of it.

There's been some shorter kicks a block too, Yeah, but part of it has been teams are attempting longer kicks, which are easier to block.

That's epidemic epidemic.

So an epidemic is it's technically different than a pandemic, but they mean similar things.

Okay, all right, close enough, get into some of these emails.

This one, how you like this and this one from Justin.

An epidemic is when a disease spreads in a specific area.

A pandemic is across multiple Okay.

Well, this is very specific to a lot of field goals getting blocked.

Well, no, I think it might be because an epidemic goal is only a couple teams of panstrick point, it's the whole league.

Yeah, it's it's been like crazy this year.

Subject line to this email outs Evan's alerted to fun which is something that you have said about me for probably our entire friendship.

Evan must have called the fun police the way he's beating up on the hard count trend.

Come on and cut loose and have some fun.

Saying that I called the fun police is also, you know, very corny.

But here, Actually, if you got in here and you got like Paul and Fred to try do the hard.

Count, I feel like that's something Fred would do, because Fred's all for the bid to do it.

That's what I'm saying.

Hard count.

Well, this is like the first I'm hearing of the hard count.

What is the hard count?

It's when the quarterback goes the line and gives a bunch of dummy signals try to get the other team to jump off sides.

Aaron Rodgers is probably the best hard Aaron Rodgers is in the history of the league.

Gotcha okay, okay?

He gives a little hut hut, and then they all see that was a weak.

Well, I'm not gonna do it like I'm doing it now.

As a way to explain it to that might be your hard count.

We're not doing this.

I'm gonna get you to do it.

I'm gonna get you to do it.

Okay.

A couple of questions about left tackle in the chat.

Here in the emails, I should say, uh, the guy they got from Cleveland.

I'm assuming he's talking about Munford or Marcus Bryant.

If Vederian Lowe struggles.

So Marcus Brian's an interesting one because he played left tackle in college, played left tackle last year at Missouri with Membu on the right side, Are you thinking at all that?

I still think it's gonna be low But I guess the question is is like, how short of a leash does low have?

Yeah?

I think short.

Since they have an extra will they kind of have an extra day to get ready for this game?

I guess they're probably they're not gonna practice on Thursday, right, They're off on Thursday.

Assume no, it's Wednesday, Friday, Saturday this.

So because of Thanksgiving?

Yeah, I mean I think a relatively quick, quick pull.

Now, whether it's Mumford or Bryant would be the question.

Yeah, because remember Mumford was here yep for a couple of weeks early in the season, so he may have the playbook, he should have the playbook down a little bit.

And was he working at left tackle a right tackle when he was here.

We don't know.

Like if they just feel like he's more ready to step into left tackle specifically, and he's a true swing tackle, then maybe they give it to him.

But I don't think they're gonna score around with Drake May's blindside.

I don't now they're gonna give low help.

I don't think they're gonna hang them out to dry.

But if it's not working, I do think they'd make a change.

Yeah, I agree with that.

I think it's gonna be a couple games.

So and so.

Diana Russini, I guess has a report on Will Campbell.

That's said it's at least four weeks.

So the thing I'd say about Bryant too, that people really want to see Brian.

Look, I get it, you want to see what he can do.

Like, they drafted this kid, and let's let's find out.

It's see how many he didn't take a lot of reps at left tackle in the summer, did he, Marcus.

Bryant, Yeah, a little bit, but not a lot.

And they've kind of been working him as the right tackle right.

That's I wonder how much work he's gotten on the left side.

There was something I was thinking where he's like Low's been there, he probably hasn't had a ton of time over there.

So even if they want to go to him, and they'll probably started this week because he's all right.

If if Low's you bet you're now you're starting left tackle, right, Bryan's probably your backup.

Yeah, it'll be so he's going to get and then maybe it's Kane Wallace at right tackle or that's where Mumford is.

I don't know, but you know, it's probably going to be a little bit of a ramp up to get him ready to go in there if you need him.

I wonder it could.

It's been pretty clear from the jump, and I said this yesterday on you that I do think that Bryant's play style, body type in the McDaniel system fits more the right side on the left side.

But I do wonder also, you know kind of related.

You know, Morgan Moses is thirty four years old.

I think best case.

Scenario when you draft a guy in the seventh round, if he's if he's a solid swing tackle, if he's a solid third tackle, Adrian Waddall.

You made a good draft pick.

Asking him to be like the air to Morgan Moses is probably pretty hefty, you know, pretty high bar, but still like that's the spot.

You know, Campbell's going to be at left tackle for the next ten years, you know, right, So that's the spot that you look at that maybe there could be an opening down the line.

So a combination of you know, getting him maybe as seeing him, you know, work behind Moses, Like could he be the right tackle of the future.

We know Campbell's going to be over there on left side, so I think that he's probably worked mostly at right tackle in practice, but he has played left tackle a lot in college.

So Marcus Bryant thirty four and five eighths cinch arms, he's a big dude.

He's like six'.

Eight, yeah, yeah he's a big.

Boy the dear low thirty five and a half loong.

Arms maybe that'll help him.

Out, well we were told that that that's the only thing that.

Matters do you want to take a little bit of a victory wrap here with?

Something what you?

KNOW i love a good victory and THEN i and THEN i have a real QUESTION i want to ask after this from the.

Emails this is From tom And, maine just wondering if this was just a fever DREAM i had or were there are actually people In New england wishing we HAD jj McCarthy Over.

Drake look At, alex look at how happy is THAT i brought this, Up Drake Drake May may at the beginning of the.

Season, nope you did not.

Dream.

Tom i'm not going to call out.

Names SOMETIMES i, do But i'm not going.

To i'm going to take the high.

Road but it's been pretty rough FOR jj.

McCarthy a it's BEEN i feel for the.

KID i don't want to like take a victory lap on a twenty one year.

Old it's going through.

It it's going through.

IT i mean he's like it's.

Football it's not like you're like, Victory like he's not going through.

It, well, no he's.

Concussion, okay, fine but you know What i'm, Saying, like it's not like you're not it's it's just wild when you look at and when he got, Drafted i'd said at the, time like that's a pretty good spot for him to go and if he's gonna succeed Anywhere between O'Connell and, NOW i know their offensive line's been banged, up but that offensive line And Justin jefferson and, like it's it's just a lot of what what we talked about leading into the, draft and maybe he figures it out down the.

Road he's very, young and we've seen guys have this kind of career.

Resurgence this is the new it thing in THE.

Nfl The Baker, mayfields The Sam, darnolds who The vikings moved on, from The Daniel, joneses who The vikings moved on.

From, no IF i really wanted to take a victory, lap i'd play the clip of me On Felgrin maz saying THAT jj McCarthy Is Zach wilson waiting to.

Happen BUT i won't do, that not.

YET i am.

EXCITED i am excited to See Max.

BROSMER i do kind of Like Max.

BROSMER i liked him a little bit in the.

Draft, NO i liked him as like a you, know potential.

Backup, now the last TIME i said this about a guy Was bailey's, appy and that turned into whole.

Thing Could Max Brosber bailey's?

APPY jj, McCarthy i don't.

KNOW i liked him in the.

DRAFT i liked him as kind of a project backup.

Quarterback he obviously, played he played.

Well we saw him against The patriots in the.

Preseason, yeah that was somebody we were talking about when we were wondering About Josh, dobbs if they need another, backup you, know if he got, cut if he'd be an.

Option BUT i do like, UH i do Like.

Brosmer i'm interested to see What brosma is gonna.

Do SO i think the biggest hell he's gonna Be Tom.

Brady but, RIGHT i haven't a full.

DISCLOSURE i have, not you, know, actually FOR i wouldn't have any reason.

TO i haven't watched or you, know STUDY jj McCarthy on film at.

All but the things That i've seen or that some of the cut ups and some of what people are saying that do Study vikings tape are saying is, that you, know he's having a lot of trouble reading coverage and specifically reading.

Leverage you know a lot of, uh you, know we talk about coverages like cover, One cover, two cover, three but a lot of reading coverage from a quarterback perspective is just reading the body positioning of the.

Defender, Right so the defender is sitting, inside then the route's going to break, outside and you should know with anticipation that that's going to, happen and you're going to have an open area of the.

Field you, know it's called reading.

Leverage you know the defender is sitting outside the route and you know that the receiver is gonna run a, slant then, you in, theory should have an easy throw there away from the defender's.

Leverage so when you watch McCarthy a lot on, tape you know he doesn't really see those leverage opportunities as quickly as he, should and so that leads to throws that shouldn't really be tight window throws becoming tight window Throw it's.

That and then to, me everything's a fastball and people talk about his arm.

Strengthening these go hand in hand BECAUSE i don't think he's throwing with.

Anticipation so what he's trying to do is he's trying to make up for the lack of anticipation with just throwing the ball as hard as he.

Can, yeah he doesn't really have a touch, throw and, look these are things that can be, coached that can be.

Fixed, again he's a young guy and maybe he figures it, out it's probably gonna have to be outside Of minnesota at this.

Point but, oh you're.

Already you're already having The vikings move.

On we're already.

There it's a you're going to need a.

Quarterback SO i don't, know but, LIKE i don't think O'Connell's gonna if he can't get it.

DONE i don't think O'Connell's gonna waste.

TIME i don't think O'Connell doesn't seem like the kind of coach that would do the, obligatory mean to give them another year because you drafted.

Me you also memories going in a year.

Three O'Connell needs needs his Brock party because this is this is what happened With Trey lance and Brock.

Party is it Mac?

JONES i don't, know but he just needs his no like it might, be but he doesn't have.

That he doesn't Have Black purty.

Yet, look he Needs maybe he could Get brocket if The niners really Like Mac.

Jones he needs that, guy and then that's one of The niners quarterbacks is on The vikings next year would be pretty.

High, yeah all, right here comes another question from DON i want to talk a little BIT afc playoff picture and before we preview The giants, Game so right, now you, know how do you see the basically simple, question how do you see THE afc seating shaking?

Out he thinks The patriots win in The east is almost a.

Lock it isn't not mathematically over by any.

Means it's getting pretty close in terms of The patriots.

When they win this.

Week if The patriots beat The, giants.

They could clinch the division against both no.

Matter What buffalo does against The.

Steelers that's a hat AND t shirt.

Game, yes, okay?

Yes is?

It do they can they clinch the playoffs this?

Week or is it one and the?

SAME i haven't seen any eleven wins they would.

CLINCH i haven't seen any clinching.

Scenarios it feels like we're getting, there.

Though come out On.

Tuesdays, yeah SO i.

DIDN'T i didn't see.

Those i'm starting to see.

Teams what's the reverse of a.

Clinch we're starting to see teams.

Eliminated, yeah The giants are, eliminated and THE i think The giants are eliminated and it's just The.

Giants how are The titans not?

Eliminated they're one in ten because their division leader is how are they not?

Eliminated i'm on THE nfl website right.

Now is the k the case is knocked?

Out, oh knocked out of division title.

Contention The giants can.

Playoffs The titans can only go seven to.

Ten that's not Making there's three seven win wild card teams right.

Now that's.

Why, okay, yeah you're, Right so like there's STILL i go in the playoff machine and try to.

So they they're gonna get eliminated this.

Week so right, now just you, know reading off the standings really.

Quickly The patriots have an extra.

Game but The patriots are number one seed right?

Now, Denver, Indye, baltimore The Lack, Jacksonville buffalo is your top Seven Kansas city, Right New, England, Denver, Indy, baltimore The Chargers Jackson.

Bellway what'd you call The chargers?

Lack don't, know but that's not a thing you want to talk.

About, Cringey, no that's so much all the.

Time i've never heard.

That don't do that.

Anymore, wow that's bad.

Fight so The rams the Lar, yeah this Is Paul perrillo with.

Him i've never heard.

That, YEAH i don't love.

That, Anyways, yeah, Clearly so here we.

Go so The patriots call him, lack not the.

Lack, okay The patriots are the one seed with the extra game and before their bye week, here But DENVER i think currently still has the tie breakers over The patriots IF i think it's conference and THEN i think it's strength of victory If i'm not.

Mistaken is the next, one which.

Is, Yes so right now they are Both, no there's common games in there, too oh.

RIGHT i don't know if how many common games, it but they're both six and two in the.

Conference and The broncos have a better strength of, victory but it is currently than The.

Patriots it is, close and The patriots and The chiefs Are.

Broncos so basically that's where we're.

At if the playoffs sort of start the day of The patriots will of course have the.

Bye BUT i think the more interesting thing to me is that if they do fall down to the two seed Once denver plays a game, in The patriots.

Don't in terms of the tie.

Breakers you're looking at a situation NOW i, think you, know Maybe jacksonville falls off, here but you're looking at a situation where a team Like, Buffalo.

Houston Or Kansas city is going to be that seventh.

Seed AND i have been kind of projecting this whole time That buffalo would be the top wildcard BECAUSE i have respect For buffalo AND i think they'll be the best wildcard team in terms of their.

Record but as of right, now after they lost to The, texans they're seven and four and they're the seventh seed right now in THE.

Afc how do you see this whole thing shaking?

OUT i think the number one team THAT i don't know if they will hold on looking at it Is.

JACKSONVILLE i just don't Trust.

Jacksonville jacksonville's weird And Trevor lawrence has just not been particularly.

Great so IF i had to, guess one Of houston Or Kansas city might Jump jacksonville by the end of this, While.

I'm just gonna throw this.

Out SO i was playing around with THE Espn playoff machine a little.

Bit, yeah the first and second seed could come down to The cults are really tough schedule down stretch Of patriots And.

Broncos remember last year with the or two years ago with the draft, stuff we were cheering for like random games because it impacted the strength of, schedule that same thing might.

Happen LIKE i just flipped A Jet saints game and it changed, Something so that's gonna be a.

Thing who DO i think is gonna fall out?

THERE i, mean if, anybody The jaguars And chargers both, could like do you end up with a wild?

Card That's, Buffalo houston And Kansas.

CITY i think those are probably the three best.

TEAMS i just don't know if the way the schedule is in the fact That Kansas city's margin For arabat is basically zero at this, point you, know do they have that ability TO i don't think they have to run the table, necessarily BUT i think they have five games left or six games, left five games, left they have to go what four and, two five and, one like they're NOT i think they could trip.

Up, once but they're gonna have to mostly run the.

Table Bill's Texans.

CHIEFS i think the team most likely to miss as The.

CHIEFS i think the team most likely to go on a late run here and really climb up Is.

Houston, yeah The bills are kind of in the.

Middle Now i'll ask you, This, okay those are because that's right, now it's there's kind of a.

Gap so you have the three wild card teams are seven and, Four, Houston, Pittsburg Kansas city are six and, five and then No.

Gate no team is within two games of that.

Group, yeah that being, said do you put any stock Into Joe burrow being back and The bengals lurking as a.

Threat now they have The, Ravens, Bills, Ravens, Dolphins, Cardinals.

Browns not a, lot not a.

LOT i think that they're they're two.

BURIED i don't know now If burrow plays that.

Game SO i hear a lot of this, too that If burrow, plays The patriots lose or If chase, plays The patriots.

Lose like to, ME i think that's hard to do because it's a butterfly effect of like are The patriots more locked?

In like do they play the game?

Differently like you, know when It's.

Chase Of beaconsalz the Way Mitchell tinsley, did.

It's hard to get up for a game against a banged Up Joe flacco and No Jamar.

Chase If Joe burrow And Jamar chase are playing in that game On, sunday that's a totally different.

Feel like it's a totally different.

Game SO i hate playing that sort of.

Game AND i just think with The, bengals like on the, WHOLE i don't know if their offense has really been the.

Issue like they've scored points basically with both.

Quarterbacks SO i don't know If Joe burrow coming, Back now there's the whole angle of like he's going to rally the troops and everybody's gonna be, confident And I'LL i hear, That BUT i don't know If Joe burrow coming back is gonna fix what ails, Them like the are they now all of a sudden gonna have a great defense Because Joe burrow's, Back, LIKE i, mean it got a little bit, Better LIKE i think it was a little bit better Against, pittsburgh and it was a little bit better against The, patriots but it's still not a good defense, Sure and SO i don't know how Much Joe burrow actually.

Fixes and that's not taking anything away From.

BURROW i just all, right let me ask you one.

More, yeah four and.

Seven The, Dolphins, Saints, Jet, Steelers, Bengals, Bucks.

Patriots are they lurking say that?

Again, Saints, Jets, Steelers, Yeah, Bengals, Bucks, patriots are they lurking.

In terms of what the?

Playoffs The patriots are in the.

Playoffs, no The, dolphins The, Dolphins, Oh, Saints, jets that's the rest of their.

Schedule ye?

Gotcha, Okay.

Dolphins i'm a little bit more optimistic about The.

Dolphins oh.

SEE i think there's a better chance The bengals make a.

RUN i think there's a better.

Chance that The dolphins make a run BECAUSE i think that The bengals are gonna have to win their, division AND i Think baltimore is gonna kind of blow doors the rest of the.

WAY i really.

DO i.

DON'T i Think miami.

IS i don't know what's going on In.

Miami, like Maybe miami's problem was not saying that he's don't get all, upset not saying That mike McDaniel's.

Perfect but Maybe miami's bigger problem was Actually Tyreek hill and not Not mike.

McDaniel is that.

Possible, well they were bad After Tyree hill got, hurt but they're playing a lot better.

NOW i just wonder if the vibes are better In miami because of.

THAT i just look at it more in terms of like your path, Right LIKE i think Since cincinnati's only pat me to make the playoffs is to win the.

Division AND i just don't Think baltimore is gonna take.

That it's going to go backwards and.

START i just think their wins this year home indoors it.

HOME i think so.

Too but like they still got to go To New york And pittsburgh that's in the cold In New.

England.

Yeah, now maybe The patriots aren't playing for anything that last.

Week it'd be, great who, knows but, like, yeah, okay.

Anything changing in your mind in terms of who you want to, play and if The patriots are playing on wild card, Weekends chargers Or, jaguars and The chargers are really The chargers are really banged.

Up, yeah we've seen what that team does coming here in the.

Cold, yeah that's, True AND i am with.

YOU i IF i had to pick one team THAT i would want to play the most of The, Jacksonville.

Yeah, Probably BUT i put those two in like a similar.

TIER i don't think That.

JACKSONVILLE i worry that that's going to Be houston instead Of.

Jacksonville And houston's not A.

Houston i'm not saying The patriots can't Beat houston and we'll see how well that defense.

Travels but that defense is the real.

Deal that's going to be a tough one if they have to play.

Them all, right let's Take mars call and then we'll get to The giants and we'll wrap it up on The.

Giants what's, Up?

Mark, hey, guys how you doing?

Today Happy thanksgiving.

Guys i'm telling YOU i cannot See Vederian lowe out there one more.

TIME i, mean the guy is literally falling over his.

FEET i THINK i saw him two or three times literally just fall flat on his face and there was nobody even around.

HIM i can't watch that.

ANYMORE i Think bryant is an excellent.

TACKLE i think he played pretty well when he came in For Morgan moses on the.

Right i'd love to see him on the.

Left i'm not sure about this guy that we just picked, up BUT i really think that at this, point anything is better Than Viderian.

LOWE i can't believe that they kept the guy after last.

YEAR i, mean you, know we just we got to move on from.

Him the last thing is from a fantasy, Perspective, alex who would you Play Lamar jackson this?

Week Or Drake may you don't.

Want to ask me fantasy QUESTIONS a little bad at.

It Lamar jackson against The bengals Or Drake may against The.

Giants, Correct, Well bengals defense has to, regress, right you would.

Think.

AND i would think That baltimore has to.

Win but it is a division.

Game it is a division.

Game Drake, may it's a short.

Week i'd probably Go lamar Ask, evin he actually plays fantasy football a little.

Bit i'd probably Go Lamar mark just BECAUSE i don't.

KNOW i just HAVE i have you, know easy have two TIME.

MVP i have a little bit more faith in guys like that, sometimes you, know than a young player Like.

Drake So i'd probably Go.

Lamar BUT i think that you could see it either.

WAY i.

Agree and what's your take On Vederian?

Low are you?

Agreement?

Look you, know and thanks for the.

Call.

Mark we're gonna let you go and we'll answer your question About.

Low i'm not nearly as strong As mark is on the anti Vendarian low.

TRAIN i he was not good for them last, year but a lot of people did not play good football for The patriots last.

Year and was he really set up in a great position to succeed with that coaching.

Staff on top of, that like he had to.

Play we're talking about him playing, LIKE i don't know what did he played like thirteen games last?

Year fourteen games last?

Year played a no because chokes the coor four played one.

But he didn't finish.

It.

Ye, Yeah well so he played a lot of games last.

Year you're hope he played.

Fourteen you're hoping That.

Vederian lil only has to play like four, games three, games four games this, year, Right so it's a much, shorter much smaller sample.

Size AND i REMEMBER i looked this up last night because as we segue here to The, giants The giants on paper have a pass rush that you should.

Fear you, know A, Carter Brian, Burns Dexter lawrence rushing in the.

Middle it's a good.

Group they have, underperformed wildly, underperformed and that's why they're head.

Coaching their defensive coordinator no longer have.

JOBS i would say that's the main reason they have the second highest payroll in THE nfl on, defense including a third overall pick rookie And Abdull carter all invested in their.

Defense Dibideau Carter Burns, lawrence and with that, group they are twenty third in pressure.

Rate they are fifteenth in past rush win.

Rate that's not good.

Enough if that's how heavily invested you are and all of, that that is not good enough if you're The.

Giants that's why their staff has gotten blown.

Out, now at the same, time those guys individually are still disruptive and can still wreck a.

Game SO i went AND i looked back at this and BECAUSE i remember watching remember The Raiders patriots game In Mexico city twenty, Seventeen, Yeah Mexico city.

Game at right tackle for that, GAME i think that it was supposed to Be Marcus.

CANNON i think he was the starter that.

YEAR i can't remember exactly who they had at right.

Tackle it's kind of blurred lines Between volmer And, cannon and when exactly those transitions.

HAPPENED i think it Was cannon they needed to Start Lee Adrian.

Waddle canon was hurt in that, game So Lee Adrian waddle started that game In Mexico city in twenty seventeen against Prime Khalil, mack who rushed over the right tackle for most of his.

Career so we're talking about A hall Of fame, player and he guesses on how many sacks Le Adrian waddle gave up in that.

Game non zero was the right tackle the, yeah so.

Zero so that to, me not to testament To Adrian waddle like, good good effort by.

Him is WHY i always say they need a guy like Le Adrien.

Wattle good effort by.

Him you guys laugh WHEN i bring him up like they're a valuable.

Player good effort by.

Him but at the same, time that's, coaching, right that's.

McDaniel Dante scarnecia was still on the staff at that.

Point they were able to piece it.

Together that was just one, game but they were able to piece it.

Together can The patriots piece together for you, know let's call it four or five weeks Of Darian lowe at left tackle instead Of Will, campbell that's the question that's.

Gonna that's the next To Joe.

Toney Probably watt was playing right that, day so it's next to shat good, player, Right, YEAH i, mean that's what they're gonna have to.

Do that's what they're gonna have to.

Do so a couple of things with This giants.

Team Hey Derian low's coach Not Vderian Lowlador wills coaching high school fotball now for him all coach and run game coordinator At Bishop Dune Catholic.

School so there's the difficult part about this matchup to.

Me for The, giants AND i hate writing and talking about games like.

This they have a brand new coaching.

Staff they have an interim head coach it's only coached two games In Mike, kafka and then they just and they just hire Fired Shane bowen and Appointed Charlie bullen as their defensive coordinator slash play caller on.

Defense there is a big element of unknown with.

That last week Against detroit they ran true two trick plays for long.

Touchdowns on, offense you don't really know how Much bulan's gonna, change you, know in a.

Week you don't think he's gonna change a.

Ton it's probably gonna be relatively the.

Same but each play caller has different.

Tendencies they like different things in different, situations like for, example.

Third and.

Five you, Know bowen might have all these tendencies on third and.

Five Does bolan have the same tendencies on third and five As bowen?

Does and when you face that, situation what are you looking?

At what are you?

Expecting like those different types of things gives this game a little bit of an, unknown.

Right and it's tough because it's not like you can go back and, look he's never called plays.

Before he's a long time linebackers, Coach so it's not like you can go all, right, well you, know we talked about this With mike McCoy and you were going way.

Back but Like mike McCoy had coached, before had been a head, coach so you kind of go maybe study some of those.

Tendencies you can't really do that.

Here and the other thing is he AND i talked To David andrews about this this, week he is going to be more aggressive in.

General, yeah so the issues The patriots had with The blitz last, week, like you're just gonna see a more aggressive, defense whether that's what you know The bengals put on tape last week or.

Not he's trying to show up.

Again never been a coordinator.

Before here's a chance for him to maybe get on the league.

Map and you come out first game as an INTERIM dc and you shut Down Drake, may you might get some.

Calls, Yeah so he we don't really know What Charlie bullen's defense is gonna look.

Like what we can go off of is what The giants have been AND i, AGAIN i they're not going to reinvent the wheel in a, week so it's gonna be somewhat.

Similar.

Uh they play a lot of man.

Coverage they're one of the highest rates of man coverage in the ENTIRE nfl this.

Year.

Uh they play a lot of five man pass.

Rush my guess is that.

You're gonna see more three and four man pass rush with a spy On Drake may in this.

Game Maybe Abdull carter spying him a little.

Bit.

Uh it was A Abdul carter do that in college and he's, like he's awesome at.

That he's a really good.

SPY.

H so maybe it hits him that's gonna be the.

Spy this pass rush worries me a little.

Bit it's.

Legit they get after the.

Quarterback the numbers might not bear it, out but on paper you can see how they can be.

Dangerous the other element of this game that we are kind of unsure about is who's going to pay quarterback for The.

Giants so we have a new defensive play caller we have an interim head, coach and we don't know exactly On wednesday at you, know eleven, thirty who's going to play quarterback for The giants On Monday.

Night it definitely sounds like it's trending Towards Jackson's dart being back in this.

Game BUT i will add it's, there but It's giants bye week next week as, well so do you if he's kind of like if he clears protocol late in the, week, like do you throw him in there on A monday night game or do you just take the bye week reset and bring him back for the last four.

Games he's going to come back because he needs the.

Reps he's a rookie quarterback and he needs the, Reps but do you know run him out?

There so to, speak with all this concussion, nonsense when you have that bye weekly and you're not really playing for anything in terms of, STANDINGS i don't.

KNOW i would much rather Play Jameis, Winston there's no doubt about.

It i'd much rather Play Jameis.

Winston but it does sound like it's trending towards, it but potentially Being.

Dart, YEAH i, mean it's it's.

Tricky you wanted to get the.

Experience this is good prime time on the.

Road you get him a chance that.

Environment but he's had multiple concussion issues this, year so that's a tricky.

One, yeah it.

Is and you know a couple of things With, Dart he's particularly been good on extended plays and design quarterback.

Run but are you really going to run him coming off a.

Concussion but that's the.

Thing you don't play him if you can't run the full compliment of.

Place so it's very different, offenses is WHY i bring it, up, Right so With Jackson dart, there AND i wouldn't say they're they're completely copying it Because Lane kiffen does some creative, things but they're they're putting him in the shotgun spread all the, Time like it's like seventy five percent shotgun rate When jackson darts in the, game because that's what he did at all miss that's what he did in, college that's what he's comfortable.

Doing With jameis Wins In Russell, wilson they've been an under center heavy.

Offense they've actually been the total.

Opposite so this is totally uh this in this, instance you are kind of preparing for two different.

Offenses, Right it's not like last, week, right so it is a little bit more of a.

Factor you, Know dart has been a gun run quarterback RPOs design quarterback, run, uh drop back pass from the.

Gun Jameis winston's been under center bombs away As James winston.

Does so it's a big.

Different touchdown passes From.

Gunnroshewski, yeah double plus double, passes trick, plays crazy, Nonsense.

How awesome was?

That SO i it'd be interesting to, see uh What kafka, says what they?

Do you, know if he practices without a red non contact and in full you know he's, cleared.

Right and they're also is the thing of, like hey he's our starting.

Quarterback if he can, play he's gonna.

Play and just the message that that.

Sense you got no thoughts on gun throwing a touchdow Past James, Winson, no because it didn't work and it.

Works jamis apparently has excellent ball.

Skills, yeah but it like shouldn't have, worked but it.

Did they have a gutter navigating the pocket.

And neither one of them should have, worked like the first one that they, ran the double pass That winston, actually you know they threw it back To, winston And winston threw it To Wandell.

Robinson Wandell robinson was opened for like five, minutes and it took so long to execute the hand off fake and then the throwback To winston that The lions actually almost broke up the pass in the end zone To Wandell, robinson even Though Wandell, robinson if you look at the all twenty two was open the entire play until the catch point and then it's like it's a traffic area at the catch.

Point and then the one to the Gunner roschewsky touchdown, Pass WINSTON'S i don't know how he caught the ball and THEN i don't know how he broke.

The tackle on the.

Ends because He's Jameis, winston he.

Does it's.

Crazy apparently he's like an elite tight.

End if It's Jameis winston On monday, night he's going to give you two or three chances to pick off passes and you got to take advantage like.

That that's The James Cover Jameis winston.

Game In Jameis.

Winston, uh you know in the open we, say you, know no risk, it no.

Biscuit that Is Jameis.

Winston that was birth From Jameis.

Winston this guy has a high turn turnover worthy play rate and a high big.

Time he's, thirty mister thirty.

Thirty, like that's that's the GUY i want to play On Monday.

Night Jamis, Okay SO i was about to Say Jameis winston is the embodiment of fun chaos.

FOOTBALL i would much rague.

Chaos, Alright, yeah that's Why i'd much rather play him IF i was The.

PATRIOTS i Think dart's got SOMETHING i was impressed, watching but.

IT'S i said in the.

Draft my thing On dart was, LIKE i don't love, him BUT i think in the right situation it makes sense and The giants can build up that offensive line a little.

Bit Molik neighbors comes back fully, Healthy LIKE i actually do like that spot for HIM i.

HAD i can kind of see it With, dart And i'll give The giants the coach, Though i'll give him a little bit of.

Credit their offense has not gone in the, tank despite the fact that they've played three different.

Quarterbacks Molik neighbors is out for the.

Season they Fired Brian.

Dable they have an interim head coach and they're like eighteenth and Dvo.

At which in like a hot coaching name for a.

While.

Yep was he the ORIGINAL qb coach For.

MAHOMES i know he was In Kansas city.

One he, was he was one of THE qb.

COACHES i don't.

Know he was the quarterbacks coach eighteen through twenty.

One he was the passing game coordinator in twenty and twenty.

One so you say they need to get the right coach in, There i'm not, now they need to win some games down the, stretch.

Right kavka has been interviewed for head coaching jobs in the.

Past he's kind of a hot.

Name he's a tight pants.

Guy he's a former, player, quarterback you, know former oc you, know like he's got all that going, on, Right like he's got that is that's it.

Now dable didn't, play but they hired that kind of guy With, Dable so maybe they want to completely move away from.

That but If kavka had wins some games here down the stretch Like Darth, nion there is.

Going to be.

Somewhere.

Yeah he also he said he read off his, resume what do you know about the twenty ten out back?

Ball?

Oh, god let's not do.

This, NO i gotta give you stat, line real, quick go.

Ahead and the twenty ten Out Back bowl Against, Auburn Mike, coffins quarterback For, northwestern went forty seven for seventy.

Eight, yeah you want to talk about no risk and no.

Biskit forty seven for seventy, eight five hundred and thirty two, yards four, touchdowns five.

Picks also recorded twenty carries for thirty yards in a.

Touchdown good.

Numbers that's the guy who should be Coaching jamis wit is?

It you know you didn't listen to anything as no four, touchdowns five.

Picks i'll take, that no, risk no best.

Hit this.

Wild they.

The giants, OFFENSE i give them some.

Credit the defense is completely.

Underperformed in.

Stinks their offense, though like they should, stink and they kind of are, middling WHICH i give them credit for for keeping it.

Together there one last thing On.

Dart, Also patriots Legend Jeremy everard caught six passes for sixty four yards in that.

Game, okay one last thing On dart and then we have a couple more calls and.

Stuff the, splits the man zone splits are.

Crazy he is much worse against man coverage for whatever, reason much.

Worse like it's like, crazy.

Which is weird because to, run so you'd think he'd you, know take advantage of.

That, yeah it is.

INTERESTING i thought it would be the opposite as.

Well usually young quarterbacks have difficult time with zone because you have to read out zone and it's more about reads and scheme and finding the voids and all that kind of stuff man to manage just like pick a match up and throw at, it.

Right so normally young quarterbacks that's, more that's simpler for, them that's easier for.

Them H Wandell robinson's a good man beating, receivers kind of like their Pop.

Douglas BUT i wonder if maybe you, know the lack of weaponry shows up, there you, know no.

Neighbors slayton's, Fine, YEAH i do wonder Like robinson's the kinder receiver Like TREMARY dk And, tennessee like that prototype of receiver has given them.

Trouble, Yeah Marcus jones should be On Wandel.

Robinson but you, know that's a speed on speed matchup in the.

Slot so hopefully that that goes The patriots way On.

Sunday BUT i are A.

Monday excuse.

ME i was really shocked that how bad darts numbers are against man compared to his.

Own SO i expect man with a spy on third down in this game from The patriots of dart plays in the.

GAME i think that's about.

It on The, giants their run defense is historically.

Bad this is a weakness on weakness matchup in that.

Regard patriots rush offense has not been.

Good they're thirtieth in the league AND epa as a run, offense and then The giants are thirty second in the league and pretty much every statistical category as a run defense and, theory your run offense has been a little bit better than their defense has been stopping the.

Run last, Week Jamior gibbs had like what two twenty five or something like.

THAT a couple of big.

Runs you, know downhill runs have really given them.

Problems here's a good staff for you before we wrap it up on man gap.

Schemes so just like downhill duo lead you know, power The giants are giving up seven point nine yards of carry the next the next closest, team the thirty first team in the.

League you're gonna like.

This who want to guess who the thirty first team in the league.

Is it's stopping it stopping downhill.

Tradition, yeah traditional downhill, runs gap.

Schemes Buffalo, bills The Buffalo, bills, right thirty first The Buffalo, bills so seven point nine yards for The.

Giants The Buffalo bills are thirty first.

Four it's a two yard.

Difference, wow it's a two yard difference like.

That you don't see that a whole.

Lot so if you're looking for The patriots to run the ball against a historically bad run, defense even With Dexter lawrence, inside they cannot stop the run down the middle of the.

Field And Jamior gibbs just torched, them torched them on those types of.

Runs so there you have.

It all, Right we're gonna let you guys wrap it up here for.

Us tony is In.

Canada what's, Up?

Tony, hi.

Guys, Yeah i'm just.

SORRY i just this show, now So i'm just catching a late apologies IF i asked something you guys have already.

Discussed but looking at the big, PICTURE i don't know if we're going to get THE afc overall and the number one by BUT i think THE Afc east is definitely.

Realistic SO i think, QUESTION i want to ask you guys real, quick which games do you think we have to win in order to finish in THE.

Afc east The, bills they, have The paths and The eagles as their hardest match.

Up for, us it's The bills And.

Ravens And i'll get off the line here right.

Away but last, question real, quick if you can answer and please humor, Me batman Or?

Superman that's.

All thank, Thanks.

Tony i'm A batman guy, Person Batman Dark knight.

TRILOGY i even liked the new one with what's his Name?

PATTINSON i haven't seen That one's pretty.

Good, yeah but The New superman was good.

TOO i like.

It i'm not a big like superhero movie, guy BUT i mean The Dark knight movies.

Are The New superman is pretty.

Solid you, know he has a, dog which obviously gives him brownie points in my.

Mind in terms of THE, afcas you, know, LOOK i would love to see The patriots beat The bills and The ravens too and really make a statement in those.

Games but in, actuality they really just need to beat The, giants The, jets and The.

Dolphins if they clean up on that they should Be, okay they're gonna.

Win they're gonna be at thirteen, wins.

Right if they can just get one of the two between The bills and The, ravens they're being great.

Shape, YEAH i mean that would be like dream.

SCENARIO i do think that there's a, possibility AND i was thinking about this that if they beat The bills and that's a division clincher and t shirt the letdown Against buffalo or Against, Baltimore excuse me is staring at, You so maybe you, KNOW i think it'd probably be more likely that they off the by get up For, buffalo win the, division and then they probably go To baltimore and maybe they have a little bit of a letdown.

Game AND i also wonder if you, know we're gonna pick all these games and we get to the end of the year and maybe That miami game doesn't mean.

Anything, yeah, Yeah but if they beat The, giants The, jets and The, dolphins and they take care of business against the teams they should, beat they're going to be at thirteen and four at worst case, scenario, right and that should easily win the division and maybe even so.

Well, actually if they do, That so if they can just beat to your, point just beat the teams they, Should, Jets, Giants.

Dolphins, yeah one loss from The bills would would give them the.

Division so you would just need The bills to lose To, Philly, Cincinnati cincinnati With, burrow, right With, Burrow, pittsburgh maybe that's At.

Pittsburgh they're probably not gonna lose to The browns Or.

Jets but, yeah, NO i, mean you don't even necessarily need to beat The.

Bills if you take care of, business you can have, to but it's, yeah it'd be, nice all, right last, Call, eldred wrap us.

Up what's, Up?

Beldrid, Hey so let's tell y'all are doing.

Today they?

Good, hey Bart, ALEX i love you on The mother podcast, man love of most of the.

Time but What i'm worrying about, is LIKE i said that we had a historic bad.

Defense we couldn't run against that we didn't play it against a couple of, times and we still, get you, know not that many.

Yards but one day Of, ROBINSON i don't know If Marcus jones to run with, him cause that food is past BECAUSE i saw, him you, know saw the game again last, night you, know on THE Nfl.

Network, Yeah i'm Like, darren you, know And evan Be kevin about going Against, kevil about going Against.

WINSTON i know he might give you something but that but that guy can't throw and he is, Accurate so you gotta Be kevin With.

Jacksville But i'm hoping we pull it.

Off i'm thinking twenty one BECAUSE i think they're gonna put some points on the.

Board, YEAH i don't know how office line gonna.

Be, YEAH i like that.

Prediction eligent dame for the.

Call, Yeah i'm a Big Wandell robinson.

Fan but his game is a lot Like Pop.

Douglas's he's a speed.

Slot he's not a like jitterbug.

Slide he's on an underneath.

Slot they targeted him a lot on like crossers and deep overs and you, know vertical routes out of the slot and his like a dots like over ten like you, know like he's a down the field receiver with a lot of, speed a lot Like.

Pop Pop douglas is playing in this role for The patriots.

Now uh he's their leading.

Receiver he's been their best player on offense without, neighbors and he's a good.

PLAYER i like watching them.

PLAY i love those types of guys that create that kind of.

Separation.

Uh the run, Game, yeah it's a it's a concern.

Now My my biggest thing with the run game and we have to wrap it, Up alex is uh THAT i want it to be situationally.

GOOD i don't need.

Them to be a dominant run.

Team they're a dominant passing.

Team they're an explosive passing, team a high efficiency passing.

GAME i don't need them to be a great passing or run, game, LIKE i don't need this good, enough just situationally short, yardage five minute offense to close out, games goal line like you need to be able to gain yards on the.

Ground when you need to gain yards on the, Ground, yeah doesn't mean that needs to be you like the the hallmark of your offense or like the foundation of your.

Offense but when it's you, know first and goal from the, one you need to be able to get it to punch it in and score a.

Touchdown, sure all, right what a hard count for.

Us, now we'll be back next, week coming off The monday night football.

Game it's it will be the bye, week so no game to, preview but we'll still be.

Here On, wednesday and we will still be talking about That giants, game And i'll maybe look ahead To buffalo a little bit and talk about the rest of the week and all that good.

Stuff so we'll see you guys, Then Patriots, unfiltered we'll be up in ten minutes here or so at noon for, us, though we'll see you guys Next.

Wednesday.

Right, hey this Is.

Alex thanks for tuning into the.

Show if you really want to help, us make sure you like us On Apple, Podcasts, spotify or wherever you get your.

Podcasts, also make sure you follow us on The New England patriots YouTube channel to see this show and everything else we do here at The.

Patriots that's a lot