[SPEAKER_00]: Hey y'all, and welcome to least of these.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm your host, Leadie, and in case you haven't noticed already, I have the flu.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm not able to record an episode this week, even though I waited to the last minute to try and see if this would get any better, but nobody wants to hear this for the next 30 minutes to an hour.

[SPEAKER_00]: So thankfully, my friend Holly with Crime with Holly is here to bring you the shocking case of Gail and Rick Brink in Michigan.

[SPEAKER_00]: Shout out to Holly for coming in last minute, and if you're not already following crime with Holly, you can find her show wherever you get your podcast.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be sure to drop a link in the show notes.

[SPEAKER_00]: And if you're not following her already, well, you're definitely missing out.

[SPEAKER_00]: Thanks again, Holly.

[SPEAKER_00]: And with that said, let's join Holly as she tells us the story of Gail and Rick brings.

[SPEAKER_01]: Today's case is a case that I honestly had never heard of, and I stumbled upon it while trying to figure out which case I wanted to cover this week.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I do that a lot, I stumble across these lesser-known cases, which I love.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love sharing these cases that really haven't received as much attention as others.

[SPEAKER_01]: Lots of creators do amazing amazing jobs sharing those bigger cases and I just feel like some of these smaller cases deserve the spotlight as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is a case that went unsolved for 26 years and it took a new set of eyes to uncover some discrepancies that nobody ever could have imagined.

[SPEAKER_01]: This case has some serious twists that I myself never saw coming.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't have any kind of case updates today or shoutouts to give so we are just going to get down to business and hop right into today's episode.

[SPEAKER_01]: Today's episode is on the murders of Gale and Rick Brink.

[SPEAKER_01]: .

[SPEAKER_01]: Gail Marie Weingaarten was born on April 24, 1965, to her parents Windell and Dorothea Weingaarten.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gail grew up in a large family and she was one of eight children that Windell and Dorothea had.

[SPEAKER_01]: She lived in Ottawa County, Michigan and for the most part it seems like her childhood was pretty typical.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will say that there were financial struggles within the family.

[SPEAKER_01]: Windell and Dorothea were not well-off by any means, and given such a large family, you can imagine some of the financial strains that come with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it was because of these financial strains that gale knew from a young age, what it was like to work hard and to provide.

[SPEAKER_01]: She knew that she wanted to get a job as quickly as she could, so she could begin saving for her future, and she even told family members that she would do whatever it took, so that she always had enough money to buy herself whatever she wanted whenever she wanted.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was her goal.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was going to make it happen whether that meant working overtime or multiple jobs.

[SPEAKER_01]: As soon as she was old enough, she got a job as a teenager working as a waitress.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the hourly wage was not great, but she made up for that with amazing tips that she brought in.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was a total natural when it came to waiting on people and that kind of work.

[SPEAKER_01]: She had this big, beautiful smile, she was vibrant, she was friendly and funny, and made all of her customers feel special.

[SPEAKER_01]: Her sister Cheryl was quoted saying, quote, she made good money because she had a charming personality about her, and quote, not only did Gayle have this incredible work ethic and a vibrant energy about her, she also was beautiful with dark, curly hair and a big smile, and being such a beautiful and charming and an amazing, incredible person that Gayle was, [SPEAKER_01]: People were just drawn to her, and while that's fine in Dandy, she had an older brother named Ryan, who was not quite three years older than she was, I think he was about like two and a half years, and he was like this fierce protector of his little sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: He always looked out for her, he protected her, he scared dudes away if they weren't treating her right, or even if they were treating her right, he just made sure that he let these men know that he was there for his sister and you're not going to mess with her.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was this bulky, manly man who didn't back down from a fight from what it sounds like.

[SPEAKER_01]: When Gail was 18 years old, she met a man by the name of Lars, and the two started dating.

[SPEAKER_01]: The two seemed like they had a happy little life together, and they moved in with each other and lived together for about a year.

[SPEAKER_01]: At 19 years old, Gail was at work when a handsome man named Rick Brink walked in.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick was this handsome, slightly older man.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was 25 years old, and again, Gail was just 19, and when Gail laid eyes on him, something [SPEAKER_01]: It was legit, love at first sight for Gail.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that feeling was reciprocated from Rick as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: What's crazy is that very day that he met Gail.

[SPEAKER_01]: He went home and told his mom all about her and said, this is the girl I'm going to marry.

[SPEAKER_01]: They say when you know you know and both Rick and Gail knew that they wanted each other.

[SPEAKER_01]: meeting Rick was a pivotal moment for Gail.

[SPEAKER_01]: A light bulb went off in her head that this relationship that she was in with Lars was not for her anymore and she wanted Rick.

[SPEAKER_01]: So after meeting Rick, she goes home after work and she tells Lars that she doesn't want to be with him anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: Things aren't going to work out and they were done.

[SPEAKER_01]: Lars was not happy to say the least, and as Gail was packing up her things, he kind of snapped.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when she was pulling things from her dresser drawers, he actually slammed the drawer shut on her hand, and he even hit her in the face, giving her a black eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, Lars was not a stand-up guy.

[SPEAKER_01]: He wasn't really the most amazing man prior to her breaking up with him.

[SPEAKER_01]: and she kind of I think had this gut feeling all along that she didn't want to be with him long-term and so meeting Rick really gave her that push in the direction that she needed to leave.

[SPEAKER_01]: When Gales older brother Ryan caught wind that his sister was assaulted by Lars, Ryan went and confronted him and they got into a physical altercation and Ryan made threats to him and told him to stay away from his sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, after breaking up with Lars, Gale and Rick started dating, and it truly was such a cute little love story for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick was such a gentleman, and he treated Gale like his queen.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was what every person could hope and dream for in a partner, and the two really made a great team.

[SPEAKER_01]: Both were very hardworking and dedicating to building their life together.

[SPEAKER_01]: They had big dreams of buying a house, making it a home, and creating a family together.

[SPEAKER_01]: they were so full of life and energy and were an adventurous couple that you could just tell when you were around them that they were so madly and deeply in love.

[SPEAKER_01]: And again, this is what we all hope and dream of when thinking about a life partner and Gale found that in Rick.

[SPEAKER_01]: On April 25th, 1986, a year after they met and a day after Gales' 21st birthday, she and Rick had a small wedding in a church with their family and friends present.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was a beautiful and happy day for the newlyweds and all of the pictures I've seen from the big day.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were just beaming with happiness and love, and they're just, again, I said it earlier.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're just so cute.

[SPEAKER_01]: They had your typical wedding reception filled with dancing, cake, the works, you name it, they had it.

[SPEAKER_01]: After the wedding, they went on a tropical cruise for their honeymoon and spent their days lounging in the sand at the beach and swimming in the ocean.

[SPEAKER_01]: After their honeymoon, they came back home and settled into life as newlyweds.

[SPEAKER_01]: Their first goal together was to buy a house, and Rick's father Garrett helped them find this super cute fixer upper that was on at 20 acres of land, and they got a really good deal on it because it was a foreclosure.

[SPEAKER_01]: This house needed a lot of work though, but Galen Rick were so excited to fix this place up and make it into exactly what they wanted.

[SPEAKER_01]: The house was also located in their hometown of Holland, Michigan, and so while they were having this freedom of Mary life and adulthood, they were still close to their families.

[SPEAKER_01]: And their families were also eager to help them with their home renovations.

[SPEAKER_01]: What I love about this is they documented their home renovations on home videos, and that is such a lost thing that we really don't do anymore now that we have cell phones and social media.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know my family was huge on taking home videos with those massive camcorders that my dad had to sit on his shoulder, and that's exactly what Gale and Rick and their families did.

[SPEAKER_01]: They took tons of home videos of gale working on the kitchen cabinets, rick working on replacing windows and windowsills, painting the place, and they literally went top to bottom on this place with renovations.

[SPEAKER_01]: By November 1987 things were coming together and the house was almost complete.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick and Gayle had been married for 18 months by this time and Gayle confided in her sister that the next room that they were going to run away was going to be a nursery for their future child.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gayle told her sister Cheryl that she and Rick were ready to take the next big step in their lives and had planned to start trying for a baby.

[SPEAKER_01]: They both felt like they were ready for the next chapter of their lives and were so excited to grow their family and to live in this house that they were literally piecing together and making it their dream home.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately, Gail and Rick would never get that opportunity.

[SPEAKER_01]: They would never get the opportunity to be parents because their lives were taken in such an unexpected and tragic way.

[UNKNOWN]: Thanks for watching!

[SPEAKER_01]: On Saturday, November 21, 1987, Rick and Dale Brink were 18 months into their marriage.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were renovating their home and laying the foundation for what was going to be a beautiful future.

[SPEAKER_01]: On that day, they attended a wedding for one of Rick's friends and all was well.

[SPEAKER_01]: They enjoyed their evening out, and it was said that they had left some time after 11pm, after they danced and had some drinks and spent time celebrating the newlyweds.

[SPEAKER_01]: But come Monday morning, the 23rd Rick didn't show up for work at his job at Trinway Corp, where he was a supervisor of this manufacturing company.

[SPEAKER_01]: This immediately set off alarm bells for his co-workers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick was described as someone who was an incredible young man, wise beyond his years, responsible and had excellent people skills, for him to not show up for work that was completely out of character for him.

[SPEAKER_01]: In all his years of working at Trendway, he had never no call, no show, and rarely called in sick, if ever.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick's boss dawn tried to call their home phone, but he got no answer.

[SPEAKER_01]: He knew where Gale worked, which was a company called Donnelly Automotive, and she was their office worker.

[SPEAKER_01]: He called the office to check to see if Gale had arrived at work that day, and she too was a no-call no-show.

[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, they knew that something was wrong, and thankfully, Dawn knew Rick's parents, and so he reached out to them to see if they knew anything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick's parents also had not heard from Rick or Gales since Saturday, and his mom just had this terrible gut feeling.

[SPEAKER_01]: They went over to the home off of Ransom Street and Rick's boss Dawn met them there as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: When they pulled up, they found that Rick's Chevy Blazer was parked in the driveway, which at first glance, this seemed like a good sign.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe they were inside the home, so sick that they were unable to call into work.

[SPEAKER_01]: But as they walked up the driveway to head to the front door, they saw that 28-year-old Rick [SPEAKER_01]: Rick's body was slumped on the driver's side.

[SPEAKER_01]: His knees were on the floor under the steering wheel and his body was slumped over the center of the car and his head was on the passenger seat.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was very apparent that he had been shot in the head.

[SPEAKER_01]: And finding your son in this way is just unimaginable.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were sick to their stomachs so upset and distraught, and not only that, they were terrified to enter the home because they weren't sure what they were going to find inside.

[SPEAKER_01]: Police responded immediately and entered the home, and in the master bedroom, they found 22 [SPEAKER_01]: And at first, it appeared that she was sleeping.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the closer they got, the more they realized that the pillow covering her face was covered in blood.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gail had been shot three times in the head at point blank range.

[SPEAKER_01]: At first glance, please thought that maybe this had been a murder suicide.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe Rick had shot Gail first and then went out to the car and took his own life.

[SPEAKER_01]: Out in the Chevy Blazer investigators were trying to process the scene and see if they could find a weapon.

[SPEAKER_01]: They gently moved Rick's body to see if he had been lying on top of a gun, but they found that there was no weapon inside of the car, which this obviously quickly ruled out murder suicide as being what happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also, notably absent from the scene where shell casings, leaving the authorities to believe that either someone cleaned up the casings or the shots had come from a revolver.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was later determined that the murder weapon used was a 22 caliber revolver.

[SPEAKER_01]: So as I said, Rick had been shot in the head, also at point blank range, and they found that there was a bullet that had smashed the passenger window as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: And oddly, the driver's side window had been partially rolled down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick was clearly wearing the same clothing he had worn to the wedding that Saturday night, [SPEAKER_01]: and he had his work galoshes on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like maybe he quickly slipped his feet into his work boots to leave the house to run somewhere really quick.

[SPEAKER_01]: The Blazer's ignition hadn't been turned on and the investigators found no fibers or hair or anything out of the ordinary.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was a very weird scene and not a lot was adding up.

[SPEAKER_01]: There had been no forced entry into the home.

[SPEAKER_01]: There didn't seem to be a struggle that took place anywhere in the home.

[SPEAKER_01]: It appeared that Gail had taken her clothes off, leaving them on the floor before crawling into bed to go to sleep.

[SPEAKER_01]: Robbery also didn't seem like a motive, because there was things left all over the house that were a value.

[SPEAKER_01]: There was like $400 in a nightstand.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jewelry was left on the kitchen counter, Gilles' purse was left out that had money in it as well, and Rick's wallet was also there.

[SPEAKER_01]: One thing that the investigators were leaning towards was that whoever had done this to the brings had to have been someone that was known to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: The fact that Rick's window was partially rolled down had them thinking that maybe he rolled it down to speak to someone as he was getting into the blazer.

[SPEAKER_01]: The lack of forced entry and also the pillow over Gilles' head were flags for them as well that this was a known person to the victims.

[SPEAKER_01]: The pillow that had been placed over Gilles' head was a pillow that had come from the living room.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there weren't any bullet holes through the pillow so whoever placed this did so after shooting her.

[SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of times killers will place a pillow or something over their victims' heads so that they don't have to see what they've done.

[SPEAKER_01]: They feel guilt or remorse over it and usually it's because they know the victim on a personal level.

[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of things were pointing to someone close to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: When the autopsy were performed on the brink, it was determined by the contents of their stomach that they had likely been killed early on Sunday the 22nd.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, backing up just a bit, we know that it was Rick's parents who first made this discovery, and they had to contact Gail's family.

[SPEAKER_01]: When they got the news, they were completely shocked.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gail's brother Ryan rushed over to their home and found it swarming with investigators.

[SPEAKER_01]: He told them that he also had been trying to contact his sister all Sunday and never heard back from her.

[SPEAKER_01]: When asked if he could think of anyone that would want to harm his sister and her husband, he told them all about Lars and the end of their relationship, including the fact that he struck Gail giving her a black eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan told police that Lars was still in love with his sister and that he was always jealous about the fact that she had moved on with her life and found happiness.

[SPEAKER_01]: Naturally, hearing all of this the police wanted to speak to Lars.

[SPEAKER_01]: This was sounding like a promising lead and they needed to know where he was all weekend.

[SPEAKER_01]: When investigators tracked down Lars, he denied any involvement in the murders and he fully cooperated with police.

[SPEAKER_01]: He agreed to take a polygraph test, which he passed, and he also had a solid alibi.

[SPEAKER_01]: So maybe he wasn't involved after all.

[SPEAKER_01]: When speaking with people that were at the wedding that Gail and Rick had attended, they said everything had been fine that night.

[SPEAKER_01]: Both Gail and Rick had enjoyed some drinks while they were out, and Gail had drank more than Rick did because he had to drive home.

[SPEAKER_01]: They didn't get into any kind of arguments with anybody, they didn't leave in a haste, all seemed fine and well the entire night.

[SPEAKER_01]: They also couldn't think of anyone that would have wanted to harm the couple.

[SPEAKER_01]: About three or four days into the investigation, police received an interesting tip that came from the previous owner of Gail and Rick's home.

[SPEAKER_01]: The previous owner was named Sidney Colby, and he went by the name of Shotgun Sid.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was an interesting character to say the least, and was honestly not the most upstanding kind of guy, but he did go into the police to tell them that he was a little concerned that the actual intended target was supposed to be him and his girlfriend and not the brinks.

[SPEAKER_01]: Shotgun said it was a part of a motorcycle gang, and he was known to be a drug dealer that has wronged a lot of people in many different ways, including shorting them of drugs, stealing cars, and more.

[SPEAKER_01]: He told the authorities that he believed that it was a motorcycle gang out of Detroit, who may have done this to the brinks.

[SPEAKER_01]: He felt like they likely didn't know that he no longer lived there, and that they sent someone to kill him and his girlfriend.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so they shot both Rick and Gale assuming that they were shotguns said and his girl.

[SPEAKER_01]: The investigators contacted a narcotics unit that they worked closely with in other cases.

[SPEAKER_01]: And these guys actually had a few undercover informants that were a part of this motorcycle gang in Detroit.

[SPEAKER_01]: They got in touch with those informants to see if they knew about anything and they found no link to the Motorcycle Gang and Gale and Rick's murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: Investigators even interviewed a man that went by ghetto rat that was part of this group.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he also said that had they been murdered because of his gang.

[SPEAKER_01]: He would have been there.

[SPEAKER_01]: Though this ghetto rat guy was a shady dude, investigators believed him, and the motorcycle gang was also ruled out.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they were laughed once again, thinking that this was a targeted attack by someone that was known to Rick and Gal.

[SPEAKER_01]: A month into the investigation on Christmas Eve, another murder occurred right down the road from where Gale and Rick lived.

[SPEAKER_01]: 30-year-old Deborah Wilson had attended the same high school and was in the same grade as Rick Brink.

[SPEAKER_01]: On Christmas Eve, Deborah's husband had gone out to party with some friends, and when he came home, he found that all of the lights were on in the house, but Deborah was nowhere to be found.

[SPEAKER_01]: He noticed that the back sliding glass door had been left open, and he felt uneasy about all of this, so he called to report his wife as missing, and then he also called his family to come over to help him.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was his father who actually found Deborah deceased in the field that was behind their house.

[SPEAKER_01]: She had been violently attacked, repeatedly stabbed, and had her throat slashed.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when I say that this murder happened right up the road, it was legit less than half of a mile from Rick and Gales' house, so very, very close proximity.

[SPEAKER_01]: The authorities were wondering if these two murders were somehow connected.

[SPEAKER_01]: was there a killer targeting people that went to the school that Rick and Debra attended.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then there was also a murder that happened 10 years prior that was still unsolved.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was the murder of Debra Polinsky.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was also violently attacked.

[SPEAKER_01]: Debra was sexually assaulted and stabbed death in her own bedroom located just a mile from where the [SPEAKER_01]: was there a serial killer that was targeting these young people in Holland.

[SPEAKER_01]: Those in the community were on edge and rightfully so.

[SPEAKER_01]: Police had zero answers to questions they were being asked, and it was just a very scary time.

[SPEAKER_01]: People didn't know if they were going to be targeted next, and there was a really big cloud [SPEAKER_01]: Now investigators did everything they could to find some sort of connection between the brink murders and Deborah Wilson and Deborah Polinsky, and ultimately they found nothing linking them at all.

[SPEAKER_01]: They did not believe that they were connected in any kind of way, and with nothing to go on on all three of these cases, they all inevitably went cold.

[SPEAKER_01]: As the days turned to months, and months into years, the families of Gail and Rick struggled to move forward after such a tragic loss, and the constant questions of who did this remained in their minds for over two decades.

[SPEAKER_01]: They feared that they were never going to get answers, and that justice would never be served for guilt and wreck, and what a tragic thing to live with, how heavy that must have been.

[SPEAKER_01]: I always say that the unknown would eat me alive, and in this case the why would drive me insane, why were they murdered?

[SPEAKER_01]: Why would anyone want this sweet couple dead?

[SPEAKER_01]: As the years passed, the case remained open, obviously.

[SPEAKER_01]: And here and there, people would pick up the boxes of files and go through things to see if anything was missed.

[SPEAKER_01]: And every single time nothing knew was found.

[SPEAKER_01]: In 2007, 20 years after the break murders, the Ottawa Sheriff's Department launches a brand new cold-case unit that consisted of detectives, Venus, Rapper, and Dave Blakely.

[SPEAKER_01]: These two detectives weren't from the Holland area and had come from different parts of the state of Michigan.

[SPEAKER_01]: So they were coming into this unit as a fresh set of eyes and could look at these cases without bias, which is exactly what these unsolved murders needed.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now at first detective rapper and detective Blakely started with the unsolved murder of Deborah Wilson.

[SPEAKER_01]: They found new leads and new suspects, but unfortunately their suspect died before they could get a conviction.

[SPEAKER_01]: After his death they switched gears and started to zero in on the brink murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: They spent countless hours going over each box of information on the brink murders and started to conduct [SPEAKER_01]: After speaking with Gale's older sister Cheryl, they learned a few days before the murders, Gale and her brother Ryan actually got into an argument.

[SPEAKER_01]: Long story short, Gale's parents had been living in a RV in Ryan's driveway and apparently his landlord wanted this RV moved.

[SPEAKER_01]: So Ryan called Gale an aster if they could move it to her property since she had a large amount of acres.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gale flat out said no.

[SPEAKER_01]: She didn't want her parents living on her property.

[SPEAKER_01]: She didn't want this ugly, big, bulky RV clogging up their space.

[SPEAKER_01]: And with all of the renovations going on, she didn't want her younger siblings getting hurt.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Ryan was pissed.

[SPEAKER_01]: I guess the argument got really heated, and the Friday before the murders, so just literally a day before they were murdered, Gail had called her sister Cheryl and told her that Ryan got so violent and so mad that she said no.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this was the first time the authorities were hearing this information.

[SPEAKER_01]: and to top it off, Cheryl said that when their father told them that Rick and Gail were dead, Ryan immediately jumped up and said he was going to their house.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, at first, that doesn't sound odd, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Sounds like a normal reaction that any of us would have.

[SPEAKER_01]: but this stuck out to Cheryl because their father never mentioned that the murders occurred at their home.

[SPEAKER_01]: So how would Ryan have known to even go there?

[SPEAKER_01]: She also said that he had made a few comments after the murders about how sometimes he wonders if he could have done this.

[SPEAKER_01]: This, meaning the murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he also talked about weird dreams and premonitions he had about the murders, and again, this was never told to the authorities.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm assuming the people he said these things too just assumed that Ryan was going through it, he was grieving and going through the emotional roller coaster that comes after losing someone so tragically, and that maybe he really didn't mean anything by it.

[SPEAKER_01]: But looking back on those comments, it just didn't sit well with Cheryl [SPEAKER_01]: So, after learning all of this, the detective started looking into Ryan Weingaardin's alibi for the night of the murder, and they found a discrepancy pretty quickly in the story that Ryan and his girlfriend Pam had told.

[SPEAKER_01]: When the first question about their whereabouts, both Pam and Ryan had said that they had been at a laundromat, doing their laundry, but they had to finish at a friend's house because they ran out of change for the machines.

[SPEAKER_01]: After they were done at the friend's house, they went home and were together all night.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, both Pam and Ryan told this exact story.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the discrepancy they found was in a polygraph test that Pam had taken a little while after the murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when asked if she had been with Ryan all night long, Pam said no, which the polygraph proved was the truth.

[SPEAKER_01]: So Pam hadn't actually been with Ryan all night long.

[SPEAKER_01]: So why did they say they were together originally?

[SPEAKER_01]: That was what investigators needed to know.

[SPEAKER_01]: In February 2012 detectives Rapper and Blakely went to pay Pam and Ryan a visit at their home.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pam wasn't there, but Ryan was, and when they sat down with him, he kind of downplayed what he could remember from that day.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said it was over 20 years ago, his memory wasn't the best, and that he was having a hard time remembering the full details.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which maybe that is true, but if someone in my family had been murdered, I feel like that day would forever be ingrained in my mind.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know, I've never been in that situation obviously, but that's just how I feel like I would remember everything so vividly.

[SPEAKER_01]: So with this first initial interview with Ryan, detectives didn't get much from him because he said he couldn't really remember.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they requested that when Pam got off a work that she come into this station to talk to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: When Pam and Ryan arrived at the station for Pam's interview, Ryan wanted to be in the room with her when she was being questioned.

[SPEAKER_01]: He oddly did not want to let his wife out of his sight, he seemed like he wanted to be involved in every step of the way and seemed almost uncomfortable with the idea that she was about to be questioned again.

[SPEAKER_01]: Detectives told him that he had to wait outside and they took Pam in a separate room for an interview.

[SPEAKER_01]: She gave the same story that she had over 20 years ago.

[SPEAKER_01]: They went to the laundry mat, went to a friends at Yada Yada Yada.

[SPEAKER_01]: So during this interview, detectives didn't get any new answers from her either.

[SPEAKER_01]: They weren't able to clear up this discrepancy, they didn't find anything new out really, and it was kind of a bummer and almost a waste of time.

[SPEAKER_01]: but they just had this itch in the back of their minds that there was more to this story, and they didn't fully believe Pam and Ryan, so they dug even deeper.

[SPEAKER_01]: They started picking apart Pam and Ryan's lives from 1987, who were their friends, where were they working, what was going on in their lives, and even who were they dating.

[SPEAKER_01]: Detectives located a good friend of Ryan's named Jim Michem.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they interviewed him and asked him, standard questions about his relationship with Ryan, and they learned that they were pretty good friends.

[SPEAKER_01]: And every morning before work in 1987, Jim would go over to Ryan's house early in the morning for coffee.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, he did this before work, and it was a part of their daily routine.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said that on that Monday, November 23, when he arrived at Ryan's house, for his morning coffee and chitchat session, Pam was there, which wasn't unusual, but both Pam and Ryan were visibly upset, and it was clear that they both had been crying.

[SPEAKER_01]: When asked what was wrong, Ryan said that his sister Gail and her husband had been murdered.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, this is significant because Gem went over early in the morning on that Monday, November 23rd.

[SPEAKER_01]: That Monday, the 23rd was when Rick and Gail were found after not showing up for work.

[SPEAKER_01]: but they weren't found until 11 a.m.

[SPEAKER_01]: So how could Pam and Ryan already know about the murders if they technically hadn't been found yet?

[SPEAKER_01]: They also found out that Orion had another girlfriend and that he had been two-timing Pam.

[SPEAKER_01]: This other woman's name was Chris Bealin.

[SPEAKER_01]: Obviously they needed to speak to her as well and they went to go and interview her.

[SPEAKER_01]: When they spoke with her, nothing really knew came out about Ryan and Pam and his whereabouts from the night of the murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: And as detectives were wrapping up and beginning to stand up to leave, they were thinking her for her time and doing the typical, if you think of anything, give us a call, we appreciate you and so on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Chris all of a sudden goes, y'all know?

[SPEAKER_01]: There is this one thing, detective rapper and Blakely stop in their tracks, giving her their undivided attention, and she drops a very big wild, oh my god, huge twist of a bombshell on them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when I first heard this, you guys, I gasped.

[SPEAKER_01]: My jaw dropped.

[SPEAKER_01]: Chris tells the detectives that there was a time when Ryan showed her a picture of Gail in her bikini that was taken while the family, including Gail's husband, Rick, had been out on a boating trip.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he says to her, quote, Look how hot she is.

[SPEAKER_01]: He kept going on and on about the way she looked in her bikini.

[SPEAKER_01]: How good she looked in this picture, how hot she was.

[SPEAKER_01]: And from the sounds of it, he spent this whole trip staring and uglene at his sister in a sexual way.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's been reported that Rick, while on this boating trip, actually took note and was so bothered by how his brother-in-law was looking at his wife.

[SPEAKER_01]: His brother-in-law was looking at his own sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: Chris always felt the way that he was talking about his sister was completely off, incredibly weird, and she was so uncomfortable by it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then Ryan confides in Chris and tells her that he had a sexual relationship with Gail, his baby sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan told Chris that these sexual relationship started when Gail was just nine years old and he was 12 and continued throughout their teen years.

[SPEAKER_01]: He had admitted that there were times that Gail would say no and he forced her and raped her anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: But in the next breath, Ryan tried to make it seem like Gail was into it.

[SPEAKER_01]: But detectives did not buy that one bit, and they fully believed that he actually took advantage of his sister for years.

[SPEAKER_01]: He manipulated her, controlled her, forced her, scared her into this situation, and she kept quiet out of fear.

[SPEAKER_01]: Talk about devastating for Gale, to just be nine years old, not fully understanding what was going on, and having these things done to her.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not only heartbreaking and sad, but it's disgusting, and talk about a major bombshell this was for the authorities.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan had never, ever disclosed this information to the police.

[SPEAKER_01]: He had never admitted to having a sexual relationship with his sister, ever.

[SPEAKER_01]: And with this information, detectives just knew that there was no way that he wasn't somehow involved in the case.

[SPEAKER_01]: They had the feeling for a long while that he was involved when they found the discrepancy.

[SPEAKER_01]: But this was huge, and this was potentially a secret that was big enough to kill for.

[SPEAKER_01]: With the shocking revelation that Ryan had been sexually abusing his little sister Gail Brink for years, authorities knew that they needed to speak once again with Ryan's now wife Pam.

[SPEAKER_01]: They needed her to be honest with them about Ryan's whereabouts on the night of November 21, 1987.

[SPEAKER_01]: After getting in touch with Pam, she agreed to come back to the station, but once again, she did not show up alone.

[SPEAKER_01]: In her wake was her husband and Gail's brother, Ryan.

[SPEAKER_01]: Once again, he wanted to be in the room while Pam was being questioned and they told him no that he needed to wait outside.

[SPEAKER_01]: This time, Pam kind of broke down and just said that Ryan was very controlling and she finally admits that she wasn't with Ryan that night.

[SPEAKER_01]: She said that originally she didn't know where he was and that she had assumed that while he was out, he was gone to go deal drugs.

[SPEAKER_01]: After interviewing Pam, they then brought Ryan in again, and this time they took the approach of an interrogation.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were a lot harder with their questioning and really tried to get him to crack.

[SPEAKER_01]: Detective Blakely took the lead any time Ryan was interviewed or interrogated because Ryan really did not like women and didn't respond well to Detective Rapper.

[SPEAKER_01]: They start off by telling him that Pam confessed that they were not together all night on the night of the murders, which Ryan continued to deny and said that Pam was just confused.

[SPEAKER_01]: Then Detective Blakely asks Ryan about his relationship with his sister, and Ryan just asks him back, quote, What do you mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: And Detective Blakely stared Ryan down and said, quote, You know exactly what I mean, sexually.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Ryan went completely silent.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan and both detectives sat in silence for like 40 seconds just staring each other down.

[SPEAKER_01]: And talk about an uncomfortable moment for the detectives.

[SPEAKER_01]: 40 seconds likely felt like forever in that moment, in that small cramped interrogation room.

[SPEAKER_01]: Staring down the person who they believed not only sexually abused his sister, but murdered her and her husband.

[SPEAKER_01]: Finally, after that long silence Ryan says, quote, well, it was just kids play, you know, like playing doctors in quote.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he really, really, really, really tried to downplay the severity of it all.

[SPEAKER_01]: Even though he previously admitted to other people that he raped his sister.

[SPEAKER_01]: So after detectives gave him to admit to this insesuous relationship with Gail, he refuses to say anything else and completely denies any involvement in the murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: and just because Ryan admitted to this sexual relationship, and I hate calling it a relationship because I fully believe it was abuse.

[SPEAKER_01]: You cannot change my mind about that, but just because he admitted to that, that wasn't enough to arrest him.

[SPEAKER_01]: So they had to let him go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Over the next few days, Ryan called Detective Blakely 32 times leaving him these crazy and unhinged voicemails.

[SPEAKER_01]: He would say that he hates him, but he appreciates him at the same time.

[SPEAKER_01]: He would say that he thinks that the detectives are sons of bitches and a necessary evil.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is also demanding that they find his sister's killer and that they're barking up the wrong tree and claiming that he knows nothing about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: He also accuses the detectives of forcing his wife to confess to something that just isn't true.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said that they intimidated her and forced her to say that the alibi was a lie and that she was scared and said whatever they wanted to hear.

[SPEAKER_01]: He also talks about how confused she was over the timeline and so on.

[SPEAKER_01]: With the amount of calls and voice messages, it appears that Ryan was scared.

[SPEAKER_01]: They are closing in on him and he seems terrified.

[SPEAKER_01]: So even though detectives got Pam to admit that the alibi was a lie, they felt like she knew more.

[SPEAKER_01]: That she was holding on to some key information that will ultimately get them an arrest.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was just a matter of getting her alone and away from Ryan and comfortable enough to speak her truth.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which was shaping out to be impossible.

[SPEAKER_01]: Any time they tried Ryan intervened.

[SPEAKER_01]: So instead of having Pam come to the station and instead of going to their home, they randomly showed up to Pam's work and told her flat out, listen, we're not going away.

[SPEAKER_01]: Our job is to solve cold cases.

[SPEAKER_01]: Back in 1987, you were interviewed and the police left you alone after that.

[SPEAKER_01]: This time, we aren't going anywhere and we will keep coming back.

[SPEAKER_01]: So just tell us what you know, [SPEAKER_01]: and finally, she caves.

[SPEAKER_01]: She admits that she has been so controlled by Ryan for so many years and that she is ready to get this bird and that she has carried for 25 years off of her chest.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pam tells them that on the night of September 21st, 1987, Ryan showed up at her apartment and at that time the two were just dating and they didn't actually live together.

[SPEAKER_01]: When he showed up at her apartment, he was very angry and very upset and indicated to her that he had just shot and killed Rick and Gail.

[SPEAKER_01]: He told her that they thought that they were better than everyone else and too good for everyone so he killed them.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this is what it sounds like the authorities piece together about what happened on that night.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick and Gail went to that wedding and returned some time between 11 and 1130pm.

[SPEAKER_01]: Still dressed in their wedding attire the two watch TV for some time and then Ryan showed up.

[SPEAKER_01]: He came over to discuss something which I'm going to assume was the RV parking situation with their parents and their exchange got heated.

[SPEAKER_01]: At one point, Gail told Ryan he needed to leave and she turned to go to the bedroom to get ready for bed.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan was still standing in the living room angry when Rick told him that he needed to leave.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the authorities believe that maybe he kind of gave it away that he knew about the sexual abuse that had gone on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick makes Ryan leave and he goes back to watching TV.

[SPEAKER_01]: A half hour later, Ryan comes back telling Rick that he needs his help because he was having car issues.

[SPEAKER_01]: Rick slips on his work glashes and his coat and goes out to his blazer and gets inside, before Ryan shoots him in the head.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan then went inside and shot Gail three times in the head.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is believed that one of the driving forces for Ryan to murder his sister and brother law was not only the abuse and Rick potentially finding out about that or knowing about it and not only the RV situation, but they felt like Ryan was jealous of how well they were doing for themselves.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan himself was struggling to make ends meet.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was selling drugs on the side for extra cash, and he was jealous that Rick and Gale seemed to have it all.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were hard workers, they were newly wedds and happily married.

[SPEAKER_01]: They had bought this house on their own, and he hated to see them happy.

[SPEAKER_01]: After admitting to the detectives that Ryan confessed to murdering them, they took Pam to the prosecutor's office for her to do a formal interview and give a full statement.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was there that she told the story of how Ryan intimidated her into silence for over 25 years.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pam said that after he told her that he killed Rick and Gale, he took her to their house, and they walked up to the truck where he showed her Rick inside.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said to her, quote, if you say anything, this is going to happen to you, in quote.

[SPEAKER_01]: He then forced Pam who was crying at this point inside the home.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was telling him she doesn't wanna see, she doesn't wanna go down there, but he forces her into the bedroom and brought her to the edge of the bed, lifted the pillow from Gail's face and said, quote, isn't she beautiful and quote?

[SPEAKER_01]: Which, that part is crazy to me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Gail had been shot three times in the head, yet he's sitting there saying how beautiful she looks when you know that had to have been a devastating scene.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pam said that Ryan had put the clothing he had worn as well as a gun into a bag and disposed of it somewhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think those items were ever recovered from what I found.

[SPEAKER_01]: So as Pam was telling the authorities this, she was just a broken emotional mess.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can imagine that this felt like this suffocating weight had been lifted off of her shoulders.

[SPEAKER_01]: And while I'm sure some people are wondering why she didn't speak up sooner and why she married this man anyway, knowing that he was a killer, we really truly don't know what it's like to be in her shoes and to feel the fear and the control that she felt from Ryan.

[SPEAKER_01]: While she was at the prosecutor's office giving her statement, Ryan was calling her cell phone, non-stop trying to figure out what was going on.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think he just had this feeling that something was off, they were closing in on him, and he feared that his wife would finally be brave enough to speak up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And with all of this new information, they felt like they finally had enough to arrest him.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they also wanted to make sure that Pam was going to be safe at home as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: They fully believed that Pam was another one of Ryan's victims.

[SPEAKER_01]: She had been controlled and manipulated by this man for decades.

[SPEAKER_01]: Pam also suffered psychological abuse from her father, and this is how they believed that Ryan was able to sneak in there and control her the way he did.

[SPEAKER_01]: She had never really known anything else, which is so sad.

[SPEAKER_01]: On January 18, 2013, Ryan Weingaarten was officially arrested and charged with the murders of his sister Gail and brother-in-law Rick.

[SPEAKER_01]: And while, in jail, awaiting his trial, he sent 29 letters to Pam, as well as a bunch of letters that he sent to his children and friends that he wanted them to give to Pam, he wanted to ensure that she read these letters and read what he had to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: In these letters, he tried to convince Pam that she was being brainwashed and manipulated by detectives to blame him for the murders.

[SPEAKER_01]: He wrote, quote, I think that now you are in this lie that you feel like you must follow through with it or get in trouble.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think he was trying to gaslight and make her question her sanity.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think Ryan was spiraling because he lost control of his wife that he had this hold on over 25 years and he was in a panic.

[SPEAKER_01]: On March 11, 2014, Ryan's trial began nearly three decades after the murders, and of course [SPEAKER_01]: Getting up there and testifying against her husband was probably the hardest thing that she could ever do, and Ryan did not make it easy.

[SPEAKER_01]: The entire time she was testifying, he stared her down, and she was visibly emotional about being on the stand.

[SPEAKER_01]: Throughout her testimony, Ryan would have random outburst calling her black hearted saying she's lying, and that he can't believe the lies that she was making up.

[SPEAKER_01]: The judge got on him multiple times and threatened to remove him from the court, which I think eventually happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: Detective rapper in an interview stated that as the days went on and as her testimony went on, you could almost see Pam become empowered.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan's outburst showed the jury the type of person he was and how manipulative and controlling he was.

[SPEAKER_01]: He was losing it in court because he no longer held the power over Pam and he could not stand it.

[SPEAKER_01]: The trial lasted over three weeks and during that time, the jury heard testimonies from 60 different people, including someone that Ryan had met and jail named Darrell.

[SPEAKER_01]: Darrell claimed that Ryan admitted to him that he had shot and killed his sister and her husband.

[SPEAKER_01]: He also said that Ryan talked about his older sister Cheryl and her fight for justice for Gayle and REC.

[SPEAKER_01]: And how he said, quote, if I had known that bitch was going to cause me so much trouble, I would have killed her a long time ago.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan also took the stand in his own defense and would go on crazy, long, tangents, and he denied molesting Gale.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said the very few sexual encounters they had was when they were young and it was just innocent and kids being kids and exploring.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan said that he wouldn't have cared if Gale told anyone about their few encounters because [SPEAKER_01]: and really wasn't a big deal.

[SPEAKER_01]: So he was saying that the prosecution's motive was completely ridiculous, and again he wouldn't have cared if Rick found out because it happened only a few times, and they were just young and exploring.

[SPEAKER_01]: When asked about his original alibi, he stuck to it.

[SPEAKER_01]: He said that his wife Pam had been threatened, manipulated, coerced, and abused by the authorities [SPEAKER_01]: When asked why he thought that she would stick to this new story, he said that he believed she was doing it because she wanted a divorce.

[SPEAKER_01]: He got emotional on the stand crying saying he can't believe his sister and Pam would say these things about him, and that he believes they were manipulated into this.

[SPEAKER_01]: He says that he wants to sue the county over it all.

[SPEAKER_01]: The defense tried their hardest to prove that Ryan was innocent and brought up the motorcycle gang theory amongst a few other theories, and ultimately the jury did not buy it.

[SPEAKER_01]: On March 28, 2014, the jury had reached their verdict.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan Weingaarten was found guilty on two counts of first-degree murder.

[SPEAKER_01]: Three weeks later, at his sentencing, Ryan was still claiming he was innocent and cried asking God why he would do this to him because he was such a good and innocent man.

[SPEAKER_01]: While the judge was trying to address Ryan and give him his sentence, Ryan kept interrupting him telling him that he was flat out lying.

[SPEAKER_01]: The judge got so irritated and so fed up with it that he straight up asks Ryan, do I need to bind and gag you sir?

[SPEAKER_01]: He proceeded to tell Ryan that he will have the deputies duct tape him if necessary, but he will sit there and listen to what he has to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: After Ryan got himself under control, the judge said quote, [SPEAKER_01]: He then sentenced Ryan to two life sentences with no possibility of parole.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan has, of course, tried to appeal his conviction three times, and all of his appeals were denied.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ryan will remain at the Michigan Department of Corrections for the rest of his natural life.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is now 62 years old, and his wife Pam did divorce him after everything, and I do hope that she was able to heal and grow now that she is no longer under his thumb.

[SPEAKER_01]: This story is just so heartbreaking and tragic.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ricking Gail's family and friends feel their loss every single day.

[SPEAKER_01]: Their loved ones are left wondering what could have been.

[SPEAKER_01]: They fully believe that Rick and Gale would have been incredible parents, giving their children the best lives possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately, they never got that chance.

[SPEAKER_01]: That is all for this week's episode, guys.

[SPEAKER_01]: I look forward to hearing what you guys think about this episode, so make sure you leave comments on the Facebook group, Instagram, or if you listen on Spotify, leave an episode comment.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can find my private Facebook group where I share all things true crime by searching crime with Holly, podcast, discussion group.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can find me on Instagram at crime a holly and if you would like more true crime content You can find me on TikTok at crime with holly dot podcast I just want to say and I wasn't sure if I was going to address this at all But I just it's it's really It's really weighing heavy on my heart if you follow me on If you follow me on Instagram you might have seen yesterday in my stories that I've been taking [SPEAKER_01]: a little bit of a break until Monday.

[SPEAKER_01]: Today's I'm recording this on Thursday.

[SPEAKER_01]: This episode's gonna go up tomorrow.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll be back on Monday, but this week has been so incredibly heavy in my country in the United States.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you are on social media at all you have been exposed to two horrific attacks that have happened, one of which is only being reported on now and it happened last month, which is absolutely crazy.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the videos that are circulating is so heavy and such a hard topic and we're not meant to see that kind of traumatic.

[SPEAKER_01]: stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like it's just, it's very, very heavy.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know a lot of people are hurting and I just want to remind you guys to take care of yourself, take care of your mental health, love on your loved ones, and really hold each other at this time because [SPEAKER_01]: It's just a reminder that life is so, so short.

[SPEAKER_01]: Just take care of yourself, guys.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know how to form what I want.

[SPEAKER_01]: What I want to even say, but I am just so, it's been an emotional week.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't care what set of the road you're on, what your beliefs are, what I just, there's just so much hate and so much evil.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't even know what to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want to address this, but I don't even know what to say.

[SPEAKER_01]: Always remember to be aware and take care and what is done in dark always comes to light.

[SPEAKER_01]: Bye-bye.