Welcome back to a new episode of Podcasts on the Brink Thursday, December eleventh.

Big basketball game coming up this weekend.

Indiana Basketball will be in Lexington, Kentucky to take on the University of Kentucky, who is off to a bit of a shaky start this season under second year coach Mark Pope.

To help us talk a little bit about Kentucky's early season struggles and also look forward to the matchup.

Cameron Drummond, old friend now the Lexington Herald Leader one time was a student reporter for Inside the Halls with us on Podcast on the Brink.

Before we get to Cameron, I wanted to just take a quick moment remind you if you're watching the show on YouTube, like the video, subscribe to the channel.

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Thank you for that.

Cameron, welcome back.

You had an abrupt ending to your time and Inside the Hall because of the pandemic.

I remember still remember it.

You know people you know ask me some of the moments that stand out.

Been doing this now since two thousand and seven.

I still think about this from time to time.

You and Dylan Wallace at the Big Ten Tournament in twenty twenty.

It looked like Indiana was going to break through there and make it to the NCAA tournament.

You guys were finally going to get to cover the tournament, and then all of a sudden everything is shut down.

You were I think in the aftermath of that, you and Dylan were like helping me grind like Q and a's with former IU players and all time IU player bracket things like that, just to kind of keep the conversation going because there were no games.

But it's come a long way in those what it will be six years in March.

Things much more normal now.

But what do you remember about that that time in that day.

I remember seeing Fred Hoiber looking ill on the bench in that game, and there's a lot of concern that and then all of a sudden it was just Big To tournament was over.

You know, there's certain things that like I don't think about a ton from my time at IU or covering IU basketball, just because I've been on the Kentucky beat for a few years.

And you mean, you know this as well as anyone news comes left, right and center.

Things just get pushed to the recess of your brain.

But hearing you described kind of the parameters of that, I remember everything about that day because there was Indiana and Nebraska in the eight twelve game or ten the eleven fourteen games, something like that.

Basically, Indiana needed a win to lock up that tournament spot, and I guess what ended up being Archie's penultimate year in charge, they crushed them, and Nebraska played like two on football players in the game because they didn't have enough scholarship basketball guys.

Fred Hoiberg, who ended up just having the flu is like sick on the bench.

Me and Dylan Wallace you mentioned, my former roommate and fellow inside the Hall intern.

We're sitting courtside at Banker's Life.

Also during that game is when Rudy Gobert comes back positive for COVID.

So the NBA shuts down and they canceled that game in Oklahoma City, and I remember postgame, you know, they really rushed through postgame press conferences at Banker's Life and we were basically sequestered on the Pacers practice court, which is where they had a big ten tournament.

Like podium media sessions.

We all had to chill out there for like an hour or two because everyone thought Fred Hoiberg had COVID.

Nobody knew how it spread any of that stuff.

And one of the things, actually one of my biggest regrets from my time at inside the Hall is that night we drove back from India to Bloomington, we weren't sure really what was going to happen with the world.

Obviously we know everything got canceled from that point onward.

But I stayed up until like three am, and I wrote a story because I was sitting right behind the Indiana bench the entire game.

So I wrote a.

Story that laid out exactly what Archie Miller said, did bench interactions, yelling at the ref, talking with you know, probably Bruiser Flint and tom O'strummer, whoever the assistants were, and it was I thought it was pretty good, or at least my like twenty one year old brain thought this is a killer story.

And it just remained in my Google docs the entire time because it didn't feel like a good time to post it when the world was that ding, So that one never saw the light of day.

So I'm still disappointed I didn't force that one through, especially when we were starved for content.

You know, IU doesn't play from December twenty second through January fourth, so maybe we can fit that one in after Christmas.

Just kind of look back at the story that was never told by Cam drummen.

Just just kidding.

So you you graduated, obviously, and then went to Austin for I think you told me eleven months to cover community news down in Austin, Texas, a good maybe break from the sports world there after covering pretty depressing time in IU basketball.

For the amount of years you did in other IU sports too, there wasn't just a lot of good sports.

But then get the opportunity to go to Lexington cover UK women's basketball.

I believe it first.

And now you're the secondary on UK men's basketball.

What's it just been like just adjusting to You've been there now for what more than four years?

But what's what's it been like just covering those programs and what's your time on Lexington been like so far?

Well, let me start by saying, my time in Lexington has been tremendous.

I was telling you off fare that I was actually in Bloomington, Indiana, visiting friends.

I want to say it was maybe around the graduation period for that twenty twenty one class, and I would just out of the blue got an email from the former sports editor here at the Lexington Herald Leader, Matt Groff, asking if I'd be interested in covering UK women's basketball or joining the sports staff here at large, and I told him I'd never been to Lexington, Kentucky before.

The only thing I knew about it is that UK was situated here.

But I was up for an adventure and so that could have gone really poorly if I like didn't like the city and everything that came with the job.

But it's been a tremendous few years and you reference, you know, I started off on the UK women's basketball beat.

I actually got to cover the senior year of Ryan Howard, who went on to be the one number one overall pick in the twenty twenty two WNBA draft.

I actually was in Indiana twice of the first year I covered the UK women's basketball team, because they played at Indiana in the regular season, lost by like thirty, then returned to Indiana as their NCAA tournament site, and it was kind of billed as of maybe a big rematch between them and Terry Moorin's IU squad, and then UK lost to Princeton in the first round, So continued the streak of if I'm around a program in the postseason, it's usually going to go poorly for them.

But you know, you reference kind of obviously this is a tremendous, you know, spectacle in the state of Kentucky.

Like Kentucky basketball very much like Indiana basketball is something that the passion throughout the state, not just in Central Kentucky, you know, really on a national scale as well, especially given what John Calipari did, you know, kind of the turn of the oughts to the twenty tens with all the freshmen in the one and done's, Like, the leadership we get is tremendous.

You know, eighteen twenty thousand people at RUP Arena, where there's fireworks going off before games.

You know, we were talking off air, and I'm sure we'll get into it in the podcast, but the resources that they dedicate to the UK men's basketball program as well, the scrutiny that Calipari toward the end of his tenure, Mark Pope's gotten, especially this season, you know, it really is a pressure cooker, a fish bowl kind of environment.

And I will say as well that I think I was sitting in a coffee shop here in Lexington.

I want to say in twenty twenty three when the series was announced the renewal of the IU UK rivalry, you know, back when Calipari and Mike Woodson were the head coaches to people who notably are no longer here.

But one of my first thoughts after writing up the news release was, man, I wonder if I may get on podcast on the Brink again when that game rolls around.

So I'm happy to have a few years on.

Yeah, it's I think it's a good thing that the game's coming back.

It's been far too long.

Obviously, it's the first time since the December tenth, twenty eleven game in Bloomington that they played a regular season game, or I think a lot of that obviously was because cal Perry didn't want to come to Bloomington again and Indiana was not necessarily open to neutral court games.

Kind of had a bit of a compromise with this series with the four game deal where they're going to play two in Lexington one and Indy one in Bloomington.

Don't love that set up from an IU perspective to give in that much, but I think that's what it took to get it done.

And then, obviously, as you mentioned, the coaches that agreed to the deal no longer in place, So I do think for the long term, both programs probably in healthier positions.

Just in terms of the coaching changes you mentioned cal Perry, you know, it seemed like his time had really come to an end there, just based on a lot of different factors.

And obviously with Indiana Mike Woodson, I think a lot of people thought maybe after year three that it was time for him to go, and he stayed that extra year and things didn't go well and his tenure.

But this Kentucky team, you mentioned the reported twenty two million dollar INIL payroll whatever you want to call it, for this group, that was obviously something that was you know, I saw it aggregated various places in the preseason, but you told me that the Herald Leader was the one that actually reported that figure.

How has that impacted the way that the fan base looks at this team in terms of just the performance so far, because it seems to me, and this is again I've told you I've only watched really part of the Gonzaga game, not watch the team play, but I see some of the stuff on social media.

It seems to me that people are kind of throwing that number out when it's can in terms of criticizing Mark Pope and saying that he's not done a good job with this team.

And I'm just curious how that kind of how that number is maybe kind of weighed on the start that they've had so far.

Certainly.

Yeah, and let me just start by saying that if anyone has any interest in any of our Kentucky preview content, please go over to Kentucky dot com and Kentucky dot com slash sports.

We have a really good men's basketball staff led by my kind of senior colleague, Ben Roberts, who was the first to get that twenty two million dollar number out there.

And we have a ton of stuff this week leading up to the IU game, even some Indiana focused stuff that I'm taking a crack at my expert knowledge of both the both teams that I think people will enjoy.

But you mentioned the twenty two million dollar number.

Obviously that was something that came out, you know, September ish.

I think is when we reported it, you know, kind of in the lead up to the season.

You combine that with defeating Purdue, then the number one team in the country in their first exhibition game, and that those two factors I think really rashed up expectations for this team, which were already high.

I think a lot of people remember Mark Pope's introductory press conference some eighteen months ago where he's yelling about raising banner number nine and that national championships and final fours are really the only standard that matters at Kentucky.

The fan base ran with that obviously.

Last year they were hindered a bit by injuries and some on the fly roster construction, but they showed a lot of promising play.

They played a really beautiful brand of basketball that was predicated on cutting three point shots, free flowing offense.

They had a ton of seniors, fifth year grad transfer guys who really made that gel and it was a pretty likable team to kind of fall in love with from a fan based perspective.

Stylistically, all those things entering this season, as I was telling you off air, Mark Pope really kind of changed the roster construction, or at least based on historically what he did both during his first year at Kentucky in his previous stops at Utah Valley and BYU, he went a lot more physical, a lot more defense.

First.

You know a lot of these guys that they targeted in the portal, the likes of Jaden Quainton's, who is their top transfer from Arizona State, who hasn't even played yet this year because he's recovering from a torn acl but other guys as well.

You know, I'm thinking about Mohammed Diabate from Alabama, Denzel Aberdeen, who was the sixth man on last year's Florida National Championship squad.

You know, even otega Oway, who was the preseason SEC Player of the Year.

It was a little bit less offensive skill and a little bit more like physicality, grittiness defense, because that was an area that Kentucky struggled in last year.

So far this regular season, they've gotten none of that defensive trade off, and their offensive ceiling has seemingly shrunk.

Feels like a case where maybe they brought in a lot of pieces that don't necessarily fit the coaches playing style or philosophy super well, and then the result of that has been in zero to four record in high major games.

You know, you lose a rivalry matchup to Louisville, they hadn't lost in several years.

You go down by north of twenty points at one point, you know, in the Cardinals gym at the Young Center, you get blown up by Michigan State.

In the Champions Classic, you lose what was an eminently winnable game against North Carolina where Kentucky kind of choked a bit down the stretch and I think missed thirteen or their final fifteen shots in a really lively rap arena.

And then you reference the game that you watch part of that Gonzaga embarrassment where that Nashville crowd booed the Wildcats off the court like nothing too many people have ever seen before.

So the twenty two million dollar number to go back to that obviously plays a role.

You know, I think a lot of members of the fan base feel that that's currently not money well spent or money that cope and just the roster building folks have kind of mismanaged.

I will say some of that is a little bit misleading, only from the standpoint of a large chunk of those deals and that monetary payout came before the true summer house settlement regulations came in, so you know, you can look at it from more so players that Pope identified to maybe give some more money on the front end, while you know, maybe taking a longer term approach, like hey, if we give you a little bit more here, committing you to stay for an extra year or two, or just you know, looking at not just from the pure twenty two million dollars for one season lens.

All that being said, I think a lot of people in the fan base are very dubious, shall we say, about this team's roster construction, how they fit in together.

You know, if there's enough offensive production.

If there's one, go get a bucket guy on this team.

And there's also been a ton of questions recently about just basic tent pole things like energy, effort, hustle.

We had Kentucky's starting center at the beginning of the year, Brandon Garrison getting benched during the wildcats last game against North Carolina Central on Tuesday night for a lack of hustle.

You had one of the.

Transfer editions, Cam Williams, not checking in until there were thirteen minutes to go in the game.

I think you referenced injuries earlier too.

Mohammed Diabate has been out with a high ankle sprain.

Their projective starting point guard, jail and Low, actually hasn't started a game yet this year because he's hurt his right shoulder for the last two or so months.

So a combination of a ton of factors, but it's all leading to some really intense scrutiny of Mark Pope his roster building approach for this season, and you know, plain and simple, the allocation of resources for a team that on December eleventh, as we record on Thursday morning, still doesn't have a high major win and could really be staring down the barrel of things if they losed Indiana this weekend and Saint John's next weekend before SEC play begins.

Yeah, so I understand the you know, you mentioned fish Bowl and scrutiny and everything.

Is it and you'll never I think there's it's probably impossible to rationalize with some Kentucky fans ever about the program and what it should be.

But do you think the do you think it's a little overboard in terms of what the reaction has been so far based on the fact that Hope did go to the Sweet sixteen last year, had a really solid first year.

He seems to do everything kind of the right way, just in terms of how he presents himself.

He always takes responsibility.

It feels like for losses when things go bad and there's still a lot of season left, I mean, the season's clearly not over.

There's gonna be a ton of opportunities.

You mentioned the Indiana game, you mentioned the Saint John's game.

There's gonna be eighteen sec games.

It just feels to me and in some ways, you know, I think Indiana can be this way too, that sometimes every loss is every win is expected, and every loss is magnified to the point where it just becomes sometimes the negativity is hard for a coach and players to operate in.

Is that is that kind of the Is that?

Is that a fair way to put this?

And do you feel like the scrutiny sometimes is maybe a little bit too high on on this on this team?

Well, certainly from like a potential coaching Chaine standpoint, we are eons away from that.

I don't think there's any world short of anything off the court occurring, which there's no semblance of Mark Pope not returning as UK's coach next season.

I do think even some of this fan anger is maybe built up from the tail end of last season.

You know, Kentucky's defense was really porous.

You know, they kind of had an improvement toward the end of SEC play going into the tournament, but still, this is a team that lost its SEC tournament game by nearly thirty points in the quarterfinals to Alabama, your reference going back to the Sweet sixteen for the first time since twenty nineteen.

But then in the Sweet sixteen, which they played at Lucas Oil up in Indy, lose to a Tennessee team that you had already beaten two times earlier in the season, which a lot of people you know, kind of really earmarked is a pretty golden chance to get to the Elite eight, I believe, also for the first time since twenty nineteen.

And obviously a lot of this is you know, kind of fan angst and anxiety, and that's always going to get blown out of proportion at a place like Kentucky.

I do think the manner of their defeats have really driven a lot of this as well, because again, this is not like they've lost four coin flip games against name brand opponents.

They've gotten absolutely boat raced in three of them.

I think a lot of people have the jury still out on how good North Carolina is and losing you know, a blue blood premier game at home like that when they had the game won several times over isn't going to sit well with folks.

You know, people are probably very much like kind of still jumpy and reactionary.

Again because you know, Kentucky basketball.

Pope comes in preaching the standard of banners and final fours the north of twenty million dollars anil figure, and then starting off oho and four in high major games.

The way that they've played, I'm sure is unacceptable in a lot of people's viewpoints.

I think now Pope is something like two and nine in his last eleven games against ranked teams, which isn't going to help people.

And again, some of the things I've referenced earlier, like Mark Pope was really mad postgame Tuesday after they clobbered North Carolina Central talking about how there's a standard that the players need to live up to that they're not currently reaching.

That you know, there's basic kind of requisite things like giving the right energy, hustling back after a turnover, playing off two feet and trying to make plays for your teammates.

He even talked about how this team doesn't truly know what it means to compete yet, and he described that as terrifying.

You know, again, we're here on December eleventh, after an off season where anybody who watch the UK practice was willing to tell media members how competitive and feisty and you know, tenacious they are.

Yet this is a team that seemingly just doesn't gel on the court, or at least hasn't to this point.

And obviously that spins off into a million different message board rumors, right.

I mean, we've heard everything from off the court stuff involving players, to this team doesn't really like each other, to this team you know, is fighting in pregame meetings, in the locker room, you know, some outlandish things that you know, for the most part, is not true.

And then Pope's also had some pr blunders as well, and I think that kind of goes into why the fan base has been particularly disappointed in him this season.

As you mentioned, he does a lot of things the right way.

At his best, He's a very engaging personality.

He'll dive into the basketball X and o's all day, but at his worst, like if anybody saw him post that Michigan State game at Madison Square Garden, he is he takes losing really hard, so he'll go up there at the postgame press conference and he'll mumble out some words and just maybe not be the most engaging, confident, gregarious presence.

And for the last fifteen years before that, you got nothing but that, you know, with John Caliperi, in the best of times and in the worst of times.

So that's been adjustment, and you know that leads to you know again people on message boards being mad that Pope isn't getting angry in the huddles and that he's not, you know, projecting this bombastic presence that people usually look for from the Kentucky basketball coach.

He did break a clipboard over his knee in that North Carolina Central game on Tuesday night, which is just about the angriest I've ever seen him in any setting.

So maybe that tide is starting to change.

But I think all those factors are kind of co mingling in a way where the fan base is overreacting in the overall about Pope's tenure, but specifically within like the micro of this season, why they're so desperate for a win, like the opportunity will come for on Saturday.

Yeah, so it feels like a big game for Indiana, but it's not a game.

I don't think before the season that you would look at the schedule, you know.

I looked at the schedule before the year in turn, like leading to the Washington game, which is the first game after this long break after Christmas, and I thought, if they could get there with only two losses, they'd been doing pretty well for themselves.

Well, they have two losses now, and the Minnesota game was the game where I think people were a little perplexed they lost.

I don't think anyone in the preseason would expected them to beat Louisville and North Misial Court.

And I don't think anyone expected them to go into Rept.

Breen and win Steels.

Is obviously a little bit more possible now, just kind of based on how Kentucky's played so far.

But is this a much bigger game for Kentucky than it is Indiana at this point?

I think that's fair to say, because again, looking at the UK schedule, they get Indiana on Saturday.

After that they go to st.

They play a neutral syde game in Atlanta against Saint John's, and the whole tenor of that game completely changed with Kentucky's slow start to the year, because before that's Rick Patino, who was the head coach of UK's ninety six title team that Mark Pope was a captain on.

They finally got this game on the schedule, you know, a four.

Patino finally exits college basketball may be or maybe whole coach to be one hundred and fifty, who knows, And then they play another Cupcake.

They get Bellerman right after that Saint John's game, and after that it's only SEC play, and all of a sudden, this looks like a bit of a down year for the SEC, or at least certainly not the heights that it was at last year when they got fourteen of the league sixteen schools into the tournament.

You start as a CE play at Alabama.

That's probably not going to go well for this Kentucky team if they keep playing that the way that they are, And so all of a sudden, you know, you get off to an oh and one star and SEC play you're potentially and seven at high major games at that point, you.

Know, some of the other off court stuff as well.

Has been a lot of scrutiny about Kentucky's NIL procedures, not just in the context of this season, but in the aggregate.

They still don't have a true high school commitment from the twenty twenty sixth class, despite being rumored with several five star prospects from that group, so that stop people on edge as well.

It does feel like the season's on a little bit of a knife edge.

The season might be on the brink.

Some people are saying to borrow a line.

So it's crazy to think about.

But this game actually matters a ton for Kentucky, way more than I would have expected to begin this season.

And you mentioned I use season to this point.

You know, the Minnesota loss not great, but again, you probably didn't expect to beat Louisville in a neutral court.

You probably didn't expect to go into rep Arena and beat Kentucky.

But if Kentucky can pinch this off, or if Indiana seem we can pinch this off, this is already a team that's projected to be in the tournament, This would be a nice feather in their cap.

Certainly a win you that you would expect to remain as a quad one win as the season goes onward, and especially given the way that it looks like the seasons are trending for the like of Marquette and Kansas State, you know, maybe the signature win of I use non con if they're able to pull this off on Saturday.

So how do you think the team you mentioned you're going to do some stuff on India and I've before we got on here and I started to write my preview which will probably be up at some point on Friday and inside the hall, how do you kind of see these teams matching up?

I looked at Kentucky's last game.

They kind of started for I want to call Trenton Noah a guard.

I mean they really started four guards in Malchoim moreno at the five.

Is that with the injury situation, do you can do you expect a similar kind of line up in terms of what the C Saturday?

Could there be changes?

Are guys going to becoming available that were maybe injured?

And then just in terms of the matchup specifically with IU, how do you feel like the two teams match up?

Well, let me start on the Kentucky side, of things.

And one of the issues where that's kind of gone hand in hand with their slow start is Mark Pope very much feels like he's still trying to figure out optimal rotations.

You know, there's been calls for him to shorten the group of guys who are playing.

I think entering the game earlier this week, they had eleven players who were averaging at least fifteen minutes, which is a pretty hard thing to do.

Again, a lot of this is predicated on the health of point guard Jalen Low.

He hurt his right shoulder, which is his non shooting shoulder, during UK's Blue White exhibition game in October, So the worst thing that can happen in one of those, you know, just fan fest kind of exhibition, he kind of things.

He really has not come back to full form.

He didn't shoot it super well as a sophomore pit without a right shoulder injury.

This year, he's come off the bench in four games.

He's really the catalyst for their offense.

He offers them a lot of pace, you know, to a man, UK players have described him as a vocal leader on this team.

Not having him has really hurt their ceiling at both ends.

Of the court, so Pope has really played around with the lineup.

One of the biggest storylines this year has been a lack of inconsistent point guard play because some of the name brand guys on this Kentucky team, otega Oway, Colin Chandler, Denzel Aberdeen all great in a two or three role, you know, off ball stuff, none of them a super true point guard.

Jasper Johnson, who's a five star recruit who came in this year, has had a real up and down year in terms of his backup point guard role.

He scored twenty two points on Tuesday night.

I actually have a story up this morning about that potentially being a breakthrough, but obviously the Indian game being a bigger sign of things to come.

Your reference mal Chai Moreno, He's probably been the standout player of this UK year.

Five star freshmen from just down the road in Georgetown, Kentucky slotted into their starting five role and been really effective.

But another thing to watch with the Kentucky team and some of the lineups that Pope puts out there is they have not shot the ball well from three point range.

They're at thirty two point nine percent for the year mark that's right around the two hundreds nationally.

And this is a team that in theory likes to get a lot of threes up, but the volume of threes has decreased from last year, and last year they were shooting it, shooting it at nearly thirty seven percent.

So they're shooting it worse from three because they're putting lineups out there featuring maybe the likes of Diabate and moreno who are kind of non shooters from deep.

That's putting a lot more stress on the guards.

Without their starting point guard, they're having a very difficult time driving past guys playing off two feet in the lane, kicking out to teammates, and the cycle kind of repeats itself, right.

So we've seen some small ball lineups where you mentioned what they started on Tuesday night, Malachis at the five and Trent Noah, who's effectively a wing gone kind of players at the four.

They've done some big lineups where they've played two seven footers who are kind of non shooting personnel at the four and five.

They have an international player from Croatia, Andreya Yelovich, who hasn't been super consistent from three this year, despite taking a lot of them, so we're waiting to see if he has a breakout moment from deep.

So a lot of these roster construction issues are kind of bearing fruit in some of these high major losses.

So to be completely candid with you, I'm not quite sure what Pope's gonna do on Saturday.

You know.

Again, it feels like he's trying to figure out things on the fly, giving certain guys rope to play, pulling it back on others.

How much Jalen Low can play and if he slots back into the starting lineup I think will be kind of a major indicator of how this game goes.

And from the IU standpoint, you know, I was kind of analyzing the roster.

I watched a large portion of that Louisville game from this past weekend, and then Lamar Worklessing goes out and has like the best shooting night in Assembly Hall history.

And this was already kind of going to be a weak filled with Lamar Wilkerson discourse because of the transfer portal battle between Kentucky and Ie for him over the spring when he transferred from sam Houston State.

I'm sure a lot of people who are listing have seen the photo of him and Mark Pope with a horse at Keenland during his UK recruiting visit.

So I'm sure that one's gonna come up on social media this week.

But you know, looking at the game specifically the matchup between Wilkerson and I think otega Oway, who's going to draw that assignment and always maybe been the most disappointing player on this Kentucky team this year just because of the SEC preseason player of the Year hype that he had.

He's really tried to own up the things developing, being more of a vocal leader, and he's supposed to be a guy who's leading by example with defense with his driving ability and physicality on offense.

How always able to handle Wilkerson, or if he's able to handle Wilkerson, I think will be a big factor in how this game goes on Saturday in terms of.

The other big guys injuries.

I mean, is is Diabate or I know Quaintance is a little bit further away, but is expected to play on Saturday.

So the technical term on Diabat is day to day.

Right now, Mark Pope's presser is going to be Friday at noon, so that's when you'll get the latest update on that he is dealing with the high endful sprain that Pope has said includes a torn ligament in his ankle area, so that's not great.

He hasn't played since the Michigan State game in the Champions Classic back in early to mid November when he sustained that injury in the closing minutes of that one, So that means again, mal Chai Moreno is probably going to continue to shoulder a big load for Kentucky upfront.

You put in Yellovich for some shooting space or in theory, some shooting gravity.

Brandon Garrison's a fascinating player because he was one of the four holdovers from Pope's first year, but he's really regressed so far to this point this year.

He got benched in the North Carolina Central game on Tuesday night for failing to hustle back after getting ripped on a turnover on the offensive end.

So Kentucky really hasn't gotten what they've needed from Garrison so far this year.

And Diabate is considered a game changer for Kentucky based on his physicality, his rebounding prowess, you know, especially in Kentucky's losses to North Carolina in Gonzaga, a major issue has been UK's inability to rebound the ball defensively.

I think they're giving up like a thirty three percent offensive rebounding rate currently.

Yabat is a guy who's long been promised as a physical player who can hit you once, hit you twice, track the ball whether he's able to go or not again, I think will be a big marker in if UK's big men are able to have an advantage from a size perspective over IU, you know, and maybe you get some of those perimeter guys using their foot speed, their relocation tactics to also get some stuff on the margins.

But the big men battle will be huge in this one as well, assuming Kentucky is at full strength, and if they're not, that's a huge opening for IU to maybe take advantage of down low.

How have they been in terms of guarding the three, because obviously it's clear Indiana wants to take and make a lot of three pointers.

They've done that in several games at other games where you know, Minnesota and Louisville kind of took them off what they wanted to do in terms of getting up threes.

But this is Kentucky, how's their ball pressure on the perimeter, and in terms of contesting shots and kind of reacting to Indiana runs some pretty sophisticated things in terms of try to free shooters up.

So I think they'll be a little bit better prepared for this opportunity based on what they saw defensively against Minnesota and Louisville.

Louisville was able to really keep them all balanced to start the game, and then as the game went along they adjusted better to it.

But you know, Louisville, watching them up close to me, they felt like a top five, top ten team in terms of talent and just kind of the way their their guards were to me pretty elite in terms of what Indiana will see the rest of the way.

So I'm curious kind of how you see, because I think the key to slowing Indiana down obviously is getting into their shooters and making them uncomfortable because they don't really have necessarily a back to the basket guy that you're going to throw the ball to in the post and it's going to hurt you.

But they like to get paint touches and then get the ball out to the perimeter freezy look, So I'm just curious how you kind of see them being able to defend that and if that's something that they're good at.

Well, good news for Indiana fans out there.

Let me read you out the splits right now.

So Kentucky has played four games against top one hundred teams this year.

In the Torvic metrics, all those have been losses.

That's all their high major games.

In those four games, UK is shooting twenty four point three percent from three and UK's opponents you're shooting thirty nine percent from three.

So that's a huge margin right there.

You reference Indiana's desire to get up and shoot a lot of threes.

Obviously, Wilkerson coming off a game where he was I think ten to fifteen from three against Penn State.

So those numbers right there should be, you know, having Mark Pope sweat bullets currently.

Right There's been a lot of defensive issues with this Kentucky team.

The latest ones that Pope's had gripes with have been just their kind of one two in passing lanes, their help defense, their gap defense, their ball screen defense, which was a major theme and a major reason why the defense was so bad for most of Pope's first season last year has come back up again and been a constant negative for this team this year.

Ball Screen defense is obviously a major key to three point defense as well.

Right so, based on the numbers, based on what we've seen against high major opponents, Indiana should have its chances this game to get the three pointers off in theory to make them at a high clip.

You know, again, this will be a major stress test for Kentucky's ball screen defense.

Again, a lat of that maybe you can trace back to Jalen Low being out, not maybe for his defense specifically.

You know, he's not quite the Lamont Butler type player they had last year, but the way that's changed, the rotations, the pairings, having guys kind of play a bit out of position.

So good news for who's your fans on that front.

It seems like the opportunity is right there for your Indiana to at least have the success from three point range that the North Carolinas, the Michigan States, the Gonzagas of the world certainly did enjoy as well.

You know, obviously Kentucky will try and make strides in that regard.

You know, we'll see again.

I mentioned Jashper Johnson earlier.

He's a real skinny guard six five point eighty, but he does have some length, you know, ways a physical player.

Aberdeen can be a physical player.

Colin Chandler, maybe alongside Moreno has been another one of the benefits in year two under Pope, and he's come along offensively, but he's still trying to find his way defensively.

So all that to say that Indiana, as a team that likes to shoot the three and likes to shoot a lot of the three, has to be looking at those three point shooting splits for Kentucky this year and really liking their chances of at least playing the style of game that they want to play at Reparina.

Well, Cameron, thanks for the time.

Always good to catch up with a inside the Hall alum.

Do it from time to time here on the show because so many of you guys have gone on to have great careers in sports media.

Love to see your success.

We do check in from time to time you me and Dylan on text and follow your work as closely as I can from afar, even though I'm not obviously locked into reading things about Kentucky at this point, but congrats on your success there and thanks for making the time to come on the show today, of.

Course, and if I could take a moment to thank you for everything that you've done for again all the student interns and writers that you've had down the years that inside the hall, you know, we were talking off there.

It's funny like so many people, you know.

Again, I lived with Dylan for a year and me and him are still good friends.

I was a groomsman in his wedding.

But even some of the older guys as well, the Ben Ladner's of the world, where I'm still really good friends with the seth Tows.

You know, every now and again I'll see a Josh Margolis tweet.

You know, I think he was on the field after I you beat Oregon, and that always gets me a good chuckle.

You know, only one of one Margolis is, but you know, just a tremendous opportunity that you gave all of us that helped obviously launch so many people's like legitimate careers as a professional salary with healthcare sports reporter.

So we can't thank you enough.

On our end field, well, I usually don't do too much but provide the platform.

You guys do all the hard work and it's it's a lot of fun.

And I mean you and you and Dylan were early adopters of Tyler Tashman, right, I mean you you bought you had the first stock in him.

And look at Tyler, I like to give him a hard time, but he's gone on to do great things covering Iowa now And it's just a lot of some of my closest friends, I mean are people that wrote Friends with the whole before your time that I still keep in touch with, and still keep in touch with Tyler pretty often too.

So just it's a lot of fun.

I think what we're able to do, you know, with obviously me not living in Bloomington, it's a great opportunity for kind of students to kind of take the reins on the day to day on the ground coverage, get to travel to games, get to do different things.

I mean, we've had a great experience this year with covering football for the first time.

Josh pos has really kind of taken that opportunity and run with it.

And obviously it's not going to be a thirteen and o season for every student that comes in the future to cover IWU football will see how it continues to go in the future.

But it's been a lot of fun, and yeah, I appreciate you saying that, but you know, it's it's the hard work that all you guys have done, and it's it's rewarding for me to see the success.

I mean, there's others I can name him and Graycie Barrow is doing great work now.

Duram is now doing his thing covering Louisville and on the radio network there.

I mean Matt Press last year now at the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, Will Foley, Kevin Vera.

You know, all these guys are going on to do good things and it's been a lot of fun just to be a part of it and give everyone a platform to do the work.

So I appreciate you saying that.

Thanks everybody as always for listening to the show.

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