We acknowledged the traditional custodians of the land we're recording on today.

Hello, and welcome back to Eat Sleep Repete.

I'm Kellen McCarron and just a reminder, if you love the pod, please share it with your family and friends.

I'm Key Resells and that's right.

Go and recommend us to someone that you know and who you think might need us in their ears.

Listen, there's one thing I don't do, and that's beat around the bush.

Anyway, we've got a pretty jam packed episode today, so let's get straight into it.

Key, You've got a pretty big hitch.

Yeah, Queen, everything's pretty shit.

So basically last week I just reached a bit of a rock bottom for context, guys, Like I haven't really slept for six months, and I have a thing of just being like, yeah, really fucked up stuff's happened, but it'll be okay, or you know, it's gonna get better, and it just hasn't.

I think it was after our last record, cal like I could not remember what we had spoken about.

And another thing that happened is like I was driving to pick up Rue one afternoon and I was on a street with the traffic lights and everything, and I could see this woman walking, I could see the little man, and I could see my light, but for some reason, my brain had switched it and it was like my stop sign was green and her man was red, but it wasn't.

And I just thought I should not be driving.

I've had zero sleep.

Oh okay, let's not admit to a felony on an air did run over someone?

No, I didn't run over anyone, but we did that thing you know when you dance with someone when you accidentally go like, oh sorry, sorry, sorry, and you kind of do a little bit of a dance on the street.

Like she was like should I be walking?

And I was like should I be driving?

And we're both kind of like she was obviously in the right because she'd probably had a full night's sleep for the past six months.

But there were things that were happening that was very clear that my sleep deprivation had reached kind of a new level, and I just really had kind of gone to a bit of a dark place with it all.

A lot of shit is listening who have experienced it when them had sleepers that are a bit tricky.

I just got to a point where I was like I can't imagine her ever sleeping properly.

I felt like I didn't have a lot of options, and I had to really have a serious think about what is in my control and what can I do to alleviate some of the pressure that I'm feeling, and what it ultimately came down to was working.

Unfortunately, I can't do it all.

I tried to trick myself that I could, so I spoke to Kelly, and I also spoke to Lucy, my other business partner on my other podcast, I'm working out, and just let them know that I would be really appreciative of taking a little bit of time off nearing the end of the year.

So it felt less of I'm leaving everyone high and dry and more of like, can we make this work.

It's only a few months, and both of you were really receptive to that, which is great.

So we don't have an update on who the host will be for the next couple of months or so.

We're still working on that, so I will be staying on the pod until we figure that out.

So we'll update you obviously as soon as we know, And if you have any suggestions of any creators who you follow that are Sydney based then let us know.

But for now you'll just have to listen to me and watch the videos where I'm disheveled in a T shirt of worm for a couple of days like today.

Okay, so my peak for this week.

You may hear that I'm a little bit lasher in my voice, and that's because obviously talking to Kell and Lucy and getting a plan in place that has relieved some of the stress that I had.

But our apartment's very tiny and it's very depressing.

So our lovely friends were going on holiday and they actually reached out to us and said, hey, would you mind house sitting for us for the next four weeks while we're away.

So we moved into their house on the weekend.

It's just been lovely.

It's been lovely being in a house with two kids.

Rue can like play independently at the front room, like while I'm cooking dinner in the back with souks, and she's not under my feet and I'm not getting annoyed, and I don't know, she's just less annoying and I'm less grumpy.

I think it's a crux of it.

Space is magic, isn't it.

I think I underestimated how much of a difference it would make, and even being in someone else's space, Like initially when they asked us, I was like, I always just feel bad imposing on people.

But I'm so glad that I got over that because it's nice, like they can be on holiday and know that their house is being looked after, and we can, you know, look after their house and enjoy the space.

So yeah, it's been lovely.

And it's just lovely to be in a big kitchen and be able to all sit at a dining table and eat dinner together.

And you know, I've been doing loads of washing every day.

It's just I can actually have room to think and move and suddenly I don't feel like everything's on top of me.

So just a couple of small changes has made a big difference.

And I've also started sleep training, so that's I guess sorry little peak two point zero Suki, which has had a massive effect on her day sleep.

So I don't have a baby attached to me, which is something very rare, So she's sleeping independently in her cot.

She's probably gonna wake up now I've said that, but I'm feeling a lot more positive which is lovely.

After rock Bottom, I joked that you can only go up from rock bottom.

So here we are, this is the up.

It is true, there's only there's only one direction that you can go.

The only way is up.

What are your chicken pits for this week?

So last weekend, me and my sister took my mum for Mother's Day.

So we booked it a long time ago to go to the Blue Mountains with the kids for a weekend and just do like wholesome shit with them.

I don't know why.

We just thought it would be cute.

Upon reflection, like why would we not do it without the kids or why, you know, I just I don't really know what the point was.

And we also got catfished a little bit by the airbnb.

It was one of those situations where it was just a very small space for six people to be in, including three children, and there was no doors.

So I'm not even going to get into the logistics of the space that we had for the weekend, but I was a little bit on edge from the weekend.

Had a lovely time, created some hilarious memories, but I wouldn't say it was an enjoyable time.

I would say it was quite stressful, and I was very overstimulated.

And it was the weekend after Key had messaged me about stuff that was going on with her anyway, So I was just feeling like a little bit stressed on this drive.

And as I've mentioned before, Lenny winges a lot, and it really really really grinds me.

So we're driving along and he'd sort of been pushing my buttons all weekend.

I'm feeling at the end of my rope stress wise, like I'm just you know, when you're just like, oh my god, I'm about to snap.

And he just keeps going and then he's like, oh sick, I'm sick, and he wouldn't stop, and I pulled over on the side of the freeway and I just screamed at the top of my lungs, shut the fuck up, like at the top of my lungs.

Yes.

I know.

I'm going to get hate for admitting that, because I've probably traumatized him.

We stayed on the side of the road for quite sometime until we both come to down and then we sort of made friends again, and I think I profited a snack at him, and then we went along our merry little way, but Yeah, that wasn't my finest moment, and I think that I will live with the guilt of that for quite some time.

Anyway, my peak was that, I mean, it's just so silly, but I'm just so proud of myself that I got my veins removed.

And long term shitters will know I faint at procedures.

I had a panic attack so bad last year that in a procedure Keith thought I was a little bit crazy for trying to do it by myself.

I did, given that everything that has happened last time, this is so bad to admit as well.

I wasn't even vaccinated this year because I didn't want to get that stupid needle.

Like, I am just so proud of myself for getting it done, and I put a plan in place, and like I proved it to.

Myself that I could do it.

I called Keith straightaway after it.

I was like, guess what, I just did it.

I really didn't think you were going to get it done.

I know, I knew that you were doubting me, and I was doubting myself, but I did it so very proud of my Yeah.

Yes, girl, I love that.

All right, Well, let's get into today's episode.

So as always, once a month we get pretty rogue and give you unhinged advice with our monthly drunk Aunt episode, except neither of us are drunk, so no, we need to change that, but anyway, I'll kick it off.

Question one, what's a small everyday ritual in your family life that feels ordinary now, but that you hope your kids will remember forever?

Full disclosure.

I actually tried to do peek and pit with rub but she didn't get it, so eventually we will do peek and pit.

I think when she's a bit older around the dinner table each night.

I love that.

So that's one that I'm like, have banked that we're gonna do later.

But one little thing I do with her now, just because she's so little, it's hard for her to like obviously grasp big concepts.

But when I pick her up from daycare, I say to her, do you want to talk or do you want to listen to music today?

And this came about because I saw something on Instagram that basically said, your childhood has had to sit.

And we've talked about this before.

They've had to go to daycare and they've had to be told what to do all day and they've had to listen, and because they're not with you, you know, they're on their very best behavior and they haven't had any say in what they do that day.

So the first thing that when they get into your car and then you kind of it happened, actually happened to me the other day.

I was like, to her, let's put Frozen on.

She was like, I don't want to listen to Frozen.

I want to listen to Frozen when we get home.

And I was like so confused by that.

But I saw this thing and it was like, they will start to test you because they haven't had any control over themselves all day.

So something that you can do is when they get into the car, give them their first choice for the day or you know that they've had in a few hours for them to control what is going on in their life.

So I've started doing it with her every day, like do you want to talk?

Do you want to listen to music?

And she'll choose either one and then I'll just go off that so I'll drive home is whatever she wants to do, and that has kind of been easing the pain of me then giving her a lot of instruction obviously with dinner time, bathtime, all of that routine.

Then I go straight into telling her what she has to do.

So just her having a little bit of ownership and control around that part of her night.

I really like that idea of her remembering, you know, and then she's going to start to save things to talk to me about in the car, or she's gonna they would have sung a song at school that day, and she's like, I want to listen to this song.

Half the time, I have no idea what the song is, but I do my best to find it on Apple Music or something similar, like a you know, Unicorn song or something like that.

The other thing that we do now this is more of a Charlie thing, but he does mornings, so he'll take the two girls and he puts music on and he'll do drum and bass because that's his favorite.

So Rue in the morning knows that she listens to daddy's music and they just have like a little rave downstairs.

So I think she will remember that forever.

That is so cute.

Yeah, they're both so special.

And because I was putting this together, I thought, goodness, me, I'm feeling like the shittiest mum at the moment.

And I'm sure that there are little things that I do, but I was like, oh god.

Nothing I do is magical.

And so when Lenny walked through the door last night, I put on a song because I was like, it'd be really cute if when he walks in, I'm dancing like and excited to see him.

Yeah, but he goes, he.

Goes, oh no, turn that off and burst into tears.

Oh like, oh right, So that's what I get for trying to create a magical moment.

So I think I know one that you do when you guys do like your girl dinners.

I think he'll remember that because, like one of my friends said, one of her favorite memories from being a kid is when they would have like toast dinner, but she called it something funnier, like obviously her parents like when they just gonna be they're doing dinner, They'll be like, let's have toast and you can choose any spread you want, and she was like, we loved it.

And she does it with her son now and he loves it too.

And it reminded me about when you do your like girl dinner or your platters and you cut everything up, like he's gonna remember that later as being something like a special thing that mum did for dinner, you know, like it doesn't have to be magical.

I know, I guess maybe I'm thinking of something that's like an every day or most days thing.

Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean.

I know, but it's never too late to start.

I've only just started doing the post daycare thing.

So we'll ask the shit is and then maybe we can adopt one of theirs.

All right.

Question number two, This one's provy.

A while ago, you did a live sex therapy session on the pod.

Hasn't made any difference.

Can you give us an update on sex life?

If not too pervy?

A question.

I have a one point five year old and it's still dire.

Okay, update us first, my update on my sex life.

Ah, it's nonexistent.

She's entered tumbleweed territory with me.

I have I have.

Look, I've been definitely feeling like I would like to, but oh but I also don't want to, if that makes sense.

Like I'm feeling, you know, I'm feeling the attraction.

You know, he can look at me a certain way and I'm just like, Nope, don't you look at me like that.

But I'm also just not I'm still so milky, and.

You haven't slept for six months, so yeah.

It's not really the vibe.

So at the moment, I'm just you know that will come, That will come.

I mean, look, it's his birthday on Friday, and you never know, you might get a little birthday quickie.

What about you?

You guys have been you guys have been vibeing lately?

I think Nah.

The other day I called him a predator.

He pissed me off so much he entered the garage.

Call him a predator.

He entered the garage with his pants off and a boner.

Oh, and I was like, I was in the middle of work.

Imagine if I'd been on a call with you or a meeting or something.

I was like, you are disgusting.

That is so inappropriate.

Just because you don't have a job that you're passionate about doesn't mean that I don't do.

Not interrupt me like that again.

I was so cranky.

Listen, I did this live sex therapy session.

Did I ever do my homework?

No?

I did not, Because.

About a week and a half after I recorded that episode, that's when my nanny decided to make a little dance at the pearly gates, and then I spent the next.

Two months forcing the poor woman to stay alive.

And I just have never like done it, like, of course we do it every now and then, but I would say that I still am kind of just literally throwing him a bone when I musked, because I feel like I should, rather than ever wanting to myself.

I think it's really normal.

I think it's in this phase of our lives.

Like obviously there are outliers and everything like that, but there's also just like a lot of stress and lives, and stress has like the biggest effect on libido as well.

So exactly, just be kind to yourselves.

If you're not doing it, don't be stressing.

Your time will come.

Don't stress to yourself.

Like I completely agree, it's a season.

And although maybe the sex therapists do say that it's not that healthy for us, like we need it for our health, I'm sure that they're right.

But you know what else is healthy.

Green juice, meditation, journaling, and I ain't doing any of that shit either, So just give.

Yourself a little bit of grace.

And also I would say that I talk to a lot of women, and I have like all of my friendships are very TMI oversharing relationships.

Ninety five percent of people are not having swinging from the chandeliers sex.

Like Unfortunately, I've reached an age bracket or a life stage where we're all cliches.

We are, we are, We'll get that.

Oh I'm too doyed.

Yeah, we'll get there.

I reckon it's coming in our forties, carrious.

I reckon, we are going to be so absolute sexual deviance in our forties.

Three years and then I'll be I'll be a little predator myself, if you will.

A female equivalent.

No, there's no female equivalent because both we just go.

If they reacted saying yuck to us, oh, well, that'd be grounds for divorce.

Yeah, exactly, Yeah yuck.

That would be so sad.

Sorry, but you don't come at me when I'm in the middle of like working with a boner.

That is actually, to be honest, I think that'd be quite funny, And I reckon I probably would have done it, just because, like, you know.

I get what you mean, and like maybe if I was like in a really funny mood and we'd been joking all day, but he'd already asked me three times anyway, so I was just in a bad mood.

That's why a giant schlong waving at me.

Just oh, keyword, they're being giant.

Okay.

Question three, Oh, don't let him hear that.

My partner has started vaping and I hate it.

When we started didting years ago, he smoked and I said it was a deal breaker, so he quit.

But he thinks vaping is different to smoking, and I disagree.

This is so crazy.

I just actually had this conversation with two girlfriends the other day.

So she was going out on a date and she's so funny.

She was like, had scold through all of his Instagram photos and been like trying to basically find all the things that were wrong with him, and she's like, I found one photo of him holding a vape and I was like, Okay, well, let's not get ahead of ourselves here.

We don't know.

Maybe it wasn't a bape, maybe it was something else.

But we got into the conversation about this, and I think vaping is worse than smoking.

The only difference is you look like an absolute loser vasy, because why are you sucking out of a giant USB.

I know that you're not allowed to say it, but I'll say it.

Some people are kind.

Of hot having a smoke on a cigarette.

I get it, Like it's kind of sexy, but like, don't do it boys and girls, because obviously it kills you.

But I get the sexuality of that.

I do think that your partner, if you are looking to create a life together, I do think your partner has a responsibility to keep themselves like healthy, especially if you're gonna think about, you know, buying a house together or maybe having kids together, Like you're investing in this relationship for the long term, I'm guessing, so they shouldn't be doing things that are gone to shorten their life, Like that's not fair to you.

And I just think it's gross, Like I don't care if you vape over smoking, Like all of it's gross.

Just because it doesn't stick to clothing doesn't make it any better.

And it's not even that regulated.

There are gross stuff in it, heated plastics, smoking out or something that's like heated that's got microplastics written all over it.

What are you gonna do?

Smoke cardible glass, smoke out of a glass pape I think that's called a bong.

Yeah, even more alarming.

Really, I agree with you, but I also so think that everyone deserves to have autonomy over their own decisions.

But if they originally quit and morally ethically whatever the reasons are, that you don't agree with it and you don't want them to do it, like for some people, it is a deal breaker.

So I think that as long as you're clear, but like, lol, just tell them they're being a loser.

It's absolutely no different.

But I don't think that you can tell them what to do.

I actually do think that you can when it comes to like a health thing like that.

What if Charlie was like, I don't like that.

I don't know what's something you do that's unhealthy?

I know that there would be something like, yeah.

If I drink too much and he said, hey, you drink too much, I don't want you to drink same thing.

Okay, Luke makes a lot of comments about the amount of sugar that I eat.

How would you feel if I told you that Luke actually said to me, Hey, I really think that you need to cut back on sugar.

Well, I've seen how much sugar you eat, and I agree.

Oh my God, But then that is coming from a fellow sugar addict, like I too think that I shouldn't need as much sugar, and I'm gonna you and.

Charlie can't even have it in the house.

At least I can have it in the house.

No way, I wouldn't want it in the house.

Have to eat it, then, wouldn't I.

I get what you're saying.

I know this will probably cause a bit of a debate with people listening, but I do think when you are going to share your life with someone and they're doing something that everyone knows kills you, why can't you have some kind of say in that?

And then if you get sick, who's looking after you?

I'm looking after you because I've made that commitment to you, So.

Yeah, I've got to pick up the pieces.

And if there's kids involved, I've got to look after the kids.

Because you wanted to suckle on your grape usb so much exactly.

I think obviously it's we never want to tell our partners what to do.

But I do think when it comes down to something like that, you can have a little bit of a say in it, and they should want to, like, haven't they seen those fucking adverts.

Geez, they're terrible's time.

My son is three, and I feel like I'm relying on a little bit too much atm because the tantrums are slowly killing me and I need to get work done, housework.

We don't have much help.

He's at school two days.

Any tips to cut it down get through the shit three majors stage?

Then another question that I've combined our three enagors centers a test.

How do you handle the meltdowns?

Oh yea yai.

Look when it comes to the TV, I find that the more television room watches, the rattier she gets.

So we have a hard rule of no TV during the week and only TV on weekends.

I understand that if your kid's only in school two days a week, what hell are you meant to do for the other three days.

We have started playing stories for her, so Julian Donaldson, actually this is one of my followers, told me about this the other day.

Julia Donaldson on Spotify reads all of her books, So Snail in the Whale Room on a broom zog.

She reads all of them and you can put them on and play them.

So that's something that we've been doing to kind of change it up.

Floor puzzles, just things that take a bit of time, but maybe like not having the TV on for like more than an hour at a time if you need to get work done, I understand, like an hour is you need about an hour to kind of get into a rhythm and get something done.

But breaking it up, so maybe it's like an hour of TV.

Then you guys do something together, maybe go for a walk or just hang out together, and you do a puzzle with them, but try doing it in increments rather than like having them sit and watch TV, you know, for hour upon hour, and maybe that will help.

Basically you get stuff done, then be entertained, and then you can also enjoy some of the time together.

Yeah, those are all really great suggestions.

And there's also this thing.

I recently wrote an article about it, so I was sent one to trial.

It's called a leap move.

But it's not that expensive.

Remember how like I don't know if they still exist, but there's like Wheat and Nintendo Wheeze and things that they're interactive with the TV.

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's kind of like that, but it's much more affordable.

I think it's one hundred and twenty dollars.

You could put this on your list for maybe the kid's birthday or something.

It is still on the screen, but it's interactive and they're counting and they're exercising and they're it's cool.

I'm getting my niece and nephew on for Christmas because Lenn loves his.

I also just want to add a different perspective because I think what you said is great, but sometimes you just like it's so hard.

And I know that.

A lot of kids really really love the TV, and as someone that wasn't allowed to watch TV at school while I was at school, I think that there's always sometimes you've just got to do what you can do to get through the day and survive.

So at this age, if that does involve a bit more TV, then you'd ideally like, long term, try not to beat yourself up about it too much.

When I was a little kid, Mum said this.

She taught me from a very young age because my mum's exactly like me.

She hates getting up in the morning, so I would be really young and just go and put the TV on.

So I obviously was watching a fair bit of TV when I was really little.

I don't remember any of that though.

What I do remember is from five to eighteen, when I was at school, I was not allowed to watch TV during the week at all.

But then I was obviously very busy with school and with extracurricular activities and with homework and all of that sort of thing, so it was probably a lot easier to manage, yeah, getting things done.

So it's not forever.

It's not like, oh, my three year od's going to be watching hours and hours of TV for the rest of their life.

So just try not to beat yourself up about it too much.

And with the question about the threeen Ager in terms of tantrums, please go listen to our episode with gen which we recently did the Oracle.

We'll link it in the show notes because she's so good.

However, even after speaking to her, there was a Friday a couple of weeks ago where I actually sent Luca text saying that I think Lenny was put on this earth to torture me slowly because of the constant winging in tantrums all day.

So yeah, three ages, it is a completely different beast to the Terrible twos with the tantrums, because they know how to push your buttons better, and it's just about absolutely everything I've found.

I've had a lot of success lately.

And when I say lately in the past week, maybe there are good weeks and there are bad weeks with my three and agers.

But I think that what I've been finding is that I disengage a lot.

Like I know that sounds bad, but instead of like letting it kind of get a rise out of me, I've just kind of taken to it.

Sounds like, you're really sad.

Do you want to let me know when you're happy again?

And then we can hang out.

And then what I did was like I put music on it, and I was like overly happy.

And then half an hour later she was like, hey, mom, I'm happy now.

And I'm like, oh my god, you're happy.

Yes, I've been waiting for you to be happy again.

Okay, come, let's be happy together.

And she has the biggest grin.

So, like, what I'm finding with her is that I think I'm really like, oh'll just get on with that kind of thing, which is not always the best way to be, but kind of not indulging her, but like letting her have that moment to sit with her feelings and then modeling the behavior that I want her to do.

So like yesterday at dinner, she was just not listening to anything, and I just said to her, hey, you've really hurt mummy's feelings because you're not listening.

So I'm actually not going to talk to you for a bit, okay, And so she was being like mummy, mummy, mummy, and I was like, just not talking to her at all.

I like round the bath for her, and I put her in the bath.

This is just all me music and her being like mommy, mommy, mommy, me.

And then eventually goes, Mummy, I'm sorry, I wasn't listening, and I said it's not nice when people don't listen to you, is it, And she goes, yeah, I don't like it.

So I'm finding that there are ways to do it that I don't know, like just not letting it piss me off.

But like I was at a fucking ten last night when she wasn't she was like not listening, just being we're all raady, you know, just before they're getting into bath time and stuff, and I just found like me giving in the silent treatment.

Like in my head, I was like, is this fucked up?

Or like is this okay to do?

But it got the desired outcome, and then it also taught her a lesson like it's not nice to ignore.

So keep trying to try different and you'll see.

Yeah, different things resonate with them at different times, like their brain is constantly evolving, so something you tried a month ago might not work anymore.

Like I'm finding that bribery doesn't work because now she's smart and knows that.

I never give her the stuff hardly, like when I try or like that, I'll give it to.

All I through key resells.

I don't have to done with that.

I like need to fix in the moment, and then I'm forgetting about it later.

Half the time I do, I give her a chocolate muffin.

But like the thing about it is that she knows or she just doesn't really care, like she wants the rise in the moment.

So now I'm trying to model the behavior that I want her to give me in trickier ways.

So I just have to be a bit more crafty, which you know, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

So yes, they are sent to test us, and let me tell you, just to make you feel better as well, no, absolutely, no judgment on the television.

But on Friday, when I have both kids, the television is on all day, so there you go.

Key, Oh, it's very spicy.

This is I've never thought to ask you this.

This is so interesting.

How are you planning on talking to the girls about your mother?

This is something I am struggling with as I too have an estranged parent.

Yeah, look, it's really interesting.

I have thought about this a lot.

They will obviously be curious.

It will evolve how I talk to them.

I think if I'm talking about like toddler's school, primary school age, I think that maybe I would say that I do have a mummy and a daddy, but like that, not all mummies and daddies were meant to be mummies and daddies.

And it's hard because my grandparents aren't here to be like this is who mummy grew up with.

So it's also like teaching them about them as well.

But I think I will will say, like, you know, when mummy was little, she lived with her nana and granddad, so you know how you have pop.

Yeah, my pop and my nana they were my mummy and daddy, and my mummy was not there or something I don't know.

But then when they're in teenage years, I think I will be really open with them about it.

I'll just explain to them, like I'll like be like, this is what my childhood was like, and I really struggled as a teenager, I really struggled into my twenties.

And so be grate for you little shits.

Yeah, exactly, because I also want to tie that in with the relationship that I will have with them, Like I really want them to be honest with me, be open with me, like I want to know what they're getting up to without judgment, without fear, Like I want to be an active part of their lives.

And I will explain to them why that's so important to me, you know, like I want to be that because I didn't have that obviously.

It's how much they will actually give me, which is the other kind of piece to the puzzle.

But I think that I won't shy away from giving them the nitty and gritty when they're teenagers.

But I think when they're asking as like littles, I'll just kind of explain that not all people who have babies end up being around or something like I don't even know I'm kind of struggling with it now, but I think in the moment, hopefully I'll find the words.

But that is the general vibe that I'm thinking.

If anyone has any suggestions.

Well, seriously, there's probably someone that has been through this exact thing with having to and they might have the perfect response.

So please, yeah, let us know.

Yeah, because it is something that happens more than some people think, and it is a conversation that needs to be had.

I think often when the kids a little you can give them very simple answers and they're just like, oh, okay, they don't need a lot of context exactly.

So I think with this it's just like finding that perfect kind of line that is just like, oh, mummy hasn't seen her mummy in a very long time, my mummy lives away and I haven't seen her in a very long time, or mummy doesn't talk to her mummy.

I'm just gonna have to work on what that kind of one line, simplistic answer will be.

But that's my general vibe.

Sorry, I don't know if I've answered the question well enough of our shitter, but maybe it'll give you some ideas.

Exactly how did you both know that you wanted kids, Kelly, what made you stop at one?

And Key?

What made you want to you go first?

I've just gasbaged forever.

So I always knew that I wanted kids, and I always assumed that I would probably have more than one.

But I never expected it to be as hard as it is, which is effectively the reason why I've stopped it one.

And in terms of timing, it was the middle of COVID, not the middle of COVID.

We've been through one year of COVID, and Luke and I were kind of like, oh, we've got nothing else to do.

We were going to delay for a few years, but we had nothing else to do, so thought, well, let's just do it now.

That's long story short.

I did not then fall pregnant the next day and whatnot, but that's long story short.

Yes, yes, mine was.

I worked with a girl.

Her name's Hannah.

Actually I think she listens.

I actually asked her this question because I was still ish, not ish on the fence, but I was like, how do you know, like when the right time is?

And she said something along the lines of I couldn't imagine a life without them, like that's how I knew that I wanted them, and I got to a point where I think, like I was just a bit bored of life, Like I just thought like something's missing, something is missing from my life, and that is another little person, Like we would be together and it would be great.

But I was like, gee, it'd be nice if we had another little person here and our family was bigger.

So and I guess the other part to that was also meeting Charlie, because prior to meeting Charlie, I dated someone for like ten years and he never wanted kids, and I kind of didn't think I wanted kids either, But after I met Charlie, I very much was like, yeah, I want to have kids with this dude.

So I think it was a combination of those two.

And how did I know that I wanted two or more than one.

I was an only child and I just always I mean, I wanted four, but I've had two, and I'm like, Jesus, hey, you never did that.

When you're out of the trenches, you might maybe maybe I'll never say ever, but yeah, I just thought, like if my kids hate me, at least they'll have each other, because that's what I always wanted, Like I always wanted to just to be like how cooked is mum, you know, to be in it together with them.

So I thought, like, I'll do my best, but I've given them a sibling that hopefully they will get along with.

No guarantees obviously, but like they're in it together and they they've got each other.

Hey, I think you're going to be able to relate to this one.

So my baby is six months old and still waking three to five times per night.

I'm thinking of sleep training, but feel guilty.

Oh look, I'm about four days into sleep training and I get.

What having a slenby for two nights, So I don't think it's going that well, is it?

No, it is going well.

Like her naps during the day, I've gotten so much better, Like she hasn't contact mapped now and like that whole time.

We're getting a little stretch that we didn't get before.

But they say that you have to get the day sleep good and consistent for about two weeks before you see any impact on nighttime sleeps.

Also, I think sleep training isn't the right word, Like following a sleep guide can be a more gentle approach to things, like I'm not letting Suki cry it out or anything like that.

I'm like in there patting her and I'm with her until she falls asleep.

So although I'm not letting her, you know, have the full comfort that she wants to use me as a dummy and contact map sleep all the time.

I'm there with her to show her how to sleep and that it's okay to sleep and be you know, a person that is separate from me.

And I think in the long run, it's going to make you a better mum because you're going to be clearer and well rested and start to enjoy things a little bit more too.

So look, it takes a while though, it's never going to be overnight.

And also look into resources.

So I've actually booked a mothercraft nurse to start in a couple of weeks and she will be basically teaching me how to get Suki in a good place, but also how to put two kids down at the same time.

She's like, I've got a lot of techniques, so that too.

So I think think just being open to different resources and things that you can find on the internet.

So I will share how my mothercraft journey goes.

Just straight away talking to someone that validated everything that I was saying, but also saying like we can make it better felt really good as well.

So I think the guilt will fall away once you have a plan and place and that you start to see things change, because then you start to feel like so much better about everything else as well.

I think that sleep deprivation is torture, and the longer it goes on for the worse you feel, as Key can very much so vouch for.

At the moment, when Lenny was seven months old, I paid for someone to sleep train him because I was nowhere near in any sort of a headspace or mental capacity to do it myself, and it is the best money I've ever spent.

Exactly like Key said, you're not just leaving them.

There was a bit of crying.

Actually there was a lot of crying, but I still don't regret any of it, and I would do it with another baby in a heartbeat.

I actually offered to.

Do it four Key if she was unable to do it, because it is quite hard to do it yourself, I think, but there are so many different ways to do it, and it's magic.

Like I completely understand why some people don't want to do it, but then probably just stop winging then though if you don't want to do it, but then you also don't want to do anything about the sleep deprivation.

I do think that some people have really warped perception of what is normal though, and the whole idea of that baby should be sleeping through the night listen, that's another discussion, but it is a little bit ridiculous.

Like I even say that now as someone who I'm an adult and I wake up through the night, I yes, I put myself back to sleep, and Lenny, if he wakes up, will generally put himself back to sleep.

But a baby is.

They don't know how to and they don't know that it's okay, and you know, they might be hungry, they might not have eaten during the day.

So I think it was it two eighteen months then he was still having one to two bottles per night, but apart from that, he was sleeping independently in his own cot so I was very thankful to that.

So I think it's about managing expectations.

But also there's nothing to feel guilty about helping your baby learn how to sleep independently because it is going to benefit both of you long term.

Yeah, definitely.

Oh.

I recently discovered that my partner had been seeing someone during the first ten months of our relationship, adding another layer of complication.

The woman he was seeing has a partner and even got engaged and pregnant during this period.

Should I out them or keep my mouth shut?

What do you mean?

Like, well, I feel like I need more information from this person, like out them as in your partner or out them like the woman.

Do you know what I mean?

I think she means both.

But the only person who owes you anything in the scenario is your partner.

And if you've forgiven your partner and want to stay with your partner, then I think that's your prerogative do whatever makes you happy.

But I don't think that you go and blow up someone else's life.

Oh, absolutely not.

I completely agree.

Unless there's a chance that the baby is your partners that's another layer.

I mean, it's another really deep layer.

That is another really deep, deep layer.

And also how long have you been together?

You know?

Was this a decade ago or was this two years ago?

There are so many layers.

But I agree with key fuck your partner like you definitely out him if he doesn't know that you know, and then you decide how you want to progress, whether or not you want to go to counseling, whether or not you want to break up, or whether or not you want to work your.

Way through it.

But yeah, it's none of your business to involve anyone else and blow up their lives, as good as it would feel in the moment I get wanting to do it, but yeah, don't question ten Kelly ither a three year old and a nine month old, and I'm already thinking about schools, which seems wild.

What are your thoughts on public versus private, in co ed versus same sex.

Oh, this is a good question.

I think it's really based on personal preference.

I think that what informs what I want to do with my kids is because of the experience that I had, and not all experiences obviously at the same I actually don't know what we're going to do for secondary I'll definitely be sending Rue to a co ed public primary school and Suki I always forget about Suki, sorry six.

But for secondary school I probably will send if we can afford it, because obviously it's so different to when we went to school.

But I would want to send them to a private girls school, and that's just based on my experience.

I went to a co ed public secondary school and I didn't have that good an experience, but I loved the experience that I had at my all girls' school.

But I think each to their own.

I think there are some really amazing public and private schools and there are some really shitty public and private schools.

So no answer is better than the other.

I think you have to base it off what's available in your area is what it will probably also come down to.

Because if there's a really good public high school in your area and you don't mind if your kids go co ed, then fantastic, do it.

But if there's nothing in your area and really the only option is to enroll them in a co ed or a same sex private school, then do that.

But try not to get too stressed out about it.

Now.

I know everyone will try and fear amonger you with putting their names on the list, and yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, blah blah blah, But at the end of the day, like you'll be able to get your kid into a school.

I completely get why this question came through, but it's one of those questions that I have.

I mean, I've spoken to you about this before that I have a few friends and they're on the higher end of the income or tax bracket, whatever it's called.

And I swear to God, at least eighty percent of the time, when we're all having lunch or something, someone will bring up you've already got them on the name for this private school.

And I'm just like, this is the most elitist, boring, ridiculous conversation.

And it happens all like too often.

Why why is this a conversation?

And I just want to jump off the harbor and swim far away from it, because I just think that it's so ridiculous that it is something that people talk about.

But also I guess it's important, but whenever people ask me, I'm.

Like, I don't know.

I'll put him next year on the list of the local school, probably the Catholic one, and hope for the best.

I'm not getting him baptized, though, so we'll just have to see.

Yeah.

Yeah, I honestly think it has become another thing that we as parents have to stress out about.

I'm just not going to buy into it anymore.

Like certainly we know now that we're trying to buy a house, like I am thinking of like the different catchments to make you know.

Luckily, you know in the areas that we're looking the public primary schools are all really good.

I will say this is potentially one of those things that in a year someone will play me back this and go, oh, I thought you thought it was really boring and blah blah blah, because I'll be like, oh, anyway, and Len's going to this one and then I've already got his name down at five different high schools.

I'm definitely getting on these conversations like mine usually is though, is like what year are you starting your kids?

I'm just like, when is everyone letting their kids start?

Because I'll just follow the herd, like I do not need to be the leader of that.

So now I know twenty twenty eight we were sending the kids to school.

But I do ask these questions like I've definitely been in these conversations, and obviously it depends on the people who you're having a conversation as to how like wankery the conversation is.

But what it comes down to and what the general thing about this conversation is that everyone just wants to give their kid the best.

I'm looking for some advice about my mum.

She's sixty and has had some cosmetic procedures over the years botox, lip filler, a neck lift, and eyelid surgery, which is all fine and she looks great.

However, it's becoming more frequent and extreme.

She's now on a weight loss medication similar to ozempic and has booked a facelift overseas.

I keep going back and forth between thinking it's her body and her money and feeling really concerned, mainly about the risks of having surgery abroad and how much she's spending when she should probably be focused more on retirement.

The hard part is she doesn't respond well to any kind of concern or constructive feedback.

She gets very defensive or angry.

So I'm unsure of how to approach this.

What would you do in my situation, Kelly.

Well, I'm purely thinking about what would I do in this exact situation, and I think if she's defensive and doesn't really respond well to anything that she would think of as criticism or constructive feedback, I think just don't go there.

At the end of the day, as you said, it is her face, her body, her money and you can't really try to control or police what she does with it.

And of course you have every right to be concerned, but she's her own person at the end of the day, and if she's doing what she wants to and what makes her happy and she's not hurting anyone else, well you sort of just have to let her do it.

I think I completely agree with you.

I think we have to remember that people's parents are from a generation where they were told they weren't small enough, they weren't pretty enough, they weren't you know whatever enough, and they now have the resources and you know, desire to do different things.

So be it.

Like I think, you know, it's easy to judge when we have had I don't know, a different relationship similar in a lot of ways, you know, like if I'm talking about, you know, the ozampic thing.

You know, we've had a few years of body positivity up our sleeves, so we can have a more balanced view of everything.

But they haven't necessarily And I think that everyone's entitled to do what they want to do.

But I think if you're generally worried about like health concerns about the surgery abroad, then definitely sit down and have a conversation with her, just be like, hey, have you done your research?

Find out the name of the doctor, do your own research.

Ye, is there a way that you could go with her?

I know that's obviously means that you've got to take time out of your schedule and everything like that, but maybe just do your due diligence a little bit and make sure that she's done hers and then maybe you'll be like, Okay, this is actually a reputable doctor.

I don't feel as nervous about this, and maybe just saying to her like, have you got a reference pick that you want to take, like just to make sure that what you want to get done is aligned with what the surgeon thinks that you want to get done, Like have you looked at before and after?

Just like ask a few more questions to that, because I think also my concern is with that with anyone from a different generation of like finding something on the internet, like you know how they just don't know when they're getting like.

A TMOU version of something.

Well yeah, or even like they're not really that smart when it comes to scams, but like we can we can see a scam a mile away, so I think like that is where you can just make sure that just help them and make sure that the whatever they're planning to get done is legit.

And maybe there's someone in her life that she would be more receptive to hearing.

Is your dad in the picture.

They do, they have a relationship, so maybe you could speak to your dad about your concerns.

Or if she's got a sister or a best friend, someone that she might be more receptive too.

Like I'm thinking about if I was sixty, if Lenny came to me with concerns and be.

Like you shut up, you little shit.

But if my sister or Ash or someone was like, babe, what are you doing?

Just might be received a bit differently.

Yeah, And I do think that there is space for a conversation around like hey, how much is this all costing?

Like you are so entitled to spend your money on what you want to spend your money on, But I just want to be like, have a frank conversation like when you get older, like obviously superannuation now is such a thing.

Have you got enough saved away?

Because if it comes down, like, we will help you as much as we can, but you know, times are.

Time we're not paying for your nursing home.

If you've also bought yourself a new face.

Yeah, so you just want to be like, I just want to make sure that you know you're making good financial decisions.

Have you thought about this and you know?

Can you do this and still have enough?

So I think all of those conversations are okay conversations to have.

It's just how you approach it and giving lots of caveats before you ask those questions.

Yeah, I want to do an entire episode about this.

My in laws are very overbearing and want to be at my house daily.

This sounds great in theory, but my mother in law undermines me as a parent, and my father in law is rude.

I've tried to set up boundaries whereby they need to text before coming over, and they are very unhappy.

Advice, keep holding those boundaries.

Yeah, and also why are you having to set the boundaries?

Why is your partner their son or daughter not stepping up and making sure that their boundaries are enforced, Like, why do you have to do it when it's their parents?

Totally?

I think that your partner in the scenarios should be also backing you up with this but if they're overbearing in laws, chances are there overbearing parents, and it might take a little bit of time for your partner to kind of learn to stick up for themselves and hold those boundaries on behalf of your family.

But at the end of the day, your happiness, especially in your own home, comes before anything else.

And although it might be awkward, what's more uncomfortable and awkward is having that tension exact continue.

So it might not be an overnight thing, but I think you just always kind of have to hold the line on that stuff.

Like if they come to the house and your first thing you need to say to them is like, I'm just reminding you, like you need to send a text message before you come.

Oh my god, how can you say that though to someone's face.

The thing is is that they are betting on you not saying anything.

This is how people get away with stuff.

They're betting on you not saying anything.

Right, So maybe if you're too scared to say it in the moment, but I think after they leave, send them a text message and say, hey, it was obviously lovely to see you.

But again, just reminding you you need to send a text message before you come.

Over.

It doesn't mean that I'm gonna not welcome you.

So I think it's just constantly reminding them of that and not feeling bad about it, because this is the other thing, right, So much of what we do is because we don't want to feel bad about something.

But also that has a massive impact on your happiness.

So if this is really important you, I think you've just got to try and continue to do it until it actually becomes a learned behavior and they understand.

I also have an idea that I think would be quite effective.

So every time they walk in the door or arrive from now on, I want you to open the door and be like, oh my god, thanks Heavens you're here.

I've got so much I need help with, and start giving them.

Tasks that is actually genius, and.

Make them feel really bad for not help.

Be like, oh my god, thank you so much.

I'm so glad you're here.

The kids are driving mad, whatnot.

I've just got so much to do you.

Can you please go and sort out my linen closet?

It looks like a disaster.

Can you get dinner on?

I need to run to the shops and grab a few things and just make sure that they have tasks every time they come over, and then they I guarantee you they will not come over as often.

Yes, put them to work.

They're not coming over for a hang.

It's time to work, honey.

Recommendations before we wrap up key resells.

Have you got anything?

I don't actually have one yet, but I will.

I think you should go first.

Well, I think of mine.

Okay, So I've got two very quick ones.

My first is, as I mentioned at the top, I was in the Blue Mountains recently.

If you have a vehicle loving child or train specific please like at some point you need to take them to the Blue Mountains because there's this thing called the Zigzag Railway and it's a proper old fashioned steam train.

It's so cool.

It too choos.

I was so jealous when I saw those photos and all the video actually, and it was so cute.

I still remember my first steam train that I went on as a kid.

Yeah, well, I just I wasn't expecting anything from it, but then I was like, this is actually so cool.

It's a proper good choo choo.

And then my other recommendation is I'll find the creator on TikTok because she definitely deserves the recognition.

While back, we were talking about you had a privacy box song or something.

Yes, this is my private square, you can't touch me.

There.

I have another song.

It's more aggressive and it's so fun.

Lenny and I are obsessed with it, so it's kind of similar, I guess.

But ready three two one.

These are my private parts, private parts, private parts.

These are my private parts, and you can't touch them.

If you touch my private parts, private parts, private parts.

If you touch my private parts, I.

Will tell my mother, I will tell my father, I will tell my teacher.

Yes, I've seen this go viral on the internet.

I love it.

Good recommendation.

I love her so much.

And she's like, get them angry, get them seeing this so that they are really singing it that aggressively in real life.

I also saw on I think it was Tiny Heart's education, teach them to swear, saying don't fucking touch me.

Love that.

Kids when they're screaming and an adult's holding them, you're just like, if you're a parent, you're like, yeah, been, we've all been there.

But if you see an adult picking up a kid and they're saying, don't fucking touch me, people are more inclined to stop and be like, hey, is that your kid?

So that was another like that just reminded me of a tip.

So actually, that's my recommendation for this week.

Teach your kids to swear if randoms are taking them.

All right, Well, thank you so much for joining us.

This podcast was produced by us Kiri Cells and Kelly McCarron, with audio production by Maddie's Joannu and Audio Flavor.

Bye Suki Cells, Bye Shitess.

Bye