You're listening to Amma Mia podcast.

Mamma Mere acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on Hello and welcome to mid.

My name is Holly Wainwright and I am mid, midlife, mid family, mid identity crisis.

Friends.

I'm not going on and on today.

You don't need to hear from me who's been dating the same guy for twenty years talking about being out there as a grown up.

If you want to talk about the tedium and comfort of long term love, I'm your girl.

But today's episode is not about that.

It is about the excitement, the fear, the insecurity, and orgasmic joy of mid dating.

And oh my, did you send me some good dilemmas about that?

Clearly I'm no use to you.

When I was last dating, don't you wish your girlfriend.

Was hot like me?

Was on this thing called a radio?

So let's ask the expert.

Back in season one, episode two, Kath who is a writer, a comedian and an all round top chick, was on mid on an episode the one of our most popular ever called the midlife Dating Pool has we in It?

And gosh was she funny about this phase of life?

So when I knew that we needed somebody.

Kath was your gal.

She has written a book called Currently Between Husband about life post divorce.

She's been the host of many podcasts, including one Mere's four five six Club and So I Quit My Day Job, and she is currently between Boyfriends.

Welcome to the dating dilemmas, Kath Mahony, Kath, thank you for being here.

Oh it's just to join a pleasure.

We should remind the listeners that you were on episode.

I believe it was episode two of two.

Ever, I think it's Prenny got good.

It got it very popular that episode.

But that episode got you kicked off one of the famous people dating apps.

Yeah, it did, right, Thanks.

It's like fight Club, Rayer.

Apparently the first really fight club is you don't talk about fight Club and ray felt the same.

I'm very sorry about that.

You could have shot your shot with some very famous people.

James Norton, who I have a crush on.

It is now on RAYA.

If I believe the celebrity goss, I mean, do I he's having a date with Lily Allen and they met on RAYA.

Could have been me.

I'm so sorry.

I'm the reason why.

Anyway, we are today here to talk about our listeners dating lives mid they have some dilemmas for us.

Okay that I think your perspective will be very helpful.

Not maybe, No one not an expert.

Just put it out there.

No one here has any qualifications, so don't take our advice too seriously.

But we have a lot of life experience.

We do, we do, and.

You have a lot of life experience in the dating more recently, yes, in my mids.

How long have you been separated for now.

From my husband?

Ten years?

Ten and a half years, so I mean we're good.

We're on a WhatsApp group chat with the kid and stuff, so yeah, that's all good.

But single for a couple of years now.

I've met someone I was with for about four years and then that all ended.

Learnt the word.

Ghosting, zombieing, and other phrases that you would associate with a horror movie, not with dating, but good content.

I've seen it in a while.

Dating and horror movies have in common.

But we shan't get too negative, says somehope out there for people.

Okay, here is our first question.

Okay, I am recently divorced and I have had what my mates call a relaunch glow up.

I think she's looking hot.

Yeah, I'm just putting a bit more effort into my appearance, I think, and my marriage wasn't happy for the last few years.

So I'm beginning to feel good about myself.

Good for you, We're please suddenly.

My Facebook dms are from more than one old boyfriend, and I mean old boyfriends from before I was mad married, before I had kids.

Some of them are funny and I just left them off.

But one of them, well, he was the one that got away my year twelve formal date.

We were together for a year until he moved away and it fell apart.

He says he's married but not happily, going to leave soon, and he can't stop thinking about me.

Now we've reconnected on Facebook, I think maybe he's the one I should have been with all along.

We've been messaging and now I'm thinking of traveling into state to meet him.

It's all I think about.

But my best friend says it's a huge mistake and that I need to look forward and not back.

What do I do.

That's a tricky one because I'm torn between growing up in the nineties with you know those kind of unrealistic movies that were romantic and you know, there was they'll get back together.

So there's part of me that's like, what if that is?

What if?

What if?

This story is that?

What if?

What if?

He but he also appears to be married?

I know he's also someone else's one at the moment, don't you think so?

Two things?

Yeah, Facebook, like ex is popping up on Facebook is a real thing.

It's hilarious, it is, Yeah, and it can give you lots of like a lot of entertaining, imaginative, you know stories in your head.

Yes, but don't you think that there's also a type of man I may have come across with myself when I was dating in my thirties.

Who is I'm married but I'm about to leave?

Yes?

That is?

Would we call it red flag?

A red flag?

And also bullshit?

Yes?

Do you have you ever heard stories otherwise?

Oh?

Look, one good thing about getting older is I really don't judge anyone, sort of stay in your own lane, don't judge anywine.

I've got friends who've been in similar situations and it's worked out and they've left and then friends and it hasn't kind of gone to plan.

So I'm not sure.

So, As I said, the romantic in.

Me would like to see this work out, the realist in me worries that that's a plane ride, that she's just going to be coming back with a broken heart.

What do you think?

I don't know.

I think one of the things that's so seductive about an ex from your youth someone why I've said this, it's not my idea, but what you're actually thinking about, you know how She says, I can't stop thinking about it.

I bet she can't.

Is the you that you were then, like being in love when you're eighteen or whatever?

They went to the year twelve form altogether if that was a big love in her early adulthood, like it's hard no other like if her recent relationship didn't end happily, you know, her marriage and everything.

Imagining how you felt and that youthful love, and it's like it's so seductive, but it's not real.

You're still you in your forties with your kids and your shit when you go and meet him, and he's going to be.

In his still marriage marriage wind.

May or may not know that.

It's like I think sometimes it's about us yearning for who we were.

Yes, now I agree with that.

I remember it was COVID time when Sally Rooney's normal people, and you know, with the help of a bottle of red wine, I reached out to my like my my first love from them because the whole show took me back.

Because that's what's exactly why that was so seductive.

Nostalgia of the past and first love and what could have been as opposed to what you had left with in the kitchen when you're arguing about your stacking of the dishwasher with your your husband or your wife.

When you reached out to that X was did you talk to him?

Do it?

Was it?

Did it go anywhere?

Or was it just one of those things?

Well, I think the great thing was having had a lot of red wine in Australia contacting somebody who's in England.

Very kind of he wasn't as nostalgic about I was, so luckily it kind of it stayed put.

But yeah, I don't know.

I mean, if she's really keen, I.

Would she should give it a go.

I would I would.

Kind of wait for him to be more unmarried, would be my advice.

And there, but then you've got the whole You've got all of the baggage of a marriage ending.

So I'm just not sure.

What do you think about her best friend who says I need to look forward not back.

Do you think that's true?

I think it's what you said, isn't it a little bit?

Although I've got I've got friends whose parents separated and then eighteen years later got back together.

So again, I buy those books.

I want to watch that.

I want to watch that TV season.

Okay, mate, we think that you should say you might get on that plane when he's left his wife.

Yeah, maybe FaceTime in between.

Yes, I don't know, because he might not even be he might not look like his photos anymore.

That's true.

And then in my and I'm going to say something uncharitable in my experience, when you bump into your past lovers that you're properly older, men tend to go one of two ways around forty five.

It's they either go triathlon way look like they've become a bit obsessed with fitness and health and being young and the good head of hair and stuff.

Or they go to seed.

Yes, and I think that women, and again generalizing massively, we have more ways.

We have more distinctions in the things we do like you know, the gray hair, the whatever, like I don't know whereas it might be a root shock to see in real life.

Anyway, I'm being judgmental.

Let's move on.

This one's about age two though.

I am forty four being on the dating apps for the first time, and I set my age bracket at what I thought was the right level my age and ten years older.

Oh.

The thing is, all these men who have matched with me are old, like old old gray hair, beer bellies, seem to have old man hobbies and interests.

I do not feel old, she says in caps.

I know you don't.

You're not old.

You're forty four.

Yeah.

I've always been a bit judgy about younger men' I'm beginning to see the appeal.

Do I lie about my age?

Go younger?

And do you think that's a waste of my time?

I'm just not ready to date a granddad.

Okay, I apologize for my judgmental comments about what some older men look like, but now I think our listener needs to do yes.

Well, Look, first of all, a lot of chaps, as with the ladies, do lie about their age.

So sometimes when I see when someone who says they're fifty two.

I'm like, what, you're born in nineteen fifty two, So they don't always tell the truth.

Sometimes if photos tell the truth a bit more.

Secondly, I would always like, if she's going her age and ten years up, what about ten years younger?

Would you?

Is that what you think?

You don't like that?

Maybe said it broadly, said it.

Yes, cast you netwide.

I always do ten years younger, ten years older.

I have done twenty years younger of late, but that's for research that's not necessarily.

For all life.

So I would say go younger.

My things when it comes to younger chaps would be well, I guess whether or not she wants someone long term, whether it's a bit of fun, whether it's just sex like whatever.

Because with younger guys, especially if they haven't been married and haven't had children and want that, obviously, being you know, in our mid years, we might not want to do any of that stuff again.

So I think what I would say with the younger chaps is be really clear yourself what you want, because if you want a bit of slap and tickle, well they're definitely probably in better nick than the guy who's born in nineteen fifty two and.

There's a lot of stereotapes about younger men loving older women.

Apparently we're more experienced, and we're wise, and we're more confident.

Like do you and your other mid friends who are dating in that pool?

Is that true?

Do you see?

Is it true that a lot of younger men like older women?

Yes?

I get hit on way more or I get matched or liked way more by younger guys than kind.

Of guys my age.

So it's either much younger chaps or older chaps I seem to hit a mark with.

But there's the pros and cons of dating a younger man.

I suppose you have ecultural references can be really skewed off.

Yeah, I can imagine dirty dancing.

What that's my favorite VHS?

What's a VHS?

So that can make you feel a bit funny?

Okay, you heard it.

Here go ten years younger and ten years older.

On the dating apps After the break, Kat shares advice with a woman whose ex wants her back.

But there's a twist.

Okay, this one.

My ex wants me back, but the sex has been much better without him.

I like this right, Come on.

Hold.

When I got divorced four years ago, I was devastated.

She says, I truly believe my husband is the love of my life.

But after we had kids, life got really difficult for us and we lost sight of each other.

I think it was very, very hard.

But after a couple of years, I started dating other men and I kind of disc my mojo.

Like my husband and I had become more like friends over the years, and then we were in don't fucking touch me enemy territory.

I don't know what you mean.

So I hadn't felt like enjoying sex for a long time, and then I did, Like, really, I've really enjoyed having great sex with some different people, men and women, actually, since my husband and I split.

When I don't have the kids.

Of course, she says, she feels like she has to say that in case we.

Judge it, Darling, No one's judging.

Thing is my ex has started saying he wants me back, and we've been hanging out a bit, and I know I still love him, but I don't want to give up this version of me that feels like, oh, like I've worked out what I want and that sex is a big deal for me.

Quite late, the idea of living without that isn't good.

What do I do?

Ooh, there's a lot to unpack.

There is so for a hack start.

She's I, actually this is around me a bit.

Actually that friends have like a real second window sexual energy.

Did Yeah, because having sex with the same person for a long time is a bit boring someone.

Well, and then you're throwing kids and bodies after having kids and sleepless nights and all of that sort of stuff.

I think too.

I wish i'd known coming into my forties that you can kind of really hate your sexual peak as a woman in your early forties.

And that worked for.

Me because I was not with my husband anymore.

I was enjoying other people.

But I do think we have this second wave.

It's wonderful.

I would probably suggest trying to rekindle things with her husband sexually first, but to be really honest that she's not who she was.

That's interesting because getting back together with him because they've got kids and stuff, that's a big deal anyway, which I'm sure she's thinking about.

But she's obviously thinking about that on emotional level, but the sex part of it, it's almost like she needs to see if this new version of her is still compatible with him.

Yes, so I would be dating my ex husband if I was here, I think, and making it really clear secretly, secretly, yes, like having an affair with your ex husband.

I do not want to do that.

If anyone's listening that I know, bless him.

I think that's great, But she has to very much.

It's all about communication, isn't it, I think, And as we get older and we're more confident with was new sexual paths, it's about owning that and sort of I guess, yeah, being able to convey that with him because he's either going to be along for the ride literally no pun intended, or he's not, or we won't be able to.

Keep up, you know what.

I think.

I think that when people are having really great sex, you can kind of tell, like that there's a crackly energy about you when you're in that stage of a relationship or in that stage of life.

Right, it's the best.

And I reckon the ex husband can probably smell the pair amon, Yeah, I can feel the crackle, right, and he obviously likes it.

Yeah, as we say this, or to it if they get back together.

But maybe he's going to surprise you by who he is too.

I mean, look all I can compare it to is sort of break up sex, getting back together sex.

It can be great on it.

Yeah, it can actually if it, because it can sometimes feel like you've turned the clock back to when you were first.

Yeah, just to make I guess if she feels like she's really made big self discoveries in this.

Look, he's either going to grow with her or he won't.

I would imagine he'll be excited to hear about the women.

Yeah, situation, she's sort of experienced.

But yeah, I think it all comes down to communication and staying who she is now, not reverting to who she might have felt towards the end of the marriage.

Yeah.

And also you'd hope that he's not it's not jealousy there, there's more excitement.

You want to test that too, Yeah, all right, this is an interesting one.

I have a great life on my own, lots of friends, good jobs, some hobbies.

I travel a bit, but living alone is so expensive.

Yeah, and the men I've met since my long term relationship Ben did have any money.

Mate.

I met this really nice guy.

We had a good connection, but he didn't have a good job, and I knew if we got together I would be paying for everything.

Is it really shallow not wanting to shoulder all the financial responsibility and to want to meet a man with some money, or at least with as good a job as mine.

The young me didn't used to think like this, and I worry I've changed.

Of course you've changed, you've grown up.

Is it wrong to be looking for a man with money in middle life?

Oh?

Look, I think you can kind you have both a partner and someone who earns two or I get what she's saying, splitting the bill.

It's just nice to know you can both split the bill as opposed to having to cover it.

I think she's worried that what it says about her.

You know, like we kind of go, oh, I don't care about things like that, And then there's different phrases in your life where you go, no, I do care about I do care about that.

Yeah, I would want to date someone who you know that we can go half.

Yeah, I don't need.

Someone to sort of swoop me off my feet and kind of pay for everything.

But you want to know.

I think that they're sort of equal in that status.

That's just my take.

How do you sniff that out?

For want of a better term, when you're early dating someone who maybe you've met on the apps or whatever.

How do you what are you all like tell tale signs for like, oh, this guy's a bit like you know that the guy is on the place in the place you want him to be with his life.

You know what I mean.

When they come to split the bill and they're like, well, you had a dessert and I do, this will be this, this will be what I'm paying, I think you can kind of work out pretty pretty early on.

But yeah, for me, like financial security is important in a partner because I'm not in a position.

You know, I'm already a solo parent.

And it is freaking expensive.

It's so expensive, so I am and again, when I was younger, I would have no problem if they had no money.

But I think as you get older, you want and you want to be able to have a weekend away.

It doesn't have to be a European holiday, but something that you know that you can both do together equally.

So I don't think it's a bad thing.

Now, that's okay, she says.

Do I want a partner or a provider?

It's not a provider.

You just want some who's on an even keel.

To you that is a partner, yes, yeah, otherwise if you're gay for anything for them exactly, you know, all right, I want to do a few quick fires with you, Kath, because I got so many as you can see, I've got so many dms.

When I ask people for their mid dating dilemmas and there i'd like to they kind of group into themes in a way.

Okay, So quite a few women messaged me and said, what about those of us who've given up dating?

Like it's just too much angst to like we've just done with it?

What about us?

So I want to ask you, have you I know that you've had time on the apps, off the apps, whatever, what do you think, like do you wear you at with your relationship with the dating world.

Well, I'm writing a book, as you know, so I'm sort of trying to focus on that because the thing about apps is they do take so much of your time and you can be emotionally invested.

I mean I can be already married off four voters in a bio, yes, which is just how I am.

I can't help it.

But at the moment I'm off the apps and I'm actually quite enjoying learning how to be around men in the real life and sort of relearning how to flirt and just be so at the moment, I'm off the apps, but I, you know, I like to meet somebody.

Yeah with my lights on.

Do you understand why a lot of women, once they've sort of settled into being alone, if it's post divorce or if it's just they're growing into themselves as they get older, like just go.

You know what, Maybe I don't need all that shit totally.

And I have times where I think that I would say to people, I would make room for the right person, but I don't just want someone so I have someone to watch thee and thirty footoort with.

You know, I kind of want I want.

A life partner, which obviously you have to date many people to find the life partner unless you're in the oldie middle lane.

Yeah, it's tricky.

I get that women.

I get that women wouldn't want to do that, because sometimes I feel like that.

Sometimes I think I really love being diagonal in my big bed, and I really love waking up and being able to pop off and not worry.

My only reason it's lying there.

And I literally my breath at the moment when I wake up kills my hand?

Is this an age thing?

I think?

I think, I don't think I really want to put.

Another humans through this right now?

I do go in peaks and troughs.

And also when it's really hot in Australia, I can't even worse being on top of someone and being with all sweatiness.

And then when it's cold, I'm like, I don't want to be touched to you because it's freezing.

Is there a right time?

Think it's a four week window.

I also reckon that it's the same with young women in lots of ways, depending on how they feel about family.

Is that for a lot of women now it's not we don't need a relationship as in financially necessarily, which was always the deal like previously or generally it was.

And so when you get to actually ask yourself, well what do I want, and maybe you've got some experience of finding out all the things you don't want, then you're also like, maybe I just want to live my life and have my mates around my stuff.

Yeah, yeah, I'm finding love through friendship at the moment, but not in a not in a crossing the boundaries way.

Get it, guys, My age want to date women twenty years younger, leaving me with the crumbs.

There are quite a few in here about age.

Now.

We talked about age in that in adult list of Dilements, but we were talking about younger men.

Is it true that all the men the age our age are interested in young women.

I don't think that's entirely true, because you know if they're in your feed that they're interested in your age bracket, because you can't see them for those that aren't on the apps, they are you appear if you know you're you've both agreed to be in a certain age group.

I don't know.

I think my brother, who.

Is happily married, has a friend who has just come out of his marriage who I've seen a few times at netball and gone hot, and I'm like James, and he's like, I'm not pimp my sister out, And he said he's at a point where he just needs to have sex for a bit with other people because there wasn't a lot going on in the marriage towards name.

So so my brother's like to stay away because he just needs to do that to work through that.

So I do think that's when a lot of guys do potentially go younger.

I think a lot of guys who want to repartner properly often want to want you to be the same.

They want to have similar age kids.

If you've got kids, you know, I think so.

I think it depends who who you're matching with.

And can you pretty quickly tell whether somebody is like you know that?

As we were saying about the guy who may or may not still be married, Yes, when you are an experienced put and who's been through separation, are you're like, oh do your divorce wasn't long enough ago?

This won't be like what's the sweet spot this?

Well, with women it tends to be longer, but I think with guys it's anything anything over twelve months okay, But you've got to get them quick, so don't sort of hang around, dear.

So some listeners want to work up the nerve to get out there after whatever's happened in their personal lives.

This woman is saying, how do I get the confidence together to go on a date.

I haven't been on a date for twenty five years?

Do you have any wisdom about that?

If they're not feeling very you know, they're not vibing, They haven't had their relaunch glow up.

They haven't got their pheromones popping off like the other lady.

What's it like going on your first date.

It's nerve wracking, It's really nerve wracking.

And I think you have to really acknowledge the fact that you're going to feel all the feels.

That's going to be like a mixture between butterflies and wanting to vomit and wanting to cancel.

I suppose my advice would be put something on you feel really comfortable in, not what you think somebody wants to see you.

And also some don't necessarily buy a whole new thing that then you're like, oh, it doesn't cry.

Yes, we're something that you know you feel good in.

Put some great music on, you know, as you sort of getting ready.

If you're a drinker, probably have a couple of or a glass.

Let's not have you like going in sideways on the date.

If you're not a drinker, a meditation or something to just get you on the zone.

And acknowledge the fact that it's it's nerves.

You know, It's not it's like us doing anything we haven't done for a long time.

It's nerves and also the other person potentially is feeling nervous too.

And if you're not mega mega chatty, obviously you and I'd be fine.

Yes, just trying to show mega chatty, and you don't know if the person you're meeting is megach you know, have a think about some topics.

I know it sounds like you're going for an interview, but it slightly is have a few topics that you know that you can talk about or would want to ask, because I do find guys are not necessary and not necessarily the question asking tight.

That's what people say, is they say, often a guy, I won't ask you any questions.

And some of that's nerves or it might be narcissism or what you're working up pretty but go with some questions ready and just except that it's nerves.

But at the end of the night, it might be nerves and a lovely first kiss yeah, or a funny chat to have with your girlfriends the next day over what did or didn't sort of, that's true.

The date doesn't go well if you won't get a good story out of it.

Next, Catherine has some straight talking advice if dating apps make you nervous, If you're feeling stuck or scared to swipe, don't go anywhere?

What about the people who are scared of the apps?

I don't want to go on the apps?

Is a big thing here because a lot of people say when I was single, they weren't around.

Last time I'm dating, lots of people say it was in real life and now I'm scared of the apps?

Does it?

What's your advice for getting on the apps in the first place?

Pull the band aid off, piculane.

You know there's there's different different ones for different ones to different things.

Pick one, because, as I said, they you can waste a lot of time on them.

Pick one.

Sit down with your girlfriend or you know, your best boy mate, whatever it is.

I actually think involving guys is good because I had photos and a boy mate said to me, He's like, it's just of your head.

They don't know that you've got a body or not.

It's like, but they're.

Nice foot and he's like, no, you need some full body shots and you know, not.

In a bikini.

Yea yeah, but like yeah, give.

Some good feedback and also say what you want.

So if you yes, if you just want a bit of fun, say that in your bio.

If you're looking for a committed relationship, say that, you know, I think you're not just saying that to the people on the apps, you're saying that to the universe and kind of things come in a bit more like that.

That's right, So rather than pretending that you only want a bit of fun if you want to, because yeah, one of the women in my DMS is like, how do I use the apps?

I haven't been single since I was seventeen and I'm forty six.

I can see that that would be very intimidated.

So you're like, I feel like I have and how do you do it?

Course, yes, that's one of the things that's.

An revenue stream.

If you've been talking to my accountant.

Is it worth all the effort to be in a relationship?

Again, some of.

The things I don't know.

One on one of my bios, I wrote, I'm just looking for somebody that can change it down, like do up my bracelet and put a bit of fake down on.

My back, because I do have a thing that I missed.

This is what I miss.

I miss.

I do miss holidays.

I think when you're a single person, I just haven't had as many great holidays like.

I've gone back home.

Obviously we're both from the UK, but I do miss that, you know, when you used to go away for the weekend with your partner, Like that sort of stuff I'd love, Or if there's a gallery opening something that I would just like to go with my person.

Yeah, I think it is with it.

I know lots of people who've met beautiful other halfs on the apps.

Yeah, we're leaving on a hopeful note.

Oh here's one that I think is quite pertinent, clashing parenting schedules.

It's hard to build a relationship with little time together.

Is this one of the criteria you've got to put in your apps?

It's like, are our weekends it's going to be the same.

Yeah, you need someone whose weekends are the same, because very often people have got their kids every other weekend or whatever.

Your weekends still all are you?

And also be really upfront.

You know, if you've got kids who are older and you really don't want to be back in the toddler stage with someone, especially when they're not entirely your toddlers, they're sort of someone else's.

Be really clear about what you do and don't want before you go on the apps.

People who have lots of children who are young just go unmatched, because that's not where I'm at now.

I've barely got one half the week.

That's one of my mates.

She says her kids are quite young, like a daughter is still at primary school, and she she wants a guy who's got similar age kids.

I'm like, wouldn't you want them older so that you don't have to and she's like, no, they won't understand my life.

Do you know that's true?

I think that is true, or it's I think it's down to the individual what they want.

But I think these are the things that people don't think about.

Then they get into something a situational ship with someone, and then it is the week on, week off that that drives you mad with that sort of stuff.

I saw someone at a sporting event the other weekend and he's like six years out of the marriage and I hadn't seen him for a while.

He's looking good.

But then I was like, oh, he does this, he does that, he does sports with you know, I just went when would I see him if I did like him?

And I don't even know if he's interested.

But in my head I've gone right through that, like how it would look, and I'm like, I don't think it would look that good.

But he did look good in his shorts, so that's nice.

You know what you're trying.

Cas, Thank you so much for solving all dating dilemmas of the meds for me.

Appreciating I just keep going, Just keep going, Just keep going, friends trucking while it still works.

Thank you for coming back on MID.

I love havn't you here?

Thank you?

It's a pleasure.

If you enjoyed that.

And who doesn't enjoy hanging out with Kath mahoney?

She is the most fun.

If you're wondering, Yes, we are both originally from the North of England and it's why we sound a bit the same.

It's also obviously why she looks great in a red lip, because you know that's I think anyway, if you enjoyed that conversation about dating, We've done loads of them here on MID, and I think you're gonna love them.

One of my favorites is an episode that we did with an amazing American writer called Leslie Morgan.

It's called From No Sex to Best Sex.

At forty nine, and she divorced her husband after he was just a dick no offense, Leslie Morgan's husband, and after they broke up, she went on a mission to date as many men as she could within a year, and she did, and she had the best adventures and the best sex, and she tells us all about it.

Also a great conversation with Julie Cohen, another American writer although she lives in England, about coming out as bisexual in midlife and why it isn't too late to work out what you want and tell the world about it.

And then if you're more data driven and you're looking for something serious, please listen to my episode with Amantha Imba.

She is an amazing psychologist who's all about efficiency and productivity and she took that energy into her quest to find a partner in midlife and went on a lot of first dates and kept some spreadsheets and just got married.

So they go a lot to choose from.

Thank you from being with us on this episode of mid.

If you have a dilemma for us, please feel free to dm us.

We are Mid by Mamma Mia on Instagram and you can send us your dilemmas anytime.

The executive producer of this episode is Niama Brown.

The producer is Charlie Blackman, and we've had audio production from Jacob Brown.

And I'll see you next week.