Andrew Greaves (00:01.397) Hello and welcome to From the Be All End, the Burnley podcast, I'm Andrew Greaves. Alongside me this episode, Paul Woodhouse in Cleveland, Ohio and Chris Borden in Haptan, Lancashire. Lots to talk about. Burnley fell to a one-nil defeat to Latio in their final pre-season warm-up game, but plenty of positives, I think, to be taken from that, which we'll discuss. Woody donned his rather sexy Mark Zuckerberg gimp mask. to experience it in full VR glory. So we'll find out how that went. It'd be interesting to see the viewing figures on that. We'll talk about the new third kit, which was kind of sneaked out almost without much fanfare pre-game and then a little bit after the game. So we'll talk about that. We'll talk about pies, just because we love talking about pies and the overall kind of catering stroke stadium situation. Woody (00:30.059) You Andrew Greaves (00:56.683) from the game against Lazio. And then I thought we'd just end by having a bit of a discussion about personal trainers and this trend that footballers like to spend their summers not getting pissed in Aynapa anymore but going to various warm weather training camps and that's in the news because Preston boss Paul Hegingbotham not best pleased with one of these so-called social media personal trainers because of an injury to one of his players so we'll perhaps round up with a chat about that. And then right at the end, stay tuned, I'm not going to give anything away, we've got a bit of a special announcement as well for all you from the BLN fans. So let's start with Lazio versus Burnley, Burnley versus Lazio. One no defeat, Chris, but up until the wholesale changes, a very, very encouraging performance, would you say? Chris Boden (01:46.562) Yeah, hugely. get you looked very secure at the back. I'm saying we've been sort of, everything's been pointing towards maybe playing a back three over the course of the summer with the arrival of Kyle Walker, et cetera. But yet it's taken, at least publicly, till Saturday for us to see it in the flesh. And if this is the way he's gonna go or if it's just another... card up his sleeve as such then it was encouraging in that sense. Yeah, Ekdal was sort of like the spare man at the back and you're giving his very graceful football adept at bringing the ball out. He was quite comfortable in that respect. He, Steve again, we basically say every time we watch him could play with a bloody cigar on. He's just the most composed. Andrew Greaves (02:43.435) Superb, innit? Chris Boden (02:43.735) cultured, just outstanding. And Carl Walker's in pinging Crossfield balls and, you know, I'll just say to Woody off here, Oliver Son played right wing back. I said, I thought he did all right, but he's got the easiest job in the world because he's got Carl Walker covering for him. There's a right centre back and he's got Hannibal who's covering the bloody... doing the jobs of two or three men with the work rate he put in. The only problem is, actually with a string of chances, it would work three times I think, it was a terrific save. half, I Hannibal thought he'd scored, but again we've got nil. with nil at Stoke and with the sort of travails we had last season, especially in the first half of the season, it's... It is a concern. Andrew Greaves (03:42.665) Yeah, mean, would he, that build up play, probably, you know, B plus, A minus, maybe even an A. Finishing off, final third, C minus should do better, perhaps need to do better. Is it a worry a week out from Spurs? I know we've got Broy at coming and Fleming, I saw Fleming before the game on Harry Potts way. He wasn't limping, but he didn't look, he wasn't walking, he wasn't striding comfortably. Is it a worry a week out, especially given the fact that Scott Parker almost eluded to fact that Broyer probably wouldn't feature against Spurs with his, we'll have to take a look at the new lads over the next couple of weeks, is it a worry going into the Premiership season without really setting the world alight in pre-season? Woody (04:32.732) It's pre-season and you can't take too much. mean, if we'd have spanked them, you know, 4-1, we'd have all been getting overly excited, you know, in the other direction. And it's looking at those kind of patterns of play and how we've set up. And I think, like you say, with the build up piece, there were times when we looked exceptional, didn't we? There was some very fluid pressing going on. There were people dropping off, you know, you know, and I thought Hartman looked exceptional down the left and the way everybody seemed to be joining up. And there was some nice patterns of play, like I was saying. Yeah. So it's a Scott Parker Burnley side. So we're always going to be slightly worried about our capability to finish. But you'd think that that there are players to come in who, you know, could do a slightly better job. But speaking of Sony, looks like especially if we're going to play three at the back at some point that the people like Sonic, et cetera, going to have to take on a little bit of added, you know, responsibility in terms of finishing because we know that from last season it wasn't necessarily our strong point, was it? Andrew Greaves (05:41.033) Yeah. And just picking up on Son, I mean, you mentioned him, Chris, he had, I think I thought he had a mixed game. I thought he's lacking, he lacked a bit of concentration at times, you know, let the ball roll under his foot a couple of times, but it was interesting seeing Kyle Walker almost coaching him through that game, which is, which is, you know, what you want. It's one like Walker, but he was the man at the back post, wasn't he? Two or three times when a ball came in looking for that header. I can't remember the last time we had a kind of flying wingback who would be you know, in that position. And Hartman again, I think on the left hand side, especially first half, he was almost the man that was kind of popping up on the left hand side of the box at that back post. I mean, that's an interesting dynamic, it? It's different to what we saw under Scott Parker last year. Chris Boden (06:28.907) Well yeah I think we were ahead of the game talking about having two out and out flyers in the fullback positions expecting a back four but you've got this sort of interesting scenario where we've got sort of like you say Hartman on the left who as we sort of you know read up on it when he arrived from final he can underlap he can overlap he was he was giving us that width at times and you know allowing Jayden Anthony to cut inside and have an impact off Foster. And again, he could have grabbed himself a goal or two and just those worries again about his final finish, Jaden Anthony. I just like it really passes him to feet with purpose. I enjoyed an awful lot of what I saw from Hartman. He was aggressive. up and down, set piece delivery was good although we didn't take advantage of it. He's going to be one of those players that rattled umpteen Lazio players on the day. He's going to be a real fan favourite. I must say I thought Lucas did ever so well when he came on last few minutes as well and I think he can't be sort of ignored or I think he's going to have to wait for his opportunity come the start of the season. If you're going to play Woody (07:51.613) you Chris Boden (07:54.386) that sort of wingback system, you have to have that sort of attacking impetus from either one or both of these wingbacks. Son can sort of stay at home if Hartman's the one that's going to be bombing on predominantly. yeah, so he worked quite well. You've got the metronome of Cullen in midfield, Hannibal. I'd have to see it again, but I was convinced he stamped on one of their players. first half, he sort of had a bit of a look and sunk his studs into one of them and he was one of those with a VAR, he might have found himself in a bit of trouble but I thought he was terrific yesterday Hannibal and he looked poised to certainly start the season and be one of our more effective players. Foster played well, held the ball up well but again... Is he going to score enough goals? His record suggests not, doesn't it? Chris Boden (09:08.295) We've lost you, bud. Woody (09:22.41) We're not hearing you. Woody (09:36.586) I unmute. Have you got Borders Wifi from old? You absolute spanner. Chris Boden (09:38.345) you Andrew Greaves (09:40.459) No, was on mute. There we go. was on mute. Fucking hellfire. Here we go. There we go. I did reset the internet just in case, but I'll start that bit again. So Simon, 10 minutes in, you need to do a bit of editing. So I'll give it a couple of seconds and start again. Chris Boden (09:42.59) Just frozen on it. Woody (09:49.994) Ahem. Woody (10:03.454) He'll be a fin and jeffy. Andrew Greaves (10:07.011) Would you just look at that formation? I mean, I was sat there yesterday on the turf and I really like the look of Lazio. I don't know much about Lazio. They kind of, you know, didn't finish that high in the Serie A table. I think they were kind of seventh or eighth, maybe, you know, a little bit lower than that last season. But what my thinking was, this is almost the kind of Scott Parker team that you'd probably expect us to play against, aside that... feels like that Lazio team. So I'm thinking maybe Brentford's, your Crystal Palaces, your West Ham's, know, ones where they've got kind of fairly, you know, good counter-attacking players. Do you think we'll see this as the kind of template for next season, this 3-5-2, or do you think it is one of them where we'll dip in and out of different games and it'll be choosing the formation for the game? Woody (11:05.034) It's a good question. don't know. think it's one of those that Scott Parker didn't seem to mess about too much with formations last season did he? It seems like if he's settled on it but it seems like also it's a good option as a plan B or a plan C. So and it does seem to play to some other players strengths that we've currently got. So it's that level of pragmatism again isn't it? But a week out from the start of the season, you would think that it's very much top of his mind that he's going to be playing it at some point, don't you? Andrew Greaves (11:42.207) definitely. We'll come on to VR in a second, but Chris, just a word on Max Weiss, came on at half time for Vlachy. I don't think I've ever pronounced his name correctly, but there we go. Penalty save, which was superb. And overall, the young lad did well, he? I mean, not a lot he could do with a goal on the break, but saved the penalty. One really good save second half. Were you impressed by Max Weiss and his showing, given the fact that he perhaps didn't have his best game against Stoke last week? Chris Boden (12:13.256) Yeah, again, given what he had to face, he's made a super save closer to his near post to turn an effort over, little chance with the goal. The penalty was one of them where he's gone to his right, but he's had the presence of mind to be able to volley away essentially, the penalty that's gone straight down the middle. And he got some distance on that as well. So this is a real firm... Woody (12:39.357) You Chris Boden (12:42.834) firm clearance. I mean it's nice to see it, it'll give the lad a whole load of confidence. But you would imagine, I think we're all expecting Dubravka to be the first name on the team sheet. Who knows, we may well be surprised at Spurs next week. I don't think it's as set in stone as maybe we thought it was. know, I say the new lads. and they're going to get some game time this week. Out of the three that signed last week, how many are going to start at Spurs? It really remains to be seen. And again, it was intimated after the game that there might be two or three more new faces on top of that. So that's the excitement is that we're obviously going to be working until the end of the month. And it's this really frustrating. Andrew Greaves (13:28.191) Yeah. Chris Boden (13:39.693) aspect of the transfer window where your season starts and you're still not really settled in terms of the final squad that will take you towards January. Andrew Greaves (13:49.727) Yeah, definitely. He did mention as well getting rid of quite a few and I kind of certainly probably will see in this next kind of week or so a of those players, perhaps Del Qua, your Bensons, certainly your Cherlin, obviously you'd have thought your Oberfemmys moving on to pastures new. We've resisted long enough, Woody, but we're now interested to know what the VR experience was like. You're shaking your head. I think at one point you were saying in your left eye it was... the VR experience and you're right, it was the live football and were both going in opposite directions. I mean, how did you find it? Is it the future of football and is it made for people like us? Chris Boden (14:19.985) Ha ha ha! Woody (14:22.953) Yeah. Woody (14:30.537) It's not made for people like anybody. It was quite frankly bollocks. It really was. It was a tech in search of a solution causing a problem. Imagine if you will, you're plunked in a throne off way up the James R. Greaves and across the way the Bob Lloyd has been taken over. It's turned into basically a football drive through and they put a massive screen on the top of the Bob Lloyd stand that covers the entire top of the Bob Lloyd stand. And that's the normal Phil Bird stream. But the actual pitch level, they've got the VR players. We were playing left to right on the stream on the pitch, they were playing right to left, which is the most disconcerted I've been watching a football game since I was on mushrooms watching escape to victory. So I can say and as the as and to couple that the game on the actual pitch was a second or two in front of the full bird stream. So we had that problem as well. then Lazio players started disappearing progressively during the first half. So every time I did look down, I thought, he's in there. But no, this invisible force just popped up nowhere. And then second off, all the players disappeared, you know. So take that as you will. It was it was a very difficult 90 minutes. Let's put it that way. Very difficult 90 minutes. Chris Boden (15:40.422) Ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha! Andrew Greaves (15:56.267) So I'm just trying to get my head around this. they're basically showing you, and I guess if we were doing it for Premier League games, you wouldn't necessarily have the live video because of the rights. I guess this because we were showing it on Twitter, which I presume is part of this deal with sign with X. I should call it X to give it his proper name. Would it have been, I mean, obviously disappearing players not withstanding. Had you not had that kind of weird... Woody (15:57.93) Yeah. Chris Boden (15:59.078) Thank Woody (16:09.233) Yes. Andrew Greaves (16:23.007) big screen experience, had it just been the kind of computer graphics, would it, and that was the only way you could watch it, so I'm kind of putting lots of hypotheticals in the way, would it have been something which you would kind of go, you know what, if this is how I can watch it live, then it's gotta be better than just keep refreshing live scores on your phone. Woody (16:30.985) Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. Woody (16:45.735) mean, it's arguably slightly better than that. Don't get me wrong, the technology, the way in real time that you see the players in VR pinging the ball about is extremely life like. And you can see that there's an opportunity, for example, if you were watching the game as a stream and then you say you wanted to watch a highlight or you wanted to see how the penalty was going on or you wanted to focus in. on a particular passage of play, then just being able to zoom in and see what had happened. It'd be a very good usage of it as like a bit of a second screen experience. But VR is one of those isolating types of technologies, isn't it? When we're used to being in a WhatsApp group and you're used to having that second screen and you're to conversing with other people, it's kind of not quite as social. And I know you can get WhatsApp on there and whatnot. I think with a with a few tweaks and it being like an additional technology, it could be it could be extremely useful for you for your viewing pleasure. But it's one of those things that if it's just a little tiny thing that's slightly off, it tends to ruin everything else. So it wasn't quite for prime time by any stretch. Andrew Greaves (17:57.791) Yeah, two other questions that I had, and I've got many, many questions, but we'll keep it to two. Are you able to kind of turn your head, so if you turn to the left, you look towards, so it's happening, it's not like on FIFA or Pro Evo where the screen moves with you. You've got to be sat there in your cinema room, which looks very nice, by the way, in that rather sexy picture you've got on Twitter. You have to look at the... Woody (18:03.198) Yes. Woody (18:07.581) Yep. Yeah. Chris Boden (18:20.677) you Woody (18:21.127) Yeah, anti football is quite keen. Yeah. You Andrew Greaves (18:26.367) the Jimmy Mack stand, or I'm guessing it was the reverse for some reason, you have to look at the stand. If you look in the opposite direction, the action is still happening out of your eyesight. Is that correct? Woody (18:38.125) No, what you whatever you're facing, you see. So when I turn around the full 180, I could see the back of the Jimmy Mack, which was just a load of like two centimeter, you know, cardboard cutouts of fans from 1982 PlayStation or whatever, you know. And so, yeah, if you were further further down the line, if you could like transport more lifelike type things going on, yeah, it'd be pretty good. Andrew Greaves (18:51.795) Excellent. Woody (19:07.709) But being sat on a throne and being able to like stand over and see my little funny legs in shorts and whatnot was, yeah, that was slightly odd as well. Yeah. Andrew Greaves (19:12.434) Hahaha Andrew Greaves (19:16.093) Excellent. And then my other question, I'm amazed by this technology, have to say. Yeah, so you mentioned the fact that it was the opposite way around. So as the stadium is built in the VR world, were we kicking towards the Jimmy Mack stand in the first half, as in a virtual version of Jimmy Mack stand? Right, so they've got the, essentially they've got the teams on the wrong side of the pitch. Woody (19:18.13) Ha ha! Woody (19:28.103) Mm-hmm. Woody (19:35.643) Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. That's exact. That's exactly it. And it's just one of those like minor oversights that just tends to spoil everything else. It won't you know it's one of those that you probably like kicking yourself if you're there having created that as an experience thinking shit why didn't we ask which way they'd be you know kicking off and why can we not switch it around and stuff like that you know that just would have helped. But yeah I'm so I'm selling a headset if anybody wants one. Yeah. Andrew Greaves (19:43.506) Interesting. Andrew Greaves (19:49.3) Yeah. Andrew Greaves (20:01.237) Yeah. Yeah, I'm amazed by it. Andrew Greaves (20:09.606) I'm amazed by the whole thing. mean, I find VR really interesting and I know Daz was saying they used it Everton to sell premium experiences really when they didn't have a stadium. know, they were, you know, doing all that and you know, the lads from Manchester, Rizal, think it is, Andy Etchers and his partner down there. You know, clearly this technology is fantastic, as you've said. I am keen to give it a try, but I'm not sure I want to spunk whatever it is for a head. Woody (20:19.326) Mm-hmm. yeah. Andrew Greaves (20:38.089) headset, if you will. Woody (20:38.483) To be fair to them though, there is their Premier League player app which is a completely different experience where you're actually there. It's infinitely more lifelike. You can actually play, go through various training drills and it's an entire game and experience which I haven't played too extensively and that's completely different to what was going on with regards to the stream because that was very much about, you know, tracking players in real time and in essence they'd probably say that that worked quite well. Andrew Greaves (21:14.643) Yeah. Yeah. Be interested to see the viewing figures on that. Because I think, you know, it's like with a lot of things, you know, EVs and all this, like, you know, the technology is there. How many people have the conduit to use that technology, i.e. the headsets, et cetera, et cetera. But one thing you would have missed out on is being able to catch Russell Ball pinging the new third shirt at half time into the stands. Which again, he's, I mean, don't get me wrong. You know, the club gave away quite a few of those new Woody (21:26.951) Yeah. Chris Boden (21:35.843) Ha Woody (21:36.457) You Chris Boden (21:39.107) Thank Andrew Greaves (21:43.403) black shirts. mean, Chris, the players were warming up in black shorts and socks, so we kind of had an inkling that's what it was going to be. There was no real announcements at the start. They just kind of came out in there, kind of tracky tops, took them off. And then all of a sudden the LEDs around the screen, around the stadium started saying new third kit. It wasn't until half time that we started to kind of, you know, see, you know, or have this kind of, you know, announcement that this was the third kit. Obviously it was on the website, so a lot of people were checking. So maybe that's job done. Chris Boden (21:47.042) you Andrew Greaves (22:12.779) What did you make of the third kit? I only saw the closer details this morning and we'll perhaps go on to that, but it looked really nice and clean again, didn't it? It's another good kit for this season, I thought. were your views, Chris? Chris Boden (22:27.017) Yeah, yeah, I've got to be honest when they had the tracksuits on and you could sort of see it was going to be some play on the sort of bees theme that had been mooted the night before. I was hoping it was going to be the yellow and black stripes that sort of thing that we wore understand that you can picture Jimmy Papadopoulos and Ian Cox running around in it at Portman Road, think. think we wore it at Ipswich one night out of memory. Andrew Greaves (22:48.245) Papadopoulos. Woody (22:50.033) You Andrew Greaves (22:53.546) Yeah. Chris Boden (22:56.099) But so disappointment aside that he wasn't yellow and black stars. I thought it was really well done. It's really subtle I like the honeycomb. I'd like the honeycomb thing to be a bit more Covering a bit more of the shirt again. I'm just picking picking real minor holes because I think it's a real There's a lot of thought gone into that. I was you know, same with the bay. It's You've been on the you know, the previous club crest etc. But Andrew Greaves (23:12.17) Yeah, yeah. Chris Boden (23:26.178) I think it's really nice. reminds me of that. Remember the Man City one, the black with a bit of yellow on it. I think it's really classy. It's a nice addition to the blue away strip, which I think is almost universally approved. I saw that in the flesh for the first time yesterday and thought that was really nice in the club shop. I think we, on the whole, I think we've got three solid... choices there. There'll be a lot of people getting the lot if they've got lucky enough to have the spur cash to do so. yeah, think it's just pleasing to see when there's a bit of thought going into things. And yeah, I quite like that. Andrew Greaves (23:57.183) cash to do so. Andrew Greaves (24:07.177) Yeah, mean Woody, take the piss quite a bit with the AI generated descriptions that we use. I mean, just to point on the blue Awake, I saw it on a lot of fans yesterday and I thought that is probably one of the best shirts, home away or third, that we've had in a long time. That looks mint. Like Chris says, the detail is not overbearing. I agree with Chris. It reminds me a little bit, if we're talking about Burnley shirts, of the... Woody (24:13.48) . Woody (24:32.156) Mm-hmm. Andrew Greaves (24:34.887) one where it was black with the silver honeycomb slightly smaller design coming up to kind of just under the laba bet or whatever it was. I'd probably liked Chris wanted a bit more of that honeycomb design but it is a really nice kit and again the know the Dude Perfect sponsor I wish I could get an adult one with the Dude Perfect because I think again the Dude Perfect looks fantastic in that gold. Are you a fan of you tempted to get one shipped out to Cleveland? Woody (24:56.402) you Woody (25:04.7) You know, me and Sam were talking about it. We may do. Maybe shove the soccer business on it. It's our colour scheme as well. you know, might as well hop, skipping a jump on that one. But no, it is a classy little kit. I always like black kits, you know, and I think this one, I like the understated yellow because you've got to be careful not to look like an umbug, haven't you? You've got to be careful not to overdo it on the B front. And I think and I think these are. Andrew Greaves (25:13.536) nice. Woody (25:31.608) arguably three of the most solid kit sets as set we've had for quite a while. I think there isn't there isn't really a stinker amongst them is there? all they're all they're all a solid set of kits. So fair play to them. Yeah. And picking holes in them, you'd be able to do with Castore. Yeah. Andrew Greaves (25:44.437) Yeah, definitely. Chris Boden (25:47.985) I'm just waiting for this warm up shirt, which I think is the real jewel in the crown. a lot of people, again, if you can't afford whatever 60 odd quid it is for a first team replica shirt, a lot of people are turning towards the training shirts up and down the country. The sort of freedom of design where people can be a bit more adventurous and a bit more out there. Andrew Greaves (26:07.136) Yeah. Woody (26:13.0) Mmm. Chris Boden (26:15.442) And the training shirts are almost where it's at really. So I await those in the club shop with the bait in breath. Andrew Greaves (26:22.985) Yeah, that warm up shirt that they've been wearing throughout pre-season with the kind of dark blue and dark claret pattern and things like that. think the last few training shirts actually have been decent. Like you say, Chris, it's a slightly cheaper alternative to the actual kits, which are getting more and more expensive. Something else that's getting more and more expensive, look at that for a link, catering options on the ground. It was obviously the first time we were back at Turf Moor since the end of last season. Woody (26:45.608) You Chris Boden (26:46.001) Hahaha! Andrew Greaves (26:51.423) Pleased to report that the pies are now halfness pies, which just absolutely fills me with joy. What doesn't fill me with joy is having to queue up for a hell of a long time just to secure one. I think, you know, we talk about the importance of pre-season for getting us fitness back and the players getting ready. I think one or two of the new signings on the catering side of things perhaps could do with a little bit more practice at pulling pints. You know, you might remember the old, was it Melanie Griffiths? The old, you want to flake in that love bodies advert? There was quite a lot of form, quite a lot of form going into those pinecrackers. Not Melanie Griffiths, what was she called? Chris Boden (27:22.111) A body tune, yeah. Woody (27:25.256) Are you grippin'? Chris Boden (27:29.247) Melanie Griffiths! Woody (27:32.776) Melanie, Melanie, Melanie Sacks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Chris Boden (27:33.363) Yeah. Andrew Greaves (27:35.527) Melanie Sykes, there you go, not Melanie Griffiths, there you go. But yeah, mean, obviously there's a big thread on up the Clarets about some of the pies being burnt and the queues were horrific. And I put some of that down to the fact that in James R Grieves upper, not all of the concession stands were open. A few grumbles about the price. I think the pints are up to about 6.20 now. The beer selection has moved on from San Miguel to Estrella, so probably a bit of a plus point there. Chris Boden (27:39.231) You Chris Boden (27:47.199) you Chris Boden (28:03.471) There's a Peretti... there's a Perettion in the fan zone as well. Andrew Greaves (28:07.371) Pareti as well, yeah. And they've got Wame Rats, is... Oh, did get the Cannes Guinness? Chris Boden (28:09.896) and who pour your own Guinness. Chris Boden (28:17.05) In the fan zone you had a pour your own Guinness stand. didn't have a closer look to be honest but it looked like was one of those you could pour your own and take it to the stand or whatever and declare you paid for it etc. You'd be paying half the price in the bars on Harry Potter's Way wouldn't you? Andrew Greaves (28:20.079) wow. Andrew Greaves (28:33.15) reference. Chris Boden (28:45.883) Once you're captive audience member in there, it is what it is. Every time I take my oldest one, he inhales one of the other rollover type hot dogs. He lives for those, so he was delighted to see they were still available and wolfed that before they came. So he don't complain on that front. Andrew Greaves (29:10.473) Yeah, hopefully when we kick off again, suddenly in a couple of weeks, those that queuing situation will be will be sorted. But I think, the fact that the pies are now haffners and you know, you get a good pie. It was I have to say the pie was decent. I think he's very good. So but yeah, like you say, much cheaper to buy your beer elsewhere. Plenty of very nice places across Burnley where you can get a pretty much pint for half what you can on the turf. But there we go. Just to wrap up. I just wanted to kind of touch on this because I know we do stray into other areas and you know there is a Burnley link to what we're talking about but Paul Eggingbotham kind of a little bit miffed in his press conference afterwards because of an injury to one of his players who'd been working with a you know one of these many kind of personal trainers that are on social media. He named him which I thought was a bit unfair really I think you you're on a bit of slightly, you know, I'm not quite sure where that stands up, but we won't name him, but he's somebody who's worked with Josh Brownhill over the summer. I've seen Brownie working with him quite a bit on some of the videos and Armando Breuer as well was, was working with him, kind of slightly earlier. Now, Eggingbottom was basically saying, you know, it's, it's a bit of a pain in the ass. We've got this player, he's injured, Jeberson's injured. They charge this money. They get the hits on social media. We don't get any money. Woody, where do you stand on players using personal trainers? Because again, gone are the days, I guess, when players would just get fat over summer and then fear the pinch test when they came in for the first day pre-season. Someone like Josh Brown, who looks to have spent most of summer moving from exotic location to exotic location, spending his days basically training. What's your view on the use of personal trainers? Woody (30:53.394) Mm-hmm. Woody (31:00.22) Well, what do you think? It's the first time I've thought about one this summer. Let's put it that way. But it's like, mean, I don't I don't know. Is he saying that they should only have like club sanctioned personal trainers or not personal trainers at all? Or what's he suggesting? I don't know what his beef is. He said it was an accident. So what's what's his what's his problem? The club should be. Andrew Greaves (31:02.278) Ha ha. Chris Boden (31:08.222) you Woody (31:24.892) basically saying, yeah, this is OK or whatever. It seems a seems a funny thing. It seems like you just missed and taking it out on somebody, which I get. I understand. But it's not the problem of personal trainers, is it? Anybody can fall over a coffee table or whatever it is. don't know. You know, so. Chris Boden (31:41.512) Drop to Jar of Ver... Andrew Greaves (31:43.465) jar of mayonnaise. Woody (31:44.488) Exactly, run into an alien board, whatever it may be. Chris Boden (31:47.997) you Andrew Greaves (31:48.203) I mean, it's a fair point, Chris, isn't it? you know, if you think about, I always think about that summer when Kieran Trippier just looked to be on holiday after holiday after holiday. know, because he was and I know, know, Sean Dice, you know, took him to one side and basically said, you know, don't waste your career, you know, put your chippy tits away and, you know, work hard. We want, we want players to be ready, don't we? And then we kind of like... Chris Boden (31:58.887) Yeah, yeah, because he was, yeah. Woody (32:11.656) You Chris Boden (32:11.805) Hahaha! Well... Andrew Greaves (32:17.737) then whinging that players have gone above and beyond and, you know, perhaps had an accident in a gym or turned an ankle while they're doing some of these drills. It just feels slightly odd excuse for Egging Bottom to use, doesn't it? Chris Boden (32:29.694) Well, do you want them like I said back in the old days to like have a bit of a run round the estate that they live on the night before they return to training? Do you want them to be diligent and disciplined and actually, well not just do the program that they've been given but go over and beyond? I mean, I can remember doing a piece with Brownie's agent who did, he did share the same agent as Daniel Jebbison. I don't know if they're still... Woody (32:36.583) Mm. Chris Boden (32:57.981) that's still the case, you know, in regularly Brownie had gone on a sort of pre-pre-season training camp and get yourself in the best possible physical shape. And you can see that, I mean, the game's changed beyond belief, haven't you? I can remember Adrian Heath sort of raving about Andy Cook's physique, if you go back 30 years, and Cook, was... built like a brick out house. You lost the baggy shirt. In this day and age you'd be able to see he was built. Back then he couldn't tell what was under there. He's got a double XL Adidas parachute on him basically. Players were fit but Cookie was almost like an outlier at the time. No, they are all. you look at them, there's not an ounce of fat on them. You look at even the ladies, see the women's team that won the Euros a couple of weeks ago, you see them all sort of on holiday celebrating in the dressing room afterwards and there's no body fat at all there is there, it's ridiculous. He's had an accident, he's had an accident, it is what it is, but you know, said do you want to absolutely... ready to roll as a physical specimen. Do you want him give me another another program? It's going to be another month before he gets up to up to physical speed sort of thing. It's it's an altism but I must say so on the Brownie issue and I know he's not our player anymore and it's entirely up to him what his next move is but I'm absolutely puzzled what's going on there. It's EFL season started, the Premier League season's Woody (34:50.94) Mm. Chris Boden (34:52.732) Well, it starts on Friday night. He's not got a club. So has he got offers? mean, Burnley offered him something. So he's either got an offer from Burnley and nothing else, or he's sort of playing it by ear and hoping. you know, as the clubs work down their shortlists and they lose out on players and they, maybe we'll keep, keep Brownie in mind because he's a Freemans sort of thing. You have to be careful because it can end up with absolutely nothing or end up having to go somewhere because the deadline is gone and you're going to have to take what's coming to you, otherwise you're not going to get a until January. Andrew Greaves (35:27.243) Thank Woody (35:35.045) Depends where he's shopping, don't it? If we could work out which shops he was in front of, we'd have some sense as to which cities he was at and who he might be talking to. you know, I'm not sure. It's a weird one. It is. Andrew Greaves (35:35.477) Yeah. Andrew Greaves (35:47.435) Yeah, it is a strange one, isn't it? yeah, there's a picture of Jamie Vardy. It looked to be at Sunderland. There seemed to be a Sunderland crest on a kind of electronic advertising board behind him. And you kind of think, you know, he's getting fixed up. looks like Calvert Lewin's getting himself fixed up. Wilson joining West Ham. You know, these players, they're, they're, you know, hawking themselves around clubs, aren't they? And you just wonder whether... you know, maybe Josh has got something in America perhaps, or, you know, but you kind of think in the longer it goes on, Scotland and England become less of an option, don't they? I mean, that's, it's a weird one. Yeah. Woody (36:17.895) Mm. Chris Boden (36:23.408) Yep, well Tyrese Dolan was what I mean obviously he's not Tyrese Dolan I don't think I'm being sort of out of order but I suggest he wouldn't be good enough for us but he's the amusing thing I read an interview he's obviously signed for Espanyol who we now have a close tie with and he was almost having to sort of say to Blackburn fans like well I knew nothing about this tie with Burnley when I signed for them I they sort of thought that he was going to go to Espanol to be loaned to us in a rather roundabout way of us taking him off their hands. yeah, he left himself a good while, but he's got sorted out with a terrific move on paper. I don't know, I just find it bizarre that he hasn't, looks to me, again, he posted something on Instagram, he looks to me again, sullied himself on holiday when really he should be. Andrew Greaves (36:58.079) Yeah. Chris Boden (37:22.425) you know, the finishing touches to be getting ready to kick off the season somewhere. Andrew Greaves (37:23.541) on doors. Andrew Greaves (37:29.557) Yeah, definitely. Just talking about that lockdown the road just to end, we always like to end on a positive. They got beat one though yesterday at West Brom, which was one of the loudest cheers inside the ground yesterday as the announcer announced that at both half time and full time. Chris Boden (37:34.307) I think. Woody (37:38.405) You Chris Boden (37:43.89) Well, they've now lost 50 % of the games we lost last season. Andrew Greaves (37:50.643) Very true, that's really good point, they won't be winning the league in August like they usually do. Chris Boden (37:54.169) and play, and Birmingham's next up I believe, so good luck to them. Woody (37:55.462) You Andrew Greaves (37:59.243) Oh, excellent. Definitely. Yeah, definitely. Well, we've got less than a week to wait now until the Clarence are back in action. Clarence back on Saturday at Spurs to prepare for that and for us to give you a glimpse at how our pre-season training has gone. We are going to do a special live episode. It's not going to be in VR. You are going to have to look at our actual ugly mugs if you do choose to tune in. We'll have more details on social media, but there will be a chance for you to... Woody (37:59.495) Yeah, man that gap fellas, yeah. Andrew Greaves (38:27.955) sending questions in advance or join the conversation on YouTube. But a little date in your diary, I think we're looking at eight o'clock on Thursday this week, kind of a pre-premier league kickoff live show. I think most of the pod squad will be in attendance. know Justin's away, I know a lot of people getting ready to see Mr. Connell again, but he's away this week. But certainly we'll probably have Daz and Simon with us as well. So a fuller pod squad for a special live episode. Keep your eye on social media at BO podcast for the details of that. But looking like Thursday at eight o'clock will of course be available as a downloadable podcast on Friday as well if you can't make it. But until then, enjoy the week and up the Clarence.