Hartman, Colorado, reached a point where it could no longer function as a town. Its water system was unsafe, every member of the town board had resigned, and no one remained with the authority to hold an election or sign the agreements needed to fix the water. Norm Van Eeden Petersman is joined by Joshua Hopkins, mayor of Chugwater, Wyoming, and Strong Towns executive director John Reuter to look past the political infighting and ask what happened before the final collapse. The question facing places like Hartman and Chugwater is increasingly basic: How much town can a very small community actually afford to maintain?

ADDITIONAL SHOW NOTES

• "Colorado declares town abandoned amid water and leadership crisis" by Ramon Antonio Vargas, Theguardian.com (August 2026)
• Norm Van Eeden Petersman (LinkedIn)
• Joshua Hopkins (LinkedIn, Instagram)
• John Reuter (LinkedIn)
• Articles mentioned and Downzone:
  
  • How a Rodeo Arena Can Strengthen A Rural Community (Bottom-Up Short Episode)
  • Don’t Give Up on Your Small Town (Article)
  • Whatever Happened to the Music Teacher? How Government Decides and Why by Donald Savoie (Book) 
  • Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion by Robert B. Cialdini (Book)
  • Chugwaterite (Instagram)
• Theme Music by Kemet the Phantom.

 

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