Summary

In this episode, Andy welcomes back his friend Stuart Taylor, a PMO leader and PMI PMO Awards judge, author of Becoming the Project Manager. Most of us didn't grow up dreaming of leading projects. We drifted into the role, and then discovered it's far less about plans and methodologies than it is about people, pressure, and learning to lead while you yourself still feel unsure.

Stuart shares the story behind the book, including the university project where he publicly chastised a teammate and the response from his dad that changed how he understood leadership. He and Andy dig into the real value and limits of PM certifications, why AI can help you communicate but can't replace the human part, the stakeholder questions younger Stuart was afraid to ask, what his mentor Wayne taught him about proximity and follow-through, and why a new sponsor has to be sold on your project rather than assumed into it. You'll also hear the 30-minute CV rule and the trouble it once caused him.

If you're looking for an honest, human look at what it actually takes to become the project manager, this episode is for you!

Sound Bites

• "Well, now that you've reprimanded that person, you do realize you've got to go and pick them back up again?"
• "So going out into the world with this as my toolkit, and I thought it was a toolkit, but actually it turned out to be more like a life raft because I ended up clinging onto it without reasoning at an early point in my career."
• "There's an awful lot that falls between the processes, and that's what the early part of the book is really exploring."
• "I don't believe there's great value in repeatedly recycling the same learning over and over and over again. I think there's much greater value in taking that energy and going to learn something about your industry, the, actual industry that you're working in."
• "And also, I should add, you will have greater value to them by being there too, because you're the interesting change person in the room then, rather than one of another 200 change people walking around all talking about the same methodologies."
• "So be the person who is not avoiding hearing about challenges, but actively seeking them out, and cataloging them, and managing them."
• "Something else I've learned: they don't like you tiptoeing around them."
• "But if anybody's having to go into the office more frequently now, go and spend some of that time sitting with the people whose world you are changing."
• "But if your own leader, the person who's supposed to be championing you in the organization just doesn't get it, then you've got an impossible task on your hands."
• "When your sponsor goes or leaves and somebody else comes in and replaces them, don't just assume that, that because they've now been told they're gonna have to be the sponsor of your project, that they understand it and they can see the value in it."
• "Every project that you work on, the benefits, they are your accomplishments."
• "There is no point in being loyal to organizations. Be loyal to people."

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction
• 01:56 Start of Interview
• 02:15 Growing Up in Walsall and Learning Leadership from Dad
• 07:15 Drifting Into Project Management
• 09:06 When the Methodology Becomes a Life Raft
• 10:14 Why the Playbook That Worked Elsewhere Fails Here
• 11:49 Will AI Create PMs Who Look Prepared but Aren't?
• 13:37 Using AI to Understand a Difficult Stakeholder
• 15:31 The Value and Limits of PM Certifications
• 17:44 The Talent Triangle and Learning Your Industry
• 19:34 Stakeholders Are People, Not Org Charts
• 20:46 Curiosity and Asking Better Questions
• 21:54 Stop Tiptoeing: Busy Stakeholders Want the Point
• 22:55 What Wayne the Mentor Taught Stuart to Notice
• 25:47 Go Sit With Operations
• 28:19 The Power of Proximity
• 29:33 Sponsorship and Why PMOs Collapse
• 34:18 Earning Support and Managing Up
• 35:07 When a New Sponsor Takes Over
• 37:08 Keep Your CV 30 Minutes From Ready
• 39:39 When the 30-Minute Rule Got Stuart in Trouble
• 41:28 Project Lessons That Carried Into Family Life
• 43:23 End of Interview
• 43:58 Andy Comments After the Interview
• 47:08 Outtakes

Learn More

You can learn more about Stuart and his work at InfluentialPMO.com.

For more learning on this topic, check out:

• Episode 474, which is an earlier and pretty candid conversation with Stuart about LinkedIn, careers, and AI.
• Episode 429 with Bill Dow. Bill and Andy talk about the signs that your PMO is going to fail, and you don't have to be in a Project Management Office to get value out of that discussion.
• Episode 441 with Michaela Flick. A discussion on the human side of project management that resonates with much of what you hear from Stuart.

Chat with PMeLa

You can chat directly with PMeLa, ;the podcast's AI person, to get episode recommendations and answers to your project management and leadership questions. Visit PeopleAndProjectsPodcast.com/PMeLa to chat with her.

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Thank you for joining me for this episode of The People and Projects Podcast!

Talent Triangle: Business Acumen

Topics: Project Management, Leadership, Stakeholder Management, Sponsorship, PMO, Mentoring, Career Development, Certifications, Artificial Intelligence, Communication, Influence, Professional Growth

The following music was used for this episode:

Music: Brooklyn Nights by Tim Kulig
License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license

Music: Fashion Corporate by Frank Schroeter
License (CC BY 4.0): https://filmmusic.io/standard-license