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Wil Reynolds of Seer Interactive says agency owners are dishonest about how business is really going, and that most have been flat for three or four years. Eric reads the post and Neil agrees the downturn started around 2022 and is the longest he has seen, then explains why NP Digital kept growing anyway. Eric's take: the agencies dying are the ones still doing what they did five years ago, and tough markets are exactly when adaptable founders win the deals against the holding companies. The episode closes on the part of being a founder nobody talks about: watching the people you trained go on to build their own companies, why mindset separates the people who survive the downs, and why a business win feels the way it does.

Key takeaways
◾Be honest about how business is going; it keeps leads and opportunities flowing to you
◾The agencies in trouble are still running the 2021 playbook; adapt or die
◾You can't train mindset, and hard years are what build it

Chapters
00:00 Agency owners are lying about how business is going (Wil Reynolds)
01:41 Neil: why NP Digital is still growing
03:54 Eric: adapt or die, the invisible hammer
07:06 Flat for 4 years? You're doing the same thing
08:06 The burn-victim YouTuber: keep going
10:34 If you're going through hell, keep going
11:14 The best part of being a founder
12:44 Mindset: people can't handle the downs
13:48 The business high