Today I’m talking with Mustafa Suleyman, the CEO of Microsoft AI. This is a real burner of an episode. We covered everything from his approach to training new models to his criticisms of Anthropic talking about Claude as though it is conscious. 

Of course, we also talked about Microsoft’s relationship with OpenAI, how Mustafa is thinking about all the negative polling and political pushback around AI right now, and whether any of the consumer products are good enough to overcome it. Like I said, it’s a burner.

Read the full interview transcript on The Verge.

Links: 

• Microsoft and OpenAI broke up — now they’re ready to fight | The Verge
• Microsoft Build 2026: The 7 biggest announcements | The Verge
• Microsoft’s first advanced reasoning AI is here | The Verge
• Microsoft’s new ‘superintelligence’ game plan is all about business | The Verge
• Here’s how the new Microsoft and OpenAI deal breaks down | The Verge
• Microsoft AI chief says 18 months until white-collar tasks automated by AI | FT

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Credits:

Decoder is a production of The Verge and part of the Vox Media Podcast Network.

Decoder is produced by Kate Cox and Nick Statt and edited by Ursa Wright. Our editorial director is Kevin McShane. 

The Decoder music is by Breakmaster Cylinder.

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